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Transgender boy Mack Beggs wins Texas state girls' wrestling title (1 Viewer)

whiskey7 said:
I understand his parents were part of this process. We're not talking about getting a tattoo or pierced tongue here. Physically changing one's body from girl to boy to align with what they are feeling is a pretty major decision. I would think we would only want that decision to be made by someone on their own behalf once deemed fit to make that kind of long term serious call. Point is this decision was made before Mack had reached the age he is even permitted to choose what movies he can buy a ticket to on his own. 
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But at the tail end of the ideal period for doing this and not looking like Caitlyn Jenner. 

 
Biological girls compete with girls, everyone else competes with boys.  

 
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Henry Ford said:
Kids who are having a difficult time in school due to being different often have a very different experience after bringing tremendous positive attention to the school by, for instance, winning a state championship in something.  
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You mean by being jacked up on testosterone, basically being a guy, and having a clear unfair advantage, and calling all this negative attention? I'm sure you're right though. I'm sure her experience will be much more stellar. Sometimes people go out of their way to worry about every single person's feelings when the truth is, she's clearly different and that's on her. Choice or genetics, she's different and should not be allowed to compete in either gender group. Sometimes that's just the way it goes. Let her transgender, whatever, but her winning a state championship in girl's wrestling is BS. It just is.

 
proninja said:
As for the sports thing, It seems easy. 

If, as the result of your transition, you want to compete with a gender to whom you have a natural disadvantage, that's fine. If you want to compete with a gender to whom you have a natural ad advantage, no dice. 

Girls want to transition and compete with the boys? Absolutely. 6'8" Jimmy wants to transition and play hoops with the girls? Not so fast. 

The caster semeneya situation is different than this. She is intersex, not transitioning from one to the other, if I remember correctly 
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Yes, this really is the crux of the problem. I said a few times he shouldn't have wrestled girls due to a huge advantage given by testisterone shots. He should be wrestling boys.

I love your idea, but inevitably lawyers come knocking when Johnnys dad really wants his kid to have that trophy or hold the girls long jump record for the next 50 years. Unless the rules are written to account for every possibility...lawyers. And districts just can't afford that. I just hope this stuff doesn't eventually destroy girls sports at the high school level. 

 
T J said:
You mean by being jacked up on testosterone, basically being a guy, and having a clear unfair advantage, and calling all this negative attention? I'm sure you're right though. I'm sure her experience will be much more stellar. Sometimes people go out of their way to worry about every single person's feelings when the truth is, she's clearly different and that's on her. Choice or genetics, she's different and should not be allowed to compete in either gender group. Sometimes that's just the way it goes. Let her transgender, whatever, but her winning a state championship in girl's wrestling is BS. It just is.
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Then I guess the state should make its rules less stupid. 

 
Henry Ford said:
Then I guess the state should make its rules less stupid. 
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The rule will probably be changed now. When rules are made, they have no way of knowing every extreme situation that may arise. I highly doubt the rule was made thinking that one day a 15 year old chick will be pumping herself full of testosterone in order to become a boy.  I imagine they never thought a boy would take pride in beating up a bunch of girls in wrestling. So because he did, they will now be forced into changing the rule.  I bet the boy is going to take great pride bragging about how he is the girls state wrestling champ.  Impressive.

 
JuniorNB said:
The rule will probably be changed now. When rules are made, they have no way of knowing every extreme situation that may arise. I highly doubt the rule was made thinking that one day a 15 year old chick will be pumping herself full of testosterone in order to become a boy.  I imagine they never thought a boy would take pride in beating up a bunch of girls in wrestling. So because he did, they will now be forced into changing the rule.  I bet the boy is going to take great pride bragging about how he is the girls state wrestling champ.  Impressive.
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If he got a very stupid rule changed he has plenty to be proud of.  It will affect thousands of people.  Of course, I'm not convinced anything will change, but I hope it does. 

 
Henry Ford said:
If he got a very stupid rule changed he has plenty to be proud of.  It will affect thousands of people.  Of course, I'm not convinced anything will change, but I hope it does. 
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How would you change the rule? I'm sure you already posted your ideas, I apologize for being too lazy to dig through the thread.

 
squistion said:
Dude, your exact words, which I was responding to because you used the word "child" and said that a child can change their sex gender (not a minor and not a 14-18 year old as you later corrected it to):

      1 hour ago, Ditka Butkus said:

You can't buy a beer until you are 21 but as a child you can change your sex/ gender
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Posted 10 hours ago · Report post

  10 hours ago, squistion said:

So you are a child at 14 and an adult after that age in every jurisdiction in this country. Okie Dokie.

I added minor between 14 and 18 after your above post. As you incorrectly called them adults.

 
Jobber said:
How would you change the rule? I'm sure you already posted your ideas, I apologize for being too lazy to dig through the thread.
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I think just adopting the NCAA rules would be the way to go.  One year on transition hormones, and you belong in the other category is the main crux of it.

 
Henry Ford said:
Then I guess the state should make its rules less stupid. 
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The rule should be written to exclude - not find a way to include. Sometimes life ain't fair and the presumption of fairness should fall on the side of the majority, not skewed to allow "fairness" to the vast minority (i.e. transgender in this instance). Sucks for her, but, like I said, sometimes life just ain't fair. 

 
mr roboto said:
So during the year transition is the athlete out of sports?
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For that year:

1.    A trans male (FTM) student-athlete who has received a medical exception for treatment with testosterone for diagnosed Gender Identity Disorder or gender dysphoria and/or Transsexualism, for purposes of NCAA competition may compete on a men’s team, but is no longer eligible to compete on a women’s team without changing that team status to a mixed team.

2.    A trans female (MTF) student-athlete being treated with testosterone suppression medication for Gender Identity Disorder or gender dysphoria and/or Transsexualism, for the purposes of NCAA competition may continue to compete on a men’s team but may not compete on a women’s team without changing it to a mixed team status until completing one calendar year of testosterone suppression treatment.

 
T J said:
The rule should be written to exclude - not find a way to include. Sometimes life ain't fair and the presumption of fairness should fall on the side of the majority, not skewed to allow "fairness" to the vast minority (i.e. transgender in this instance). Sucks for her, but, like I said, sometimes life just ain't fair. 
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Sometimes life ain't fair so we should make the rules more fair.  Got it.

 
Henry Ford said:
For that year:

1.    A trans male (FTM) student-athlete who has received a medical exception for treatment with testosterone for diagnosed Gender Identity Disorder or gender dysphoria and/or Transsexualism, for purposes of NCAA competition may compete on a men’s team, but is no longer eligible to compete on a women’s team without changing that team status to a mixed team.

2.    A trans female (MTF) student-athlete being treated with testosterone suppression medication for Gender Identity Disorder or gender dysphoria and/or Transsexualism, for the purposes of NCAA competition may continue to compete on a men’s team but may not compete on a women’s team without changing it to a mixed team status until completing one calendar year of testosterone suppression treatment.
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So in both cases they can compete in the men's division (ostensibly the tougher competition). Seems reasonable. 

 
Henry Ford said:
Sometimes life ain't fair so we should make the rules more fair.  Got it.
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i understand what you're saying but you conveniently ignored the part where I said the rules should favor the majority. In an instance like this where the majority is put at the disadvantage in favor of one, then yes, the rule should favor the majority and not the one. The sometimes "life ain't fair" comment was clearly directed toward the girl transgendering, but you twisted it the other way. Not surprised, but that's indeed what you did. 

 
T J said:
The rule should be written to exclude - not find a way to include. Sometimes life ain't fair and the presumption of fairness should fall on the side of the majority, not skewed to allow "fairness" to the vast minority (i.e. transgender in this instance). Sucks for her, but, like I said, sometimes life just ain't fair. 
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It doesn't suck for her. This is a choice she's making. She wants to wrestle, postpone her transition till after the season of her senior year. If she's in that much of a hurry to start with the testosterone, she does so knowing her high school sports are over. Why is everyone acting like this kid got cancer or something?  Life is all about choices.

 
JuniorNB said:
It doesn't suck for her. This is a choice she's making. She wants to wrestle, postpone her transition till after the season of her senior year. If she's in that much of a hurry to start with the testosterone, she does so knowing her high school sports are over. Why is everyone acting like this kid got cancer or something?  Life is all about choices.
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I agree with this too.

 
JuniorNB said:
It doesn't suck for her. This is a choice she's making. She wants to wrestle, postpone her transition till after the season of her senior year. If she's in that much of a hurry to start with the testosterone, she does so knowing her high school sports are over. Why is everyone acting like this kid got cancer or something?  Life is all about choices.
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Yeah but she did what the school's rules allowed her to do. I'd love to see all the times in your life you turned down an advantage because a school/city/state/federal rule gave you one. 

:popcorn:

 
mr roboto said:
Yeah but she did what the school's rules allowed her to do. I'd love to see all the times in your life you turned down an advantage because a school/city/state/federal rule gave you one. 

:popcorn:
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I can honestly say that if my only way to compete is to go up against all females, I would skip the high school season and concentrate on camps and tournaments. I would take absolutely no pride in beating up chicks. And I'd be absolutely embarrassed to accept a medal.

 
JuniorNB said:
I can honestly say that if my only way to compete is to go up against all females, I would skip the high school season and concentrate on camps and tournaments. I would take absolutely no pride in beating up chicks. And I'd be absolutely embarrassed to accept a medal.
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But you've always been a dude (I assume). So yeah obviously. She's still transitioning. 

 
Anyone think we shouldn't allow any transgenders from competing in Highschool Sports?

Or at least throw them all together in a bubble like we do the Special Needs kids?

 
Can't they just go back to the shadows, getting bullied and killing themselves at unprecedented rates? MAGA!

 
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The Busy The Tired said:
They're neither male or female by altering their body chemistry they relinquish their right to compete the same way a High School kid who takes steroids does.

Parity does not make me a bigot.
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It appears that you don't know what parity or bigot mean

 
Henry Ford said:
Yes, I'm very much known for my idealistic view of the world filled with rainbows and tweety birds. 
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I like mine to have unicorns pooping sherbet, and Sandra Bullock and Halle Berry perpetually in their mid 20's.  Oh, and a whole herd of young Alexandra Pauls, sort of a guilty pleasure of mine.

 
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Henry Ford said:
Yes, I'm very much known for my idealistic view of the world filled with rainbows and tweety birds. 
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I don't agree with you on pretty much anything, so ya, that's definitely my impression of you.

 
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