Soon to be Ex-Wife...UPDATE 06/16 (1 Viewer)

[Henry Ford]

Haven't read the thread and don't plan to. If you have a lawyer, talk to him/her. Don't talk about an existing case you have that's currently in litigation on the internet.

 

[PatsWillWin]

This is the exact situation we'd all be complaining/#####ing about if it were a wife asking for 1/2 of everything her husband made. If she's offering to split "everything" 50/50, and she contributed the vast majority of the assets, you should be happy to get that.

You got to basically not work for who knows how many years. That's payment enough right there. No deadlines, stress, commute, ####### co-workers. Sheesh.

I don't get this line of thinking (even if it's commonly held). He likely sacrificed his career to take care of the kids.

All I'm pointing out is that we ##### and moan when women do this to us. Hence the popularity of "start hiding money." And I'll bet that he gladly agreed to stay home with the kids (just like the wives normally do). I doubt she had to coerce him. When you rely on someone else for almost all of your income/resources, there's inherent risk.

I don't think anyone #####es and moans about women who want a fair 50/50 split of assets.

 

[Henry Ford]

This is the exact situation we'd all be complaining/#####ing about if it were a wife asking for 1/2 of everything her husband made. If she's offering to split "everything" 50/50, and she contributed the vast majority of the assets, you should be happy to get that.

You got to basically not work for who knows how many years. That's payment enough right there. No deadlines, stress, commute, ####### co-workers. Sheesh.

I don't get this line of thinking (even if it's commonly held). He likely sacrificed his career to take care of the kids.

All I'm pointing out is that we ##### and moan when women do this to us. Hence the popularity of "start hiding money." And I'll bet that he gladly agreed to stay home with the kids (just like the wives normally do). I doubt she had to coerce him. When you rely on someone else for almost all of your income/resources, there's inherent risk.

I don't think anyone #####es and moans about women who want a fair 50/50 split of assets.

Many people do.

 

[Fennis]

Haven't read the thread and don't plan to. If you have a lawyer, talk to him/her. Don't talk about an existing case you have that's currently in litigation on the internet.

Sorry Henry that is the worst piece of advice I have ever in the history of these forums.

 

[James Daulton]

Haven't read the thread and don't plan to. If you have a lawyer, talk to him/her. Don't talk about an existing case you have that's currently in litigation on the internet.

Sorry Henry that is the worst piece of advice I have ever in the history of these forums.

Seriously, stop jacking up the fun.

 

[The Ref]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

 

[CletiusMaximus]

So you're basically trying to do what we all get pissed at women for doing during divorce?

Unless she's asking for alimony, let her keep her money.

She wants to settle now. She wants to line up all assets and all liabilities and go with a 50/50 split, no alimony, no child support. I am fine with that.

She is not reporting all of the assets, so a true 50/50 split is not happening.

ETA: she has tried hiding assets before. About one and a half years ago she secured a PO Box and opened a checking account, savings account, and bank credit card without my knowledge. I learned of these accounts by accident. When I told her I knew, she promised to close the accounts...even made the promise again in a session with our marriage counselor. All three accounts are reported in the Financial Report for the court so she never closed them as per her "promise".

Of course she wants to settle and pretend its all very amicable. That's always the opening position of the person in control of the information. She may be willing to perjure herself, but its unlikely her employer and banks will do the same. Its "no more Mr. Nice Guy" time for you, unfortunately. She's got a history of financial dishonesty, so really there can't be any settlement based on trust. Divorce lawyers very commonly use valuation experts, and the value of stock options/grants in a private company are very commonly disputed. There are several fundamental valuation assumptions that can dramatically affect the value of these interests. Good luck, potential ####storm on the horizon.

 

[Henry Ford]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

 

[Drifter]

Seems like you need to go a little hardball and demand copies of the tax returns from the past few years at the very least. The grants will be reflected there and then she'll have to explain where the money went.

 

[Quez]

Man if she is this sneaky about hiding money I can only imagine the good stories.

 

[Gianni Verscotchie]

Haven't read the thread and don't plan to. If you have a lawyer, talk to him/her. Don't talk about an existing case you have that's currently in litigation on the internet.

Sorry Henry that is the worst piece of advice I have ever in the history of these forums.

Seriously, stop jacking up the fun.

No kidding man! These forums were founded on the misery of others

Where is the dislike button??

 

[Meatwad Reloaded]

So you're basically trying to do what we all get pissed at women for doing during divorce?

Unless she's asking for alimony, let her keep her money.

She wants to settle now. She wants to line up all assets and all liabilities and go with a 50/50 split, no alimony, no child support. I am fine with that.

She is not reporting all of the assets, so a true 50/50 split is not happening.

ETA: she has tried hiding assets before. About one and a half years ago she secured a PO Box and opened a checking account, savings account, and bank credit card without my knowledge. I learned of these accounts by accident. When I told her I knew, she promised to close the accounts...even made the promise again in a session with our marriage counselor. All three accounts are reported in the Financial Report for the court so she never closed them as per her "promise".

Who makes more money, you or her?

She does, by a long shot. I was stay at home parent with 2 kids. Currently working part time as a substitute teacher.

She makes 150K, I'm just under 20K.

dude....you have to get alimony and child support. You stayed at home and raised the kids! That is worth at least 20k a year for a few years until you get settled.

Trust me on this, I am at least 75% sure the reason she wants this done so quickly is because she has a master plan already lined up. This plan probably includes marrying another dude she is banging who makes $150K or more so she can really live the lifestyle she thinks she deserves. You need to bleed her ### dry and I am pretty sure she will agree to any of your demands because she will want to be with the new guy asap.

 

[SoBeDad]

Think about your situation after the divorce. You want your kids to be talking to you after a potentially contentious divorce - I guess that isn't a problem since you've played the role of Mr. Dad for the past 20 years. You need a place to live, perhaps close to your old house, so your daughter and son can easily visit both mom and dad during Thanskgiving, etc. Is it feasible to buy something nearby using the marital assets? Or perhaps buy a small condo near the beach in Florida, so your kids will be excited to visit you during the harsh winters up north. Maybe a fresh start.

 

[Meatwad Reloaded]

This is the exact situation we'd all be complaining/#####ing about if it were a wife asking for 1/2 of everything her husband made. If she's offering to split "everything" 50/50, and she contributed the vast majority of the assets, you should be happy to get that.

You got to basically not work for who knows how many years. That's payment enough right there. No deadlines, stress, commute, ####### co-workers. Sheesh.

Yeah....sorry to burst your bubble, but staying home to raise the kids is a sacrifice. There is a reason why they call marriage a partnership; if you are too dumb to understand that, you should never marry anyone because once you are about 5 years in you are giving up half your sh%t. If there are kids involved and you advanced your career because your better half was playing house, you are giving up way more than half.

Step into a time machine and try advancing your career, meeting all of those 'stressful deadlines', enduring all of those terrible commutes in your luxury vehicle, and putting up with dooshy co-workers, when you also have to take care of a kid or two or three.

 

[Zow]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

 

[Meatwad Reloaded]

Think about your situation after the divorce. You want your kids to be talking to you after a potentially contentious divorce - I guess that isn't a problem since you've played the role of Mr. Dad for the past 20 years. You need a place to live, perhaps close to your old house, so your daughter and son can easily visit both mom and dad during Thanskgiving, etc. Is it feasible to buy something nearby using the marital assets? Or perhaps buy a small condo near the beach in Florida, so your kids will be excited to visit you during the harsh winters up north. Maybe a fresh start.

Exactly....he should think about it, because he is most likely holding ALL THE #######G CARDS!!!!! She is going to throw this dude from an upper middle class lifestyle into the poorhouse. If he hasn't been able to get a teaching job in the last few years he certainly will have a tough time getting one now. I guess if he wants to start sniffing 40K or so he could try to get a retail management job, but those are punishing, especially for the over 40 set.

At minimum, he should be keeping the house. The wife should be getting an apartment and paying him 25 - 30K alimony until the 16 year old moves out when they can then sell it and get a 50 / 50 split.

 

[tommyboy]

Id go after it (money). But at the end if the day, id move on wit your life

 

[Meatwad Reloaded]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

The problem though is that it sounds like the lawyer might suck. Being a lawyer yourself you probably realize that family law practitioners generally do not hail from the top half of the class, or sometimes even the top 80% of the class, right? He certainly might be smart to ask this lawyer a few more questions about how screwed he is going to be once this goes through.

I had an amicable divorce. And I also had a great lawyer. You know why she was great? Because I was the person who came up with the split and helped to draw up the agreement. I paid her $500 to look it over and that was that.

If the dude is dealing with a snake; and we should all agree that a person who opens unknown accounts and what not during a marriage is most certainly a reptile of the snaketonian variety, he should be looking at this venture as if it is not amicable at all. If the snake wants to escape quickly, he should let her go if she agrees to provide more than half of the assets and a cash flow guarantee for maybe five years or so.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that this guy probably does not have the resources to pay a lawyer much money anyways if he is sitting at 20 K a year with no benefits. The snake knows this. Many years of living under the roof has made the man quite Charmin-esque and ready to agree to whatever the snake suggests 'for the kids'. That is probably why the snake has worked so diligently to not only hide assets but create a facade of cooperation.

The lawyers, while probably not being directly in cahoots with the snake, understand that a short 'amicable' process is their best chance at getting paid their full fee and want to steer the stay at home dad to concede. This is because aside from the fact that family law practitioners do not hail from the upper or even middle reaches of their third or fourth tier law schools, they still had to pay the full freight on tuition (150K or more) and rely on suckers like this to agree quickly on rotten deals. The reason these two lawyers probably 'work so well' together is simply because they are cut from the same cloth. They fully understand that the longer they work on this, the greater chance there is that neither of them will get paid for the amount of hours they had to bill, because in the grand scheme of things it does not seem like we are dealing with rich people here.

Yeah...there sure is lots to think about for our friend.

 

[mr fancypants]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

The problem though is that it sounds like the lawyer might suck. Being a lawyer yourself you probably realize that family law practitioners generally do not hail from the top half of the class, or sometimes even the top 80% of the class, right? He certainly might be smart to ask this lawyer a few more questions about how screwed he is going to be once this goes through.

I had an amicable divorce. And I also had a great lawyer. You know why she was great? Because I was the person who came up with the split and helped to draw up the agreement. I paid her $500 to look it over and that was that.

If the dude is dealing with a snake; and we should all agree that a person who opens unknown accounts and what not during a marriage is most certainly a reptile of the snaketonian variety, he should be looking at this venture as if it is not amicable at all. If the snake wants to escape quickly, he should let her go if she agrees to provide more than half of the assets and a cash flow guarantee for maybe five years or so.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that this guy probably does not have the resources to pay a lawyer much money anyways if he is sitting at 20 K a year with no benefits. The snake knows this. Many years of living under the roof has made the man quite Charmin-esque and ready to agree to whatever the snake suggests 'for the kids'. That is probably why the snake has worked so diligently to not only hide assets but create a facade of cooperation.

The lawyers, while probably not being directly in cahoots with the snake, understand that a short 'amicable' process is their best chance at getting paid their full fee and want to steer the stay at home dad to concede. This is because aside from the fact that family law practitioners do not hail from the upper or even middle reaches of their third or fourth tier law schools, they still had to pay the full freight on tuition (150K or more) and rely on suckers like this to agree quickly on rotten deals. The reason these two lawyers probably 'work so well' together is simply because they are cut from the same cloth. They fully understand that the longer they work on this, the greater chance there is that neither of them will get paid for the amount of hours they had to bill, because in the grand scheme of things it does not seem like we are dealing with rich people here.

Yeah...there sure is lots to think about for our friend.

Impressive analogy Meat. To many of the posters are to caught up in their image of masculinity and the time honored role of the male. But if the OP is assuming the child rearing and domestic duties, he surely is entitled to a true split along with child support. Remember marriage is a 50/50 partnership.

As for your scenario about what actually maybe going on. Many years ago I had a friend of mine who married up so to speak. Both were in their mid 20's. He was an blue collar appliance repair guy and she was finishing her undergrad work as an accountant and working towards her CPA. She soon got into a firm after graduation and within 2 years was having an affair with one of her senior level constituents. Needless to say they were soon divorced upon his discovery.

So yes I can see this unfolding and the OP's wife having ulterior motives for settling ASAP, just as you state above.

 

[Zow]

Obligatory Christo

 

[Lutherman2112]

Haven't read the thread and don't plan to. If you have a lawyer, talk to him/her. Don't talk about an existing case you have that's currently in litigation on the internet.

I want full disclosure, as the law requires. This is the only item in our divorce that hasn't been resolved. The stocks that she holds are the elephant in the room, and she isn't talking about it. If she wants to use this thread against me, so be it.

Just looking into the innerwebs for info with a great big salt lick by my side.

 

[JFT Ben]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

The problem though is that it sounds like the lawyer might suck. Being a lawyer yourself you probably realize that family law practitioners generally do not hail from the top half of the class, or sometimes even the top 80% of the class, right? He certainly might be smart to ask this lawyer a few more questions about how screwed he is going to be once this goes through.

I had an amicable divorce. And I also had a great lawyer. You know why she was great? Because I was the person who came up with the split and helped to draw up the agreement. I paid her $500 to look it over and that was that.

If the dude is dealing with a snake; and we should all agree that a person who opens unknown accounts and what not during a marriage is most certainly a reptile of the snaketonian variety, he should be looking at this venture as if it is not amicable at all. If the snake wants to escape quickly, he should let her go if she agrees to provide more than half of the assets and a cash flow guarantee for maybe five years or so.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that this guy probably does not have the resources to pay a lawyer much money anyways if he is sitting at 20 K a year with no benefits. The snake knows this. Many years of living under the roof has made the man quite Charmin-esque and ready to agree to whatever the snake suggests 'for the kids'. That is probably why the snake has worked so diligently to not only hide assets but create a facade of cooperation.

The lawyers, while probably not being directly in cahoots with the snake, understand that a short 'amicable' process is their best chance at getting paid their full fee and want to steer the stay at home dad to concede. This is because aside from the fact that family law practitioners do not hail from the upper or even middle reaches of their third or fourth tier law schools, they still had to pay the full freight on tuition (150K or more) and rely on suckers like this to agree quickly on rotten deals. The reason these two lawyers probably 'work so well' together is simply because they are cut from the same cloth. They fully understand that the longer they work on this, the greater chance there is that neither of them will get paid for the amount of hours they had to bill, because in the grand scheme of things it does not seem like we are dealing with rich people here.

Yeah...there sure is lots to think about for our friend.

My BIL recently went through this in a similar situation. He stayed home to raise the kid, was underemployed, she made over $100k, etc.. But he took an exact opposite approach. A) He dragged it out as long as he could. Besides just putting this stuff behind him emotionally, there was NO other benefit for a fast resolution. He was on her medical to why be in a rush to buy his own policy?. She was the one who moved into a local apartment. His lawyer is one of our best friends who I've known for 25 years and has been doing family law since she started. Certainly somewhat in the category what Meatwad said - she has a big heart, but she can be a lion if instructed to do so.

B) He fought and fought for every nickel, and then continued to push the envelope. He ended up getting full custody of the kid from the maneuvering, and more money for child support because of this.

C) Following the divorce he landed back on his feet - he was getting some money on the side from his ex-wife, started working full time again, and has been dating a hot yoga instructor instead of his ice queen ex.

Why you are letting this financial situation go is beyond me. Alimony is designed for exactly this situation, not to mention the unresolved stock situation. Yes, it is much easier emotionally to put this behind you and move on with your life, but think about this - would you prefer to work an extra 5 or 10 years on the back end because you gave up a significant financial income because you and your lawyer want an "amicable" divorce? Your relationship with your kids will be independent of your ex-wife's and will stand on its own, plus they are both practically grown up - we're not talking about a 4 and 7 year old here. So my opinion is to pump the brakes here, let this drag out for awhile, don't get a high paying salary right now until the divorce is final, and get your lawyer to fight for what is rightfully yours since you contributed to her current financial health in your own way. Good luck!

 

[GroveDiesel]

If you ask for advice and all the lawyers here are telling you the same thing, I think I would listen to their collective wisdom and delete this thread ASAP.

 

[matuski]

This is the exact situation we'd all be complaining/#####ing about if it were a wife asking for 1/2 of everything her husband made. If she's offering to split "everything" 50/50, and she contributed the vast majority of the assets, you should be happy to get that.

You got to basically not work for who knows how many years. That's payment enough right there. No deadlines, stress, commute, ####### co-workers. Sheesh.

LOL. Yeah, I didn't do anything...except work part time as closing manager at a restaurant for 6 years, worked on the road while her dad lived with us, earned a second BA and teacher certification, then worked 2 years with a child advocacy group. All the while (except on road) was the primary care giver.

No offense, but is that supposed to sound like a lot? Many of us worked full time, attended school in the evenings, and handled the kids in our spare time while our wives either worked or went to school.

Quit being an doosh.

 

[James Daulton]

This is the exact situation we'd all be complaining/#####ing about if it were a wife asking for 1/2 of everything her husband made. If she's offering to split "everything" 50/50, and she contributed the vast majority of the assets, you should be happy to get that.

You got to basically not work for who knows how many years. That's payment enough right there. No deadlines, stress, commute, ####### co-workers. Sheesh.

LOL. Yeah, I didn't do anything...except work part time as closing manager at a restaurant for 6 years, worked on the road while her dad lived with us, earned a second BA and teacher certification, then worked 2 years with a child advocacy group. All the while (except on road) was the primary care giver.

No offense, but is that supposed to sound like a lot? Many of us worked full time, attended school in the evenings, and handled the kids in our spare time while our wives either worked or went to school.

Quit being an doosh.

Meh, let him sponge off of his wife forever for all I care. Oh, I have to go to work now.

 

[AAABatteries]

Oh, and I don't mean to be a #### even though I know I'm coming off like one.

You're at least correct on the 2nd part.

 

[RUSF18]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

It's not delaying the divorce, it's completing the process of valuing assets which can take forever. If she's not valuing them herself (she put "unknown" on the value of them in her filing), he and his lawyers and his accountants need to do what is necessary to arrive at a reasonable value, which she'll also need to agree to so it's not like he can overinflate. The sale of the company puts a market value on those shares. If she owned 5% of the company two years ago, owns 5% today, and will own 5% once it's sold, their marital assets haven't changed.

Now I can see an argument that any additional stock she is granted as the process gets completed, he wouldn't be entitled to. I'm not sure how that works out legally once divorce is filed, but that's an easy give back as you try to settle things.

 

[Foosball God]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

The problem though is that it sounds like the lawyer might suck. Being a lawyer yourself you probably realize that family law practitioners generally do not hail from the top half of the class, or sometimes even the top 80% of the class, right? He certainly might be smart to ask this lawyer a few more questions about how screwed he is going to be once this goes through.

I had an amicable divorce. And I also had a great lawyer. You know why she was great? Because I was the person who came up with the split and helped to draw up the agreement. I paid her $500 to look it over and that was that.

If the dude is dealing with a snake; and we should all agree that a person who opens unknown accounts and what not during a marriage is most certainly a reptile of the snaketonian variety, he should be looking at this venture as if it is not amicable at all. If the snake wants to escape quickly, he should let her go if she agrees to provide more than half of the assets and a cash flow guarantee for maybe five years or so.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that this guy probably does not have the resources to pay a lawyer much money anyways if he is sitting at 20 K a year with no benefits. The snake knows this. Many years of living under the roof has made the man quite Charmin-esque and ready to agree to whatever the snake suggests 'for the kids'. That is probably why the snake has worked so diligently to not only hide assets but create a facade of cooperation.

The lawyers, while probably not being directly in cahoots with the snake, understand that a short 'amicable' process is their best chance at getting paid their full fee and want to steer the stay at home dad to concede. This is because aside from the fact that family law practitioners do not hail from the upper or even middle reaches of their third or fourth tier law schools, they still had to pay the full freight on tuition (150K or more) and rely on suckers like this to agree quickly on rotten deals. The reason these two lawyers probably 'work so well' together is simply because they are cut from the same cloth. They fully understand that the longer they work on this, the greater chance there is that neither of them will get paid for the amount of hours they had to bill, because in the grand scheme of things it does not seem like we are dealing with rich people here.

Yeah...there sure is lots to think about for our friend.

Impressive analogy Meat. To many of the posters are to caught up in their image of masculinity and the time honored role of the male. But if the OP is assuming the child rearing and domestic duties, he surely is entitled to a true split along with child support. Remember marriage is a 50/50 partnership.

As for your scenario about what actually maybe going on. Many years ago I had a friend of mine who married up so to speak. Both were in their mid 20's. He was an blue collar appliance repair guy and she was finishing her undergrad work as an accountant and working towards her CPA. She soon got into a firm after graduation and within 2 years was having an affair with one of her senior level constituents. Needless to say they were soon divorced upon his discovery.

So yes I can see this unfolding and the OP's wife having ulterior motives for settling ASAP, just as you state above.

Why would he get child support when one is in college and the other is going to live with the mom?

 

[James Daulton]

Oh, and I don't mean to be a #### even though I know I'm coming off like one.

You're at least correct on the 2nd part.

I know I know. I'll stop.

 

[gameday]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

It's not delaying the divorce, it's completing the process of valuing assets which can take forever. If she's not valuing them herself (she put "unknown" on the value of them in her filing), he and his lawyers and his accountants need to do what is necessary to arrive at a reasonable value, which she'll also need to agree to so it's not like he can overinflate. The sale of the company puts a market value on those shares. If she owned 5% of the company two years ago, owns 5% today, and will own 5% once it's sold, their marital assets haven't changed.

Now I can see an argument that any additional stock she is granted as the process gets completed, he wouldn't be entitled to. I'm not sure how that works out legally once divorce is filed, but that's an easy give back as you try to settle things.

This is another reason why the OP should have his lawyer subpoena all stock grant details. It's not unlikely that the OP's wife will ask her employer to cancel all prior grants and re-issue them with a date that falls after she filed for divorce. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I've been with several companies that issued private stock grants. I've seen all kinds of questionable things done.

 

[kentric]

What are the laws in your state regarding divorce? You should definitely go to alimony/child support (if you get the kids). She's going to be making much more than you going forward. You've been out of work (for the most part) watching your kids. Your earnings potential due to this is hampered. You don't want to just live on a mostly fixed income, go for the alimony/child support.

 

[culdeus]

What child support can he really get? Sounds like he's gonna get 50/50 custody of a 16 year old. In Texas they may not even grant a dime for that, and at most looking at 2 years at like 9% of gross, maybe. Lawyers here would probably push for a lump sum in lieu of the support for a quick custody agreement.

 

[sbonomo]

I have received several private stock grants from past employers. A simple grant document is issued by the employer and is jointly signed by them and the employee. That is not filed with the IRS. A taxable event occurs when the grant is exercised. At that point the sale would be reported to the IRS.

It is very difficult to value a stock grant in a private company. My suggestion is that you have your lawyer subpoena her employer to provide all stock grant information. In addition, I would find out if there is any deferred comp that has not been reported to the IRS. Given her history of hiding assets that is a very real possibility. One option you could pursue is to have 1/2 of the stock grant transferred to you (and 1/2 of deferred comp, if any). Good luck.

i came to post this. Going to be tough to value if the company does not already have it. Good luck. Sounds like you have been living the dream so may be best to let her have the stock since she worked for it. What are you going to do now? Full time teacher? why didnt it work, just grow apart?

 

[fruity pebbles]

I have received several private stock grants from past employers. A simple grant document is issued by the employer and is jointly signed by them and the employee. That is not filed with the IRS. A taxable event occurs when the grant is exercised. At that point the sale would be reported to the IRS.

It is very difficult to value a stock grant in a private company. My suggestion is that you have your lawyer subpoena her employer to provide all stock grant information. In addition, I would find out if there is any deferred comp that has not been reported to the IRS. Given her history of hiding assets that is a very real possibility. One option you could pursue is to have 1/2 of the stock grant transferred to you (and 1/2 of deferred comp, if any). Good luck.

i came to post this. Going to be tough to value if the company does not already have it. Good luck. Sounds like you have been living the dream so may be best to let her have the stock since she worked for it. What are you going to do now? Full time teacher? why didnt it work, just grow apart?

She got tired of him sitting around the house

 

[Quez]

The OP's situation sounds exactly like my ex-barbers divorce.

She made all the money, was trying to hide some, etc.

Ended up closing up his barbershop & doing something else due to the divorce. So she indirectly screwed his customers as well.

 

[Quez]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

Don't listen to Woz, Meatwad is the one to listen to. Odds are your public defender is on the take with the other firm. They are all going to screw you over.

I'm 100% bought into Meatwads "she has a master plan & is going to BF you".

 

[Fat Nick]

The IRS definitely doesn't and I doubt the SEC would have any kind of public info available, but you could check.

The stock price for a private company is tough to figure. You can either look at historical transactions, an internal valuation or a third party valuation.

Honestly, if things are amicable enough, I'd just ask her to please include something fair in there. Any discrepancy between her valuation and the true value will pale in comparison to the cost of trying to dig out a better value. If she tries to say zero, or set it at something insanely low like par value of $1, I'd complain. But otherwise, whatever she would come up with will have to be good enough.

This has most everything relevant IMO. Private company values are tough to crack because there is no real volume, and unless there are recent sales of shares, the value is really subjective.

 

[D-Day]

This is the exact situation we'd all be complaining/#####ing about if it were a wife asking for 1/2 of everything her husband made. If she's offering to split "everything" 50/50, and she contributed the vast majority of the assets, you should be happy to get that.

You got to basically not work for who knows how many years. That's payment enough right there. No deadlines, stress, commute, ####### co-workers. Sheesh.

LOL. Yeah, I didn't do anything...except work part time as closing manager at a restaurant for 6 years, worked on the road while her dad lived with us, earned a second BA and teacher certification, then worked 2 years with a child advocacy group. All the while (except on road) was the primary care giver.

No offense, but is that supposed to sound like a lot? Many of us worked full time, attended school in the evenings, and handled the kids in our spare time while our wives either worked or went to school.

Quit being an doosh.

Meh, let him sponge off of his wife forever for all I care. Oh, I have to go to work now.

Yeah, we b' & moan about women asking for the world in divorce. But you think that if the OP rolls over and takes one for the team, that women will stop?

 

[Zow]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

The problem though is that it sounds like the lawyer might suck. Being a lawyer yourself you probably realize that family law practitioners generally do not hail from the top half of the class, or sometimes even the top 80% of the class, right? He certainly might be smart to ask this lawyer a few more questions about how screwed he is going to be once this goes through.

I had an amicable divorce. And I also had a great lawyer. You know why she was great? Because I was the person who came up with the split and helped to draw up the agreement. I paid her $500 to look it over and that was that.

If the dude is dealing with a snake; and we should all agree that a person who opens unknown accounts and what not during a marriage is most certainly a reptile of the snaketonian variety, he should be looking at this venture as if it is not amicable at all. If the snake wants to escape quickly, he should let her go if she agrees to provide more than half of the assets and a cash flow guarantee for maybe five years or so.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that this guy probably does not have the resources to pay a lawyer much money anyways if he is sitting at 20 K a year with no benefits. The snake knows this. Many years of living under the roof has made the man quite Charmin-esque and ready to agree to whatever the snake suggests 'for the kids'. That is probably why the snake has worked so diligently to not only hide assets but create a facade of cooperation.

The lawyers, while probably not being directly in cahoots with the snake, understand that a short 'amicable' process is their best chance at getting paid their full fee and want to steer the stay at home dad to concede. This is because aside from the fact that family law practitioners do not hail from the upper or even middle reaches of their third or fourth tier law schools, they still had to pay the full freight on tuition (150K or more) and rely on suckers like this to agree quickly on rotten deals. The reason these two lawyers probably 'work so well' together is simply because they are cut from the same cloth. They fully understand that the longer they work on this, the greater chance there is that neither of them will get paid for the amount of hours they had to bill, because in the grand scheme of things it does not seem like we are dealing with rich people here.

Yeah...there sure is lots to think about for our friend.

No. No, it's not.

 

[Binky The Doormat]

The IRS definitely doesn't and I doubt the SEC would have any kind of public info available, but you could check.

The stock price for a private company is tough to figure. You can either look at historical transactions, an internal valuation or a third party valuation.

Honestly, if things are amicable enough, I'd just ask her to please include something fair in there. Any discrepancy between her valuation and the true value will pale in comparison to the cost of trying to dig out a better value. If she tries to say zero, or set it at something insanely low like par value of $1, I'd complain. But otherwise, whatever she would come up with will have to be good enough.

LOLOLOLOLOL. Right. She is going to #### you until you are crying and bleeding.

 

[elbowrm]

Private co value shouldn't be hard to ballpark if you can get any info - ebitda and industry are enough for a back of the envelope number. Or even an educated guess on annual revenues.

 

[Christo]

Your lawyer should already know the answer to this question.

No ####.

 

[Christo]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

The grants were already given. The value is unknown. He's entitled to half of an unknown value. This has nothing to do with inflating value.

 

[Christo]

Talk to your lawyer. Don't listen to anything else anybody says in here.

Except, you know, this post.

The problem though is that it sounds like the lawyer might suck. Being a lawyer yourself you probably realize that family law practitioners generally do not hail from the top half of the class, or sometimes even the top 80% of the class, right? He certainly might be smart to ask this lawyer a few more questions about how screwed he is going to be once this goes through.

I had an amicable divorce. And I also had a great lawyer. You know why she was great? Because I was the person who came up with the split and helped to draw up the agreement. I paid her $500 to look it over and that was that.

If the dude is dealing with a snake; and we should all agree that a person who opens unknown accounts and what not during a marriage is most certainly a reptile of the snaketonian variety, he should be looking at this venture as if it is not amicable at all. If the snake wants to escape quickly, he should let her go if she agrees to provide more than half of the assets and a cash flow guarantee for maybe five years or so.

Also, let's not overlook the fact that this guy probably does not have the resources to pay a lawyer much money anyways if he is sitting at 20 K a year with no benefits. The snake knows this. Many years of living under the roof has made the man quite Charmin-esque and ready to agree to whatever the snake suggests 'for the kids'. That is probably why the snake has worked so diligently to not only hide assets but create a facade of cooperation.

The lawyers, while probably not being directly in cahoots with the snake, understand that a short 'amicable' process is their best chance at getting paid their full fee and want to steer the stay at home dad to concede. This is because aside from the fact that family law practitioners do not hail from the upper or even middle reaches of their third or fourth tier law schools, they still had to pay the full freight on tuition (150K or more) and rely on suckers like this to agree quickly on rotten deals. The reason these two lawyers probably 'work so well' together is simply because they are cut from the same cloth. They fully understand that the longer they work on this, the greater chance there is that neither of them will get paid for the amount of hours they had to bill, because in the grand scheme of things it does not seem like we are dealing with rich people here.

Yeah...there sure is lots to think about for our friend.

 

[Zow]

Christo I already said that.

 

[Henry Ford]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

The grants were already given. The value is unknown. He's entitled to half of an unknown value. This has nothing to do with inflating value.

Current value. Versus attempting to delay the divorce solely in the hopes of the stock appreciating in value due to a sale. Which of course would be impossible to show that he was doing unless he stated it in a post on the internet.

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Whatever Meatballs Remumbled said, do the exact opposite of that.

:X

 

[AAABatteries]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

The grants were already given. The value is unknown. He's entitled to half of an unknown value. This has nothing to do with inflating value.

Current value. Versus attempting to delay the divorce solely in the hopes of the stock appreciating in value due to a sale. Which of course would be impossible to show that he was doing unless he stated it in a post on the internet.

You know the the Ref wasn't the OP, right?

 

[James Daulton]

If her company is selling in the next 4 months there isn't a chance I'm settling with her till after said sale.

I certainly hope courts don't look at statements like this as an attempt to improperly inflate the amount of money you get out of a divorce settlement by delaying the divorce. Or that the community of acquiets and gains isn't fixed at the time of filing. :crosses fingers:

The grants were already given. The value is unknown. He's entitled to half of an unknown value. This has nothing to do with inflating value.

Current value. Versus attempting to delay the divorce solely in the hopes of the stock appreciating in value due to a sale. Which of course would be impossible to show that he was doing unless he stated it in a post on the internet.

Lawyers really are nothing but wet blankets.

(except maybe Christo)

 

[The Commish]

Wife and I split in May. Fairly amicable right now as we head into settlement meeting next Friday as a precursor to what could be our final court date in November. Wife is a VP of a private company, and has received several bonuses of the company's private stock. Company sold approximately 25% of their stock a few years ago, some of which was granted to wife. Her take home after tax was $550,000.

Looking over the financial statement, she isn't reporting the number of shares granted, nor the value of shares. I have pointed this out to my lawyer a couple of times, and I will know more when I go to a meeting later this week.

Is there a specific form (like IRS form, SEC, etc) that could be produced that will show the trail of stock granted, value, and date of sale?

When the stock was sold, would the company sell just 25% of her holdings? Could they have sold a large % of her shares as opposed equal amounts from each shareholder?

To the bold, do you mean the money she got from the stock? If so, that number had to come from somewhere and processed as some sort of compensation. Start with that year's tax return. It has to be on the return somewhere if you know the "take home".