rockaction
Footballguy
Anyway, back to Sanders. Coach today starts talking about 3 RB committees and stuff.
Oof.
Oof.
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RB Miles Sanders, DAL (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter Zyphros
- Start date
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Receptions
'19-'20-'21-'22
63- 52- 34- 26
They have been going down every year
'19-'20-'21-'22
63- 52- 34- 26
They have been going down every year
responded in the pollard thread.
rockaction
Footballguy
That's really a function of Hurts. 63 and 52 is acceptable, and not really too much of a drop off. Then you bring in new coaches and a new QB and all of the sudden he can't catch the ball in practice? C'mon.
rockaction
Footballguy
As far as acceptable pass catching, sometimes guys just need a change in coaching or at QB to come fully into their own. Look at Josh Jacobs under Gruden vs. under McDaniels. Night and day. Sometimes coaches just get down on a guy and that guy gets the yips or whatever. I'd expect Sanders to be competent catching the ball. Whether he'll be the guy on the field on third down instead of Hubbard or Blackshear is another question.
Drake Hater
Footballguy
Sneaky value right there.
zamboni
Footballguy
Unfortunately I don’t think he’s going to be such a value by the time August drafts take place. There aren’t too many 3-down backs any more that rarely leave the field, and Sanders seems to be in that group now.
Miles Sanders is arguably the worst pass catching RB in the NFL. The idea that he's going to supply any value in the receiving game is bad process.
Sanders is a worthwhile pick in round 6/7, as he is certainly a big play runner, but he's pretty 1 dimensional and you need the TDs to pan out for him to be an ok RB2.
Sanders is a worthwhile pick in round 6/7, as he is certainly a big play runner, but he's pretty 1 dimensional and you need the TDs to pan out for him to be an ok RB2.
rockaction
Footballguy
More declaratives that are wrong. See: above. He didn't forget how to catch in three years. At all. Me thinks he just never was a favorite of Sirianni's coaching staff. That begins and ends there.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Plus in general rushing QB don’t check down to the RB as often. Hurts would take off running. On RPOs he would often be the primary ball carrier.
Tends to reduce RB receptions a little.
I’m not as high on Sanders as some, but I do think he’s probably a value this year.
What's his excuse for 2020 under the same HC as 2019?
Sanders was dead last in PFF receiving grade in 2022, ok in 2021, 2nd to last in 2020 (only Ronald Jones was worse) and even 2019 was good, but not great.
I'm seeing 2 coaching staffs (and QBs) deciding he's not the guy in the passing game. 2019 was more because the Eagles had nothing at all at WR, headlined by washed/injured Alshon Jeffery, and injury plagued Nelson Agholor. I think its a mistake to hold onto that as some evidence he's good at it, then it is to take into account how horrible he's been since.
efactor
Footballguy
But you just said he may be the worst pass receiving back in the entire NFL. That’s just wrong.
According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Same.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
42 would be the ultimate answer to life, the universe & everything.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Da Franchise
Footballguy
Seems to happen quite a lot.
Da Franchise
Footballguy
According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
While there’s validity to that, there’s also an aspect where one could attribute much of Sanders great rushing year on the threat of Hurts opening significant holes for Sanders.According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Holes he likely won’t see in CAR.
The Hurts taketh away, but the Hurts giveth
efactor
Footballguy
Kind of disagree here. Carolina has a good OL. Foreman averaged 4.5 a carry with 900 yards and Hubbard averaged 4.9 a carry with 400 yards. I don't think either of them are as good as Sanders. McCaffrey had another 400 yards rushing before he was traded at 4.6 a carry. These fellows can run the ball.While there’s validity to that, there’s also an aspect where one could attribute much of Sanders great rushing year on the threat of Hurts opening significant holes for Sanders.According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Holes he likely won’t see in CAR.
The Hurts taketh away, but the Hurts giveth
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Time will tell. I think Sanders is the same dude he’s been, but benefitted from a perfect storm of an offense last year.Kind of disagree here. Carolina has a good OL. Foreman averaged 4.5 a carry with 900 yards and Hubbard averaged 4.9 a carry with 400 yards. I don't think either of them are as good as Sanders. McCaffrey had another 400 yards rushing before he was traded at 4.6 a carry. These fellows can run the ball.While there’s validity to that, there’s also an aspect where one could attribute much of Sanders great rushing year on the threat of Hurts opening significant holes for Sanders.According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Holes he likely won’t see in CAR.
The Hurts taketh away, but the Hurts giveth
But I’m not positive - I could see a scenario where your take is closer to reality.
Da Franchise
Footballguy
Time will tell. I think Sanders is the same dude he’s been, but benefitted from a perfect storm of an offense last year.Kind of disagree here. Carolina has a good OL. Foreman averaged 4.5 a carry with 900 yards and Hubbard averaged 4.9 a carry with 400 yards. I don't think either of them are as good as Sanders. McCaffrey had another 400 yards rushing before he was traded at 4.6 a carry. These fellows can run the ball.While there’s validity to that, there’s also an aspect where one could attribute much of Sanders great rushing year on the threat of Hurts opening significant holes for Sanders.According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Holes he likely won’t see in CAR.
The Hurts taketh away, but the Hurts giveth
But I’m not positive - I could see a scenario where your take is closer to reality.
I kind of agree with both of you. Hurts helped make things favorable for him and I expect it to continue in Carolina because they are really good at running the football.
Seems like a good but boring RB2, which is all you need.
efactor
Footballguy
4.6, 5.3, 5.5 and 4.9 YPC in each of his first four years. He got a bigger workload and obviously more green zone carries last year but you could say he was the "dude he's been" all 4 years of his career. If he gets the bulk of the carries in Carolina like it looks like he will, he's going to be a great value this year, especially if he gets the passing game role that Carolina is saying he will.Time will tell. I think Sanders is the same dude he’s been, but benefitted from a perfect storm of an offense last year.Kind of disagree here. Carolina has a good OL. Foreman averaged 4.5 a carry with 900 yards and Hubbard averaged 4.9 a carry with 400 yards. I don't think either of them are as good as Sanders. McCaffrey had another 400 yards rushing before he was traded at 4.6 a carry. These fellows can run the ball.While there’s validity to that, there’s also an aspect where one could attribute much of Sanders great rushing year on the threat of Hurts opening significant holes for Sanders.According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Holes he likely won’t see in CAR.
The Hurts taketh away, but the Hurts giveth
But I’m not positive - I could see a scenario where your take is closer to reality.
Definitely on my radar as a RB 2 if he slides into the late 4th, early 5th round area.
rockaction
Footballguy
I actually like Sanders (who I roster in dynasty and went out of my way to get) for his upside. I think there's quite a bit there because he has the potential to break long runs out of seemingly nothing. That's just my take in watching him on a limited basis. The Philly heads on the board will tell you his best ability isn't availability so we will see about how his stint in Carolina plays out if they make him a workhorse back.
I have no idea how the year will play out or what his value relative to redraft ADP is. All I know is he lost a ton of value touches to Hurts last year and Sirianni and the staff didn't seem to have faith in him as the guy. His contract with Carolina says they view him as somebody important.
I think he can be an RB1 if all breaks right. If it doesn't, he could lose his job to Chuba. That's a range of values there. If you're looking for something steady, he might not be your guy. You have got to ride the ride with this guy, IMO.
I have no idea how the year will play out or what his value relative to redraft ADP is. All I know is he lost a ton of value touches to Hurts last year and Sirianni and the staff didn't seem to have faith in him as the guy. His contract with Carolina says they view him as somebody important.
I think he can be an RB1 if all breaks right. If it doesn't, he could lose his job to Chuba. That's a range of values there. If you're looking for something steady, he might not be your guy. You have got to ride the ride with this guy, IMO.
efactor
Footballguy
Agree with everything you said with the exception that he could lose the job to Chuba. Only if there is an injury.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I think they’ll run enough that Chuba will have stand-alone value in 2023, but that’s just me.
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rockaction
Footballguy
I don't know. The thing that gives me pause is that they weren't done in their running back room. As soon as Tiyon Evans was released by the Rams, Carolina pounced and signed him. It just leads me to believe they're a bit less than settled at the back end of their RB rotation. You've got Sanders, Hubbard, Blackshear, and now Evans.
rockaction
Footballguy
And I honestly don't know what to make of the signing. Is it a signing with an eye towards the future? Is Evans a developmental project?
I don't know really what the scoop is or how Blackshear fits into the equation. He and Evans are really different backs. It think Evans's BMI is over 30 or something. He's a lead guy or a bruiser, not a third-down running back.
But he was also just cut by the Rams, so they had either a numbers game or weren't impressed with him. Rams Report says he's not a bruiser, but at that BMI, he'd better be.
I don't know really what the scoop is or how Blackshear fits into the equation. He and Evans are really different backs. It think Evans's BMI is over 30 or something. He's a lead guy or a bruiser, not a third-down running back.
But he was also just cut by the Rams, so they had either a numbers game or weren't impressed with him. Rams Report says he's not a bruiser, but at that BMI, he'd better be.
Leroy Hoard
Footballguy
With a rookie QB and one of the least inspiring receiver rooms around, I expect them to run the ball a lot. Sanders should get a lot of touches.
RenegadeRoy
Footballguy
I imagine he will also benefit from more dump-offs. Hurts was prone to tuck and run in those situations, not sure Young will do the same.
Receiving grades are independent of QB play.According to PFF receiving grades, he was in 2022.
ETA: Also, dead last in yards per route run among RBs among qualifying RBs, by a wide margin.
This is a Jalen Hurts post.
Hurts also hasn't seemed to hurt Kenneth Gainwell or even Boston Scott. I'd be of the belief the Eagles RB receiving production will look even better with D'Andre Swift.
MCFootball123
Footballguy
Follow the money. Miles owns this backfield this year until he get hurt. Miles talent running or receiving isn't going to ever blow anyone away, but he is plenty capable. We have seen less talent last year put up solid numbers - this o line is really good. When you look at the surrounding cast of players, it's similar to the early eagles teams that had little receiving talent as well. I see him catching 50+ balls. Bryce is smart and will dump off a lot because ain't going to be nothing open over the top. If I own Miles Sanders I want Chuba in there plenty to keep him fresh. I see Miles as a rock solid RB2 that is probably not going to score as many TD's as you want him to. I see a lot of 16 carry 80yd, 5 catch 40 yd weeks...17PPR pts never lost me a week in my RB2 slot though.
Tanner9919
Footballguy
DraftSharks has him at 94% chance of injury, and forecasts 3.9 missed games in 2023.That's probably a VERY conservative number.
Code:
Aug 19, 2020 NFL Thigh Hamstring Strain Grade 2 Sanders suffered a hamstring injury during preseason camp, which kept him out of the Week 1 game vs. Washington.
Oct 18, 2020 NFL Knee Patella Sprain Sanders suffered a knee injury during the game vs. the Ravens. He missed the next two games.
Dec 31, 2020 NFL Knee Patella Sprain Sanders missed the season finale game vs. Washington as he was a limited participant at Eagles' practice due to a knee issue.
Jan 5, 2020 NFL Knee MCL Sprain Grade 2 Sanders suffered an MCL sprain during the wild-card loss to the Seahawks
Oct 24, 2021 NFL Pedal Ankle Sprain Grade 2 Sanders suffered an ankle injury in the Eagles' Week 7 game against the Raiders. He missed three games
Nov 28, 2021 NFL Pedal Ankle Sprain/Pull Unspecified Grade 1 Sanders suffered an ankle injury in Week 12's loss to the Giants. He was available in the next game
Dec 5, 2021 NFL Pedal Ankle Sprain/Pull Unspecified Grade 1 Sanders re-injured the ankle that has bothered him since Week 7. He was fine for the next game
Dec 26, 2021 NFL Hand Metacarpal Fracture Sanders suffered a broken hand in Week 16's win over the Giants. he missed two games
Aug 14, 2022 NFL Thigh Hamstring Sprain/Pull Unspecified Grade 1 Sanders missed a couple weeks of practice.Tanner9919
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
It’s hard to predict injury, but yeah, he’s been banged up a lot.
His average is 2 missed games a season.
rockaction
Footballguy
League average is more than that, but that's because of full-season injuries and whatnot.
That's still not below-average for a running back.
He's been pretty available despite all the whinging coming from Philadelphia fans on the board.
zamboni
Footballguy
I didn’t even know that was a stat, but I wouldn’t put much stock in it. RBs get hurt - it’s the nature of the position for the most part - and as rock says above, seems like he’s been available a lot more than the detractors would have you believe.
rockaction
Footballguy
What choo talkin' 'bout, Willis?
Damn Girmay was a bad pick. Why expend the effort to hang up front if you're going to coast the the last 50 m of every sprint.
Also the most boring today as I was surfing NFL during it.
The most watched sporting event in the world.
Also the most boring today as I was surfing NFL during it.
