The Curious Case of Eric Bieniemy (1 Viewer)

[BassNBrew]

My expectation is that if there isn't bias involved, then I'd expect the diversity of coaches to fall somewhere in between that of college and the NFL players which I think combined is the main pool of potential candidates.

Which does lower the minority percentage from that of the NFL players alone. We saw those stats back in the Rooney Rule's early days though I don't recall the exact numbers, but it was closer to 50/50 than 75/25 as the NFL is. But even expecting a level in between college and NFL ratios, where the NFL was, and still is, is so far away from that, that it's pretty tough to believe there isn't bias at hand.

I do think NFL players have a leg up on college players for more exposure to the sport and higher levels of coaching to interact with, and more contacts with decision makers. But it's true that NFL players isn't the exclusive pool from which coaches are drawn. However, the general US diversity makeup is a horrible level to cite.

All that said, I don't have a specific reason to think bias a deciding role with Bieniemy. I'm sure it was there as much as it is with anyone, but I don't think it would be the trump card in his case.

Because of the high regard for his coaching there was, I would have expected that to be enough to trump bias with some team. But then we do hear of the other issues he has and that seems likely the main issue with him. When his last head coach had to publicly address how he had to smooth over a rift between the players and EB, that's pretty telling.

It probably should fall more towards the level of college players. That's a huge pool of people than are essentially starting their careers years earlier. I personally would prefer someone with a degree who had enough self awareness that they weren't going to play as a pro and took the initiative to at least get that piece of paper during that time. Their biggest hurdle is getting an invite to the big dance as a position coach.

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

 

[doeseatplace]

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

But they don't throw darts... they just look across the table at dinner or talk to whoever they're playing an offseason round of golf with .

When Ron Rivera took the job as Commanders HC, his staff included

Vincent Rivera, nephew of Ron
Luke Del Rio, son of DC Jack
Scott Turner, son of Norv
Ken Zampese, son of Ernie

and a whole bunch of carryovers from Rivera's time in Carolina and Del Rio's multiple failed stops (including some guy named Brent Vieselmeyer, who Del Rio hired from Santa Margarita Catholic HS, because he was the bets qualified person available to coach up the Commander's terrible defensive backfield)

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

But they don't throw darts... they just look across the table at dinner or talk to whoever they're playing an offseason round of golf with .

When Ron Rivera took the job as Commanders HC, his staff included

Vincent Rivera, nephew of Ron
Luke Del Rio, son of DC Jack
Scott Turner, son of Norv
Ken Zampese, son of Ernie

and a whole bunch of carryovers from Rivera's time in Carolina and Del Rio's multiple failed stops (including some guy named Brent Vieselmeyer, who Del Rio hired from Santa Margarita Catholic HS, because he was the bets qualified person available to coach up the Commander's terrible defensive backfield)

Yeah, nepotism is a huge issue. In some cases, you could make the argument that it makes them stronger candidates (eg, Kyle Shanahan) although it's still unfair. But in many cases it clearly makes the team worse. (Also worth noting that Mike Shanahan refused to hire his son to his own staff until he had proved himself elsewhere as Texans OC. Then again, Houston's HC was Shanahan's former backup QB).

But I think the problems go beyond nepo babies. NFL teams make all kinds of mistakes in their hiring process.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

 

[pinkstapler]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

This is such a great point. It feels like it's ok/looked down on less to make a mistake that someone else already made (hiring a retread coach that doesn't pan out) rather than be the first guy over the ledge with a brand new coach.

 

[JohnnyU]

“But Washington lost its next three games, a stretch that culminated in a 40-20 loss to the previously winless Chicago Bears at FedEx Field. Facing a massive early deficit, Bieniemy called 53 consecutive passes in that game. Howell was hit 11 times and took five sacks. Several players saw that moment as a turning point.

Two weeks later, the New York Giants used blitzes and man-to-man coverage to beat up Howell, who took six more sacks and 12 hits. McLaurin, who almost never critiques coaching decisions or play calls, said he thought the Commanders could’ve countered better.”

This is all I had to hear- 53 straight passes, 11 QB hits and 5 sacks. Then 6 sacks and 12 hits.

What’s EB problem? Can’t he see something isn’t working and change his play calling? Stubborn?

 

[need2know]

“But Washington lost its next three games, a stretch that culminated in a 40-20 loss to the previously winless Chicago Bears at FedEx Field. Facing a massive early deficit, Bieniemy called 53 consecutive passes in that game. Howell was hit 11 times and took five sacks. Several players saw that moment as a turning point.

Two weeks later, the New York Giants used blitzes and man-to-man coverage to beat up Howell, who took six more sacks and 12 hits. McLaurin, who almost never critiques coaching decisions or play calls, said he thought the Commanders could’ve countered better.”

This is all I had to hear- 53 straight passes, 11 QB hits and 5 sacks. Then 6 sacks and 12 hits.

What’s EB problem? Can’t he see something isn’t working and change his play calling? Stubborn?

Now imagine him as head coach of a team. Yeah no real team thinks so either

 

[BladeRunner]

Bienemy is abrasive. People don't like working with abrasive in any industry.

Bienemy needs to look in the mirror.

Ever hear of an NFL head coach called Bill Belichick?

I have not. Tell me more about this "Bill Belichick".

 

[Yenrub]

Bieniemy paid a visit to the Chiefs before their AFC Championship Game against the Baltimore Ravens. He sat in on meetings and talked with various offensive players, including Patrick Mahomes.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...y-fired-commanders-visited-chiefs-playoff-run

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Bieniemy paid a visit to the Chiefs before their AFC Championship Game against the Baltimore Ravens. He sat in on meetings and talked with various offensive players, including Patrick Mahomes.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...y-fired-commanders-visited-chiefs-playoff-run

That's interesting, I would think it's a conflict of interest drawing a paycheck from one team and then sitting in on another before their big AFCC game
I would imagine he was in the shadows this week at Vegas or helping in any capacity the Chiefs want.

 

[rockaction]

I would think it's a conflict of interest drawing a paycheck from one team

He has already been replaced in D.C.

He has every right to go and help the Chiefs out, regardless of whether he's cashing Commanders checks or not.

How foolish.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I would think it's a conflict of interest drawing a paycheck from one team

He has already been replaced in D.C.

He has every right to go and help the Chiefs out, regardless of whether he's cashing Commanders checks or not.

How foolish.

Specifically I meant the AFCC, don't think Quinn was in place just yet when he worked with the Chiefs and was still listed as the OC on the Washington team website.
Sure, EB knew his time was coming to an end in D.C. but technically he was still their OC and no one had told him he was fired yet

-Do you understand why i said that?
I agree with you, he can walk into the stadium today dressed head to toe in KC colors
I'm just saying when he was working with them on the AFCC, think he was still employed by Washington

 

[rockaction]

I would think it's a conflict of interest drawing a paycheck from one team

He has already been replaced in D.C.

He has every right to go and help the Chiefs out, regardless of whether he's cashing Commanders checks or not.

How foolish.

Specifically I meant the AFCC, don't think Quinn was in place just yet when he worked with the Chiefs and was still listed as the OC on the Washington team website.
Sure, EB knew his time was coming to an end in D.C. but technically he was still their OC and no one had told him he was fired yet

-Do you understand why i said that?
I agree with you, he can walk into the stadium today dressed head to toe in KC colors
I'm just saying when he was working with them on the AFCC, think he was still employed by Washington

Ah, I see what you're saying.

 

[Desert_Power]

RG III.on twitter
Eric Bieniemy not being a Head Coach after 2 Super Bowls and 7 straight AFC West titles in Kansas City is STILL BAFFLING. Then he got Charlie Brown’d by people saying he needed to run his own offense and goes to a Washington staff on its last breath. He should have never left KC.

RG111 Is 100 percent wrong. EB needs to look in his own mirror. Period. It's as if Andy Reid just stands around yelling "Koolaid..OH YEAH!" on Sundays.

RG3 is never going to encourage anyone else to look in the mirror. Dude is still doing Twitter beefs about stuff ten years old. Seems like another clown who has way too much of a platform thanks to ESPN.

 

[Grahamburn]

Maybe he’s waiting for the KC job?

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

I would think it's a conflict of interest drawing a paycheck from one team

He has already been replaced in D.C.

He has every right to go and help the Chiefs out, regardless of whether he's cashing Commanders checks or not.

How foolish.

Specifically I meant the AFCC, don't think Quinn was in place just yet when he worked with the Chiefs and was still listed as the OC on the Washington team website.
Sure, EB knew his time was coming to an end in D.C. but technically he was still their OC and no one had told him he was fired yet

-Do you understand why i said that?
I agree with you, he can walk into the stadium today dressed head to toe in KC colors
I'm just saying when he was working with them on the AFCC, think he was still employed by Washington

I agree, but imagine the conversation going something like this:

"Eric, you're still employed by this organization. You shouldn't have done that."

"OK. What are you gonna do, fire me?"

 

[IvanKaramazov]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

I remember when the whole Jets/Pats/Belichick drama played out in 2000, thinking, "Why are they spending all this time fighting over a guy who was mediocre in his previous HC role?"

I have since revised that view.

 

[nightmare]

Back to college. UCLA

 

[Ilov80s]

Back to college. UCLA

As an assistant. So puzzling.

 

[Da Franchise]

Back to college. UCLA

As an assistant. So puzzling.

Don’t forget, he’s also an associate head coach.

-What is your position? -I'm an associate.

Seinfeld (1989) - S09E17 The Bookstore clip with quote -What is your position? -I'm an associate. Yarn is the best search for video clips by quote. Find the exact moment in a TV show, movie, or music video you want to share. Easily move forward or backward to get to the perfect clip.

getyarn.io

As a Washington fan I can tell you he really revealed himself last year. Whatever connection he has with the KC locker room is one thing, but he’s a terrible play caller. Hard to say how good of a motivator he is because it was an impossible situation. But as far as drawing up an offense and calling the plays for it, he sucks ***.

 

[Capella]

Kind of gasped when I saw where he was going. That’s not even a top-30 college job. Wild.

 

[Deamon]

Kind of gasped when I saw where he was going. That’s not even a top-30 college job. Wild.

I think he wants to be a head coach, and has realized he will never be one in the NFL.

 

[zamboni]

Kind of gasped when I saw where he was going. That’s not even a top-30 college job. Wild.

I think he wants to be a head coach, and has realized he will never be one in the NFL.

There aren't any more open OC jobs, so it's not like he has another option. He may indeed be migrating towards a HC job in college or perhaps hoping he can re-prove himself and get another NFL opportunity. But seems clear that until he shows something elsewhere, he's going to be viewed as having rode the coattails of Reid.

 

[Ilov80s]

Back to college. UCLA

As an assistant. So puzzling.

Don’t forget, he’s also an associate head coach.

-What is your position? -I'm an associate.

Seinfeld (1989) - S09E17 The Bookstore clip with quote -What is your position? -I'm an associate. Yarn is the best search for video clips by quote. Find the exact moment in a TV show, movie, or music video you want to share. Easily move forward or backward to get to the perfect clip.

getyarn.io

As a Washington fan I can tell you he really revealed himself last year. Whatever connection he has with the KC locker room is one thing, but he’s a terrible play caller. Hard to say how good of a motivator he is because it was an impossible situation. But as far as drawing up an offense and calling the plays for it, he sucks ***.

I didn’t really watch many Washington games but I also see Sam Howell, a below average OL, no real TE and a weak RB room. Granted they had a very good trio of WRs but that’s not enough to build an offense around. But I will take your word that the play calling was bad.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

I think it's a good move for him. His play calling was horrible. I actually think he had well designed plays. But his overuse of the pass with a 1st year QB was tough to watch. 1st among all teams at 67% pass plays, while his guy is getting sacked 5+ times per game.

I think he'll be good at UCLA. The way the system is set up, kids are mostly forced to deal with angry coaches. Professionals are a bit beyond that.

 

[need2know]

Back to college. UCLA

As an assistant. So puzzling.

Huge step back. He must be impossible to work with or something

 

[JohnnyU]

Back to college. UCLA

As an assistant. So puzzling.

Huge step back. He must be impossible to work with or something

yeah, somem' ain't right.

 

[Ilov80s]

Back to college. UCLA

As an assistant. So puzzling.

Huge step back. He must be impossible to work with or something

Yeah he has to be a real PITA or something.

 

[menobrown]

Kind of gasped when I saw where he was going. That’s not even a top-30 college job. Wild.

When the head coach left apparently a lot of money on the table to be a coordinator at another college and they gave the head coaching job to someone whose highest coaching role in his career was the RB coach I would not put being the associate HC/OC at UCLA as a top 100 college job.

Then when you factor in a college head coach left millions on the table to be coordinator in the NFL I'm going to say he's not got a top 200 job in the college or pro game.

I'd say he bet on himself and lost by taking the Commanders job but not sure he had much choice, from what I had heard last year the Chiefs were not looking to renew his contract.

 

[Da Franchise]

I think it's a good move for him. His play calling was horrible. I actually think he had well designed plays. But his overuse of the pass with a 1st year QB was tough to watch. 1st among all teams at 67% pass plays, while his guy is getting sacked 5+ times per game.

I think he'll be good at UCLA. The way the system is set up, kids are mostly forced to deal with angry coaches. Professionals are a bit beyond that.

I’m curious what you mean when you say he had well designed plays. If you mean route combinations, I’m with you. They were fine IMO. Nothing spectacular but solid at minimum. I think his offense was pretty flawed when it came to utilizing play action, under center QB snaps, and pre snap motion. They did ok with the latter with Samuel specifically but on the whole I thought it each of those three things, particularly the first two, were woefully underused.

Those types of things help disguise the plays and keep defenses honest, which would have helped keep the rush off Howell some. He really did him no favors on top of the comically high pass rate given the players he had to work with. I don’t necessarily object to the pass rate for a team like KC, for example, but it was just idiotic to put Howell in that position. Not to go overboard defending Howell or anything. I saw a clip of each of his INTs this week and I’d say the majority weren’t due to pressure so much as Howell being careless or inaccurate.

And as you say, EB was horrible as a play caller on top of it all. Defenses seemed to know exactly what was coming and if I recall correctly some players alluded to that in interviews.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

I think it's a good move for him. His play calling was horrible. I actually think he had well designed plays. But his overuse of the pass with a 1st year QB was tough to watch. 1st among all teams at 67% pass plays, while his guy is getting sacked 5+ times per game.

I think he'll be good at UCLA. The way the system is set up, kids are mostly forced to deal with angry coaches. Professionals are a bit beyond that.

I’m curious what you mean when you say he had well designed plays. If you mean route combinations, I’m with you. They were fine IMO. Nothing spectacular but solid at minimum. I think his offense was pretty flawed when it came to utilizing play action, under center QB snaps, and pre snap motion. They did ok with the latter with Samuel specifically but on the whole I thought it each of those three things, particularly the first two, were woefully underused.

Those types of things help disguise the plays and keep defenses honest, which would have helped keep the rush off Howell some. He really did him no favors on top of the comically high pass rate given the players he had to work with. I don’t necessarily object to the pass rate for a team like KC, for example, but it was just idiotic to put Howell in that position. Not to go overboard defending Howell or anything. I saw a clip of each of his INTs this week and I’d say the majority weren’t due to pressure so much as Howell being careless or inaccurate.

And as you say, EB was horrible as a play caller on top of it all. Defenses seemed to know exactly what was coming and if I recall correctly some players alluded to that in interviews.

Yes, the bolded. For passing I really liked his route combinations being at different depths. I thought it created nice passing lanes and yardage came in chunks. Howell started off finding those mid level routes fairly easily. But if you call the same play 10 times a game with only a slight wrinkle, the D will figure it out. To me that is what set Howell back, along with no run game or tight end. He didn't just get worse. The D took away his favorite routes and the offensive schemes kinda let him down. It's like EB read chapter 1-3 of Reid's book. Then lost chapters 4-10.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I really appreciate those that found this thread so we can keep a watch on this guy's arc/narrative

-I don't want to walk on people who posted or challenge their ideas and feelings about this guy. I was curious why things are not working out, i never said I had the answers
Lot of good posts in here from those who might have rooted for a team he was a coach or part of.
I'm guilty of taking a stance sometimes and not having the ability to back off...I hope that will inspire others to do likewise and not just pound down.

Cheers!

 

[SeniorVBDStudent]

Bienemy is abrasive. People don't like working with abrasive in any industry.

Bienemy needs to look in the mirror.

Ever hear of an NFL head coach called Bill Belichick?

They're both obnoxious, but Belichick built cult-like loyalty in the players who played in New England. Bienemy seems to lack the ability to instill in players a willingness to let him coach them. This is not a condemnation of the man...it's rare to be a demanding coach and still demand respect and loyalty. When you can't command respect and loyalty, you get called abrasive behind your back. And then you get fired when an NFL retread comes to town.

 

[TripItUp]

Bienemy is such an alpha I can see college head coach working out way better than NFL OC or HC.

He can be the big fish in his own pond.

 

[FarFromHome]

Fired today. His offense ranked 126th among 134 FBS schools in points per game and 117th in offensive yards per game. Gotta sting a little. What's his next move?

 

[Snotbubbles]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

 

[Chaka]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

He did?

 

[Chaka]

I think it's possible that EB isn't very good at his job.

 

[BLOCKED_PUNT]

I think it's possible that EB isn't very good at his job.

I knew this as soon as he failed in wash.

 

[FantasyGuru24]

He should go back to KC in a consultant role .. Similar to what Saleh is doing with the Pack.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Fired today. His offense ranked 126th among 134 FBS schools in points per game and 117th in offensive yards per game. Gotta sting a little. What's his next move?

Obviously his Offense is just too complex for the college athlete, needs to return to the NFL immediately to work with real professionals

 

[Snotbubbles]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

He did?

Yeah fired by the Cleveland Browns and New England Patriots.

 

[Chaka]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

He did?

Yeah fired by the Cleveland Browns and New England Patriots.

Okay, he failed with the Patriots. Sure thing.

 

[travdogg]

I think it's possible that EB isn't very good at his job.

He's a RB coach, that's it, its always been it. His role in KC was to agree with Andy Reid.

 

[Bigboy10182000]

Fired today. His offense ranked 126th among 134 FBS schools in points per game and 117th in offensive yards per game. Gotta sting a little. What's his next move?

To think people were clamoring for him to be an NFL HC is so laughable now. Things like this should humble a lot of people.

 

[Snotbubbles]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

He did?

Yeah fired by the Cleveland Browns and New England Patriots.

Okay, he failed with the Patriots. Sure thing.

Define fail then.

 

[Chaka]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

He did?

Yeah fired by the Cleveland Browns and New England Patriots.

Okay, he failed with the Patriots. Sure thing.

Define fail then.

Fail /fāl/ intransitive verb -

1) To prove deficient or lacking; perform ineffectively or inadequately.

2) To be unsuccessful.

3) Nothing representing any part of Bill Belichick's tenure with the New England Patriots.

 

[Snotbubbles]

First of all, a reminder that the last time there was a thread on the Rooney Rule, it got moved to the PSF, which is now shut down. So let's make sure we don't get too far off topic.

The only thing I'll say is that anyone who thinks the current hiring process is anything close to a meritocracy, and that fixes handed down from the league office move us away from that platonic ideal, is kidding themselves. Honestly, the league could mandate that teams pick their coaches by throwing darts at a dartboard and we might see better results

This is true.

And while there might be outright discrimination (particularly based on race - as opposed to simply familiarity) happening, it seems that it's more like many owners and/or front office guys simply aren't very good at their jobs which leads them to play it safe and familiar. The market punishes this when they hire retread failures instead of taking a chance on new talent.

That is, again, why it's so gratifying to see someone new being given a chance and succeeding. Risk taking sometimes comes with reward, in other words, and hopefully the dam is breaking so that we don't have to see guys like my favorite snark target Mike McCarthy in the league much longer.

They're only called "retreads" when they fail a second time. You never hear Bill Belichick or Andy Reid referred to as a retreads.

Belichick failed twiced.

He did?

Yeah fired by the Cleveland Browns and New England Patriots.

Okay, he failed with the Patriots. Sure thing.

Define fail then.

Fail /fāl/ intransitive verb -

1) To prove deficient or lacking; perform ineffectively or inadequately.

2) To be unsuccessful.

3) Nothing representing any part of Bill Belichick's tenure with the New England Patriots.

Other than the fact he was fired for being unsuccessful?