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Soriano Refuses To Play Outfield (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Eraser
- Start date
JZilla
Footballguy
At the end of the day, Terrell Owens really didn't get too screwed. And I blame the Eagles for that situation as much as I blame the Nats for this one. You got what you paid for in both cases.My perfect world?
I hope they can get some value for him, but if they can't, I hope they screw him, a la, Terrell Owens.
Giant Wooden Badger
the Beav
Zirra is right. Soriano is a baby but he's been up front about his position on playing the OF all along and it does have a direct impact on his future earning potential.Bowden is the idiot here, not Soriano.
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
It comes down to people bashing an athlete because he makes millions. You see it in every post.
"He makes millions he should do it."
Money has nothing to do with the issue because what someone makes is relative to his peers.
Someone may think you should do whatever your boss asks because you make more money than them. You don't think so because you see people making more than you.
good fishing today bags
Capella
Footballguy
I agree with that part of what you're saying. The money doesn't matter here, to me. That's not the issue.
"He makes millions he should do it."
Money has nothing to do with the issue because what someone makes is relative to his peers.
Someone may think you should do whatever your boss asks because you make more money than them. You don't think so because you see people making more than you.
bagger.
The One Play Quiz
It comes down to respect and drawing the line at what you are willing to do at a job and what you aren't. He is a 2B and doesn't want to play anywhere else. He made that clear. Management ignored that.This is the best way for Soriano to negotiate playing him at the position he wants. If he gets stuck in the OF he may be miserable and his long term career earnings could suffer. Why would he just accept that?
Oh that's right...because he makes millions.
bagger.
The One Play Quiz
"He makes millions he should do it."
Money has nothing to do with the issue because what someone makes is relative to his peers.
Someone may think you should do whatever your boss asks because you make more money than them. You don't think so because you see people making more than you.
What part is fishing? You see this on these boards time and time again.Boo hoo he makes millions so he should do it because I would.
I am sure Jerry Rice would have had no issue with being converted to TE halfway through his career.
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
So no one can ever question anything an athlete does becuase they make less?
"He makes millions he should do it."
Money has nothing to do with the issue because what someone makes is relative to his peers.
Someone may think you should do whatever your boss asks because you make more money than them. You don't think so because you see people making more than you.
Boo hoo he makes millions so he should do it because I would.
I am sure Jerry Rice would have had no issue with being converted to TE halfway through his career.
JZilla
Footballguy
What does salary have to do with anything?If you had to clean your company's toilets somebody living below the poverty line probably thinks you shouldn't complain because you are making $50k.Yeah, because getting paid millions for playing the OF is so demeaning compared to getting paid millions for playing 2B.
It's all relative.
Don't be so ####### stupid.
TIA
I bet the dude who cleans our ####ters would call me a big baby for not filling the Windows admin position too. No difference at all to him.
brewer
Footballguy
There are a couple of problems with your position. I'll assume that you are a pretty good Oracle DBA. By all accounts, that is not true of Mr. Soriano and 2B. If your company had a better Oracle DBA than you, they would certainly be within their rights to ask you to change jobs. You would also be within your rights to quit.However, I would hope that you would notify the company if you were not going to show up for work.
To simply not take the field is a prima donna move. On that, I guess we will have to agree to disagree.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
BTW, not only to I agree with JerkZilla re: Soriano's right to refuse to play and not get paid, I agree that the politics of baseball had something to do with the Wilkerson deal.
Hicks had been trying to move Soriano for over a year - no one will give him a ham sandwich b/c Soriano is a butcher at 2B and his stats mean he'll get paid far more than he's worth because of the lack of offensive stars in MLB at 2B.
Why in the world would Bowden give up value for Soriano? Given the leverage of the situation, Bowden should have sent a prospect or two and a bad salary to offset the impact of Soriano's #. Instead, he deals his best offensive weapon, a servicable OF (Sledge), and a prospect.
The only explanation is that Bowden is a temp who cares nothing about the long range future of the the franchise and helped out his buddy Hicks.
Hicks had been trying to move Soriano for over a year - no one will give him a ham sandwich b/c Soriano is a butcher at 2B and his stats mean he'll get paid far more than he's worth because of the lack of offensive stars in MLB at 2B.
Why in the world would Bowden give up value for Soriano? Given the leverage of the situation, Bowden should have sent a prospect or two and a bad salary to offset the impact of Soriano's #. Instead, he deals his best offensive weapon, a servicable OF (Sledge), and a prospect.
The only explanation is that Bowden is a temp who cares nothing about the long range future of the the franchise and helped out his buddy Hicks.
bagger.
The One Play Quiz
Please tell me what other leverage he has? Negotiating is all about leverage. The one constant power ballplayers can use to leverage their position is not playing.One of the best negotiating tactics is saying you will quit if the other side does not come off their position and following through if they don't.
That's not being a prima donna.
The other explanation is that Bowden is a total idiot who is only good at going on TV and blathering about how great he is. But I like your explanation just as much.The guy who is getting totally disrespected here isn't Soriano, but Frank Robinson, who has to try to manage this bunch of losers. The Nats of 2006 will be lucky to win 65 games.
JZilla
Footballguy
It's hard to compare the situations. Soriano was FORCED to come to DC, where the "better DBA" was already in place. Obviously I can't be FORCED to take a job.Soriano made his position clear in December regarding playing the outfield. His refusing to take the field should not have been a surprise to anyone.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
I agree, but I wonder how the whole not taking the field thing came about. Someone was obviously playing hardball. If Soriano didn't warn the Nats that he wouldn't physically take the field if his name was on the lineup card, that's pretty bush.However, if Soriano told the Nats ahead of time that he wouldn't take the field if he was on the lineup card as an OF, and the Nats did so anyway, they're the baffoons.
One of the best negotiating tactics is saying you will quit if the other side does not come off their position and following through if they don't.
That's not being a prima donna.
My money is on the Nats being the baffoons.
brewer
Footballguy
See, I don't think Soriano was FORCED to do anything. He wants to play major league baseball, he needs to abide by the rules of the league. I know it's not about the money, but I bet he would get plenty to play in Japan.I'll liken this to a QB refusing to switch to a WR in the NFL. It is certainly their right, but more often than not, the player will end up out of the league.
Giant Wooden Badger
the Beav
Soriano has already played in Japan. That's where he started.From Wikipedia:
Soriano's career began in Japan with the Hiroshima Carp, training at their Carp Academy for Dominican players. In 1997, he was promoted briefly to the varsity team, and, wearing uniform number 74, he appeared in nine games, batting .181 (2 for 17) with two walks.
He signed as a free agent with the New York Yankees in 1998 and played in New York for five seasons.
Koya
Footballguy
From a legal/contractual standpoint the money doesnt mean anything.From the be a ####### man and accept a position move when you are making 10 million to play a boy's game perspective... that is another story.I agree with that part of what you're saying. The money doesn't matter here, to me. That's not the issue.
"He makes millions he should do it."
Money has nothing to do with the issue because what someone makes is relative to his peers.
Someone may think you should do whatever your boss asks because you make more money than them. You don't think so because you see people making more than you.
Koya
Footballguy
As I noted, from a contractual standpoint the money means nothing. But Sori has NOTHING to stand on contractually.If I am under contract and the terms of that contract are I report for work and take the position my boss tells me to take, then regardless what we discussed beforehand, I have to abide by my employer's will. I might be pissed, but if I dont show up, I dont get paid.Don't let $$ envy cloud the issue.If you moved and made it clear of your expectations of your new job before that move and upon arrival your new boss moved you from sales to accounting, you'd be pissed too.The contract is also pretty clear that if Soriano doesnt get his ### out there, the TEN FREAKING MILLION HE IS PAID TO PLAY A GAME is held back, and he loses any service time.Yeah, poor guy under a TEN MILLION DOLLAR contract let the new team know he wouldnt move positions. Rough life there.
Just because he makes more than you doesn't change the issue.
Same for Sori.
But for people to ignore that these are men playing a boys game for millions is to ignore something that may not mean something legally, but sure as hell means something as to what type of person we are talking about.
whoknew
Footballguy
That's the problem and that's why Soriano's position is perfectly reasonable. You could quit and go get another job at another company as an Oracle DBA. Baseball, however, has an antitrust exemption. Because of this, they are a monopoly. Soriano has no other choice to go and play 2b like he wants.
Soriano is making a very reasonable decision and, in doing so, not going to cost himself $20MM (at least).
The Nats are boneheads.
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
he's going to cost himself a lot. A LOT!
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
1. He's now labeled a pain in the ###. Not a team player.2. He's exposing his weaknesses at 2B. He might as well get used to playing outfield now.
3. He will never get $10M a year in his next contract.
Mr. Know-It-All
Footballguy
I would love to read Soriano's contract. According to a lot of people in this thread it must be a second base only contract because I was under the assumption that most players were signed by a club to meet the needs of the club. Unless his contract says second base only he should get his ### on the field wherever his manager puts him. BTW, if my boss tells me to clean the can you bet I would unless I had another job lined up so I could quit immediately. Do you really think anyone is going to sign this wuss after this latest stunt? Sure the Yankees or Red Sox might, but no one else.
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
Not sure who won here.Just traded Soriano/Posada for Rolen/Varitek
Mark Davis
Footballguy
You wuz robbed!Just traded Soriano/Posada for Rolen/Varitek
whoknew
Footballguy
You answered your own question. OF COURSE a team will sign him to play 2B. Here's what's going to happen:1) Nats will trade him to a team he'll play 2b
2) He'll get a big FA contract from a team to play 2B
And the difference with your analysis of your boss and his situation is that there are other places you can work. MLB has a monopoly in the US.
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MelvinTScupper
Guest
And that's why no one else wanted him.
ren hoek
Footballguy
I dunno man. Jim Bowden is a godawful GM, and it's mind-blowing to me that he still has a job. But why would he risk his reputation as a GM, or lack thereof, by leaving his handprints all over what will likely turn out to be a horrendous trade for the Nationals? What obligation does he have to MLB to risk his reputation like that? Not trying to be a ##### here, just curiuos about your point of view. It's much easier to just write it off to Bowden being a bonehead.
