Rams kicking "meaningless" FG to end game - And cover spread (1 Viewer)

[Joe Bryant]

Thoughts on this?

Sean McVay should have to answer for his spread-covering field goal, even if he had other intentions

We may never know the real reason why Sean McVay kicked that field goal.

ftw.usatoday.com

Los Angeles Rams head coach Sean McVay made himself a few enemies in the sports betting world Sunday after sending his kicker out to attempt a meaningless field goal at the end of their loss to the San Francisco 49ers.

The Rams were trailing by 10 with fours seconds left and no chance of completing a comeback. Yet, instead of milking the clock on second down, McVay added three points to his team’s score as time expired, covering a +7.5 spread in the process.

As you can imagine, 49ers bettors were livid about the result. What appeared to be money in the bank ended up a bad beat shrouded in the mystery of why. The decision to kick a field in that spot didn’t make much sense outside the context of the betting spread.

 

[dutch]

A fool and his money

points for and points against are considerations for tiebreaker’s at the end of the season if you’re trying to get in as a wildcard team in the playoffs. At that point in the game at that point on the field going for the Hail Mary or going for the long field goal kick the kick was the safer option to assure a chance at some points. gamblers should just bring some tissues with them if they’re going to cry about every decision that goes against them.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

My experience with coaches from youth sports is “you play to the whistle”.

If you can put points on the board, you do, so long as there’s time left in the game.

Crazy things happen in sports. I don’t believe it was to cover the spread.

Then again, if someone came forward and admitted it I’d believe that, too. lol

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I didn't learn that this happened until this morning, and I think it's pretty funny.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

It was meaningful to me!

 

[Chemical X]

usually i say it’s to extend the game, but the kick was the last play of game…..? 9th tiebreaker?

 

[Raging weasel]

Cost me a 4 leg parlay win. Fine him !! Lol

 

[cdclopper]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

 

[Navin Johnson]

Thoughts on this?

Sean McVay should have to answer for his spread-covering field goal, even if he had other intentions

We may never know the real reason why Sean McVay kicked that field goal.

ftw.usatoday.com

Los Angeles Rams head coach Sean McVay made himself a few enemies in the sports betting world Sunday after sending his kicker out to attempt a meaningless field goal at the end of their loss to the San Francisco 49ers.

The Rams were trailing by 10 with fours seconds left and no chance of completing a comeback. Yet, instead of milking the clock on second down, McVay added three points to his team’s score as time expired, covering a +7.5 spread in the process.

As you can imagine, 49ers bettors were livid about the result. What appeared to be money in the bank ended up a bad beat shrouded in the mystery of why. The decision to kick a field in that spot didn’t make much sense outside the context of the betting spread.

 

[Joe Bryant]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

 

[eighsse2]

A fool and his money

points for and points against are considerations for tiebreaker’s at the end of the season if you’re trying to get in as a wildcard team in the playoffs. At that point in the game at that point on the field going for the Hail Mary or going for the long field goal kick the kick was the safer option to assure a chance at some points. gamblers should just bring some tissues with them if they’re going to cry about every decision that goes against them.

This.

 

[Banger]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

You never complain when you win because you were “right”

 

[massraider]

Little reward for their fans who believe in them. Good for them.

Man, I am thinking about the reaction my wagering friends would have had watching the Rams line up for a meaningless FG to cover.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

What would have happened if the Rams kicked the FG and SF for whatever reason roughs up the kicker or commits a personal foul penalty?

 

[jm192]

I have no problem with it.

It's a tie breaker. Someone pointed out it's one of the later tie breakers--but still, it's a tiebreaker. Why not put yourself in the best position? Because it bucks tradition?

Teams are constantly trying to score in the final seconds despite being down multiple TD's. We're upset they tried to score 3 instead of 7? A hail mary that leads to 6 is ok, but a kick can only be to cover the spread?

The authour sounds like someone who lost his bet over this. Sour grapes.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

It's refreshing to see a coach that actually thinks of the gamblers out there.

 

[wlwiles]

Teams are constantly trying to score in the final seconds despite being down multiple TD's. We're upset they tried to score 3 instead of 7? A hail mary that leads to 6 is ok, but a kick can only be to cover the spread?

This is almost exactly what I was going to say. If they were down by 14 and completed a Hail Mary to cut it to 8, nobody would bat an eye unless the spread was 8.5? I don't fault them for trying to score whatever amount they can. Is it possible McVay was aware of the spread and some little part of him said "go kick this to help out our faithful fans that took a bet on us?" Yeah it's possible. Will he ever admit it? Not a chance...

 

[Rubi]

No one has mentioned the fantasy footballers who won or lost their game by a couple points because of this decision. I wonder if coach has his own kicker on his fantasy team,
and the field goal beat the Niners coach by 2 points.

 

[ghostguy123]

What would have happened if the Rams kicked the FG and SF for whatever reason roughs up the kicker or commits a personal foul penalty?

Guessing there's no kickoff cause time expired.

They shoulda kicked a FG earlier to have a shot at an onside.

 

[jm192]

When every point matters:

WE NEED MORE POINTS 1999

GOTTA SCORE FAST

www.youtube.com

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

In football and other pro sports, the coaches say "dont let it come down to a call by the referees".

There's a lesson to be learned in the degenerates community...don't let a bad beat come down to sketchy coaching decisions.

Its a shame we can't administer sodium pentathol here...something stinks.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

That was the 5th leg of a $40 parlay for me that I believe paid $800 (which I won, because they didn’t kick the PAT)

That was a long, stressful 10 mins.

Another time many moons ago I was in Vegas, and it was the Bulls in game 3 or 4 against I want to say Utah? End of the game, ball finds Scotty Pippen standing under the basket all alone. 4-3–2-1 (f it, Pippen takes the easy uncontested bucket) BZZT

Hotel explodes with people yelling, both those who got their miracle cover, and those who got bad beat. That’s about the loudest I’ve ever heard a hotel.

So yeah - every time something like this happens, there are roughly an even number of winners & losers. It’s always amazing when it happens at the very last second.

 

[jm192]

I'm going to continue to give McVay the benefit of the doubt. I don't believe he cares about the spread.

But let's say he does in fact care about the spread. I've always understood point shaving to be intentionally underperforming so as to not cover the spread. And that's bad and illegal.

But is it wrong/unethical/illegal to try to perform better/score more to cover the spread? As I said before, teams are always chucking the ball towards the endzone despite games being out of reach. That can affect the spread. Is that bad/illegal? Seems to happen in a lot of games and no one bats an eye.

In the NBA, teams shoot the ball despite the game being out of reach.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

In the NBA, teams shoot the ball despite the game being out of reach.

Except at the very end when the shot clock is off - they dribble it out. It’s considered good sportsmanship.

 

[Wrigley]

just weird

 

[Insein]

I watched it happen and was laughing hysterically at how absurd it was. In my pickem league, I had Rams +8.5. A lot of others had SF. It caused quite the stir.

 

[Navin Johnson]

I have no problem with it.

It's a tie breaker. Someone pointed out it's one of the later tie breakers--but still, it's a tiebreaker. Why not put yourself in the best position? Because it bucks tradition?

Teams are constantly trying to score in the final seconds despite being down multiple TD's. We're upset they tried to score 3 instead of 7? A hail mary that leads to 6 is ok, but a kick can only be to cover the spread?

The authour sounds like someone who lost his bet over this. Sour grapes.

Isn't net TDs a higher tie breaker than net points?

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

Nope, you had it right. After the MM, they voted to change the rule so that XP attempts aren't required after walkoff TDs.

 

[UncleZen]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

The TD Seattle scored yesterday in OT ended the game, no XP.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

Nope, you had it right. After the MM, they voted to change the rule so that XP attempts aren't required after walkoff TDs.

Which now makes getting 6.5 a better bet in O.T.

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

The TD Seattle scored yesterday in OT ended the game, no XP.

OT games have never required an XP. "Sudden death" means that as soon as the team scores, it's over

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

Nope, you had it right. After the MM, they voted to change the rule so that XP attempts aren't required after walkoff TDs.

Which now makes getting 6.5 a better bet in O.T.

It is theoretically possible for a team to win by 9 in OT. They get the ball first, drive down and kick a FG. Other team throws a pick-six

 

[Snoopy]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

The TD Seattle scored yesterday in OT ended the game, no XP.

OT games have never required an XP. "Sudden death" means that as soon as the team scores, it's over

and the NFL recently changed the rule that if a game-winning TD was scored with no time left in regulation, no extra point is required either.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

Nope, you had it right. After the MM, they voted to change the rule so that XP attempts aren't required after walkoff TDs.

I was certain of it.

like I’d said, it almost cost me $800 - I followed the story intensely!

ETA: what I didn’t know before your link was that the Vikes were effected by that rule against the Lions. Nifty.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

is theoretically possible for a team to win by 9 in OT.

Good point. How would it be in the college system? A TD +2 pointer would be 8 but then that could also be followed by a pick 6 to make 14 the max?

 

[da_budman]

I find it hillarious that fans would be upset at a coaching decision that affects bets in a sport that is wildly popular mostly because of..... BETTING. There seems to be considerable irony in that to me. I mean can you really take issue with a coach making a decision probably because of betting in a sport that is largely popular by.... BETTING?

 

[Todem]

I watched it happen and was laughing hysterically at how absurd it was. In my pickem league, I had Rams +8.5. A lot of others had SF. It caused quite the stir.

I am in a pick em league as well......had the 49ers........I know why he did it. Purely because of tiebreakers....pretty simple.

Bad beat for me...miracle back door cover for others.

However typically teams don’t trot out the kicker for a potential tie breaker FG.....they typically throw a ball to the endzone........so yeah kinda weird. But in the end....oh well. I have won so many back door covers.....gonna lose some too. Part of gambling.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

i thought it was an awesome decision.*




*took the points

 

[massraider]

NFL Tie-breaking Procedures | NFL Football Operations

The NFL's procedures for breaking ties for postseason playoffs.

operations.nfl.com

Points scored is a tiebreaker, I am sure a lot of you knew this already.

Plausible deniability reached.

Mr. McVay will accept your apologies now.

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

is theoretically possible for a team to win by 9 in OT.

Good point. How would it be in the college system? A TD +2 pointer would be 8 but then that could also be followed by a pick 6 to make 14 the max?

I suppose, thought I'm not up on college rules. Also, if the offense is on or around the opposing 25, I think it's pretty unlikely that a guy who intercepts a pass is going to run 75 yards when all he has to do is fall down and the game is over. Whereas in the NFL scenario, I could imagine a guy picking off a pass at the 5 and waltzing in, or a fumble being recovered in the end zone

 

[jm192]

I have no problem with it.

It's a tie breaker. Someone pointed out it's one of the later tie breakers--but still, it's a tiebreaker. Why not put yourself in the best position? Because it bucks tradition?

Teams are constantly trying to score in the final seconds despite being down multiple TD's. We're upset they tried to score 3 instead of 7? A hail mary that leads to 6 is ok, but a kick can only be to cover the spread?

The authour sounds like someone who lost his bet over this. Sour grapes.

Isn't net TDs a higher tie breaker than net points?

According to NFL.Com

1. Head-to-head (best won-lost-tied percentage in games between the clubs).
2. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the division.
3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games.
4. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
5. Strength of victory in all games.
6. Strength of schedule in all games
7. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed in all games.
8. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed in all games.
9. Best net points in common games.
10. Best net points in all games.
11. Best net touchdowns in all games.
12. Coin toss

 

[Gally]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

In that “MN Miracle”’ there was about 10 mins of limbo when the players all left the field, and the PAT hadn’t been kicked.

Incredibly (predictably) that PAT was the difference between a cover or not.

Eventually they ruled the game was over, and IIRC precedent was set that a PAT wasn’t necessary on a GW play.

My understanding is that they do typically attempt the PAT during the regular season for the tie-breaking purposes outlined above. But in the playoffs, that's obviously not a consideration. I also recall seeing a college game once that ended on a walkoff TD with no XP

Nope, you had it right. After the MM, they voted to change the rule so that XP attempts aren't required after walkoff TDs.

I was certain of it.

like I’d said, it almost cost me $800 - I followed the story intensely!

ETA: what I didn’t know before your link was that the Vikes were effected by that rule against the Lions. Nifty.

Except the Vikings actually came back out on the field (at least a few of them) to snap the ball and kneel for the XPT. They still had to do the play but since everyone was gone they just snapped it and knelt. They could have ran it for 2 pts though.

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

I have no problem with it.

It's a tie breaker. Someone pointed out it's one of the later tie breakers--but still, it's a tiebreaker. Why not put yourself in the best position? Because it bucks tradition?

Teams are constantly trying to score in the final seconds despite being down multiple TD's. We're upset they tried to score 3 instead of 7? A hail mary that leads to 6 is ok, but a kick can only be to cover the spread?

The authour sounds like someone who lost his bet over this. Sour grapes.

Isn't net TDs a higher tie breaker than net points?

According to NFL.Com

1. Head-to-head (best won-lost-tied percentage in games between the clubs).
2. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the division.
3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games.
4. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
5. Strength of victory in all games.
6. Strength of schedule in all games
7. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed in all games.
8. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed in all games.
9. Best net points in common games.
10. Best net points in all games.
11. Best net touchdowns in all games.
12. Coin toss

Every time I see the net points tiebreakers I'm reminded of this amazing moment from the '90s when the Packers and Panthers both tried to run up the score on their opponents to win a potential tiebreaker against each other (it became moot a few hours later when Dallas won to eliminate them both)

 

[Moonlight]

333333

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

People much more likely to remember and talk about their bad beats than their miracle finish. Its like we have this in our brain that tells us we are never supposed to lose at anything.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Except the Vikings actually came back out on the field (at least a few of them) to snap the ball and kneel for the XPT.

Oh yeah!!

They still had to do the play but since everyone was gone they just snapped it and knelt. They could have ran it for 2 pts though.

Sure but that would be ridiculous.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

People much more likely to remember and talk about their bad beats than their miracle finish. It’s like we have this in our brain that tells us we are never supposed to lose at anything.

I only remember my miracle finishes. It’s why I’m a degenerate. I always believe miracles will happen!

 

[Da Guru]

To be fair, he made as many people happy as he made mad, no?

I always wonder about that too. People scream "Bad Beats" but aren't there probably just as many people on the other side who benefit?

That is what I have always thought when I hear bad beat. If I had Rams I would be happy.

I have no issue with it..unless I had the Niners