Ran a 10k - Official Thread (3 Viewers)

[ChiefD]

Cool. Thanks for a few minutes to talk this through. Appreciate the help.

I'll see about the nutrition aspect: I need to start tracking my calories better, but I would bet I'm under 2000 calories a day.

Start logging on myfitnesspal. It was an eye opening experience for me. If you're truly eating under 2000 calories a day and running > 30mpw, you've got problems. Unless you're 132 pounds

If you have your profile set up correctly on TomTom's website, your calorie burn should be pretty accurate since you've got HR data. Plug that into myfitnesspal along with every single thing you eat...

We might be on to something here. Logged all my info yesterday into myfitnesspal, and I was 1800 calories SHORT yesterday.

Oof.

Yeeeeeeeeeeesh!

Give us some details.....

How old are you? 46

How much do you weigh? 154

What did you set your base calories at on MFP? It's set at 2394. I think the software calculated it based on the info I put in: height, weight, age, how often I work out.

What did your watch say you burned on your run? 1081 (this was the 8 miler yesterday)

How many calories did you eat? 1639

2394 feels high to me. I'm 175 and that's damn close to my BMR (I've calculated it out - not based on MFP settings). I'm wondering if you're double dipping a bit with the 'how often you work out' and the 1081 burned on your run.

At either rate, 1639 is criminally low! Go pig out today. Seriously.

Keep logging everything and see how you feel. Try to hit the goals set by MFP, but don't stress about hitting it perfectly. I'm betting after a couple of days of eating 2500-3000, you're going to be feeling a lot better.

I'll check the settings on the calorie thing and see if that's the case.

Thanks for all the help guys. Really appreciated.

 

[ChiefD]

If you usually get about half way through a run and you start to feel sluggish, now you know why.

Yeah, this has been happening bad on my long runs.

Sweet, I can eat more!

 

[Hang 10]

Cool. Thanks for a few minutes to talk this through. Appreciate the help.

I'll see about the nutrition aspect: I need to start tracking my calories better, but I would bet I'm under 2000 calories a day.

Start logging on myfitnesspal. It was an eye opening experience for me. If you're truly eating under 2000 calories a day and running > 30mpw, you've got problems. Unless you're 132 pounds

If you have your profile set up correctly on TomTom's website, your calorie burn should be pretty accurate since you've got HR data. Plug that into myfitnesspal along with every single thing you eat...

We might be on to something here. Logged all my info yesterday into myfitnesspal, and I was 1800 calories SHORT yesterday.

Oof.

Yeeeeeeeeeeesh!

Give us some details.....

How old are you? 46

How much do you weigh? 154

What did you set your base calories at on MFP? It's set at 2394. I think the software calculated it based on the info I put in: height, weight, age, how often I work out.

What did your watch say you burned on your run? 1081 (this was the 8 miler yesterday)

How many calories did you eat? 1639

2394 feels high to me. I'm 175 and that's damn close to my BMR (I've calculated it out - not based on MFP settings). I'm wondering if you're double dipping a bit with the 'how often you work out' and the 1081 burned on your run.

At either rate, 1639 is criminally low! Go pig out today. Seriously.

Keep logging everything and see how you feel. Try to hit the goals set by MFP, but don't stress about hitting it perfectly. I'm betting after a couple of days of eating 2500-3000, you're going to be feeling a lot better.

Must just be myfitnesspals software. I'm the same size as Chiefs and it has my goal at 2420. For the most part that's inline with what my nutritionist has said that I need.

 

[Nigel]

Are you shedding a bunch of weight lately Chief? Was that a goal when you started running?

I work hard to maintain my current weight. Dropped 30 when I was sick, was 170 when I started running seriously a year ago and am 168 today. After my morning runs I blend up a shake of 12 oz chocolate milk, a whole frozen banana, 1/4 cup each of penut butter and Greek yogurt and a scoop of chocolate protein powder. So tasty. No idea how many calories but must be a lot and I feel so damn energized afterwards. Not sure if you pay much attention to it but the post run fuel within 30 min of finishing is very important.

 

[Ned]

Are you shedding a bunch of weight lately Chief? Was that a goal when you started running?

I work hard to maintain my current weight. Dropped 30 when I was sick, was 170 when I started running seriously a year ago and am 168 today. After my morning runs I blend up a shake of 12 oz chocolate milk, a whole frozen banana, 1/4 cup each of penut butter and Greek yogurt and a scoop of chocolate protein powder. So tasty. No idea how many calories but must be a lot and I feel so damn energized afterwards. Not sure if you pay much attention to it but the post run fuel within 30 min of finishing is very important.

Sounds awesome - That's like Chief's entire daily intake in one shake!

 

[Hang 10]

Are you shedding a bunch of weight lately Chief? Was that a goal when you started running?

I work hard to maintain my current weight. Dropped 30 when I was sick, was 170 when I started running seriously a year ago and am 168 today. After my morning runs I blend up a shake of 12 oz chocolate milk, a whole frozen banana, 1/4 cup each of penut butter and Greek yogurt and a scoop of chocolate protein powder. So tasty. No idea how many calories but must be a lot and I feel so damn energized afterwards. Not sure if you pay much attention to it but the post run fuel within 30 min of finishing is very important.

Very similar to a post workout shake I have. 1/2 cup of dry oatmeal, 1 banana, 1 cup of almond milk, 2 scoops of chocolate protein powder and 1.5 tbsp of peanut butter. :flex:

 

[SteelCurtain]

Grue - congrats on the epiphany. Life changes require us to make changes. Cool that you recognize it. I'm sure there will come a time when your competitive juices start flowing and you'll want to ramp up your running. Until then....enjoy the time with the lady.

Ned - great archery story! A good friend of mine has a ski condo in Ellicottville. I've been there in the winter. Nice little mountain. You'll like my update below. Also, special thanks to the texts over the summer listening to me ##### and moan about my ankle.

Hang10/Juxt - I'm a bad heart guy too. Had arrhythmia and had a cardioversion a couple years back. In regards to your HR monitor being wonky in the beginning, I had that same problem. I found that if I ran the sensors quickly under water before putting it on, it would record accurately. I think what may be happening is once you start to sweat a little (which may take 1/4 to 1/2 mile), then sensors start getting accurate readings. So I found by putting water on, I would get the right HR immediately. Just a thought.

worrier - Sorry about your mom. Hope she improves. Do your best to take care of her, but make sure you take care of yourself as well. Those runs will help clear your mind.

======================================

My update -- its been quite a while since I've been in here. I was ramping up for a serious BQ attempt for this October. I ran a trail race on May 3 and severely sprained my ankle. Went to podiatrist and she hoped it would get better. After a while, it really didn't. Finally, she got me into physical therapy and I'm making serious progress. The PT guy is my new favorite person. I've been able to run the last three weeks and my long run is up to 8.5 miles. I'm still in PT 3 days a week so running is still tough to do (timewise) with that and trying to lift as well. The BQ Marathon has become an "I'll jog it" marathon with an eye to try to BQ in Fall 2016. In terms of timewise, I'm slightly hopeful I can try to pace my brother in law (at least the first half) for a sub 4 hour marathon during that race, but I'm not going to push it at all. I'll just see where I'm at.

I'll try to start posting more often to keep me honest.

In other good news, I've really tried to watch my diet during this summer of no running, and lost 8 pounds by eating more salads than I would wish on anyone.

Everyone is doing great stuff and can't wait to see PR's all over the place this fall.

 

[worrierking]

Chief, if I get away from the hospital for a while, I will find one the Big Easy's finest eating establishments and I will give you an exhibition of calorie consumption! I will put on a clinic.

 

[ChiefD]

Are you shedding a bunch of weight lately Chief? Was that a goal when you started running?

I work hard to maintain my current weight. Dropped 30 when I was sick, was 170 when I started running seriously a year ago and am 168 today. After my morning runs I blend up a shake of 12 oz chocolate milk, a whole frozen banana, 1/4 cup each of penut butter and Greek yogurt and a scoop of chocolate protein powder. So tasty. No idea how many calories but must be a lot and I feel so damn energized afterwards. Not sure if you pay much attention to it but the post run fuel within 30 min of finishing is very important.

No, not really. I originally started at 172 three years ago and dropped down to about 155 pretty quickly. I've held pretty steady around that number ever since.

 

[ChiefD]

Chief, if I get away from the hospital for a while, I will find one the Big Easy's finest eating establishments and I will give you an exhibition of calorie consumption! I will put on a clinic.

 

[tri-man 47]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

 

[SFBayDuck]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

I'll chime in from the fat guy perspective and say that I definitely don't think this is always necessary. After an easy (aerobic/MAF) or recovery run of 90 minutes or less you haven't really done much muscle damage or completely depleted glycogen stores, so just eating when you would normally eat your next meal would be fine. I think this does come into play after hard workouts or if you have a short window between efforts (Steve and Ned's two-a-days).

Most all of my runs are in the morning and fasted (just coffee with a little coconut milk), even my "workouts" like the hill repeats I referenced yesterday or the 9 miler with 4 miles hard downhill I did today. I definitely look to take in something with carbs, protein, and fats right afterward and often will supplement with amino acids (I use MAP) to help immediately start that muscle repair.

But big picture I agree with everyone else here regarding Chief's situation - it just doesn't sound like you are getting enough calories to support the amount of running you are doing. If you struggle to eat enough then get some good fats in there as an easy way to get in some dense, healthy calories - coconut milk, coconut oil, avocado, grass fed butter or meat, fatty fish, raw nuts, etc.

 

[2Young2BBald]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

I remember watching Kiana on ESPN (you know, for the fitness tips) https://www.google.com/search?q=kiana+tom&espv=2&biw=1093&bih=514&site=webhp&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMI15DvvdymxwIVgXI-Ch3-zQNjand recall her mentioning something similar, stating that the window in which it was best to consume calories to "feed" the muscles was within 45 minutes of the workout.

 

[SFBayDuck]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

I remember watching Kiana on ESPN (you know, for the fitness tips) https://www.google.com/search?q=kiana+tom&espv=2&biw=1093&bih=514&site=webhp&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMI15DvvdymxwIVgXI-Ch3-zQNjand recall her mentioning something similar, stating that the window in which it was best to consume calories to "feed" the muscles was within 45 minutes of the workout.

Kiana spoke? I never noticed, and must have "watched" her show 1000s of times in my teen years.

 

[2Young2BBald]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

I remember watching Kiana on ESPN (you know, for the fitness tips) https://www.google.com/search?q=kiana+tom&espv=2&biw=1093&bih=514&site=webhp&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAWoVChMI15DvvdymxwIVgXI-Ch3-zQNjand recall her mentioning something similar, stating that the window in which it was best to consume calories to "feed" the muscles was within 45 minutes of the workout.

Kiana spoke? I never noticed, and must have "watched" her show 1000s of times in my teen years.

HFS, I just Googled up her age, she is 50 She needs to be added to the hottest women over 50 thread stat.

 

[Ned]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

I'll chime in from the fat guy perspective and say that I definitely don't think this is always necessary. After an easy (aerobic/MAF) or recovery run of 90 minutes or less you haven't really done much muscle damage or completely depleted glycogen stores, so just eating when you would normally eat your next meal would be fine. I think this does come into play after hard workouts or if you have a short window between efforts (Steve and Ned's two-a-days).

Most all of my runs are in the morning and fasted (just coffee with a little coconut milk), even my "workouts" like the hill repeats I referenced yesterday or the 9 miler with 4 miles hard downhill I did today. I definitely look to take in something with carbs, protein, and fats right afterward and often will supplement with amino acids (I use MAP) to help immediately start that muscle repair.

But big picture I agree with everyone else here regarding Chief's situation - it just doesn't sound like you are getting enough calories to support the amount of running you are doing. If you struggle to eat enough then get some good fats in there as an easy way to get in some dense, healthy calories - coconut milk, coconut oil, avocado, grass fed butter or meat, fatty fish, raw nuts, etc.

I didn't want to over-complicate things, but since you said it.....

I fully believe the 2 bolded points are important for any long distance runner. Becoming fat adapted changed my running forever.

Avocados

 

[FUBAR]

But this is a good thing, Chiefs. You can't fix a problem if you don't identify it. And we've definitely found a problem.

Years before I was a runner, I was a gym rat. Loved lifting weights. The best piece of advice that I was given back then was that your muscles don't grow in the gym. They grow when you eat and rest. You can bench press 24/7 but without the proper nutrition you can't get the gains.

Now, I know running is different that body building but the general principle is true. It's not at all surprising that your potential is being stunted by your diet.

This is why it's recommended we consume calories (and protein) within 15-30 minutes of a workout ...need to refuel the muscles as they start to repair and grow.

I'll chime in from the fat guy perspective and say that I definitely don't think this is always necessary. After an easy (aerobic/MAF) or recovery run of 90 minutes or less you haven't really done much muscle damage or completely depleted glycogen stores, so just eating when you would normally eat your next meal would be fine. I think this does come into play after hard workouts or if you have a short window between efforts (Steve and Ned's two-a-days).

Most all of my runs are in the morning and fasted (just coffee with a little coconut milk), even my "workouts" like the hill repeats I referenced yesterday or the 9 miler with 4 miles hard downhill I did today. I definitely look to take in something with carbs, protein, and fats right afterward and often will supplement with amino acids (I use MAP) to help immediately start that muscle repair.

But big picture I agree with everyone else here regarding Chief's situation - it just doesn't sound like you are getting enough calories to support the amount of running you are doing. If you struggle to eat enough then get some good fats in there as an easy way to get in some dense, healthy calories - coconut milk, coconut oil, avocado, grass fed butter or meat, fatty fish, raw nuts, etc.

it's funny because with Duck, it's true.

Kiana spoke? I never noticed, and must have "watched" her show 1000s of times in my teen years.

GB ESPN's fitness shows.

 

[Hang 10]

I was doing some fasted runs earlier in the year and I think they are fine when running under an hour but don't you think that's more of an advanced training method? I'm at the point where I just want get some quality training in and I'm not going to get there if I'm completely depleted of glycogen by the end of my run. I'm just thinking that there are more important things I need to work on first.

 

[Ned]

I was doing some fasted runs earlier in the year and I think they are fine when running under an hour but don't you think that's more of an advanced training method? I'm at the point where I just want get some quality training in and I'm not going to get there if I'm completely depleted of glycogen by the end of my run. I'm just thinking that there are more important things I need to work on first.

I don't think anyone's advocating jumping head first and running everything fasted. I started by doing just recovery runs in a fasted state and gradually worked my way up to 20mi last year. If you run your first fasted run on your Sunday long, you're probably not going to like the results. As with everything else, you need to ease into it.

 

[Hang 10]

I was doing some fasted runs earlier in the year and I think they are fine when running under an hour but don't you think that's more of an advanced training method? I'm at the point where I just want get some quality training in and I'm not going to get there if I'm completely depleted of glycogen by the end of my run. I'm just thinking that there are more important things I need to work on first.

I don't think anyone's advocating jumping head first and running everything fasted. I started by doing just recovery runs in a fasted state and gradually worked my way up to 20mi last year. If you run your first fasted run on your Sunday long, you're probably not going to like the results. As with everything else, you need to ease into it.

Yeah, I realize it's a process and I did gradually work my up. And it may be fine for you. You are definitely farther ahead of me as fitness and training. I was just saying for me, I don't want my body working any harder for lack of fuel at this point. As my fitness improves, I may go back to some fasted runs.

 

[Juxtatarot]

This thread is very good at reminding me of a whole host of things I do wrong.

 

[SFBayDuck]

This thread is very good at reminding me of a whole host of things I do wrong.

While I think I do a lot of things "right", you would smoke me at every distance below 50 miles. And probably there, too. So there's that.

 

[Nigel]

How are we defining fasted runs?

Before my early morning runs I don't eat anything, just take 8 oz of water or so and go, usually 6 - 8 miles without any hunger issues.

On the other hand I've had a big lunch at 1 and then gone out for a run at 4 and had to stop after a few miles because I'm overcome with hunger.

 

[Nigel]

Ned - on a 20M fasted run you can do it without any GUs or anything along the way?

 

[tri-man 47]

How are we defining fasted runs?

Before my early morning runs I don't eat anything, just take 8 oz of water or so and go, usually 6 - 8 miles without any hunger issues.

This is my pattern (maybe just a little nibble of something to, uh, get the system working so I clear the pipes before heading out). My stomach might be growling a bit, but I'll run a good 10-12 or even more without eating. For a harder effort, I'll add a gu or two. The basic hunger is just a minor irritant.

 

[Ned]

Ned - on a 20M fasted run you can do it without any GUs or anything along the way?

Yeah, just water during the run. I used to rely heavily on gels to get me through long runs (1 every 5mi), but I no longer need them after changing my diet to high fat/high protein and working my way up on fasted runs. I will still train with them at times to make sure my body still accepts them for race day (changed from 1 every 5mi to 2 gels total for racing the full). I've been experimenting with Tail Wind recently. So far so good.

A fasted run is generally no calories ingested before running. I'll drink a black cup of coffee and some water while I'm still waking up. The coffee usually does the trick to get the GI a-churnin'.

 

[FUBAR]

Ned - on a 20M fasted run you can do it without any GUs or anything along the way?

if you're running in zone 2 or below MAF, you'll be surprised at how long you can go without taking a gel.

 

[worrierking]

I got away for a four-miler yesterday. Mom has been officially diagnosed with a rare blood cancer called Waldenstrom's Macroglobulinemia. It's a slow-moving cancer but in her condition we are not certain if we will treat it or not. She has moderate Alzheimer's, so we have to consider her future with that in mind. Honestly, dying of cancer now would spare her the indignities of the worst of Alzheimer's.

Going to try to run again today if she is asleep or occupied.

I am out of clean running clothes so I will reek.

I never eat before a run, but I am not sure I am a good example of best practices. In my last good training period I got to the point where running a 20-miler without any nutrition was no big deal.

 

[Hang 10]

Man, sorry to hear that, worrierking. :(

 

[tri-man 47]

Damn, worrierking ...tough times for your mom whichever way you turn. Sorry to hear.

 

[Ned]

Damn, worrierking ...tough times for your mom whichever way you turn. Sorry to hear.

Thinking of you, worrier.

 

[FUBAR]

Damn, worrierking ...tough times for your mom whichever way you turn. Sorry to hear.

Thoughts and prayers good buddy.

 

[ChiefD]

Ned - on a 20M fasted run you can do it without any GUs or anything along the way?

Yeah, just water during the run. I used to rely heavily on gels to get me through long runs (1 every 5mi), but I no longer need them after changing my diet to high fat/high protein and working my way up on fasted runs. I will still train with them at times to make sure my body still accepts them for race day (changed from 1 every 5mi to 2 gels total for racing the full). I've been experimenting with Tail Wind recently. So far so good.

A fasted run is generally no calories ingested before running. I'll drink a black cup of coffee and some water while I'm still waking up. The coffee usually does the trick to get the GI a-churnin'.

For your races, what gels are you using?

I've been experimenting with different things this cycle, but want to try and nail this down by next week so I can use the last 7 weeks dialing in my race day strategy.

 

[MAC_32]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

 

[ChiefD]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

I've been using Honey stingers ever since I started running. So I'm real comfortable with em and my stomach can handle them.

How many are you taking when you race? During my long runs, I usually take 2 about every 3-4 miles.

 

[ChiefD]

Ned - another question.

Since you switched to a high fat/high protein diet, how much of each are you taking in? Are you staying within the recommended daily allowances or are you going way above that?

 

[Alex P Keaton]

How are we defining fasted runs?

Before my early morning runs I don't eat anything, just take 8 oz of water or so and go, usually 6 - 8 miles without any hunger issues.

This is my pattern (maybe just a little nibble of something to, uh, get the system working so I clear the pipes before heading out). My stomach might be growling a bit, but I'll run a good 10-12 or even more without eating. For a harder effort, I'll add a gu or two. The basic hunger is just a minor irritant.

Tri: I'm just getting into runs > 15 miles now (race day Oct 25th!) and am looking for advice on caloric intake during the race ....and during long training runs. Any advice? I'm not a huge fan of taking in too many calories while I run....just doesn't make my stomach feel great. In the past I've brought along a small plastic bag of jelly beans.....but 13 miles is just a different animal than 26.....All suggestions would be appreciated!

 

[FUBAR]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

I've been using Honey stingers ever since I started running. So I'm real comfortable with em and my stomach can handle them.

How many are you taking when you race? During my long runs, I usually take 2 about every 3-4 miles.

the wafles? at 160 calories each, 320 calories every 3-4 miles?

by the way, who's this Royals' fan?

 

[MAC_32]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

I've been using Honey stingers ever since I started running. So I'm real comfortable with em and my stomach can handle them.How many are you taking when you race? During my long runs, I usually take 2 about every 3-4 miles.

I try to hold out as long as I can then once I have one it's usually one every 20 mins or so. Gotta know where the water stops are though. I go more than thirty minutes without one and I really start scuffling.I don't use them on my long runs. If I'm worried about running out of calories I make sure to end up near my starting point 50-75% of the way and have a nutrigrain bar on standby. More often than not I will just eat a banana twenty minutes before my long run and that holds me over.

Keep in mind, my long runs are different than most here. I have been racing 10-half and most of my long runs are 7-11. Just now getting to the 12+ ones. Still may hold out til September if it doesn't cool down soon.

 

[MAC_32]

Ned - another question.

Since you switched to a high fat/high protein diet, how much of each are you taking in? Are you staying within the recommended daily allowances or are you going way above that?

If the fats you're consuming are good fats then the daily intake allowances are irrelevant. Just check out JJ Watt's diet making the rounds right now.

 

[ChiefD]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

I've been using Honey stingers ever since I started running. So I'm real comfortable with em and my stomach can handle them.

How many are you taking when you race? During my long runs, I usually take 2 about every 3-4 miles.

the wafles? at 160 calories each, 320 calories every 3-4 miles?

by the way, who's this Royals' fan?

No, they are the organic chews. Which are 160 calories per pack. And there are about 10 per pack. Usually go through about a pack on a long run. And so far, that's been about 15 miles at the longest. So I guess I'm taking in 160 calories over 15 miles.

Too little?

 

[Juxtatarot]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

I've been using Honey stingers ever since I started running. So I'm real comfortable with em and my stomach can handle them.How many are you taking when you race? During my long runs, I usually take 2 about every 3-4 miles.

the wafles? at 160 calories each, 320 calories every 3-4 miles?

by the way, who's this Royals' fan?

No, they are the organic chews. Which are 160 calories per pack. And there are about 10 per pack. Usually go through about a pack on a long run. And so far, that's been about 15 miles at the longest. So I guess I'm taking in 160 calories over 15 miles.Too little?

Probably. Duck posted a link to an article that suggested about 200 calories an hour, IIRC. That's my plan. A gel (100 calories) every half hour.

 

[FUBAR]

Honey stingers for me. The consistency of gels initiates my gag reflex. That was not an enjoyable race experience.

I've been using Honey stingers ever since I started running. So I'm real comfortable with em and my stomach can handle them.How many are you taking when you race? During my long runs, I usually take 2 about every 3-4 miles.

the wafles? at 160 calories each, 320 calories every 3-4 miles?

by the way, who's this Royals' fan?

No, they are the organic chews. Which are 160 calories per pack. And there are about 10 per pack. Usually go through about a pack on a long run. And so far, that's been about 15 miles at the longest. So I guess I'm taking in 160 calories over 15 miles.Too little?

Probably. Duck posted a link to an article that suggested about 200 calories an hour, IIRC. That's my plan. A gel (100 calories) every half hour.

I always find the variety of techniques interesting. I usually consume a lot less while running or swimming. Cycling I'll eat more, but don't really do gels unless racing.

 

[pbm107]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

 

[Juxtatarot]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

Do you stick with water or take some sports drink?

 

[pbm107]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

Do you stick with water or take some sports drink?

Just water.

 

[Juxtatarot]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

Do you stick with water or take some sports drink?

Just water.

That's amazingly few calories. It goes to show how different runners can be. I've had a bad history of bonking in marathons. In general though I think I'm better off with lots of calories. I've never had GI issues. The hydration/nutrition part is what I hate most about marathons. I never know for sure if I'm doing it right. (And I historically likely haven't.)

 

[pbm107]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

Do you stick with water or take some sports drink?

Just water.

That's amazingly few calories. It goes to show how different runners can be. I've had a bad history of bonking in marathons. In general though I think I'm better off with lots of calories. I've never had GI issues. The hydration/nutrition part is what I hate most about marathons. I never know for sure if I'm doing it right. (And I historically likely haven't.)

We are all different and perhaps I should be taking more. I don't like the idea of forcing gels down when I don't want them. I don't know why you have had issues bonking, but I think most cases are due to running beyond ones fitness level rather than hydration/nutrition.

 

[Juxtatarot]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

Do you stick with water or take some sports drink?

Just water.

That's amazingly few calories. It goes to show how different runners can be. I've had a bad history of bonking in marathons. In general though I think I'm better off with lots of calories. I've never had GI issues. The hydration/nutrition part is what I hate most about marathons. I never know for sure if I'm doing it right. (And I historically likely haven't.)

We are all different and perhaps I should be taking more. I don't like the idea of forcing gels down when I don't want them. I don't know why you have had issues bonking, but I think most cases are due to running beyond ones fitness level rather than hydration/nutrition.

My understanding is the faster you're running compared to your fitness level the faster you go through your carbohydrate stores. If you can add to that during the race and your body can process it, then you can delay the bonk or hopefully even eliminate it.

A little bit ago I read this article that mentions:

Like almost every other facet of running, the timing of when you should take your gels is very individual. Each runner absorbs and processes carbohydrates at a different rate — some can feel the effect within three minutes while others might take up to 15 minutes.

This variation in absorption rate has to do with how well your stomach reacts to the gel. When running hard, your body often diverts blood away from the digestive track to help your legs continue to move forward (your body naturally conserves resources). Sometimes, however, your body shuts the stomach down completely while other times it just slows down. This is why it isn’t uncommon to see runners throw up fluids or gels right after ingesting them late in the race.

I wonder if your feeling about "forcing one down" is your body telling you something. I've gotten that feeling late in marathons where I have no interest whatsoever in eating or drinking. I had previously assumed I was just too tired but now I'm wondering if it's my stomach shutting down.

 

[pbm107]

All of my runs are fasted except for when I run at lunch. I do take clif gels during marathons, 3 for my first marathon, 2 for my 2nd, and 1 for my last marathon. Each time I planned on taking one after every five miles, but I stopped taking them when I didn't want them. I think that proper pacing in a marathon is far more important than how one fuels during the race. So I wouldn't worry about it too much and just take what you are comfortable taking.

Do you stick with water or take some sports drink?

Just water.

That's amazingly few calories. It goes to show how different runners can be. I've had a bad history of bonking in marathons. In general though I think I'm better off with lots of calories. I've never had GI issues. The hydration/nutrition part is what I hate most about marathons. I never know for sure if I'm doing it right. (And I historically likely haven't.)

We are all different and perhaps I should be taking more. I don't like the idea of forcing gels down when I don't want them. I don't know why you have had issues bonking, but I think most cases are due to running beyond ones fitness level rather than hydration/nutrition.

My understanding is the faster you're running compared to your fitness level the faster you go through your carbohydrate stores. If you can add to that during the race and your body can process it, then you can delay the bonk or hopefully even eliminate it.

A little bit ago I read this article that mentions:

Like almost every other facet of running, the timing of when you should take your gels is very individual. Each runner absorbs and processes carbohydrates at a different rate — some can feel the effect within three minutes while others might take up to 15 minutes.

This variation in absorption rate has to do with how well your stomach reacts to the gel. When running hard, your body often diverts blood away from the digestive track to help your legs continue to move forward (your body naturally conserves resources). Sometimes, however, your body shuts the stomach down completely while other times it just slows down. This is why it isn’t uncommon to see runners throw up fluids or gels right after ingesting them late in the race.

I wonder if your feeling about "forcing one down" is your body telling you something. I've gotten that feeling late in marathons where I have no interest whatsoever in eating or drinking. I had previously assumed I was just too tired but now I'm wondering if it's my stomach shutting down.

I think you are right in that my stomach was slowing down or shutting down completely. I have come to learn that my body is a lot smarter than I am, and I am trying to get better at listening to it.