The Russia Investigation: Trump Pardons Flynn (4 Viewers)

[Koya]

Gorsuch has done nothing criminal and there's no basis to impeach him. Feelings don't have anything to do with it -- he keeps his job. He was nominated by a president and confirmed by the Senate, and that's all there is to it.

This. 

Also, CHILL, people.  Still a LONG way away from a realistic possibility that the President gets impeached.  The far flung Hatch getting the nuke code talk is a bit getting over the skiis, here.  

 

[Dedfin]

This. 

Also, CHILL, people.  Still a LONG way away from a realistic possibility that the President gets impeached.  The far flung Hatch getting the nuke code talk is a bit getting over the skiis, here.  

Dude, no one is seriously thinking ####'s going down tomorrow.  I've said a hundred times in this thread that I don't think anything happens to Trump.

 

[fatness]

Comey friend: Nothing scarier to Trump than someone who tells the truth

One of James Comey's friends is praising the former FBI director and warning that nothing is scarier to President Trump than someone who tells the truth and is always willing to do the right thing.

"In the world of President Trump, we really want people who aren’t going to lie," he wrote. "We want people who can sit in front of a congressional committee for hours and, however mad they may make us, never give us reason to doubt that they are telling the truth as they see it."

 

[Bob Magaw]

It's all the same facts being repeated one way or another.  It all may be true, but for one I doubt the NY AG is that far advanced in anything at this point (unless someone just dumped a ton of info on him).  I do think there is something up with the EDVA though what that is, I don't know.

Everything about this is a long shot. But in fairness, so was the idea of a Russian hijacking of our Democracy (if that's what happened?). It would obviously be the biggest and most important story in American political history. It would get bigly ratings, which might please Colonel Kurtz-Trumpsein.

So with the massive caveat/proviso hypothetical that if true, to sum up some of the possibilities:

This could represent the tip of the spear of a coordinated, interagency, RICO/FARA, money laundering/treason-related investigation and charges, an effective decapitation strike and death blow to the admin.

The targets would have the collective prospect of Zed at the mercy of Marcellus and his Medieval crackheads, soon to be in legal agonizing pain for the rest of their short political lives. 

There is a school of thought that this story would be too big to keep a lid on, but consider who we are talking about. FBI, DOJ, CIA. Large criminal networks (Mafia, political machines, terrorist networks) have been brought down before. A few things are required. Discipline, professionalism, PATRIOTISM, not having gabby law enforcement and spook types, no moles (the Rocket Docket may have been chosen to compartmentalize and keep secret as much as possible the state of the indictments, almost certainly not an accident it was chosen, IF this subsequently proves real in 2-3 days). And they are motivated, Trump has attacked them, may have treasonously coordinated/colluded with a hostile foreign power. You think maybe they want to roll up the syndicate? These people are heroes, help protect our way of life and keep our families and friends safe. The opposite of traitors.

DUTY. HONOR. (and unlike craven, complicit R's, who are blinded by party first and may have made a Faustian pact) COUNTRY.

* Putin and Trumpsein may have messed with the wrong melon farmers.

 

[jerry jones]

4/5 vote. Politically would be scarcely used and politically dangerous if abused.

I think it would be used to call for a vote on things either party didn't like, just to stir up the masses. Regardless of whether it passes. 

 

[fatness]

Flynn subpoena sets up battle between White House, Congress

The Senate Intelligence Committee’s subpoena of Michael Flynn’s private documents sets up a potential battle between the legislative and executive branches over whether the Justice Department will enforce Congress’s will.

The Justice Department is charged with enforcing congressional subpoenas. But it is led by Attorney General Jeff Sessions, and the Flynn subpoenas are related to investigations of Russia’s involvement in last year’s election, a sore spot for President Trump.

Senators had assumed before this week that the FBI would be doing most of the heavy investigative lifting in finding out whether members of Trump’s campaign or transition team had special knowledge of Russian efforts to influence the election. But the FBI’s role is now in limbo in the wake of Trump’s surprise firing of Comey.

As Congress awaits Trump’s choice for a replacement, there’s a dawning realization that the Senate investigation may have to shoulder more of the burden.

Democrats don’t take for granted that Sessions will have Congress’s back, especially since he recommended Comey’s dismissal. They argue that Sessions acted improperly because he created the appearance of interfering in an investigation after earlier this year promising to recuse himself from oversight of the probe.

If Flynn or other former Trump advisers refuse requests for information or testimony, Congress could declare them in contempt. But enforcing the contempt finding would fall to the Justice Department.

"Stonewall".  Anyone remember that phrase from Watergate?

 

[jon_mx]

Thank God we have some Twitter feed to confirm all this.  

 

[fatness]

3-year sentence for obstructing an FBI investigation

 

[fatness]

Is it time for Trump staff to lawyer up?

In the past week, a Senate committee began issuing subpoenas in its investigation into Russian contacts with President Donald Trump’s staff and other associates during the 2016 election campaign and transition, while the FBI continues its own criminal investigation. Trump himself fired FBI Director James Comey and then, in the aftermath, said the Russia probe was “made up” and appeared to threaten Comey on Twitter. “There’s obviously a risk here,” said Washington white-collar defense attorney Robert Luskin. “And that’s not any kind of judgment on [Trump’s] personal integrity or absence of it, but the apparent fact he doesn’t seem to be very sensitive about norms and about risks.”

It’s an axiom of Washington scandals that the cover-up tends to be worse than the crime — and it’s lower- or mid-level people who wind up getting caught in the worst legal trouble, usually for tangential offenses like perjury or obstruction of justice. The ancillary stuff, like a forgotten meeting or a discarded document, can cause the most serious problems for staffers navigating the unfamiliar, expensive and high-stakes world of grand juries, subpoenas and congressional hearings, where the prospects of perjury or obstruction of justice charges can be filed for both unintended slip-ups or intentional attempts to cover up for a superior.

 

[Slapdash]

Flynn subpoena sets up battle between White House, Congress

"Stonewall".  Anyone remember that phrase from Watergate?

The confirmation of Sessions was a dark day

 

[jerry jones]

Just coming to post that. I'm at this point in expecting the worst, hoping for the best mode, but there is a specificity of detail there that sounds somewhat authoritative. We'll see soon enough if it has merit.

15. Be of epic proportions. I will have more on insight and what to expect later tonight. Brotha's gotta eat, drink and....

yup...this guys got the goods

 

[fatness]

Will Firing Comey Cost Trump?

In the frenzied days since Donald Trump fired James Comey, all the original justifications have been shredded. To quote Richard Nixon’s press secretary Ron Ziegler (the Sean Spicer of his day), they are now “inoperative.”

Trump’s defenders still hug tight to one argument. Like any president, they note, Trump has the legal right to dismiss the FBI director. Comey himself told the FBI staff, “I have long believed that a President can fire an FBI Director for any reason, or for no reason at all.” Give him points for sportsmanship. And it’s true that the statute setting a ten year term says the president can remove the FBI chief—with no explicit requirement that it be “for cause,” as some other laws require.

Does that fact alone give Trump a free pass? As it turns out, emphatically, no. Donald Trump still could face of harsh legal jeopardy for firing Comey, depending on why he did it, and what else he did. Start with the law itself. It is simply not the case that something that’s legal under normal circumstances is always legal. I have a right to drive, but not to drive a getaway car. A business can have a policy of deleting all emails after thirty days. (Euphemistically known as “document retention.”) But if you begin to frantically shred documents after you get a subpoena, that’s different. Many things can become legal problems if they are designed to block an investigation.

The federal obstruction of justice statutes are notably expansive, as civil liberties advocates often warn. Section 1512 of Title 18 of the federal code makes it illegal when someone “obstructs, influences, or impedes any official proceeding, or attempts to do so.” That could bring a twenty year sentence. What matters most is motive. Cue the President to Lester Holt: “And in fact when I decided to just do it I said to myself, I said, “You know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story, it’s an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should’ve won.” Sarah Huckabee Sanders blithely explained from the White House podium that the firing would hasten the end of the investigation. “We’d love for this to be completed. But we also want it to be completed with integrity.”

Now, in the unlikely event that Trump were to ever be hauled before a jury, he would no doubt say he had other motives. Professors have noted that Trump also called Comey a “showboat.” Making a case would be hard. But Trump keeps blurting out incriminating evidence. There are the thuggish tweets attacking Sally Yates as she prepared to testify. His bizarre, barely literate warning: “James Comey better hope that there are no "tapes" of our conversations before he starts leaking to the press!” And there is the now-infamous January dinner, which seems like a House of Cards outtake. That’s the chilling chat where Trump demanded “loyalty” and asked if he were under investigation, all while implicitly dangling the chance for Comey to keep his job. (Add “am I under investigation” to “are you pregnant” on the list of things not to ask in job interviews.)

Context matters, too. Trump was no bystander. These officials all worked for him. If a President can simply derail an investigation by firing the investigator, just because the probe was getting close to the White House, there’s not much left of the crimnal law.

Given all this, why do his lawyers let him confess his intention to obstruct justice on national television? Don’t discount the possibility that Trump and his team are just winging it.

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

http://i.imgur.com/NnoGhN1.gif

http://img.pandawhale.com/47778-colbert-popcorn-dis-gun-b-gud-fqXR.gif

 

[badmojo1006]

Just coming to post that. I'm at this point in expecting the worst, hoping for the best mode, but there is a specificity of detail there that sounds somewhat author,itative. We'll see soon enough if it has merit.

Hope so, but I'm not holding my breath

 

[shader]

Hope so, but I'm not holding my breath

It's amazing that people hope it's true.  If Trump and 40-50 people go down (as twitter is saying), serious instability is coming.  

 

[badmojo1006]

It's amazing that people hope it's true.  If Trump and 40-50 people go down (as twitter is saying), serious instability is coming.  

We have instability right now. And if there is corruption dont we want to deAl with it now, rather then later?

 

[Slapdash]

We have instability right now.

Exactly

 

[cobalt_27]

Here is one theory on that.

4 and 5 seem like guesswork. From 6 onward it gets interesting. If Boente and Rosenstein brief all 100 Senators this week, our government could suddenly  be a lot more interesting than any of us want it to be.

I'm all for this, except it does seem to be high on wishful thinking and low on verifiable information.  For starters, I've heard nothing about Boente joining Rosenstein in briefing the full senate.  Schumer invited Rosenstein to do so, which seems rather ordinary in the context of all the extraordinary stuff going on these days.  But, I don't find anything in Boente joining him (if he is, then I'll inch closer to this theory).

Regardless, the SCIF meeting with the DAG, EDVA, and two senate intel chairs is quite something and still raises a lot of red flags and questions.

 

[cobalt_27]

It's amazing that people hope it's true.  If Trump and 40-50 people go down (as twitter is saying), serious instability is coming.  

Welcome to present tense.  

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

This getting passed around by the Twitter crew...  someone claims to be IC says it all ends in next 48-72 hours, with specifics.  

https://twitter.com/broadsword_six/status/863895628333539328

shrug.......its on the innernet so it must be true???

 

[Sinn Fein]

It's amazing that people hope it's true.  If Trump and 40-50 people go down (as twitter is saying), serious instability is coming.  

To be fair, the thread points out that he expect things to start small and flip people on the way to the top. No matter what happens this week, the government will not be in turmoil. There may be a bit of gridlock if everything goes down, but that is relatively normal. 

 

[shader]

We have instability right now. And if there is corruption dont we want to deAl with it now, rather then later?

A fired FBI director, 2 scoops of ice cream, narcissistic tweets...they cause twitter to go crazy, make the talking heads ratings go up and promote conversation.

Trump Pence and Ryan ousted with 30-50 friends would tank the market and potentially start a civil war.  

 

[Koya]

The confirmation of Sessions was a dark day

For many following closely, the darkest.

 

[fatness]

Claude Taylor‏ @TrueFactsStated 2h2 hours ago

Update: I previously had reported that according to a source close to investigation, 28-42 individuals were targeted for indictment. 1/2

Claude Taylor‏ @TrueFactsStated 1h1 hour ago

That same source has just confirmed that number is now signicantlly higher-with upwards of 70 individuals/entities targeted. 2/2

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

A fired FBI director, 2 scoops of ice cream, narcissistic tweets...they cause twitter to go crazy, make the talking heads ratings go up and promote conversation.

Trump Pence and Ryan ousted with 30-50 friends would tank the market and potentially start a civil war.  

civil war? nah and the market is going to correct itself soon anyway as soon as all the trump cronies cash in

 

[fatness]

A fired FBI director, 2 scoops of ice cream, narcissistic tweets...they cause twitter to go crazy, make the talking heads ratings go up and promote conversation.

Trump Pence and Ryan ousted with 30-50 friends would tank the market and potentially start a civil war.  

There's some irony there.

 

[Koya]

  Quote
Claude Taylor‏ @TrueFactsStated 2h2 hours ago

Update: I previously had reported that according to a source close to investigation, 28-42 individuals were targeted for indictment. 1/2

  Quote
Claude Taylor‏ @TrueFactsStated 1h1 hour ago

That same source has just confirmed that number is now signicantlly higher-with upwards of 70 individuals/entities targeted. 2/2




WHA???

Doubling down seems a bold move.

 

[JIslander]

A fired FBI director, 2 scoops of ice cream, narcissistic tweets...they cause twitter to go crazy, make the talking heads ratings go up and promote conversation.

Trump Pence and Ryan ousted with 30-50 friends would tank the market and potentially start a civil war.  

####ed up elections have consequences.

 

[Koya]

There's some irony there.

Well, the cause wouldn't be slavery.  

Winning?

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

A fired FBI director, 2 scoops of ice cream, narcissistic tweets...they cause twitter to go crazy, make the talking heads ratings go up and promote conversation.

Trump Pence and Ryan ousted with 30-50 friends would tank the market and potentially start a civil war.  

To be fair, this edition of the House Of Representatives isn't principled enough to impeach Trump, so hold off on any doomsday calls until at least February 2019.  

 

[Sinn Fein]

WHA???

Doubling down seems a bold move.

Here is to hoping the dealer goes bust.

 

[Bob Magaw]

A fired FBI director, 2 scoops of ice cream, narcissistic tweets...they cause twitter to go crazy, make the talking heads ratings go up and promote conversation.

Trump Pence and Ryan ousted with 30-50 friends would tank the market and potentially start a civil war.  

So if they coordinated/colluded with Russia, just leave them in place for sake of "stability"?

I think the *hope* part is IF they committed treason, they need to go. HARD.

 

[cosjobs]

It's amazing that people hope it's true.  If Trump and 40-50 people go down (as twitter is saying), serious instability is coming.  

Not as unstable as we'd be if the allegations are true and they are not brought down. There would be mayhem for a while, but we would rebuild on justice and truth, making our long odds SO much better

 

[shader]

To be fair, this edition of the House Of Representatives isn't principled enough to impeach Trump, so hold off on any doomsday calls until at least February 2019.  

Crap. Sell all the puts I just bought?

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

It's about looking at incomplete information and filling in blanks.

Trump has been acting guilty as #### for a long while.  

A bunch of people of increasing credibility are saying it's because he colluded and he and all around him will pay. 

Putin pissed on the carpet of the Oval Wednesday as a bunch of other irregular stuff happened like DAG calling emergency meeting is SCIF with ranking members of Intel Committee and then overt claims of indictments.  

Throw in an unexpected and unexplained settlement in a major Russian money laundering case and the fired Federal Prosecutor congratulating (plus former head of FBI NY saying tonight that Trump staffer better lawyer up)...

...and the conclusion is.. are you ready for this.

To all Trumpkins...

PAY THE #### ATTENTION! (Like you should have a long ####### time ago!) 

I hope you are right, I want him to go down....best thing for us...but some dudes twitter account don't mean its happening.....hope so..

 

[cosjobs]

civil war? nah and the market is going to correct itself soon anyway as soon as all the trump cronies cash in

Sounds like collecting the dodged taxes and seizing Trumpire would be good for the budget

 

[shader]

I hope you are right, I want him to go down....best thing for us...but some dudes twitter account don't mean its happening.....hope so..

 This is what I mean.  Wouldn't  the best thing be to find out that all the twitter crap is false, Trump actually has no ties to russia, etc?

 

[Slapdash]

 This is what I mean.  Wouldn't  the best thing be to find out that all the twitter crap is false, Trump actually has no ties to russia, etc?

Trump pretty clearly has ties to Russia, which have been documented in the media ad naseum.  We are far beyond "ties"

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

We have instability right now. And if there is corruption dont we want to deAl with it now, rather then later?

Says 50+ people and entities 

 

[Doctor Detroit]

John Cornyn is on the short bus for FBI Director

That has to be a ####### joke. 

 

[Sinn Fein]

 This is what I mean.  Wouldn't  the best thing be to find out that all the twitter crap is false, Trump actually has no ties to russia, etc?

No.  Trump is a terrible president. The worst.  Best thing, no matter what side of the aisle you are on, includes Trump not being president. If you are GOP you want this to end quickly and you are praying (probably literally) that the entire party is not swept up in a RICO/money laundering scheme that taints everyone in the party. 

 

[Doctor Detroit]

Oops, meant list.  Freudian slip, I kid you not. 

 

[Rirruto]

 This is what I mean.  Wouldn't  the best thing be to find out that all the twitter crap is false, Trump actually has no ties to russia, etc?

It would be, but Trump promised that I would get tired of winning. Seeing the opposing party brought down in a treason scandal qualifies as a win that I don't want. 

But I guess he promised to drain the swamp, so it all ties in. Trump's just doing what he promised all along. We were all just too simple to recognize it. 

 

[Rirruto]

John Cornyn is on the short bus for FBI Director

That has to be a ####### joke. 

He literally has to be on the list only to make the eventual choice look better by comparison. 

 

[fatness]

 This is what I mean.  Wouldn't  the best thing be to find out that all the twitter crap is false, Trump actually has no ties to russia, etc?

No. Drop the qualifiers.

The best thing would be --- will be --- to find out everything that has happened that is currently being investigated.

That's my rooting interest. Not in Trump being brought down, or left standing, or in anyone being right or wrong.

I just want to know what the #### happened.

After that, let the chips fall where they should.

 

[Henry Ford]

It's amazing that people hope it's true.  If Trump and 40-50 people go down (as twitter is saying), serious instability is coming.  

"is coming."

 

[cobalt_27]

 This is what I mean.  Wouldn't  the best thing be to find out that all the twitter crap is false, Trump actually has no ties to russia, etc?

If you want to indulge in the illusion, sure.  That would be swell.

 

[HellToupee]

Trump pretty clearly has ties to Russia, which have been documented in the media ad naseum.  We are far beyond "ties"

Zero proof

 

[shader]

Tough crowd. sorry to interrupt!  Back to the 30, no wait 40, no wait 70-80 arrests coming and the impending Orrin Hatch presidency.  I'll leave you guys to it.

 

[Bruce Dickinson]

We actually restrict voting rights now.  We restrict voting to those 18 years of age and over.  Would you not entertain a rational discussion from one who suggested that 21 might be a more appropriate age?  We restrict voting to those not currently incarcerated, or on parole or probation for felonies.  Would you not entertain a rational discussion regarding incremental changes to this restriction?

I'd greatly enjoy a rational discussion about those parameters.  

I think it's immoral to have citizens allowed to be drafted into military service without also having the right to vote.  So any discussion of moving the voting age out to 21, 25, or whatever needs to be accompanied with a parallel discussion about moving the draft age to match, or dissolving the draft completely.  

I'm good with people "off papers" having their voting rights restored.  My intuition is a citizen is less likely to commit a crime again if they were a stakeholder like being able to vote again.  If that topic has been formally studied, I'm curious what the results are.  (This is probably best covered in another thread about incarceration in general.)  

I think voter registration should be automatic.  The notion of making someone jump through hoops just to be able to vote is against what we are supposed to be about.  Yeah it sucks that some people are informed and some aren't, but IMO the solution to that is making access to voting easier, not harder.  More voting by mail, more early voting hours.  Look at what Oregon is doing to produce monster voting participation and see what is feasible to install in other states.