University of Idaho college student murders - suspect arrested (1 Viewer)

[Zegras11]

He waived extradition and has an Idaho attorney now. Anne Taylor out of Kootenai County, which looks to be about two hours from Latah County where the crimes occurred. Not surprising in that it appears there are no death-penalty certified attorneys in that rural part of the state, and I assume the DP will be in play. Court ruled he has to be returned to Idaho within 10 days (though I don't expect it will take that long).

How does an attorney become death penalty-certified?

by submitting FBG song lists in the wrong format.

 

[fatness]

I get the feeling that the Moscow ID police want him in their custody to start building a case against him, which they haven't built yet.

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

Really? I would hope they are pretty far along.

 

[General Malaise]

So apparently, this guy's dad flew out to drive back with him cross country. For those of us who have driven across this country, I'll state the obvious - that is a LONG drive through mostly rural, rugged, baren landscape. I have to imagine the dad brought up the murders at some point. I mean, I run out of things to talk about with my wife after about 73 miles.

Also, when did they leave? How long was this guy in the area before departure east? When did they put out an alert for his vehicle? Having been to Pullman and Moscow (they are right next to each other) numerous times, a more isolated dot on our map you will not find. The biggest city with a decent sized airport is Spokane and that's a pretty long drive with windy, twisty roads through farmland and nothingness. He couldn't have been hiding out at home very long, but I also don't believe he floored it to PA right after if his dad flew in to drive back with him. Maybe this guy drove up to Spokane to hide, grab his dad and then go?


Lotta questions. The guy waived extradition hearing and is on his way back to Idaho to face the music. Terribly sad and tragic for the families, friends and community. And for what? Why?

Idaho has the death penalty. Hasn't put anybody to death in 10 years. I have a feeling that's about to change.

They put out the alert for the white Hyundai Elantra on Dec. 7. Apparently the guy finished up the semester, which for PhD students went through something like Dec. 9. Estimates are that he and dad drove back Dec 14-16 or thereabouts. All this meaning that the guy stayed in town for like a month after the murders, just going about his life!

Reading now they arrived in PA on DEC 13. Got pulled over twice in Indiana, an hour apart for speeding and tailgating.

Yeah, there's bodycam footage out now from the tailgating stop by Indiana State Police.

Impressive considering not a few hours ago, Indiana State Police had assured everyone no such stops had occurred

Not the same Indiana that bungled the Delphi murders! Police Chief Wiggums has some splaining to do.

A whole lot of info coming out about this guy from former students and old friends. The story from Daily Mail (I know) about the woman in the jail cell next to his is just bizarre.

That story has already been debunked - wasn't him.

I was wondering what a guy suspected of killing 4 college students was doing in a cell next to a woman accused of domestic violence.

 

[krista4]

I get the feeling that the Moscow ID police want him in their custody to start building a case against him, which they haven't built yet.

I know nothing of this stuff and wonder what roverfish or Woz might say, but at the PA state police press conference yesterday, both the police and the DA who spoke mentioned that they had to show "additional probable cause" to the PA judge in order to serve a warrant when they did, at "hours of darkness." They had 50 tactical people serving a no-knock warrant at 2 a.m., busting windows and doors, which apparently requires additional scrutiny (and should IMO). Based on that, I believe that have some pretty solid evidence already (which doesn't mean he's guilty, of course).

 

[facook]

I mean, the dna connection to material found on scene seems like strong enough circumstantial evidence for the warrant(s), not that I know jack squat about law.

 

[krista4]

Looks like he'll be landing back in Idaho within minutes. Once he has his first hearing, the probable cause affidavit is allowed to be released under Idaho law, assuming there's no motion to seal it. Reminder for those who, like me, know nearly nothing of criminal law that the PCA does not have to contain all of the evidence they might have. It just needs to contain enough to give a basis for the arrest warrant. So while it will give us more information about the basis for his arrest, it won't necessarily show us everything.

 

[krista4]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

 

[-fish-]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

story going around twitter is that FBI instructed Indiana patrol to make the stops to get images of him and specifically his hands on video. That would explain why the stops were weird and he didn't get cited for anything or have to show registration or insurance either time.

 

[krista4]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

story going around twitter is that FBI instructed Indiana patrol to make the stops to get images of him and specifically his hands on video. That would explain why the stops were weird and he didn't get cited for anything or have to show registration or insurance either time.

Yeah, I've seen those but wasn't sure whether to believe that. Do you find it credible? In the first stop, what I found weird was his behavior, talking about "going for Thai food" and bringing up the Pullman shooting out of nowhere.

 

[-fish-]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

story going around twitter is that FBI instructed Indiana patrol to make the stops to get images of him and specifically his hands on video. That would explain why the stops were weird and he didn't get cited for anything or have to show registration or insurance either time.

Yeah, I've seen those but wasn't sure whether to believe that. Do you find it credible? In the first stop, what I found weird was his behavior, talking about "going for Thai food" and bringing up the Pullman shooting out of nowhere.

It doesn't seem completely far-fetched, and it would explain how odd both of those stops were. "License and registration" is pretty much automatic. Neither one asked for registration, although one did ask if it was his car. I've also never even heard of someone getting pulled over for tailgating. Twice in one day? I can believe that something else was going on.

Fox is reporting it as fact, saying they have a law enforcement source that the FBI directed the stops. Of course, it's Fox and an anonymous source, so who knows.

 

[krista4]

It doesn't seem completely far-fetched, and it would explain how odd both of those stops were. "License and registration" is pretty much automatic. Neither one asked for registration, although one did ask if it was his car. I've also never even heard of someone getting pulled over for tailgating. Twice in one day? I can believe that something else was going on.

Fox is reporting it as fact, saying they have a law enforcement source that the FBI directed the stops. Of course, it's Fox and an anonymous source, so who knows.

Ah, good point about the registration; didn't even notice that.

I might know someone who has been pulled over for following too closely. It might be that such person was unknowingly following an unmarked police car, though.

 

[massraider]

It doesn't seem completely far-fetched, and it would explain how odd both of those stops were. "License and registration" is pretty much automatic. Neither one asked for registration, although one did ask if it was his car. I've also never even heard of someone getting pulled over for tailgating. Twice in one day? I can believe that something else was going on.

Fox is reporting it as fact, saying they have a law enforcement source that the FBI directed the stops. Of course, it's Fox and an anonymous source, so who knows.

I have never heard of a situation like this before. The FBI had a single cop approach a car with two men in it, one of whom they think killed 4 people....twice?

 

[Desert_Power]

It doesn't seem completely far-fetched, and it would explain how odd both of those stops were. "License and registration" is pretty much automatic. Neither one asked for registration, although one did ask if it was his car. I've also never even heard of someone getting pulled over for tailgating. Twice in one day? I can believe that something else was going on.

Fox is reporting it as fact, saying they have a law enforcement source that the FBI directed the stops. Of course, it's Fox and an anonymous source, so who knows.

I have never heard of a situation like this before. The FBI had a single cop approach a car with two men in it, one of whom they think killed 4 people....twice?

It’s a ploy to motivate true crime podcasters

 

[fatness]

I get the feeling that the Moscow ID police want him in their custody to start building a case against him, which they haven't built yet.

I know nothing of this stuff and wonder what roverfish or Woz might say, but at the PA state police press conference yesterday, both the police and the DA who spoke mentioned that they had to show "additional probable cause" to the PA judge in order to serve a warrant when they did, at "hours of darkness." They had 50 tactical people serving a no-knock warrant at 2 a.m., busting windows and doors, which apparently requires additional scrutiny (and should IMO). Based on that, I believe that have some pretty solid evidence already (which doesn't mean he's guilty, of course).

The bolded sounds like a weak case for the warrant. The 50 tactical people serving a no-knock warrant sounds like overkill based on the reports of one cop stopping him, twice, while driving so they could get a good photo of him. Couple that with the fact this his lawyer said he agreed to extradition so he could go see what he was charged with, and what the charges were based on, since he was not allowed to see that where he was arrested, and that seems shaky.

I'm just playing devils advocate here and don't pretend to know all the details of the case.

But I don't automatically trust the police or prosecutors, and when the public is calling the police force dummies for making no progress on the case I recognize the police have additional motivation to arrest someone.

 

[-fish-]

I get the feeling that the Moscow ID police want him in their custody to start building a case against him, which they haven't built yet.

I know nothing of this stuff and wonder what roverfish or Woz might say, but at the PA state police press conference yesterday, both the police and the DA who spoke mentioned that they had to show "additional probable cause" to the PA judge in order to serve a warrant when they did, at "hours of darkness." They had 50 tactical people serving a no-knock warrant at 2 a.m., busting windows and doors, which apparently requires additional scrutiny (and should IMO). Based on that, I believe that have some pretty solid evidence already (which doesn't mean he's guilty, of course).

The bolded sounds like a weak case for the warrant. The 50 tactical people serving a no-knock warrant sounds like overkill based on the reports of one cop stopping him, twice, while driving so they could get a good photo of him. Couple that with the fact this his lawyer said he agreed to extradition so he could go see what he was charged with, and what the charges were based on, since he was not allowed to see that where he was arrested, and that seems shaky.

I'm just playing devils advocate here and don't pretend to know all the details of the case.

But I don't automatically trust the police or prosecutors, and when the public is calling the police force dummies for making no progress on the case I recognize the police have additional motivation to arrest someone.

I think they have him dead to rights. I think he planned it and thought he got away with it, but he screwed up because his DNA was under someone's fingernails or something and his car was at the scene. 50 people on a no knock warrant for someone that killed 4 people isn't overkill at all.

 

[[scooter]]

It doesn't seem completely far-fetched, and it would explain how odd both of those stops were. "License and registration" is pretty much automatic. Neither one asked for registration, although one did ask if it was his car. I've also never even heard of someone getting pulled over for tailgating. Twice in one day? I can believe that something else was going on.

Fox is reporting it as fact, saying they have a law enforcement source that the FBI directed the stops. Of course, it's Fox and an anonymous source, so who knows.

I have never heard of a situation like this before. The FBI had a single cop approach a car with two men in it, one of whom they think killed 4 people....twice?

How did the FBI know when the car was going to be traveling through Indiana (and where)?

Also, did the FBI tell the police that this was a murder suspect? Because in the video I saw, the cop was pretty nonchalant.

 

[simey]

How did the FBI know when the car was going to be traveling through Indiana (and where)?

Also, did the FBI tell the police that this was a murder suspect? Because in the video I saw, the cop was pretty nonchalant.

They started tracking him before he left Idaho/Washington. He was under surveillance by multiple FBI teams, which included being handed off to new teams in different areas of his trip. They had to be very careful in rural PA to not be noticed and stand out. While he was being surveilled in PA, investigators and the prosecutors were working on a probable cause warrant, and when they got it they arrested him. This is all according to an FBI guy, and he didn't mention anything about the police pulling Kohberger over.

 

[the moops]

I have never heard of a situation like this before. The FBI had a single cop approach a car with two men in it, one of whom they think killed 4 people....twice?

Imagine the **** storm if this is/was true and something happened to the cop. I don't believe this to be true at all, for what it's worth

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

I have never heard of a situation like this before. The FBI had a single cop approach a car with two men in it, one of whom they think killed 4 people....twice?

Imagine the **** storm if this is/was true and something happened to the cop. I don't believe this to be true at all, for what it's worth

This case is so weird, its hard to believe its true but who knows. I cant imagine who would have leaked it though that the FBI instructed the police to pull him over. It does sound like BS. The second body cam captured the door handle mostly so if they were trying to get footage of BK, they did a terrible job.

Its probably BS and was just overzealous Indiana cops pulling over an out of state plate. They like to do that.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

I have never heard of a situation like this before. The FBI had a single cop approach a car with two men in it, one of whom they think killed 4 people....twice?

Imagine the **** storm if this is/was true and something happened to the cop. I don't believe this to be true at all, for what it's worth

I’m not going to link it but in a different incident awhile back a cops window sued the F out of the department that had him pull over a known armed and dangerous cartel member without informing the officer how dangerous the person was.

 

[Jaysus]

the probable cause affidavit is allowed to be released under Idaho law,

It's out now... full document available here. : https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case...it - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf

 

[krista4]

the probable cause affidavit is allowed to be released under Idaho law,

It's out now... full document available here. : https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf

It's...a lot. Really surprising stuff in there, such as one of the surviving roommates having seen the killer!

 

[krista4]

By the way, if you find the Idaho site crashing or slow, you can see the whole thing here.

 

[Jaysus]

the probable cause affidavit is allowed to be released under Idaho law,

It's out now... full document available here. : https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf

It's...a lot. Really surprising stuff in there, such as one of the surviving roommates having seen the killer!

it is quite detailed, very shocking, and extremely sad :(

 

[krista4]

it is quite detailed, very shocking, and extremely sad :(

I agree on all of that. What's still unknown is why? Looks like he had been watching them for a while. Why???

 

[General Malaise]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

story going around twitter is that FBI instructed Indiana patrol to make the stops to get images of him and specifically his hands on video. That would explain why the stops were weird and he didn't get cited for anything or have to show registration or insurance either time.

That's kind of what I was thinking. Also was curious if they were able to obtain any DNA in those stops.

 

[krista4]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

story going around twitter is that FBI instructed Indiana patrol to make the stops to get images of him and specifically his hands on video. That would explain why the stops were weird and he didn't get cited for anything or have to show registration or insurance either time.

That's kind of what I was thinking. Also was curious if they were able to obtain any DNA in those stops.

The info was recently released, but they got his dad's DNA from their trash. That's how they matched him.

 

[Jaysus]

Also, the video of the first time he and his dad were stopped in Indiana was released today. It was odd and interesting, I thought.

story going around twitter is that FBI instructed Indiana patrol to make the stops to get images of him and specifically his hands on video. That would explain why the stops were weird and he didn't get cited for anything or have to show registration or insurance either time.

That's kind of what I was thinking. Also was curious if they were able to obtain any DNA in those stops.

The info was recently released, but they got his dad's DNA from their trash. That's how they matched him.

that sounds like the extra probable cause that the PA state troopers needed.

 

[eoMMan]

By the way, if you find the Idaho site crashing or slow, you can see the whole thing here.

For a PhD student (or anyone really), this guy isn’t that bright.

 

[eoMMan]

Still wondering about why the four (did he see one previously and become obsessed) and why he didn’t murder the roommate who saw him.

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

It doesn't sound like he left much dna behind, just a tiny bit on the knife sheath. I would have thought there would have been more left behind.
Also Dylan the downstairs roomate saw him and he just walked right by her? That's surprising in itself. Why did they wait until the next day to call the police?

 

[the moops]

The info was recently released, but they got his dad's DNA from their trash. That's how they matched him.

Love this twist in the story. They had suspects DNA from the knife sheath, but didn't need to match it to the suspect, because they could match if to the father and conclude with 99.998% that it was him. Fascinating

 

[General Malaise]

It doesn't sound like he left much dna behind, just a tiny bit on the knife sheath. I would have thought there would have been more left behind.
Also Dylan the downstairs roomate saw him and he just walked right by her? That's surprising in itself. Why did they wait until the next day to call the police?

yeah, that's bizarre.

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

It doesn't sound like he left much dna behind, just a tiny bit on the knife sheath. I would have thought there would have been more left behind.
Also Dylan the downstairs roomate saw him and he just walked right by her? That's surprising in itself. Why did they wait until the next day to call the police?

yeah, that's bizarre.

I mean she had to be doing drugs that night, that's the only thing that makes sense. Perhaps was a little messed up herself and maybe even questioning what she saw. Also maybe not in a state to call the cops if she was f'd up.
That's as solid a theory as any

 

[facook]

the probable cause affidavit is allowed to be released under Idaho law,

It's out now... full document available here. : https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf

It's...a lot. Really surprising stuff in there, such as one of the surviving roommates having seen the killer!

Still wondering about why the four (did he see one previously and become obsessed) and why he didn’t murder the roommate who saw him.

"D.M." must be so traumatized. :(

Total conjecture, but he was obviously planning it out. I wonder if he randomly encountered and became obsessed with one of the girls over the period of a few months.

 

[krista4]

I mean she had to be doing drugs that night, that's the only thing that makes sense. Perhaps was a little messed up herself and maybe even questioning what she saw. Also maybe not in a state to call the cops if she was f'd up.
That's as solid a theory as any

This is a very good theory.

 

[krista4]

When Ted Bundy killed the women in the sorority house, he left survivors as well, including one who saw him leave. Kinda eerie.

 

[krista4]

Also, she heard a male say "It's OK, I'm going to help you." She had heard crying but not screaming or anything like that (that we know of). It's only looking back now that we know there were murders that we think it should have been obvious there were issues, but this girl didn't have any reason to jump immediately from "I saw a guy and heard some crying" to "my friends have been stabbed to death." This was known as a party house with tons of people coming and going all the time.

 

[General Malaise]

It doesn't sound like he left much dna behind, just a tiny bit on the knife sheath. I would have thought there would have been more left behind.
Also Dylan the downstairs roomate saw him and he just walked right by her? That's surprising in itself. Why did they wait until the next day to call the police?

yeah, that's bizarre.

I mean she had to be doing drugs that night, that's the only thing that makes sense. Perhaps was a little messed up herself and maybe even questioning what she saw. Also maybe not in a state to call the cops if she was f'd up.
That's as solid a theory as any

From the Daily Beast:

University of Idaho undergrad Dylan Mortensen said she first woke up around 4 a.m. on Nov. 13 to what she assumed was the sound of her roommate, Kaylee Goncalves, playing with her dog upstairs.

A short time later, Mortensen thought she heard her 21-year-old friend say, “There’s someone here.” But when Mortensen looked out of her bedroom, she didn’t see a thing. She peeked outside her bedroom door a second time when she heard crying coming from the bedroom of her other roommate, Xana Kernodle.

“It’s ok, I’m going to help you,” Mortensen told authorities she heard a male voice say.

Shocked Neighbors of Idaho Suspect Say He Was a ‘Lone Wolf’

The third time Mortensen opened her bedroom door to a far more terrifying sight: “a figure clad in black clothing and a mask that covered the person’s mouth and nose walking toward her.” But the masked man just walked past her and left the home from the back sliding glass door as she just stood there in “frozen shock.”

Hours later, Mortensen would learn that three of her roommates—and one of their boyfriends—had been brutally murdered.

That’s according to a probable cause affidavit unsealed Thursday, which lays out previously unknown details about what happened in the Moscow, Idaho, rental home the night of the shocking murders that have since captured national attention.

Investigators “believe the homicides occurred between 4:00 a.m. and 4:25 a.m.,” the affidavit states.

One of the surviving roommates—it has not been revealed which it was—called 911 at 11:58 a.m., police revealed more than a week after the deadly scene unfolded. Cops said “multiple people” spoke to the dispatcher on that call, which is not mentioned in the affidavit, but was made from one of the roommates’ phones.

:(
That poor kid. Ugh.

 

[General Malaise]

Also, she heard a male say "It's OK, I'm going to help you." She had heard crying but not screaming or anything like that (that we know of). It's only looking back now that we know there were murders that we think it should have been obvious there were issues, but this girl didn't have any reason to jump immediately from "I saw a guy and some crying" to "my friends have been stabbed to death." This was known as a party house with tons of people coming and going all the time.

Yeah, and at 4am or whenever it was the brain is foggy on a non-party sleep night. Guessing she just fell back into a deep slumber considering the 11am call time to 911. My two sons were home from college over the break; it was a minor miracle if either made an appearance before noon.

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

I mean she had to be doing drugs that night, that's the only thing that makes sense. Perhaps was a little messed up herself and maybe even questioning what she saw. Also maybe not in a state to call the cops if she was f'd up.
That's as solid a theory as any

This is a very good theory.

Its only a good theory because I know it all too well firsthand

 

[jobarules]

So they have DNA on a knife sheath, surveillance video of his car in the area at the time of the murders, a witness that saw a masked man with bushy eyebrows, and cell phone records of him being in the area 12 other times. Is that enough to convict? Jeez not a lot to go on.

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

So they have DNA on a knife sheath, surveillance video of his car in the area at the time of the murders, a witness that saw a masked man with bushy eyebrows, and cell phone records of him being in the area 12 other times. Is that enough to convict? Jeez not a lot to go on.

I can't tell if this is sarcasm but honestly I hope they have a lot more.
A good defense attorney would be able to cast a lot of doubt I think as it stands right now. They are going to have a lot of material to work with since its a known party house.
Im sure he did it but trials are no slam dunks as we know

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

The one thing they seemingly don't have in all this surveillance is a license plate? That would be a nice to have

Edit to say the cell phone data does seem to tie him to the car so at least there is that

 

[jobarules]

So they have DNA on a knife sheath, surveillance video of his car in the area at the time of the murders, a witness that saw a masked man with bushy eyebrows, and cell phone records of him being in the area 12 other times. Is that enough to convict? Jeez not a lot to go on.

I can't tell if this is sarcasm but honestly I hope they have a lot more.
A good defense attorney would be able to cast a lot of doubt I think as it stands right now. They are going to have a lot of material to work with since its a known party house.
Im sure he did it but trials are no slam dunks as we know

I wasnt being sarcastic at all

 

[jobarules]

All the lawyer has to do is say the guy was at the house for parties in the past and left his knife sheath behind.

Also I realize this is an arrest warrant so maybe they have more.

 

[Dwayne Hoover]

Someone took his knife? I can't believe no blood at all was left behind or there isn't more dna than this. Its good what they have just was expecting more

 

[the moops]

So they have DNA on a knife sheath, surveillance video of his car in the area at the time of the murders, a witness that saw a masked man with bushy eyebrows, and cell phone records of him being in the area 12 other times. Is that enough to convict? Jeez not a lot to go on.

They don't lay out their whole case in the affidavit. Just enough to get the warrant. Chances are they have loads more stuff that place him at the scene that night

 

[krista4]

All the lawyer has to do is say the guy was at the house for parties in the past and left his knife sheath behind.

@Zow wants you on his juries.