Too many flags (1 Viewer)

[Harjiran]

In my 40+ years of watching NFL football, I can't remember seeing so many flags thrown for ticky tack procedural infractions like illegal shifts, illegal formations, dirty underwear, etc., and there also seems to be an uptick in false starts, offsides and everything in between. Flags, flags, flags, on back-to-back-to-back plays, then a little mistake-free football, followed by more flags. I'm not a fan of this and I feel like the NFL is not putting its best product on the field. It's getting to the point where I'd almost rather watch the stats on NFL.com, and the post-game highlights, than a live game. I don't have any real data here, just my general observation that games are not flowing along like they used to back in the day, and watching games is not as fun as it used to be. The on-field interviews are also terrible, plus all the injuries, the stupid new kickoff rules ... sigh. Am I just an old man screaming at clouds or WTF is going on here? I feel like Goodell and the rest of these idiots are ruining the game I love.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

In my 40+ years of watching NFL football, I can't remember seeing so many flags thrown for ticky tack procedural infractions like illegal shifts, illegal formations, dirty underwear, etc., and there also seems to be an uptick in false starts, offsides and everything in between. Flags, flags, flags, on back-to-back-to-back plays, then a little mistake-free football, followed by more flags. I'm not a fan of this and I feel like the NFL is not putting its best product on the field. It's getting to the point where I'd almost rather watch the stats on NFL.com, and the post-game highlights, than a live game. I don't have any real data here, just my general observation that games are not flowing along like they used to back in the day, and watching games is not as fun as it used to be. The on-field interviews are also terrible, plus all the injuries, the stupid new kickoff rules ... sigh. Am I just an old man screaming at clouds or WTF is going on here? I feel like Goodell and the rest of these idiots are ruining the game I love.

Teams used to line up with 2 WRs in the same spot and 2 RBs in the same spot and a TE in the same spot on every play. It was pretty easy to line up in a legal formation when the only change you ever made to a formation was whether the FB was directly behind the QB or offset a yard to either side.

Now a zillion different formations, tons of motion, all with different players running on and off the field, some of them coming in for an injured or tired player and expected to immediately line up in the right place of a complex formation where the 3rd WR over is the one that's supposed to be on the LoS before going in motion then getting set off the line of scrimmage because the TE is going to motion and end up on the line...

A lot more room for error.

 

[ClownDogs]

NFL red zone is really the only way to watch it in my opinion. . Guess that’s what appeases my ADHD

 

[Crazy8s__]

I agree. Some potential solutions.

The illegal formation is an unnecessary foul. Simple replace that with a side judge holding his arm up until the offense is properly lined up. No harm no foul.

Add 2 more yards before illegal man down field.

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

And then a blatant face mask right in front of the ref DOESN’T get called. Unreal

 

[JohnnyU]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

 

[Insein]

And then none when you need one.

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

If replay assist can’t be used for things like that, then what are we even doing here

 

[Largent]

CFL game, that would have been a challenge and taken out to the 25. NFL needs this shaddy **** so they can shave when they need to. Its a racket

 

[Deamon]

definitely misread the title of this thread.

 

[Snoopy]

Too many fbgs?

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

I agree. Some potential solutions.

The illegal formation is an unnecessary foul. Simple replace that with a side judge holding his arm up until the offense is properly lined up. No harm no foul.

Add 2 more yards before illegal man down field.

No and no. How about just do it correctly like they have for over 100 years?

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

NFL red zone is really the only way to watch it in my opinion. . Guess that’s what appeases my ADHD

I basically have games on in the background now. If Im interested in a game Ill watch the 12-16 minute highlights on youtube. Very few flags and I dont have to watch the same 3 commercials over and over.

 

[Lansdowne]

It’s to the point where any time there is a big play you’ll hear the play-by-play broadcaster say “and there are no flags”, because you almost expect a flag to be thrown to nullify that play. It’s like waiting for the other shoe to drop.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

CFL game, that would have been a challenge and taken out to the 25. NFL needs this shaddy **** so they can shave when they need to. Its a racket

The CFL also gives 1 point on a missed FG that goes through the end zone. So we aren't talking the gold standard of leagues here

Meh, players should learn how to do things right. If your coach has motion, do it right. If you are running a screen play and as a LG you are 3 yards downfield, don't do it. If you hit a QB low, don't do it. More concerning is the inconsistency of the flags.

They could probably throw one every play. I'd like to see them be able to determine if a penalty impacted a play, and pick it up if it didn't. like throw the holding flag, but then scoop it up if the defender was to the right but the play was run left.

 

[BroncoFreak_2K3]

NFL red zone is really the only way to watch it in my opinion.

agree 1000%

 

[Rubi]

There is a solution to too many flags,or flogs,or frogs...
Full time officials.
Not attorneys and engineers on a long weekend pursuing a part time job.

 

[-OZ-]

NFL red zone is really the only way to watch it in my opinion. . Guess that’s what appeases my ADHD

YouTube’s 4 games on the screen works well for me.

 

[-OZ-]

players should learn how to do things right

Except the occasional bad call, the refs are enforcing the rules agreed upon.

Most of this isn’t on the refs.

 

[BlackCrowes]

they could've just changed their minds, like the refs in the UT/GA game

 

[IvanKaramazov]

At least they've loosened up on those ticky-tack "tackle the QB by the facemask" penalties. About time they let 'em play.

 

[Da Guru]

I agree. Some potential solutions.

The illegal formation is an unnecessary foul. Simple replace that with a side judge holding his arm up until the offense is properly lined up. No harm no foul.

Add 2 more yards before illegal man down field.

Who cares if a WR in on the line of scrimmage or back a foot. As long as they are not over the line of scrimmage. All the ticky tacky flags last night and the most blatant one on Darnold who had his head almost ripped off is not called. Not that it would have changed the outcome.

Then you have Stafford whiner for a flag for anyone who come close to him. Stafford was not like that in his earlier days.

 

[wlwiles]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

 

[Snoopy]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

Judgment calls can't be reviewed even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed.

 

[JohnnyU]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

Judgment calls can't be reviewed even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed.

Not true if a face mask penalty was reviewable. That's the purpose of a review. Your statement that is untrue is "even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed", which it currently isn't reviewable.

 

[BassNBrew]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

Judgment calls can't be reviewed even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed.

What was the judgement? Whether he broke his neck or just sprained it?

 

[JohnnyU]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

Judgment calls can't be reviewed even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed.

What was the judgement? Whether he broke his neck or just sprained it?

Not funny if that had happened, but I get the humor -

 

[BassNBrew]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

Judgment calls can't be reviewed even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed.

What was the judgement? Whether he broke his neck or just sprained it?

Not funny if that had happened, but I get the humor -

Yeah, not much judgement involved when a guys head goes from 6 feet above sea level to Bryce level faster than an Amari drop.

 

[Willie Neslon]

Agree completely about sideline interviews. Totally pointless. Adds nothing to the broadcast.

"You're down at the half. What do you need to do to get back in this?"
"We need to play better."

"You're up at the half. What's the plan for the 2nd half to secure the win?"
"We need to keep it up."

 

[wlwiles]

Agree completely about sideline interviews. Totally pointless. Adds nothing to the broadcast.

"You're down at the half. What do you need to do to get back in this?"
"We need to play better."

"You're up at the half. What's the plan for the 2nd half to secure the win?"
"We need to keep it up."

Postgame:

"You guys won the game, how did you make that happen?"
"Our guys made some plays at the right time, we just believed in ourselves and each other and took it one game at a time, and hard work pays off"

 

[Stinkin Ref]

I agree. Some potential solutions.

The illegal formation is an unnecessary foul. Simple replace that with a side judge holding his arm up until the offense is properly lined up. No harm no foul.

Add 2 more yards before illegal man down field.

not the officials job to make sure players are properly lined up.....that starts crossing the border of "coaching"....plus guys shift all the time to try and confuse defense....you can't expect an official to try and guess or assume where a guy is supposed to be....plus with a snap eminent....there are other things they need to be focused on with regards to the neutral zone etc.....where players line up is not on the officials....and receivers should not just assume because they put their arm forward or back that that means they are lined up properly....that may be their "intent" to be on or off, but it doesn'r mean you "ARE" on or off......lining up properly is pop warner type stuff....shouldn't be an issue

 

[Stinkin Ref]

CFL game, that would have been a challenge and taken out to the 25. NFL needs this shaddy **** so they can shave when they need to. Its a racket

The CFL also gives 1 point on a missed FG that goes through the end zone. So we aren't talking the gold standard of leagues here

Meh, players should learn how to do things right. If your coach has motion, do it right. If you are running a screen play and as a LG you are 3 yards downfield, don't do it. If you hit a QB low, don't do it. More concerning is the inconsistency of the flags.

They could probably throw one every play. I'd like to see them be able to determine if a penalty impacted a play, and pick it up if it didn't. like throw the holding flag, but then scoop it up if the defender was to the right but the play was run left.

they already do this .....you very rarely see a holding call unless it is at the point of attack....

 

[Stinkin Ref]

There is a solution to too many flags,or flogs,or frogs...
Full time officials.
Not attorneys and engineers on a long weekend pursuing a part time job.

most of the penalties that are being discussed here are infractions by the players that are automatic......being a full time official doesn't help with those...."judgement calls" might be open for discussion....

 

[Stinkin Ref]

I agree. Some potential solutions.

The illegal formation is an unnecessary foul. Simple replace that with a side judge holding his arm up until the offense is properly lined up. No harm no foul.

Add 2 more yards before illegal man down field.

Who cares if a WR in on the line of scrimmage or back a foot. As long as they are not over the line of scrimmage. All the ticky tacky flags last night and the most blatant one on Darnold who had his head almost ripped off is not called. Not that it would have changed the outcome.

Then you have Stafford whiner for a flag for anyone who come close to him. Stafford was not like that in his earlier days.

where you line up is huge....it is a factor in eligibility...

 

[JohnnyU]

Should be able to review for a penalty in last 2 minutes. That blatant missed face mask shouldn’t have to stand.

Don't all scoring plays get automatically reviewed? I didn't understand why that play can't be subject to review...

Judgment calls can't be reviewed even if the play is otherwise automatically reviewed.

What was the judgement? Whether he broke his neck or just sprained it?

Not funny if that had happened, but I get the humor -

Yeah, not much judgement involved when a guys head goes from 6 feet above sea level to Bryce level faster than an Amari drop.

When a players helmet comes off I usually tell my wife I hope his head isn't in that helmet.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

In my 40+ years of watching NFL football, I can't remember seeing so many flags thrown for ticky tack procedural infractions like illegal shifts, illegal formations, dirty underwear, etc., and there also seems to be an uptick in false starts, offsides and everything in between. Flags, flags, flags, on back-to-back-to-back plays, then a little mistake-free football, followed by more flags. I'm not a fan of this and I feel like the NFL is not putting its best product on the field. It's getting to the point where I'd almost rather watch the stats on NFL.com, and the post-game highlights, than a live game. I don't have any real data here, just my general observation that games are not flowing along like they used to back in the day, and watching games is not as fun as it used to be. The on-field interviews are also terrible, plus all the injuries, the stupid new kickoff rules ... sigh. Am I just an old man screaming at clouds or WTF is going on here? I feel like Goodell and the rest of these idiots are ruining the game I love.

most of these penalties you list (besides dirty underwear) are no brainers and automatic calls that have to be called...and have for years....all of those are on the players and pop warner type penalties.....it has nothing to do with "officials throwing too many flags"....it has to do with teams making too many stupid, silly, basic football mistakes....and why?...well part of it is because what it comes down to is the offense is trying to squeeze every little ounce of advantage that they can pre snap....they get fancy with formations and motions and cadence by the QB and changing plays and adjusting at the line of scrimmage.....these lineman are often getting set and then things change three times, etc....I also don't think short weeks help very much as play on short weeks is usually a little more "sloppy"....although I have seen some SNF and MNF that were sloppy too.....but with so many games being one score games, teams often fail to focus on the basic things and are worried about gaining any little advantage everywhere they possibly can...and when you try to do too much....simple mistakes happen....

 

[FairWarning]

I agree. Some potential solutions.

The illegal formation is an unnecessary foul. Simple replace that with a side judge holding his arm up until the offense is properly lined up. No harm no foul.

Add 2 more yards before illegal man down field.

Who cares if a WR in on the line of scrimmage or back a foot. As long as they are not over the line of scrimmage. All the ticky tacky flags last night and the most blatant one on Darnold who had his head almost ripped off is not called. Not that it would have changed the outcome.

Then you have Stafford whiner for a flag for anyone who come close to him. Stafford was not like that in his earlier days.

where you line up is huge....it is a factor in eligibility...

Let’s eliminate the tackle eligible then. Make all the linemen wear numbers above 50 so it’s easier to see if they are lined up correctly, anyone else can line up how they want. This will eliminate the illegal formation.

 

[Harjiran]

You make some geat points, Stinkin Ref ... biased much? I kid. I wasn't trying to lay this all at the feet of the refs. Bottom line, the games are becoming unwatchable, in my opinion and apparently others. I think some of this is overzealousness on the part of the refs (with some under-zealousness as displayed at the end of last night's game), but I agree with folks who point out that the game has become complicated with all the shifts and feints, and maybe players are not being adequately prepared by the coaches. Has the game become too complex? I'm not sure what the answer here is, just sceaming at clouds I guess. But I think the NFL has the beginnings of a problem with end users here and they better address it in some way.

 

[Andy Dufresne]

Scoring plays aren't reviewed to see if a penalty was missed - not any that I've seen anyway. They're reviewed to see if the plane was broken or a catch was made etc., but not to see if an offensive lineman holding or a defensive back interfering was missed.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

Scoring plays aren't reviewed to see if a penalty was missed - not any that I've seen anyway. They're reviewed to see if the plane was broken or a catch was made etc., but not to see if an offensive lineman holding or a defensive back interfering was missed.

this 100%.... I think the NBA allows "things that may have been missed" to be reviewed and part of the "outcome" of the review....but no such thing in the NFL....nor should there be...

 

[Statorama]

Agree completely about sideline interviews. Totally pointless. Adds nothing to the broadcast.

"You're down at the half. What do you need to do to get back in this?"
"We need to play better."

"You're up at the half. What's the plan for the 2nd half to secure the win?"
"We need to keep it up."

During the Saints / Broncos game, and they questioned Payton at the half…he tried to give an actual answer, it was kind of off-putting and weird to hear something that wasn’t canned and boring.

 

[Statorama]

All I ask is that they be consistent. Refs have a hard on to call holding very closely and by the book? No problem. But there’s no way one team is holding 8 times and the other team only once. What angers fans more than anything is seeing your DB called for a ticky-tack PI, but then see your WR get assaulted and brutalized without a flag coming out. If your calling something, call it the same for both sides.

 

[Da Guru]

You make some geat points, Stinkin Ref ... biased much? I kid. I wasn't trying to lay this all at the feet of the refs. Bottom line, the games are becoming unwatchable, in my opinion and apparently others. I think some of this is overzealousness on the part of the refs (with some under-zealousness as displayed at the end of last night's game), but I agree with folks who point out that the game has become complicated with all the shifts and feints, and maybe players are not being adequately prepared by the coaches. Has the game become too complex? I'm not sure what the answer here is, just sceaming at clouds I guess. But I think the NFL has the beginnings of a problem with end users here and they better address it in some way.

What made it annoying last night was showing McVeigh after every play pacing up and down and covering his face while talking. Not sure why they felt the need to show him so much.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

WHISTLE BLOW!!!

"Illegal procedure on the OP, @Harjiran - 5 yard penalty and we'll re-write the post"

 

[Da Guru]

Scoring plays aren't reviewed to see if a penalty was missed - not any that I've seen anyway. They're reviewed to see if the plane was broken or a catch was made etc., but not to see if an offensive lineman holding or a defensive back interfering was missed.

this 100%.... I think the NBA allows "things that may have been missed" to be reviewed and part of the "outcome" of the review....but no such thing in the NFL....nor should there be...

The pace of the game is interrupted enough now. Score a TD, go to commercial, kick the PAT go to a commercial. Every punt or FG go to a commercial. At home I don't notice it as much but when I go to a Lion game in person you really notice as the players are all standing around for 2-3-4 minutes.

The can`t review every play to see if a penalty occurred as that would slow it even more, and there are penalties are pretty much every play that are not called anyway. The DBs grabbing and holding the jerseys of WRs is totally out of hand now. That is almost every play.

 

[JohnnyU]

All I ask is that they be consistent. Refs have a hard on to call holding very closely and by the book? No problem. But there’s no way one team is holding 8 times and the other team only once. What angers fans more than anything is seeing your DB called for a ticky-tack PI, but then see your WR get assaulted and brutalized without a flag coming out. If your calling something, call it the same for both sides.

…,but…..but…..but…..Patrick Mahomes must win.

 

[Ted Lange as your Bartender]

Scoring plays aren't reviewed to see if a penalty was missed - not any that I've seen anyway. They're reviewed to see if the plane was broken or a catch was made etc., but not to see if an offensive lineman holding or a defensive back interfering was missed.

this 100%.... I think the NBA allows "things that may have been missed" to be reviewed and part of the "outcome" of the review....but no such thing in the NFL....nor should there be...

The pace of the game is interrupted enough now. Score a TD, go to commercial, kick the PAT go to a commercial. Every punt or FG go to a commercial. At home I don't notice it as much but when I go to a Lion game in person you really notice as the players are all standing around for 2-3-4 minutes.

The can`t review every play to see if a penalty occurred as that would slow it even more, and there are penalties are pretty much every play that are not called anyway. The DBs grabbing and holding the jerseys of WRs is totally out of hand now. That is almost every play.

I agree that you shouldn’t use replay assist to call every procedural type penalty or illegal contact (holding/PI), things like that.

I do think you can make a case that replay assist be brought in for penalties that can put player safety at risk, and are generally pretty black and white when you see them on replay. Helmet-to-helmet, horse collar, face masks, and maybe even hip drop tackles though that might be a little to interpretative. It’s pretty rare that those type calls get missed as it is, so replay assist shouldn’t be too much of an interruption in those cases.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

CFL game, that would have been a challenge and taken out to the 25. NFL needs this shaddy **** so they can shave when they need to. Its a racket

The CFL also gives 1 point on a missed FG that goes through the end zone. So we aren't talking the gold standard of leagues here

Meh, players should learn how to do things right. If your coach has motion, do it right. If you are running a screen play and as a LG you are 3 yards downfield, don't do it. If you hit a QB low, don't do it. More concerning is the inconsistency of the flags.

They could probably throw one every play. I'd like to see them be able to determine if a penalty impacted a play, and pick it up if it didn't. like throw the holding flag, but then scoop it up if the defender was to the right but the play was run left.

they already do this .....you very rarely see a holding call unless it is at the point of attack....

I disagree with that. I saw two block in the back/hold penalties called on fair caught punts last week. And I see interior holds called on FG attempts at least once a week. Fact is they should probably let both sides hold all they want. That would eliminate 26% of penalties right there.

Fact remains, TV timeouts are what makes these games slower. There is a commercial every possible chance. Gotta make that $.

 

[BassNBrew]

You make some geat points, Stinkin Ref ... biased much? I kid. I wasn't trying to lay this all at the feet of the refs. Bottom line, the games are becoming unwatchable, in my opinion and apparently others. I think some of this is overzealousness on the part of the refs (with some under-zealousness as displayed at the end of last night's game), but I agree with folks who point out that the game has become complicated with all the shifts and feints, and maybe players are not being adequately prepared by the coaches. Has the game become too complex? I'm not sure what the answer here is, just sceaming at clouds I guess. But I think the NFL has the beginnings of a problem with end users here and they better address it in some way.

NFL TV Ratings Surge to Nine-Year High - Ministry of Sport

NFL viewership reaches 18.6 million in 2024, driven by star players and strategic matchups, reflecting a strong audience engagement trend.

ministryofsport.com

The only problem is that so many people are flocking to the NFL that you hear more complaints. Does anyone complain about baseball?

 

[Stinkin Ref]

CFL game, that would have been a challenge and taken out to the 25. NFL needs this shaddy **** so they can shave when they need to. Its a racket

The CFL also gives 1 point on a missed FG that goes through the end zone. So we aren't talking the gold standard of leagues here

Meh, players should learn how to do things right. If your coach has motion, do it right. If you are running a screen play and as a LG you are 3 yards downfield, don't do it. If you hit a QB low, don't do it. More concerning is the inconsistency of the flags.

They could probably throw one every play. I'd like to see them be able to determine if a penalty impacted a play, and pick it up if it didn't. like throw the holding flag, but then scoop it up if the defender was to the right but the play was run left.

they already do this .....you very rarely see a holding call unless it is at the point of attack....

I disagree with that. I saw two block in the back/hold penalties called on fair caught punts last week. And I see interior holds called on FG attempts at least once a week. Fact is they should probably let both sides hold all they want. That would eliminate 26% of penalties right there.

Fact remains, TV timeouts are what makes these games slower. There is a commercial every possible chance. Gotta make that $.

none of the plays you talked about have anything to do with my response about the point of attack.....the other post talked of a play going to the left but a hold being called on the right side....they don't do that

holds or block in the back on fair catches happen all the time because they involve players that have no idea if the guy signaled for a fair catch or not so they are playing as if there may be a return.....so there will be penalties called there....and holding someone who is attempting to block a FG probably qualifies as "the point of attack"...