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The Russia Investigation: Trump Pardons Flynn (8 Viewers)

Wait a sec.  Did I just read this?

According to Chris Wylie, a former Cambridge Analytica employee who spoke with the Post, Bannon oversaw Cambridge Analytica’s 2014 effort “to collect troves of Facebook data as part of an ambitious program to build detailed profiles of millions of American voters.” That effort included testing “of anti-establishment messages that later would emerge as central themes in President Trump’s campaign speeches” — including “drain the swamp” and “deep state.”
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link

 
Koya said:
Best way to hold them accountable is to ignore known purveyors of outright lies. It's like the Simpsons episode where the mascots came to life... their entire sense of being is to engage you in a one sided affair where they have zero desire to pursue or admit truth not engage in any legitimate conversation.

So let's not legitimize their trolling / trolling tactics by responding and let them suck wind. 

Such an effect would also have an effect to make it more fruitful when engaging in Trump fans that at least don't continually spout constant lies, as the behavior of those who do so here merely reflect that much worse on Trump supporters in general (how can I not lump these guys in with others here in these boards and in real life when they play off one another and influence overall perception of his base... quite negatively mind you.  Maybe these folks are double agents sent to make Trump supporters look that much less intelligent and/or willing and able to hold a legitimate and intectually honest discussion?)
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I have the opposite take. Bludgeon these people with facts until they relent. If its trolling, it loses its luster. If its in earnest, the facts eventually will drown out the ignorance. But letting it go unchallenged, ignoring it, is pretty much how we got to Trump as President of the U.S.

 
Bucky86 said:
WOOOOOOW!!!!!!!!!!

Investigate Russia‏ @InvestigateRU

EXCLUSIVE: Fired FBI official authorized criminal probe of Sessions, sources say - ABC News - http://abcn.ws/2puXIwt via @ABC
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McCabe oversaw a federal criminal investigation into whether Sessions lacked candor when testifying before Congress about contacts with Russian operatives,
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Man, I thought I couldn't be amazed.

 
Now Sessions pulls a Comey firing so he can't be investigated?  They just need to somehow pause time to stop this criminal enterprise from committing more crimes or the Mueller probe is never going to end.  It just keeps mushrooming...

 
Gr00vus said:
I have the opposite take. Bludgeon these people with facts until they relent. If its trolling, it loses its luster. If its in earnest, the facts eventually will drown out the ignorance. But letting it go unchallenged, ignoring it, is pretty much how we got to Trump as President of the U.S.
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I do t suggest we ignore it en masse, all the time.

But its apparent in a semi open but contained community like this that some people have no desire and/or ability to engage in fruitful discussion. The result is a lot of just crap that's repeated day after day. Want to refresh the convo ever few weeks for anyone new? Knock yourself out.

I just believe that as part of the STRATEGY for folks that spread such lies is the disintegrate the conversation itself... if we are talking endless loops and giving them the stage it encourages more of their behavior, which then further consfuses things, convolutes legit points of dialogue and destroys the ability to even have enriched and educated conversations. 

If they become trees falling in a forest, let the debate become whether or not anyone even heard it on the first place rather than discuss how gravity doesn't exist and had no role in why the tree fell.

 
What is the thinking about how McCabe lacked candor? Did he not offer up that Comey was the one who authorized the FBI to release info to the WSJ? They didn't say that McCabe lied, so maybe he wasn't asked? If it is true, then didn't Comey lie under oath during questioning about anonymous sources?

 
Another example of selective outrage:

You go all-in on the opinion that some police officers wake up in the morning and go to work with the sole intent of killing minorities.....but....you cannot (or will not) accept the fact that a few FBI agents (mostly, those at the top) have chosen to "weaponize" their political beliefs and use their power to help leaders of their chosen political party.

Why is one so feasible to you (and likely) and the other is so unbelievable?

 
Opie said:
Another example of selective outrage:

You go all-in on the opinion that some police officers wake up in the morning and go to work with the sole intent of killing minorities.....but....you cannot (or will not) accept the fact that a few FBI agents (mostly, those at the top) have chosen to "weaponize" their political beliefs and use their power to help leaders of their chosen political party.

Why is one so feasible to you (and likely) and the other is so unbelievable?
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good grief.  Dial down the hyperbole about 11 notches.

 
For no reason in particular, here are the chosen political parties of a few relevant players: 

Comey - Republican

Mueller - Republican

Rosenstein - Republican

McCabe - Republican

I would be interested to hear how the leaders of the Republican party benefited when these individuals weaponized their political beliefs and used their power to help those same Republican leaders. 

:popcorn:

 
proninja said:
My ignore list is getting a little longer today
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Thank you. I know the argument for engaging is they're not trolls they're just idiots unwilling to hold intellectually honest discussion, but that's mostly a distinction without any difference. Differing viewpoints are important...but when differences between a partisan hack and paid trollbot become nonexistent, just do the board a favor and expand your ignore list so they can shriek in the shadows. 

 
jamny said:
What is the thinking about how McCabe lacked candor? Did he not offer up that Comey was the one who authorized the FBI to release info to the WSJ? They didn't say that McCabe lied, so maybe he wasn't asked? If it is true, then didn't Comey lie under oath during questioning about anonymous sources?
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My hunch is that they asked him something like "do you know if Mueller is looking into Trump Org" and he said "no" or "I don't know," when he may have known that was going on or was going to happen.

 
The Indestructible said:
For no reason in particular, here are the chosen political parties of a few relevant players: 

Comey - Republican

Mueller - Republican

Rosenstein - Republican

McCabe - Republican

I would be interested to hear how the leaders of the Republican party benefited when these individuals weaponized their political beliefs and used their power to help those same Republican leaders. 

:popcorn:
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But they aren’t real republicans because they won’t show loyalty to Trump by break the law and do his bidding.  He’s used to guys like Cohen that just solve his problems with money and threats. This is a different world than he’s used to but he’s not smart enough to realize it 

 
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Gr00vus said:
jamny said:
What is the thinking about how McCabe lacked candor? Did he not offer up that Comey was the one who authorized the FBI to release info to the WSJ? They didn't say that McCabe lied, so maybe he wasn't asked? If it is true, then didn't Comey lie under oath during questioning about anonymous sources?
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My hunch is that they asked him something like "do you know if Mueller is looking into Trump Org" and he said "no" or "I don't know," when he may have known that was going on or was going to happen.
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Well then that would be a lie. I'm going by lacking candor being withholding info. I'm also assuming it had to do with the info given to the WSJ but I guess it could be totally unrelated.

 
Mr. Nader has been granted immunity in a deal for his cooperation with the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, according to people familiar with the matter, and his relationship with Mr. Broidy may also offer clues to the direction of that inquiry.
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High on the agenda of the two men — George Nader, a political adviser to the de facto ruler of the U.A.E., and Elliott Broidy, the deputy finance chairman of the Republican National Committee — was pushing the White House to remove Secretary of State Rex W. Tillerson, backing confrontational approaches to Iran and Qatar and repeatedly pressing the president to meet privately outside the White House with the leader of U.A.E.
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- We're all behind, Elliott Broidy has hardly been discussed here.

 
Dinsy Ejotuz said:
This is a good article from John Schindler.
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I really think he hits it square on the matryoshka with this point about ideology. I totally agree. I wish liberals and conservatives alike would see this point, but the horrible thing is that it really seems it appeals to US conservatives. We haven't heard it here for a while since most Trumpites fled for the internet hinterlands but I can still recall the claims that the US & Russia had shared interests when it comes to 'saving western civilization,' which of course is solely defined by ethnicity and religion. TBH for anyone listening to tones and noises Trump's speech in Poland was very much about that.

 
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Days later, Mr. Nader wrote to his friend that he was looking forward to an upcoming trip to the United States. Mr. Broidy was arranging for him to attend a gala dinner at Mar-a-Lago, the president’s Florida estate, to celebrate the anniversary of Mr. Trump’s inauguration, and the two men were considering a trip Saudi Arabia to try to sell the kingdom’s young and powerful crown prince on a $650 million contract with Mr. Broidy’s security company.

But those grand plans were interrupted. It was on that trip to the United States that, as he touched down at Dulles Airport, Mr. Nader was greeted by F.B.I. agents working for Mr. Mueller.
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- That was the night Trump was so pissed off because he had to miss his gala because of the budget deadline.

 
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jamny said:
What is the thinking about how McCabe lacked candor? Did he not offer up that Comey was the one who authorized the FBI to release info to the WSJ? They didn't say that McCabe lied, so maybe he wasn't asked? If it is true, then didn't Comey lie under oath during questioning about anonymous sources?
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- You do ask some good questions, like trying to clarify the McCabe testimony. But as I understand it what McCabe said, in his statement, was that as No. 2 he had the authority to arrange background for stories. I don't think that means that he had to get authority from Comey or anyone for any instances, but he also said that he consulted with the Legal counsel (I think Baker) plus one other.

But just stop and think about what we're talking about here. FBI providing background for reporters. This gets a no-duh, just read the news reports from any administration. I think if there's a pressure point for McCabe here it's not just the issue of the Weiner investigation, which is partly what that article in the WSJ addressed, but also the issue of his own non-recusal, which is a bit of a conflict. I do think there's more to this story which led McCabe to be reticent about what he said to whom, but no I don't think Comey lied under oath about that.

 
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D_House said:
I’m a bit lost in the McCabe backstory, this Twitter thread cited in an article that I can no longer find was helpful.
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That is good. Somewhere buried in the internet are the actual text strings that the Senate published, and mostly what I see is a guy, Strzok, struggling with a marriage and a career both stuck in neutral. It sucks what has been done to him (and Lisa Page) with this insanity. - eta - McCabe, like Comey, was a guy (IMO) who worked so hard at being impartial that he ended up being accused of criminal partiality. Sad and unfair.

 
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SaintsInDome2006 said:
Comey, was a guy (IMO) who worked so hard at being impartial that he ended up being accused of criminal partiality. Sad and unfair.
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So true. 

He has become a parabal for the saying don't try, just do.  In all his extra effort to NOT be impartial, to do whatever he could and go the extra step to be impartial... all that trying resulted in partiality. 

The lesson of the parabal: Don't try (to be impartial). Just be (impartial).

 
SaintsInDome2006 said:
- You do ask some good questions, like trying to clarify the McCabe testimony. But as I understand it what McCabe said, in his statement, was that as No. 2 he had the authority to arrange background for stories. I don't think that means that he had to get authority from Comey or anyone for any instances, but he also said that he consulted with the Legal counsel (I think Baker) plus one other.

But just stop and think about what we're talking about here. FBI providing background for reporters. This gets a no-duh, just read the news reports from any administration. I think if there's a pressure point for McCabe here it's not just the issue of the Weiner investigation, which is partly what that article in the WSJ addressed, but also the issue of his own non-recusal, which is a bit of a conflict. I do think there's more to this story which led McCabe to be reticent about what he said to whom, but no I don't think Comey lied under oath about that.
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I'm just trying to think about what he said, or didn't say, that got him fired. I know that it seems like he doesn't need authority to give info, so that's not really an issue. If Comey requested it of him, that seems like something he might withhold mentioning unless asked directly. Of course, it's all just a guess until the report comes out but it could be related to Comey. We'll see.

 
Opie said:
Another example of selective outrage:

You go all-in on the opinion that some police officers wake up in the morning and go to work with the sole intent of killing minorities.....but....you cannot (or will not) accept the fact that a few FBI agents (mostly, those at the top) have chosen to "weaponize" their political beliefs and use their power to help leaders of their chosen political party.

Why is one so feasible to you (and likely) and the other is so unbelievable?
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No evidence of this.  

 
Opie said:
Another example of selective outrage:

You go all-in on the opinion that some police officers wake up in the morning and go to work with the sole intent of killing minorities.....but....you cannot (or will not) accept the fact that a few FBI agents (mostly, those at the top) have chosen to "weaponize" their political beliefs and use their power to help leaders of their chosen political party.

Why is one so feasible to you (and likely) and the other is so unbelievable?
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The main reason to not believe it's likely is that Trump is pushing it, and before he was pushing it, it wasn't a thing.  Now it's a thing.

He's also pushed the narrative that the free press is the enemy of the people, that anyone who decides cases against him is biased, that the intelligence community was wrong in their assessments.  He personally attacks anyone who goes after him, from gold star family members to foreign leaders.

It couldn't be more clear that he is demonizing the FBI leadership because he felt they were a threat to him.  He does this in almost EVERY SINGLE aspect of his life, and in almost every case he is just making #### up.

 
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