Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
The Trent Richardson Thread (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter False Start
- Start date
Touchdown There
Footballguy
Just as bizarre as the Bills saying they are going to run Spiller until he throws up. Bad year for running backs after two weeks.
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
Joe Banner said exactly the opposite today, so I guess it depends on who you choose to believe.
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
haven't read the entire thread, this may be redundant...
below quote reported on espn, i don't have link, found on message board, but can confirm they showed this verbatim on NFL Live thursday...
Michael Lombardi on the 2012 draft:
"I believe the safest pick in the draft -- beyond Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III -- is Alabama running back Trent Richardson. He's a blue-chip player and has all the skills to quickly establish himself as a top-five player at his position. Forget the nonsense about not taking backs early -- everyone would love the chance to get this guy."
interesting, so he changed his mind, or was overruled by banner?
sounds like a real garage sale potentially (maybe they are tanking for teddy?)...
i wasn't surprised by speculation that gordon or little (just demoted) could be next... but serial pro bowler joe thomas? no idea if thomas knows this or is speculating himself?
reported at PFT...
"What makes the most sense in the interim could be even more trades. During a separate appearance on PFT Live, Tony Grossi of ESPN Cleveland suggested that other players acquired before Jimmy Haslam bought the team could be available, including receiver Josh Gordon, receiver Greg Little, and left tackle Joe Thomas.
Thomas acknowledged that to Mike Silver of NFL Network, saying that everyone is currently on the trading block."
silver's twitter feed...
https://twitter.com/InsideNFLMedia/status/380821074843168768
there was an article in preseason about thomas with headline stating losing was drudgery, which could have been taken out of context that he was complaining and being critical, but after reading it (no link, didn't want to have link OD, but just google joe thomas losing drudgery), i think it was just meant in the spirit of it would be great if they could win...
here is a slightly different take on michael silver tweet... more of a general acknowledgement that with new owner, front office and coaching staff, sweeping changes shouldn't be a surprise... from that context, as far as i could infer, didn't sound like thomas had been informed by team personally (than again, richardson found out about trade on radio - stay classy, browns!
)...
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000246919/article/joe-thomas-well-be-behind-trent-richardson-trade-eventually
i looked it up, and thomas turns 29 this season... if he were traded, it would seem CLE was committed and determined to sweeping the pillbox with a flamethrower and incinerating everything down to the molecular level...
in a usa today article breaking down trade, i was reminded of how many injuries richardson had since being drafted (not just ribs, but 2012 preseason knee, missed last game with ankle, shin 2013 preseason)... that in turn reminded me of an article/reference upthread (maybe elsewhere) that there is school of thought that saban works his RBs really hard, and some scouts are concerned they could have even shorter shelf lives, for a position that already comes with notoriously shortened date stamp expectations...
in same article, some league-wide execs spoke out (on condition of anonymity, of course), and while acknowledging the smoking crater in the ground in lieu of a QB, also pointed out they have some nice pieces in places, such as edge rushers kruger and sheard (unmentioned, but top 10 pass rusher mingo would be included here), d'qwell jackson, (also not mentioned but joe haden is pro bowl caliber CB, some scouts are high on safety TJ ward), joe thomas on offense...
below quote reported on espn, i don't have link, found on message board, but can confirm they showed this verbatim on NFL Live thursday...
Michael Lombardi on the 2012 draft:
"I believe the safest pick in the draft -- beyond Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III -- is Alabama running back Trent Richardson. He's a blue-chip player and has all the skills to quickly establish himself as a top-five player at his position. Forget the nonsense about not taking backs early -- everyone would love the chance to get this guy."
interesting, so he changed his mind, or was overruled by banner?
sounds like a real garage sale potentially (maybe they are tanking for teddy?)...
i wasn't surprised by speculation that gordon or little (just demoted) could be next... but serial pro bowler joe thomas? no idea if thomas knows this or is speculating himself?
reported at PFT...
"What makes the most sense in the interim could be even more trades. During a separate appearance on PFT Live, Tony Grossi of ESPN Cleveland suggested that other players acquired before Jimmy Haslam bought the team could be available, including receiver Josh Gordon, receiver Greg Little, and left tackle Joe Thomas.
Thomas acknowledged that to Mike Silver of NFL Network, saying that everyone is currently on the trading block."
silver's twitter feed...
https://twitter.com/InsideNFLMedia/status/380821074843168768
there was an article in preseason about thomas with headline stating losing was drudgery, which could have been taken out of context that he was complaining and being critical, but after reading it (no link, didn't want to have link OD, but just google joe thomas losing drudgery), i think it was just meant in the spirit of it would be great if they could win...
here is a slightly different take on michael silver tweet... more of a general acknowledgement that with new owner, front office and coaching staff, sweeping changes shouldn't be a surprise... from that context, as far as i could infer, didn't sound like thomas had been informed by team personally (than again, richardson found out about trade on radio - stay classy, browns!
)...http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000246919/article/joe-thomas-well-be-behind-trent-richardson-trade-eventually
i looked it up, and thomas turns 29 this season... if he were traded, it would seem CLE was committed and determined to sweeping the pillbox with a flamethrower and incinerating everything down to the molecular level...
in a usa today article breaking down trade, i was reminded of how many injuries richardson had since being drafted (not just ribs, but 2012 preseason knee, missed last game with ankle, shin 2013 preseason)... that in turn reminded me of an article/reference upthread (maybe elsewhere) that there is school of thought that saban works his RBs really hard, and some scouts are concerned they could have even shorter shelf lives, for a position that already comes with notoriously shortened date stamp expectations...
in same article, some league-wide execs spoke out (on condition of anonymity, of course), and while acknowledging the smoking crater in the ground in lieu of a QB, also pointed out they have some nice pieces in places, such as edge rushers kruger and sheard (unmentioned, but top 10 pass rusher mingo would be included here), d'qwell jackson, (also not mentioned but joe haden is pro bowl caliber CB, some scouts are high on safety TJ ward), joe thomas on offense...
Last edited by a moderator:
Jewell
Footballguy
Yeah, but during his rookie season Faulk had 1282 yards rushing with 11 TDs and 4.1 yards per carry. Add on 52 receptions for 522 yards and 1 receiving TD that season, and you already knew that Faulk could produce numbers worthy of a high draft pick. No need to wait five years to assess his talent or whether he could produce because Faulk showed it right out of the gate. Richardson may still prove great, but he has shown less evidence of that early on than Faulk did.
Here's a better example of a guy who entered the league amid much hype with a high draft pick, looked like he wasn't going to live up to that hype early on, and then he began to slice up defenses and become an all-time great...
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SimpO.00.htm?mobile=false
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
That actually would be a pretty good nickname. There aren't too many left these days.cstu said:
cstu
Footballguy
Richardson himself 12 TD's and caught 51 passes on a terrible team. All that missing is the YPC which IMO is the product of being the focus of the defense every week.
glock
"Don't grumble, give a whistle!"
softball
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
"Rolling ball of butcher knives" is a description someone came up with for Maurice Jones Drew a few years back. Pagano is stealing it to apply to Richardson.
B-Deep
Footballguy
one question i have is when did they decide this?
was it in their minds all off season?
did 0-2 bring it up?
was it a Wheedon went down lets clean as many Holmgren peeps out as we can?
of course, even if asked and they answered this question i am not sure i would believe them. they are gonna answer questions in the way they think makes them look best, which is what i would expect of any team
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
I don't think OJ's a good comparison, hard to believe but he was in a time share for his first 2 years and he was injured for half of a another, he did very well with the touches he had.
The difference happened when a run oriented coach named Lou Saban took over.
See this guy Saban knew how to (1) build a great line and (2) create a system where RBs thrived with huge holes to run through.
Sound familiar?
Last edited by a moderator:
MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
Jewell
Footballguy
Wow. Cool info. Thanks.
Keith Lewis
Footballguy
Report on the radio of Gordon to SF for a 3rd. Doesn't make sense, successful 2nd rounder???
MoveToSkypager
Footballguy
It turned out to be Richardson for Matt Kalil (LT), Jarius Wright (WR) and some backup/STers.
PVCap99
Footballguy
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
Next strike is a year off though.
From just a talent perspective it's nuts. He's a first-round talent.
Coeur de Lion
Footballguy
That speaks to his usage -- not his talent. He got the ball a ton in all facets of the game for over a year and did squat. And the guys that know him best just dumped him for a loss. He might end up being a good RB, but nothing he's done in the NFL suggests he's the great player he was hyped to be coming out.
buddhacwru
Footballguy
Not sure I trust the coaching staff in Indy when they say he will start. The Staff in Buffalo promised us big things for Spiller too... and he's in a RBBC with FJax. Coaches lie. They might want SF to game plan more for Richardson.
msudaisy26
Footballguy
If this is true I think several teams that need a receiver dropped the ball, New England for one
Spin
Footballguy
Jewell
Footballguy
Cleveland Browns ex-LB Scott Fujita says Trent Richardson was late for treatments, failed to engage with teammates and came off as high maintenance | cleveland.com
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/09/cleveland_browns_ex-lb_scott_f.html
BEREA, Ohio -- Former Browns linebacker Scott Fujita, now an analyst for Fox Sports, shed some light on Trent Richardson in his column today, saying he made little effort to engage with teammates, was late for treatments, was high maintenance and didn't appear to buy in.
Fujita said the trade of Richardson to the Colts for a 2014 first-round pick was a win-win for both clubs.
"It seems strange to say a fresh start is needed for someone whos beginning his career, but that might be the case here,'' said Fujita of Richardson. "Guys get drafted all the time to places they just dont want to be. I cant speculate about whats in any one persons head, but when a player enters the league wearing headphones incessantly, shows up late for treatments, and makes little effort to engage with his teammates, he can quickly develop a reputation for being insular and high-maintenance.''
Fujita, a Browns captain who keeps in touch with some of his former teammates here, went on to write, "It can be perceived that he isnt happy and that hes not making an effort to buy in. Ive seen this happen countless times, especially in todays head down, keep-things-to-yourself culture.
"Generally, you hope the player grows out of that coming into his second season, especially when theres been a complete regime change and everyone is expected to prove themselves all over again. Some players buy in, and some dont. Buy-in, even if its just perceived, goes a long way. You have to be willing to show you want to be part of the team.
"I have no idea what took place during Thursday mornings team meeting in Berea, the first since the trade was announced the previous afternoon. But my sense tells me a message was sent, loud and clear, even if nothing was spoken: No one is guaranteed a spot on this team. No one is bigger than the team. If you dont buy in, you dont belong on this team.''
Fujita's remarks echo the sentiments of one Browns starter who anonymously told NFL.com that Richardson "has some things he needs to figure out before he becomes a dominant player ion the league.''
Browns linebacker D'Qwell Jackson, asked about those remarks, said, "He is still young. To be in this league, you have to go through the ups and downs. A lot of guys' paths don't start off as they would like. There's nothing to say things can't change and you can't be that dominant person. Every player in this locker room has a lot of work to do. I have a lot of work to do. That's not something to say why it's the reason he got traded.''
Fujita, who spent last season here with Richardson, was part of a group of team leaders in 2011 that conducted an intervention with running back Peyton Hillis to urge him to get his priorities straight and focus on football.
For some of the reasons he outlined, including perceived lack of buying in, Fujita feels like the move will benefit both clubs.
"The Colts got an incredibly skilled back to complement one of the best young quarterbacks in the game,'' he said. "And they have a coach in Chuck Pagano who has a fantastic reputation for reaching his players and getting the absolute best out of each and every man in his locker room. Their future was already bright, but their team just got better now.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/09/cleveland_browns_ex-lb_scott_f.html
BEREA, Ohio -- Former Browns linebacker Scott Fujita, now an analyst for Fox Sports, shed some light on Trent Richardson in his column today, saying he made little effort to engage with teammates, was late for treatments, was high maintenance and didn't appear to buy in.
Fujita said the trade of Richardson to the Colts for a 2014 first-round pick was a win-win for both clubs.
"It seems strange to say a fresh start is needed for someone whos beginning his career, but that might be the case here,'' said Fujita of Richardson. "Guys get drafted all the time to places they just dont want to be. I cant speculate about whats in any one persons head, but when a player enters the league wearing headphones incessantly, shows up late for treatments, and makes little effort to engage with his teammates, he can quickly develop a reputation for being insular and high-maintenance.''
Fujita, a Browns captain who keeps in touch with some of his former teammates here, went on to write, "It can be perceived that he isnt happy and that hes not making an effort to buy in. Ive seen this happen countless times, especially in todays head down, keep-things-to-yourself culture.
"Generally, you hope the player grows out of that coming into his second season, especially when theres been a complete regime change and everyone is expected to prove themselves all over again. Some players buy in, and some dont. Buy-in, even if its just perceived, goes a long way. You have to be willing to show you want to be part of the team.
"I have no idea what took place during Thursday mornings team meeting in Berea, the first since the trade was announced the previous afternoon. But my sense tells me a message was sent, loud and clear, even if nothing was spoken: No one is guaranteed a spot on this team. No one is bigger than the team. If you dont buy in, you dont belong on this team.''
Fujita's remarks echo the sentiments of one Browns starter who anonymously told NFL.com that Richardson "has some things he needs to figure out before he becomes a dominant player ion the league.''
Browns linebacker D'Qwell Jackson, asked about those remarks, said, "He is still young. To be in this league, you have to go through the ups and downs. A lot of guys' paths don't start off as they would like. There's nothing to say things can't change and you can't be that dominant person. Every player in this locker room has a lot of work to do. I have a lot of work to do. That's not something to say why it's the reason he got traded.''
Fujita, who spent last season here with Richardson, was part of a group of team leaders in 2011 that conducted an intervention with running back Peyton Hillis to urge him to get his priorities straight and focus on football.
For some of the reasons he outlined, including perceived lack of buying in, Fujita feels like the move will benefit both clubs.
"The Colts got an incredibly skilled back to complement one of the best young quarterbacks in the game,'' he said. "And they have a coach in Chuck Pagano who has a fantastic reputation for reaching his players and getting the absolute best out of each and every man in his locker room. Their future was already bright, but their team just got better now.
pater familias
Footballguy
He doesnt buy into the Browns...I cant imagine that...go figure.
StopTradingMeTebow
Footballguy
How dare you come up with data and logic.
That doesn't jive with what some want to believe.
*covers eyes and scrolls down*
greenmasterlc
Footballguy
The Trent Richardson trade was an awful move for numerous reasons. Merry Xmas, Indy. Here was the only scoring threat the abysmal offense had, and they send the guy packing. This talking of "rebuilding" only 2 games into the season is tantamount to waving a white flag of surrender. And now Scott Fujita is throwing in his 2 cents worth of knucklehead commentary ? Please. He needs to stick to watching Dog the Bounty Hunter episodes, and comment on those. That's his area of expertise.The Browns were just an unpleasant distraction to both. Richardson had potential. Joe Banner and Mike Lombardi are the head honcho flavors of the month for the Browns, but I have no faith in their judgement after pulling this boneheaded move. Oh, he wasn't OUR draft pick ? Uhh, he's a prima donna. He drinks bottled water instead of tap, he must be high maintenance.. He drives a Lexus instead of a Honda.. You get the idea. Everyone in Cleveland is against, roughly 75-25% against the trade. In Baltimore, it's 80-20% for the trade. Lucky us, we get a 2014 1st rounder.. What good is any draft pick in Cleveland, since none of them ever seem to pan out ? Browns fans are some of the greatest & loyal in the NFL- they deserve a helluva lot better than they have gotten since 1964. ,
Joe Summer
Footballguy
2012 first round pick to Vikings (#4-Matt Kalil)2012 fourth round pick to Vikings (#118-Jarius Wright)
2012 fifth round pick to Vikings (#139-Robert Blanton)
2012 seventh round pick to Vikings (#211-Scott Solomon)
$13.3 million signing bonus
$540,000 salary for 2012 and 2 games of 2013
$3.5 million of dead cap space in 2013
$6.7 million of dead cap space in 2014
Biabreakable
Footballguy
This is absolutely what Fujita is doing though, speculating that because Richardson is listening to head phones that he isn't buying in to the program.
How does he know if Richardson was late to treatments? Does he keep Richardson's schedule?
Not saying there might not be some truth to his statements. Just saying he is speculating, despite his denial of doing so.
cstu
Footballguy
Csonka4life
Footballguy
In this instance all Richardson has shown as a pro that he can be a workhorse back. Dickerson was the equivalent of AP.
cstu
Footballguy
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
Most likely he's maintained connections in the organization and they're using him as a mouthpiece. Pretty common arrangement.
Ashem
Footballguy
Don't be naive. He doesn't have to know Richardson's schedule to have a doctor mention that Richardson is late for treatment, or for a teammate to mention Richardson walked in late. It's a team of 53 or so players, not a company of 500. It's not difficult to find out what everyone is doing or what everyone is like.
jdoggydogg
Footballguy
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
question for the virulently anti-richardson clique...
is it possible that he was less dynamic and explosive because of the broken ribs?
like, hypothetically, if we had a time machine, went back to last september, got a truncheon, banged on doug martin and alfred morris torsos and fractured a few ribs, possibly their rookie season's would have unfolded differently?
is it possible that he was less dynamic and explosive because of the broken ribs?
like, hypothetically, if we had a time machine, went back to last september, got a truncheon, banged on doug martin and alfred morris torsos and fractured a few ribs, possibly their rookie season's would have unfolded differently?
Last edited by a moderator:
Wonderllama
Footballguy
I'm really rooting for Trent Richardson, not just because he's on one of my fantasy teams and it's the most exciting in-season trades I can remember, but also because it saddens me when people talk about RBs having very little value. That may or may not be true, but running backs are people too! It's a hard job and they deserve respect! I want Trent to be the second coming of Beast Mode and prove the haters wrong.
Last edited by a moderator:
Jewell
Footballguy
Totally agree. Fujita says you can't speculate, and then he speculates. Plus, some people get insular when they compete. That's how they focus and prepare mentally.
There's also the chance that Richardson did socialize with other players, but he didn't socialize with Fujita because Fujita is a ####.
This.....best post in this entire thread!
Reported he was sleeping for 7 plus weeks upright in a chair.....are you kidding me?
Like a previous poster said.....we will find out over the next 2 months how good Trent is.....healthy and out of Cleveland.
pollardsvision
Footballguy
These sentiments sound like people are letting Browns history cloud their opinion of this move.
The Browns' previous ineptitude shouldn't be a factor here. Trading away "the one player fans can get excited about" or "rebuilding for X more years" really shouldn't be fan complaints.
The Richardson story in CLE was likely to end just like every other story where fans of a sorry team feel like the one good offensive player they have is a RB. Badly.
In almost every other case of this, unless they land an elite QB or very good defense, the team just rides that RB into the ground with a smattering of 1 to 8 win seasons. They end up giving that RB a big contract (we can't lose our only offensive weapon!!!!), which only makes the problem worse and delays true rebuilding.
CLE fans have been abused for years. It sounds like most see this as a continuing of that. To me, it signifies just the opposite. A bold move to do what so many other bad teams were afraid to do.
Last edited by a moderator:
ebsteelers
Footballguy
Tell bounty gate fujata shut his ##### ### up.. scrub
Riversco
Footballguy
To me its about having multiple threats on offense.
I'd like at least 3 threats on offense to make an offense really good. Some combination of QB / RB / WR / TE
The reason this trade is bad for the Browns is because I think the Browns actually had 3 genuine threats to gameplan for. They had it at WR / TE / RB. Trent Richardson, Jordan Cameron Jordan, and Josh Gordon. They might have surprised some people with all 3 pieces on the field at the same time. That's actually a headache to try to stop all 3. It becomes extremely difficult to stack up and play the run with Gordon AND Cameron running free as serious playmakers. That would open big holes for Richardson to run through.
I actually thought there was a chance the Browns offense could do some surprisingly big damage starting in week 3 once Gordon returned. But now, it will never be.
I'd like at least 3 threats on offense to make an offense really good. Some combination of QB / RB / WR / TE
The reason this trade is bad for the Browns is because I think the Browns actually had 3 genuine threats to gameplan for. They had it at WR / TE / RB. Trent Richardson, Jordan Cameron Jordan, and Josh Gordon. They might have surprised some people with all 3 pieces on the field at the same time. That's actually a headache to try to stop all 3. It becomes extremely difficult to stack up and play the run with Gordon AND Cameron running free as serious playmakers. That would open big holes for Richardson to run through.
I actually thought there was a chance the Browns offense could do some surprisingly big damage starting in week 3 once Gordon returned. But now, it will never be.
Restricted
Footballguy
my late two cents. Initial shock for the trade of the "franchise" RB but after some thought into the possibilities of why I'm ok with it for Cleveland. As many have said (only read the first few pages) TR was selected during the old regime and the new management may have different ideas and this is a way to implement them.
The NFL has become a passing league and the need for a star running back had deminished as evident as the prolonged success of the Packers and Patriots as well as the current success of the Broncos. Building a team around a RB can be difficult and current evidence (sup Vikings?) shows that it doesn't flurish as much.
Trading Richardson for a first gives Cleveland's current group a great opportunity to to start building the team the way that they want, and it appears that they may take it toward a passing team. In the preseason, Cleveland looked strong in the passing game and maybe this will allow them to focus toward that versus having to give their star RB a particular amount of carries.
Really can't wait to see how this plays out.
The NFL has become a passing league and the need for a star running back had deminished as evident as the prolonged success of the Packers and Patriots as well as the current success of the Broncos. Building a team around a RB can be difficult and current evidence (sup Vikings?) shows that it doesn't flurish as much.
Trading Richardson for a first gives Cleveland's current group a great opportunity to to start building the team the way that they want, and it appears that they may take it toward a passing team. In the preseason, Cleveland looked strong in the passing game and maybe this will allow them to focus toward that versus having to give their star RB a particular amount of carries.
Really can't wait to see how this plays out.
Riversco
Footballguy
Arguably the best team in the NFL is the Seahawks and they are a running team. They basically ran at will against the 49ers and destroyed them. You can definitely win big running the ball.
sportsphysio
Footballguy
I think this is a VERY underestimated factor...Imagine that, a guy with busted ribs (which make simple tasks like BREATHING difficult) had trouble accelerating and breaking tackles. He could have just sat out half the season, and then all the haters would be calling him out for being brittle.
As for Fujita....so TRich gutting through this injury and showing up to play every day for a crap team that was obvioiusly going nowhere...that's a sign of not buying into the program? As far as I'm concerned, his YPC is pretty impressive taking all things into consideration (busted ribs, no offensive support, stacked boxes, etc).
I THINK he will show his true potential in Indy; I'm certainly pulling for him considering his obvious heart and determination.
