RB Doug Martin, Free Agent (2 Viewers)

[Quez]

Doug Martin is a top 5 RB in this league if only he could have go go gadget arms. They continue to try and lead him on passes, but poor Dougie can't lift his arms above his helmet.

Dropping him is ridiculous. Any RB with that amount of involvement is worth rostering.

 

[mikel0254]

Doug Martin is a top 5 RB in this league if only he could have go go gadget arms. They continue to try and lead him on passes, but poor Dougie can't lift his arms above his helmet.

Dropping him is ridiculous. Any RB with that amount of involvement is worth rostering.

As an owner, I'd love him to be top 5. But he does not belong in the same company as Murray, Charles, Forte, Foster, Gio, Lynch, and McCoy (although he's busted pretty bad this year too, I expect him to rebound).

I do however see big things for him in the 2nd half of the season.

ETA: He's caught 6 of 9 targets, so those 3 not caught wouldn't change his stats that dramatically.

 

[The Indestructible]

Doug Martin is a top 5 RB in this league if only he could have go go gadget arms. They continue to try and lead him on passes, but poor Dougie can't lift his arms above his helmet.

Dropping him is ridiculous. Any RB with that amount of involvement is worth rostering.

As an owner, I'd love him to be top 5. But he does not belong in the same company as Murray, Charles, Forte, Foster, Gio, Lynch, and McCoy (although he's busted pretty bad this year too, I expect him to rebound).

I do however see big things for him in the 2nd half of the season.

ETA: He's caught 6 of 9 targets, so those 3 not caught wouldn't change his stats that dramatically.

What reason do you see to be optimistic for his second half? Serious question. I own him but don't follow the Bucs. Is Glennon enough to right the ship? Are injured o-linemen expected to come back? Easier schedule?

As an owner, for those of you looking to buy him, I think I'd jump at almost any offer made for him, so if you think he is going to rebound, he is an excellent buy low.

 

[Grahamburn]

Glennon has been good. Teams will have to respect his ability to throw the football. The Saints and Steelers did not and he made them pay for it. The line is playing much better and they are healthy as far as I know. When Evans returns this could be an above average offensive attack.

Martin also had some big gains nullified by penalties yesterday.

 

[matttyl]

Doug Martin is a top 5 RB in this league if only he could have go go gadget arms. They continue to try and lead him on passes, but poor Dougie can't lift his arms above his helmet.

Dropping him is ridiculous. Any RB with that amount of involvement is worth rostering.

As an owner, I'd love him to be top 5. But he does not belong in the same company as Murray, Charles, Forte, Foster, Gio, Lynch, and McCoy (although he's busted pretty bad this year too, I expect him to rebound).

I do however see big things for him in the 2nd half of the season.

ETA: He's caught 6 of 9 targets, so those 3 not caught wouldn't change his stats that dramatically.

He did have a 30 some yard reception called back because of an illegal movement pre-snap or something dumb. That would have helped quite a bit.

 

[mikel0254]

Doug Martin is a top 5 RB in this league if only he could have go go gadget arms. They continue to try and lead him on passes, but poor Dougie can't lift his arms above his helmet.

Dropping him is ridiculous. Any RB with that amount of involvement is worth rostering.

As an owner, I'd love him to be top 5. But he does not belong in the same company as Murray, Charles, Forte, Foster, Gio, Lynch, and McCoy (although he's busted pretty bad this year too, I expect him to rebound).

I do however see big things for him in the 2nd half of the season.

ETA: He's caught 6 of 9 targets, so those 3 not caught wouldn't change his stats that dramatically.

What reason do you see to be optimistic for his second half? Serious question. I own him but don't follow the Bucs. Is Glennon enough to right the ship? Are injured o-linemen expected to come back? Easier schedule?

As an owner, for those of you looking to buy him, I think I'd jump at almost any offer made for him, so if you think he is going to rebound, he is an excellent buy low.

The coaches must like him. In the last two games when he's been healthy, he's out-touched Rainey 33 to 14. In the last two games he has 130 total yards and a TD...averaging almost 10pts in standard league (and I guess he had a 30+ yard catch and run called back on a procedure penalty, not a hold or something that would allow him to get those 30 yards). He's a RB2 who gets 15 touches a game. PLUS, it seems like TB is finally putting it together. The better their passing is, the more lanes he'll have to run through. And lastly, he's dirt cheap. Great buy low in my eyes.

 

[BigJim®]

Any update on Sims and when he could be recalled from IR? It is 6 week minimum, correct?

 

[Spookytooth]

Sims is coming. I believe he can begin practicing a week from today. I picked him up a week ago before the articles on him start popping up at the different fantasy sites. I think there is a real chance he grabs the lead back role (assuming he is healthy). Either way, he has a great shot at the job in the off season.

 

[mikel0254]

Sims is coming. I believe he can begin practicing a week from today. I picked him up a week ago before the articles on him start popping up at the different fantasy sites. I think there is a real chance he grabs the lead back role (assuming he is healthy). Either way, he has a great shot at the job in the off season.

A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. This is the classic fantasy football syndrome. A rookie RB who needed ankle surgery is somehow going to come in and grab the starting role when he comes back after not playing for half a season? I don't buy it. Sure, if there's an injury, he may get a shot for some carries. But I don't see anyway that he's worth anything this year without an injury to Martin AND Rainey.

But if you have a roster spot and can handle a third TB RB (which would be almost impossible to justify), then grab him as a handcuff. And if you're in dynasty, he's worth something.

 

[Spookytooth]

Yes, my league is dynasty that I am talking about above. I agree I would not touch him in a re-draft league at this point. But in dynasty, if he is available, this is the week to grab him.

 

[Dark Matter]

Question: If the coaching staff likes him so much, why is Rainey on the field at crunch time? I watched the game via RZ and every time TB was there, so was Bobby.

 

[The General]

Approaching droppable status in 12 teamers and smaller. Pretty much useless even with majority of carries.

Definitely have to drop him this week.

I can't bring myself to drop him but he is worthless. That team gives him such limited upside. Would much rather start a variety of pickups this week that are probably available in many 12 team leagues - guys like Hillman, Andre Williams, Oliver.

 

[Andrew74]

Worthless is harsh...he's not setting the world on fire by any stretch of the imagination but not worthless. In weeks 4 & 5 in my 0.5PPR, he is a low-end RB2. Few more breaks yesterday, he's probably a mid-RB2. In this year of brutal injuries, I'll take it.

But the comment about the team is true - there is limited upside here. Maybe the teams gels some like it did last year, but even then, he's no more than a mid-level RB2 IMO.

 

[NREC34]

Worthless is harsh...he's not setting the world on fire by any stretch of the imagination but not worthless. In weeks 4 & 5 in my 0.5PPR, he is a low-end RB2. Few more breaks yesterday, he's probably a mid-RB2. In this year of brutal injuries, I'll take it.

But the comment about the team is true - there is limited upside here. Maybe the teams gels some like it did last year, but even then, he's no more than a mid-level RB2 IMO.

Yeah I was really hoping they'd win the game yesterday. If they fall out of contention I think they will see what Sims can do when he is healthy.

 

[cvnpoka]

Question: If the coaching staff likes him so much, why is Rainey on the field at crunch time? I watched the game via RZ and every time TB was there, so was Bobby.

the red zone usage of rainey sas very troubling. the "crunch time" usage should be expected though, bc rainey is the clear passing down back and is used in the hurry up offense.

martins value is hanging by a thread it seems. rainey could steal more series at any team given how much better he is.

 

[NREC34]

Rainey is better at fumbling if that's what you mean by better.

 

[Andrew74]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

 

[Banger]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

 

[mikel0254]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

TB coaches had the perfect opportunity to keep Rainey as the starter, but didn't. That should tell you enough of what they see in the two. And even if you see differently, unfortunately, they are the ones calling the shots.

 

[Banger]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

TB coaches had the perfect opportunity to keep Rainey as the starter, but didn't. That should tell you enough of what they see in the two. And even if you see differently, unfortunately, they are the ones calling the shots.

to me things aren't black and white and they are often a process. I think they are giving Martin every chance to be the guy but I can't see them continuing to feed him if he continues to show nothing. Why should they? I've been wrong a million times and could absolutely be wrong here but it just doesn't seem logical.

 

[Andrew74]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

TB coaches had the perfect opportunity to keep Rainey as the starter, but didn't. That should tell you enough of what they see in the two. And even if you see differently, unfortunately, they are the ones calling the shots.

to me things aren't black and white and they are often a process. I think they are giving Martin every chance to be the guy but I can't see them continuing to feed him if he continues to show nothing. Why should they? I've been wrong a million times and could absolutely be wrong here but it just doesn't seem logical.

On the flip side, what did Rainey show the last two games?

 

[mikel0254]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

TB coaches had the perfect opportunity to keep Rainey as the starter, but didn't. That should tell you enough of what they see in the two. And even if you see differently, unfortunately, they are the ones calling the shots.

to me things aren't black and white and they are often a process. I think they are giving Martin every chance to be the guy but I can't see them continuing to feed him if he continues to show nothing. Why should they? I've been wrong a million times and could absolutely be wrong here but it just doesn't seem logical.

On the flip side, what did Rainey show the last two games?

Exactly. He did have a nice TD run, 9 yards untouched. Neither has been better or worse than the other, so why would they change?

I own both and could care less about who is starting, so I'm trying not to argue for one side over the other...I just don't see anything to indicate a change is coming. Coaches are feeding the ball to Martin at a 2 to 1 clip over Rainey and both are performing about the same. I don't see a need for them to change. If they thought Rainey was better, they would be feeding him at a 2 to 1 clip over Martin, but they're not.

 

[Banger]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

TB coaches had the perfect opportunity to keep Rainey as the starter, but didn't. That should tell you enough of what they see in the two. And even if you see differently, unfortunately, they are the ones calling the shots.

to me things aren't black and white and they are often a process. I think they are giving Martin every chance to be the guy but I can't see them continuing to feed him if he continues to show nothing. Why should they? I've been wrong a million times and could absolutely be wrong here but it just doesn't seem logical.

On the flip side, what did Rainey show the last two games?

he hasn't gotten the opportunities..he's gotten about half as many touches and put up similar numbers. Look Martin is running for 2.54 ypc this year...read that again. He's jealous of Trent Richardson. If you are comfortable thinking he's going to retain the starting role continuing to put up those numbers you're much more optimisitc than I would be. At least when Martin has been out Rainey has played much better than Martin has in 2 years. Maybe the team fully backs Martin the entire year but I certainly wouldn't bet on it....

a big part of this game is not seeing things as they are now but predicting how and why things may change in the future. As Wayne Gretzky said...you skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it was. Part of what has made me very competitive in my leagues year after year is taking shots at situations like this....unproductive starter, someone decent and cheap with good upside waiting in the wings....I load my bench with them and churn them week after week. Things may stay status quo and it costs me nothing but the last roster spot on my bench.

 

[mikel0254]

I like how Rainey is so much better yet Martin gets the workload.

for how long though?

TB coaches had the perfect opportunity to keep Rainey as the starter, but didn't. That should tell you enough of what they see in the two. And even if you see differently, unfortunately, they are the ones calling the shots.

to me things aren't black and white and they are often a process. I think they are giving Martin every chance to be the guy but I can't see them continuing to feed him if he continues to show nothing. Why should they? I've been wrong a million times and could absolutely be wrong here but it just doesn't seem logical.

On the flip side, what did Rainey show the last two games?

he hasn't gotten the opportunities..he's gotten about half as many touches and put up similar numbers. Look Martin is running for 2.54 ypc this year...read that again. He's jealous of Trent Richardson. If you are comfortable thinking he's going to retain the starting role continuing to put up those numbers you're much more optimisitc than I would be. At least when Martin has been out Rainey has played much better than Martin has in 2 years. Maybe the team fully backs Martin the entire year but I certainly wouldn't bet on it....

Apples to apples comparison: In the games that Martin played (ie, same defenses), Rainey has averaged 2.5 YPC. 14 carries, 35 yards.

Rainey performed very well against STL and poorly against ATL. I get the argument that Rainey has performed better, because on a whole, he has. But against the same competition, they have both been poor.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

At least when Martin has been out Rainey has played much better than Martin has in 2 years.

That's just not true. Rainey has a couple of big games surrounded by a whole lot of crud. I don't know why this stat keeps getting ignored, but here it is again.

Rainey has exceeded 4.0ypc in only 2 of his 8 starts.

Martin has exceed 4.0ypc in 4 of his last 8 starts.

Rainey is around 3.5ypc on the whole as a starter. On top of that, he's fumbled 3 times this year including one that probably cost them a game.

If Martin can hold onto the job he could have value this year. Each of the last two years the Bucs' line has started out AWFUL, and then turned things around about mid-season.

 

[Andrew74]

Banger, you write for FBGs?

"Rainey is still outplaying incumbent starter Doug Martin..."

All I hope is TB picks one and sticks with it, since I own both.

 

[RushHour]

He's basically the same as Zac Stacy at this point in terms of fantasy value.

 

[btemp]

Sims is ahead of schedule...

 

[Faust]

Bucs still believe Doug Martin is answer in backfield:

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000407694/article/bucs-still-believe-doug-martin-is-answer-in-backfield

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

Bucs coach Lovie Smith said "we're staying the course" with Doug Martin.

Martin has been a liability in pass protection, is among the league's worst in yards after contact per attempt and is averaging 2.54 YPC one year after getting 3.59 YPC. But Smith said he's sticking with his "bell cow." It's unlikely Martin will get out of the mud against the Ravens this week, but following the Week 7 bye he'll get to face MIN, CLE, ATL, WAS and CHI. It'll be an excellent chance to prove his impressive rookie year was legit and not propped up by one monstrous game.

Source: Tampa Tribune

Oct 9 - 8:36 AM

 

[The General]

Dropped in my 12 team league with small bench. Not picked up in the following round of pickups.

 

[dickey moe]

Dropped in my 12 team league with small bench. Not picked up in the following round of pickups.

Redraft maybe he's not a grab with small benches, but you'd have to in dynasty.

 

[The General]

Dropped in my 12 team league with small bench. Not picked up in the following round of pickups.

Redraft maybe he's not a grab with small benches, but you'd have to in dynasty.

It's a redraft league. The Rotoworld article quote above gives some hope with a good schedule after the bye. Was a little surprised that he wasn't picked up as a stash but then looked back at his production.

 

[Ilov80s]

Dropped in my 12 team league with small bench. Not picked up in the following round of pickups.

That is absurd.

 

[The General]

Dropped in my 12 team league with small bench. Not picked up in the following round of pickups.

That is absurd.

We do only have to start one RB. When you can pick up an Oliver, Andre Williams, Hillman, then Dougie and his 30 yards a game and sub 3 yards a carry start looking not so good.Fully expect him to explode this weekend.

 

[Ilov80s]

Dropped in my 12 team league with small bench. Not picked up in the following round of pickups.

That is absurd.

We do only have to start one RB. When you can pick up an Oliver, Andre Williams, Hillman, then Dougie and his 30 yards a game and sub 3 yards a carry start looking not so good.Fully expect him to explode this weekend.

Ok. Starting 1 RB is huge, that makes sense. I take back my statement.

 

[Ilov80s]

Martin has been bad, but his schedule is about to ease up. The truth is he has only played in 2 games since the week 1 mid game injury. In those 2 games he has 130 yards and 1 TD. It isn't that bad. The 3.0 YPC is a real concern, but there is still a bit of hope here moving forward.

 

[cvnpoka]

was able to trade him thankfully. 2qb standard scoring league i shipped martin and locker for montee ball and keenan allen. guy needed a qb for upcoming byes. im so happy this guy is gone.

 

[Ilov80s]

was able to trade him thankfully. 2qb standard scoring league i shipped martin and locker for montee ball and keenan allen. guy needed a qb for upcoming byes. im so happy this guy is gone.

Allen is like the Doug Martin of WRs this year. Ball has been just as bad and is hurt. I'm not sure there was a real winner here.

 

[The General]

Martin has been bad, but his schedule is about to ease up. The truth is he has only played in 2 games since the week 1 mid game injury. In those 2 games he has 130 yards and 1 TD. It isn't that bad. The 3.0 YPC is a real concern, but there is still a bit of hope here moving forward.

Even with those stats he was still something like the 17th and 30th scoring RB in those weeks.

Hope in the schedule for sure though, maybe Glennon will help the O out and the line has to improve.

With Baltimore this week though and a bye we are talking half close to half the season where he has been taking up space or more likely killing you at a starting position considering he was a 2nd-3rd round pick and was probably being started. Huge bust.

 

[Ilov80s]

Martin has been bad, but his schedule is about to ease up. The truth is he has only played in 2 games since the week 1 mid game injury. In those 2 games he has 130 yards and 1 TD. It isn't that bad. The 3.0 YPC is a real concern, but there is still a bit of hope here moving forward.

Even with those stats he was still something like the 17th and 30th scoring RB in those weeks. Hope in the schedule for sure though, maybe Glennon will help the O out and the line has to improve.

With Baltimore this week though and a bye we are talking half close to half the season where he has been taking up space or more likely killing you at a starting position considering he was a 2nd-3rd round pick and was probably being started. Huge bust.

He has been bad. I'm not arguing otherwise. But in a normal 12 team start 2 RB league with reasonable benches, he should be rostered.

 

[The General]

Martin has been bad, but his schedule is about to ease up. The truth is he has only played in 2 games since the week 1 mid game injury. In those 2 games he has 130 yards and 1 TD. It isn't that bad. The 3.0 YPC is a real concern, but there is still a bit of hope here moving forward.

Even with those stats he was still something like the 17th and 30th scoring RB in those weeks. Hope in the schedule for sure though, maybe Glennon will help the O out and the line has to improve.

With Baltimore this week though and a bye we are talking half close to half the season where he has been taking up space or more likely killing you at a starting position considering he was a 2nd-3rd round pick and was probably being started. Huge bust.

He has been bad. I'm not arguing otherwise. But in a normal 12 team start 2 RB league with reasonable benches, he should be rostered.

Agreed. It did feel great cutting him for Branden Oliver. Perfect guy to pick up as a lottery ticket. He is dead to me though!

Now watching him blow up this weekend.

 

[Faust]

Buccaneers' Doug Martin: Breakout game is coming

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000408715/article/buccaneers-doug-martin-breakout-game-is-coming

 

[georg013]

This thread reminds me of the TRich thread. No longer an owner but I imagine I sounded equally ridiculous in my blind support of a declining asset. Owners will see what they want to see. Some see Martin as a top talent. Reality disagrees.

 

[cvnpoka]

was able to trade him thankfully. 2qb standard scoring league i shipped martin and locker for montee ball and keenan allen. guy needed a qb for upcoming byes. im so happy this guy is gone.

Allen is like the Doug Martin of WRs this year. Ball has been just as bad and is hurt. I'm not sure there was a real winner here.

ya, im pretty effed the next few weeks anyway so im trying to focus my team on 3 weeks from now. not much else i can do when calvin and jennings go down and i face the 2 strongest teams.

ultimately, i think ball has a much higher ceiling than martin. i just dont see martin ever getting back on track and being productive. at least ball showed last year that he was able to put up some points. ofc, he might not get his job back either.

 

[Ilov80s]

This thread reminds me of the TRich thread. No longer an owner but I imagine I sounded equally ridiculous in my blind support of a declining asset. Owners will see what they want to see. Some see Martin as a top talent. Reality disagrees.

I definitely don't see Martin as a big talent. I liked his value this year based mostly on opportunity, youth and past production. There are many reasons why his rookie year was much better than TRich. Right now, I'm not sure he is any better. I still think he has a chance to be ok this year. By ok, I mean a viable mid to low end RB2. The way RBs have been this year, I would be happy with that.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

This thread reminds me of the TRich thread. No longer an owner but I imagine I sounded equally ridiculous in my blind support of a declining asset. Owners will see what they want to see. Some see Martin as a top talent. Reality disagrees.

The difference is that Martin has played a whopping 2 consecutive games that were sub-par. He got hurt early in the Carolina game, but even if we chalk that one up it's 3, not 10+ like we saw out of Richardson.

People are pretty quick to forget that Martin averaged 4.2ypc or better in 4 out 6 games last year in his "bad" year. He just had one really, really bad game that brought his average as a whole down. That's a lot different than Richardson, who has gone 22 consecutive games without averaging 4.2ypc in a game. TWENTY TWO!!!

Their levels of ineffectiveness are not even on the same planet.

 

[cvnpoka]

i think martin had a single carry after getting hurt in the carolina game, if even that. it certainly was not the reason for his horrible stat line.

but ya, hes no trich. ofc, that doesnt make him fantasy worthy either.

 

[BustedKnuckles]

do young players just decline that fast ? So odd

 

[just_want_2_win]

Martin has looked bad in pass protection and toting the ball and there's a lot of viable competition there with Rainey (though yes there are the 3 fumbles), Mike James (zip this year but shone when had the opportunity last year), and Sims on the horizon. Not looking good but he has 3 plus matchups upcoming. If he does well maybe can sell for something.