RB RJ Harvey, DEN (2 Viewers)

[Hot Sauce Guy]

draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver

3 dynasty rookie drafts, the earliest he went was 1.07

Still too high for my tastes, but I’ve seen a lot of rookie drafts & it’s pretty well chalk that Jeanty, Hunter, & Hampton were top 3 in 1QB, and Jeanty, Hunter, & Cam Ward were top 3 in SF.

I did not see him go “as early as 3” anywhere, but I admit I am not omnipresent or omniscient.

 

[Mitchie]

draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver

3 dynasty rookie drafts, the earliest he went was 1.07

Still too high for my tastes, but I’ve seen a lot of rookie drafts & it’s pretty well chalk that Jeanty, Hunter, & Hampton were top 3 in 1QB, and Jeanty, Hunter, & Cam Ward were top 3 in SF.

I did not see him go “as early as 3” anywhere, but I admit I am not omnipresent or omniscient.

He went 3 in one free league in Alaska.

 

[Dez]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

I am guessing the feeling is mutual by many here as well.

 

[BigTex]

I honestly cannot fathom the love for this guy. I guess people scouted off his highlight films or fell in love with his measureables, because I saw some serious shortcomings watching him - and that was for a 6 year college player who was literally a man playing against boys.

He’s got great speed and if he gets a clear runway through the line he understands how to move downhill to the sideline and turn on the jets for long gainers. When he does get a runway, he gets into it fast and through in a hurry and then gets his one cut at the second level where he can utilize that speed.

The problems I saw were multiple. His vision is poor and he doesn’t see the times where he needs to take what he has and instead tries to slow play to the outside and then beat contain when they stall thinking he’s trapped. That’s a tactic that will not win often at the next level. His footwork is not good and he tends to get very linear approaching the PoA. He does not do a good job at getting skinny through small gaps, which combined with the questionable vision is not a good combination in the NFL where seams are smaller and close quickly. And that stutter step and shoulder shimmy crap he does may have frozen college defenders but pros will attack him while he’s dancing and stalling waiting for the defender to freeze so he can get by. He has gained a lot of YAC because he can bounce off a pile, sometimes running into the backs of his O line, and then end run around it, another tactic that won’t end well many times in the NFL. He’s definitely not a pile mover and when a D player gets level with him and gets hold of an arm or his jersey they can spin him down pretty effortlessly.

His pass protection is God awful, and it’s partly due to a lack of willingness as well as technique issues. I get that he’s not a big guy, but you’ve got to stick your nose in and take some pop. His pass catching is a true unknown because so many of the receptions he had in college were at or behind the LoS. If people are counting on him being a substantial CoP factor they may end up being rudely surprised. Maybe not, but there’s no way to confidently project him into that role based upon his college resume.

He easily could be the classic case of a great college RB who translates very poorly to the next level. We’ve seen plenty of examples of that in the past and some of those looked a lot like this guy.

well said BB. have similar thoughts and shocked hearing his name called so early in the draft. he wasn't good at avoided tackle rate or breaking tackles which is a neon red flag going against lesser competition. that's only going to get worse in the NFL. harvey will probably make some splash plays but he's a serious liability in passing situations. he didn't look like a natural pass catcher in college.

Hhhmmmmmm ok

He averaged over 130 rushing yards per game last season. He is also very experienced in the passing game, finishing with 1.44 yards per route run over the previous three seasons.

“Across the 2022 to 2024 seasons, Harvey posted consistent and solid evasion rates between 20.7% and 22.1%. His yards after contact decreased to 3.0 in 2024, but his yards per carry ballooned to 6.8 as he gained 131 rushing yards per game. He posted extremely high boom rates (above 16%) in both of the last two seasons.

Harvey averaged 3.2 YPRR in his 2022 breakthrough, and kept those numbers at 2.0 or above in each of his final two seasons. He finished his college career with 61 receptions and four receiving scores. He even posted a receiving yardage share above 10% in 2024. Harvey generated 73 air yards and evaded eight additional tackles as a receiver.“

Since Sean Payton took over in 2023, the Broncos lead the league in running back receptions (214), a trend consistent with Payton’s tenure in New Orleans, where his backfields totaled a league-high 1,074 receptions from 2013 to 2021.

A big reason for optimism for Harvey is that he gets to play in Sean Payton’s offense. Broncos running backs have caught 214 passes over the past two years, which is more than any other team. Back with the Saints, Payton had Bush, Sproles, Thomas and Kamara, who were all fantasy-relevant, at times, even in part-time roles. For example, Kamara was selected 67th overall compared to Harvey, who was selected 60th. Kamara was a backup as a rookie and played 44.9% of his team's offensive snaps over the season. Kamara finished fourth in fantasy points per game that season with 120 carries and 81 receptions.

Tex

 

[efactor]

I honestly cannot fathom the love for this guy. I guess people scouted off his highlight films or fell in love with his measureables, because I saw some serious shortcomings watching him - and that was for a 6 year college player who was literally a man playing against boys.

He’s got great speed and if he gets a clear runway through the line he understands how to move downhill to the sideline and turn on the jets for long gainers. When he does get a runway, he gets into it fast and through in a hurry and then gets his one cut at the second level where he can utilize that speed.

The problems I saw were multiple. His vision is poor and he doesn’t see the times where he needs to take what he has and instead tries to slow play to the outside and then beat contain when they stall thinking he’s trapped. That’s a tactic that will not win often at the next level. His footwork is not good and he tends to get very linear approaching the PoA. He does not do a good job at getting skinny through small gaps, which combined with the questionable vision is not a good combination in the NFL where seams are smaller and close quickly. And that stutter step and shoulder shimmy crap he does may have frozen college defenders but pros will attack him while he’s dancing and stalling waiting for the defender to freeze so he can get by. He has gained a lot of YAC because he can bounce off a pile, sometimes running into the backs of his O line, and then end run around it, another tactic that won’t end well many times in the NFL. He’s definitely not a pile mover and when a D player gets level with him and gets hold of an arm or his jersey they can spin him down pretty effortlessly.

His pass protection is God awful, and it’s partly due to a lack of willingness as well as technique issues. I get that he’s not a big guy, but you’ve got to stick your nose in and take some pop. His pass catching is a true unknown because so many of the receptions he had in college were at or behind the LoS. If people are counting on him being a substantial CoP factor they may end up being rudely surprised. Maybe not, but there’s no way to confidently project him into that role based upon his college resume.

He easily could be the classic case of a great college RB who translates very poorly to the next level. We’ve seen plenty of examples of that in the past and some of those looked a lot like this guy.

well said BB. have similar thoughts and shocked hearing his name called so early in the draft. he wasn't good at avoided tackle rate or breaking tackles which is a neon red flag going against lesser competition. that's only going to get worse in the NFL. harvey will probably make some splash plays but he's a serious liability in passing situations. he didn't look like a natural pass catcher in college.

Hhhmmmmmm ok

He averaged over 130 rushing yards per game last season. He is also very experienced in the passing game, finishing with 1.44 yards per route run over the previous three seasons.

“Across the 2022 to 2024 seasons, Harvey posted consistent and solid evasion rates between 20.7% and 22.1%. His yards after contact decreased to 3.0 in 2024, but his yards per carry ballooned to 6.8 as he gained 131 rushing yards per game. He posted extremely high boom rates (above 16%) in both of the last two seasons.

Harvey averaged 3.2 YPRR in his 2022 breakthrough, and kept those numbers at 2.0 or above in each of his final two seasons. He finished his college career with 61 receptions and four receiving scores. He even posted a receiving yardage share above 10% in 2024. Harvey generated 73 air yards and evaded eight additional tackles as a receiver.“

Since Sean Payton took over in 2023, the Broncos lead the league in running back receptions (214), a trend consistent with Payton’s tenure in New Orleans, where his backfields totaled a league-high 1,074 receptions from 2013 to 2021.

A big reason for optimism for Harvey is that he gets to play in Sean Payton’s offense. Broncos running backs have caught 214 passes over the past two years, which is more than any other team. Back with the Saints, Payton had Bush, Sproles, Thomas and Kamara, who were all fantasy-relevant, at times, even in part-time roles. For example, Kamara was selected 67th overall compared to Harvey, who was selected 60th. Kamara was a backup as a rookie and played 44.9% of his team's offensive snaps over the season. Kamara finished fourth in fantasy points per game that season with 120 carries and 81 receptions.

Tex

Landing spot matters. I’m amazed some minimize or totally ignore this.

Good post

 

[joey]

I did not see him go “as early as 3” anywhere, but I admit I am not omnipresent or omniscient.

He went at 1.03 in our SharkPool FFPC 1QB league. I’ll let that owner out themselves if they want and explain their thinking.

 

[menobrown]

I did not see him go “as early as 3” anywhere, but I admit I am not omnipresent or omniscient.

He went at 1.03 in our SharkPool FFPC 1QB league. I’ll let that owner out themselves if they want and explain their thinking.

All I know is I'm grateful as could be to that owner for saving me from having to make that decision at 1.03 when he agreed to trade back a spot. Still have no idea what I'd have done if I had to make that pick and could not move, I hate even thinking about it.

That would be the highest Harvey would go in any of my 8 dynasty leagues but really was pretty close. He went 1.4 and 1.5 in two others. As late as 1.12, had biggest discrepancy of any first round player.

I'll just say that before the Dobbins signing I did have Harvey as my #2 rookie RB for redraft and I would say clearly. Not sure now.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

ding spot matters. I’m amazed some minimize or totally ignore this.

Good

Totally agree, but it’s also a combination of talent+landing spot.

Hampton landing in LAC put him in the top 3 convo for sure.

And I think Payton’s “total package, 3-down back” fluff comments really got folks excited when it was just Payton being Payton. And hey, maybe Dobbins gets hurt again & folks who drafted Harvey will have the last laugh.

But landing spot alone shouldn’t drive a players value that high. I guess the example from last year is Quinten Johnston?

 

[kutta]

ding spot matters. I’m amazed some minimize or totally ignore this.

Good

Totally agree, but it’s also a combination of talent+landing spot.

Hampton landing in LAC put him in the top 3 convo for sure.

And I think Payton’s “total package, 3-down back” fluff comments really got folks excited when it was just Payton being Payton. And hey, maybe Dobbins gets hurt again & folks who drafted Harvey will have the last laugh.

But landing spot alone shouldn’t drive a players value that high. I guess the example from last year is Quinten Johnston?

Well, 2nd round draft capital doesn’t hurt either.

 

[efactor]

ding spot matters. I’m amazed some minimize or totally ignore this.

Good

Totally agree, but it’s also a combination of talent+landing spot.

Hampton landing in LAC put him in the top 3 convo for sure.

And I think Payton’s “total package, 3-down back” fluff comments really got folks excited when it was just Payton being Payton. And hey, maybe Dobbins gets hurt again & folks who drafted Harvey will have the last laugh.

But landing spot alone shouldn’t drive a players value that high. I guess the example from last year is Quinten Johnston?

Well, he’s talented too. Obviously the Broncos think so since they grabbed him in the 2nd round.

It’s both things. I do agree #3 overall is high but who knows how it plays out.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Well, 2nd round draft capital doesn’t hurt either.

Definitely part of the equation. But I don’t remember seeing Harvey’s name from the pre-NFL draft FF mocks as a 1st or 2nd round dynasty pick. It was kind of shocking they took him in the 2nd.

Maybe the FF community overreacted to a questionable draft pick. Certainly wouldn’t be the 1st time.

And hey, maybe Dobbins does what Dobbins does best (get hurt) and Harvey proves to be a bargain as a 1.03-1.10 pick.

I fully concede that the possibilities are wide open for him. But at this moment, the Dobbins signing definitely throws some cold water on his dynasty stock. I’m probably not going out on a limb in saying that was a less than optimal outcome for his new shareholders.

 

[starks]

Traded up from 2.01 and threw in 2.09 to score him at 1.09 the other day in 1 qb half point ppr league. Now have Jeanty, Henderson and Harvey to lead my RB stable next few years. Let’s ride!

 

[Grid71]

Love seeing polarizing differences of opinion. I’m fine with fading Harvey with <1% shares in my portfolio. Currently 2 of 260 teams. Will take him a few times 10+ picks past ADP. If I’m wrong, good for those who got it right.

I do recognize 2nd round draft capital is meaningful. Also expect him to get every opportunity to succeed. Denver is a premium landing spot. It is in the range of outcomes he gets good fantasy stats. I just don’t like an old rookie RB from a small program being someone I invest heavily.

RJ is 24
JK is 26

Very weird RJ didn’t go to the NFL sooner if he was that good. Full disclosure, numbers I looked at were from last year only. Didn’t look at his 2019-2023 stats. Just know he started as a 5’8” QB then transferred schools and switched positions. Had the ACL injury then played very well against weaker competition. Definitely promising but some concerns that scare me from trusting he can make the jump to great by NFL standards. Especially concerned with his willingness and ability in the pass protection. Also as a receiver. Hopefully he will find a role in Denver and play well. I’m rooting for him to make it just don’t trust placing bets on that outcome at this time.

 

[Soulfly3]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.
And the rest of it is also dead accurate.

Listen, the guy could end up a star. Anyone can. But at his cost, I'm not touching him anywhere in rnd 1 of rookie drafts.

 

[efactor]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

 

[Soulfly3]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes. For compairson, Hampton fumbled every 124 carries... Even jeanty who I think has 1 sole flaw, fumbling, fumbles every 74 carries

 

[Mitchie]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

 

[Soulfly3]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

 

[Soulfly3]

RJ harvey doesn't have a fumbling Problem:

Rushes per fumble:

Harvey in college as the oldest man on the field - 1 per 64 carries (last 3 season avg) 1 per 77 last season
NFL Top 5 Rushers 2025:
Saquon - 1/177
Henry 1/108
Bijan - 1/304
Taylor - 1/151
Gibbs 1/250

 

[Ilov80s]

All good points being made here. I think it is very fair to downgrade him for his age and path to the NFL. I also think it's fair to give him some grace for having changed positions. I see Harvey as the clear RB6 in the class because of the bit of uncertainty around his profile.

Jeanty/Hampton- check all the boxes
Henderson/Judkins/Johnson- check most of the boxes

 

[eighsse2]

RJ harvey doesn't have a fumbling Problem:

Rushes per fumble:

Harvey in college as the oldest man on the field - 1 per 64 carries (last 3 season avg) 1 per 77 last season
NFL Top 5 Rushers 2025:
Saquon - 1/177
Henry 1/108
Bijan - 1/304
Taylor - 1/151
Gibbs 1/250

I can't find fumbling stats for college players. But throughout college it looks like he had 640 touches. How many total fumbles did he have?

 

[Mitchie]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

Technically yes, but the point you're making is disingenuous and I think you know that. All the players are "playing against teenagers", Harvey just is a year or 2 older than others.

 

[efactor]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes. For compairson, Hampton fumbled every 124 carries... Even jeanty who I think has 1 sole flaw, fumbling, fumbles every 74 carries

Well, based on last year, Harvey had 229 with 3, so one every 76 carries. For the sake of accuracy. Using the latest season is a better indicator of where they are at this point than what may have happened 3 years ago.

Ball security is also something that can be taught at the pro level. Breece Hall fumbled 6 times on 209 carries last year. Granted, against “men” but Jets don’t seem to be spun about it. At least I never hear anyone talk about it.

 

[efactor]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

Technically yes, but the point you're making is disingenuous and I think you know that.

 

[Soulfly3]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

Technically yes, but the point you're making is disingenuous and I think you know that. All the players are "playing against teenagers", Harvey just is a year or 2 older than others.

Having a fumbling problem when you're playing against players almost 99% younger than you is a problem already.
Now doing it at the most extreme level against the cream of the crop grown *** men in all the world...

Not disingenuous at all.

 

[efactor]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

Technically yes, but the point you're making is disingenuous and I think you know that. All the players are "playing against teenagers", Harvey just is a year or 2 older than others.

Having a fumbling problem when you're playing against players almost 99% younger than you is a problem already.
Now doing it at the most extreme level against the cream of the crop grown *** men in all the world...

Not disingenuous at all.

But 3 isn't a fumbling issue, which is the point. When talking small numbers, where do you draw the line? If he had 2, would he have a fumbling issue?

Very disingenuous as you're inventing an issue to try to make your point.

 

[TheWinz]

Definitely part of the equation. But I don’t remember seeing Harvey’s name from the pre-NFL draft FF mocks as a 1st or 2nd round dynasty pick. It was kind of shocking they took him in the 2nd.

Number of posts in player thread before they were drafted:

447 - Jeanty
183 - Henderson
144 - Skattebo
121 - Hampton
107 - Judkins
90 - Johnson
41 - Etienne
16 - Harvey
16 - Tuten

 

[Soulfly3]

Definitely part of the equation. But I don’t remember seeing Harvey’s name from the pre-NFL draft FF mocks as a 1st or 2nd round dynasty pick. It was kind of shocking they took him in the 2nd.

Number of posts in player thread before they were drafted:

447 - Jeanty
183 - Henderson
144 - Skattebo
121 - Hampton
107 - Judkins
90 - Johnson
41 - Etienne
16 - Harvey
16 - Tuten

My point exactly. But (potential) top 3 pick!

 

[Soulfly3]

Anyways, I've stated my case as to why I don't think he's worth the squeeze.

That said, I'd love him to prove me wrong and I'd get no joy out of him failing, so I'm bouncing from this thread.

I'm sounding like a hater when I'm really just saying I'd take him nowhere at his current numbers.

Good luck to him.

 

[eighsse2]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

Technically yes, but the point you're making is disingenuous and I think you know that. All the players are "playing against teenagers", Harvey just is a year or 2 older than others.

Having a fumbling problem when you're playing against players almost 99% younger than you is a problem already.
Now doing it at the most extreme level against the cream of the crop grown *** men in all the world...

Not disingenuous at all.

But 3 isn't a fumbling issue, which is the point. When talking small numbers, where do you draw the line? If he had 2, would he have a fumbling issue?

Very disingenuous as you're inventing an issue to try to make your point.

I agree, sample size matters here. I wonder how many total fumbles he had since that is a pretty decent sample size over 640 touches.

 

[Soulfly3]

Turning 25
the worst pass protection % in all of college
fumbling issues
was talked about by no one in this place pre-draft

... became a guy to target as early as 3 because he landed in denver.

I talked about these issues in April/early May and got slammed for some reason... And now, mid-june, here we are. I genuinely wish I played in some of your leagues

A bit premature for a victory lap. You couldnt even wait til his first game?

Not to mention the inaccuracies. Harvey fumbled 3 times in 2024 (1 lost) on 232 carries. Calling that a "fumbling issue" is a stretch. A large stretch.

Hard to take some of these posts seriously. But thankful I don't play in leagues with them

There's nothing inaccurate, he put the ball on the ground 3 times as a 24yr old man, playing against teenagers.

So Harvey played strictly against freshman defensive players? Teenagers?

Sounds like another inaccuracy on your part.

Again, 3 fumbles is not a “fumbling issue. You seem intent on misinformation to try to make your point.

What percentage of opponents do you think were YOUNGER than Harvey, out of curiosity?
Just toss a number out there.

ETA: I think a fumble every 64 carries is a bit of a fumbling issue, yes.

A lot, just say that rather than "playing against teenagers", also he was 23 during the season. Treveyon Henderson was 22.

So he was 23, and A LOT of his opponents were in fact teenagers. Hell even playing against 20 yr olds when you're 23 is a bit of a difference in my eyes

Technically yes, but the point you're making is disingenuous and I think you know that. All the players are "playing against teenagers", Harvey just is a year or 2 older than others.

Having a fumbling problem when you're playing against players almost 99% younger than you is a problem already.
Now doing it at the most extreme level against the cream of the crop grown *** men in all the world...

Not disingenuous at all.

But 3 isn't a fumbling issue, which is the point. When talking small numbers, where do you draw the line? If he had 2, would he have a fumbling issue?

Very disingenuous as you're inventing an issue to try to make your point.

I agree, sample size matters here. I wonder how many total fumbles he had since that is a pretty decent sample size over 640 touches.

3 in 232. 3 in 226. 3 in 118.

There's the context... now like I said, I'm out fellas.

 

[TheWinz]

3 in 232. 3 in 226. 3 in 118

9 fumbles in 640 touches. I've never compared college to pro fumbles. I wonder if 1 fumble every 71 touches is average for someone coming out? Let's compare to the other RB's drafted in the first 3 rounds:
Jeanty - 1 fumble every 83 touches
Hampton - 1 fumble every 139 touches
Johnson - 1 fumble every 179 touches
Judkins - 1 fumble every 200 touches
Henderson - 1 fumble every 334 touches

 

[FarFromHome]

My gut says Dobbins leads this team in carrys for 2025. Imo

 

[JoeKappBudGrant]

RJ harvey doesn't have a fumbling Problem:

Rushes per fumble:

Harvey in college as the oldest man on the field - 1 per 64 carries (last 3 season avg) 1 per 77 last season
NFL Top 5 Rushers 2025:
Saquon - 1/177
Henry 1/108
Bijan - 1/304
Taylor - 1/151
Gibbs 1/250

Based on those numbers from last year, Harvey fumbles about 4 times per 300 carries. The top 5 NFL RB's fumbled 1 and 1/2 times per 300 carries. As to age, Harvey was a 6th year college player last year. The average college starter is a third-year player. Harvey was on average 3 years older than his competitors. As to Harvey's actual age compared to the top drafted RB's, he is 21 months older than Henderson, 26 months older than Hampton, 31 months older than Johnson, 33 months older than Judkins and 34 months older than Jeanty. Harvey is 25 months younger than Dobbins.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I wonder if 1 fumble every 71 touches is average for someone coming out? Let's compare to the other RB's drafted in the first 3 rounds:
Jeanty - 1 fumble every 83 touches

Seems kinda high for both Jeanty & Harvey tbh.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

My gut says Dobbins leads this team in carrys for 2025. Imo

He’s the ultimate boom/bust. He’ll either lead the team in carries or he’ll lead the team in trips to the blue tent.

 

[efactor]

In the NFL, the top 10 RBs in fumbles for 2024 had 48 between them. Only 22 recovered by the defense.

Thought that number would be higher. Kind of interesting.

Fumble leaders in 2024:

Stevenson 7 207 attempts
Breece Hall 6 209 attempts
Aaron Jones 5 255 attempts
Kyren Williams 5 316 attempts
Tyrone Tracy 5 192 attempts

 

[menobrown]

I wonder if 1 fumble every 71 touches is average for someone coming out? Let's compare to the other RB's drafted in the first 3 rounds:
Jeanty - 1 fumble every 83 touches

Seems kinda high for both Jeanty & Harvey tbh.

Jeanty's fumble rate also got worse this last two years, rose to one very 73.3 touches.

Skattebo missed that bolded cutoff by a few picks but fwiw he's one out of 82 touches.He's also almost exactly only one year younger then Harvey and also broke out late against a lower level of comp. Cheaper in rookie drafts and a different style of player but if these are concerns on Harvey should be on him as well IMO.

Jaydon Blue probably wins the Marshawn Lloyd butterhands award from this rookie class, one every 38 career touches and that was actually worse last year, one ever 35.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Ya'll remember that RB prospect that was a great prospect, and looked great in the NFL, but never made it in fantasy because his college fumbling issues reared their ugly head?

Probably not....because he doesn't exist. College fumbles for a RB may be the most irrelevant stat in all of fantasy football. It just doesn't matter. It's very easy to fix, and even if it ends up being worse than average it rarely (never?) keeps a guy from getting significant work if he ends up being good enough for significant work.

Every year the FF community zeroes in on one prospects fumbling issues, and then once they hit the NFL we essentially never hear about it again. Over and over again.

Here are some of the prospects with the worst fumbling "problems" coming into the league, all with fumbles at a frequency of at best 1 in 80 carries, all the way down to the absurd 1 in 27 carries (Miles Sanders)

Adrian Peterson
LeSean McCoy
Dalvin Cook
Tiki Barber
Jay Ajayi
Nick Chubb
Melvin Gordon
Jonathan Taylor
Miles Sanders
Joe Mixon
Alvin Kamara

JT and Dalvin in particular were both around 1 in 50 carries.

On the flipside, the NFL leaders in fumbles over the last two years (Breece Hall and Kyren Williams) both didn't have fumble issues at all in college, and even though they've had fumble issues in the NFL it hasn't really impacted their playing time or FF performance.

There are certainly reasons to fade Harvey, but his college fumble rate probably isn't one of them. It just never really has an effect on FF, even though people talk about it with RB prospects every single year.

 

[Bronco Billy]

If you guys are putting any significant emphasis on college fumbling in your evaluations you’re making a serious mistake IMO.

The pros spend a lot more time on small details including position of the ball while running, the players get to practice against absolute masters in creating fumbles - moreso than the vast majority of college players - and guys get tackled more quickly in the NFL instead of being able to drag tacklers an extra 5 yards and exposing the ball more recklessly while doing so.

This all leads to much better ball security at the pro level, where there is little tolerance for turning the ball over (one of the highest correlating factors to victories is turnover ratio and coaches/players know it).

 

[menobrown]

Ya'll remember that RB prospect that was a great prospect, and looked great in the NFL, but never made it in fantasy because his college fumbling issues reared their ugly head?

If you guys are putting any significant emphasis on college fumbling in your evaluations you’re making a serious mistake IMO.

I agree and just posted what I did a few posts up providing more info.

I argued this considerably last year in discussions on Marshawn Lloyd and it's not a reason to get down on Jaydon Blue for me as it is for others.

It's a fixable problem, lack of talent's not, and the more talent you got the longer leash you get to fix the problem.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

Ya'll remember that RB prospect that was a great prospect, and looked great in the NFL, but never made it in fantasy because his college fumbling issues reared their ugly head?

Probably not....because he doesn't exist. College fumbles for a RB may be the most irrelevant stat in all of fantasy football. It just doesn't matter. It's very easy to fix, and even if it ends up being worse than average it rarely (never?) keeps a guy from getting significant work if he ends up being good enough for significant work.

Every year the FF community zeroes in on one prospects fumbling issues, and then once they hit the NFL we essentially never hear about it again. Over and over again.

Here are some of the prospects with the worst fumbling "problems" coming into the league, all with fumbles at a frequency of at best 1 in 80 carries, all the way down to the absurd 1 in 27 carries (Miles Sanders)

Adrian Peterson
LeSean McCoy
Dalvin Cook
Tiki Barber
Jay Ajayi
Nick Chubb
Melvin Gordon
Jonathan Taylor
Miles Sanders
Joe Mixon
Alvin Kamara

JT and Dalvin in particular were both around 1 in 50 carries.

On the flipside, the NFL leaders in fumbles over the last two years (Breece Hall and Kyren Williams) both didn't have fumble issues at all in college, and even though they've had fumble issues in the NFL it hasn't really impacted their playing time or FF performance.

There are certainly reasons to fade Harvey, but his college fumble rate probably isn't one of them. It just never really has an effect on FF, even though people talk about it with RB prospects every single year.

Good stuff. Appreciate the thoughtful post. Although I did chuckle at the inclusion of Jay Ajayi.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Dobbins is definitely going to cloud things on the run up for Redrafts but that might only make Harvey more affordable and push him down a round or two, or maybe not BUT...
Before we get too excited about Dobbins, let's look at what he's done thus far in the NFL

J.K. Dobbins Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Draft, College | Pro-Football-Reference.com

Checkout the latest stats for J.K. Dobbins. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, college, draft, and more on Pro-football-reference.com.

www.pro-football-reference.com

He's now on his 3rd team in 5 years, he's a journeyman at this point.
195 carries last year, a career high. I know he's been injured a lot, that's not good either and something you want to consider
After last season, the most carries he had previously was 134 his rookie season, that's an avg of about 8-10 carries a game
Harvey will still be heavily involved and sure it might take a couple weeks to get him acclimated but you saw it took Bucky Irving a few games to get going last season

Still bullish on Harvey and glad a more accomplished veteran wasn't brought in.
Anyone know what they paid Dobbins to sign him?

Harvey spoke out about the signing of Dobbins

Rookie RJ Harvey Breaks Silence on Broncos Signing RB J.K. Dobbins

The Denver Broncos' rookie running back spoke publicly on the J.K. Dobbins topic for the first time.

www.si.com

“I’m excited to be in the room with him. He’s a vet," Harvey said of Dobbins, via Klis. "He’s been in the league for about, what, five, six years now? I’m excited to get to learn from him and all the other guys as well. I feel like we’ve got a great room. People sleeping on us right now but we’re going to wake everybody up this year.”

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Bucky Irving showed a lot of flashes but ultimately did not seize the starting job until about Week 10
He posted 14 carries in week 6 but didn't get a steady diet of touches until about about halfway thru the season

I think Harvey will now take a slower path before he is able to win the starting job, assuming Dobbins can stay healthy which he usually doesn't
If Dobbins cannot start the season healthy which he's done a couple times, training camp is not kind to him.

We'll see how it shakes out but certainly Harvey has to take a little bump down in his ADP in the next few days/weeks.
I hope people forget about him and focus on Dobbins

He is about a Mid 5th round pick at the moment, RB20 off the board, maybe that will change