Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
timdraft #4: Movie Category Draft (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
jwb
Footballguy
Time Kibitzer
Footballguy
For sports scene I considered taking something from a Sonja Henie movie, the 3-time figure skating Olympic gold medalist, Hollywood Star, Hitler acquaintance who figure skated in most of her films. Decided against it though since I've never actually seen an entire movie of hers, and really had no intention of sitting through one despite many of the figure skating scenes actually being pretty great.
timschochet
Footballguy
So it's time to do some judging. Und ve might as vell start with ze Chormans!
First few coming right up...
First few coming right up...
Tiananmen Tank
Footballguy
I was between Goon and Warrior, actually. Would have loved it if I could have worked Big Fan in somewhere as well. Only place I could think to slot it would have been monologue.
timschochet
Footballguy
1 pt- Ilsa, She Wolf of the SS
Well, jwb managed to select not only the worst film in this category, but also the worst movie in this entire draft. (Granted, I haven't seen all of the WTF films, but it's not possible they could be worse than this one.) After watching Val Rannous' selection (coming up VERY shortly!) I thought there was no way that wouldn't be the slam dunk bottom of the list, but I hadn't watched the fair Ilsa yet!
This interesting film is LOOSELY based on the life of Ilsa Koch, arguably the most notorious female Nazi in history. Fraulein Koch's life would make a rather sickening and highly unpleasant film, but the directors of this masterpiece weren't quite willing to go that far for realism: while the real Ilsa spent her time sadistically torturing starving concentration camp victims, the movie Ilsa whips and fondles soft-porn stars and starlets from the early 70s, while groaning, cooing, and murmuring such lines as "You call yourself men, but now that you are naked before me, I don't see much manhood!"
While there is not a single shred of redeemable material in this movie, I can't help but admire the creativity behind the titles of the 4 sequels (Yes, there were actually 4 sequels):
Ilsa, Absolute Power
Ilsa, Harem Keeper of the Oil Sheiks
Ilsa, the Tigress of Siberia
Ilsa, the Wicked Warden
Well, jwb managed to select not only the worst film in this category, but also the worst movie in this entire draft. (Granted, I haven't seen all of the WTF films, but it's not possible they could be worse than this one.) After watching Val Rannous' selection (coming up VERY shortly!) I thought there was no way that wouldn't be the slam dunk bottom of the list, but I hadn't watched the fair Ilsa yet!
This interesting film is LOOSELY based on the life of Ilsa Koch, arguably the most notorious female Nazi in history. Fraulein Koch's life would make a rather sickening and highly unpleasant film, but the directors of this masterpiece weren't quite willing to go that far for realism: while the real Ilsa spent her time sadistically torturing starving concentration camp victims, the movie Ilsa whips and fondles soft-porn stars and starlets from the early 70s, while groaning, cooing, and murmuring such lines as "You call yourself men, but now that you are naked before me, I don't see much manhood!"
While there is not a single shred of redeemable material in this movie, I can't help but admire the creativity behind the titles of the 4 sequels (Yes, there were actually 4 sequels):
Ilsa, Absolute Power
Ilsa, Harem Keeper of the Oil Sheiks
Ilsa, the Tigress of Siberia
Ilsa, the Wicked Warden
Nick Vermeil
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
2 pts- Iron Sky
All I can say is, extremely disappointing.
There is an absurd brilliance to the plot of this film: a colony of Nazis at the end of World War II flee to the dark side of the Moon. They stay there for decades planning to return to Earth and conquer it in the name of the Third (Fourth?) Reich. And who can stop them? Only the poorly armed United States, led by President Sarah Palin.
I think a very entertaining film could have been made out of this: both an obvious cultural and political satire and rather exciting at the same time. Unfortunately this film wasn't it. So poorly acted. Such terrible dialogue. So incredibly unfunny. I admit to not making it through the whole piece of crap. I survived about 35 minutes of it. It is so unbearably unwatchable that even that is torture (I have a vision of Ilsa behind me, screaming in my ear: "WATCH IRON SKY, JEW!! KEEP YOUR EYES ON THAT SCREEN, OR YOU WILL TASTE THE WHIP!!" )
All I can say is, extremely disappointing.
There is an absurd brilliance to the plot of this film: a colony of Nazis at the end of World War II flee to the dark side of the Moon. They stay there for decades planning to return to Earth and conquer it in the name of the Third (Fourth?) Reich. And who can stop them? Only the poorly armed United States, led by President Sarah Palin.
I think a very entertaining film could have been made out of this: both an obvious cultural and political satire and rather exciting at the same time. Unfortunately this film wasn't it. So poorly acted. Such terrible dialogue. So incredibly unfunny. I admit to not making it through the whole piece of crap. I survived about 35 minutes of it. It is so unbearably unwatchable that even that is torture (I have a vision of Ilsa behind me, screaming in my ear: "WATCH IRON SKY, JEW!! KEEP YOUR EYES ON THAT SCREEN, OR YOU WILL TASTE THE WHIP!!" )
Tremendous Upside
Footballguy
Wicked Warden was my favorite as a 15 yr old
Despite not carrying "adult" films, my local video store had these in stock
GB Dyanne Thorne
Despite not carrying "adult" films, my local video store had these in stock
GB Dyanne Thorne
jwb
Footballguy
Yea, that was kinda my reasoning for picking it - there wasn't much left in the category, so I went with video store schlock. My pick was going to be the HBO film Conspiracy, would would have netted the same 1 point for being an HBO film. So what the heck - let me get some S&M on my team.
It's a shame that "the movie Ilsa whips and fondles soft-porn stars and starlets from the early 70s, while groaning, cooing" wasn't worth more.
Tremendous Upside
Footballguy
Movie poster is classic also"Yea, that was kinda my reasoning for picking it - there wasn't much left in the category, so I went with video store schlock. My pick was going to be the HBO film Conspiracy, would would have netted the same 1 point for being an HBO film. So what the heck - let me get some S&M on my team.
It's a shame that "the movie Ilsa whips and fondles soft-porn stars and starlets from the early 70s, while groaning, cooing" wasn't worth more.
http://imgc.allpostersimages.com/images/P-473-488-90/56/5664/H61UG00Z/posters/ilsa-she-wolf-of-the-ss.jpg
timschochet
Footballguy
3 Points- Hangmen Also Die!
Now it gets very, very difficult, because the 23 other films selected in this category are all pretty good, entertaining movies. This one, from the 40s, was directed by Fritz Lang and scripted by Bertold Brecht- pretty lofty. It tells the story of the assassination of Reinhard "Hangman" Heydrich in Prague in the summer of 1942 (Heydrich, along with Eichmann, was the Nazi most specifically responsible for the Holocaust.) I watched this a few years back on Turner Classic Movies, and re-acquainted myself with some scenes- it's a fine dramatic movie, very suspenseful and tells a good story. For it's time.
And the last sentence is the reason I can't rank it any higher. It's just too dated. One of the villains actually sports a monocle and says, "Ve have vays of making you talk!". (Yes, that's actually in the film.) Brecht disowned it later on because it was too cliche and too Hollywood; at that point in his life he was apparently eager to promote Stalinism. That would have made it a more interesting piece of history (though probably a worse film.)
Now it gets very, very difficult, because the 23 other films selected in this category are all pretty good, entertaining movies. This one, from the 40s, was directed by Fritz Lang and scripted by Bertold Brecht- pretty lofty. It tells the story of the assassination of Reinhard "Hangman" Heydrich in Prague in the summer of 1942 (Heydrich, along with Eichmann, was the Nazi most specifically responsible for the Holocaust.) I watched this a few years back on Turner Classic Movies, and re-acquainted myself with some scenes- it's a fine dramatic movie, very suspenseful and tells a good story. For it's time.
And the last sentence is the reason I can't rank it any higher. It's just too dated. One of the villains actually sports a monocle and says, "Ve have vays of making you talk!". (Yes, that's actually in the film.) Brecht disowned it later on because it was too cliche and too Hollywood; at that point in his life he was apparently eager to promote Stalinism. That would have made it a more interesting piece of history (though probably a worse film.)
timschochet
Footballguy
4 pts- Valkyrie
I saw this in the movie theaters, and I expected it to be terrible. But it wasn't terrible. Not great, either, just mediocre and OK.
For me, Von Stauffenberg's story is one of the most fascinating of World War II. I have read several books on the subject, and actually watched three different films, including this one. You'd think it would translate to film, but it doesn't, because what actually happened doesn't make for great cinema- every director that has tackled it has tried to "spice it up". That was my fear going into this movie, especially because of the director-star- I couldn't imagine a more unlikely actor to portray the idealistic, urbane, aristocratic, badly wounded Stauffenberg.
But as I wrote, Cruise doesn't do a bad job, astonishingly enough. The mostly British cast that surrounds him are fine, the action is fine, and the drama is there. But in the end, it's rather a yawner. Nothing particularly special or exciting about this movie.
I saw this in the movie theaters, and I expected it to be terrible. But it wasn't terrible. Not great, either, just mediocre and OK.
For me, Von Stauffenberg's story is one of the most fascinating of World War II. I have read several books on the subject, and actually watched three different films, including this one. You'd think it would translate to film, but it doesn't, because what actually happened doesn't make for great cinema- every director that has tackled it has tried to "spice it up". That was my fear going into this movie, especially because of the director-star- I couldn't imagine a more unlikely actor to portray the idealistic, urbane, aristocratic, badly wounded Stauffenberg.
But as I wrote, Cruise doesn't do a bad job, astonishingly enough. The mostly British cast that surrounds him are fine, the action is fine, and the drama is there. But in the end, it's rather a yawner. Nothing particularly special or exciting about this movie.
timschochet
Footballguy
5 pts- Apt Pupil
I feel bad because I know this was taken high. And I really debated placing it higher, because it is a very entertaining (and disturbing movie.) It's based on a Stephen King novella from his book Different Seasons (which also, BTW, included what became The Shawshank Redemption and Stand By Me.)
My problem with this movie is that Todd Bowden doesn't seem real. In the book, Bowden (the kid who enamored with an old Nazi) goes through stages of development which are quite shocking and might (IMO) be among King's best character analysis ever. In the movie, something is missing from this character, and despite Ian McKellan's always excellent acting, something is ultimately missing from this movie which makes it lack the narrative power of most of the films ranked above it on this list. Still a good film to watch, but I couldn't rank it any higher than this.
I feel bad because I know this was taken high. And I really debated placing it higher, because it is a very entertaining (and disturbing movie.) It's based on a Stephen King novella from his book Different Seasons (which also, BTW, included what became The Shawshank Redemption and Stand By Me.)
My problem with this movie is that Todd Bowden doesn't seem real. In the book, Bowden (the kid who enamored with an old Nazi) goes through stages of development which are quite shocking and might (IMO) be among King's best character analysis ever. In the movie, something is missing from this character, and despite Ian McKellan's always excellent acting, something is ultimately missing from this movie which makes it lack the narrative power of most of the films ranked above it on this list. Still a good film to watch, but I couldn't rank it any higher than this.
timschochet
Footballguy
That's it for the moment.
More later on today.
More later on today.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
These both sound good, I'm going to look for them @ NYPL (take my daughter every Saturday).
timschochet
Footballguy
Continuing...
6 pts- The Boys From Brazil
Another absurd plot (not quite as absurd as Iron Sky) but carried off much better. Gregory Peck is actually menacing as Mengele, Olivier is fine as Simon Weisenthal (that's not his name in the movie, but that's who he's supposed to be) and whoever the kid is who plays little Adolf could have competed in both the child actor and multiple roles category. As an action film, it's a little lacking. I enjoyed it though. The novel (by Ira Levin) is better.
6 pts- The Boys From Brazil
Another absurd plot (not quite as absurd as Iron Sky) but carried off much better. Gregory Peck is actually menacing as Mengele, Olivier is fine as Simon Weisenthal (that's not his name in the movie, but that's who he's supposed to be) and whoever the kid is who plays little Adolf could have competed in both the child actor and multiple roles category. As an action film, it's a little lacking. I enjoyed it though. The novel (by Ira Levin) is better.
timschochet
Footballguy
7 pts- Triumph of the Spirit
Boxing in Auschwitz? Apparently a true story, no matter how bizarre. But this is a boring film, really unemotional and uninspiring. The reason that I am ranking it here and not even lower is that Willem Dafoe is tremendous in this role. In fact, it might be his best acting performance I have seen. He kind of saves the day for this otherwise uninteresting movie.
Boxing in Auschwitz? Apparently a true story, no matter how bizarre. But this is a boring film, really unemotional and uninspiring. The reason that I am ranking it here and not even lower is that Willem Dafoe is tremendous in this role. In fact, it might be his best acting performance I have seen. He kind of saves the day for this otherwise uninteresting movie.
timschochet
Footballguy
8 pts- The DIrty Dozen
9 pts- The Great Escape
10 pts- Raiders of the Lost Ark
These are three of my favorite movies of all time. The first two would make my list of top 10 World War II films. And Raiders is one of the great entertaining movies of all time.
But...they really don't fit in the category, because in all three cases, although Nazis play the villains, their role is rather peripheral. (In the case of The Great Escape, Nazis don't even appear until the end of the film- the Stalag is run by Luftwaffe officers, and as I warned in my criteria, this is not the same thing.) Same for the Dirty Dozen. Even in Raiders, which features a fun caricature of the villain from Hangmen Also Die!, they are really minor.
I really should have ranked all 3 films much lower, but they are so much significantly better than the films ranked before them, in terms of sheer entertainment value, so they get points for that. But this is as high as they go. The top 15 films in this category are all excellent movies, and all about Nazis.
9 pts- The Great Escape
10 pts- Raiders of the Lost Ark
These are three of my favorite movies of all time. The first two would make my list of top 10 World War II films. And Raiders is one of the great entertaining movies of all time.
But...they really don't fit in the category, because in all three cases, although Nazis play the villains, their role is rather peripheral. (In the case of The Great Escape, Nazis don't even appear until the end of the film- the Stalag is run by Luftwaffe officers, and as I warned in my criteria, this is not the same thing.) Same for the Dirty Dozen. Even in Raiders, which features a fun caricature of the villain from Hangmen Also Die!, they are really minor.
I really should have ranked all 3 films much lower, but they are so much significantly better than the films ranked before them, in terms of sheer entertainment value, so they get points for that. But this is as high as they go. The top 15 films in this category are all excellent movies, and all about Nazis.
Val Rannous
Footballguy
Cool. I wanted to take a wild pick for the 30th round, and actually hadn't seen this - wanted to, as I thought it might just be funny in a stupid way. It had such a cool premise and I'm a sucker for SF taken in weird directions that I wanted it to be good. Now I don't have to bother, thanks for taking that bullet for me
Mrs. Rannous
Footballguy
Did I mention my husband is something of a Richard?
timschochet
Footballguy
11 pts. The Shop on Main Street
Brilliant film. Actually all the films are brilliant from this point on. Gets really hard.
Czechoslovakia is a country which has had trouble dealing with it's complicity in the Holocaust. The makers of this film chose to deal with it head on. This in itself, coming in 1965, was a brave act, which would not have happened in Poland, Romania, Bulgaria and Hungary (all also complicit.)
Compared to Hollywood, this is a slow movie, (the roll call scene goes on forever) but the acting is superb. Highly recommended.
Brilliant film. Actually all the films are brilliant from this point on. Gets really hard.
Czechoslovakia is a country which has had trouble dealing with it's complicity in the Holocaust. The makers of this film chose to deal with it head on. This in itself, coming in 1965, was a brave act, which would not have happened in Poland, Romania, Bulgaria and Hungary (all also complicit.)
Compared to Hollywood, this is a slow movie, (the roll call scene goes on forever) but the acting is superb. Highly recommended.
timschochet
Footballguy
On a side note-
One of the greatest directors of films dealing with Nazism (and the Holocaust) was French director Louis Malle, best known in this country for the wonderful Atlantic City. Two of his films, Lancombe Lucien and Au Revoir Les Enfants, were both brilliant and would have done very well in this category. So would the similar film Mr. Klein, also French, starring Alain Delon.
Finally, a recent German film, Sophie Scholl: The Final Days would probably have placed top 5 in the rankings.
One of the greatest directors of films dealing with Nazism (and the Holocaust) was French director Louis Malle, best known in this country for the wonderful Atlantic City. Two of his films, Lancombe Lucien and Au Revoir Les Enfants, were both brilliant and would have done very well in this category. So would the similar film Mr. Klein, also French, starring Alain Delon.
Finally, a recent German film, Sophie Scholl: The Final Days would probably have placed top 5 in the rankings.
timschochet
Footballguy
12 points- Romper Stomper
Two movies were selected dealing with Neo-Nazis. Of the two, this is the lesser one IMO, though it's still captivating and stars a young Russell Crowe. Somewhat exploitative, and the style seems a little dated and artsy- but it's fascinating. Probably the most violent of all the movies in the category, which is saying something.
Two movies were selected dealing with Neo-Nazis. Of the two, this is the lesser one IMO, though it's still captivating and stars a young Russell Crowe. Somewhat exploitative, and the style seems a little dated and artsy- but it's fascinating. Probably the most violent of all the movies in the category, which is saying something.
timschochet
Footballguy
13 pts- Triumph of the Will
This was the only documentary drafted, although there are a few others that might have done even better (Shoah and The Sorrow and the Pity). I really had trouble trying to figure out where to place it. Riefenstahl's work is endlessly fascinating as a historical work- (though visually, not quite as stunning as Olympia, IMO). But it lacks the narrative power and intensity of the films ranked above it- in point of fact, it's a hard film for me to watch all at once (though I've seen it now several times.)
The other factor is that this film was intended as a positive introduction to the Third Reich, and therefore part of what makes it such a rich viewing performance is the knowledge of the viewer of what Nazi Germany was really about- which was not intended. For example, Hitler's speech about the purification of the Party is especially ironic if the viewer is already aware of the 1934 Purge (which occurred just before the filming of this movie.) This is not meant to be criticism, but the other films higher on this list don't demand prior knowledge for them to be fully appreciated.
This was the only documentary drafted, although there are a few others that might have done even better (Shoah and The Sorrow and the Pity). I really had trouble trying to figure out where to place it. Riefenstahl's work is endlessly fascinating as a historical work- (though visually, not quite as stunning as Olympia, IMO). But it lacks the narrative power and intensity of the films ranked above it- in point of fact, it's a hard film for me to watch all at once (though I've seen it now several times.)
The other factor is that this film was intended as a positive introduction to the Third Reich, and therefore part of what makes it such a rich viewing performance is the knowledge of the viewer of what Nazi Germany was really about- which was not intended. For example, Hitler's speech about the purification of the Party is especially ironic if the viewer is already aware of the 1934 Purge (which occurred just before the filming of this movie.) This is not meant to be criticism, but the other films higher on this list don't demand prior knowledge for them to be fully appreciated.
timschochet
Footballguy
14 pts- The Counterfeiters
Another incredible movie. (I seem to be repeating that a lot, and it's only getting more difficult). One of the themes that is prevalent in many of these films are the moral choices that Nazism posed on both it's victims and perpetrators. Like many great works, this movie doesn't attempt to answer the question posed- it lets the viewer decide. The narrative of the forgers in a concentration camp is based on a true story, but that really doesn't matter one way or the other. Brilliantly acted and directed; one the best films of the last several years IMO.
Another incredible movie. (I seem to be repeating that a lot, and it's only getting more difficult). One of the themes that is prevalent in many of these films are the moral choices that Nazism posed on both it's victims and perpetrators. Like many great works, this movie doesn't attempt to answer the question posed- it lets the viewer decide. The narrative of the forgers in a concentration camp is based on a true story, but that really doesn't matter one way or the other. Brilliantly acted and directed; one the best films of the last several years IMO.
timschochet
Footballguy
15 points- The Pianist
Roman Polanski was a survivor of the Holocaust and a Polish ghetto, so he obviously put a lot of emotion into the film, which is a brutal depiction of the Holocaust- much more brutal, for example, than Schindler's List, to which this film is compared. But probably because this movie is more realistic (reminiscent for me of the Holocaust scenes from Pat Conroy's Beach Music), it loses a little of the narrative power as compared to the other film.
That being said, this is an amazing movie in every way. Once again, it features a moral dilemma. Adrian Brody's performance is truly astonishing, yet matched by the other characters as well. Just barely missed out on my top 10.
Roman Polanski was a survivor of the Holocaust and a Polish ghetto, so he obviously put a lot of emotion into the film, which is a brutal depiction of the Holocaust- much more brutal, for example, than Schindler's List, to which this film is compared. But probably because this movie is more realistic (reminiscent for me of the Holocaust scenes from Pat Conroy's Beach Music), it loses a little of the narrative power as compared to the other film.
That being said, this is an amazing movie in every way. Once again, it features a moral dilemma. Adrian Brody's performance is truly astonishing, yet matched by the other characters as well. Just barely missed out on my top 10.
timschochet
Footballguy
If your pick hasn't been chosen so far, it is truly magnificent. I'll reveal the top 10 Nazi movies tomorrow.
krista4
Footballguy
Wow, Sophie Scholl was the second movie I thought of for the category, but I was pretty sure no one but me had seen it. Oh well, I'm happy with my pick as I think the movie is brilliant, much more brilliant than its ranking, and was admirable in its production.
timschochet
Footballguy
Mrs. Rannous
Footballguy
I really wanted to pick Escape From Sobibor, but since it was made for TV, it was ineligible. Pity. It was gripping.
Or I could have gone with Surf Nazis Must Die. Tough call.
Or I could have gone with Surf Nazis Must Die. Tough call.
Last edited by a moderator:
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
It wasn't really a documentary. And your second paragraph confirms as much which invalidates your criticism in the first. Having said that, I'm fine with the ranking.
timschochet
Footballguy
Good morning.
16 points- Notorious
This probably should have been drafted in the long take category, since the "balcony shot" is one of the most famous in cinematic history. That being said, it's certainly a Hitchcock classic, one of his greatest films (though oddly rarely mentioned as such.) Certainly it belongs in the top 10 here.
16 points- Notorious
This probably should have been drafted in the long take category, since the "balcony shot" is one of the most famous in cinematic history. That being said, it's certainly a Hitchcock classic, one of his greatest films (though oddly rarely mentioned as such.) Certainly it belongs in the top 10 here.
timschochet
Footballguy
17 points- Inglorious Basterds
Tarantino's fantasy revenge epic is a triumph due to a vignette of incredibly suspenseful scenes, combined with some very memorable acting performances, particularly by Christoph Waltz and the beautiful Melanie Laurent. If it were not for Brad Pitt's ham-fisted over acting, which sticks out like a sore thumb, this would be a damn near perfect war film.
Tarantino's fantasy revenge epic is a triumph due to a vignette of incredibly suspenseful scenes, combined with some very memorable acting performances, particularly by Christoph Waltz and the beautiful Melanie Laurent. If it were not for Brad Pitt's ham-fisted over acting, which sticks out like a sore thumb, this would be a damn near perfect war film.
timschochet
Footballguy
18 points- American History X
The other Neo-Nazi flick taken. IMO, better than Romper Stomper because it is more character driven, and that allows for a more in-depth narrative. Also, Edward Norton has never been quite this good (and he is a fine actor.)
The other Neo-Nazi flick taken. IMO, better than Romper Stomper because it is more character driven, and that allows for a more in-depth narrative. Also, Edward Norton has never been quite this good (and he is a fine actor.)
timschochet
Footballguy
19 pts- Marathon Man
What's so brilliant about this film is that Dustin Hoffman needs an ultimate bad guy to make his life right- to avenge his father's suicide (at the hands of McCarthyism), and his brother's untimely demise, and he is confronted with a true monster, portrayed by Lawrence Olivier in perhaps his finest performance. The dentist scenes have become cliche, but they remain among the most frightening in movie history. William Devane also helps make this movie among the very best of it's kind. But in the end it's Hoffman, who gets to gun down all the baddies, who makes this film.
What's so brilliant about this film is that Dustin Hoffman needs an ultimate bad guy to make his life right- to avenge his father's suicide (at the hands of McCarthyism), and his brother's untimely demise, and he is confronted with a true monster, portrayed by Lawrence Olivier in perhaps his finest performance. The dentist scenes have become cliche, but they remain among the most frightening in movie history. William Devane also helps make this movie among the very best of it's kind. But in the end it's Hoffman, who gets to gun down all the baddies, who makes this film.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
20 pts- Judgment At Nuremberg
This is an old fashioned Hollywood epic directed by Stanley Kramer, and everything about it is tremendous, especially the dialogue (written by Abby Mann) and the ensemble cast of great actors. I find the Marlene Dietrich scenes to be a little boring and irrelevant to the plot, but otherwise the narrative is smooth. The most brilliant aspect of the film IMO is that Burt Lancaster is presented sympathetically throughout, but then we come to realize that he is the guiltiest of all the accused- because he is the man who should have known better.
This is an old fashioned Hollywood epic directed by Stanley Kramer, and everything about it is tremendous, especially the dialogue (written by Abby Mann) and the ensemble cast of great actors. I find the Marlene Dietrich scenes to be a little boring and irrelevant to the plot, but otherwise the narrative is smooth. The most brilliant aspect of the film IMO is that Burt Lancaster is presented sympathetically throughout, but then we come to realize that he is the guiltiest of all the accused- because he is the man who should have known better.
timschochet
Footballguy
21 pts- The Tin Drum
I'll probably get some flack for this ranking, since it's I pick and I made it so late in the draft. But I will stand by it, since this is one of the finest films ever on the subject of Nazism. Oskar is born in 1918, but decides at age 3 that he will not grow up- and doesn't. Oskar, of course, is symbolic of a Germany which refused to grow up during the years, with catastrophic results.
The film is a tribute to German Expressionism; I also considered drafting it in the sex category because it contains some of the most graphic disturbing sex scenes I have ever seen (such as when Oskar decides to get it on with his 15 year old housekeeper- he's still 3 of course) But it truly belongs here. A masterpiece.
I'll probably get some flack for this ranking, since it's I pick and I made it so late in the draft. But I will stand by it, since this is one of the finest films ever on the subject of Nazism. Oskar is born in 1918, but decides at age 3 that he will not grow up- and doesn't. Oskar, of course, is symbolic of a Germany which refused to grow up during the years, with catastrophic results.
The film is a tribute to German Expressionism; I also considered drafting it in the sex category because it contains some of the most graphic disturbing sex scenes I have ever seen (such as when Oskar decides to get it on with his 15 year old housekeeper- he's still 3 of course) But it truly belongs here. A masterpiece.
timschochet
Footballguy
22 pts- Mephisto
Returning to the subject of moral choices here. Faustus is originally a Germanic tale (best developed by Goethe) and it is adopted here in this film about an actor who sells his soul to Nazism in order to gain and retain a level of stardom. Dark, subtle, nuanced, this movie is sheer magnificence and beauty, and one of the best foreign films I have ever seen, period.
Returning to the subject of moral choices here. Faustus is originally a Germanic tale (best developed by Goethe) and it is adopted here in this film about an actor who sells his soul to Nazism in order to gain and retain a level of stardom. Dark, subtle, nuanced, this movie is sheer magnificence and beauty, and one of the best foreign films I have ever seen, period.
timschochet
Footballguy
23 pts- Schindler's List
My top 5 is dominated by foreign films- Schindler is the only Hollywood effort on the list. But it belongs right toward the top, with it's strong narrative and moving performances. It MAY be Spielberg's best film. Haunting score (played by Itzhak Perlman) helps as well. Ralph Fiennes steals every scene he's in.
My top 5 is dominated by foreign films- Schindler is the only Hollywood effort on the list. But it belongs right toward the top, with it's strong narrative and moving performances. It MAY be Spielberg's best film. Haunting score (played by Itzhak Perlman) helps as well. Ralph Fiennes steals every scene he's in.
timschochet
Footballguy
24 pts- Downfall
Best portrayal of Hitler ever. Best portrayal of the top Nazis ever. My favorite scene is when Hitler learns that the Dallas Cowboys lost in the playoffs again- Hitler goes beserk and just blisters Tony Romo...
Best portrayal of Hitler ever. Best portrayal of the top Nazis ever. My favorite scene is when Hitler learns that the Dallas Cowboys lost in the playoffs again- Hitler goes beserk and just blisters Tony Romo...
timschochet
Footballguy
25 pts- Europa Europa
If you haven't seen this movie, see it. (It's available on Netflix). A dark comedy based on a true story in which a Jewish boy hides his identity during the war by pretending he's German, and ends up being sent to a Hitler Youth school. Shocking, disturbing, funny, and brilliant, it is my #1 film ever on Nazism.
If you haven't seen this movie, see it. (It's available on Netflix). A dark comedy based on a true story in which a Jewish boy hides his identity during the war by pretending he's German, and ends up being sent to a Hitler Youth school. Shocking, disturbing, funny, and brilliant, it is my #1 film ever on Nazism.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I thought it was intentional (the character was more of a cartoon character) and was hysterical.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
How are Nazi's any more central to this story than they were in Raiders, Dirty Dozen and Escape? I love this movie and the "White Angel" character but don't see how it wasn't lumped in with those other three per the standard applied to them. I haven't see in it a real long time so maybe I'm off base, but wasn't Olivier the only Nazi and not really in the movie until the end?
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Similar threads
