Small Scale Farming - Anyone Into It? (2 Viewers)

[Joe Bryant]

In another thread, I asked this about small scale farming when our friend @Chaos34 mentioned he'd done this in the past.

It's something I'm interested in and I asked:

• Motivation for doing it?
• Economics of a small farm?
• What types of food are most. needed? Most profitable? Relatively easiest?
• What you would do differently if you were to do it again?
• Things to NOT do

@Chaos34 kindly replied:

In the 00s prior to selling I posted about my greenhouses quite a bit. It's a humble brag and back then I was accused of bs-ing, but I sort of kind of was one of the first to make aeroponics affordable for commercial applications. Nasa tech was deemed far too expensive, but I experimented with workarounds that surprisingly worked. Think epdm lined raceways like those used in fish farming but with aeroponic misting manifolds running through them.

• Motivation for doing it?

Lifelong dream. Rooted a Wandering Jew the first day of kindergarten and was hooked. College gf was a botany major and we made big plans. I had to do it without her 10 years later. My mom often said I don't play well with others. I play well with plants. I'm a personality that needed to be self-employed. Bosses are dumb.

• Economics of a small farm?

Obviously variable to the nth degree. Overall nothing spectacular and potentially horrible, but rewarding if you love it. I do love it, but another motivation was tax breaks investing in something I loved. I was making good money in the mortgage business. Buying in SoCal in 92 and selling in 06 is where I made my hay. RE equity. I'm the smallest of sample sizes and every piece of potentially productive land needs research. A big plus for you and Longtime is having both land and other income.

• What types of food are most. needed? Most profitable? Relatively easiest?

Greens are easy, always in demand, and fast growing. Microgreens were the ticket a decade ago, but big ag seems to have killed a cool little niche. I'm experimenting with indoor crocus sativus. No that isn't weed. It's where we get saffron - the most profitable crop. Speaking of weed, easy and profitable.

• What you would do differently if you were to do it again?

I bought 20 acres with a humble 2 bedroom home and 5 acres put to avocados. I planted another 11 acres to avos and built my dream greenhouses. Those young avos were expensive and slow to produce. There's 50 things I could have done that were smarter. I should have put in 11 acres of greenhouses and beat the crowd to microgreens. Maybe went with prickly pear or dragonfruit (drought tolerance in socal). I should have inoculated the first five acres of avos with high value mushroom spores (intercropping is smart)... and on and on.

• Things to NOT do

Start big. Overestimate your ag zone's climate. Underestimate pest loads, labor and equipment.

He also added:

I have a little quirk here. I've never started a thread. I like saying that. Sorry for continuing the hijack. It's been almost 20 years since I got out, and while I keep up with fancy new tech for indoor growing, I feel way out of the loop for commercial ideas. Things have changed a lot and AI is coming for this industry too.

I asked if he'd be ok with me copying his reply over to a new thread and he said this:

Sure, but just as I avoid RE questions here, I usually avoid this topic too. Won't even open the gardening thread. If I remember correctly, there's another grower or two here. I'm actively restraining myself from doing the tl/dr thing here, and I struggle with short replies too.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Thanks a ton @Chaos34. I didn't know you had this experience.

I see stalls at Farmers Markets and they always seem busy. They are able to charge significantly more for local produce than I see at even the more expensive places like Whole Foods.

And I know a ton would depend on what grows well in one's area.

I also look at things like selling eggs. Those seem super popular but I know there's a different element with animals.

It's all really interesting to me.

 

[Peggy]

6 acres. Not nearly that much planted though.
Tractor, barn, shop, and soil so rich things grow like they're on steroids.
I have more corn than I know what to do with right now. Giving bags away to neighbors, anyone and everyone.
Thought about the farmers market, maybe when we get caught up with all the other projects on the farm.
Currently canning beans and everything tomatoes - salsa, pizza sauce, spaghetti sauce, chopped tomatoes. Freezing bags of peppers. Roots in the root cellar.

 

[Peggy]

• Motivation for doing it?

Keeping busy in retirement, not for profit. And farm means more to me than just growing things. Beautiful country where things are cheap and people are friendly. Enough land to do whatever I want with. Swimming in the pool, sitting by the fire pit and watching fireflies. Building things. Wood working shop.

• Economics of a small farm?

Tractor is the biggest expense after the land. Fair amount of gas each week. Seed is dirt cheap and rain water is free.

• What types of food are most. needed? Most profitable? Relatively easiest?

Everything grows easy where I'm at. Corn is super easy, plant and pick, and has huge output. More than I bargained for.
Tomatoes are too fragile to multi-handle if you were going to sell, imo. We'd sell the salsa instead if we ever decided to.
Roots would be easy, but unlike corn you dig up and at least brush clean. We'll just plant enough to last us all year long.
You could do early crops like lettuce and kayle then switch to a second crop.
Peppers, cucumbers.
Honestly just let the prairie grass grow and harvest hay is the easiest if you invest in the equipment. Not sure how profitable it is.

• What you would do differently if you were to do it again?

Ask me again in a couple years.

• Things to NOT do

Start small and don't bite off more than you can chew.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

 

[QUEZILLA]

I recently prompted AI on ag/ small scale farming ideas for a small plat in my area, that could benefit in the future from a humanoid robot like Optimus. It gave a pretty cool response, precion farming, weeding, watering, can feed & clean livestock areas. I have no interest in farming now, but if I can get an Optimus for 30k that can do all the work, then it could be a possibility in 10yrs

 

[Joe Bryant]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

 

[Ron Swanson]

I've had a lot of fun with my mangos and Avocados but don't really have room for any more. I've toyed with the idea of buying a few acres nearby and planting it for retirement income but I haven't found property in the right microclimate at a price that makes sense and I fear by the time I get the trees big enough to really produce I'll be too old to maintain it.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

My grandparents always had a pretty big garden and i hated it. Tons of work i was always recruited for when I'd rather be playing baseball with my buddies. Fast forward 40 years and I started my first real garden this year and am loving it. I've done a few tomato and pepper plants in the backyard, but this is my first attempt at a real garden.

I have 250 acres of mostly timber, but 60 acres of that are currently being worked and leased to a local farmer that plants a rotation of corn and cover crops. There's another 30 acres that i currently have as food plots for deer hunting i plant myself. To maintain everything i have a 45 horsepower tractor and all the implements to go with it. A small farm has been on my radar for a very long time, but getting started was always the hangup as where to start seems overwhelming.

This property, the fact that I've already got close to 90 acres tilled, and most of the big equipment needed has me set up pretty well to make this a reality if i really want to do it. I also have over 60 apple trees and a very large raspberry patch I've been expanding (bear proofing has been a challenge). Last year i also started making small batches of maple syrup and have more trees than i can count so i see an opportunity there aswell. There's so many possibilities that I'm kind of suffering from paralysis by analysis. The farmer I'm currently leasing to is getting old and planning on hanging it up in the next year or two, so that will open those acres to whatever I'd like.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

I recently prompted AI on ag/ small scale farming ideas for a small plat in my area, that could benefit in the future from a humanoid robot like Optimus. It gave a pretty cool response, precion farming, weeding, watering, can feed & clean livestock areas. I have no interest in farming now, but if I can get an Optimus for 30k that can do all the work, then it could be a possibility in 10yrs

This is the kind of thing i need to look into also. If something like this is available and economical for a small scale farm it would sure make the workload seem a lot less daunting. I've seen there's a few different automated farm tools, how realistic that is i have no idea though.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

Are there any sources for old stock left? I was always under the impression heirloom was closer to the original stock and what I've looked for, but now I'm wondering if it matters. The ones I've been growing do seem pretty bland.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

This. And most commercially available tomatoes are grown in hot houses. You just can't make a blend of soil or nutrients that mimic the micronutrients in a good garden plot. I've been growing tomatoes in "the Southeast" for a good while now and they just taste better. I don't plant the quick growing, disease/pest resistant hybrids. My go-to varieties are Cherokee Purple, German Johnson, sungold, and striped German. I usually add a couple plants of a new variety every year, but mostly fall back to those 4. My kids eat the sungolds like candy and during the peak of the season, they make a wonderfully sweet sauce (even if it is yellow-ish). The rest make for exceptional 'mater sammiches that I will gorge myself on for the 3-4 weeks that they start producing. That leaves a bunch of tomatoes for the office staff and neighbors and you can't underestimate the goodwill generated by gifting someone a delicious tomato!

Around here, though, most small farmers <20acres tend to farm hay for the horse crowd. Usually 2 cuttings a year. It's definitely a lower effort crop that can yield some decent profits.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

Are there any sources for old stock left? I was always under the impression heirloom was closer to the original stock and what I've looked for, but now I'm wondering if it matters. The ones I've been growing do seem pretty bland.

Get your soil tested yearly by your local ag extension and amend as necessary. In our deep red clay, I amend every single year. Usually throw down quite a few bags of composted cow manure for nutrients and that's about it. Plant heirlooms that are outside the realm of the standard, baseball sized red tomatoes, preferably ones that aren't super fast to produce.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

Are there any sources for old stock left? I was always under the impression heirloom was closer to the original stock and what I've looked for, but now I'm wondering if it matters. The ones I've been growing do seem pretty bland.

I don't, sorry. I wonder if there are Reddits or FB groups or - gasp! - forums that may have some guidance. I've been out of that game for a good many years.

Heirloom is supposed to be closer to old-time tomatoes - they probably still are. But they became big business, too.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

Are there any sources for old stock left? I was always under the impression heirloom was closer to the original stock and what I've looked for, but now I'm wondering if it matters. The ones I've been growing do seem pretty bland.

Get your soil tested yearly by your local ag extension and amend as necessary. In our deep red clay, I amend every single year. Usually throw down quite a few bags of composted cow manure for nutrients and that's about it. Plant heirlooms that are outside the realm of the standard, baseball sized red tomatoes, preferably ones that aren't super fast to produce.

This is a really good suggestion. Soil + climate will help you understand how to maximize your crops. You won't get all of the acid back, but you'll have healthier, tastier tomatoes. It's a little more effort, but I've been a tomato fanboy since I came out of the womb.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

Are there any sources for old stock left? I was always under the impression heirloom was closer to the original stock and what I've looked for, but now I'm wondering if it matters. The ones I've been growing do seem pretty bland.

Get your soil tested yearly by your local ag extension and amend as necessary. In our deep red clay, I amend every single year. Usually throw down quite a few bags of composted cow manure for nutrients and that's about it. Plant heirlooms that are outside the realm of the standard, baseball sized red tomatoes, preferably ones that aren't super fast to produce.

I do test soil often, though not yearly and make the amendments. This is for my food plots, but should translate over. I'm lucky i live in a place with naturally good lime levels and i do "green manure" crop rotations with rye and clover. I've been at it long enough that i don't really need any fertilizers unless I'm doing brassicas.

Vegetables on a larger scale will need a little more amendment I'm sure. My grandparents used to get manure dropped off that we'd spread by hand , but i see they have liquefied manure trucks will spray for you and can be disc'd in after. The farms all around me seem to have these trucks running 24/7 in spring.

I'll keep an eye out for the varieties you mentioned. Something with some flavor would be appreciated.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

@Chaos34 (or anyone else with experience) i can Google this or ask around if this is a complicated question, but since you've done organic farming I'm curious what my steps would be following the farmer I'm currently leasing to.

The fact that he's got 60 acres tilled for years is a pretty big advantage with no need to break new ground, but he is not organic in the least. Herbicides, pesticides, fertilizers have all been used on these fields yearly so a transition from that to organic probably presents some challenges, or maybe transitioning is as simple as just reducing the use of industrial chemicals?

I guess my question is can i ever call anything produced from this field truly organic, or what would i need to do to make that happen? No worries if that doesn't have an easy answer.

 

[Joe Bryant]

and I fear by the time I get the trees big enough to really produce I'll be too old to maintain it.

Thanks GB. That’s a real challenge for sure. At my age I have the same concern.

But in a weird way, that forcing function of having to play the long game and deploy patience is oddly a big part of the draw for me in our Modern society where everything is instant gratification.

Seems odd I know, but I am drawn to what Stephen Covey would call the “laws of the farm“. Meaning some things you can’t rush. Preparation and consistent work are rewarded.

For me, there’s lots of spiritual ties as well as Jesus talked a ton about farming examples. Granted, that was what they did back then, but still I think there’s some draw to the principles.

That may be too woo woo. But it connects with me.

 

[Joe Bryant]

And of course, there’s also that future paying Forward thing.

I love that quote paraphrasing , “a healthy society is one where old men plant trees under which they know they’ll never get the benefit of sitting in the shade beneath them“.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

That may be too woo woo. But it connects with me.

Same for me. Nature is my church and putting my hands in the dirt and making or producing something is food for my soul. Turning this into "work" has felt unrealistic, but maybe that's not the case.

Playing the long game on this property has been one of the most rewarding things I've ever done. Habitat and wildlife management takes years and watching it develop and pay divideds is what it's all about. Quite a departure from the norm of instant gratification.

 

[Max Power]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Whoever figures out how to mass grow tomatoes like they used to grow them down in the southeast will make billions. My grandma grew them in small batches and they were soft and full of flavor. Mass produced tomatoes today are .

Agreed on the mass produced tomatoes today. It seems that it's just tough to scale the really great ones. Especially for more than a couple of months when they naturally are at the peak.

The problem with tomatoes over the last 50+ years is that the seed manufacturers cross-bred them so much to make them last longer that most of the acid in them disappeared. The acid is (was) what helps give them much of their taste. Their were still some farms who kept threading the old stock, but they got swallowed up by the "heirloom" movement 30 years ago (most of which is a ripoff).

Are there any sources for old stock left? I was always under the impression heirloom was closer to the original stock and what I've looked for, but now I'm wondering if it matters. The ones I've been growing do seem pretty bland.

The old and heirloom seed stuff is super fun. If you Google, Sean Brock and Southern foodways alliance and heirloom seeds you should be able to find a lot of info there. Brock is an amazing chef and restaurateur and dove in to the seed preservation thing a while back. One of my best friends works For him as a Line Cook and says he’s the real deal. There’s a ton of video for him online with his chef’s table thing also.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

Tax incentives are something I've never looked at outside grants for habit which requires locking up acreage for years and i was never comfortable with that because my goals are always evolving. I actually have a small Christmas tree farm I've been meaning to look at for tax breaks, but never get around to it. Probably pretty dumb i keep putting it all off.

Mushroom farming seems genius to get things started. I actually have a bunch of chicken of the woods spores i was going to do exactly as you're describing. Calling the county extension is now on the to do list.

 

[Max Power]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

Tax incentives are something I've never looked at outside grants for habit which requires locking up acreage for years and i was never comfortable with that because my goals are always evolving. I actually have a small Christmas tree farm I've been meaning to look at for tax breaks, but never get around to it. Probably pretty dumb i keep putting it all off.

Mushroom farming seems genius to get things started. I actually have a bunch of chicken of the woods spores i was going to do exactly as you're describing. Calling the county extension is now on the to do list.

I don't think they are game changing tax breaks, but I'm happy saving anything I can. I think I like it more from the equipment write-off standpoint. I have a bad tendency to buy cheaper stuff that doesn't last. I'd love to be able to buy once, cry once and know I can write that off at the end of the year.

For reference, I called the county and they sent a representative out to evaluate the property and offer some guidance. The rep didn't have to offer advice, but he was a good guy who had lived in the county all his life and wants to keep it rural. He was supportive of any plot purchased to remain undeveloped.

 

[Chaos34]

@Chaos34 (or anyone else with experience) i can Google this or ask around if this is a complicated question, but since you've done organic farming I'm curious what my steps would be following the farmer I'm currently leasing to.

The fact that he's got 60 acres tilled for years is a pretty big advantage with no need to break new ground, but he is not organic in the least. Herbicides, pesticides, fertilizers have all been used on these fields yearly so a transition from that to organic probably presents some challenges, or maybe transitioning is as simple as just reducing the use of industrial chemicals?

I guess my question is can i ever call anything produced from this field truly organic, or what would i need to do to make that happen? No worries if that doesn't have an easy answer.

Three years of jumping through hoops (transition period), doing everything right, testing the soil for residues, and passing random and scheduled inspections. There's a few fees involved. I never got certified. I had neighbors growing persimmons and pomegranates that got sprayed. I had to be a specific distance from them for certification and in my case it just didn't make sense. If profit is the motive there's a break even point somewhere along the timeline where organic pricing covers all the nonsense, but that three year transition for land like you describe pushed the break even way down the road. So doing what that farm you linked to does is just the right way to do it, imo. They don't have certification. They're growing organically anyway. They market themselves accordingly. /endb4rant

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

Tax incentives are something I've never looked at outside grants for habit which requires locking up acreage for years and i was never comfortable with that because my goals are always evolving. I actually have a small Christmas tree farm I've been meaning to look at for tax breaks, but never get around to it. Probably pretty dumb i keep putting it all off.

Mushroom farming seems genius to get things started. I actually have a bunch of chicken of the woods spores i was going to do exactly as you're describing. Calling the county extension is now on the to do list.

I don't think they are game changing tax breaks, but I'm happy saving anything I can. I think I like it more from the equipment write-off standpoint. I have a bad tendency to buy cheaper stuff that doesn't last. I'd love to be able to buy once, cry once and know I can write that off at the end of the year.

For reference, I called the county and they sent a representative out to evaluate the property and offer some guidance. The rep didn't have to offer advice, but he was a good guy who had lived in the county all his life and wants to keep it rural. He was supportive of any plot purchased to remain undeveloped.

Any savings as long as it isn't to intrusive works for me too.

I had conservation district guys come out and walk my property prior to a timber harvest and they had a lot of ideas too. I'm also big on keeping what i can undeveloped, but am constantly improving habit for every kind of plant and wildlife i can. This is probably a different topic, but there's so many options for improvements. Getting conservation district guys back out to discuss farm options sounds like the right move.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

@Chaos34 (or anyone else with experience) i can Google this or ask around if this is a complicated question, but since you've done organic farming I'm curious what my steps would be following the farmer I'm currently leasing to.

The fact that he's got 60 acres tilled for years is a pretty big advantage with no need to break new ground, but he is not organic in the least. Herbicides, pesticides, fertilizers have all been used on these fields yearly so a transition from that to organic probably presents some challenges, or maybe transitioning is as simple as just reducing the use of industrial chemicals?

I guess my question is can i ever call anything produced from this field truly organic, or what would i need to do to make that happen? No worries if that doesn't have an easy answer.

Three years of jumping through hoops (transition period), doing everything right, testing the soil for residues, and passing random and scheduled inspections. There's a few fees involved. I never got certified. I had neighbors growing persimmons and pomegranates that got sprayed. I had to be a specific distance from them for certification and in my case it just didn't make sense. If profit is the motive there's a break even point somewhere along the timeline where organic pricing covers all the nonsense, but that three year transition for land like you describe pushed the break even way down the road. So doing what that farm you linked to does is just the right way to do it, imo. They don't have certification. They're growing organically anyway. They market themselves accordingly. /endb4rant

Thanks, that's helpful starting info. If i get really serious about this maybe the farm i referenced before wouldn't mind mentoring the start-up process.

 

[InDitkaWeTrust]

@Chaos34 (or anyone else with experience) i can Google this or ask around if this is a complicated question, but since you've done organic farming I'm curious what my steps would be following the farmer I'm currently leasing to.

The fact that he's got 60 acres tilled for years is a pretty big advantage with no need to break new ground, but he is not organic in the least. Herbicides, pesticides, fertilizers have all been used on these fields yearly so a transition from that to organic probably presents some challenges, or maybe transitioning is as simple as just reducing the use of industrial chemicals?

I guess my question is can i ever call anything produced from this field truly organic, or what would i need to do to make that happen? No worries if that doesn't have an easy answer.

Here's the process from the USDA's perspective: https://www.ams.usda.gov/services/organic-certification/transitioning-to-organic

The little that I've heard from local farmers who've transitioned to 100% organic produce is that it's around a 3 year process.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

6 acres. Not nearly that much planted though.
Tractor, barn, shop, and soil so rich things grow like they're on steroids.
I have more corn than I know what to do with right now. Giving bags away to neighbors, anyone and everyone.
Thought about the farmers market, maybe when we get caught up with all the other projects on the farm.
Currently canning beans and everything tomatoes - salsa, pizza sauce, spaghetti sauce, chopped tomatoes. Freezing bags of peppers. Roots in the root cellar.

Do you do any kind of greenhouse or just open air?

 

[Peggy]

6 acres. Not nearly that much planted though.
Tractor, barn, shop, and soil so rich things grow like they're on steroids.
I have more corn than I know what to do with right now. Giving bags away to neighbors, anyone and everyone.
Thought about the farmers market, maybe when we get caught up with all the other projects on the farm.
Currently canning beans and everything tomatoes - salsa, pizza sauce, spaghetti sauce, chopped tomatoes. Freezing bags of peppers. Roots in the root cellar.

Do you do any kind of greenhouse or just open air?

Green house is under construction and on my to-do list. There is an old foundation footing I unearthed on one side and the length of the barn. Local told me it was an old cinderblock building they used to hang tobacco in. I'm using the foundation to put back a CMU stem wall and then solex it all in.

 

[Joe Bryant]

For just small scale selling at Farmers Markets and such, there's no need for any official certification is there?

At all the markets I see, it's super informal.

 

[The Longtime Lurker]

6 acres. Not nearly that much planted though.
Tractor, barn, shop, and soil so rich things grow like they're on steroids.
I have more corn than I know what to do with right now. Giving bags away to neighbors, anyone and everyone.
Thought about the farmers market, maybe when we get caught up with all the other projects on the farm.
Currently canning beans and everything tomatoes - salsa, pizza sauce, spaghetti sauce, chopped tomatoes. Freezing bags of peppers. Roots in the root cellar.

Do you do any kind of greenhouse or just open air?

Green house is under construction and on my to-do list. There is an old foundation footing I unearthed on one side and the length of the barn. Local told me it was an old cinderblock building they used to hang tobacco in. I'm using the foundation to put back a CMU stem wall and then solex it all in.

Nice when you can repurpose something like that and cut down on work and materials. Plus old stuff like that is pretty cool.

Been thinking about putting one up to extend the growing season and help with critter control. The DIY options look to be a lot cheaper and i can't imagine putting one together isn't overly complicated.

 

[Peggy]

6 acres. Not nearly that much planted though.
Tractor, barn, shop, and soil so rich things grow like they're on steroids.
I have more corn than I know what to do with right now. Giving bags away to neighbors, anyone and everyone.
Thought about the farmers market, maybe when we get caught up with all the other projects on the farm.
Currently canning beans and everything tomatoes - salsa, pizza sauce, spaghetti sauce, chopped tomatoes. Freezing bags of peppers. Roots in the root cellar.

Do you do any kind of greenhouse or just open air?

Green house is under construction and on my to-do list. There is an old foundation footing I unearthed on one side and the length of the barn. Local told me it was an old cinderblock building they used to hang tobacco in. I'm using the foundation to put back a CMU stem wall and then solex it all in.

Nice when you can repurpose something like that and cut down on work and materials. Plus old stuff like that is pretty cool.

Been thinking about putting one up to extend the growing season and help with critter control. The DIY options look to be a lot cheaper and i can't imagine putting one together isn't overly complicated.

At our old place we took a 12' x 4' dog kennel, raised the roof to 6' and ecompased it in solex. Piece of cake.

New one is pretty large so we'll likely use old windows and stuff. Wife does stained glass.

 

[Dezbelief]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

Tax incentives are something I've never looked at outside grants for habit which requires locking up acreage for years and i was never comfortable with that because my goals are always evolving. I actually have a small Christmas tree farm I've been meaning to look at for tax breaks, but never get around to it. Probably pretty dumb i keep putting it all off.

Mushroom farming seems genius to get things started. I actually have a bunch of chicken of the woods spores i was going to do exactly as you're describing. Calling the county extension is now on the to do list.

I don't think they are game changing tax breaks, but I'm happy saving anything I can. I think I like it more from the equipment write-off standpoint. I have a bad tendency to buy cheaper stuff that doesn't last. I'd love to be able to buy once, cry once and know I can write that off at the end of the year.

For reference, I called the county and they sent a representative out to evaluate the property and offer some guidance. The rep didn't have to offer advice, but he was a good guy who had lived in the county all his life and wants to keep it rural. He was supportive of any plot purchased to remain undeveloped.

Beekeeping is another way to get agriculture tax breaks.

 

[Max Power]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

Tax incentives are something I've never looked at outside grants for habit which requires locking up acreage for years and i was never comfortable with that because my goals are always evolving. I actually have a small Christmas tree farm I've been meaning to look at for tax breaks, but never get around to it. Probably pretty dumb i keep putting it all off.

Mushroom farming seems genius to get things started. I actually have a bunch of chicken of the woods spores i was going to do exactly as you're describing. Calling the county extension is now on the to do list.

I don't think they are game changing tax breaks, but I'm happy saving anything I can. I think I like it more from the equipment write-off standpoint. I have a bad tendency to buy cheaper stuff that doesn't last. I'd love to be able to buy once, cry once and know I can write that off at the end of the year.

For reference, I called the county and they sent a representative out to evaluate the property and offer some guidance. The rep didn't have to offer advice, but he was a good guy who had lived in the county all his life and wants to keep it rural. He was supportive of any plot purchased to remain undeveloped.

Beekeeping is another way to get agriculture tax breaks.

Good call. I have a coworker who does this and makes a couple bucks selling honey.

I'm not a big fan of bees, but it has to feel more legitimate to sell jars of honey than baggies of mushrooms.

 

[Dezbelief]

I own about 8.5 acres currently and have an offer in to acquire another 9 acres from an adjoining parcel. Most of the acreage is heavily wooded with a pond and a couple streams feeding it. We plan to get chickens shortly and I contacted my county about tax incentives to own and operate a farm. My best course of action is to start mushroom farming in the wooded area. Its as simple as finding fallen trees (There are plenty), drilling holes in the trees and placing mushroom spores in there. Because of the conditions required to grow mushrooms, I can write off a decent amount of square footage per planting area. I'd need to get up to 5 acres of farming area to qualify for some reduced property tax on that acreage. I can also write off equipment required to maintain the property.

Tax incentives are something I've never looked at outside grants for habit which requires locking up acreage for years and i was never comfortable with that because my goals are always evolving. I actually have a small Christmas tree farm I've been meaning to look at for tax breaks, but never get around to it. Probably pretty dumb i keep putting it all off.

Mushroom farming seems genius to get things started. I actually have a bunch of chicken of the woods spores i was going to do exactly as you're describing. Calling the county extension is now on the to do list.

I don't think they are game changing tax breaks, but I'm happy saving anything I can. I think I like it more from the equipment write-off standpoint. I have a bad tendency to buy cheaper stuff that doesn't last. I'd love to be able to buy once, cry once and know I can write that off at the end of the year.

For reference, I called the county and they sent a representative out to evaluate the property and offer some guidance. The rep didn't have to offer advice, but he was a good guy who had lived in the county all his life and wants to keep it rural. He was supportive of any plot purchased to remain undeveloped.

Beekeeping is another way to get agriculture tax breaks.

Good call. I have a coworker who does this and makes a couple bucks selling honey.

I'm not a big fan of bees, but it has to feel more legitimate to sell jars of honey than baggies of mushrooms.

Some mushrooms are crazy valuable.

 

[Peggy]

I guess it 's Solexx with two x's if anyone is googling to see what it is. Lol.

 

[the moops]

Wife's uncle retired and lives on Lake Tahoe. Bought up some land near Carson City and has a small'ish lavender farm. Sells most of it extracted into essential oils. He seems to love it. I am jealous

 

[Peggy]

Two bakers at our farmers market, I know I can make a better sourdough loaf than either one. But mine takes 24 hours and couldn't scale it more than 8 loafs at a time because of oven space. $5 a loaf for $40 for 24 hours work doesn't seem worth it. Lol

I'd put my wife's salsa against anyone's. She said the 12 plants would get 48 pints. That's about $400 for a day or two's work. Plus a couple days at the market. We could scale that and get a few grand over a few weeks I suppose. Two or three harvests per year. Still seems like a lot of work for little payoff.

I figure we got about 25 dozen corn cobs this year. That's only $75 at 25 cents each. Not woth scaling. Lol. We're taking a lot of it down to the food bank.

I don't see how anyone makes much cash at the farmers market. Especially on cheap vegetables.

The grass fed meat lady does I bet tho. She sells a lot and it's expensive. I don't get it, grass fed tastes horrible.

 

[Cowboysfan8]

I'd put my wife's salsa against anyone's

If you’re not going to sell it would you share the recipe here?

 

[Peggy]

I'd put my wife's salsa against anyone's

If you’re not going to sell it would you share the recipe here?

Maybe. She does have a secret ingredient that would raise eyebrows tho.

 

[odin33]

I'd put my wife's salsa against anyone's

If you’re not going to sell it would you share the recipe here?

Maybe. She does have a secret ingredient that would raise eyebrows tho.

Go on...

 

[SWC]

if by small scale you mean two awesome pepper pots that we have on our front patio then hells to the yeahs i take them dehyradate them then grind them up in a coffee grinder and then mix them with salt and it is the best thing ever to put on anything take that to the bank pepmigos

 

[Chaos34]

I don't see how anyone makes much cash at the farmers market. Especially on cheap vegetables.

Few do. Well, from what I saw anyway. My wife loved setting up at farmers markets, socializing all day, and being part of that community. As bookkeeper I just shook my head once a month. She was making minimum wage if you count "all" the hours, "tax free" cash in pocket if you know what I mean. She was a nurse who worked nights and did two or three markets a week for about three years. Eventually she burned out. I had a day job but spent many nights loading her up for the next day's market. The books suggest I did this for free.

This is a good read if you're wondering about what's involved in selling a variety of crops on a small scale.

We participated in a CSA with three other farms, but it was fraught with issues between us and satisfying subscribers. A single grower has a better shot at making a CSA work, in my experience. Selling direct to restaurants was the most fun, the most satisfying and the most profitable, but it takes legwork, time, and you need access to a lot of restaurants. My niche was Asian greens. Free meals were a nice bonus.

Wife's uncle retired and lives on Lake Tahoe. Bought up some land near Carson City and has a small'ish lavender farm. Sells most of it extracted into essential oils. He seems to love it. I am jealous

I'll be in Tahoe for most of August. I know the Carson Valley like the back of my hand. I've posted before about it being a great retirement area, and I will again be looking at land. The ag land west of Gardnerville is dreamy. But the more important reason for quoting moops here is the single crop growing idea. That makes the life easy and wholesaling was the best option for me. By 2001 16 acres of Avos were in full production, trouble free, easy peezy and netting 6 figures. I'd call the packing company anytime between late August and early October. They show up with trucks, bins, a team of pickers, strip the grove, weigh and grade the crop - cut me a check a month later. I'm sure lavender farming works the same way. I used Henry Avocado. You may have seen their sticker on your avos.

After my divorce in 02, I did what had obviously been making the most sense for years. Converted the greenhouses to a single crop - tomatoes. Two varieties for awhile because I had a huge crush on one. I used the massive wholesale produce market in downtown LA at first. Fun scene. Opens at 2am closes at 8am. Eventually just one beefsteak contracted to one buyer who came and got them. Perfect. For three years they netted more monthly (7 months a year) than the avos did annually and I sold. Had I done that from the start I would have retired early on the beach not here in this god forsaken desert.

 

[Joe Bryant]

I don't see how anyone makes much cash at the farmers market. Especially on cheap vegetables.

Few do. Well, from what I saw anyway. My wife loved setting up at farmers markets, socializing all day, and being part of that community. As bookkeeper I just shook my head once a month. She was making minimum wage if you count "all" the hours, "tax free" cash in pocket if you know what I mean. She was a nurse who worked nights and did two or three markets a week for about three years. Eventually she burned out. I had a day job but spent many nights loading her up for the next day's market. The books suggest I did this for free.

This is a good read if you're wondering about what's involved in selling a variety of crops on a small scale.

We participated in a CSA with three other farms, but it was fraught with issues between us and satisfying subscribers. A single grower has a better shot at making a CSA work, in my experience. Selling direct to restaurants was the most fun, the most satisfying and the most profitable, but it takes legwork, time, and you need access to a lot of restaurants. My niche was Asian greens. Free meals were a nice bonus.

Wife's uncle retired and lives on Lake Tahoe. Bought up some land near Carson City and has a small'ish lavender farm. Sells most of it extracted into essential oils. He seems to love it. I am jealous

I'll be in Tahoe for most of August. I know the Carson Valley like the back of my hand. I've posted before about it being a great retirement area, and I will again be looking at land. The ag land west of Gardnerville is dreamy. But the more important reason for quoting moops here is the single crop growing idea. That makes the life easy and wholesaling was the best option for me. By 2001 16 acres of Avos were in full production, trouble free, easy peezy and netting 6 figures. I'd call the packing company anytime between late August and early October. They show up with trucks, bins, a team of pickers, strip the grove, weigh and grade the crop - cut me a check a month later. I'm sure lavender farming works the same way. I used Henry Avocado. You may have seen their sticker on your avos.

After my divorce in 02, I did what had obviously been making the most sense for years. Converted the greenhouses to a single crop - tomatoes. Two varieties for awhile because I had a huge crush on one. I used the massive wholesale produce market in downtown LA at first. Fun scene. Opens at 2am closes at 8am. Eventually just one beefsteak contracted to one buyer who came and got them. Perfect. For three years they netted more monthly (7 months a year) than the avos did annually and I sold. Had I done that from the start I would have retired early on the beach not here in this god forsaken desert.

Thanks for this.

I need to do better at comparing prices. It seems to me the vegetables are expensive. Last week, the big Beefsteak tomatoes were selling for $5 each and there was a line. That seems not cheap but maybe it is.

 

[Cowboysfan8]

I don't see how anyone makes much cash at the farmers market. Especially on cheap vegetables.

Few do. Well, from what I saw anyway. My wife loved setting up at farmers markets, socializing all day, and being part of that community. As bookkeeper I just shook my head once a month. She was making minimum wage if you count "all" the hours, "tax free" cash in pocket if you know what I mean. She was a nurse who worked nights and did two or three markets a week for about three years. Eventually she burned out. I had a day job but spent many nights loading her up for the next day's market. The books suggest I did this for free.

This is a good read if you're wondering about what's involved in selling a variety of crops on a small scale.

We participated in a CSA with three other farms, but it was fraught with issues between us and satisfying subscribers. A single grower has a better shot at making a CSA work, in my experience. Selling direct to restaurants was the most fun, the most satisfying and the most profitable, but it takes legwork, time, and you need access to a lot of restaurants. My niche was Asian greens. Free meals were a nice bonus.

Wife's uncle retired and lives on Lake Tahoe. Bought up some land near Carson City and has a small'ish lavender farm. Sells most of it extracted into essential oils. He seems to love it. I am jealous

I'll be in Tahoe for most of August. I know the Carson Valley like the back of my hand. I've posted before about it being a great retirement area, and I will again be looking at land. The ag land west of Gardnerville is dreamy. But the more important reason for quoting moops here is the single crop growing idea. That makes the life easy and wholesaling was the best option for me. By 2001 16 acres of Avos were in full production, trouble free, easy peezy and netting 6 figures. I'd call the packing company anytime between late August and early October. They show up with trucks, bins, a team of pickers, strip the grove, weigh and grade the crop - cut me a check a month later. I'm sure lavender farming works the same way. I used Henry Avocado. You may have seen their sticker on your avos.

After my divorce in 02, I did what had obviously been making the most sense for years. Converted the greenhouses to a single crop - tomatoes. Two varieties for awhile because I had a huge crush on one. I used the massive wholesale produce market in downtown LA at first. Fun scene. Opens at 2am closes at 8am. Eventually just one beefsteak contracted to one buyer who came and got them. Perfect. For three years they netted more monthly (7 months a year) than the avos did annually and I sold. Had I done that from the start I would have retired early on the beach not here in this god forsaken desert.

Thanks for this.

I need to do better at comparing prices. It seems to me the vegetables are expensive. Last week, the big Beefsteak tomatoes were selling for $5 each and there was a line. That seems not cheap but maybe it's not.

Yeah. The sellers at the one near me are definitely making money. Prices have gone way up

 

[the moops]

I don't see how anyone makes much cash at the farmers market. Especially on cheap vegetables.

Few do. Well, from what I saw anyway. My wife loved setting up at farmers markets, socializing all day, and being part of that community. As bookkeeper I just shook my head once a month. She was making minimum wage if you count "all" the hours, "tax free" cash in pocket if you know what I mean. She was a nurse who worked nights and did two or three markets a week for about three years. Eventually she burned out. I had a day job but spent many nights loading her up for the next day's market. The books suggest I did this for free.

This is a good read if you're wondering about what's involved in selling a variety of crops on a small scale.

We participated in a CSA with three other farms, but it was fraught with issues between us and satisfying subscribers. A single grower has a better shot at making a CSA work, in my experience. Selling direct to restaurants was the most fun, the most satisfying and the most profitable, but it takes legwork, time, and you need access to a lot of restaurants. My niche was Asian greens. Free meals were a nice bonus.

Wife's uncle retired and lives on Lake Tahoe. Bought up some land near Carson City and has a small'ish lavender farm. Sells most of it extracted into essential oils. He seems to love it. I am jealous

I'll be in Tahoe for most of August. I know the Carson Valley like the back of my hand. I've posted before about it being a great retirement area, and I will again be looking at land. The ag land west of Gardnerville is dreamy. But the more important reason for quoting moops here is the single crop growing idea. That makes the life easy and wholesaling was the best option for me. By 2001 16 acres of Avos were in full production, trouble free, easy peezy and netting 6 figures. I'd call the packing company anytime between late August and early October. They show up with trucks, bins, a team of pickers, strip the grove, weigh and grade the crop - cut me a check a month later. I'm sure lavender farming works the same way. I used Henry Avocado. You may have seen their sticker on your avos.

After my divorce in 02, I did what had obviously been making the most sense for years. Converted the greenhouses to a single crop - tomatoes. Two varieties for awhile because I had a huge crush on one. I used the massive wholesale produce market in downtown LA at first. Fun scene. Opens at 2am closes at 8am. Eventually just one beefsteak contracted to one buyer who came and got them. Perfect. For three years they netted more monthly (7 months a year) than the avos did annually and I sold. Had I done that from the start I would have retired early on the beach not here in this god forsaken desert.

Thanks for this.

I need to do better at comparing prices. It seems to me the vegetables are expensive. Last week, the big Beefsteak tomatoes were selling for $5 each and there was a line. That seems not cheap but maybe it's not.

Yeah. The sellers at the one near me are definitely making money. Prices have gone way up

I mean I hope they are making money, it's not a charity after all

 

[Joe Bryant]

I don't see how anyone makes much cash at the farmers market. Especially on cheap vegetables.

Few do. Well, from what I saw anyway. My wife loved setting up at farmers markets, socializing all day, and being part of that community. As bookkeeper I just shook my head once a month. She was making minimum wage if you count "all" the hours, "tax free" cash in pocket if you know what I mean. She was a nurse who worked nights and did two or three markets a week for about three years. Eventually she burned out. I had a day job but spent many nights loading her up for the next day's market. The books suggest I did this for free.

This is a good read if you're wondering about what's involved in selling a variety of crops on a small scale.

We participated in a CSA with three other farms, but it was fraught with issues between us and satisfying subscribers. A single grower has a better shot at making a CSA work, in my experience. Selling direct to restaurants was the most fun, the most satisfying and the most profitable, but it takes legwork, time, and you need access to a lot of restaurants. My niche was Asian greens. Free meals were a nice bonus.

Wife's uncle retired and lives on Lake Tahoe. Bought up some land near Carson City and has a small'ish lavender farm. Sells most of it extracted into essential oils. He seems to love it. I am jealous

I'll be in Tahoe for most of August. I know the Carson Valley like the back of my hand. I've posted before about it being a great retirement area, and I will again be looking at land. The ag land west of Gardnerville is dreamy. But the more important reason for quoting moops here is the single crop growing idea. That makes the life easy and wholesaling was the best option for me. By 2001 16 acres of Avos were in full production, trouble free, easy peezy and netting 6 figures. I'd call the packing company anytime between late August and early October. They show up with trucks, bins, a team of pickers, strip the grove, weigh and grade the crop - cut me a check a month later. I'm sure lavender farming works the same way. I used Henry Avocado. You may have seen their sticker on your avos.

After my divorce in 02, I did what had obviously been making the most sense for years. Converted the greenhouses to a single crop - tomatoes. Two varieties for awhile because I had a huge crush on one. I used the massive wholesale produce market in downtown LA at first. Fun scene. Opens at 2am closes at 8am. Eventually just one beefsteak contracted to one buyer who came and got them. Perfect. For three years they netted more monthly (7 months a year) than the avos did annually and I sold. Had I done that from the start I would have retired early on the beach not here in this god forsaken desert.

Thanks for this.

I need to do better at comparing prices. It seems to me the vegetables are expensive. Last week, the big Beefsteak tomatoes were selling for $5 each and there was a line. That seems not cheap but maybe it's not.

Yeah. The sellers at the one near me are definitely making money. Prices have gone way up

I mean I hope they are making money, it's not a charity after all

For sure. I think the question is how much money. Or more to the point, if it's a profitable enough business to be attractive to get into.

 

[Chaos34]

I don't plant the quick growing, disease/pest resistant hybrids. My go-to varieties are Cherokee Purple, German Johnson, sungold, and striped German. I usually add a couple plants of a new variety every year, but mostly fall back to those 4. My kids eat the sungolds like candy and during the peak of the season, they make a wonderfully sweet sauce (even if it is yellow-ish).

Three of those are heirlooms but the Sungolds are disease/pest resistant hybrids. My favorite tomato. I eat them like your kids do, like candy. They taste tropical, very different and super sweet. They're prone to cracking which made them hard to market. I grew 100 plants outdoors in brutal desert conditions and won a taste test competition at the Santa Monica farmers market. They torture wine grapes for high brix so I tortured grape tomatoes. It worked but the yield was tiny, like high end wine grapes. The tomato I had a huge crush on was Sunsugar, a hybrid of the the hybrid Sungold. No cracking, a little bigger, massive trusses, just as sweet, but lose the tropical thing. More tomato-y isn't a bad thing, but Sungolds are just awesome vine ripened at home. Sunsugars are my 2nd recommendation. Cherokee Purples are on a long list of best beefsteaks but difficult to grow for market and I think the ones I see in the grocery store (in the little high priced heirloom section) are not true Cherokee Purples. I can tell by the stems. They should be thick, but they're so thin I think they're hybrids and won't buy them.