****Official DOJ Investigation into Trump, Fake Electors, Fraud, Etc.**** (1 Viewer)

[lazyike]

Back in February of this year the FBI siezed 15 boxes of docuuments. How the hell is it he still had more? Did he have them hidden so they weren't found last time? The DOJ had to have proof for a judge to issue a search warrant for these and that they were pertinent. Was someone working undercover at Mar o lago? https://www.latimes.com/politics/st...ged-for-not-turning-over-presidential-records

 

[lazyike]

Double post

 

[the moops]

Even if he has classified documents, which doesn't appear to be in dispute:
1) Is this illegal for a former President?
2) What type, or how sensitive, would this information be to justify the political fall-out of this? There would have to be something huge to justify this, not just classified information, but the type that would be leave no doubt. Any ideas on what that could even be? Trump in contact directly with far right groups for Jan 6?

Good questions. There’s an obscure Federal Law - Section 2071 of Title 18 of the United States Code — that makes it a crime if someone who has custody of government documents or records “willfully and unlawfully conceals, removes, mutilates, obliterates, falsifies or destroys” them.

If convicted, defendants can be fined or sentenced to prison for up to three years. In addition, the statute says, if they are currently in a federal office, they “shall forfeit” that office, and they shall “be disqualified from holding any office under the United States.”

Good article about this - republicans were giddy about the possibility of Clinton not being able to hold office it convicted of something like this. Turns out its not true.

noted that the Constitution sets eligibility criteria for who can be president, and argued that Supreme Court rulings suggest Congress cannot alter it. The Constitution allows Congress to disqualify people from holding office in impeachment proceedings, but grants no such power for ordinary criminal law.

No, 18 U.S.C. § 2071 Cannot Disqualify Trump From The Presidency

That statute disqualifies a person from "holding any office under the United States."

reason.com

 

[The General]

They could have asked just asked Don to give them the documents.

 

[ekbeats]

I tend to agree with you and MT that the law is probably unconstitutional, but I don’t think the issue has ever been adjudicated with regard to the Presidency (there is case law as respects Congressional offices). Here’s some interesting info on it. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/hillary-clinton-disqualified/

 

[timschochet]

Apparently the MAGA types are angrier about this than any moment since 1/6. There’s all sorts of talk about “civil war” on the internet.

I don’t really think anything will come of this (in terms of right wing violence.) But if it does it will not only be crushed very quickly, it will have a profound effect on the upcoming elections, and not in a way conservatives will like.

On the other hand, if there are no moronic acts of violence, then this event could energize conservatives beyond what they are now for November (and it’s already pretty high.) Might even turn around some of these Senate races (could help JD Vance and Oz in particular.)

 

[ekbeats]

I don’t really think anything will come of this (in terms of right wing violence.) But if it does it will not only be crushed very quickly, it will have a profound effect on the upcoming elections, and not in a way conservatives will like.

So said the picnicers at Manassas.

 

[Herb]

Apparently the MAGA types are angrier about this than any moment since 1/6. There’s all sorts of talk about “civil war” on the internet.

Now they know how I've felt since mid-2017.

 

[timschochet]

I don’t really think anything will come of this (in terms of right wing violence.) But if it does it will not only be crushed very quickly, it will have a profound effect on the upcoming elections, and not in a way conservatives will like.

So said the picnicers at Manassas.

 

[[scooter]]

Civil War analogies are to latter-day conservatives :: as Hitler analogies were to liberals.

 

[Yankee23Fan]

Apparently the MAGA types are angrier about this than any moment since 1/6. There’s all sorts of talk about “civil war” on the internet.

I don’t really think anything will come of this (in terms of right wing violence.) But if it does it will not only be crushed very quickly, it will have a profound effect on the upcoming elections, and not in a way conservatives will like.

On the other hand, if there are no moronic acts of violence, then this event could energize conservatives beyond what they are now for November (and it’s already pretty high.) Might even turn around some of these Senate races (could help JD Vance and Oz in particular.)

If this energizes people to vote FOR the Trump-GOP then they are truly lost souls.

 

[lazyike]

You can't make this stuff up....back in early November of 2016 in regards to Hillary Clinton, Sarah Huckabee Sanders tweeted.."another day, another scandal in the news about the Clintons" followed by this tweet."When you're attacking the FBI because you're under criminal investigation, you're losing"

 

[Stealthycat]

I hate Trump, but this is wrong.

I appreciate this - seriously


Lots of Trump haters here but if this will help keep Trump in a negative light they'll accept it even though its wrong :(

When did we get to that in this nation?

 

[Stealthycat]

If this energizes people to vote FOR the Trump-GOP then they are truly lost souls.

its energizing people to NOT vote for Trump - isn't it ? more anti-Trump hate right ? it works both ways, and the media knows it

 

[The Commish]

Wish we had this sort of outrage for the no-knock warrants where people lose their lives

 

[The Dude]

So the raid happens - and team trump runs for their pitchforks.
Maybe we should wait and see what they were looking for before the faux outrage

 

[sho nuff]

Decent thread on this…informative.

 

[bigbottom]

I hate Trump, but this is wrong.

I appreciate this - seriously


Lots of Trump haters here but if this will help keep Trump in a negative light they'll accept it even though its wrong :(

When did we get to that in this nation?

It may be politically wrong, but I’m not sure whether or not it’s legally wrong. Withholding judgment for the time being. It is truly significant though.

 

[2Squirrels1Nut]

Ugh. These threads are unbearable without the ignore function.

I thought I was missing the ignore option. :(

 

[urbanhack]

I hate Trump, but this is wrong.

I appreciate this - seriously


Lots of Trump haters here but if this will help keep Trump in a negative light they'll accept it even though its wrong :(

When did we get to that in this nation?

It may be politically wrong, but I’m not sure whether or not it’s legally wrong. Withholding judgment for the time being. It is truly significant though.

The federal judge and director of the FBI were both installed by Trump.

 

[sho nuff]

I hate Trump, but this is wrong.

I appreciate this - seriously


Lots of Trump haters here but if this will help keep Trump in a negative light they'll accept it even though its wrong :(

When did we get to that in this nation?

It may be politically wrong, but I’m not sure whether or not it’s legally wrong. Withholding judgment for the time being. It is truly significant though.

The federal judge and director of the FBI were both installed by Trump.

But “the democrats “ did this…is what I keep reading. And the White House denies having knowledge before the warrant was served.

 

[urbanhack]

Ugh. These threads are unbearable without the ignore function.

I thought I was missing the ignore option. :(

Oh...it works.

 

[2Squirrels1Nut]

I hate Trump, but this is wrong.

I appreciate this - seriously


Lots of Trump haters here but if this will help keep Trump in a negative light they'll accept it even though its wrong :(

When did we get to that in this nation?

It may be politically wrong, but I’m not sure whether or not it’s legally wrong. Withholding judgment for the time being. It is truly significant though.

The federal judge and director of the FBI were both installed by Trump.

Wow. There must have been an overwhelming amount of evidence and importance to do this then.

 

[2Squirrels1Nut]

Ugh. These threads are unbearable without the ignore function.

I thought I was missing the ignore option. :(

Oh...it works.

I see it now, thank you! For others click on a user's picture..

 

[JIslander]

Apparently the MAGA types are angrier about this than any moment since 1/6. There’s all sorts of talk about “civil war” on the internet.

I don’t really think anything will come of this (in terms of right wing violence.) But if it does it will not only be crushed very quickly, it will have a profound effect on the upcoming elections, and not in a way conservatives will like.

On the other hand, if there are no moronic acts of violence, then this event could energize conservatives beyond what they are now for November (and it’s already pretty high.) Might even turn around some of these Senate races (could help JD Vance and Oz in particular.)

If this energizes people to vote FOR the Trump-GOP then they are truly lost souls.

I think that water passed under the bridge awhile ago ....

 

[Stealthycat]

Wow. There must have been an overwhelming amount of evidence and importance to do this then.

we'll see

but c'mon ... do you REALLY think this isn't anything more than Russia / Ukraine / tax returns / Stormy Daniels etc etc head hunting ?

 

[JIslander]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/02/25/trump-oversight-records/

From February

 

[Witz]

Wow. There must have been an overwhelming amount of evidence and importance to do this then.

we'll see

but c'mon ... do you REALLY think this isn't anything more than Russia / Ukraine / tax returns / Stormy Daniels etc etc head hunting ?

I saw this posted elsewhere but it rings true IMO and where it’s different than the other things -

You don’t become the first FBI Director, the first Attorney General and the first Federal Judge in our nations history to grant a search and seize warrant for the home of a former President unless you’ve seen the smoking gun.

 

[Mookie]

Why would Trump keep all of these records, in a safe no less, especially when he's been on notice since he left office that they were the property of the USA and had to be returned? I'm sure it was just pictures of his kids and some memes, right?

 

[joffer]

Wow. There must have been an overwhelming amount of evidence and importance to do this then.

we'll see

but c'mon ... do you REALLY think this isn't anything more than Russia / Ukraine / tax returns / Stormy Daniels etc etc head hunting ?

I saw this posted elsewhere but it rings true IMO and where it’s different than the other things -

You don’t become the first FBI Director, the first Attorney General and the first Federal Judge in our nations history to grant a search and seize warrant for the home of a former President unless you’ve seen the smoking gun.

I have little doubt they had good PC to find what they were looking for, but the question will then become what was it. I can see the Jon posts now framing it as they seized a birthday card signed by Putin.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

I hate Trump, but this is wrong.

I appreciate this - seriously


Lots of Trump haters here but if this will help keep Trump in a negative light they'll accept it even though its wrong :(

When did we get to that in this nation?

It may be politically wrong, but I’m not sure whether or not it’s legally wrong. Withholding judgment for the time being. It is truly significant though.

The federal judge and director of the FBI were both installed by Trump.

thats just how DEEP the deep state is!!!!

 

[sho nuff]

Wow. There must have been an overwhelming amount of evidence and importance to do this then.

we'll see

but c'mon ... do you REALLY think this isn't anything more than Russia / Ukraine / tax returns / Stormy Daniels etc etc head hunting ?

Russia/Mueller...resulted in multiple arrests and a report citinig multiple instances of obstruction of Justice (among other things). Ukraine...extremely bad resulting in impeachment. The problem with always calling these head hunting or witch hunts...is that they typically found the heads and witches along the way. Yeah, lots of people end up taking the fall for Trump this far in his life. All a coincidence that he surrounds himself with such awful people? Or maybe, just maybe...he has typically been involved in some very shady stuff and likely criminal behavior?

 

[the moops]

but c'mon ... do you REALLY think this isn't anything more than Russia / Ukraine / tax returns / Stormy Daniels etc etc head hunting ?

Those were all pretty big deals and things that should have resulted in republicans abandoning ship.

 

[(HULK)]

i mean this is serious and one hell of a precedent setter so they better have the goods here take that to the bank brochachos

Word is they pulled out 15 boxes of classified documents so... Goods gotten apparently

 

[roadkill1292]

I think this is all just another sign that the noose is tightening. And that insiders like Meadows and Manafort are beginning to sing.

If there's another Trump administration in our future, you can bet that personal loyalty to Himself will be the number one attribute any close or powerful appointee can bring as a qualification.

I think we're also seeing that, along with power and adulation, what Trump likes most about being president is the immunity.

 

[Joe Mammy]

Remember when Melania had some success selling NFT's at auctions?

Scanned classified docs would sell for a pretty penny on the black market NFT underweb.

Poor Jr. has been scanning for months!

 

[JIslander]

I think this is all just another sign that the noose is tightening. And that insiders like Meadows and Manafort are beginning to sing.

If there's another Trump administration in our future, you can bet that personal loyalty to Himself will be the number one attribute any close or powerful appointee can bring as a qualification.

I think we're also seeing that, along with power and adulation, what Trump likes most about being president is the immunity.

He's gonna require the same loyalty in the clink.

 

[lazyike]

If this energizes people to vote FOR the Trump-GOP then they are truly lost souls.

its energizing people to NOT vote for Trump - isn't it ? more anti-Trump hate right ? it works both ways, and the media knows it

1. The same people who were already were going to vote for Trump now saying they are more likely to vote for Trump doesn't equal more votes for Trump in 2024
2. Why are people who wanted to lock Hillary up fo her mishandling of classified emails now completely fine with Trump recklessly taking classified emails home with him after he lost which we know is illegal? No one is saying they came up with nothing. They took boxes of documents with them many of which were classified.
3. The fact that the DOJ would move forward with siezing these documents ( I think there is very little chance they come up with nothing) indicates to me that Trump is more likely to be indicted so I believe like it or not you are less likely to vote for Trump because he wouldn't be eligible.

 

[tommyGunZ]

Wow. There must have been an overwhelming amount of evidence and importance to do this then.

we'll see

but c'mon ... do you REALLY think this isn't anything more than Russia / Ukraine / tax returns / Stormy Daniels etc etc head hunting ?

Stealth: Are you aware that Trump’s campaign mgr admits he shared campaign data with a Russian intelligence offer during the 2016 campaign? https://news.yahoo.com/ex-trump-campaign-chairman-paul-140803308.html

 

[Toby2ElectricBugaloo]

Man, this is crazy. Talk about crossing a line. Steve Bannon just said on Fox - and I quote “We are at war.”

You've seen the warrant application?

Nope. From the reports I’ve been reading it’s not about Jan. 6 but about a violation of classified material handling. If that’s the case - knowing that nothing was done to Hillary - then this is a politically motivated prosecution. If all that is true - this will get REAL ugly.

Hillary was investigated over it, wasn’t she?
Served search warrants?

Inside the Clinton Email Search Warrant

abcnews.go.com

I think the Hillary search warrant was to open emails - not to have 30 FBI agents ransack her residence and break into her safe.

Further evidence that there is more to the Trump evidence than was to Clinton's.

Not sure I understand. I’ll just cut to the chase - based on what I know right now… I think the Left grossly overplayed their hand here, and it will backfire. I hate Trump, but this is wrong. The President can declassify anything, so the whole case here is in shaky ground to be behin with. Then factoring in the Russia collusion hoax, the whitewashing of Hilary, Hunter, even James Comey malfeasance…. You have to be blind if you think the DOJ and FBI aren’t making politically motivated decisions. This will not end well.

What exactly did "the Left" do here?

Before you answer, keep in mind that the FBI Director is a Republican Trump appointee, that the FBI rank-and-file are universally considered to be right-leaning, that a watchdog report concluded that there is no political bias in FBI agents' official actions as recently as 2019, and that we don't know what the warrant application said or which magistrate approved it.

Now then, what's the issue here?

 

[moleculo]

my link

I'm no expert, but this seems to be from a dispute between the Trump org and the national archives. Trump believed documents were his property, the National Archives thought they belonged to the office of the presidency. The Trump org cooperated for a while but that dried up. When pressed, Trump org still refused. So, the national archives went up the food chain and had a warrant.

in February, Archivist David Ferriero told U.S. House lawmakers that the National Archives and Records Administration had been in communication with Trump throughout 2021 about the return of 15 boxes of records. He eventually returned them in January 2022.

At the time, the National Archives was still conducting an inventory, but noted some of the boxes contained items "marked as classified national security information."

Trump previously confirmed that he had agreed to return certain records to the Archives, calling it "an ordinary and routine process." He also claimed the Archives "did not 'find' anything."

Why they felt they needed to do this - I have no idea. Why Trump org refused to cooperate - I also have no idea. At the end of the day, Trump tried to strong-arm, as he always does, and found out that the DoJ is more powerful than citizen Trump. This whole thing isn't a big deal, and is only being magnified to "OMG the FBI is weaponized!1!1!one!1" by sensational muckrakers.

"After working and cooperating with the relevant Government agencies, this unannounced raid on my home was not necessary or appropriate," Trump said, adding: "They even broke into my safe!"

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

 

[Sand]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

 

[The Commish]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

That approach was attempted in February

 

[Amused to Death]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

First, do we know the safe was damaged? The FBI had professional safe crackers with them. I have no idea if they damage the safe.
Second, the FBI wouldn't be there if Trump had complied.

 

[Sand]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

First, do we know the safe was damaged? The FBI had professional safe crackers with them. I have no idea if they damage the safe.
Second, the FBI wouldn't be there if Trump had complied.

We don't, though reports are the safe was empty.

Also, if a safe cracker was able to open the safe without grinding wheels and a blowtorch it wasn't much of a safe to begin with.

 

[timschochet]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

First, do we know the safe was damaged? The FBI had professional safe crackers with them. I have no idea if they damage the safe.
Second, the FBI wouldn't be there if Trump had complied.

We don't, though reports are the safe was empty.

 

[timschochet]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

First, do we know the safe was damaged? The FBI had professional safe crackers with them. I have no idea if they damage the safe.
Second, the FBI wouldn't be there if Trump had complied.

We don't, though reports are the safe was empty.

Also, if a safe cracker was able to open the safe without grinding wheels and a blowtorch it wasn't much of a safe to begin with.

What reports?

 

[Amused to Death]

We don't, though reports are the safe was empty.

Correct, we don't. And again if Trump had complied the FBI wouldn't have been there.

 

[Sand]

Haha, you don't say? Is he under the impression that when raided by the FBI, his safe is out of bounds?

Instead of breaking into the safe and likely damaging it maybe just call DJT for the combo first?

First, do we know the safe was damaged? The FBI had professional safe crackers with them. I have no idea if they damage the safe.
Second, the FBI wouldn't be there if Trump had complied.

We don't, though reports are the safe was empty.

Also, if a safe cracker was able to open the safe without grinding wheels and a blowtorch it wasn't much of a safe to begin with.

What reports?

Eric Trump says safe breached by FBI in Mar-a-Lago search was empty - Washington Examiner

Eric Trump said his father, Donald Trump, had nothing in a safe they claim the FBI breached as part of a raid of the former president's Mar-a-Largo resort on Monday. The second son of the 45th president said he was with his father in New York City when they found out about the search, and

www.google.com

 

[tommyGunZ]

Trump could release the warrant or contest the warrant in court if he felt the warrant was legally defective.

Any guesses as to why neither of these have happened?