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the history of a Javon Walker injury (1 Viewer)

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Footballguy
I am looking for a list of WR's that suffered as close to the same type of injury as Javon Walker and how they performed the following year after the injury?

Will there be a two year wait to see a full recovery or can we expect JW will be catching deep balls for TD's on week 1? Or do we have to wait untile sometime late in the seaon before he gets complete confidence back in the knee?

 
I am looking for a list of WR's that suffered as close to the same type of injury as Javon Walker and how they performed the following year after the injury?

Will there be a two year wait to see a full recovery or can we expect JW will be catching deep balls for TD's on week 1? Or do we have to wait untile sometime late in the seaon before he gets complete confidence back in the knee?
I know Rice had an ACL tear and came back in a ridiculously short amount of time (less than a year). Nowhere near the time Walker has had.He was immediately a factor upon his return and did catch a TD that first game back.

Unfortunately he broke his knee cap on that TD catch. The repaired ACL remained solid, but it was specuclated that his knee cap broke, as Rice had come back too early. Tiny holes are drilled into the knee cap to attach the ACL and some feel that it was not structually sound.

With the time Walker has had, I don't think that will be a concern for him.

 
Just wanted to add, that this year will be a good stepping stone for understanding how well QBs and WRs recover from an ACL injury.

We all know the two year rule for RBs, but there is no such rule for other offensive positions because this type of injury has been more rare for them.

As usual, I'm taking a more conservative approach since that tends to be my nature, but I won't be totally surprised if one of those three light it up this year.

 
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Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.

 
Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.
Much like Walker. I highly doubt he bumps Rod Smith to the #2 role in Denver. Good comparison actually. I think Walker has more talent than Engram, but he's going into a similar situation. It took Walker 3 seasons to digest the playbook in GB, it's not like he's going to just be able to learn Denver's in a summer.

 
Just wanted to add, that this year will be a good stepping stone for understanding how well QBs and WRs recover from an ACL injury.

We all know the two year rule for RBs, but there is no such rule for other offensive positions because this type of injury has been more rare for them.

As usual, I'm taking a more conservative approach since that tends to be my nature, but I won't be totally surprised if one of those three light it up this year.
Well if you're going to add stuff to this thread, you might want to correct your first post KRS.Rice did not do Ok when he first came back from his ACL reconstruction.

He was not able to make it through the first game back. He had to be shelved the rest of the year with a busted knee cap.

Of course, that injury was probably a result of him trying to come back too soon.

 
and the jury is still out on Braylon Edwards. didn't he have the same injury? if so that's 2 in one year and we can't even think of hardly any other comparisons. weird.

-orphan

 
Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.
Much like Walker. I highly doubt he bumps Rod Smith to the #2 role in Denver. Good comparison actually. I think Walker has more talent than Engram, but he's going into a similar situation. It took Walker 3 seasons to digest the playbook in GB, it's not like he's going to just be able to learn Denver's in a summer.
I don't see Engram & Walker's situations, as being all that similar.K. Robinson (39) & Engram (29) divided the #2 targets in Seattle.

Walker is definitely the clear cut #2 WR in Denver (I don't see Lelie eating up many of Walker's targets) if not the #1B WR.

 
Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.
Much like Walker. I highly doubt he bumps Rod Smith to the #2 role in Denver. Good comparison actually. I think Walker has more talent than Engram, but he's going into a similar situation. It took Walker 3 seasons to digest the playbook in GB, it's not like he's going to just be able to learn Denver's in a summer.
Along with the injury this is my main reason for staying away this year. Also, work ethic is involved in Rehab. I'm willing to bet J. Rice was more concerned with rehab and doing things right.

Also, a couple of months ago, when he first went to Denver. Doctors scoped his knee again. If h was healing correctly and everything was good, why open him back up? That only takes more time to heal the knee.

B. Edwards did have the same thing, and is scheduled to come back after the bye week in week 6.

 
and the jury is still out on Braylon Edwards. didn't he have the same injury? if so that's 2 in one year and we can't even think of hardly any other comparisons. weird.

-orphan
3 in one year... Mark Bradley
 
Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.
Much like Walker. I highly doubt he bumps Rod Smith to the #2 role in Denver. Good comparison actually. I think Walker has more talent than Engram, but he's going into a similar situation. It took Walker 3 seasons to digest the playbook in GB, it's not like he's going to just be able to learn Denver's in a summer.
Along with the injury this is my main reason for staying away this year. Also, work ethic is involved in Rehab. I'm willing to bet J. Rice was more concerned with rehab and doing things right.

Also, a couple of months ago, when he first went to Denver. Doctors scoped his knee again. If h was healing correctly and everything was good, why open him back up? That only takes more time to heal the knee.

B. Edwards did have the same thing, and is scheduled to come back after the bye week in week 6.
Edwards also injured his knee much later in the season than Walker. Recovery time frame for both players, is actually just about the same.Learning the Denver play book is probably the main concern, as Walker is supposedly not the sharpest tool in the shed.

 
Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.
Much like Walker. I highly doubt he bumps Rod Smith to the #2 role in Denver. Good comparison actually. I think Walker has more talent than Engram, but he's going into a similar situation. It took Walker 3 seasons to digest the playbook in GB, it's not like he's going to just be able to learn Denver's in a summer.
Along with the injury this is my main reason for staying away this year. Also, work ethic is involved in Rehab. I'm willing to bet J. Rice was more concerned with rehab and doing things right.

Also, a couple of months ago, when he first went to Denver. Doctors scoped his knee again. If h was healing correctly and everything was good, why open him back up? That only takes more time to heal the knee.

B. Edwards did have the same thing, and is scheduled to come back after the bye week in week 6.
Edwards also injured his knee much later in the season than Walker. Recovery time frame for both players, is actually just about the same.Learning the Denver play book is probably the main concern, as Walker is supposedly not the sharpest tool in the shed.
:goodposting: Correct, i should have added that with Edwards.
 
Bobby Engram is another.

Tore up his knee in Chicago game 3 of the 2000 season then went to the Seahags in 2001 and did OK.

His numbers in Seattle don't look good, compared to his last full season in Chicago, but that's because he was Chicago's #1 or #1A WR in 1999 and went to being the Seahags #2 or #2B WR in 2001.
Much like Walker. I highly doubt he bumps Rod Smith to the #2 role in Denver. Good comparison actually. I think Walker has more talent than Engram, but he's going into a similar situation. It took Walker 3 seasons to digest the playbook in GB, it's not like he's going to just be able to learn Denver's in a summer.
Along with the injury this is my main reason for staying away this year. Also, work ethic is involved in Rehab. I'm willing to bet J. Rice was more concerned with rehab and doing things right.

Also, a couple of months ago, when he first went to Denver. Doctors scoped his knee again. If h was healing correctly and everything was good, why open him back up? That only takes more time to heal the knee.

B. Edwards did have the same thing, and is scheduled to come back after the bye week in week 6.
http://www.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_4084083
What if ...

- Javon Walker's right knee holds up?

- The wideout has another Pro Bowl season?

- He is just what the Broncos need to succeed?

By Jim Armstrong

Denver Post Staff Writer

Baseball, Branch Rickey once said, is a game of inches. Then there's football, the game of ifs.

Take Javon Walker, for instance. If he's healthy, he's just what the Broncos need, a big, physical wideout who can stretch the field on one play and make a tough third-down catch on another. If his right knee holds up, he could become the Broncos' most significant offseason acquisition of the post-Elway era. If he's the player he was with the Packers, he could be the difference between the Broncos making the playoffs and winning the Super Bowl.

If, if, if.

There's no way around it. When you blow out your anterior cruciate ligament, you become a questionable commodity. The good news for the Broncos is, while Walker's future is uncertain, the exclamation points following his name far outnumber the question marks.

"We think he's one of the top receivers in the league," Broncos coach Mike Shanahan said. "If he's the top one, time will tell."

Whoa, whoa, whoa. The top one, as in the best in the business, the head of the table, the top of the food chain?

"He's got a chance," Shanahan said. "We wouldn't have signed him unless we had a lot of confidence in him. You don't give up a second-round draft choice unless you think a guy is going to be on your team for a while."

In late April, Walker couldn't fully extend his right leg. With the first workout of Camp Shanahan 2006 scheduled for Friday at Dove Valley, the Broncos are confident Walker will be healthy and productive. But the top wideout in the league? Walker says he can get there.

"That's definite," Walker said. "My Pro Bowl year (2004), I'm trying to get back to that level. I'm not going to live on the hype. That's why I'm here every day working. I can't let what I've done in the past dictate what I'm going to do. I want to come out and be better than I was. I want to give people a chance to say, 'You know what, that was a great move."'

This much is certain before he breaks his first sweat in training camp: Acquiring Walker was a move the Broncos didn't hesitate one second to make. When the Packers ceded to Walker's trade demands and made him available for the 37th pick in the draft, Shanahan and his staff jumped at the opportunity.

"How they pulled that off, I don't know," said Mike Heimerdinger, the Broncos' de facto offensive coordinator. "I was as shocked as everybody else. We all had a vote and it was unanimous. I was like, 'Heck, yeah.' It was kind of a no-brainer."

Heimerdinger was the Broncos' receivers coach from 1995-99, when he oversaw the development of Rod Smith and Ed McCaffrey into one of the NFL's elite pass-catching tandems. McCaffrey caught 101 passes and Smith 100 in 2000, a production level Heimerdinger said he believes Walker and Smith can match.

"You would hope so," Heimerdinger said. "I think you can do that. Because of our run game, we're always going to get pretty good matchups with the wide receivers because people are going to play an eight-man front. That's what you want, one-on-ones. We should be able to get those matchups, so I'm hoping those guys can get those kinds of numbers."

Smith's 100 receptions in 2000 remain the second-highest total of his career. Walker caught 89 passes with Green Bay in 2004 after beginning his NFL career with 23 catches in 2002 and 41 in 2003.

He never had a chance to hit the 100 mark last season, tearing up his knee in the Packers' season opener.

Numbers don't lie

Now for the numbers inside the numbers, the ones that suggest a healthy Walker could be the most complete package the Broncos have had at wide receiver. If he's the same player he was before the injury, he would be more explosive than Smith and more physical than Ashley Lelie, the Broncos' other starting wideout last season.

Walker caught nine touchdown passes in his second season and 12 in his breakout year of 2004. Smith had six touchdown catches last season, Lelie one. Then there's the matter of third-down conversions, by far the Broncos' most vexing issue in recent seasons. Denver finished 22nd in the league last season in third-down conversions at 36.2 percent. And that number gets uglier when you take a closer look at the Broncos' third-down production.

They ranked 27th in third-down conversions through the air, converting 30.6 percent compared with the Colts, who led the league at 48.6 percent.

"The stats don't lie," Smith said. "Our third downs were horrible. When we won the Super Bowl, we were like one or two in the league in third downs. That's how you get more points. That's how you stay on the field. That's how you help your defense. ... With a guy like Javon on our team, it helps us. It gives us another weapon."

Smith made 16 catches on third down last season, 12 for first downs. Lelie, who is expected to continue his holdout into training camp, had nine third-down catches, eight of which moved the chains. Walker? He caught 31 balls on third down in 2004, 24 going for first downs.

Force is with Walker

The obvious question: How big a force would a healthy Walker be for the Broncos on third down?

"He's a force on any down," said Ray Sherman, Walker's receivers coach in Green Bay.

"I love the guy. He's got special skills. Trust me, you put the ball in his area and he's going to make the play. That's the kind of guy he is. He's a physical guy. You'll see."

He's a physical guy who can go over the middle and also get open downfield. Oh, and did we mention Walker's run blocking was one of his most attractive attributes in the eyes of Broncos' coaches? It's called the complete package - if he's healthy.

How many receivers in the NFL can match Walker's versatility? Sherman came up with three: Terrell Owens, Donald Driver and Steve Smith. There may be a few more, but you get the point. The list can be knocked off before Maurice Clarett finishes his next 40-yard dash.

More numbers to consider: Walker caught 14 passes of 25-plus yards in 2004. That's one fewer than Smith and Lelie combined for last season. Touchdown catches? You want to talk touchdown catches? Walker's 21 touchdown catches during the 2003-04 seasons were more than any Broncos receiver has caught in back-to-back seasons in franchise history.

Like we said, the man makes for exclamation points. And he's only 27, meaning Walker has plenty of time to evolve into the Broncos' go-to guy. Smith has filled that role admirably for much of his career, but at 36 he'll have to pass the torch sooner, not later.

Marvels of medicine

Sounds like a plan, but it comes with strings attached. Or should we say ligaments repaired?

Everyone is saying all the right things when it comes to Walker's comeback from surgery. But since no one knows what fate has in store for him, let's stick to the facts about his damaged right knee.

First, thanks to the wonders of medical technology, the surgery wasn't as invasive as it would have been 20 years ago. Walker has a small arthroscopic puncture on the knee, something he joked about during a recent photo shoot for The Post.

"My other knee looks worse," he said.

The advancements in ACL surgery were a major factor in Shanahan's decision to give up an early second-round pick for Walker. If the injury had occurred in a previous generation, Walker's future would have been much more uncertain.

"No question about it," Shanahan said. "Most of the guys today who have ACLs early in the season come back even stronger from the year before. A lot depends on the seriousness of the surgery. Some of these ACLs are completely blown and others are just a regular tear. Terrell Davis, for example, had a much different ACL than Javon. It was much worse."

Fact is, most NFL teams have a handful of key players who've had ACL surgeries at some point in their careers. The Broncos' list includes, among others, Smith, Matt Lepsis, Tom Nalen and Ian Gold. Then there's John Elway, who played 16 NFL seasons without an ACL in his left knee.

Rehabilitation key

None of that guarantees a successful comeback for Walker, of course, but all signs point to a big season in his first year in Denver. And if you need more proof, check out Walker's leg. He won't be wearing a knee brace, a decision he came to after consulting with, among others, longtime Broncos trainer Steve Antonopulos.

"In today's rehabilitative process, the mind-set is you don't need one," Antonopulos said. "The whole process is much different than what it used to be. He's at a phase where he'll have to go through some mental stuff, but he's doing very well with that. Every day he seems to be better, less tentative. The bottom line is we want him to be able to participate 100 percent by the first game."

As encouraged as the Broncos are by Walker's progress, it isn't like he's been ahead of the healing curve from Day One. To the contrary. Dr. Walt Lowe, the Texans' team surgeon, performed the surgery last October. Since Walker knew he was leaving the Packers, he stayed in Houston to rehab before returning to Florida State in January.

"He was working out on his own," Antonopulos said. "He thought he could just go back and do it. He had some soreness and stiffness, so he went back to Dr. Lowe in March and had a scope to clean out some scar tissue. It was during that time frame where he was traveling to different NFL teams, too."

When the Broncos made the deal, the message from their medical staff was loud and clear.

"Once we got him, the first thing we said was, 'You're going to come here right now, next week,"' Antonopulos said. "When he came to us, he wasn't able to get full extension on the leg. Gosh, you'd want that the first few weeks after surgery."

And so it was that Walker put his fate in the hands of the Broncos' medical staff. It was during that process when Antonopulos became more convinced that Walker will rediscover his Pro Bowl ways.

"He's got a great attitude," Antonopulos said. "He's done all we've asked of him. Everything psychologically and physically is geared toward that first game. That's the goal he and I have talked about from Day One, and he's followed it every inch of the way."

Walker will be relegated to one daily practice during camp, but expects to be ready for the season opener Sept. 10 at St. Louis. The difficult part, he said, is trying to be cautious and methodical at a time when he's so excited to be joining a team that fell one game short of the Super Bowl.

"Making plays on the field doesn't just happen," Walker said. "It's because you're part of a good organization. I'm excited just thinking about the caliber of the team, where they were a year ago, the new acquisitions....They fell one game short last year. Hopefully we can win that one game, go to the Super Bowl and win it."
I took the liberty of bolding the parts I found interesting.
 
As encouraged as the Broncos are by Walker's progress, it isn't like he's been ahead of the healing curve from Day One. To the contrary. Dr. Walt Lowe, the Texans' team surgeon, performed the surgery last October. Since Walker knew he was leaving the Packers, he stayed in Houston to rehab before returning to Florida State in January.

"He was working out on his own," Antonopulos said. "He thought he could just go back and do it. He had some soreness and stiffness, so he went back to Dr. Lowe in March and had a scope to clean out some scar tissue. It was during that time frame where he was traveling to different NFL teams, too."

When the Broncos made the deal, the message from their medical staff was loud and clear.

"Once we got him, the first thing we said was, 'You're going to come here right now, next week,"' Antonopulos said. "When he came to us, he wasn't able to get full extension on the leg. Gosh, you'd want that the first few weeks after surgery."
:Redflag:Having surgery in October, scope in March, and still not being able to fully extend his knee in April is not a good sign of a proper rehab.

 
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How many receivers in the NFL can match Walker's versatility? Sherman came up with three: Terrell Owens, Donald Driver and Steve Smith. There may be a few more, but you get the point.
:confused:
Why? He's simply talking about versatility, not ability. If he were talking about the proper use of board features and mentioned you as a versatile user, that would be correct. If he said you were a talented user of board features such as the color tags, that would cause me to use the :unsure: .
 
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As encouraged as the Broncos are by Walker's progress, it isn't like he's been ahead of the healing curve from Day One. To the contrary. Dr. Walt Lowe, the Texans' team surgeon, performed the surgery last October. Since Walker knew he was leaving the Packers, he stayed in Houston to rehab before returning to Florida State in January.

"He was working out on his own," Antonopulos said. "He thought he could just go back and do it. He had some soreness and stiffness, so he went back to Dr. Lowe in March and had a scope to clean out some scar tissue. It was during that time frame where he was traveling to different NFL teams, too."

When the Broncos made the deal, the message from their medical staff was loud and clear.

"Once we got him, the first thing we said was, 'You're going to come here right now, next week,"' Antonopulos said. "When he came to us, he wasn't able to get full extension on the leg. Gosh, you'd want that the first few weeks after surgery."
:Redflag:Having surgery in October, scope in March, and still not being able to fully extend his knee in April is not a goos sign of a proper rehab.
Read the rest of the article. It says Walker was way behind schedule, but he's since gotten back on it.
 
As encouraged as the Broncos are by Walker's progress, it isn't like he's been ahead of the healing curve from Day One. To the contrary. Dr. Walt Lowe, the Texans' team surgeon, performed the surgery last October. Since Walker knew he was leaving the Packers, he stayed in Houston to rehab before returning to Florida State in January.

"He was working out on his own," Antonopulos said. "He thought he could just go back and do it. He had some soreness and stiffness, so he went back to Dr. Lowe in March and had a scope to clean out some scar tissue. It was during that time frame where he was traveling to different NFL teams, too."

When the Broncos made the deal, the message from their medical staff was loud and clear.

"Once we got him, the first thing we said was, 'You're going to come here right now, next week,"' Antonopulos said. "When he came to us, he wasn't able to get full extension on the leg. Gosh, you'd want that the first few weeks after surgery."
:Redflag:Having surgery in October, scope in March, and still not being able to fully extend his knee in April is not a goos sign of a proper rehab.
Read the rest of the article. It says Walker was way behind schedule, but he's since gotten back on it.
I read the rest of the article and thought I was reading some cheesy romance novel!
And so it was that Walker put his fate in the hands of the Broncos' medical staff. It was during that process when Antonopulos became more convinced that Walker will rediscover his Pro Bowl ways.
:yucky:

It amazes me how doctors in Denver are much better than they are in Houston.

Note to self: If I ever want to have surgery, go to Denver. So, I can put my fate in the hands of real professionals and I may be able to go back to my beer drinking ways.

This article must have came from the Denverpost!

:rolleyes:

 
It amazes me how doctors in Denver are much better than they are in Houston.

Note to self: If I ever want to have surgery, go to Denver. So, I can put my fate in the hands of real professionals and I may be able to go back to my beer drinking ways.

This article must have came from the Denverpost!

:rolleyes:
I don't think that this was saying that Denver's doctors are better than Houston's. I think it was saying that, before, Walker was rehabbing outside of the watchful eye of a medical staff, and now he is back under the watchful eye of a medical staff. He wasn't working out in Houston under the supervision of those doctors that performed the surgeries, he was working out in Arizona on his own.
 
I just like the unnecessary dig at Clarett... :excited:

Bitter Broncos writer is starting to sound a lot like bitter Ohio State fan...

 
Edwards also injured his knee much later in the season than Walker. Recovery time frame for both players, is actually just about the same.

Learning the Denver play book is probably the main concern, as Walker is supposedly not the sharpest tool in the shed.

Of course he isn't, he went to FSU

(God that feels gooood). :hifive:

 
How many receivers in the NFL can match Walker's versatility? Sherman came up with three: Terrell Owens, Donald Driver and Steve Smith. There may be a few more, but you get the point.
:confused:
Why? He's simply talking about versatility, not ability. If he were talking about the proper use of board features and mentioned you as a versatile user, that would be correct. If he said you were a talented user of board features such as the color tags, that would cause me to use the :unsure: .
my point is...out of all the WR's in the league, he picks Donald Driver to compare to Owens and Smith? Heck...I don't even know how verstile Owens and Smith are. They catch passes. How versatile is that??
 
How many receivers in the NFL can match Walker's versatility? Sherman came up with three: Terrell Owens, Donald Driver and Steve Smith. There may be a few more, but you get the point.
:confused:
Why? He's simply talking about versatility, not ability. If he were talking about the proper use of board features and mentioned you as a versatile user, that would be correct. If he said you were a talented user of board features such as the color tags, that would cause me to use the :unsure: .
my point is...out of all the WR's in the league, he picks Donald Driver to compare to Owens and Smith? Heck...I don't even know how verstile Owens and Smith are. They catch passes. How versatile is that??
Ray Sherman was Driver's and Walker's position coach in Green Bay. That's probably why he mentioned driver. Smith and Owens are slam dunks. Versatility I think means, route running, blocking, catching, speed, going over the middle, down the seams, etc.
 
:yucky:

It amazes me how doctors in Denver are much better than they are in Houston.

Note to self: If I ever want to have surgery, go to Denver. So, I can put my fate in the hands of real professionals and I may be able to go back to my beer drinking ways.

This article must have came from the Denverpost!

:rolleyes:
If Terrell Davis had HOU doctors he would have been a double amputee. That's what my sources have told me.
 

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