What value to you get from a Fantasy Football Advice subscription? (1 Viewer)

[Joe Bryant]

I think the two big things a business like Footballguys provides it's customers are:

1. We offer advice. We offer guidance on making decisions on who to draft and who to start and who to pick up on waivers. The value here is we give good advice.

2. We save them time gathering the info. Lots of our info is not necessarily exclusive to us. But we save the reader time by gathering and sorting through and curating the "need to know" type information. The value we bring here is we save the customer time. 

Are their other things a business like Footballguys brings to the customer in your opinion? And it doesn't have to be Footballguys. It could be any business that's in our area of fantasy football advice.

Or maybe another way to ask, "What value do you get from a Fantasy Football Advice subscription?" 

There aren't wrong answers. Just trying to get a sense for what you folks think. 

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

Saving me time is a big reason. FBGs also has good tools. Draft Dominator is very useful. I also like the contest.

 

[shadrap]

Your site is the best IMO.  More info than I can digest most of the time.  Very complete product in that it caters to all league sizes, scoring formats, etc.  as far as value to me?  Time, but more important to me is your written weekly take on players whether to start or bench.  Anyone can rank players.  I like to know why!   it's obvious you care about your business & it shows.

thanx. 

 

[BoltBacker]

Or maybe another way to ask, "What value do you get from a Fantasy Football Advice subscription?" 

There aren't wrong answers. Just trying to get a sense for what you folks think. 

My Top 7....

1. The contest. It's just hours of entertainment and bragging rights between active posters here on the message board no matter when you get eliminated.

2. Game Projections. In traditional formats I appreciate a second opinion on "who should I start". The better player in a worse situation or a worse player in a better situation. 

3. Season Projections. I've gotten to the point I don't pay any attention to rankings unless they provide projections. For instance if someone thinks Rodgers is going to be a top 3 QB but he won't have a TE or RB that contributes much in the passing game, and he won't have a WR besides Adams worth owning then Adams has to break nearly every record in the book for Rodgers to be a top 3 QB..... OR some of those other receiving weapons are going to have to contribute a great deal more than most people expect. Pure rankings seems lazy and are kind of useless. Projections take time and effort and are a product that can be worth paying for if thoughtfully constructed.

4. General consensus on the way the crowd is leaning on certain players. Whether you call it "risers and fallers" or "sleepers" or "busts"...... I have a list of guys that I like at their ADP but if they are on these lists I know that I can't trust ADP and either need to take these guys earlier than ADP would indicate or can actually take them a little later if a lot of people are fading them at the time of the draft/blind auction.

5. Contrarian view points explained. Whether it's by the staff or a trusted poster I really enjoy hearing why someone might have a strong opinion for/against a certain player that swims against the tide of public opinion. Some people think that those rankings are the worst by your staff but I actually enjoy those the most IF they also take the time somewhere(either on the board or in an article) to explain why they hold such a strong contrarian opinion than most people. 

6. The injury analysis. In some ways this is like reading tea leaves but for me it's a pure guessing game so having someone with a medical background weigh in what they think is going on has value. This is the single most difficult part of FF to me and often times even if you are playing best ball the medium to long term health of a player helps you to decide how to manage your roster and spend your FA dollars moving forward. 

7. Just pure entertainment of the articles..... although I don't have a lot of time to enjoy many of them. Which ties into #2 on your list. Someone could get much of that info from "free" sources but it would take a lot more time. To me the time saving has quite a lot of value.

 

[Joe Bryant]

Thanks @BoltBacker

Aside from the contest, would you say if you were to lump all those into bigger category, would most of that fall under "good advice". 

And to be more clear, what I'm trying to do is get a handle on the big picture things our customers are looking for from us (or any business like ours). 

I THINK, the two big reasons are "advice" and "time saving". But not totally sure and wanted to ask here. 

 

[jtp1982]

I’m on either my 4th or 5th year subscribing for the season long packages and what brings me back to you guys specifically is:

- reliability: the articles and analytical pieces I have grown to depend on are continued year to year and come out on time on a weekly basis.  Having done content-driven work myself in an unrelated industry I know that is not a small thing, especially given I like ...

- perspectives and analytical work beyond what’s presented in the “mainstream” fantasy media: content from CBS, ESPN (including ESPN+ here because it’s the same stuff basically), and to a lesser extent Yahoo because they actually do a better job than the others, are accessible to anybody and I’m in a league where guys want to win, the info on the free articles on the first page of a google search are built into 90% of any roster decisions made in my league.  Trendspotting is a good example here.  No one is talking about those very real aspects of fantasy football.

I like that deeper look, both because of the occasional edge and because I think it’s really fascinating work you don’t see too many other places doing and it’s fun to read as a fan of the game.

-Podcasts: So based on my work schedule post-Covid I’m not using these as much because I’m not commuting as much but I’ve been a longtime fan of anything Bloom is on podcast wise.

-The dominator web app is awesome.  I love it.  From a marketing perspective I can tell you I want to spend more time on the app than there is info there to spend time on.  Not a criticism of the app (probably a criticism of me though lol), just if you are looking to deepen engagement of existing subscribers/come out with expanded levels of subscription service at additional cost/etc I’d recommend that adding new tabs of data and projections in that mobile app be on the short list of ways to do so.

-Lastly, I appreciate the simple, some might say hokey, aesthetics of the site and its features.  Over time Ive come to associate them with the straightforward, original written content on the site. I can read fantasy info surrounded by top notch professional level graphics for free all day long, If I’m opening my wallet  to get fantasy content it’s for the quality, and originality of the written content, it’s not so the company can go all pff and pay a bunch of photoshop wizards to make cool borders.

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Overall things I value in any subscription service:

• sensible and deep analytics and visualizations to tease out meaningful (and hopefully accurate) insight into match ups, tendencies, trends
  
• level-headed analysis and well-written reasoning
  
• above average rankings accuracy
  
• a good and ongoing slate of content
  
• highly timely alerts and clear impact/action items
  
• film analysis/Xs and Os to help deepen my knowledge of the game
  
• great forums with wise, humorous, and respectful members
  

Things I find I am getting continued/increasing value from a FBG sub:

• Waldman's Gut Check and Top 10 -- love the depth of analysis, and the addition of some great effects and a steady cam for his YT channel improves the content by a thousand fold (still some shaky hand-held videos that induce motion sickness and distract from the narrative). Some of the best Xs/Os analysis out there today, it's awesome.
  
• Bloom's offensive player updates -- crucial content release on Tuesdays to inform waiver wire moves. Ditto for Rudnicki's defensive updates
  
• What you need to know from week x overview from Bloom -- helpful time-saving encapsulations 
  
• Timely ongoing updates to weekly and ROS forecasts/rankings
  
• Bramel's injury updates
  
• Game Predictor -- I'd love to know how accurate this has been on a seasonal and more longitudinal basis
  
• Settle's Exposed WR/TE match up write-ups. Would be even better with data visualizations
  
• Bloom's offensive sleepers report. The analysis is as helpful as the call-outs
  
• Bitoni's offensive line rankings and movement analysis -- one of the better/accurate o-line indicators I've seen
  
• Haseley's Fatnasy Overview -- really helpful statistical and analytical analysis. Would be even better with visualizations
  
• Zamichielli's Trendspotting -- I get why it's DFS focused, and you can apply it to your team/league without the DFS angle (though I wish there was more content like this that was less DFS-specific), but great diving deep into data with really useful summaries and action items
  
• The Shark Pool and FFA are still some of the best forums out there, all credit to amazing, long-standing posters who truly drive a lot of great dialogue, insight, debate, and humor.
  

Things I find I am getting little/decreasing value from FBG sub:

• Howe/Knotts/Roberts rushing/passing matchups -- these used to be one of the best resources, delving into each game and looking at trends, WR/CB match ups, tendencies, and took a balanced view of both short and longer term historical context. Now the content has been cut by 2/3rds, there is little value in a chart without context, and even the content seems thinner and more prone to swing based on last week's results. Really one of the most disappointing takeaways in content
  
• Fantasy roundtable -- it's a gigantic wall of text that's more navel-gazing than insightful. Hard to digest and pick out nuggets of useable content, which is thin to begin with.
  
• No great visualizations of data.
  
• Allen's 3 Lesson's article -- 3 lessons from a week of football isn't enough, and what's there is not really insightful -- the same reactive takes on obvious situations that you see everywhere else. This can be way more dep and insightful than it is.
  
• Harstad's Regression Alert -- I love this kind of statistical analysis, but there is very little application of it -- it's one thing to talk about methodology, which is there in spades. But there is very little practical application and aha moments.
  
•  Bloom's Sell HIgh/Buy Low -- to be clear, this is a great article. But it's leaned into similar player takes you find everywhere that are more self-obvious. Would like to see more players that aren't as clear cut obvious.
  
• Sports wagering features. You now have only one person prognosticating all games -- believe there used to be two PLUS the staff picks against the lines, which was a great balance of opinion you don't get now. I think Larkin defends his picks well, but why is he any better than a dartboard? The more opinion/wisdom of crowd, the better. Zamichieli's Beating the Odds is fairly useless given its narrow scope, and while the prop articles are fun, I don't bet so I don't use them
  
• Graphics Lab -- why are you even bothering to link a feature that doesn't seem to exist?
  
• Random Shots -- (no offense, Joe!) It's a collection of already circulated social media content, with little value-add and erratic functionality (embedding vs taking you to a whole other page or opening in another tab and necessitating hitting back buttons), with little originality or cohesion. 
  
• The Shark Pool has decreased in value over time. Find myself ignoring more and more people looking to stir things up purposefully or just the same tired chest-thumping or polarizing takes with little analysis, thought, or intelligence. These voices slowly drown out the more tried-and-trued voices, and it's notable that less and less old-timers seem to be actively on the forums over time.
  

 

[Joe Bryant]

Thanks a ton @Stompin' Tom Connors for the super thoughtful reply. I hope this didn't seem like a fishing for a compliment thing.

I'm really just looking for big picture non specific general things people are looking for. Like "saves me time" or "good advice".

Anything else in big category like that?

And @Stompin' Tom Connors would you say most of your points would fall into the "advice" area?

 

[Joe Bryant]

Random Shots -- (no offense, Joe!) It's a collection of already circulated social media content, with little value-add and erratic functionality (embedding vs taking you to a whole other page or opening in another tab and necessitating hitting back buttons), with little originality or cohesion. 

 that's kind of embarrassing. Oh well. Sorry to hear it's bringing less value but no offense at all. That's life. Not that it matters but just to make others knew, we responded to requests from last year and all the twitter and youtube videos are embedded now so you don't have to go to another page. This week's version here. 

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

Why I subscribe:

1. Projections & Draft Dominator. I like the tool, I like practicing with the tool, and this year for the 1st time I used it live drafting & loved having it there to give me some visual cues to players i wanted to have on my radar. 

2. Strategy advice. Everyone wants to build a new mouse trap, trends come and go. I’m actually pretty steadfast in my draft strategies (different for different formats) but seeing the advice columns on strategy I get a little more insight to how others might be approaching their drafts. This adds value.

3. Player advice. I go into it knowing that different experts have different takes, and honestly it’s the diversity of opinion that I get value from. I don’t always agree about the players or projections, but your guys do a lot more research on deeper layers than I do. HC, OC or DC tendencies for players who’ve changed teams, for example. Sometimes ya get em wrong - Hopkins was a huge miss (so far) for almost every expert who predicted a smaller workload & he came right out with a 14 catch game to kick sand on y’all, but that kind of thing happens all the time. There will always be outliers - it’s the ones you get right, and for the reasons y’all give that help me. I came into 2020 prepared to not draft Crowder or Parker. Good players on bad teams are often ones I’ll avoid. But both have been dynamite in PPR, and foe the exact reasons guys like Dodds & Bloom gave in their pre-season evaluation. Those two are part of why I’m 4-0 in the league I drafted them, and the out of the box eval helped me to keep them on my radar when they each slipped about a round further than ADP. 
 

127. subscriber contest

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Thanks a ton @Stompin' Tom Connors for the super thoughtful reply. I hope this didn't seem like a fishing for a compliment thing.

I'm really just looking for big picture non specific general things people are looking for. Like "saves me time" or "good advice".

Anything else in big category like that?

And @Stompin' Tom Connors would you say most of your points would fall into the "advice" area?

You ask thoughtful questions and take time to engage the community -- of subscribers and non-subscribers -- with earnest info-gathering with an eye of staying close to your customers' needs and taking feedback into account. That's a great thing. So wanted to be as specific and (hopefully) helpful as I can in reply.

Maybe the detail wasn't what you were looking for, but you did say there were no wrong answers, and asked what value I get from a fantasy football advice subscription so painted a picture of the big generalities (first set of bullets) and some specifics of how this played out at FBG.

For the general things, these were: analytics and visualizations, deep insight (FF and football in general), well-reasoned ongoing content, timely updates, and accuracy in results.

 that's kind of embarrassing. Oh well. Sorry to hear it's bringing less value but no offense at all. That's life. Not that it matters but just to make others knew, we responded to requests from last year and all the twitter and youtube videos are embedded now so you don't have to go to another page. This week's version here. 

You do you, Joe. Don't take one person's opinions (that don't amount to a hill of beans in this world anyway) as indictment, just giving you how I see it.

I am well-aware you embedded YT videos, but that's a half-measure. Your links need target/_blank attributes so they open in new tabs. It's a pretty elemental fix that just provides way better UX.

 

[shadrap]

stompin Tom wrote:

Things I find I am getting little/decreasing value from FBG sub:

Howe/Knotts/Roberts rushing/passing matchups -- these used to be one of the best resources, delving into each game and looking at trends, WR/CB match ups, tendencies, and took a balanced view of both short and longer term historical context. Now the content has been cut by 2/3rds, there is little value in a chart without context, and even the content seems thinner and more prone to swing based on last week's results. Really one of the most disappointing takeaways in content

This I agree with big time especially the WR/CB matchups.  Who is going to cover who.  Miss that.

 

[Joe Bryant]

You ask thoughtful questions and take time to engage the community -- of subscribers and non-subscribers -- with earnest info-gathering with an eye of staying close to your customers' needs and taking feedback into account. That's a great thing. So wanted to be as specific and (hopefully) helpful as I can in reply.

Maybe the detail wasn't what you were looking for, but you did say there were no wrong answers, and asked what value I get from a fantasy football advice subscription so painted a picture of the big generalities (first set of bullets) and some specifics of how this played out at FBG.

For the general things, these were: analytics and visualizations, deep insight (FF and football in general), well-reasoned ongoing content, timely updates, and accuracy in results.

You do you, Joe. Don't take one person's opinions (that don't amount to a hill of beans in this world anyway) as indictment, just giving you how I see it.

I am well-aware you embedded YT videos, but that's a half-measure. Your links need target/_blank attributes so they open in new tabs. It's a pretty elemental fix that just provides way better UX.

Thanks. For sure, not much option for me than just be me. Thanks. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

I am well-aware you embedded YT videos, but that's a half-measure. Your links need target/_blank attributes so they open in new tabs. It's a pretty elemental fix that just provides way better UX.

I don't want to derail this thread @Stompin' Tom Connors  I tried to send a PM but could not. Can you please shoot me an email at bryant@footballguys.com with the subject line "random shots" as I wanted to ask something specific on the fix. Thanks. 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Ok. I think I've got enough feedback to know the two "general" reasons people subscribe to a Fantasy Football Subscription like Footballguys is:

Advice / content to help them win.

Save the customer time.

There are others for sure like the contest and such but I think those two cover it. 

If you think of another general category, let me know here please. 

 

[FUBAR]

My Top 7....

1. The contest. It's just hours of entertainment and bragging rights between active posters here on the message board no matter when you get eliminated.

You're right about the rest, I just haven't spent much time this year reading the articles.

To make a bad analogy, it's likea certain magazine created by Hef. Sure the articles are great if you want to read them, but we all know why you bought it.  (It's the contest)

 

[dblock05]

As someone who doesn’t post a lot but I’ve been a subscriber for 3-4 years now, I highly value the draft dominator every year. That and the myfbg weekly tool is very nice...I have a busy schedule and sometimes miss things so syncing up the rosters and telling me what moves I could make are worth it. 
 

But yep..to summarize..to save myself time. I love blooms podcast as well but I realize it’s not a membership perk

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

I don't want to derail this thread @Stompin' Tom Connors  I tried to send a PM but could not. Can you please shoot me an email at bryant@footballguys.com with the subject line "random shots" as I wanted to ask something specific on the fix. Thanks. 

PM sent -- I think my site mailbox was full?

 

[BoltBacker]

Aside from the contest, would you say if you were to lump all those into bigger category, would most of that fall under "good advice". 

I shrink away from the word "advice" because my least favorite post every year(and bye every year I mean EVERY YEAR) is the annual, "FBG told me that Kyler Murray was a top 5 QB and Fitzpatrick was a bottom 5 QB and Fitz just pummeled Murray this week and made me lose!!!!".

To me it helps to break the advice category down into its components, and those components are weighted differently for every consumer I'm sure.

 

[sho nuff]

Saving me time is a big reason. FBGs also has good tools. Draft Dominator is very useful. I also like the contest.

Yeah...not having to sift through multiple sites each week or each draft...some of them more video messages rather than quick reads.

Time is a huge factor.

The other away from just "advice" and more to the tools...the ability to customize the "advice" or "tool" for each league's different scoring set up or number of teams and so on.

With one league still pretty archaic in being almost solely TD scoring...finding rankings for such styles can be hard.  When I can customize the scoring before a draft or for ROS ranks and so on...its helpful to get that extra bit of customization to give me more information before making my decision.

 

[JoeSteeler]

I like random shots 

 

[Joe Bryant]

Yeah...not having to sift through multiple sites each week or each draft...some of them more video messages rather than quick reads.

Time is a huge factor.

The other away from just "advice" and more to the tools...the ability to customize the "advice" or "tool" for each league's different scoring set up or number of teams and so on.

With one league still pretty archaic in being almost solely TD scoring...finding rankings for such styles can be hard.  When I can customize the scoring before a draft or for ROS ranks and so on...its helpful to get that extra bit of customization to give me more information before making my decision.

Thanks. That's the kind of thing I'm trying to dial in. Thanks. 

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I like random shots 

X2

 

[sho nuff]

And agree the email updates and random

shots help too.

 

[Instinctive]

Thanks. That's the kind of thing I'm trying to dial in. Thanks. 

To dial it in even more precisely: 

Your advice is *generally* not the value prop for me. Your knowledge is. Too many leagues are too different, and I have a portfolio of teams and players that no site is going to be able to optimize with canned articles. 

But the analysis of games and matchups with deep explanations (e.g., the top 5 and bottom 5 matchups articles (would be super nice to have writeups for all of them and not just the top/bottom, but I get that there's only so much time to write things), Waldman's long-form analysis articles, the "what you need to know from each game" article (Bloom I think?), the thoughts on trendspotting, etc...things that give me knowledge, not just "hey Taylor's ranked 13th and Gallup's ranked 15th this week, separated by .21 of a point in our projections", that's what separates this place.

Distinguishing between knowledge and information, by the way,  are articles like trendspotting and the regression one that don't just say "Moore's got 300 air yards and 20 targets through 3 games," but instead add in all the context of how the games flowed, how it compares to other players on the team, why it is likely to continue or not...knowledge is what I pay for. The best possible example are the articles above - the Bloom what you need to know and the Waldman 10 things - are perfect examples of taking information and turning it into knowledge that I wouldn't necessarily have on my own. 

 

[scottybo]

"A" Fantasy Football Advice Subscription? Not much.

I like comparing my own opinion against multiple advice columns/rankings.

Now if I find one that is very consistent on ranking well/being correct a lot, that would be placed high...but still in the mixture of other opinions.