Second Year Wide Receivers (1 Viewer)

[cstu]

I don't see why so many people are down on Vincent Brown. He could be the best WR in San Diego this year.

I am glad someone else out there is thinking!

Well at least there's three of us. He's already proven to Rivers that he'll do whatever it takes to make the catch when his number is called.With everyone seemingly so down on him, he seems the perfect buy-low right about now.

People are scared off because they signed Meachem and Royal, but I see it as them looking ahead to not re-signing Floyd. If if you can acquire him cheap I think it's worth it to see how this season plays out.

 

[coolnerd]

The guy I like from a cost/upside perspective is Clyde Gates. I think he has the potential to pull a Chad Johnson this year. He has elite physical ability and a wide open opportunity to win the #1 job on a team that will be playing from behind. Definitely a guy that I'll be looking to snag in the late rounds.

Just missing why people keep bringing this guy up. Has a ton of straightline speed, and nothing else. Overaged prospect who did not flash as rookie (I know he was "injured"), has zero reputation as significant route runneer nor NFL level hands. while he lookslike he in a good situation, the Dolphins have will have either a rookie QB or below average veteran throwing to him.

The list of great receivers who didn't produce as rookies is a long one. Here are what some prominent WRs did in their rookie season:Miles Austin - 0 catches

Wes Welker - 0 catches

Vincent Jackson - 3 catches

Steve Smith (CAR) - 10 catches

Steve Johnson - 10 catches

Antonio Brown - 16 catches

Brandon Marshall - 20 catches

Plaxico Burress - 22 catches

Chad Johnson - 28 catches

Roddy White - 29 catches

The instant success of players like AJ Green and Mike Williams makes it easy to forget that there's a learning curve for players making the transition from college to the NFL. You often don't see a receiver's true ability until 2-3 years into his career. Gates has a good excuse because he not only had to make the jump from college, but from a small school. In that regard he's similar to Austin and Jackson, who both played at tiny colleges and were basically invisible as rookies.

Regarding this...

Has a ton of straightline speed, and nothing else. Overaged prospect who did not flash as rookie (I know he was "injured"), has zero reputation as significant route runneer nor NFL level hands.

He only had 12 targets last season. How much flash were you expecting? I'd say he showed

The point is that Gates is talked about as though he actually HAS DONE something that separates him from the other dart throws like Kelsey, Jean, doss, etc. Darts sometime come up bullseye. welker after his first, heck after his second season was dart throw, not "sleeper." Sleeper implies that there is evidence, Gates has NONE. No pre-season, no single play, no reproters comments, no rumor mill comments, no extended rookie playing time; absolutely zero. Deos that mean I am not wrong about him? No, but he no better chance than any other late round dude/UDFA that made his squad from last year. I missing this special could be number 1 junk. If he "makes it " I am expecting plenty of inconsistent speed guy from him, not anything to hang my fantasy hat on.

 

[cstu]

David Gettis. Granted, this is his 3rd year, but I kind of look at his last year as a redshirt. Showed good potential as a rookie.

I think he's better than Lafell but Lafell has a head start on him for the #2 job. Steve Smith is only signed to essentially a 2 year contract so there's a fair chance one of these guys will be the #1 in 2014.

 

[cstu]

No one mentions him, but in PPR, I think Jeremy Kerley is someone who will find his way mid-way through the stats of the aforementioned. He had a "fine" rookie year for a guy who was a possession receiver only used in the second half of the season. He cemented himself in a role where neither QB is accurate enough to hit the "fly guy", and he will benefit from multiple checkdowns.

I really liked Kerley until they drafted Hill. However, it's looking like he's the odd man out now behind Holmes, Hill and Keller.

 

[squistion]

No one mentions him, but in PPR, I think Jeremy Kerley is someone who will find his way mid-way through the stats of the aforementioned. He had a "fine" rookie year for a guy who was a possession receiver only used in the second half of the season. He cemented himself in a role where neither QB is accurate enough to hit the "fly guy", and he will benefit from multiple checkdowns.

I really liked Kerley until they drafted Hill. However, it's looking like he's the odd man out now behind Holmes, Hill and Keller.

You see Hill as being a possession receiver? I see Kerley competing with Keller but that has not been my impression of what I have heard about Hill - at least not being talked about as a possession receiver.

 

[cstu]

No one mentions him, but in PPR, I think Jeremy Kerley is someone who will find his way mid-way through the stats of the aforementioned. He had a "fine" rookie year for a guy who was a possession receiver only used in the second half of the season. He cemented himself in a role where neither QB is accurate enough to hit the "fly guy", and he will benefit from multiple checkdowns.

I really liked Kerley until they drafted Hill. However, it's looking like he's the odd man out now behind Holmes, Hill and Keller.

You see Hill as being a possession receiver? I see Kerley competing with Keller but that has not been my impression of what I have heard about Hill - at least not being talked about as a possession receiver.

No, but I don't think there will be enough balls to goes around. With Hill taking over Burress' role, Kerley will have to cut into Keller's targets and I don't see that happening. He should improve on last year's numbers but drafting Hill really hurts his chances since that offense is not good enough to support all of those guys.

 

[EBF]

The point is that Gates is talked about as though he actually HAS DONE something that separates him from the other dart throws like Kelsey, Jean, doss, etc. Darts sometime come up bullseye. welker after his first, heck after his second season was dart throw, not "sleeper." Sleeper implies that there is evidence, Gates has NONE. No pre-season, no single play, no reproters comments, no rumor mill comments, no extended rookie playing time; absolutely zero. Deos that mean I am not wrong about him? No, but he no better chance than any other late round dude/UDFA what made his squad from last year. I missing this special could be number 1 junk. If he "makes it " I am expecting plenty of inconsistent speed guy from him, not anything to hang my fantasy hat on.

He has rare physical tools. That alone separates him from a lot of other sleeper candidates. A guy like Doss has absolutely zero distinguishing physical qualities. He's your typical college overachiever who slipped in the draft because he lacks ideal NFL tools.Gates has freakish athletic ability. He ran 4.31 at the combine, jumped 40" in the vertical leap, and 10'11" in the broad jump (insane for a 5'11" man). That puts him in rarefied athletic territory with the likes of Chris Johnson, Justin Fargas, Calvin Johnson, Reggie Bush, and Jerome Simpson. He was a lower draft pick than all of those guys, but he had some major factors working against him (small school, advanced age, character issues). It's easy to see why he might have slipped a round or two from where his talent warrants.I haven't seen anybody on here saying he's accomplished anything or that he's a lock to succeed, but when you look at Miami's bare WR cupboard, he's the only name that has any real exciting qualities. For me he's the easy pick of the litter for FF purposes and one of the best risk/reward gambles in last year's rookie class precisely because he's cheap. Contrary to your suggestion that people talk about him as if he has done something, most people probably don't even know who he is. A lot of folks favor guys like BJ Cunningham and Jeff Fuller in the Miami WR thread even though they're later draft picks with inferior tools. Gates is one of those guys you can snag late who could have an out-of-nowhere 1,100 yard season. If he busts, no biggie because he doesn't cost much at all.

 

[mbuehner]

No one mentions him, but in PPR, I think Jeremy Kerley is someone who will find his way mid-way through the stats of the aforementioned. He had a "fine" rookie year for a guy who was a possession receiver only used in the second half of the season. He cemented himself in a role where neither QB is accurate enough to hit the "fly guy", and he will benefit from multiple checkdowns.

I really liked Kerley until they drafted Hill. However, it's looking like he's the odd man out now behind Holmes, Hill and Keller.

You see Hill as being a possession receiver? I see Kerley competing with Keller but that has not been my impression of what I have heard about Hill - at least not being talked about as a possession receiver.

No, but I don't think there will be enough balls to goes around. With Hill taking over Burress' role, Kerley will have to cut into Keller's targets and I don't see that happening. He should improve on last year's numbers but drafting Hill really hurts his chances since that offense is not good enough to support all of those guys.

Keller had 115 targets which is way too high for him (and only 5 tds to show for it). Tomlinsom had 60, these are the signs of a check down happy offense which the jets want to get away from. We'll see, but they arent throwing that much to Keller because hes where they want to go.Burress had 96 targets, tomlinson 60,and mason 20 that will have to be made up (and i think keller goes back to a more realistic number).thats actually a lot of targets to be filled, you can give hill 100 and still expand Kerleys role a good bit.

 

[loose circuits]

I'm agreeing with EBF on Clyde Gates. I think he has the best shot of all Miami's WR's to have at least a decent year and an upside for a real good year. You'll be able to get him real late and at that price I think he could be a sleeper that jumps out and then everyone wants to get him. A guy that could surprise everyone and help your team. I'd definitely take a late round flyer on him. We're always looking for that guy that no one suspects will bust out somewhat and Gates I feel could have the opportunity to do that.

I was hoping Gates would surprise last year, but now I am not so hopeful. He is an older guy, and so, his failure to step in and do more as a rookie is what makes me doubt that he will improve that much. You can expect a 20 or 21 year old to improve a ton. But a guy who is 26? He is already mature.

I guess it depends on your definition of mature. The guy didn't play football in HS, right? He went to DII right? Was hurt all year right? What should we have expected?

 

[loose circuits]

Saw this on Rotoworld:The Palm Beach Post believes second-year WR Clyde Gates is "no lock to make the roster."

Did you read the article? Sounded like a flat guess from the author

 

[oukurt]

I think Little will be a bust and I think Moore also takes a big step back.

You think this because of the QB upgrade, the RB upgrade, the OL upgrade, or all the WRs the Browns added?

You honestly think Weeden is going to be an upgrade over McCoy?

No doubt about it. McCoy is a lifetime backup QB. Weeden will start week 1. Not easy for me to say as a Sooner, but this guy is the real deal.

 

[oukurt]

Buying:

AJ Green

Julio Jones

Torrey Smith

Doug Baldwin

Greg Little

Denarius Moore

Randall Cobb

Selling:

Titus Young

  Vincent Brown

I think Ryan Broyles is a better talent than Titus Young and if Broyles is healthy he will be the number 2 in Detroit.

Vincent Brown hasn't convinced me yet. I think Randall Cobb can surpass James Jones on the depth chart his year, Jones is just to inconsistant for me. Torrey Smith has a chance to be the number 1 WR in Baltimore and what I hear he can.

The Lions have already said that Young is their outside receiver and Broyles will play the slot, if he's even healthy to start the year. I don't see Broyles starting over Young.

Why not? Have you ever seen Broyles play? I think he becomes a ppr monster.

 

[msommer]

I'm agreeing with EBF on Clyde Gates. I think he has the best shot of all Miami's WR's to have at least a decent year and an upside for a real good year. You'll be able to get him real late and at that price I think he could be a sleeper that jumps out and then everyone wants to get him. A guy that could surprise everyone and help your team. I'd definitely take a late round flyer on him. We're always looking for that guy that no one suspects will bust out somewhat and Gates I feel could have the opportunity to do that.

I was hoping Gates would surprise last year, but now I am not so hopeful. He is an older guy, and so, his failure to step in and do more as a rookie is what makes me doubt that he will improve that much. You can expect a 20 or 21 year old to improve a ton. But a guy who is 26? He is already mature.

Only reason would be if there was a lock out before his rookie season, denying him time with the team.Oh wait, there was

 

[identikit]

I'm agreeing with EBF on Clyde Gates. I think he has the best shot of all Miami's WR's to have at least a decent year and an upside for a real good year. You'll be able to get him real late and at that price I think he could be a sleeper that jumps out and then everyone wants to get him. A guy that could surprise everyone and help your team. I'd definitely take a late round flyer on him. We're always looking for that guy that no one suspects will bust out somewhat and Gates I feel could have the opportunity to do that.

I was hoping Gates would surprise last year, but now I am not so hopeful. He is an older guy, and so, his failure to step in and do more as a rookie is what makes me doubt that he will improve that much. You can expect a 20 or 21 year old to improve a ton. But a guy who is 26? He is already mature.

Only reason would be if there was a lock out before his rookie season, denying him time with the team.Oh wait, there was

That wasn't a reason for quite a few rookies who did pretty well (or, at the very least, showed some glimpses of value) with the same (lack of) opportunity.

 

[msommer]

I'm agreeing with EBF on Clyde Gates. I think he has the best shot of all Miami's WR's to have at least a decent year and an upside for a real good year. You'll be able to get him real late and at that price I think he could be a sleeper that jumps out and then everyone wants to get him. A guy that could surprise everyone and help your team. I'd definitely take a late round flyer on him. We're always looking for that guy that no one suspects will bust out somewhat and Gates I feel could have the opportunity to do that.

I was hoping Gates would surprise last year, but now I am not so hopeful. He is an older guy, and so, his failure to step in and do more as a rookie is what makes me doubt that he will improve that much. You can expect a 20 or 21 year old to improve a ton. But a guy who is 26? He is already mature.

Only reason would be if there was a lock out before his rookie season, denying him time with the team.Oh wait, there was

That wasn't a reason for quite a few rookies who did pretty well (or, at the very least, showed some glimpses of value) with the same (lack of) opportunity.

but maybe for the old guy who takes a while to improve?

 

[msommer]

I thought I'd mention Salas who seemed to be doing ok until his injury. He's quite possibly a perpetual posession receiver but there appears to be logjam of mediocrity in STL st WR it seems, he'll be someone who is available late to take a flyer on.

problem with him is the current regime has no ties to him. And they just drafted 2 WRs fairly high, he will be lucky to be on the team

Maybe Quick is a lock but have a hard time seeing this argument being valid for the fourth rounder they spent on Chris Givens. Fisher has previously spent fourth rounders (or higher) on WRs who have virtually never seen the field (e.g. Courtney Roby, Roydell Williams, Paul Williams, Lavelle Hawkins).

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

Buying:

AJ Green

Julio Jones

Torrey Smith

Doug Baldwin

Greg Little

Denarius Moore

Randall Cobb

Selling:

Titus Young

  Vincent Brown

I think Ryan Broyles is a better talent than Titus Young and if Broyles is healthy he will be the number 2 in Detroit.

Vincent Brown hasn't convinced me yet. I think Randall Cobb can surpass James Jones on the depth chart his year, Jones is just to inconsistant for me. Torrey Smith has a chance to be the number 1 WR in Baltimore and what I hear he can.

The Lions have already said that Young is their outside receiver and Broyles will play the slot, if he's even healthy to start the year. I don't see Broyles starting over Young.

Why not? Have you ever seen Broyles play? I think he becomes a ppr monster.

I have and I don't see the explosiveness needed to excel at the NFL level. He played in a spread offense that matched him up with lesser talents. How have the Oklahoma players fared in the NFL from that passing game? Sam Bradford...Greshem...Mark Bradley...Juaquin Iglesias...He's also coming off of a serious knee injury.

 

[Lash]

also, i'm loving the value VBrown looks like his ADP will bring ... Meachem and Floyd are in the dictionary beside the word "brittle"

 

[squistion]

I thought I'd mention Salas who seemed to be doing ok until his injury. He's quite possibly a perpetual posession receiver but there appears to be logjam of mediocrity in STL st WR it seems, he'll be someone who is available late to take a flyer on.

problem with him is the current regime has no ties to him. And they just drafted 2 WRs fairly high, he will be lucky to be on the team

Maybe Quick is a lock but have a hard time seeing this argument being valid for the fourth rounder they spent on Chris Givens. Fisher has previously spent fourth rounders (or higher) on WRs who have virtually never seen the field (e.g. Courtney Roby, Roydell Williams, Paul Williams, Lavelle Hawkins).

Not everyone agrees with that assessment:

From: Footballguys.com News Blogger - 2:28pm - May 14, 2012

St. Louis Rams WRs Brian Quick, Chris Givens and Danny Amendola appear to be the only receivers that are locks to make the final roster if the team decides to keep six receivers.

 

[Crazy Tony]

Buying:

AJ Green

Julio Jones

Torrey Smith

Doug Baldwin

Greg Little

Denarius Moore

Randall Cobb

Selling:

Titus Young

  Vincent Brown

I think Ryan Broyles is a better talent than Titus Young and if Broyles is healthy he will be the number 2 in Detroit.

Vincent Brown hasn't convinced me yet. I think Randall Cobb can surpass James Jones on the depth chart his year, Jones is just to inconsistant for me. Torrey Smith has a chance to be the number 1 WR in Baltimore and what I hear he can.

The Lions have already said that Young is their outside receiver and Broyles will play the slot, if he's even healthy to start the year. I don't see Broyles starting over Young.

Why not? Have you ever seen Broyles play? I think he becomes a ppr monster.

I have and I don't see the explosiveness needed to excel at the NFL level. He played in a spread offense that matched him up with lesser talents. How have the Oklahoma players fared in the NFL from that passing game? Sam Bradford...Greshem...Mark Bradley...Juaquin Iglesias...He's also coming off of a serious knee injury.

I like this list. I'm a VBROWN owner and Little Owner. I'm also keeping my eye on Donnie Avery in INDY w/ LUCK. I don't know what will happen. But there could be a lot of passes w/ the Colts. If Avery has wheels back maybe he could stretch and break open some big games. He's a FA in our league. I drafted SALAS bc of the Bradford QB...tandem... couldn't keep him. Wasn't getting opportunity. Not enough options to go around. I have guys higher than Salas but it doesn't hurt to watch him. If not in STL maybe on another roster or something. I also think Josh Baldwin could do well. He's a good player with a knucklehead. He's got plenty of upside. LITTLE had decent production for a rookie. Sometime I think we get impatient. Since I drafted him over C. Newton...I'm really hoping that I'm right here.

 

[JamesTheScot]

I think Little will be a bust and I think Moore also takes a big step back.

You think this because of the QB upgrade, the RB upgrade, the OL upgrade, or all the WRs the Browns added?

You honestly think Weeden is going to be an upgrade over McCoy?

I'm a bit surprised by the optimism for Little...and I own him.He didn't impress with either his hands or his route running. And his YAC ability (former RB), which was supposed to be a strength, wasn't really on display either.

Weedon is a rookie so even though he has a stronger arm than McCoy there's no guarantee he'll actually be a net plus for Little.

And then there's the addition of Richardson. Cleveland has a pretty solid O-line. Think they're going to try and establish a ground and pound mentality and protect their rookie QB? The addition of Richardson probably tells you all you need to know about where this team is headed in terms of offensive philosophy.

As for the lack of WR additions, that's about the only positive for Little. But here's the thing. Even if he gets the most targets, what do you really have? He's the #1 target for the Cleveland Browns. There are plenty of #1 targets that aren't going to be anything more than bye week fill-ins.

 

[msommer]

I thought I'd mention Salas who seemed to be doing ok until his injury. He's quite possibly a perpetual posession receiver but there appears to be logjam of mediocrity in STL st WR it seems, he'll be someone who is available late to take a flyer on.

problem with him is the current regime has no ties to him. And they just drafted 2 WRs fairly high, he will be lucky to be on the team

Maybe Quick is a lock but have a hard time seeing this argument being valid for the fourth rounder they spent on Chris Givens. Fisher has previously spent fourth rounders (or higher) on WRs who have virtually never seen the field (e.g. Courtney Roby, Roydell Williams, Paul Williams, Lavelle Hawkins).

Not everyone agrees with that assessment:

From: Footballguys.com News Blogger - 2:28pm - May 14, 2012

St. Louis Rams WRs Brian Quick, Chris Givens and Danny Amendola appear to be the only receivers that are locks to make the final roster if the team decides to keep six receivers.

Naturally. But please take note there is no mention of the reason why anywhere, ie. could be just speculation on the basis of draft etc.This will play itself out in camp

 

[cstu]

Buying:

AJ Green

Julio Jones

Torrey Smith

Doug Baldwin

Greg Little

Denarius Moore

Randall Cobb

Selling:

Titus Young

  Vincent Brown

I think Ryan Broyles is a better talent than Titus Young and if Broyles is healthy he will be the number 2 in Detroit.

Vincent Brown hasn't convinced me yet. I think Randall Cobb can surpass James Jones on the depth chart his year, Jones is just to inconsistant for me. Torrey Smith has a chance to be the number 1 WR in Baltimore and what I hear he can.

The Lions have already said that Young is their outside receiver and Broyles will play the slot, if he's even healthy to start the year. I don't see Broyles starting over Young.

Why not? Have you ever seen Broyles play? I think he becomes a ppr monster.

I have and I don't see the explosiveness needed to excel at the NFL level. He played in a spread offense that matched him up with lesser talents. How have the Oklahoma players fared in the NFL from that passing game? Sam Bradford...Greshem...Mark Bradley...Juaquin Iglesias...He's also coming off of a serious knee injury.

The nearest Oklahoma comparison to Broyles in terms of productivity, when they were drafted and height/weight is Mark Clayton (1.22). Clayton never lived up to his expectations but he was on an awful passing team and Broyles gets to play opposite the best WR in the game. He's old for a rookie (already 24) and coming off an ACL so I wonder how much upside he has. However, there's not much standing in the way of him putting up WR3 numbers as the #2.

 

[wadegarrett]

also, i'm loving the value VBrown looks like his ADP will bring ... Meachem and Floyd are in the dictionary beside the word "brittle"

Meachem has missed 2 games in the last 4 years.ETA: Love Meachem this year. Definitely will be targeting him for value.

 

[oukurt]

Buying:

AJ Green

Julio Jones

Torrey Smith

Doug Baldwin

Greg Little

Denarius Moore

Randall Cobb

Selling:

Titus Young

  Vincent Brown

I think Ryan Broyles is a better talent than Titus Young and if Broyles is healthy he will be the number 2 in Detroit.

Vincent Brown hasn't convinced me yet. I think Randall Cobb can surpass James Jones on the depth chart his year, Jones is just to inconsistant for me. Torrey Smith has a chance to be the number 1 WR in Baltimore and what I hear he can.

The Lions have already said that Young is their outside receiver and Broyles will play the slot, if he's even healthy to start the year. I don't see Broyles starting over Young.

Why not? Have you ever seen Broyles play? I think he becomes a ppr monster.

I have and I don't see the explosiveness needed to excel at the NFL level. He played in a spread offense that matched him up with lesser talents. How have the Oklahoma players fared in the NFL from that passing game? Sam Bradford...Greshem...Mark Bradley...Juaquin Iglesias...He's also coming off of a serious knee injury.

Well it is too early on Bradford and Gresham(he has looked pretty good). Not sure why you made Bradley and Iglesias examples though. They couldn't hold Broyles jock. Leave it to a Texas and OU guy to disagree though.

 

[Fantasy Bum]

Leonard Hankerson.

 

[bengalbuck]

I've never seen it with Hankerson. Think he'll be out of the league in a few years. I also am not very high on Greg Little. He had 120 targets last year and still didn't do much. Even though Cleveland is still terrible at WR, I can't see him getting too many more targets than that and he was unstartable despite all those opportunities.

I think AJ Green can take a big step even beyond what he did last year and I also think Torrey Smith can make a good sized leap. Both are guys I think are a little underrated even at current prices. Green is going to be a monster for a long time. And Smith is very talented and in a perfect situation. Flacco throws a nice deep ball and Torrey is the #1 WR there without a ton of competition.

I think Denarius Moore, Titus Young and Randall Cobb are talented so they are guys I wouldn't mind owning. But I wouldn't really go out of my way to get them due to their situations. Oakland's WR corp is underrated. With DHB, Jacoby Ford and Juron Criner all vying for targets, it'll be tough for Moore to put up big numbers. Especially since he converted on such a low percentage of his targets last year. Same with Titus Young. I think the Detroit D will improve and Stafford won't have so many huge 4th quarters trying to come from behind. Young will be splitting targets with Broyles and Pettigrew behind Calvin Johnson who will get a ton of balls thrown his way. If healthy, Best will also catch a lot of passes. And Cobb also has a lot of other talented guys he is competing with for targets (Jennings, Jordy, Jermichael Finley, James Jones). Even if Driver's gone, he still is likely the 4th guy behind 3 very good players.

I'm not sure what to think of Doug Baldwin or Vincent Brown. I think both are worth owning just to see where they shake out in their team's WR pecking order, but I wouldn't give up much for either of them. They do have good upside because they have a chance to end up the top target in their offenses, but could very easily end up being "just a guy" types also.

 

[coolnerd]

http://blogs.palmbeachpost.com/thedailydolphin/2012/05/19/catching-up-notes-and-quotes-from-fins-weekend-media-availability/

Ireland talking about his WRs

 

[Ghost of Bill Walsh]

The point is that Gates is talked about as though he actually HAS DONE something that separates him from the other dart throws like Kelsey, Jean, doss, etc. Darts sometime come up bullseye. welker after his first, heck after his second season was dart throw, not "sleeper." Sleeper implies that there is evidence, Gates has NONE. No pre-season, no single play, no reproters comments, no rumor mill comments, no extended rookie playing time; absolutely zero. Deos that mean I am not wrong about him? No, but he no better chance than any other late round dude/UDFA what made his squad from last year. I missing this special could be number 1 junk. If he "makes it " I am expecting plenty of inconsistent speed guy from him, not anything to hang my fantasy hat on.

He has rare physical tools. That alone separates him from a lot of other sleeper candidates. A guy like Doss has absolutely zero distinguishing physical qualities. He's your typical college overachiever who slipped in the draft because he lacks ideal NFL tools.Gates has freakish athletic ability. He ran 4.31 at the combine, jumped 40" in the vertical leap, and 10'11" in the broad jump (insane for a 5'11" man). That puts him in rarefied athletic territory with the likes of Chris Johnson, Justin Fargas, Calvin Johnson, Reggie Bush, and Jerome Simpson. He was a lower draft pick than all of those guys, but he had some major factors working against him (small school, advanced age, character issues). It's easy to see why he might have slipped a round or two from where his talent warrants.I haven't seen anybody on here saying he's accomplished anything or that he's a lock to succeed, but when you look at Miami's bare WR cupboard, he's the only name that has any real exciting qualities. For me he's the easy pick of the litter for FF purposes and one of the best risk/reward gambles in last year's rookie class precisely because he's cheap. Contrary to your suggestion that people talk about him as if he has done something, most people probably don't even know who he is. A lot of folks favor guys like BJ Cunningham and Jeff Fuller in the Miami WR thread even though they're later draft picks with inferior tools. Gates is one of those guys you can snag late who could have an out-of-nowhere 1,100 yard season. If he busts, no biggie because he doesn't cost much at all.

Yes, as said, he's a little older at 26 but that's not saying he couldn't be a late bloomer. Maybe all his work & maturity will come together this year.I think he'll have opportunity to play and I still think he's worth a late round flier. Guys come outta nowhere each year to produce. Why not Gates. Just because he's not talked about or his production & work has been scrutinized and discounted doesn't mean he can't succeed this year.Aguy takenin the 7th round no one ever heard about. He started making some noise in camp and bam, you have Marques Colston. I don't think Gates will be a Colston because yes at 26 he should have some kind of resume to go by. Yet the WR's in Miami aren't going to be feared by anyone and teams will likely focus on the running game. Even if Tannehill starts I think Gates can get some production if he works hard, stays healthy & realize his NFL clock is ticking so it's time to step up and show us your best.Miami should be playing from behind frequently so they should be throwing more and if Gates developd any chemistry with Tannehill or whoeer the starter is I think he could put up 800 yds and 6 tds. Not bad for a late round cheap flier. There will certainly be a lot of other younger guys with potiential to break out and anyone of them could. So we should have several options to choose from. I like some of the names mentioned here and may go after them because I'm not tied completely to Gates but I would draft him late and take the high risk/reward scenario. If he shows some ability in TC his name will get mentioned more and his value could move up some so I'm interested in seeing howhe progresses once football action starts.

 

[squistion]

http://blogs.palmbeachpost.com/thedailydolphin/2012/05/19/catching-up-notes-and-quotes-from-fins-weekend-media-availability/

Ireland talking about his WRs

His comments on Gates who is being hyped in this thread, is interesting:

“We’ve got draft choices, we’ve got Marlon Moore and Roberto Wallace that have shown well on this football team. (Clyde) Gates still has to develop. We’ve got a lot of young guys that have a developmental ceiling, they haven’t developed yet, and we’re going to see that this year hopefully.”

 

[FavreCo]

I really like Denarious Moore. I think he'll be the best all-around receiver Oakland has. I expect 65-80 catches if he AND Palmer can stay healthy. Probably 8 scores.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Judging by this thread, Baldwin (both of em) and Brown should be nice values. Im not very high on either, but if this is any indication both look like theyll fall in drafts.

 

[Tau837]

I don't see why so many people are down on Vincent Brown. He could be the best WR in San Diego this year.

Could be, yes, but it's an extreme longshot. Meachem is the #1 and Floyd is the #2. He is the notional #3 WR on the Chargers, which means he is also behind Gates and Mathews in terms of targets. And there are those who expect Royal to get a good amount of time in the slot, although I don't personally expect that. I own Brown, but I have low expectations, and, in fact, I'm considering cutting him.

 

[Bob Magaw]

I thought I'd mention Salas who seemed to be doing ok until his injury. He's quite possibly a perpetual posession receiver but there appears to be logjam of mediocrity in STL st WR it seems, he'll be someone who is available late to take a flyer on.

problem with him is the current regime has no ties to him. And they just drafted 2 WRs fairly high, he will be lucky to be on the team

Maybe Quick is a lock but have a hard time seeing this argument being valid for the fourth rounder they spent on Chris Givens. Fisher has previously spent fourth rounders (or higher) on WRs who have virtually never seen the field (e.g. Courtney Roby, Roydell Williams, Paul Williams, Lavelle Hawkins).

the rams WR situation has been pretty dire in recent years, i would certainly rather have had guys like britt & washington past few seasons... i think givens may be faster than most, if not all (not sure how roby would have stacked up) the above cited WRs... at the least, he could have a specific role to threaten defenses from cheating up on jackson in run support with his deep speed... he has about as good a chance as anybody of emerging as a WR3 or even WR2 at some point, and that isn't a bad use of a 4th round pick... the rams have been so bad (something like 15 wins in the last five years), they don't just have player holes, they have entire position groups that are basically smoking holes in the ground... they attacked multiple positions by doubling up... CBs jenkins & johnson in 2nd & 3rd (early), WRs quick & givens in 2nd & 4th (also early) & RB pead in 2nd & a bigger back in 7th...* they also attacked these positions in free agency, adding finnegan at CB and steve smith at WR (if he has anything left), as well as doubling up at DT in free agency/draft with langford/brockers...

 

[msommer]

I thought I'd mention Salas who seemed to be doing ok until his injury. He's quite possibly a perpetual posession receiver but there appears to be logjam of mediocrity in STL st WR it seems, he'll be someone who is available late to take a flyer on.

problem with him is the current regime has no ties to him. And they just drafted 2 WRs fairly high, he will be lucky to be on the team

Maybe Quick is a lock but have a hard time seeing this argument being valid for the fourth rounder they spent on Chris Givens. Fisher has previously spent fourth rounders (or higher) on WRs who have virtually never seen the field (e.g. Courtney Roby, Roydell Williams, Paul Williams, Lavelle Hawkins).

the rams WR situation has been pretty dire in recent years, i would certainly rather have had guys like britt & washington past few seasons... i think givens may be faster than most, if not all (not sure how roby would have stacked up) the above cited WRs... at the least, he could have a specific role to threaten defenses from cheating up on jackson in run support with his deep speed... he has about as good a chance as anybody of emerging as a WR3 or even WR2 at some point, and that isn't a bad use of a 4th round pick... the rams have been so bad (something like 15 wins in the last five years), they don't just have player holes, they have entire position groups that are basically smoking holes in the ground... they attacked multiple positions by doubling up... CBs jenkins & johnson in 2nd & 3rd (early), WRs quick & givens in 2nd & 4th (also early) & RB pead in 2nd & a bigger back in 7th...* they also attacked these positions in free agency, adding finnegan at CB and steve smith at WR (if he has anything left), as well as doubling up at DT in free agency/draft with langford/brockers...

he has about as good a chance as anybody of emerging as a WR3 or even WR2 at some point

Yep, everybody has a shot. And odds on rookie WRs generating fantasy relevant numbers are improving. But I'd still lean with the guy who got some experience but is also entering his first OTAs and fully recovered from his leg injury as reported one of the previous days. That's just me

 

[Sabertooth]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

 

[Sabertooth]

I don't see why so many people are down on Vincent Brown. He could be the best WR in San Diego this year.

Could be, yes, but it's an extreme longshot. Meachem is the #1 and Floyd is the #2. He is the notional #3 WR on the Chargers, which means he is also behind Gates and Mathews in terms of targets. And there are those who expect Royal to get a good amount of time in the slot, although I don't personally expect that. I own Brown, but I have low expectations, and, in fact, I'm considering cutting him.

Extreme? I think not. Meachem has never been more than a WR2 (was he even really that), same with Floyd. Neither of these guys has shown much durability. We aren't exactly talking about Rice and Taylor here. Neither of these guys has ever had 50+ catches. Not exactly lighting the world on fire. And this is with Pro Bowl level quarterback play. Neither was able to ascend a depth chart. Both are default starters here. I can think of 5 teams right off the top of my head where neither would start in 2 WR sets. All that said, Vincent Brown has a very good opportunity to ascend. This situation is not in stone. If he's good, which I think he is, he will get his catches. He might anyway if Meachem and Floyd get dinged, as they've been prone to doing in the past. He had 3 total targets heading into week 9 last year. He finished with 40 targets. He didn't do much with them though. So he definitely needs to get better.

 

[Sabertooth]

Titus Young, if he can grow, could be a really nice option. But I don't see him having more value than Broyles after this season.

 

[todisco1]

I don't see why so many people are down on Vincent Brown. He could be the best WR in San Diego this year.

Could be, yes, but it's an extreme longshot. Meachem is the #1 and Floyd is the #2. He is the notional #3 WR on the Chargers, which means he is also behind Gates and Mathews in terms of targets. And there are those who expect Royal to get a good amount of time in the slot, although I don't personally expect that. I own Brown, but I have low expectations, and, in fact, I'm considering cutting him.

Extreme? I think not. Meachem has never been more than a WR2 (was he even really that), same with Floyd. Neither of these guys has shown much durability. We aren't exactly talking about Rice and Taylor here. Neither of these guys has ever had 50+ catches. Not exactly lighting the world on fire. And this is with Pro Bowl level quarterback play. Neither was able to ascend a depth chart. Both are default starters here. I can think of 5 teams right off the top of my head where neither would start in 2 WR sets. All that said, Vincent Brown has a very good opportunity to ascend. This situation is not in stone. If he's good, which I think he is, he will get his catches. He might anyway if Meachem and Floyd get dinged, as they've been prone to doing in the past. He had 3 total targets heading into week 9 last year. He finished with 40 targets. He didn't do much with them though. So he definitely needs to get better.

Meachem hasn't really gotten hurt much the last couple of years. Floyd has, alot, but when healthy he is productive. Last season he missed multiple games but still had over 850 yards (IIRC he missed 4 games, and he played well in '10 as well with VJax holding out. I think for this season Floyd is the WR to own in SD, as I don't think Meachem ascends to #1 status. But it's a fluid situation for sure, anything can happen. I like Vincent Brown but think he's a year away from being a fantasy starter. Floyd - 1100 yds, 6 TDsMeachem - 860 yds, 6 TDsVBrown - 540 yds, 5 TDs.

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

Free Agent after next year I believe

 

[Tau837]

I don't see why so many people are down on Vincent Brown. He could be the best WR in San Diego this year.

Could be, yes, but it's an extreme longshot. Meachem is the #1 and Floyd is the #2. He is the notional #3 WR on the Chargers, which means he is also behind Gates and Mathews in terms of targets. And there are those who expect Royal to get a good amount of time in the slot, although I don't personally expect that. I own Brown, but I have low expectations, and, in fact, I'm considering cutting him.

Extreme? I think not. Meachem has never been more than a WR2 (was he even really that), same with Floyd. Neither of these guys has shown much durability. We aren't exactly talking about Rice and Taylor here. Neither of these guys has ever had 50+ catches. Not exactly lighting the world on fire. And this is with Pro Bowl level quarterback play. Neither was able to ascend a depth chart. Both are default starters here. I can think of 5 teams right off the top of my head where neither would start in 2 WR sets. All that said, Vincent Brown has a very good opportunity to ascend. This situation is not in stone. If he's good, which I think he is, he will get his catches. He might anyway if Meachem and Floyd get dinged, as they've been prone to doing in the past. He had 3 total targets heading into week 9 last year. He finished with 40 targets. He didn't do much with them though. So he definitely needs to get better.

Meachem is not a "default" starter; the team just signed him to a starter level contract and expects him to be its #1 WR. From Rotoworld:

Chargers coach Norv Turner believes newly acquired Robert Meachem can be a true No. 1 wide receiver.At $6.5 million a year, the Chargers are paying him like one. "He’s a No. 1 receiver," Turner said. "He’s a guy that has big-play ability. He can be a complete receiver." Meachem essentially ran one route -- the "go" -- in New Orleans' offense, and only played about 60 percent of the snaps. He'll be a 100 percent player in San Diego. Particularly as Antonio Gates shows signs of decline, we like Meachem's chances of emerging as a fantasy WR2.Source: chargers.com Mar 18 - 10:36 PMThe National Football Post's Dan Pompei is issuing a 'fantasy alert' on Robert Meachem after a recent discussion with Chargers coach Norv Turner.Turner says he wouldn’t be surprised to see Meachem between 60 and 70 catches with 1,000 receiving yards. "Look at the history of the offense," Turner said. "Meachem is capable of giving us that stat production if he can play a complete season." As for why Meachem hasn’t put up big numbers in his career so far, Turner pointed out the depth of wide receiver in New Orleans. He went on to mention that Meachem "hasn’t been the focal point", which gives the impression that he’ll now have that opportunity in San Diego. A 65-catch, 1,000 yard season with a half dozen touchdowns would put Meachem in WR2 territory, making him a player to target.Source: National Football Post Apr 1 - 9:07 AMCoach Norv Turner expects Robert Meachem to add a "different dimension" to the Chargers' offense.Meachem is so dangerous because he's long, lean, runs sub-4.4, and has very good hands. "He adds a real speed dimension to our offense," Turner explained. "He’s got a different type of speed because there’s some quickness involved. Vincent Jackson, as much as I love him and had a great time with him, is a build-up speed guy. I think Robert gives us a bit of a different dimension." May 17 - 10:51 AMSource: Sports Radio Interviews

As for durability, Meachem has played in 56 straight games; the last time he missed a game was game 14 in 2008. Your 50 catch threshold is irrelevant given how he was used in New Orleans. Meachem has 141/2269/23 (16.1 ypr) receiving on 223 career targets; he has performed well on the targets he has received.Agree Floyd has not been durable, but when he has been on the field he has been surprisingly good: 125/2349/12 (18.8 ypr) on 225 targets over the past 3 seasons. That's very good considering he was the 4th option in the passing game for most of that span (behind Gates, Jackson, and the RBs). Again, your 50 catch threshold is irrelevant.Brown got 29 of his 40 targets last season during the 4 games Floyd missed (weeks 9-12). So in the 12 games Floyd played, Brown got 11 targets, less than one per game. The Chargers were so impressed with Brown's performance during that stretch, that when Floyd returned, they gave Floyd 34 targets and Brown 7 targets over the final 5 games of the season.Basically, your entire take is off base. Brown's value is not in this upcoming season, it is in 2013 and beyond, if Floyd is gone and Gates continues to decline due to age.

 

[Kenny Powers]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

Free Agent after next year I believe

Theyd be stupid to let him walk. He's 28 and arguably a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Titus Young, if he can grow, could be a really nice option. But I don't see him having more value than Broyles after this season.

This knucklehead just got sent home from OTAs for punching Louis Delmas

 

[cstu]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

Free Agent after next year I believe

Theyd be stupid to let him walk. He's 28 and arguably a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

He's very good, but he wasn't even the best WR on his team last year. He turns 29 in September and I don't think it's crazy that they'd let him walk considering the contract he'd want.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

He's very good, but he wasn't even the best WR on his team last year.

Sure he was. By a lot.

 

[MAC_32]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

Free Agent after next year I believe

Theyd be stupid to let him walk. He's 28 and arguably a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

He's very good, but he wasn't even the best WR on his team last year. He turns 29 in September and I don't think it's crazy that they'd let him walk considering the contract he'd want.

...and the internal options available to replace him. He'll get a good contract offer from Green Bay, but he'll get more elsewhere. Does he chase the $? Don't know, but Green Bay is covered in case he does. In the end I'd bet they just franchise him though. Do they have any other big contracts expiring this year too?

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

Free Agent after next year I believe

Theyd be stupid to let him walk. He's 28 and arguably a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

Greg Jennings has never been a top 5 WR.

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

I think Randall Cobb catches 40-50 balls this season. He's going to be a star in return yardage leagues. He's the eventual heir to Greg Jennings' spot in that offense.

Free Agent after next year I believe

Theyd be stupid to let him walk. He's 28 and arguably a Top 5 WR in the NFL.

He's very good, but he wasn't even the best WR on his team last year. He turns 29 in September and I don't think it's crazy that they'd let him walk considering the contract he'd want.

...and the internal options available to replace him. He'll get a good contract offer from Green Bay, but he'll get more elsewhere. Does he chase the $? Don't know, but Green Bay is covered in case he does. In the end I'd bet they just franchise him though. Do they have any other big contracts expiring this year too?

2013 UFA: WR Donald Driver, WR Greg Jennings, OLB Brad Jones, OG TJ Lang, S Charlie Peprah, CB Sam Shields, DL Jarius Wynn, OLB Frank ZomboAlso have to think locking up Mathews/Raji is next on the list as well.

 

[FavreCo]

Titus Young, if he can grow, could be a really nice option. But I don't see him having more value than Broyles after this season.

This knucklehead just got sent home from OTAs for punching Louis Delmas

He also had numerous bonehead incidents last year on the field. He's dumb.

 

[benson_will_lead_the_way]

Titus Young, if he can grow, could be a really nice option. But I don't see him having more value than Broyles after this season.

This knucklehead just got sent home from OTAs for punching Louis Delmas

He also had numerous bonehead incidents last year on the field. He's dumb.

He fits in well with Suh/Fairley/Stafford. At least they do something...their HC just "acts" tough.