Desert_Power
Footballguy
T having a nice day. Might be a good time to finally exit since it is near the price I paid for it ~4 years ago (not counting the loss from all that WBD crap that we got)
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The “I want to retire soon” thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter fruity pebbles
- Start date
Peggy
Footballguy
Peggy Rule #1 - Don't look at the market when it's down. At all.
Following rule #1 I'm not aware of any big news, but, it's likely that the uncertainty around the election has a lot to do with it. Hoping once there is certainty it should recover ok. If we have have a correction it's probably time to start moving money out of fixed income into stocks, even if it's just rebalancing, in anticipation of interest rates dropping.. I'm due some money here at the end of the year so I'll take it as a buy opportunity. I mean we're due. Then rinse and repeat.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
I'm not trying to time the market at all in my retirement accounts. I'm still DCAing into my 401K, backdoor Roth 401K, and HSA with every paycheck. I rebalance those accounts every two weeks via the contribution allocations (I have BrokerageLink in my 401K so the cash shows up and I have to then invest it). And I have rebalancing bands (up 25%, down 15% against goal) that I look at every two weeks as well.
In retirement I'll look at it when I make withdrawals, and use those to move things back towards the desired allocation. And if a major move in either direction triggers the rebalancing bands, then I'll reallocate then as well. At least that's the plan for now!
Sand
Footballguy
We've had 6 weeks of up. A profit taking day, like today, is totally expected. VIX is under 20.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I know everybody says that you're not supposed to look at your accounts every day, but screw that. I am going to look at my accounts every day and nobody can stop me.
Peggy
Footballguy
Yeah, I don't like trying to time the market either. But interest rates have been 5%+ for what 18 months? If we think that's going away it would be a good idea to take advantage of the dip, if there is one. We had a pretty good dip the first of August the last time I pushed some chips in. I'm just saying if it happens. If it doesn't then I'll start DCAing. And I'm talking cash. All my retirement stuff DCAs like yours for the few months I have left.
-OZ-
Footballguy
I look most days. It’s like sports scores. I’m not doing anything about it but I’m always curious.
Sand
Footballguy
Good article on long term care policies. It's ugly out there and the sky is no limit to premium increases.
matttyl
Footballguy
Behind paywall, but I know the story all too well. I had to go to the bulk of my existing LTC policy holders who I sold policies to a decade or more ago (including my own parents) and tell them that while there premiums were never meant to increase, the carrier we placed them with is asking the state Board of Insurance for a 100% increase. Worse yet, that increase is totally justified with the losses they are sustaining and they may very well face more increases in the future. With insurance pools there is a term called “loss ratio” which is the percentage of premiums going to offset claims. You may have heard the term with the Affordable Care Act where carriers in those market have to have a minimum loss ratio of 80% (so $.80 of every $1 of premium they collect must be used to pay claims, at a minimum). Some of these carriers in the LTC space had loss ratios of 150%. They have to ask for these premiums to remain solvent. This creates a “death spiral” though, where anyone young and healthy enough to find a better alternative will leave that pool - leaving the remaining pool older and sicker with an ever higher loss ratio for the carrier.
To me, this is why the new way to fund LTC (via insurance) is actually with a life insurance policy with an LTC rider. Basically it allows you to spend down your future death benefit for LTC should you need it. If you don’t, the untouched death benefit is paid to your beneficiaries at your passing.
Peggy
Footballguy
Just a little life hack - paste the URL into archive.md and you'll be able to read it.
NutterButter
Footballguy
This is one of the most useful posts I've ever read on this site. Thank you.
Sand
Footballguy
I imagine the insurance is whole or universal type? What advantage would that have over simply planning for LTC inside a retirement nest egg and letting that grow? Investments always have a bit more risk, but way more upside. Given market history and (for us) probably a 30 year horizon to maybe needing LTC it seems prudent to simply keep investing.
-OZ-
Footballguy
matttyl
Footballguy
Yes, it would be a universal or whole life policy. Me personally, I’m an advocate for whole life over term, but I do completely understand the argument (in fact I have a term rider on my whole life - but I’m of the mindset that I’d like to have life insurance in place when I die, no matter when that occurs). Anyway, if you’re under age say 50, I would t worry about LTC too much at this point. So much can change, and quickly. Perhaps Medicare will have a tweak to cover more of LTC, or some other entitlement program emerges. I’d never say not to invest, especially with that time horizon. That said, LTC can easily run a few hundred dollars per day. For a married couple that could be $750+ per day just for the care, depending on its level, maybe more. That’s between $250-300k per year for just that one thing, much less all the other living expenses you might have (taxes, housing, food, utilities). That could easily bump a couple up into the next higher tax bracket (or even two brackets) if being funded by a taxable retirement account. Just something to consider.
matttyl
Footballguy
Also, if available, for sure max out your HSA (inside of an investment) as it can be used to pay for LTC with tax free dollars, or can be used to potentially pay for a LTC insurance policy with tax free dollars. I view my HSA as a retirement health account - if nothing else I can pay my Medicare premiums with it with tax free money.
Sand
Footballguy
Been maxing my HSA for years and haven't taken a penny out. So I'm with you there.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
I always chuckle when I see my last HSA card transaction listed as 2017. Yeah, that's when I learned not to spend it.
I have gone years without looking at my 401K accounts. Set it and forget.....but now as I am under 5 years I am wondering when I need to start pulling back on the aggressiveness if at all.
matttyl
Footballguy
Keep those receipts!
-OZ-
Footballguy
Maybe. Just don’t forget you also need money for 30 years down the line.
What’s your current mix?
I don't really know. I just have always went with the most aggressive options there are with the mindset that if the market goes down I am just buying on sale. I am a pretty hands off guy as I know nothing about this stuff. We have a FA guy and meet with him periodically and he says we are in good shape and in the right direction to retire in 2029. I will have some pension (as I will have 10 years in civil service) and I started maxing out 401K when I started my first real job in the mid 90's. I got some ROTH IRA (and trying to maximize this currently). My wife has a pension and she did the same with her 401K. We have zero debt (other than helping my son with college for the next 4 years).
Not sure how to answer what you mean by "mix".
-OZ-
Footballguy
In order to know whether you should pull back on the aggressiveness you need to know your goals, the portfolio that best meets your goals, and your current portfolio. Then see what needs adjusting.
Peggy
Footballguy
If you've been maxing out 401k since the 90s AND have pensions you probably don't need to worry about it. You might even be able to retire today to be honest. But mix means asset allocation. You mentioned being less aggressive, changing your asset allocation does that. In the simplest terms less equities and more fixed income.
i very likely could retire today other than I want to get to 10 years in civil service for their pension and health care options. Plus I want to get the last kid graduated from college and done paying for that (he is a freshman this year so I got about 4 years for that to happen).
In our discussions with the FA adviser those are the questions (when to pull back and get less aggressive, etc) we have been posing and kicking around. For the time being we are staying aggressive (it's my nature) but will be looking to change the "mix" in the coming years.
Peggy
Footballguy
Ah. By aggressive you might be referring to savings amounts then? Being able to spend more now (take more trips, spend more on the kids) while still working whittling away at the remaining years to get the pension? Google "Coast FIRE"
No by aggressive I mean in investment strategy. I have always had the 401K choices to be the most aggressive stock options in the plan. I haven't changed off of that yet.
Peggy
Footballguy
Sounds good. But, it also sounds like you're ahead in savings so don't forget to take some time and money to enjoy life along the way!
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That is for sure going to happen. When I retire I don't plan to sit on that money. I want to go do things.....my dream is to see a game in every MLB park. It will be one of my first goals.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Do it!! My aunt and uncle did that with every NFL stadium when they retired.
I'm more of a college sports guy so I'd like to go to 1-2 Duck away games every year, and on a bye week pick a big game/location to go to outside of the Ducks schedule - Bama at LSU, Clemson, The Grove, Red River, Georgia v Florida, that kind of thing. Hit the bowl game(s) every year. Go to some of the neutral sight hoop tourneys (I think they're playing in Maui next year, may have to check that one off), and NCAA tournament sites. Big time track and field (Olympic Trials, USATFs, NCAAs) is fun, too...luckily it's almost always right here in town!
Peggy
Footballguy
Pushed the button on my retirement day officially being 2/3/25. I have to cover for a colleague for the first two weeks in November and after that I have enough PTO to get me to February.
I think "working" one day in February gets me an extra full month of insurance. And I'll be able to plow a month's worth of salary into 401k Roth and have earned income to qualify for regular Roth.
I think "working" one day in February gets me an extra full month of insurance. And I'll be able to plow a month's worth of salary into 401k Roth and have earned income to qualify for regular Roth.
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Yes that's how it is in my company - they say always retire on the 1st or 2nd to get another month of benefits.
matttyl
Footballguy
You’ll want to verify that insurance thing. Many companies are “end of the month in which your full time employment ends” but not all. Also, if it is, your potential cobra would start 3/1 and last for up to 18 months (though I think k you e said you’d go to the exchange).
And some places limit your 401k contribution to a max % (mine does at 75%).
Peggy
Footballguy
The bold is exactly what the PPT that I found says. I have to do Cobra next year because of required stock sales that messes up my MAGI. Will be able to move to the exchange in 2026.
Yep our max percentage is 75% too. That works.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Well, now I have some decisions to make. We tried to sell the company and due to a couple factors (expiring loan over our heads, hardware division losing money that nobody wanted, etc) we got lowball offers. Shake up at the PE firm and our guys are out. New ones came in and decided to cut $ and flatten the company. So I will be out. Not all bad. 7 1/2 months severance, fully paid COBRA through that time. I'll be fighting to keep some equity and a percentage of 2024 bonus. I turn 63 in March. Severance/paid COBRA runs out in June. I know I can retire based on all Monte Carlo simulations. The question is do I want to. It's that preservation mentality - do I really want to tap into anything before 65. Including insurance (wife is 2 years younger than me). I also want to help my kids out buying their first homes. Still have mortgage (low) for 20 months or so. 3 main reasons I considered keeping going until 65. I won't draw SS until I'm 70, or 67 at the earliest.
Think I'm going to put my resume out there to my network to see if there is something that would be a great fit for 18-24 months max. In the meantime, work out, play golf, travel a bit. Sort of a trial retirement while I'm getting paid. We'll see. But now really interested in this thread.
Think I'm going to put my resume out there to my network to see if there is something that would be a great fit for 18-24 months max. In the meantime, work out, play golf, travel a bit. Sort of a trial retirement while I'm getting paid. We'll see. But now really interested in this thread.
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
Congratulations? Condolences?
Sounds like you're in good shape on "your number", but might make sense to see a fee-only advisor to put together a comprehensive plan considering your goals, taxes, healthcare options, SS claiming strategy, etc. They can weigh in on how conservative or aggressive your plan might be. You mention monte carlo sims looking good, is that like 95%? If so, your plan might be really conservative and you may be better off than you think. Might be time to look at your asset allocation as well. You may want to start to optimize that for a drawdown portfolio, which could be very different than your accumulation portfolio (or not, depending on what it currently looks like).
Is consulting an option in your field?
Nugget
Footballguy
Good luck! Severance gives you a little bit of time to find the right fit. I make a couple calls a month to former colleagues and clients just to keep the network alive. Sounds like you get to be pretty selective for your next opportunity.
NutterButter
Footballguy
That's exactly what I intend on doing once I hit that point where I can retire comfortably; continuing to work as long as the position is ideal (remote, enjoyable work that's low stress) and if not just enjoying being retired until something does present itself.
Peggy
Footballguy
I say go for it. You're likely a lot better off than your "preservation mentality" is allowing you to think. No matter how much money you have you can't buy more time.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Beyond money, mental health is so critical these days and I believe it leads to longer healthier lives. I have many Seniors in my tennis groups
The gentleman who organizes our weekly 7am Sat Morning round robin w/12 guys on 3 courts playing Doubles, that guy use to run Tropical down here in South FL, shipping company
He is turning 75 next month and has his own small shipping company now that he runs right here locally in Jupiter. Guy is in the office every day by 7:30-8:00, small staff of employees.
He runs it with an investor friend from New York, this guy is from the /BrooklynBronx, Vietnam Vet, the years have not been kind but he is a work horse
And I believe it keeps him young at heart. I'm 50 and he loves to call me up and start talking business, sports, we go have beers after tennis on Sat Morn, he's active
-You want to be around to enjoy all that money you've worked so hard to build, even working 25-30 hours a week at less money and go find a company you like and believe in and want to help them and teach them and it won't feel like work at all. You'll continue to prosper, you'll keep your health including a healthy mind, there's plenty of time for golf on the weekends and part of the fun of a part time schedule is leaving the office by 1:00 some days so you can have an afternoon golf game.
I'm just encouraging you to keep working and since you likely don't need the money as much, put a plan together to do something you really enjoy.
You like golf? Try non-profit as a gift officer, they'll pay you 6-figures to go out there and rub shoulders with the donors.
But stay in the game, you're still worth a lot of $$$ until you likely are 70-75 years old. People don't get forced into retirement as much any more, hard to find good people
Mookie
Footballguy
*Sits on hands* I was up at 3:30 this morning "problem solving". I'm so ready, and contemplating an earlier exit. It's so unhealthy.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Funny. I actually dreamt about part of my job last night. A voluntary part I enjoy.
-OZ-
Footballguy
This is what we’ve been doing.
It’s pretty nice especially when the job isn’t that stressful.
Judge Smails
Footballguy
Thanks for the thoughts/comments, gents.
1) I think last time my Monte Carlo number was 99% and it should be better now. And that was for retirement at 63 (5 years ago my target was to retire at 62). Outside of 18 months or so on a low, 2.75% mortgage we have zero debt. Paying final touches on a full house remodel now. Bought me a car a year ago for cash and just need to get my wife one (cash as well). But expenses will be low.
2) I have a fiduciary advisor so I can get him to run everything. It’s AUM now. Looking to go fee only or manage entirely on my own through Vanguard or Fidelity.
3) I can be picky. And don’t necessarily have to go for top comp packages since it’s not as important to me at this stage. Less interested in equity unless a sale is planned within 18-24 months as I would likely leave, forfeiting equity. So a decent salary, bonus, health benefits and a good company/culture/leadership will be top of list. Lifestyle and low stress.
4) Have a great network in the industry and relationships with top recruiters. No bridges burned so can reach out to all. Though it takes a lot of work to get a job. Tons of reach outs, umpteen interviews etc. Have to gear up for that.
5) Already started a management company including consulting mostly for tax benefits, but now I can go for it if desired. Also can do fractional Chief Revenue Officer type work if I want. Really, I’d prefer to get healthcare so option 1 is to get a gig outside of consulting.
6) I’m confident I’ll stay busy in some way. Consulting, another gig, hopefully board work, volunteer. More time for working out, golf, travel, grandkids etc
7) I’ve had a Widowmaker and don’t have great family history so it’s all about quality time for me, and want to put myself in the best position possible for good health to maximize my trips around the sun
What’s weird to me is so many of my friends 63-70 who could retire aren’t. Maybe expensive lifestyles, I dunno. The only ones who have retired are those with pensions. Firemen, Water and Power, etc. Everyone else is still working with no end in sight. Adding to my confusion re what’s the right move for me. Not sure which way I’m going to go. While I send out resumes I am going to “act retired” through the end of the year and see how it suits me
1) I think last time my Monte Carlo number was 99% and it should be better now. And that was for retirement at 63 (5 years ago my target was to retire at 62). Outside of 18 months or so on a low, 2.75% mortgage we have zero debt. Paying final touches on a full house remodel now. Bought me a car a year ago for cash and just need to get my wife one (cash as well). But expenses will be low.
2) I have a fiduciary advisor so I can get him to run everything. It’s AUM now. Looking to go fee only or manage entirely on my own through Vanguard or Fidelity.
3) I can be picky. And don’t necessarily have to go for top comp packages since it’s not as important to me at this stage. Less interested in equity unless a sale is planned within 18-24 months as I would likely leave, forfeiting equity. So a decent salary, bonus, health benefits and a good company/culture/leadership will be top of list. Lifestyle and low stress.
4) Have a great network in the industry and relationships with top recruiters. No bridges burned so can reach out to all. Though it takes a lot of work to get a job. Tons of reach outs, umpteen interviews etc. Have to gear up for that.
5) Already started a management company including consulting mostly for tax benefits, but now I can go for it if desired. Also can do fractional Chief Revenue Officer type work if I want. Really, I’d prefer to get healthcare so option 1 is to get a gig outside of consulting.
6) I’m confident I’ll stay busy in some way. Consulting, another gig, hopefully board work, volunteer. More time for working out, golf, travel, grandkids etc
7) I’ve had a Widowmaker and don’t have great family history so it’s all about quality time for me, and want to put myself in the best position possible for good health to maximize my trips around the sun
What’s weird to me is so many of my friends 63-70 who could retire aren’t. Maybe expensive lifestyles, I dunno. The only ones who have retired are those with pensions. Firemen, Water and Power, etc. Everyone else is still working with no end in sight. Adding to my confusion re what’s the right move for me. Not sure which way I’m going to go. While I send out resumes I am going to “act retired” through the end of the year and see how it suits me
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IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I'm 10 years younger than you. If I lost my job tomorrow, I would simply hang 'em up a few years ahead of schedule. According to the math, I am fine. And every piece of advice from every "expert" I have seen is the same: people systematically wait too long to retire and more people should just pull the trigger. I very strongly suspect that those people are spot on.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
No. It's the opposite of that. I am very good at my job, to the point that it is no longer even remotely challenging. I have a new "boss" who just arrived a few months ago, so that is creating some novelty around here. Otherwise, I could really use something else to work on.
Obviously I would not trade this situation for a high-stress job, but it does tend to lead to counting down the days.
Desert_Power
Footballguy
Between the two bold statements, I don't really see much of an argument for working at all.
Peggy
Footballguy
@Ministry of Pain
A third (33%) of retirees end up going back to work. A bunch of others don't stay healthy and don't last very long in retirement. So says a book I'm reading. A lot of people struggle replacing the structure and more importantly the sense of self worth that having a job provided. I just don't think we're naturally wired for big changes like that for the most part. I imagine it could be just as difficult as not working your entire life and suddenly you had to go get a job when you're 60 years old.
I don't think that's me because I have a list of things to do that I probably won't finish before I die, but, I'm aware of it and will try to avoid the pitfall. I'm going to list out all the things I want to do, prioritized. Then wake up each day and attack them as if they are my job 5 days a week. Then join a country club and do other things 2 days a week like it's the weekend. At least in the beginning to kind of smooth the transition.
A third (33%) of retirees end up going back to work. A bunch of others don't stay healthy and don't last very long in retirement. So says a book I'm reading. A lot of people struggle replacing the structure and more importantly the sense of self worth that having a job provided. I just don't think we're naturally wired for big changes like that for the most part. I imagine it could be just as difficult as not working your entire life and suddenly you had to go get a job when you're 60 years old.
I don't think that's me because I have a list of things to do that I probably won't finish before I die, but, I'm aware of it and will try to avoid the pitfall. I'm going to list out all the things I want to do, prioritized. Then wake up each day and attack them as if they are my job 5 days a week. Then join a country club and do other things 2 days a week like it's the weekend. At least in the beginning to kind of smooth the transition.
It’s funny, because I can’t wait. I probably don't have the long list you do, but I’ve got a bunch of series I want to watch and can’t wait until I can master cooking great meals every day. I can cook pretty well, especially on the grill but I save so many recipes. Our lake lot is in a golfing community so I am looking forward to playing more, especially since I’ll be paying for it lol. Just a handful of things without digging deep to the bucket list and some of those I kind of plan on starting once we move when no kids at home will open up free time even in semi-retirement. Heck, goal #1 is to make my wife my sugar daddy so I can quit at some point!
SFBayDuck
Footballguy
I love cooking, but at the end of the work day I don't really feel like doing it. I've added like 70 recipes to my folder on NYT Cooking, have probably made less than 5 of them.
I joined a gym recently and started strength training for the first time since my 20s, mostly to build the habit now and increase strength as I move further into my 50s. I squeeze in 2-4 times a week for 45-60 minutes, but I'd like to spend an hour or two there 5+ days a week - without checking my work email and Slack between sets or sitting on a conf call in the lounge for 20 minutes before I can started with my workout (which I did yesterday).
Since moving back to Oregon I've wanted to get back to fishing, like I did a ton as a kid. I've gone 5-6 times (in 3+ years) but I haven't had the time to develop a network/friends that do so to get me back into it and show me the local spots and methods. Hell we have an aluminum drift boat sitting in the garage at my family's cabin at the coast that hasn't been in the water in 30 years, would love to get it fixed up and learn how to work that.
Speaking of the cabin, it's only 2 1/2 hours away...and we've only been twice this year (for a week each).
Got a buddy who gave me a whole set of golf clubs when we moved here. I've never golfed but seems like a nice way to spend a few hours outdoors a couple of days a month. Those clubs have been sitting in a Home Depot bucket in my garage for 3 years now.
Yesterday I cancelled my PTO and flights to Hawaii for next month, as work is just too busy right now to take the time off.
The pile of books I want to read is growing way faster than I can read them.
Was listening to a podcast yesterday about some simple (and relatively conservative) options trading strategies. That sounds pretty interesting to me! But not sure when I'd have time to educate myself enough to feel comfortable doing it.
We do a lot already and I'm pretty active. I walk the dog 90+ minutes every day, regularly hike on weekends, have been camping with buddies a couple of times this year, have been to Mexico for a week each of the last 2 years, and last year we went to between 50 and 60 events between sports, concerts, and plays. But there is so much more I want to do.
So yeah, I'm not too worried about finding enough to do in retirement!
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