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RB Isiah Pacheco, KC (2 Viewers)

Pipes said:
Dr. Octopus said:
Pipes said:
I agree he could easily be replaced but I don't see how you can trade him for a mid to late first rounder if you are a playoff team. Production now could mean the difference of winning the league vs being an early playoff casualty
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I guess I'm not seeing him as a difference maker for a Championship team - what's his highest fantasy points game so far? You're speculating he'll score a lot of points, but KC just doesn't run the ball enough and McKinnon is used as the pass catcher.

If some one wants to over-pay for his production, I'd take it and trust the rest of my depth. The only teams that he starts for me are on two rebuild teams - he wouldn't make the lineup on my contending teams. I drafted him in every league but one. I was a big fan, but taking a first for him is a no-brainer.
ETA: “no brainer” sounds like an insult to anyone on the other side, so I’ll say I can certainly see the benefit of keeping him. He is just getting started as the starter so more production could be on the way.
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My “big” money league is16 teams. That’s the perspective of where I’m coming from. He’s a starter right now with a chance of putting up excellent RB2 numbers in those leagues. I completely understand where you are coming from though
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Yes. My leagues are 12 teams, albeit with big rosters (28-30 players with 2 IR slots) so it’s definitely a different perspective.
 
Dr. Octopus said:
The problem is there's a much better than zero chance that he's replaced via a free agent or the draft during the offseason. It's not like he's killing it from a fantasy points perspective this year either. I would take any random 2023 1st from him without much thought - even as a contender
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Between rookie backs, and the pile of free agent RBs, it would be a minor miracle if the Chiefs didn't add a good back next spring. Sooo many options.

I could also see a situation where the KC backfield gets no clarity till September. Some free agent doesn't get the deal he wants, and signs a one year deal in KC end of training camp, that kind of thing
 
Pacheco is officially useless once again. Barely seeing the field and the all world Jerrick McKinnon getting the goal line looks. I hate Andy Reid.
 

Isiah Pacheco rushed 15 times for 86 yards in Kansas City's Week 15 win over the Texans, adding one catch for 11 yards on his only target.​

Pacheco was subbed out at one point for Ronald Jones (yes, that Ronald Jones) after blowing a block that led to a sack and fumbling deep in Chiefs territory. His leash wasn't that short, though, and he was on the field on Kansas City's penultimate drive. Houston's run defense has been trending up in effectiveness if not in volume over the last few weeks, so Pacheco's yardage total is still pretty good given the circumstances. He'll be on the FLEX line against the Seahawks in Week 16.
Dec 18, 2022, 4:35 PM ET
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Isiah Pacheco had 12 rushes for 95 yards in the Chiefs' Divisional Round win against the Jaguars, catching his lone target for six yards.​

Pacheco ran as hard as he has all season, seeking contact and routinely bowling over defenders and picking up yards after contact. The rookie ripped off a 40-yard scamper in the first half and narrowly missed a short touchdown on the next play. He narrowly edged Jerick McKinnon in rushing attempts (12 to 11) and had the team's lone running back reception. Pacheco could see a ramped-up workload in the AFC Championship game if Patrick Mahomes (ankle) is limited and the Chiefs can't pass as much as usual.
Jan 21, 2023, 8:40 PM ET
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Pacheco's vision and lateral movement are suspect at best, but he runs with power, burst and determination and plays in the league's most reliable offense. Those latter points will hide a lot of his flaws, next year and beyond.

Solid rookie year, all considered, especially for a 7th rounder. Good for him and great for the Chiefs.
 
LawFitz said:
Pacheco's vision and lateral movement are suspect at best, but he runs with power, burst and determination and plays in the league's most reliable offense. Those latter points will hide a lot of his flaws, next year and beyond.

Solid rookie year, all considered, especially for a 7th rounder. Good for him and great for the Chiefs.
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Can’t do much better with a 7th round pick. I wonder how the Chiefs handle the RB position in the offseason. It certainly seems like there is room for Pacheco to grow in year 2. If they don’t substantially add anyone, he could be a sneaky candidate to finish as an RB1.
 
Ilov80s said:
LawFitz said:
Pacheco's vision and lateral movement are suspect at best, but he runs with power, burst and determination and plays in the league's most reliable offense. Those latter points will hide a lot of his flaws, next year and beyond.

Solid rookie year, all considered, especially for a 7th rounder. Good for him and great for the Chiefs.
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Can’t do much better with a 7th round pick. I wonder how the Chiefs handle the RB position in the offseason. It certainly seems like there is room for Pacheco to grow in year 2. If they don’t substantially add anyone, he could be a sneaky candidate to finish as an RB1.
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KC doesn't need to invest at RB if they re-sign McKinnon. They have the good duo that checks the boxes for what they do on offense.

Invest highly in a WR instead since Kelce can't last forever and the other pass catchers are JAGs.
 
LawFitz said:
Pacheco's vision and lateral movement are suspect at best, but he runs with power, burst and determination and plays in the league's most reliable offense. Those latter points will hide a lot of his flaws, next year and beyond.

Solid rookie year, all considered, especially for a 7th rounder. Good for him and great for the Chiefs.
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I’m glad I have him for depth, but I’m betting the Chiefs will bring in a RB in the draft. They kind of have to to replace McKinnon, and IMO they’re out on CEH.

The danger is that they don’t just bring in a COP/receiver, but spend on a Gibbs or Bijan (some mocks have them going this direction) at the end of the 1st.

If that happens, Pacheco becomes a handcuff & the bottom falls out on his value.

I might try to move him before the NFL draft - not sure yet. He’s looked good in spurts, but he’s also looked kinda not good in spurts.

As you indicated with your breakdown - he’s a mixed bag. I just don’t see a feature back there, so it’s hard to imagine his value increasing.
 
He has the skill set of a 7th rd RB. I think it’s a fairly easy upgrade for the Chiefs next year considering the strong RB market in the draft and FA
 
JetMaxx said:
He has the skill set of a 7th rd RB. I think it’s a fairly easy upgrade for the Chiefs next year considering the strong RB market in the draft and FA
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Not many 7th round picks doing what IP did. He ran for 4.9 a carry. Add in his skill as a KR and he was 10th in the NFL in all purpose yards. He has prototypical size and runs with sub 4.40 speed. I’m not saying he won’t get replaced but if he was a 3rd round pick from a bigger school or had the last name Spiller, people would be ecstatic how good his 2022 was.
 
Ilov80s said:
JetMaxx said:
He has the skill set of a 7th rd RB. I think it’s a fairly easy upgrade for the Chiefs next year considering the strong RB market in the draft and FA
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Not many 7th round picks doing what IP did. He ran for 4.9 a carry. Add in his skill as a KR and he was 10th in the NFL in all purpose yards. He has prototypical size and runs with sub 4.40 speed. I’m not saying he won’t get replaced but if he was a 3rd round pick from a bigger school or had the last name Spiller, people would be ecstatic how good his 2022 was.
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True, but it’s also on a limited sample size.

I’d be interested to see a 20 touch game from him to see if that YPC drops a bit.

He’s also in an offense that makes it difficult for opponents to stack the box against him. Heck, they made CEH look capable for a stretch of games.

I’m somewhere in the middle - I’d love to make “fetch” happen, but I agree with the RBs hitting the market & a deep RB class, the Chiefs could invest & muddy his situation.
 
KC got an extra 4th and 6th rounder from MIA in the Hill trade. They can draft a RB of their choosing in the 3rd through 5th round. I think they fill other needs in rounds 1 & 2. With most teams using 2 or 3 RBs, there should continue to be RBs taken in the mid and late rounds . Miami doesn't have any RB under contract. In 2022, there were busts, but also Allgeier in the 5th, Pierce in the 4th, R White in the 3rd, in addition to Cook, Walker, and Hall in the first 2 rounds.
 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
True, but it’s also on a limited sample size.

I’d be interested to see a 20 touch game from him to see if that YPC drops a bit.

He’s also in an offense that makes it difficult for opponents to stack the box against him. Heck, they made CEH look capable for a stretch of games.

I’m somewhere in the middle - I’d love to make “fetch” happen, but I agree with the RBs hitting the market & a deep RB class, the Chiefs could invest & muddy his situation.
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Here is what I will say in IP's defense:

- He had 4 games with 15 or more carries, he averaged 4.55 ypc in those games (stupid small sample)
- Mckinnon averaged 4.0, CEH averaged 4.3, IP 4.9. Still small sample but he was the most efficient runner of the three.
- It was the 4th most carries for a rookie this year, only 3 rookies last year got more carries, only 3 rookies in 2020 had more.
- He faced a higher % of stacked boxes and lower % of light fronts than Dameon Pierce so while yes the KC offense makes it difficult for defenses to stack the box, IP also was used pretty often in obvious run situations.
 
SoBeDad said:
KC got an extra 4th and 6th rounder from MIA in the Hill trade. They can draft a RB of their choosing in the 3rd through 5th round. I think they fill other needs in rounds 1 & 2. With most teams using 2 or 3 RBs, there should continue to be RBs taken in the mid and late rounds . Miami doesn't have any RB under contract. In 2022, there were busts, but also Allgeier in the 5th, Pierce in the 4th, R White in the 3rd, in addition to Cook, Walker, and Hall in the first 2 rounds.
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Good point on the extra picks.
 
Ilov80s said:
Hot Sauce Guy said:
True, but it’s also on a limited sample size.

I’d be interested to see a 20 touch game from him to see if that YPC drops a bit.

He’s also in an offense that makes it difficult for opponents to stack the box against him. Heck, they made CEH look capable for a stretch of games.

I’m somewhere in the middle - I’d love to make “fetch” happen, but I agree with the RBs hitting the market & a deep RB class, the Chiefs could invest & muddy his situation.
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Here is what I will say in IP's defense:

- He had 4 games with 15 or more carries, he averaged 4.55 ypc in those games (stupid small sample)
- Mckinnon averaged 4.0, CEH averaged 4.3, IP 4.9. Still small sample but he was the most efficient runner of the three.
- It was the 4th most carries for a rookie this year, only 3 rookies last year got more carries, only 3 rookies in 2020 had more.
- He faced a higher % of stacked boxes and lower % of light fronts than Dameon Pierce so while yes the KC offense makes it difficult for defenses to stack the box, IP also was used pretty often in obvious run situations.
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He was a 5.06 pick for me in last year’s rookie draft (largely thanks to @rockaction), and that’s my total rebuild - trust, no one will be happier if IP sticks as the primary back in KC. :wub:
 
Pacheco had a defined role as the hammer. 10-15 carries and a couple targets per game. I'm betting he keeps that role next year, no more, no less. They'll either bring back McKinnon or a back who fills that pass catching role. That's all they need to do to keep this version of the offense running. They will bring in a back but Pacheco won't be replaced when they do.
 
Apple Juice said:
Pacheco had a defined role as the hammer. 10-15 carries and a couple targets per game. I'm betting he keeps that role next year, no more, no less. They'll either bring back McKinnon or a back who fills that pass catching role. That's all they need to do to keep this version of the offense running. They will bring in a back but Pacheco won't be replaced when they do.
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McKinnon is a beast in pass pro. I've seen him square up bigger dudes on more than one occasion all season long. Knowing Reid, he won't let him walk without trying to retain him.
 

Isiah Pacheco rushed 15 times for 76 yards and a touchdown in the Chiefs' Super Bowl LVII victory over the Eagles.​

One of the final picks of the draft, 23-year-old Pacheco quickly took Chiefs’ No. 1 duties away from a struggling Clyde Edwards-Helaire on the ground, making a name for himself with powerful running that at times bordered on manic. Pacheco is going to make you bring him down, something he advertised by averaging 3.13 yards after first contact. Although that’s a strong number, it’s not elite, giving Pacheco room to grow if he learns to make better reads and displays just a little more patience. With Edwards-Helaire both failing to produce and stay on the field and Jerick McKinnon headed to free agency, there’s a strong chance Pacheco enters 2023 as the unquestioned No. 1. Becoming a bigger factor in the passing game — he caught five balls in the AFC Championship Game — would send Pacheco rocketing up the RB2 ranks.
Feb 12, 2023, 10:45 PM ET
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Faust said:

Isiah Pacheco rushed 15 times for 76 yards and a touchdown in the Chiefs' Super Bowl LVII victory over the Eagles.​

One of the final picks of the draft, 23-year-old Pacheco quickly took Chiefs’ No. 1 duties away from a struggling Clyde Edwards-Helaire on the ground, making a name for himself with powerful running that at times bordered on manic. Pacheco is going to make you bring him down, something he advertised by averaging 3.13 yards after first contact. Although that’s a strong number, it’s not elite, giving Pacheco room to grow if he learns to make better reads and displays just a little more patience. With Edwards-Helaire both failing to produce and stay on the field and Jerick McKinnon headed to free agency, there’s a strong chance Pacheco enters 2023 as the unquestioned No. 1. Becoming a bigger factor in the passing game — he caught five balls in the AFC Championship Game — would send Pacheco rocketing up the RB2 ranks.
Feb 12, 2023, 10:45 PM ET
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It really was one of the easiest things I've ever seen. Too bad they limit you on props.
 
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He looks pretty good to me but i still don't trust the chiefs. He needs to score to be valuable and I'm just not sure McKinnon/Mahones puts a major dent in his opportunities
 
Dr. Octopus said:
Doug B said:
Pacheco now an easy redraft second-rounder? Or hard to rely on a Chiefs RB?
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There’s a long off-season that has to come into fruition before anyone can answer that realistically.
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It’s looking like a very deep RB class, don’t think Pacheco is safe until the very late rounds. I wouldn’t rule out them bringing in another vet either with McKinnon getting up there in age.
 
IHEARTFF said:
Unless Bijan is sitting there at 1.32 (1.31 lol dolphins), I think Pacheco is the lead back.
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That’s not necessarily true. I’m a big Pacheco fan, but he’s a solid, but unspectacular back. He runs hard and has speed but he’s a straight ahead runner with limited power.
There’s plenty of scenarios that can play out where Pacheco gets knocked down the depth chart.
I’ll be pulling for him - but I stand by my point that we really can’t even pencil him in at this point.
 
Dr. Octopus said:
IHEARTFF said:
Unless Bijan is sitting there at 1.32 (1.31 lol dolphins), I think Pacheco is the lead back.
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That’s not necessarily true. I’m a big Pacheco fan, but he’s a solid, but unspectacular back. He runs hard and has speed but he’s a straight ahead runner with limited power.
There’s plenty of scenarios that can play out where Pacheco gets knocked down the depth chart.
I’ll be pulling for him - but I stand by my point that we really can’t even pencil him in at this point.
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That's probably true. Fair enough. He needs to dodge some other bullets in the middle rounds of the draft with the depth of this RB class.
 
Anybody have a rough dynasty price tag for him at the moment? I moved up to get him at 4.1 last draft and consider him a hit for now. Got Toney last year at 2.7. Any chance of parlaying the 2 for a mid 1st coming off the decent SB performance?
 
sheerterror said:
Anybody have a rough dynasty price tag for him at the moment? I moved up to get him at 4.1 last draft and consider him a hit for now. Got Toney last year at 2.7. Any chance of parlaying the 2 for a mid 1st coming off the decent SB performance?
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I'd say that would be a little steep of a price tag but you never know.
 
sheerterror said:
Anybody have a rough dynasty price tag for him at the moment? I moved up to get him at 4.1 last draft and consider him a hit for now. Got Toney last year at 2.7. Any chance of parlaying the 2 for a mid 1st coming off the decent SB performance?
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I paid a 2024 2nd (SF, 10 team) plus change for him about a month ago
 
sheerterror said:
Anybody have a rough dynasty price tag for him at the moment? I moved up to get him at 4.1 last draft and consider him a hit for now. Got Toney last year at 2.7. Any chance of parlaying the 2 for a mid 1st coming off the decent SB performance?
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A lot depends on league type, scoring, etc., but in my 16 team ppr keeper league, I'd give up a mid-1 for that pair in a heartbeat. IMO, Pacheco has a decent short-term future (at least) and Toney is slated to be a significant piece.
 
JohnnyU said:
Anyone besides me feel someone could sweep in anytime and take his job?
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It’s partly why I traded him away. He’s always going to be a 7th round pick.

The chiefs IMO are going to bring in a receiving back - who could do more than just act as a receiving back.

Short shelf life IMO, upside capped in PPR.

I could be wrong. :shrug:
 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
JohnnyU said:
Anyone besides me feel someone could sweep in anytime and take his job?
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It’s partly why I traded him away. He’s always going to be a 7th round pick.


Short shelf life IMO, upside capped in PPR
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I tried trading him away for a late first or something him with 1.12 for 1.5, CMC/Pachecho/1.12 for 1.1, threw out all kinds of deals like that and no interest and it's because I think most people see the same thing. Someone hard to totally trust has the job and lack of upside does not have most people wanting to take that gamble.

And yes we could all be wrong.
 
JohnnyU said:
Anyone besides me feel someone could sweep in anytime and take his job?
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I took him in 4th round in 4 out of my 5 leagues and was one of the first in here talking him up - because Rutgers is local and my bosses favorite team, so I watch them a few times a year. With that said I’ve moved him in one and have tried like heck in a few others because I agree (and apparently most do).

He’s fast for his size and runs hard but in one of the best situations in the league he looked solid and mostly unspectacular. I think it’s practically inevitable he gets Michael Carter-ed in this draft.
 
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