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US Men's National Team (27 Viewers)

Shocked Arriola is on there.  I know someone posted about him starting training again, I was just assuming he wasn't going to be fit enough this year.  Maybe I'm misremembering his injury.

No CP sucks but the writing was on the wall there.  Part of me wonders if as the USMNT starts to have players that are integral to big clubs like Chelsea that we don't start seeing them miss a lot of windows deemed less critical.  Nobody can be happy about sending their key guys into steel cage matches in Concacaf in the middle of the season.

 
Dr_Zaius said:
Shocked Arriola is on there.  I know someone posted about him starting training again, I was just assuming he wasn't going to be fit enough this year.  Maybe I'm misremembering his injury.

No CP sucks but the writing was on the wall there.  Part of me wonders if as the USMNT starts to have players that are integral to big clubs like Chelsea that we don't start seeing them miss a lot of windows deemed less critical.  Nobody can be happy about sending their key guys into steel cage matches in Concacaf in the middle of the season.
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We dont have the luxury of leaving a healthy CP out of the lineup. 1 point would made the difference last cycle.

Its an official FIFA window for a reason.  If guys get hurt....them's the breaks.

 
I think the other consideration for Konrad is that he's pretty exclusively a left-sided player.  If we consider Aaronson the starter there, then it seems that Hoppe won the backup LW slot (probably helped by the fact that he can also be the #3 ST).  Arriola can play both sides, but usually plays on the right for the Nats and is probably Weah's back-up on this team.  

 
TLEF316 said:
We dont have the luxury of leaving a healthy CP out of the lineup. 1 point would made the difference last cycle.

Its an official FIFA window for a reason.  If guys get hurt....them's the breaks.
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But, as Bruce Arena points out, there are two more games this cycle.  More games PROBABLY means more margin of error.  

 
If I'm picking from this roster, my lineup for Jamaica.....

                                                 Turner

                       Dest       Richards       Miles       Robinson

                                                  Adams

                                        Weston    Musah

                     Weah                   Pepi                     Aaronson

My guess is Greg does NOT slide Weston right back into the lineup. I also have a feeling he starts Nips. I bet he plays either Brooks or even REAM at LCB as well.  (moving Robinson over and bumping the inexperienced Richards)

I know Brooks only had a couple of bad games, but with Jamaica's speed, he really worries me (although I guess Bailey is out right now)

 
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Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
I think the other consideration for Konrad is that he's pretty exclusively a left-sided player.  If we consider Aaronson the starter there, then it seems that Hoppe won the backup LW slot (probably helped by the fact that he can also be the #3 ST).  Arriola can play both sides, but usually plays on the right for the Nats and is probably Weah's back-up on this team.  
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and tbf to your earlier post about KDF, his defending isn't quite at national team levels. 

But I'm with TLEF about needing that offensive player to break down a low block. 

Part of why I'm good with Dest getting pushed up and playing that role- nobody else outside of CP as good at beating a guy off the dribble as him (Konrad too).

 
TLEF316 said:
To me, its more about the skill set. With CP and Gio both out, they're missing 2 of their better "break guys down" guys. Konrad brings that potential. 
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This.

Plus, the kid is 20 and has gotten significant minutes this year on a brand new team that is top 5 in the table of a top 5 league in Europe.  That's exactly the kind of stuff we're looking for.  Playing time (and significant minutes) on a quality team in a quality league.  That should always be the gold standard. 

It's hard to argue that he doesn't merit being in a group of 27 that is missing guys at his position like Gio and Pulisic.  He's in form and he has a potential bright future as a USMNT guy. 

He's not much different than a guy like Weah.  Except Weah has netted 1 total goal in 13 appearances with USMNT.  Konrad has gotten 3 appearances (and one of those was only 7 minutes).

I think his exclusion is absolutely shocking.

 
gianmarco said:
This.

Plus, the kid is 20 and has gotten significant minutes this year on a brand new team that is top 5 in the table of a top 5 league in Europe.  That's exactly the kind of stuff we're looking for.  Playing time (and significant minutes) on a quality team in a quality league.  That should always be the gold standard. 

It's hard to argue that he doesn't merit being in a group of 27 that is missing guys at his position like Gio and Pulisic.  He's in form and he has a potential bright future as a USMNT guy. 

He's not much different than a guy like Weah.  Except Weah has netted 1 total goal in 13 appearances with USMNT.  Konrad has gotten 3 appearances (and one of those was only 7 minutes).

I think his exclusion is absolutely shocking.
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I mean, Konrad has zero goals and 2 assists in his entire senior career.  And yeah, that's a limited sample size, but that's kind of the point.  

 
TLEF316 said:
We dont have the luxury of leaving a healthy CP out of the lineup. 1 point would made the difference last cycle.

Its an official FIFA window for a reason.  If guys get hurt....them's the breaks.
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Oh I agree.  Despite the team being on paper good enough to get 6+ points this window I'm very worried going in without Pulisic and Reyna.

And I get how the windows are "supposed" to work, but what's to stop a coach leaning on GGG behind the scenes?  Players getting acclimated to new teams is already cited as a reason to not call up people you otherwise would, so it doesn't seem like a stretch to extend that to "his coach will be pissed."  Maybe I worry too much.  And maybe it's all moot for now to floppo's point that none of our players are integral enough to their teams for their coaches to be super worried.  But at some point it might not be.

 
Dr_Zaius said:
Oh I agree.  Despite the team being on paper good enough to get 6+ points this window I'm very worried going in without Pulisic and Reyna.

And I get how the windows are "supposed" to work, but what's to stop a coach leaning on GGG behind the scenes?  Players getting acclimated to new teams is already cited as a reason to not call up people you otherwise would, so it doesn't seem like a stretch to extend that to "his coach will be pissed."  Maybe I worry too much.  And maybe it's all moot for now to floppo's point that none of our players are integral enough to their teams for their coaches to be super worried.  But at some point it might not be.
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I hear ya.  I think a club could TRY. But at the end of the day, that's a really slippery slope that most clubs aren't gonna go down.

If guys are healthy, they're going to be called. I cant imagine Manchester City telling Belgium they cant have KDB or Manchester United telling Portugal to go pound sand when Fernandes is called in for a qualifier.

Now, if a guy is really hobbled (like CP is now) or just getting back to fitness....maybe. But if they're healthy, I can't imagine the club would deny the call up. Maybe they request a limited workload (which is a reasonable request in the spirit of cooperation between club and country) but an all out refusal...I doubt it.

 
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TLEF316 said:
I hear ya.  I think a club could TRY. But at the end of the day, that's a really slippery slope that most clubs aren't gonna go down.

If guys are healthy, they're going to be called. I cant imagine Manchester City telling Belgium they cant have KDB or Manchester United telling Portugal to go pound sand when Fernandes is called in for a qualifier.

Now, if a guy is really hobbled (like CP is now) or just getting back to fitness....maybe. But if they're healthy, I can't imagine the club would deny the call up. Maybe they request a limited workload (which is a reasonable request in the spirit of cooperation between club and country) but an all out refusal...I doubt it.
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At what point does FIFA step in and tell CONCACAF to get it together and have refs that call the game like the rest of the world so star players aren't being kicked into injury? I mean it seems in their best interest if guys like CP, Reyna, Davies, etc from the big North American countries are able to be healthy after a window and go back to their clubs in Europe and draw eyes.

 
SwampDawg said:
At what point does FIFA step in and tell CONCACAF to get it together and have refs that call the game like the rest of the world so star players aren't being kicked into injury? I mean it seems in their best interest if guys like CP, Reyna, Davies, etc from the big North American countries are able to be healthy after a window and go back to their clubs in Europe and draw eyes.
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Only when the check bounces.

 
Lots of great comments!  Late to the party today but it was fun catching up.

Any thoughts to whom is going to play LB in Panama as Robo can’t go?  I am not sure how comfortable I feel with either Bello or Dest in that spot. 

 
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I know any roster of this size is impossible to please every one.  These are the tweaks I would have liked to see.

Miazga over Ream

Konrad over Nips

Scally over Moore

 
Brian Sciaretta

@BrianSciaretta

Regarding Julian Araujo and his #USMNT future: - "that is information he is going to share with the group. That's not for me to share." - Gregg Berhalter

 
NewlyRetired said:
Lots of great comments!  Late to the party today but it was fun catching up.

Any thoughts to whom is going to play LB in Panama as Robo can’t go?  I am not sure how comfortable I feel with either Bello or Dest in that spot. 
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Other than them...you'd prefer Ream? Otherwise, it's one of them- probably Dest, but I have a feeling Bello might match up better- as weird as that sounds.

 
El Floppo said:
Other than them...you'd prefer Ream? O
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this is why I wanted Scally on the roster.

Taking a guy like Moore who only plays one spot and is getting zero minutes in La Liga 2 over a guy like Scally who plays on both sides and has played every minute for a solid Bundesliga club is very confusing to me.

 
Ream over Miazga is another head scratcher.  

Ream’s “light” is not needed to balance Gio’s dark side and Ream can’t play at Panama. 

 
NewlyRetired said:
this is why I wanted Scally on the roster.

Taking a guy like Moore who only plays one spot and is getting zero minutes in La Liga 2 over a guy like Scally who plays on both sides and has played every minute for a solid Bundesliga club is very confusing to me.
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Let's assume that Shaq is like number 27 on the roster.  Scally is getting minutes and earning great experience with his club.  You want to pull him into qualifying to be the emergency LB/RB where he probably won't get minutes?  This is crazy situational, but for anyone who's looking to be third choice, I'd rather not disrupt a guy who is getting valuable time with his club.  Particularly if he's just breaking through or new to the club.  And particularly if the guy has never been in the USMNT group and you have such a short turnaround.

 
I don't follow other national teams but it seems that GGG makes more boneheaded roster decisions than any other coach I can remember.

 I don't recall us having this much disagreement with Klinsmann or Arena when it comes to player selection.

 
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El Floppo said:
and tbf to your earlier post about KDF, his defending isn't quite at national team levels. 

But I'm with TLEF about needing that offensive player to break down a low block. 

Part of why I'm good with Dest getting pushed up and playing that role- nobody else outside of CP as good at beating a guy off the dribble as him (Konrad too).
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We can all agree KDF is not a complete player at this point in his career but he's a really nice game changer off bench. Puzzling to not call him because we did last time, he looked okay, and he continues playing well for club.

But then again, it's puzzling we brought 4 mids in September and October he is bringing 8 and only 3 wings. Is there a hard cap on players that I'm unaware of? Why not just bring KDF for ####s and giggles of having a 4th wing?

 
CletiusMaximus said:
Were you around in 2016?
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Or 2014?  When Klinsmann left off the most accomplished American soccer player for a guy who hadn't played a senior game (if memory serves).

Internationally, this type of roster stuff doesn't even rate.  Karim Benzema, one of the top 25 players in the world, was banned from the French team for years.  Jogi Lowe drove guys like Hummels and Mueller out of the German team.  England left Trent Alexander-Arnold at home.  He was considered the best right back in the world like six months earlier.  

 
It really is a brave new world for the US though when players getting legit minutes in a top-5 league or scoring goals for a CL side are just straight not called up.  Like, "Nah, we're good."

The pool goes 40 deep now and there just isn't enough room for everyone.

 
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prefontaine said:
We can all agree KDF is not a complete player at this point in his career but he's a really nice game changer off bench. Puzzling to not call him because we did last time, he looked okay, and he continues playing well for club.

But then again, it's puzzling we brought 4 mids in September and October he is bringing 8 and only 3 wings. Is there a hard cap on players that I'm unaware of? Why not just bring KDF for ####s and giggles of having a 4th wing?
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He didn't appear after the El Salvador game.  I just have a hard time believing that Gregg was particularly satisfied with his performance in that game or in training for that window.  

I think KDF would be the fifth wing.  Aaronson, Weah, Hoppe, Arriola, KDF.  I get that Hoppe is a striker, but he's a LW with this group.  And Gregg's had to chance to compare Hoppe in the Gold Cup to KDF in the September window.  Hoppe apparently came out on top.  

I understand the argument for bringing 30.  But I also understand the argument against it.  KDF started well for Marseilles, but has increasingly been coming off the bench.  If he's the fifth winger, and unlikely to actually get minutes with the national team, there's a real cost to taking him away from his club team (where he's still a relative newcomer) and jeopardizing his minutes.  

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Let's assume that Shaq is like number 27 on the roster.  Scally is getting minutes and earning great experience with his club.  You want to pull him into qualifying to be the emergency LB/RB where he probably won't get minutes?  This is crazy situational, but for anyone who's looking to be third choice, I'd rather not disrupt a guy who is getting valuable time with his club.  Particularly if he's just breaking through or new to the club.  And particularly if the guy has never been in the USMNT group and you have such a short turnaround.
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That is my whole point.  Scally would not be an emergency, number 27 player, if included. 

His ability to play left back would make him an instant start for me in Panama when Robbo can't play.

Moore just having been in camp before should not trump the quality and flexibility that comes with Scally and I don't buy for a second a player who has played every second of every game is suddenly going to lose his spot because he goes on international duty.

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
Ream is left-footed and Miazga isn't.  I get that Miles has shown he can play the LCB, but I think Gregg wants natural backups.  Miazga's competition was Richards.  
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Richards had played on the left almost his entire club career.  Miles has played on the left for both club and country.  Both of them should start over Ream on the left imo, especially when Ream can't even play in one of the games.

 
NewlyRetired said:
That is my whole point.  Scally would not be an emergency, number 27 player, if included. 

His ability to play left back would make him an instant start for me in Panama when Robbo can't play.

Moore just having been in camp before should not trump the quality and flexibility that comes with Scally and I don't buy for a second a player who has played every second of every game is suddenly going to lose his spot because he goes on international duty.
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 I don't think he would be, if only because he's never been with this group.  Scally might be a better backup LB option than Bello (or Dest), but Bello has had a full Gold Cup and qualifying window and Gregg knows what he can and can't ask of him.  

 
NewlyRetired said:
Richards had played on the left almost his entire club career.  Miles has played on the left for both club and country.  Both of them should start over Ream on the left imo, especially when Ream can't even play in one of the games.
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That's fine.  I don't necessarily disagree (although I note that Ream was one of the best players against El Salvador).  None of that would make me call in Miazga.  Miazga has had good club patches and bad club patches.  He's mostly had bad patches with the Nats, and more relevantly (IMO) he really struggles in a facet of the game that Gregg truly values in his position.  He can start in Europe for a decade and I still don't think he'll ever be at the top of Gregg's mind.

 
this is odd

=============

Gregg Berhalter says it's "unlikely" but he "can't completely rule it out" that Gio Reyna or Christian Pulisic are late additions to the USMNT camp

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
That's fine.  I don't necessarily disagree (although I note that Ream was one of the best players against El Salvador).  None of that would make me call in Miazga.  Miazga has had good club patches and bad club patches.  He's mostly had bad patches with the Nats, and more relevantly (IMO) he really struggles in a facet of the game that Gregg truly values in his position.  He can start in Europe for a decade and I still don't think he'll ever be at the top of Gregg's mind.
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Ream's main problem is pace.  ELS is probably the slowest of the Ocho teams so his other skills could shine.

But does anyone really want him on the field against Jamaica, easily the fastest of all the teams in the Ocho.

Ream is a severe liability to play against Jamaica and can't play in Panama.  I still think this is wasting a roster spot if not for Miazga then for Zimmerman.

 
It doesn't apply to Scally, but the one thing I do think everyone has to acknowledge is that Gregg has more information on most of these players than we do.  He's had them for training.  He's evaluated them in his system (and I get that many are not fans of his system, but he's the coach).   It really doesn't matter if you rate a guy like Arriola or Roldan or Lletget.  Gregg trusts them.   And it's easy to see why (and I hate myself for becoming Bill Simmons here) because while they might not put as much on the table as some other options, they generally don't take anything off the table.  They always play hard.  They don't make big mistakes.  They don't dog it on defense.  Arriola, in particular, seems to always at least get chances (and this is a team that struggles to create chances, not just to convert them).  

I hope Scally and KDF have long, great careers with the USMNT.  But I think it's just silly to act like that excluding them is some huge oversight considering both have pretty thin resumes. 

 
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Since Steffen can't go to Panama, I wonder if GGG will rotate keepers or just stick with Turner for the first two and then see from that point?

 
Ramsay Hunt Experience said:
It doesn't apply to Scally, but the one thing I do think everyone has to acknowledge is that Gregg has more information on most of these players than we do.  He's had them for training.  He's evaluated them in his system (and I get that many are not fans of his system, but he's the coach).   It really doesn't matter if you rate a guy like Arriola or Roldan or Lletget.  Gregg trusts them.   And it's easy to see why (and I hate myself for becoming Bill Simmons here) because while they might not put as much on the table as some other options, they generally don't take anything off the table.  They always play hard.  They don't make big mistakes.  They don't dog it on defense.  Arriola, in particular, seems to always at least get chances (and this is a team that struggles to create chances, not just to convert them).  

I hope Scally and KDF have long, great careers with the USMNT.  But I think it's just silly to act like that excluding them is some huge oversight considering both have pretty thin resumes. 
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We've also seen him make significant mistakes that you don't need to be behind the scenes to see.

Not bringing enough wingers last time. Forcing a formation that doesn't fit your players, especially when you don't have enough guys to fit your preferred formation. Poor substitutions. How he handled Weston and talked about it afterward. 

So, he doesn't just get the benefit of the doubt when those things have happened on his watch. 

 
:oldunsure:

Brian Sciaretta

@BrianSciaretta

Some potential #USMNT news is that Antonee Robinson is not on the matchday roster for Fulham today. He was not listed as injured in the club's press conference yesterday or in the official match preview on Fulham's website

 
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