Ray Rice's Domestic Abuse Presser Sends Wrong Message (1 Viewer)

[D in the D]

Now the NFL suspends him indefinitely, according to CNN. Nice PR move there. Only slightly worse than the Ravens waiting until now to release him.

 

[Doug B]

I don't think hitting a fiance/spouse should be legally any different from hitting a stranger.

There are very different considerations in these two situations.

In short -- the law often has too many carve-outs. "It's different" if it's a spouse/child/stranger/elderly person/man/woman/etc.

Shouldn't be like that. But reality disagrees. Human misery perpetuates, and humanity can't do better.

 

[McGarnicle]

####

 

[Fennis]

I don't see how Goodell's PR move new indefinite suspension will hold.

Who's going to challenge it? Rice's lawyers? Suppose they win, then what? Nobody's going to sign him anyhow.

Players Association will challenge it.

I agree it is likely that no one will sign him.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

I don't think hitting a fiance/spouse should be legally any different from hitting a stranger.

There are very different considerations in these two situations.

In short -- the law often has too many carve-outs. "It's different" if it's a spouse/child/stranger/elderly person/man/woman/etc.

Shouldn't be like that. But reality disagrees. Human misery perpetuates, and humanity can't do better.

The state has a variety of interests. Sometimes those interests are in tension with one another.

 

[Doug B]

Players Association will challenge it.

Dirt. Pure dirt. For once, take a pass on defending scum. For once. The rest of the players will understand.

 

[Henry Ford]

It's getting kind of embarrassing to be a Ravens fan. And now Ray Lewis is going to talk about this on ESPN tonight. Like that won't be hideously cringe-worthy.

The Ravens can't cut him, because that would put them $1.5 M over the cap, but they should come out right now and say he will never play for them again. Enough already. But the owner is such a jock-sniffer that I'm sure such an action will be impossible for him.

One really sad part of all this is that Rice really seemed to be a good guy. He was involved in anti-bullying stuff and my 10-year-old daughter loved him. She thought it was amazing that someone so little could be better than the huge guys he played against. He was kind of like a cartoon character, and her only jersey is a Ray Rice one. It's in the trash -- and it's been a chance to talk with her about being respected by boys/men and never tolerating any abusive behavior. But it still sucks.

If the commissioner really wants to make up for his mistake, he should create a salary cap exemption for cutting players who are in violation of the domestic violence provisions of the personal conduct policy.

Wait, how would that work? Teams get more salary cap room if they cut a guy for beating his wife than if they cut a guy for some other reason? Wouldn't that make potential abusers more valuable to prospective teams?

Didn't the Falcons get relief from the year-2 $15 million cap hit from releasing Vick? I don't recall - I know it was heavily discussed. If so, I don't think it made dogfighting ringleaders more valuable.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Players Association will challenge it.

Dirt. Pure dirt. For once, take a pass on defending scum. For once. The rest of the players will understand.

I actually don't have a problem with the PA pursuing this. Goodell is the one who screwed up in the first place by issuing a ridiculously light punishment. Having done that, it's nothing but capricious to come back now and change it to an indefinite suspension.

 

[Billy Bats]

Players Association will challenge it.

Dirt. Pure dirt. For once, take a pass on defending scum. For once. The rest of the players will understand.

That was Goodell's mistake from the start. Hit him with a year suspension and let the players union wipe the egg off of their face when they challenge it, then reduce the suspension some. He should've done that instead of the measly two games.

 

[MattFancy]

I don't see how Goodell's PR move new indefinite suspension will hold.

Who's going to challenge it? Rice's lawyers? Suppose they win, then what? Nobody's going to sign him anyhow.

Players Association will challenge it.

I agree it is likely that no one will sign him.

Doubtful. Did you see the current players on Twitter bashing Rice? Doubt the NFLPA will try to do anything with this.

 

[Doug B]

The state has a variety of interests. Sometimes those interests are in tension with one another.

Globally, sure. But the Ray Rice case should be (but isn't) cut and dried. Should be no ambiguity or gray area at all. But the legal system, to laypersons, abhors black-and-white dichotomies. So long as no one dies, way too much can be wriggled out of.

 

[timschochet]

Now the NFL suspends him indefinitely, according to CNN. Nice PR move there. Only slightly worse than the Ravens waiting until now to release him.

Often times people do the right thing either way too late, or for the wrong reasons. In the end it doesn't matter. Rice is getting what he deserves. I applaud the Ravens and the NFL.

 

[Doug B]

Having done that, it's nothing but capricious to come back now and change it to an indefinite suspension.

Once in a while ... it's right and good to be capricious. Not often, but occasionally. Have no problem with the league having a second bite at the apple.

 

[comfortably numb]

Players Association will challenge it.

Dirt. Pure dirt. For once, take a pass on defending scum. For once. The rest of the players will understand.

I'm not so sure all will.

They might think they will not ever want the union to turn on them when their time comes to face a hard PR nightmare.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

The state has a variety of interests. Sometimes those interests are in tension with one another.

Globally, sure. But the Ray Rice case should be (but isn't) cut and dried. Should be no ambiguity or gray area at all. But the legal system, to laypersons, abhors black-and-white dichotomies. So long as no one dies, way too much can be wriggled out of.

It's not a global question about the legal system. Society has a certain interest in the administration of justice, but the person who has the predominant interest in this case is Janay Rice. And if she says that she doesn't want her husband to go to jail and doesn't want to cooperate in putting him there, is it absurd for a prosecutor to consider that? Vindicating her interest in justice is a big part of that prosecutor's job.

 

[Ramsay Hunt Experience]

Players Association will challenge it.

Dirt. Pure dirt. For once, take a pass on defending scum. For once. The rest of the players will understand.

I actually don't have a problem with the PA pursuing this. Goodell is the one who screwed up in the first place by issuing a ridiculously light punishment. Having done that, it's nothing but capricious to come back now and change it to an indefinite suspension.

The gloss will likely be that this punishment is for Rice's lack of candor with the league.

 

[Doug B]

I'm not so sure all will.

They might think they will not ever want the union to turn on them when their time comes to face a hard PR nightmare.

Never really thought of the NFLPA as something like a PR "public defender". But it that's one of their roles, so be it.

I know, I know ... apples to oranges and all. But I wonder if the NFLPA did anything at all to defend Rae Carruth at any point. I know, not comparable. And I know why. The point is that even the NFLPA has a line they won't cross. I wonder which side Ray Rice's crime will lie on.

 

[Baloney Sandwich]

Just signed with the Raiders

 

[Doug B]

It's not a global question about the legal system. Society has a certain interest in the administration of justice, but the person who has the predominant interest in this case is Janay Rice. And if she says that she doesn't want her husband to go to jail and doesn't want to cooperate in putting him there, is it absurd for a prosecutor to consider that? Vindicating her interest in justice is a big part of that prosecutor's job.

Why does it suddenly change is she dies?

HYpothetically: let's say that when she hit her head on the elevator hand rail, it left her with brain damage. She was still able to speak, though, so she makes clear to police and prosecutors that she won't cooperate and doesn't want Ray to go to jail. After these statements, her health takes a turn for the worse, and she's 50-50 to make it through another 24 hours.

So, Ray Rice's fate is weirdly tied to her outcome. She pulls through, he gets off fairly lightly, it seems. She dies, does the state counter her wishes -- which you have averred as being very important to the prosecution -- and pursue manslaughter charges?

I know, I know ... it's different. I know. Sheesh.

 

[Tom Servo]

Players Association will challenge it.

Dirt. Pure dirt. For once, take a pass on defending scum. For once. The rest of the players will understand.

I'm not so sure all will.

They might think they will not ever want the union to turn on them when their time comes to face a hard PR nightmare.

IIRC if it's part of the personal conduct policy, the NFLPA can't appeal it. They bargained that away.

 

[Henry Ford]

It's not a global question about the legal system. Society has a certain interest in the administration of justice, but the person who has the predominant interest in this case is Janay Rice. And if she says that she doesn't want her husband to go to jail and doesn't want to cooperate in putting him there, is it absurd for a prosecutor to consider that? Vindicating her interest in justice is a big part of that prosecutor's job.

Why does it suddenly change is she dies?

HYpothetically: let's say that when she hit her head on the elevator hand rail, it left her with brain damage. She was still able to speak, though, so she makes clear to police and prosecutors that she won't cooperate and doesn't want Ray to go to jail. After these statements, her health takes a turn for the worse, and she's 50-50 to make it through another 24 hours.

So, Ray Rice's fate is weirdly tied to her outcome. She pulls through, he gets off fairly lightly, it seems. She dies, does the state counter her wishes -- which you have averred as being very important to the prosecution -- and pursue manslaughter charges?

I know, I know ... it's different. I know. Sheesh.

If she dies, the most compelling interest remaining in the case shifts to her other family members.

 

[McGarnicle]

Just signed with the Raiders

 

[Koya]

It's not a global question about the legal system. Society has a certain interest in the administration of justice, but the person who has the predominant interest in this case is Janay Rice. And if she says that she doesn't want her husband to go to jail and doesn't want to cooperate in putting him there, is it absurd for a prosecutor to consider that? Vindicating her interest in justice is a big part of that prosecutor's job.

Why does it suddenly change is she dies?

HYpothetically: let's say that when she hit her head on the elevator hand rail, it left her with brain damage. She was still able to speak, though, so she makes clear to police and prosecutors that she won't cooperate and doesn't want Ray to go to jail. After these statements, her health takes a turn for the worse, and she's 50-50 to make it through another 24 hours.

So, Ray Rice's fate is weirdly tied to her outcome. She pulls through, he gets off fairly lightly, it seems. She dies, does the state counter her wishes -- which you have averred as being very important to the prosecution -- and pursue manslaughter charges?

I know, I know ... it's different. I know. Sheesh.

The fate of a criminal is almost always tied to the outcome. Which, fwiw, I have always wondered about. An attempted murder gets off lighter than actual murder... why? Because the criminal merely was not competent? Makes little sense to me. The crime should be the action and intent, not the final consequence when the action and intent would be the same

 

[Fat Nick]

Just signed with the Raiders

My work buddy and I were speculating, and before the indefinite suspension, the only two teams we came up with were:

The Raiders, because they will sign anyone

The Pats, because they have no soul

 

[Yankee23Fan]

No one signs him this year (if they could - I just saw the NFL thing)

If he has a brain in his head - he doesn't fight this at all. He does a press conference and says he understands why this happened. He deserves it. What happened was horrible and he is going to spend this year working with domestic violence groups and learning to be a better man and helping other young men make sure they never do something this horrible. And he hopes that he can show that this was a terrible mistake and that he hopes that he can show that he deserves a second chance. And then spend this year being Mr. Anti-Domestic Violence in every way conceivable. Public, private every single way.

Then next year Goodell can do a presser saying it's obvious he learned his lesson. He will be suspended for the 2015 season for the 6 games but any team can sign him and then someone will.

IMHO.

 

[Abraham]

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I suspect he signs with the Ravens.

 

[Jayrod]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

 

[D in the D]

Now the NFL suspends him indefinitely, according to CNN. Nice PR move there. Only slightly worse than the Ravens waiting until now to release him.

Often times people do the right thing either way too late, or for the wrong reasons. In the end it doesn't matter. Rice is getting what he deserves. I applaud the Ravens and the NFL.

Agreed. For finally doing the right thing.

My point was nothing (other than seeing the actually blow(s) being struck) has changed today and these decisions being lauded today should have been made months ago.

 

[Henry Ford]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

I think primarily because some of the public (and probably the Ravens) had fooled themselves into thinking that if she apologized for her role, she might have been insanely violent toward him before he knocked her out.

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

I think primarily because some of the public (and probably the Ravens) had fooled themselves into thinking that if she apologized for her role, she might have been insanely violent toward him before he knocked her out.

Right, I once saw a women swinging a purse weighed down with casino chips at her boyfriend, the chips came flying out and everyone in the area was picking them up as they flew out of her purse.

 

[Cliff Clavin]

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[comfortably numb]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

Visualization,

As someone mentioned above.

Did you ever hear about police brutality? A bit? did you ever really care?

When you hear about it you make up your own mind as to what police brutality is based on your internal thoughts.

You can turn turn a blind eye.

When you saw Rodney King getting beat down, over and over, your mind decided it was something that was appalling and wrong.

Also,

I think people were hoping there was MAYBE some sort of self defense angle here. Perhaps a push or inadvertent elbow....anything???

But it just looks like he instigated it on some level and was looking to drop her.

 

[igbomb]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

Visualization,

As someone mentioned above.

Did you ever hear about police brutality? A bit? did you ever really care?

When you hear about it you make up your own mind as to what police brutality is based on your internal thoughts.

You can turn turn a blind eye.

When you saw Rodney King getting beat down, over and over, your mind decided it was something that was appalling and wrong.

Also,

I think people were hoping there was MAYBE some sort of self defense angle here. Perhaps a push or inadvertent elbow....anything???

But it just looks like he instigated it on some level and was looking to drop her.

I actually don't get why people can't spot the difference.

We are all sickened by ISIS tactics in the Mideast. But if you saw the video of a journalist being beheaded instead of just reading about it, don't you think you would be just a little more moved? Or if you saw kids dying of diseases in Africa in person rather than read an article in the Atlantic? The list goes on and on. Images have power. You can try to be entirely pragmatic and say that it shouldn't matter, but the fact is that it does.

 

[AhrnCityPahnder]

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wat

 

[AhrnCityPahnder]

When you saw Rodney King getting beat down, over and over, your mind decided it was something that was appalling and wrong.

"No it didn't" /peens

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Once again...there's no audio so we have know way of knowing what she was saying.

Why is this even relevant? I challenge you to come up with anything she could have said that would justify his actions. Make up anything you want.

"I have a gun in my pocket. I am going to kill you and 8 other people with it."

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Once again...there's no audio so we have know way of knowing what she was saying.

Why is this even relevant? I challenge you to come up with anything she could have said that would justify his actions. Make up anything you want.

"I have a gun in my pocket. I am going to kill you and 8 other people with it."

"I drafted Pierce instead of you in the players wive's FF league"

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Once again...there's no audio so we have know way of knowing what she was saying.

Why is this even relevant? I challenge you to come up with anything she could have said that would justify his actions. Make up anything you want.

"I have a gun in my pocket. I am going to kill you and 8 other people with it."

"I drafted Pierce instead of you in the players wive's FF league"

Hey...Tim and I are trying to have a serious discussion here.

 

[Mr.Pack]

I have never hit a woman. Never will. Don't condone it at all. But I was expecting this to be a lot worse with all the uproar.

First, she's physically attacking him outside the elevator and inside the elevator. Then he does something totally stupid as a reaction. Stupid. Definitely suspend able and light jail time. But I was expecting him to be hitting her multiple times or look like the aggressor.

Is this a joke?

Yea, I don't get it either, Just him bringing it up shows me he probably would hit a woman.

 

[Jayrod]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

Visualization,

As someone mentioned above.

Did you ever hear about police brutality? A bit? did you ever really care?

When you hear about it you make up your own mind as to what police brutality is based on your internal thoughts.

You can turn turn a blind eye.

When you saw Rodney King getting beat down, over and over, your mind decided it was something that was appalling and wrong.

Also,

I think people were hoping there was MAYBE some sort of self defense angle here. Perhaps a push or inadvertent elbow....anything???

But it just looks like he instigated it on some level and was looking to drop her.

I actually don't get why people can't spot the difference.

We are all sickened by ISIS tactics in the Mideast. But if you saw the video of a journalist being beheaded instead of just reading about it, don't you think you would be just a little more moved? Or if you saw kids dying of diseases in Africa in person rather than read an article in the Atlantic? The list goes on and on. Images have power. You can try to be entirely pragmatic and say that it shouldn't matter, but the fact is that it does.

I've never watched the beheading video and I'm appalled by it.

 

[Al O'Pecia]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

Visualization,

As someone mentioned above.

Did you ever hear about police brutality? A bit? did you ever really care?

When you hear about it you make up your own mind as to what police brutality is based on your internal thoughts.

You can turn turn a blind eye.

When you saw Rodney King getting beat down, over and over, your mind decided it was something that was appalling and wrong.

Also,

I think people were hoping there was MAYBE some sort of self defense angle here. Perhaps a push or inadvertent elbow....anything???

But it just looks like he instigated it on some level and was looking to drop her.

I actually don't get why people can't spot the difference.

We are all sickened by ISIS tactics in the Mideast. But if you saw the video of a journalist being beheaded instead of just reading about it, don't you think you would be just a little more moved? Or if you saw kids dying of diseases in Africa in person rather than read an article in the Atlantic? The list goes on and on. Images have power. You can try to be entirely pragmatic and say that it shouldn't matter, but the fact is that it does.

I've never watched the beheading video and I'm appalled by it.

I get his point, though. I had heard of porn, but it never really had an affect on me until I watched it.

 

[Tom Servo]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

We had to shut up the Ray Rice Truthers who claim nothing happened in the elevator.

 

[igbomb]

Can someone here explain to me why it is so different now that we actually see the punch thrown? We knew she was knocked out and he did it before. Because we get to see exactly how it went down doesn't seem like it should have changed things that much.

I think he deserves to miss the season and think the Ravens should have cut him, but why now instead of earlier? It just seems odd that one video that simply confirms what we already knew somehow changes everything.

Visualization,

As someone mentioned above.

Did you ever hear about police brutality? A bit? did you ever really care?

When you hear about it you make up your own mind as to what police brutality is based on your internal thoughts.

You can turn turn a blind eye.

When you saw Rodney King getting beat down, over and over, your mind decided it was something that was appalling and wrong.

Also,

I think people were hoping there was MAYBE some sort of self defense angle here. Perhaps a push or inadvertent elbow....anything???

But it just looks like he instigated it on some level and was looking to drop her.

I actually don't get why people can't spot the difference.

We are all sickened by ISIS tactics in the Mideast. But if you saw the video of a journalist being beheaded instead of just reading about it, don't you think you would be just a little more moved? Or if you saw kids dying of diseases in Africa in person rather than read an article in the Atlantic? The list goes on and on. Images have power. You can try to be entirely pragmatic and say that it shouldn't matter, but the fact is that it does.

I've never watched the beheading video and I'm appalled by it.

As you should be. But watch it and you might be sick. Point is, images move people.

 

[Johnny Bing]

No doubt Ray is a POS, but how does this not fall under the new domestic abuse program where 1st offense is 6 games? Why is there talk of an entire year or punishment beyond the new program the NFL just released less than 30 days ago. Isn't this fall under a 6 game suspension if a team where to sign him?

Is McDonald and Hardy all getting indefinite suspensions? This thing was a very sad story when it first released and is quickly turning into a disaster for the NFL.

 

[Tom Servo]

The abominable tweet from the Ravens is GONE.

 

[Sabertooth]

Johnny Bing, he's not in the NFLPA if he's not in the NFL.

 

[Johnny Bing]

Johnny Bing, he's not in the NFLPA if he's not in the NFL.

Missed that part...thanks for clarification.

 

[belljr]

I'm sorry...what rice did is very very very wrong.

still shouldn't lose his job because of it

 

[Gary Coal Man]

No doubt Ray is a POS, but how does this not fall under the new domestic abuse program where 1st offense is 6 games? Why is there talk of an entire year or punishment beyond the new program the NFL just released less than 30 days ago. Isn't this fall under a 6 game suspension if a team where to sign him?

Is McDonald and Hardy all getting indefinite suspensions? This thing was a very sad story when it first released and is quickly turning into a disaster for the NFL.

Both a fair and excellent point. Goodell may be saying "suspended indefinitely" to publicly look hard on the offense since he received so much deserved criticism for originally being so soft on it. I image the the indefinite suspension will eventually become six games to match his new policy.There is also a chance that the suspension is indefinite rather than six games because Rice lied to Goodell about what occurred in the elevator, and the indefinite suspension is for not only the offense but also for the lies.

Likely the former instance, IMO.

 

[Notorious T.R.E.]

The abominable tweet from the Ravens is GONE.

http://deadspin.com/whose-idiotic-ray-rice-comments-look-especially-awful-t-1632033541/all