Ran a 10k - Official Thread (6 Viewers)

[SFBayDuck]

I think it's quite likely that every runner that finishes an ultra has some level of rhabdo.  Whether that's CK levels of 5,000 or 50,000, I have no idea.  I'd love to know and find out. 

Damn, sorry you had to go through that again.  I think you're right, the labs of anyone who finishes a 100 miler are going to be off the charts, but seems like you've had a rough go these past two times.  Don't blame you at all for hanging up the 100M shoes.  Just find some nice 100Ks, you'll probably end up winning one of those one of these days!

 

[gianmarco]

I don't even have words for what I just read. Simply amazing.

 

[SteelCurtain]

@SayWhat? - Absolutely incredible.  I say that because I don't think I have the guts to even toe the starting line of a 100 mile race and here you are crushing it.  Amazing.

Now, can you do me a favor, can you accept my Strava friend request?  Its been out there for a couple weeks and I'm starting to think you don't like me.  (I'm Blind Ref).

 

[El Floppo]

great googly, man. I cried- repeatedly- watching the videos and seeing those pictures. SO amazing. Just in awe of the whole thing.

I am dumbfounded- completely- that you ran at altitude with essentially no altitude training on so little weekly mileage. I used to go up to Tahoe in HS and college and bust out some runs (top 20 d1 college soccer player) that killed me. 5 mile runs- dead. those first yards uphill with the head pounding and the heart racing... I literally can't comprehend how you did this.

####### BEARS MAN!!!!!!!!!!l

sweet jeebus... the whole thing, including that incredible race report...      

 

[El Floppo]

and I remember during my one and only IM- at about 12 hours into the race during the marathon, I had no idea when I'd finish. my brain just couldn't do the math at all. I had ditched nutrition plan partway through the bike and I was hurting. but I thought it would be somewhere around the 13 hour mark. One wrinkle- I was going to propose to my GF right before the end on the last turn of speed skating oval... but I also wanted to finish under 13 hours. that math had me completely messed up- do I finish first and THEN propose? I wasn't even sure I'd be able to stand back up when I knelt to give her the ring... that wouldn't have been good.

and all of that was HALF what you went through. and, more importantly, split up between sports to lessen the load/pounding. my brain and body would've turned to jelly out in the sierra. absolutely flat out mind-bottled at what you did.

oh... I think she said yes.

 

[JShare87]

I just can’t fathom the mental toughness it takes to do what @SayWhat? did. Seriously a super-human effort. You’re a bad man. 

 

[SteelCurtain]

Oh, one other thing.  That guy who said you wouldn't break 24 hours.  He's the biggest **** on the planet.  Maybe I give him a little pass because he might have been blotto from running for 23 hours, but still, no excuse for that level of douchey-ness.

 

[lumpy19]

@SayWhat? - Absolutely incredible.  I say that because I don't think I have the guts to even toe the starting line of a 100 mile race and here you are crushing it.  Amazing.

Now, can you do me a favor, can you accept my Strava friend request?  Its been out there for a couple weeks and I'm starting to think you don't like me.  (I'm Blind Ref).

I screenshotted his Strava entry for the 100 miler and put it on my wall, it’s beautiful 

 

[Brony]

Now there's a race report! ####ing boulders, piss pants, near misses by Karens in minivans and the bears are actually bears not phantom poos in your large intestines. 

Really proud of everything that you poured into this event @SayWhat?. You've already earned everything that you ought to get from this race, but big thanks to you for sharing your thoughts and experiences - it sounds like a bucket list kind of experience that you got to share with your friends and family and allowed some internet schlubs to glimpse. Pretty. GD. Cool. 

Loved it. Thanks. 

 

[ChiefD]

Rise and shine @The Iguana. Let's get this done. 

 

[The Iguana]

Rise and shine @The Iguana. Let's get this done. 

I'm up, just finished reading the last part of the race report with breakfast. How could I not be about to go run? 

 

[Zasada]

@SayWhat?, such an incredible race and RR.  You're as skilled a writer as runner!

I'm sitting here trying to think of a way to describe my awe and admiration for what you accomplished, and I have nothing.

Simply epic.

And I'm glad you're going to avoid 100-milers (and rhabdo) in the future.  Your kidneys thank you, and so does your family.  You achieved your goals.  Nobody can take that away from you.  Kick ###, dude.

 

[tri-man 47]

Incredible reports, @SayWhat?!  What an epic race for you.  Way to go out on top!

 

[-OZ-]

 @SayWhat? 

We're not worthy

 

[-OZ-]

 finished last in my age group Wet  

5th overall. Gotta love the rule when they go by your age at the end of the season. (Turn 45 next month)

 

[The Iguana]

I'm up, just finished reading the last part of the race report with breakfast. How could I not be about to go run? 

Well... good news is that week 1 is done. Not feeling particularly confident after finishing it, however. I'm not really prepared for this, physically or mentally. 



But I'm going to do the best i can to "fake it till I make it" or something like that. Just feeling particularly non BMF-ish right now. 

 

[gruecd]

@SayWhat?

Super impressive.  You may have inspired me to give this a shot someday...

 

[gruecd]

Just feeling particularly non BMF-ish right now. 

Join the club.

 

[bushdocda]

I took me some time to get through that legendary race report, my god what a read and what an inspiring BMF. @SayWhat?! best to you in recovery and what’s next.  

How do you ultra guys have pics and links and everything. Unreal. 

 

[gianmarco]

Join the club.

I'm not only the president.  But I'm also a client.

 

[SayWhat?]

And @SayWhat? your buckle may be a lot shinier than mine because you beat me by, oh, only six hours.....but my split on the track is waaaay faster than yours  

Hey man, a finish is a finish at this race in my opinion.  Whether it’s 14 hours or 29:59, every finish and pace has different challenges.  And you for sure smoked me on that track!  But I bet you’ve never pissed on that infield!!  

Damn, sorry you had to go through that again.  I think you're right, the labs of anyone who finishes a 100 miler are going to be off the charts, but seems like you've had a rough go these past two times.  Don't blame you at all for hanging up the 100M shoes.  Just find some nice 100Ks, you'll probably end up winning one of those one of these days!

Yeah, I don’t have the foot speed to “win” anything when it comes to running. 

As it relates to rhabdo, at this stage I do have to question if my low mileage approach and history (as @pbm107 was inquiring about) has put me in a hole from the start in the battle to avoid rhabdo.  If I was putting more miles on my legs in training, say 50-60/week instead of 30-40, you’d think the muscle breakdown would be staved off for a longer period of time.  At least, I would think.    So I think this is where my historical ability to push through to finishes, possibly despite being undertrained (?), has hurt me far more than it’s helped?

But I’m excited about the next chapter.  I’m also excited about giving a bit more back in the form of volunteering at our local ultras.  

 

[SayWhat?]

@SayWhat? - Absolutely incredible.  I say that because I don't think I have the guts to even toe the starting line of a 100 mile race and here you are crushing it.  Amazing.

Now, can you do me a favor, can you accept my Strava friend request?  Its been out there for a couple weeks and I'm starting to think you don't like me.  (I'm Blind Ref).

Ha!  I saw a few requests come through, some of which I didn’t recognize!  Though I don’t really use Strava, I’ll pop on and accept now.  
 

If anyone else sent Strava requests from here, identify yourself at once!  

 

[SayWhat?]

Oh, one other thing.  That guy who said you wouldn't break 24 hours.  He's the biggest **** on the planet.  Maybe I give him a little pass because he might have been blotto from running for 23 hours, but still, no excuse for that level of douchey-ness.

What a ####!  And he obviously didn't know what he was talking about.
 

Agreed.  Total ****.  To interject pacing proclamations to other runners at mile 98 (or anywhere, for that matter), without being asked for that opinion is a completely douchey thing to do.  Especially when you’re flat out wrong.  Wanted to punch that guy at the medal ceremony, as he finished a few spots ahead of me.

ETA:  I really think there’s a chance that I finish that race with full mental capacity if I didn’t blitz myself trying to run up that hill after he said we needed to be running.  Possibly not.  But that was the point beyond which I don’t remember much of what happened. ####er.

 

[SayWhat?]

@SayWhat?, such an incredible race and RR.  You're as skilled a writer as runner!

I'm sitting here trying to think of a way to describe my awe and admiration for what you accomplished, and I have nothing.

Simply epic.

And I'm glad you're going to avoid 100-milers (and rhabdo) in the future.  Your kidneys thank you, and so does your family.  You achieved your goals.  Nobody can take that away from you.  Kick ###, dude.

The bolded was my ultimate litmus test. Maybe I’ll give it a go again when the girls are 18 and Sue is looking for a new husband.

 

[SayWhat?]

@SayWhat?

Super impressive.  You may have inspired me to give this a shot someday...

Do it.  You wouldn’t regret it.  And I’ll be there to watch if you do it.  

 

[Brony]

 finished last in my age group Wet  

5th overall. Gotta love the rule when they go by your age at the end of the season. (Turn 45 next month)

Congrats on the AG Win!?! 

5th out of 127 - great job man!   Looking forward to hearing more about how things went. . 

 

[ChiefD]

5th overall. Gotta love the rule when they go by your age at the end of the season. (Turn 45 next month)

Awesome job! 

 

[-OZ-]

Congrats on the AG Win!?! 

5th out of 127 - great job man!   Looking forward to hearing more about how things went. . 

I'll actually do a race report for once. 

With  a little more than one mile left I had the weird experience of getting dizzy briefly, I was running straight but it was like I was getting pushed to the left, almost into runners going the opposite direction. I was able to correct, then started going right while trying to run straight. Less than a minute later I focused on breathing and was fine. But that was really odd. Looking at my Strava feed, it was probably where my HR spiked from ~165 to 188.

 

[El Floppo]

Ha!  I saw a few requests come through, some of which I didn’t recognize!  Though I don’t really use Strava, I’ll pop on and accept now.  
 

If anyone else sent Strava requests from here, identify yourself at once!  

Please PM Shuke for my strava initials MK info

 

[SteelCurtain]

Ha!  I saw a few requests come through, some of which I didn’t recognize!  Though I don’t really use Strava, I’ll pop on and accept now.  
 

If anyone else sent Strava requests from here, identify yourself at once!  

Brad = Brony.

Chicago guy who rides the bike more than running due to injury issues.  A great guy.

 

[tri-man 47]

 finished last in my age group Wet  

Ricky Bobby would be very confused.

 

[Juxtatarot]

Week 1 Report

We're now 17 weeks out, right?  I'm not sure how many of these I'll write up but I'd like to do them at least occasionally.  I would like to read yours too.

65.4 miles for the week averaging 7:14.  That's the most miles I've done in a long time but a little slower than I've been running lately.  I'm glad to get that many miles in.  I had planned to take Thursday off but I got home from the colonoscopy in the late morning, felt fine and had nothing else to do on an unusually cool summer afternoon.  Prep also messed with my nutrition routine so I felt a little off during the week. 

I didn't get many miles in below marathon pace.  I'm definitely planning to get a tempo in this week.  That will be the main week 2 goal.

The highlight of the week was yesterday's 20-miler.  Averaged 7:25/125.  Pre-run plan was to run at least 18 but slow -- focus on endurance benefits.  Plan was to never get below 7:30 pace.  After the first handful of miles I felt fine and the heart rate was low so that plan changed to running 20 and wanting to get the average pace down below 7:30.  Overall it was a successful run.  I felt OK at the end.  Nagging injuries were there but not as bad as last week's long run that had 14 miles at about marathon pace. I didn't bonk.   I decided to take some green apple Gatorade chews that someone gave me last year.  I think that was the first time I've eaten since marathon training in 2019.  I forgot how good it can feel to eat during a run even if the 100 calories over 20 miles was probably more a mental benefit than physical.  I have to decide what I want to do for calories for the marathon -- if I want to the gel/chew thing with water, sports drink or maybe a combination of the two.  

This is an example on how I train unconventionally.  It makes me feel self-conscious at times.  You're never going to see an 18-week marathon program start with a 20-miler in the first week.  But my effort was low enough that recovery wasn't a problem.  I took the first few miles slow today but quickly felt fine. I think that long time on my feet was worth it. 

 

[-OZ-]

Wet Dog RR

This was the first race I did after moving to Madison, AL 6 years ago, did it again in 2016, then they stopped it for two years, I didn't do it in 2019 because it fell on my then-11yo's birthday, like most races it was canceled in 2020. So it was great to be able to do it again. It's at our local water park, Point Mallard. 

I find myself telling my kids way too often "for a really smart guy, that was dumb!" Well, after using my Suunto watch for 4 years and many triathlons I finally figured out  how to use triathlon mode instead of going through each sport, which is really inconvenient while running through transition. so,

Training for short distances has gone alright this year, so I felt pretty good going into this event. 

Swim: 400 meters, 6:31 

The race organizers erred with numbering, putting our numbers alphabetically. Thankfully the director told us to get in time order, or the early alphabet swimmers probably would have gotten run over. we line up, and start one at a time with about 1-2 seconds between. That worked much better, and with only 127 participants it went quickly.  I was towards the front, maybe 20 in front of me. 

Strava shows 588 yards which I'm sure is incorrect, I was not swimming at a 1:06 pace.  400 meters at 6:31 is still 1:28, which is about right.  I'm fairly content with it. Felt good, but it goes quick. 

T1: 2:23

The jog from the beach, through the park, the gate, and into the lawn, was about 1/8 of a mile, fairly smooth overall. With wet and grassy feet putting on shoes took a little long, but okay overall. No socks. 

Bike: 9.3 Miles, 24:42, 21.8mph

I felt pretty confident with the bike. The trainer sessions with an emphasis on speed and power helped. But I'm still slower than either of my previous races here. But I'm also 5 years older.  Felt good, drank some skratch, didn't bother to eat anything. I don't think food is really needed for a sprint tri. 

Tried the flying dismount. Took my feet out of my shoes too early, I'll need to time that better. Speed dropped about 3mph while taking the shoes off, so I probably lost 15-20 seconds here. 

T2: 1:09

I can get faster here. Tried to clean my feet up a bit as they still had grass on them and I'd prefer to not run with grass in the shoes. No socks for a sprint. 

Run: 3.1 Miles,  22:25, 7:33 pace

Once again, significantly slower than in 15 or 16; by about 40 seconds per mile.  

It always takes a little while to settle into a run coming off the bike. With the first two miles being on a trail (decent gravel trail) I'm a bit more cautious than I would be on a road. About a mile in, I got behind and then passed a 24yo dude, which is always motivating.  With the first two miles being on gravel, splits of 7:45, 7:38, 7:15 is about as expected. 

As mentioned yesterday, at 2.6 miles I felt dizzy, and like a huge gust of wind or something pushed me to the left, and then to the right, which is noticeable on Strava. thankfully I was able to keep going and got over it quickly so I'm not concerned, but it was odd. 

Pushed a bit in the last half mile, not being near anyone and having just felt dizzy meant I didn't want to push any harder. 

Overall, I'm content with the race. I don't like seeing that I'm definitely slower. I know I'm slowing down with the run, but thought my bike was maintaining. I guess it's fairly normal, but I'll need to ramp up my training in the future. 

 

[-OZ-]

Week 1 Report

This is an example on how I train unconventionally.  It makes me feel self-conscious at times.  You're never going to see an 18-week marathon program start with a 20-miler in the first week.  But my effort was low enough that recovery wasn't a problem.  I took the first few miles slow today but quickly felt fine. I think that long time on my feet was worth it. 

Most training programs don't have the runner starting with your base and fitness level. It sounds to me like you're doing exactly what you should be doing. 

 

[lumpy19]

Wet Dog RR

This was the first race I did after moving to Madison, AL 6 years ago, did it again in 2016, then they stopped it for two years, I didn't do it in 2019 because it fell on my then-11yo's birthday, like most races it was canceled in 2020. So it was great to be able to do it again. It's at our local water park, Point Mallard. 

I find myself telling my kids way too often "for a really smart guy, that was dumb!" Well, after using my Suunto watch for 4 years and many triathlons I finally figured out  how to use triathlon mode instead of going through each sport, which is really inconvenient while running through transition. so,

Training for short distances has gone alright this year, so I felt pretty good going into this event. 

Swim: 400 meters, 6:31 

The race organizers erred with numbering, putting our numbers alphabetically. Thankfully the director told us to get in time order, or the early alphabet swimmers probably would have gotten run over. we line up, and start one at a time with about 1-2 seconds between. That worked much better, and with only 127 participants it went quickly.  I was towards the front, maybe 20 in front of me. 

Strava shows 588 yards which I'm sure is incorrect, I was not swimming at a 1:06 pace.  400 meters at 6:31 is still 1:28, which is about right.  I'm fairly content with it. Felt good, but it goes quick. 

T1: 2:23

The jog from the beach, through the park, the gate, and into the lawn, was about 1/8 of a mile, fairly smooth overall. With wet and grassy feet putting on shoes took a little long, but okay overall. No socks. 

Bike: 9.3 Miles, 24:42, 21.8mph

I felt pretty confident with the bike. The trainer sessions with an emphasis on speed and power helped. But I'm still slower than either of my previous races here. But I'm also 5 years older.  Felt good, drank some skratch, didn't bother to eat anything. I don't think food is really needed for a sprint tri. 

Tried the flying dismount. Took my feet out of my shoes too early, I'll need to time that better. Speed dropped about 3mph while taking the shoes off, so I probably lost 15-20 seconds here. 

T2: 1:09

I can get faster here. Tried to clean my feet up a bit as they still had grass on them and I'd prefer to not run with grass in the shoes. No socks for a sprint. 

Run: 3.1 Miles,  22:25, 7:33 pace

Once again, significantly slower than in 15 or 16; by about 40 seconds per mile.  

It always takes a little while to settle into a run coming off the bike. With the first two miles being on a trail (decent gravel trail) I'm a bit more cautious than I would be on a road. About a mile in, I got behind and then passed a 24yo dude, which is always motivating.  With the first two miles being on gravel, splits of 7:45, 7:38, 7:15 is about as expected. 

As mentioned yesterday, at 2.6 miles I felt dizzy, and like a huge gust of wind or something pushed me to the left, and then to the right, which is noticeable on Strava. thankfully I was able to keep going and got over it quickly so I'm not concerned, but it was odd. 

Pushed a bit in the last half mile, not being near anyone and having just felt dizzy meant I didn't want to push any harder. 

Overall, I'm content with the race. I don't like seeing that I'm definitely slower. I know I'm slowing down with the run, but thought my bike was maintaining. I guess it's fairly normal, but I'll need to ramp up my training in the future. 

Thanks for the write up.  I’m potentially doing my first tri in a few weeks and it’s similar distances.

considering biking in running sneaks and removing my clips for such a short distance. Thoughts?

 

[pbm107]

This is an example on how I train unconventionally.  It makes me feel self-conscious at times.  You're never going to see an 18-week marathon program start with a 20-miler in the first week.  But my effort was low enough that recovery wasn't a problem. 

Your run yesterday made a lot sense to me, you're already really fit and fast, a long run focusing on pure endurance early on in the cycle should address the one possible weakness for marathon you might have right now. That was a very impressive run for week one in those conditions and of course with a very low HR.

 

[SteelCurtain]

Week 1 Report

We're now 17 weeks out, right?  I'm not sure how many of these I'll write up but I'd like to do them at least occasionally.  I would like to read yours too.

65.4 miles for the week averaging 7:14.  That's the most miles I've done in a long time but a little slower than I've been running lately.  I'm glad to get that many miles in.  I had planned to take Thursday off but I got home from the colonoscopy in the late morning, felt fine and had nothing else to do on an unusually cool summer afternoon.  Prep also messed with my nutrition routine so I felt a little off during the week. 

I didn't get many miles in below marathon pace.  I'm definitely planning to get a tempo in this week.  That will be the main week 2 goal.

The highlight of the week was yesterday's 20-miler.  Averaged 7:25/125.  Pre-run plan was to run at least 18 but slow -- focus on endurance benefits.  Plan was to never get below 7:30 pace.  After the first handful of miles I felt fine and the heart rate was low so that plan changed to running 20 and wanting to get the average pace down below 7:30.  Overall it was a successful run.  I felt OK at the end.  Nagging injuries were there but not as bad as last week's long run that had 14 miles at about marathon pace. I didn't bonk.   I decided to take some green apple Gatorade chews that someone gave me last year.  I think that was the first time I've eaten since marathon training in 2019.  I forgot how good it can feel to eat during a run even if the 100 calories over 20 miles was probably more a mental benefit than physical.  I have to decide what I want to do for calories for the marathon -- if I want to the gel/chew thing with water, sports drink or maybe a combination of the two.  

This is an example on how I train unconventionally.  It makes me feel self-conscious at times.  You're never going to see an 18-week marathon program start with a 20-miler in the first week.  But my effort was low enough that recovery wasn't a problem.  I took the first few miles slow today but quickly felt fine. I think that long time on my feet was worth it. 

I'm pretty transparent on Strava as to how things are going with my training for London.  If anyone isn't following me, I'm Blind Ref.

Big picture for me in my training for London is this high mileage plan I'm following is pretty tiring.  I know that's marathon training but I may have to drop back to the advanced plan that brings the mileage closer to 50-65 mpw as opposed to the 70-85 mpw with the plan I'm following.  I'm going away on vacation late July so how the runs will happen is still TBD.  I'd like to stay with the high mileage plan at least until then.

Glute is starting to become noticeable again.  Its a bit frustrating and I'll have to manage this very carefully in the run up to London (October 3).

Finally, the last part of this is waiting for official confirmation London will allow international runners.  If they don't, then I'll have to decide whether I want to race Boston or Indy.  I'm leaning towards Boston as I'm not sure I want to extend my training another month.  If I do Boston though, I'll need to do some dedicated hill work and I worry about the impact on the glute.

 

[pbm107]

I’m following the Pfitz up to 85 mile schedule for this cycle, but this week I am going to call an audible and run my long Marathon paced run Thursday morning instead of the weekend based on my experience and feedback I received in here back on 2015.  The plan as written has a 17 miles with 8 @MP, a recovery run day, and then a 10 miler with 5 at Tempo.  I couldn’t do it back then, and I don’t think I recover fast enough now either.

 

[SteelCurtain]

Great job @-OZ-!  I always find the triathlon race reports fascinating.  Especially the transition parts and how you manage your time and needs for the race. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

I’m following the Pfitz up to 85 mile schedule for this cycle, but this week I am going to call an audible and run my long Marathon paced run Thursday morning instead of the weekend based on my experience and feedback I received in here back on 2015.  The plan as written has a 17 miles with 8 @MP, a recovery run day, and then a 10 miler with 5 at Tempo.  I couldn’t do it back then, and I don’t think I recover fast enough now either.

I was wondering about your training when I saw your 4 mile tempo. I remember that being a Pfitz week one thing.  

Remind me. I know you’ve done Pfitz, Hanson’s and I think you were doing some  Jack Daniels’ (for those of you unfamiliar note the apostrophe is after the s) in the past. All good options but what made you decide to go back to Pfitz? 

Also, is up to 85 going to be your highest mileage ever?
 

 

[pbm107]

I was wondering about your training when I saw your 4 mile tempo. I remember that being a Pfitz week one thing.  

Remind me. I know you’ve done Pfitz, Hanson’s and I think you were doing some  Jack Daniels’ (for those of you unfamiliar note the apostrophe is after the s) in the past. All good options but what made you decide to go back to Pfitz? 

Also, is up to 85 going to be your highest mileage ever?

I have done Pfitz and Hansons in the past, only drank Jack never followed the plan. This will be my 3rd time attempting the Pfitz 85 plan, 2015 went well, 2017 I started out too far out of shape and only followed the last 12 weeks of the plan.  I followed Pfitz 70 in 2013 and Boston 2015.

As to why I picked Pfitz for this cycle, I think I need to get back to basics with some balance in my workouts and build up my mileage.  The past couple years I have been attempted to address my weakness, the half marathon distance, with the thought being improve myself at that distance and then start taking some chances at in the marathon.  During those cycles I followed the Hansons Half plan, and they were hyper focused on half marathon pace and half marathon pace -10 sec runs. I think I fit more the profile of a speedster and need more time in between lactate threshold workouts than what the half plan allows. I respond very quickly VO2max work.

The other reason I picked Pfitz is that it not only prepares me for the marathon but in the past it has also set me up for the next training cycle. After following Pfitz in fall of 2015 and 2017, I had really strong springs in 2016 and 2018.  

I think I could have be successful with the Hanson’s marathon plan, and I have to admit I enjoyed it as a change of pace in 2018.  With Pfitz this cycle I am going to try to do a better job following the prescribed paces for the long runs.

 

[tri-man 47]

Thanks for the write up.  I’m potentially doing my first tri in a few weeks and it’s similar distances.

considering biking in running sneaks and removing my clips for such a short distance. Thoughts?

Especially for the shorter races, I’d suggest that stirrups w/running shoes and a quick transition can be as effective as having to change from bike to running shoes in T2.

 

[MAC_32]

Misc update #1

I've mentioned it before, but our summer schedule is a bit of a mess. Mother nature isn't helping either. I accepted beforehand that if I was going to sustain volume I'd have to do it at the worst time of day, but afternoon storms have been especially problematic. I think I've been able to navigate it fairly well to this point, but I'm concerned about this week. I'll get to that, but first...

...this 'week.' We'll go with 2 weeks actually. It was hot, humid, and stormy the first three days after returning from Louisville, so I really just tried to tire myself out, so I would get to the workout portion of this cycle sufficiently fatigued. I literally had to outrun an incoming storm one of those days, but it was otherwise uneventful. Now let's actually start training, Thu 7/1 and Fri 7/2 - a Higdon inspired back-to-back. The weather broke for about 28 hours, so I did a 4x1200 (5:35ish pace) followed by an hour 20 MLR (10.4 mi) on tired legs. The latter was expectedly a grind, but there would be a lot of alcohol the next 72 hours so suck it up buttercup. Took Sat and Sun to recover (12+ mi, 130ish a HR, 8:37 avg pace) then headed out for a miserable long run 'holiday' Monday the 5th.

By the time I expunged all of the weekend's bad decisions it was already 85 degrees (68 dew point) with very little cloud cover and temps rising to the 90's. So I decided to run 40 minute loops. I filled up my 32 oz hydroflask with both ice and water and placed it in the open garage, took my solid ice handheld out of the freezer, then headed out in literally just shoes, socks, a headband, and the lightest pair of shorts I own. The block of solid ice was luke warm before 3 miles and bone dry around mile 4. I made it back to the check point around mile 5.5 and went straight to the exterior faucet. Once I had my fill I poured the water from the hydro flask (leaving the ice) into my hand held then went out again. This was going to be the worst section because this water was going to be luke warm before the end of mile 2. And it was. I had to be real disciplined not it drink it too fast and made it again to about mile 4 before it was bone dry. Once getting home at mile 10.5 for refill #2 I repeated the process but this time I only had ice in the hydroflask - this was intentional. I wanted to preserve as much agua as possible for the last 40 minute loop and I'm glad I did. My HR stayed in control most of the 15 miles, but it really started to fly over the last 2-3 miles. I desperately needed those late fluids. I'm glad I got it done and think I managed it as well as I could, but that was miserable. And words alone can't describe how refreshing the pool was the rest of the day. I practiced some fueling too (fruit snacks) but that wasn't the feature of this particular run.

And as bad as that was this past week didn't offer much more relief. After a recovery Tues (45 mins, 8:47 pace, aHR 132, 160 suck 88/72) I set out for mile repeats Wed. When it was almost as hot (83) and humid (70) as Monday...and again without cloud cover. With storms forecasted later in the day it was unfortunately now or never. I didn't know how many I'd do, but I was confident my body would tell me 'enough.' I was thrilled to knock out two in 5:46 and 5:41 and started thinking I may have 4 in me. Then I got 10 seconds into #3 and knew that was it. My legs were fried. I thought I could gut out another sub 6, but there would be nothing left after. the arrow was beyond the slash, but I got it done in 5:50 and managed to finish without a good gian'ing. I did a same day recovery that evening (30 mins, 9:11 pace, aHR 132, 144 suck) and another 45 mins Thursday (8:38 pace, aHR 133, 142 suck). Then treated Friday's workout as a fitness test.

I haven't done a goal pace run in almost a year and a half. How long can I hold it when I am clearly not fresh given all I've done over the last week. Conditions were as good as one could hope for in July (cloudy, 123 suck), so I did a WU mile then went. I mapped out 7 miles, but would have been content with 6. It wasn't until sometime in mile 5 when my HR was still hovering in the low 150's when I decided I'm going beyond 7. How much further? I dunno, but I can do more. And I'm glad I made that decision then because I didn't reassess again until into that 8th mile. My HR was well into the 160's by then, but I thought I could squeeze out a little more. Had I realized this sooner I may have tapped out at 8, but since I didn't I convinced myself to gut it out to 9. 9 miles at 6:45 pace at this stage of training? Certainly exceeded my expectations. Then I figured this weekend would be rough, but my recovery speed was actually faster (8:22 pace) at a lower aHR (130). Weather conditions certainly helped, but I'm writing this Sunday night and feel...fresh. Certainly not what I expected when I started this cycle 10 days ago!

Overall I did 105 miles the last 2 weeks. And over an 8 day stretch I did 2 interval workouts, a goal pace MLR, another MLR, and a long run al in mostly awful conditions. Not a bad start, huh.

I had a plan for this week, but it's been tossed in the garbage. Scattered afternoon storms each of the next 5 days and a golf outing Saturday has turned the plan on its side. Since I'm feeling fresh I'm gonna test my hand at a tempo Monday pm. Those storms, an evening baseball game, and lifting over lunch may lead to a less than optimal output, so if the day goes sideways I may punt to Tuesday. Hope not because that would then have a domino effect on the rest of the week, but as long as mother nature misbehaves and our calendar remains full I'm just taking things 2 days at a time. Plus I'm way ahead of where I thought I could be at this time. This sorta conditioning was more like what I hoped for in late August; not mid July!

 

[bushdocda]

Love the OG updates, the planning and thinking is really good stuff. Thanks for sharing. 
Im on vacation before my fall cycle starts like some fancy ###.  

 

[-OZ-]

Especially for the shorter races, I’d suggest that stirrups w/running shoes and a quick transition can be as effective as having to change from bike to running shoes in T2.

Thanks for the write up.  I’m potentially doing my first tri in a few weeks and it’s similar distances.

considering biking in running sneaks and removing my clips for such a short distance. Thoughts?

In sprint I can agree with tri-man especially for your first. I don't have stirrups and think I'd lose more time on the bike than I'd gain in transitions but maybe not.  

 

[El Floppo]

Especially for the shorter races, I’d suggest that stirrups w/running shoes and a quick transition can be as effective as having to change from bike to running shoes in T2.

I prefer bike/tri shoes clips and running shoes w speed laces. Just dont like losing the power on rhe bike.

 

[gianmarco]

Well, we are under the 2 week mark. This race is going to be.... interesting.

If you wanted to experiment and see how a marathon will go on limited training, I'm about to give some insight into that. I know I'm obviously not the first to do this (and at least I'm not pacing a good friend in an ultra), but given how hard all of you guys work at your training and the results, this will be one of those exceptions here. We aren't talking roll out of bed and do a 100 mile race on no training except drinking beer like @BassNBrew, but we are close.

So, here are the negatives:

-- No base training heading into my marathon block. I took it pretty easy knowing that I was looking at 3+ months and simply didn't have the desire to put in anything more.

-- Minimal training in the actual block with pretty low mileage weeks.  Since April 26th, I've pretty much been doing 30 mile weeks. I had one 50 but I also had one 7 just before that when I hurt my back. That's not really bueno.

-- Relatively few long runs. I've done one 18, two 16s, and a 12. Oops?

-- This past week, my runs have been awful. A lot due to weather, but also "life", I think being under hydrated, and just losing motivation. Only 20 miles this week and that was a challenge. And every one of those runs felt pretty bad including a run that felt worse than any run in a long time. Fitness trending in the wrong direction.

-- Only 2 weeks left, so not much improvement fitness wise at this point.

But, let's at least look at a few positives:

-- Downhill. I don't need to say much more on it but I'm banking on this helping me out to make up for lack of training. Might be a mistake, but it's the biggest advantage I could have in any race and this ideal for it. I know it's an asterisk for some of you, but I'll take it 

-- Two successful long runs in the last 3 weeks. Like, really successful. The 16 mile run while visiting @gruecdwith 8 sub-GMP miles and a really fast finish followed by an 18 miler the following week also with a fast finish. I'm hoping I can tap into some of that on race day.

-- Weather. It'll be better than here. Luckily temps have gotten back down in the mornings there, so hoping for a start in the 50s and finishing no higher than 65 (and possibly lower)

-- Experience. I've got one under my belt so I have that going for me compared to last year when it was new.

-- Healthy. I'm overall feeling pretty good. No nagging injuries at this point. 

I will try and see if I can do an MP run in a couple days for however long I can and then that'll be a wrap. Stay healthy, get the legs fresh, some short quality as much as weather cooperates and then hope for the best.

I will still shoot for an 8:59 overall pace. But I will also abandon that if things aren't going well as I'd like to finish this race in good shape. Plan will be to take it somewhat easy the first 3 miles that are in the tunnel and flat (9:15-9:30 pace) and then go from there. No HR above 160 before mile 15ish. Nothing over 165 until mile 20+. I'm pretty sure I'm going to suffer that day but that's the price I need to pay for my preparation. 

I also think this will be my last race for a while and likely my last marathon. While I'm currently signed up for the Mesa race next February that got pushed back from this year, I just don't see myself interested in putting in the time needed to do it right. I tried taking the time off after the last one and "resetting", hoping that would come back this year but it didn't. Until I get that "why" back, I'm going to get back to just running for pleasure and health and not for training. That's especially hard for me now with other stuff going on, in particular a wife that continues to train hard all the time. Something's gotta give. 

Anyway, I hope I'll give you guys something to enjoy in a couple weeks in one way or another. Thanks again for all the help and advice leading up to this race even if I haven't followed all of it. As always, feel free to share any thoughts. 

 

[Juxtatarot]

Well, we are under the 2 week mark. This race is going to be.... interesting.

If you wanted to experiment and see how a marathon will go on limited training, I'm about to give some insight into that. I know I'm obviously not the first to do this (and at least I'm not pacing a good friend in an ultra), but given how hard all of you guys work at your training and the results, this will be one of those exceptions here. We aren't talking roll out of bed and do a 100 mile race on no training except drinking beer like @BassNBrew, but we are close.

So, here are the negatives:

-- No base training heading into my marathon block. I took it pretty easy knowing that I was looking at 3+ months and simply didn't have the desire to put in anything more.

-- Minimal training in the actual block with pretty low mileage weeks.  Since April 26th, I've pretty much been doing 30 mile weeks. I had one 50 but I also had one 7 just before that when I hurt my back. That's not really bueno.

-- Relatively few long runs. I've done one 18, two 16s, and a 12. Oops?

-- This past week, my runs have been awful. A lot due to weather, but also "life", I think being under hydrated, and just losing motivation. Only 20 miles this week and that was a challenge. And every one of those runs felt pretty bad including a run that felt worse than any run in a long time. Fitness trending in the wrong direction.

-- Only 2 weeks left, so not much improvement fitness wise at this point.

But, let's at least look at a few positives:

-- Downhill. I don't need to say much more on it but I'm banking on this helping me out to make up for lack of training. Might be a mistake, but it's the biggest advantage I could have in any race and this ideal for it. I know it's an asterisk for some of you, but I'll take it 

-- Two successful long runs in the last 3 weeks. Like, really successful. The 16 mile run while visiting @gruecdwith 8 sub-GMP miles and a really fast finish followed by an 18 miler the following week also with a fast finish. I'm hoping I can tap into some of that on race day.

-- Weather. It'll be better than here. Luckily temps have gotten back down in the mornings there, so hoping for a start in the 50s and finishing no higher than 65 (and possibly lower)

-- Experience. I've got one under my belt so I have that going for me compared to last year when it was new.

-- Healthy. I'm overall feeling pretty good. No nagging injuries at this point. 

I will try and see if I can do an MP run in a couple days for however long I can and then that'll be a wrap. Stay healthy, get the legs fresh, some short quality as much as weather cooperates and then hope for the best.

I will still shoot for an 8:59 overall pace. But I will also abandon that if things aren't going well as I'd like to finish this race in good shape. Plan will be to take it somewhat easy the first 3 miles that are in the tunnel and flat (9:15-9:30 pace) and then go from there. No HR above 160 before mile 15ish. Nothing over 165 until mile 20+. I'm pretty sure I'm going to suffer that day but that's the price I need to pay for my preparation. 

I also think this will be my last race for a while and likely my last marathon. While I'm currently signed up for the Mesa race next February that got pushed back from this year, I just don't see myself interested in putting in the time needed to do it right. I tried taking the time off after the last one and "resetting", hoping that would come back this year but it didn't. Until I get that "why" back, I'm going to get back to just running for pleasure and health and not for training. That's especially hard for me now with other stuff going on, in particular a wife that continues to train hard all the time. Something's gotta give. 

Anyway, I hope I'll give you guys something to enjoy in a couple weeks in one way or another. Thanks again for all the help and advice leading up to this race even if I haven't followed all of it. As always, feel free to share any thoughts. 

What’s the hydration/nutrition plan?

 

[gianmarco]

What’s the hydration/nutrition plan?

Well, I listened to @El Floppoand tried avoiding carrying the water pack this year. I only took it once during the 12 mile run out of necessity as it was mid day and stupid hot. The rest, I've carried a handheld a couple times, but otherwise I've either done without or doing pitstops when doing loops or whatever.

Nutrition will be GUs every 5 miles (45 minutes). I'll actually have a flask of it. I will use water from the water stations (and time my GUs with those). I'm debating the handheld. I will also carry one of the 11oz flip belt flasks that I can fill if I need to. That should hopefully get me through. But no extra weight from the CamelBak.

I'm not worried about that part as I practiced it substantially last year and I fueled during my long runs this year without any problems (and partly why they went so well, I think).

 

[gianmarco]

Aid stations are every 2 miles. So I'll probably GU at 6, 10, 14, 18, and 22. I'll walk and drink at each of those and I'll grab and drink at all the rest.