Which QB is (was) the most clutch? (1 Viewer)

[Raider Nation]

CLUTCH: –adjective

Done or accomplished in a critical situation.

Not "Who's the best?"... but rather "Who's the best in a pressure spot?"

Note: This isn't meant to slight any other clutch QBs, such as Unitas or Staubach or Bradshaw. I'm specifically interested in how most people view these three quarterbacks in particular.

 

[cobalt_27]

Joe Cool.

 

[Raider Nation]

Joe Cool.

 

[massraider]

1. Montana

2. Brady

3. Elway--He was awesome, and had a ton of comebacks. I know this. His sloppy play led to a lot of those deficits, too.

 

[diesel7982]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

 

[Blue-Kun]

Montana and it's not even close.

 

[3C's]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

 

[Devilsden2001]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

Give it a break, Mr Horse teeth only won a superbowl because he had Terrel Davis.Brady is doing it with a bunch of journeymen WR's.

 

[Bull Dozier]

Until the Patriots fall apart as a dynasty, there is no tarnish on his luster. He doesn't play with the offensive talent Montana enjoyed, and Elways' highest level of success came at the end of his career when he was no longer the focal point of his offense. Don't get me wrong, Montana and Elway were both great players, and both have amazing drives they will always be remembered for, but if Brady keeps doing what he's doing, I don't know how you put anyone in front of him, especially if the Pats get another trophy this year.

 

[3C's]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

Give it a break, Mr Horse teeth only won a superbowl because he had Terrel Davis.Brady is doing it with a bunch of journeymen WR's.

I would assume we're talking more than just the Super Bowl. Elway had plenty of clutch games prior to Davis with "journeymen" receivers.

 

[Captain Spaulding]

I'm going to take a little different approach. think another thing to add to the "clutch" description is when average statistical QB (not many TD's, passing yds, rating overall) ends up playing spectacular when games are on the line. I think Montana and Elway both were always in the top 3-5 QB's in most statistical categories each season they played in their prime. Brady seems to hover around #5 QB or so each year but somehow you can count on him in the clutch despite above average or slightly mediocre overall QB play during the season and over the course of most games. I'll vote for Brady because he seems to be more like a lightswitch...goes from Clark Kent to Superman when things are on the line.

I still think Montana is still the greatest QB ever though.

 

[Godsbrother]

Terry Bradshaw was a pretty decent clutch QB.

 

[TD Ryan]

even as a Pats fan, I'll vote Montana for the simple fact that Montana is a legend, a super-hero of NFL lore.

Brady's still in the prime of his career and has much more to do before he can be accurately judged.

However, it is quite satisfying knowing that Brady has gone from being a "lucky/system" QB in '01 to legitamitely being compared with the all-time greats.

 

[PsychoMan]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

Give it a break, Mr Horse teeth only won a superbowl because he had Terrel Davis.Brady is doing it with a bunch of journeymen WR's.

And a great defense ... and a great coach.

 

[Bull Dozier]

even as a Pats fan, I'll vote Montana for the simple fact that Montana is a legend, a super-hero of NFL lore.Brady's still in the prime of his career and has much more to do before he can be accurately judged.However, it is quite satisfying knowing that Brady has gone from being a "lucky/system" QB in '01 to legitamitely being compared with the all-time greats.

Better to judge him now than to wait until he plays past his prime. Five years ago Favre would have been in this debate, but so many people jumped off his bandwagon, he doesn't get a mention.

 

[Raider Nation]

Terry Bradshaw was a pretty decent clutch QB.

Dear Did you actually read my first post?This was only about an argument I got in about THOSE three players.I voted Montana, BTW.

 

[TD Ryan]

Better to judge him now than to wait until he plays past his prime. Five years ago Favre would have been in this debate, but so many people jumped off his bandwagon, he doesn't get a mention.

maybe... maybe not.half the fans forget that Montana finished with KC too... and did so somewhat unspectacularly.and I don't think anyone's jumping off Favre's bandwagon. It's just a case of another guy getting over-exposed by the media and fans tiring of it. It will get worse too if/when the Favre retirement nonesense starts again.But that's all peripheral really. Favre goes down as one of the all-time greats. Give it time for the All-Favre, All-The-Time media nonsense to slow down and then there will be more objectivity in ranking his greatness.

 

[Raider Nation]

Five years ago Favre would have been in this debate, but so many people jumped off his bandwagon, he doesn't get a mention.

:sigh:I give up...

 

[Chase Stuart]

I'm going to take a little different approach. think another thing to add to the "clutch" description is when average statistical QB (not many TD's, passing yds, rating overall) ends up playing spectacular when games are on the line. I think Montana and Elway both were always in the top 3-5 QB's in most statistical categories each season they played in their prime. Brady seems to hover around #5 QB or so each year but somehow you can count on him in the clutch despite above average or slightly mediocre overall QB play during the season and over the course of most games. I'll vote for Brady because he seems to be more like a lightswitch...goes from Clark Kent to Superman when things are on the line. I still think Montana is still the greatest QB ever though.

Did you know that Brady has a higher QB Rating in the regular season than the post-season.

 

[TD Ryan]

Did you know that Brady has a higher QB Rating in the regular season than the post-season.

nope.the logical next question is, "is there a QB who's Rating is higher in the post season than Regular season?"and, "if so, did he play in enough games to provide and accurat sample size?".I would think that most QB's Ratings drop in the post season because the remaining competition consists of the league's elites.

 

[zadok]

I went with Montana, but Brady is pretty close in my view.

 

[parasaurolophus]

Montana>>>>>>>Brady>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Elway

Looking at the similarities between Brady and Montana are very scary though. They both won their first SB MVP trophies with very mediocre stats. They both have postseason games that are very very poor, but still get wins on late drives. Montana didnt have a great supporting cast around him in his early years but was scary good in the postseason once he did. From 1988-90 he had 22 TDs to 2 Ints in his playoff games. If brady were to get a couple better weapons could he put up the same numbers? Or does he need the scheme more than the players?

 

[Chase Stuart]

Did you know that Brady has a higher QB Rating in the regular season than the post-season.

nope.the logical next question is, "is there a QB who's Rating is higher in the post season than Regular season?"and, "if so, did he play in enough games to provide and accurat sample size?".I would think that most QB's Ratings drop in the post season because the remaining competition consists of the league's elites.

Montana has a higher QB rating in the post-season. Troy Aikman's is significantly higher. Warren Moon's is higher. Joe Theisman's is a lot higher. Jake Delhomme, of course, has a much higher QB rating in the playoffs. So does Vinny Testaverde, Jeff George and Erik Kramer. Jeff George was a terrific playoff QB. He averaged 7.8 Y/A and had a 9/3 TD/INT ratio. The majority of QBs, however, as you expected, have lower career post-season QB ratings than career regular season QB ratings.Edited to add: This isn't really an apples to apples comparison. For example, Brett Favre's terrible QB ratings in past years has hurt his career regular season QB rating, so he might look like a better QB in the playoffs than he did a few years ago because of that. I don't think that's a justifiable rationalization of the data, though.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Tough call, as these three, along with Brett Favre in his prime, are probably the most clutch QB's of the last 25 years. I couldn't decide, so I went the homer route and voted for Elway.

 

[TD Ryan]

Montana has a higher QB rating in the post-season. Troy Aikman's is significantly higher. Warren Moon's is higher. Joe Theisman's is a lot higher. Jake Delhomme, of course, has a much higher QB rating in the playoffs. So does Vinny Testaverde, Jeff George and Erik Kramer. Jeff George was a terrific playoff QB. He averaged 7.8 Y/A and had a 9/3 TD/INT ratio. The majority of QBs, however, as you expected, have lower QB ratings in the playoffs.

interesting...thanks.ETA, oh yeah... so what's the statistical answer to the original question?Montana, Brady, Elway?

 

[PatsWillWin]

Does QB raiting always = "clutch" or is that just when you hate Tom Brady?

 

[Chase Stuart]

Montana has a higher QB rating in the post-season. Troy Aikman's is significantly higher. Warren Moon's is higher. Joe Theisman's is a lot higher. Jake Delhomme, of course, has a much higher QB rating in the playoffs. So does Vinny Testaverde, Jeff George and Erik Kramer. Jeff George was a terrific playoff QB. He averaged 7.8 Y/A and had a 9/3 TD/INT ratio. The majority of QBs, however, as you expected, have lower QB ratings in the playoffs.

interesting...thanks.ETA, oh yeah... so what's the statistical answer to the original question?Montana, Brady, Elway?

Montana has a better post-season QB rating, Elway's is nearly identical (79.86 regular, 79.80 post), and Brady's is a couple of points lower (88.36 regular, 86.75 post). Manning is 94.37 regular, 83.70 post. Before this post-season, Manning was 89.05 post, while Brady was 89.42 post.

 

[KingEl]

Montana also had those true great moments that I can't think of Brady really having.

I know Brady's clutch, but he'll hasn't had ("the Catch" moment,) (the last second pass for a Td to win a Super Bowl), (the 4th down-last play of a game- need a td to tie it, and throws it, then wins in overtime against Pitts) (the Monday night dual with Elway) to name just a few- moments that Montana had.

Those last two were with KC too for the guy who said Montana ended unspectactularly with KC.

Really, it comes down to who you are a fan of, but in my opinion, its Montana by a wide margin, Brady, then Elway.

 

[Bull Dozier]

Five years ago Favre would have been in this debate, but so many people jumped off his bandwagon, he doesn't get a mention.

:sigh:I give up...

Sorry, I was trying to say two things at the same time and it got muddled. I was commenting on the poster who thought Brady needed more time, and saying that more time hurt Favre's rep currently. At the same time I was responding to the suggesting by another poster who brought up Bradshaw, that while I understand the point of the thread is to debate the three QBs in question only, there will always be those that throw in other names regardless of the thread purpose, and 5 years ago, Favre would have been among the first.

 

[Sidewinder16]

half the fans forget that Montana finished with KC too... and did so somewhat unspectacularly.

He helped the Chiefs to the playoffs both years he was there, including making it all the way to the AFC Championship in '93. His numbers may not have been "Montana-like" those two years, but he was dinged up quite a bit at the end of his career.My opinion is far from unbiased, but I wouldn't consider the end of Montana's career "unspectacular". Injury-marred may be a better descriptor, but I never held that against the old man :( . They can't all go out like Elway.

 

[Sidewinder16]

As to the original topic ( ) all three have helped their teams win games in pressure situations. They are all pretty freakin "clutch", IMO. To pick one above the others is only going to come down to personal preference/favorites.

Given the option, I'd take any of 'em to win me a big game. If I was offered all three and had to pick one, I'd go with Montana, but that's a purely subjective opinion.

 

[Devilsden2001]

Montana also had those true great moments that I can't think of Brady really having.I know Brady's clutch, but he'll hasn't had ("the Catch" moment,) (the last second pass for a Td to win a Super Bowl), (the 4th down-last play of a game- need a td to tie it, and throws it, then wins in overtime against Pitts) (the Monday night dual with Elway) to name just a few- moments that Montana had.Those last two were with KC too for the guy who said Montana ended unspectactularly with KC.Really, it comes down to who you are a fan of, but in my opinion, its Montana by a wide margin, Brady, then Elway.

Brady has not had a "catch moment"????? He also did not have the best WR ever to play the game to throw to either. He has never had a #2 WR that could start on any team in the league. Montana had Rice, Taylor, Rathman, Craig, Brent Jones. What Brady has had is a bunch of over the hill RB's, and some complementary receivers to throw to. Branch was good but he is no better than a #2 on most teams and we all saw what Givens did in Tenn this year.No he has not had a "Catch moment" but he did lead them down the field and into Fieldgoal range in just over a minute and a half to seal their first Superbowl. He has done it again and again when the game is on the line. He is doing it with half that talent that the other two QB's did.That Wide Margin is not as wide as you think it is.

 

[thesurfshop19]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

Give it a break, Mr Horse teeth only won a superbowl because he had Terrel Davis.Brady is doing it with a bunch of journeymen WR's.

I would assume we're talking more than just the Super Bowl. Elway had plenty of clutch games prior to Davis with "journeymen" receivers.

I voted Montana and have Brady #2 (even as a Broncos fan) but just remember that Ed McCaffrey, Rod Smith, and Shannon Sharpe aren't exactly your top pedigree players. They all had moments without Elway, but it's very possible that they learned to be great from Elway.

 

[PsychoMan]

i think ppl are giving brady too much clutch credit ... he has played very well in the playoffs, but that WHOLE TEAM is clutch ... belicheck ... vinateriaiaea ... troy brown ... the defense making big stops

 

[thesurfshop19]

i think ppl are giving brady too much clutch credit ... he has played very well in the playoffs, but that WHOLE TEAM is clutch ... belicheck ... vinateriaiaea ... troy brown ... the defense making big stops

This is true, but I feel that's also true for Montana and Elway.What gave the Broncos the lead in Super Bowl XXXII? Braxton's interception and Atwater's sack-forced-fumble which led to 10 points.What allowed the Broncos to put the Jets and Falcons away in the 1998 playoffs? Timely interceptions.There are several things that impress me about Brady, even from last weekend. The drive that sticks out in my mind is the one right before the end of the first half. Down 14-3 or 14-6 is so different from being down 14-10. Brady just dissected the Chargers on that drive and made it a game and essentially laid the foundation for the unbelievable 4th quarter.

 

[matt jones]

Without a Dan Marino option this poll is bogus.

 

[Raider Nation]

Without a Dan Marino option this poll is bogus.

So is not reading the FIRST POST in the thread....

 

[Sea Bass]

Unitas

 

[thesurfshop19]

Without a Dan Marino option this poll is bogus.

So is not reading the FIRST POST in the thread....

It's almost like you need to build it into the poll or something.Which of *the following QBs* would you most like to have in the clutch?MontanaElwayBradyI didn't read the first post and want to mention someone else

 

[Chase Stuart]

What allowed the Broncos to put the Jets and Falcons away in the 1998 playoffs? Timely interceptions fumbles.

 

[thesurfshop19]

What allowed the Broncos to put the Jets and Falcons away in the 1998 playoffs? Timely interceptions fumbles.

I still feel bad when I watch that game from time to time. :( The fumbles kept Denver in the game, and the INTs iced it. Some of those plays were just baffling.

 

[Jack Burton]

I say Montana for no other reason than to not chose him seems like blasphemy. He is so "legend"

 

[Iron Mike Tomczak]

Joe Cool

In his twilight years he still beat a hungry steeler team to get to the AFC championship game.

I was alot younger than, and since then I have slight resentment but much respect for him.

"oh yea and he did alittle for the 49ers too, ya kno, some real classic ####" - edit.

 

[pats3in4]

I'd have to say Brady edges out Montana. What's about to come is going to sound weird, but hear me out...

Montana's 49ers teams should have won 6 titles (and possibly a 7th if they weren't jobbed by the refs in the NFCCG vs. Washington). Those '80s 49ers were that good. They should have won in 1987 & 1990, but Montana played like poop in the 1987 playoff loss to the Vikings and was ineffective before getting injured in the 1990 NFCCG. When his teams weren't title-contender caliber, the 49ers bowed out meekly (1985, 1986) in the first round with Montana playing stinkers of games in those losses. Doesn't make Montana a bum by any stretch because four SB titles is still damn impressive, but look at it this way...the 49ers four titles are like the Bulls winning only 4 instead of 6 titles in the 1990s - an underachievement of sorts.

In contrast, the Pats had no business winning SB36. They were 4 plays from being 10-6 in 2003, but Brady played huge in those near-losses and saved HFA which carried them to a SB38 title. In 2004 the team was clearly championship-material, but still had to go into 15-1 Pittsburgh where Brady played lights-out *with the flu* (there's his 'The Catch' game) and then he picked apart a blitz-happy Eagles team that had 3 Pro Bowlers in the secondary backing those blitzes up. Brady's road to his titles has been more impressive and this is why I'm giving him the nod. If the Pats win SB41 in three weeks, he'll start to distance himself from the field.

 

[dparker713]

If you dont play crappy for 58 minutes, there is little to no need for clutch play in the last 2 minutes.

 

[Iron Mike Tomczak]

I'd have to say Brady edges out Montana. What's about to come is going to sound weird, but hear me out...Montana's 49ers teams should have won 6 titles (and possibly a 7th if they weren't jobbed by the refs in the NFCCG vs. Washington). Those '80s 49ers were that good. They should have won in 1987 & 1990, but Montana played like poop in the 1987 playoff loss to the Vikings and was ineffective before getting injured in the 1990 NFCCG. When his teams weren't title-contender caliber, the 49ers bowed out meekly (1985, 1986) in the first round with Montana playing stinkers of games in those losses. Doesn't make Montana a bum by any stretch because four SB titles is still damn impressive, but look at it this way...the 49ers four titles are like the Bulls winning only 4 instead of 6 titles in the 1990s - an underachievement of sorts.In contrast, the Pats had no business winning SB36. They were 4 plays from being 10-6 in 2003, but Brady played huge in those near-losses and saved HFA which carried them to a SB38 title. In 2004 the team was clearly championship-material, but still had to go into 15-1 Pittsburgh where Brady played lights-out *with the flu* (there's his 'The Catch' game) and then he picked apart a blitz-happy Eagles team that had 3 Pro Bowlers in the secondary backing those blitzes up. Brady's road to his titles has been more impressive and this is why I'm giving him the nod. If the Pats win SB41 in three weeks, he'll start to distance himself from the field.

Joes 4 has to edge Bradys 3.Until theyre on the same level with rings, how can you give the nod to Brady.I read your post and I hear your argument, but it seems like youre banking on Brady winning it all this year. That ship has still to set sail, and how clutch would Brady be if he loses this weekend. I would wait it out a few weeks to say what youre saying. And I appreciate the fact that you are not just basing this opinion on nothing, you have showed a substaintial amount of data to develop your well thought out but poorly advised argument. Career wise, you have to give it to Joe as of now, nothing you can say will take away the fact he has won more Superbowls, and what is more clutch than being the QB for a 4 SB winning team (just ask terry bradshaw).

 

[pats3in4]

I'd have to say Brady edges out Montana. What's about to come is going to sound weird, but hear me out...Montana's 49ers teams should have won 6 titles (and possibly a 7th if they weren't jobbed by the refs in the NFCCG vs. Washington). Those '80s 49ers were that good. They should have won in 1987 & 1990, but Montana played like poop in the 1987 playoff loss to the Vikings and was ineffective before getting injured in the 1990 NFCCG. When his teams weren't title-contender caliber, the 49ers bowed out meekly (1985, 1986) in the first round with Montana playing stinkers of games in those losses. Doesn't make Montana a bum by any stretch because four SB titles is still damn impressive, but look at it this way...the 49ers four titles are like the Bulls winning only 4 instead of 6 titles in the 1990s - an underachievement of sorts.In contrast, the Pats had no business winning SB36. They were 4 plays from being 10-6 in 2003, but Brady played huge in those near-losses and saved HFA which carried them to a SB38 title. In 2004 the team was clearly championship-material, but still had to go into 15-1 Pittsburgh where Brady played lights-out *with the flu* (there's his 'The Catch' game) and then he picked apart a blitz-happy Eagles team that had 3 Pro Bowlers in the secondary backing those blitzes up. Brady's road to his titles has been more impressive and this is why I'm giving him the nod. If the Pats win SB41 in three weeks, he'll start to distance himself from the field.

Joes 4 has to edge Bradys 3.Until theyre on the same level with rings, how can you give the nod to Brady.I read your post and I hear your argument, but it seems like youre banking on Brady winning it all this year. That ship has still to set sail, and how clutch would Brady be if he loses this weekend. I would wait it out a few weeks to say what youre saying. And I appreciate the fact that you are not just basing this opinion on nothing, you have showed a substaintial amount of data to develop your well thought out but poorly advised argument. Career wise, you have to give it to Joe as of now, nothing you can say will take away the fact he has won more Superbowls, and what is more clutch than being the QB for a 4 SB winning team (just ask terry bradshaw).

Which is more impressive: Winning 4 rings when you should have won 6 or winning 3 rings when you should have won 1 (I'll concede 2 if the Pats 2003 season is considered like the 49ers 1988 season - those Pats were real close to 10-6)? If the Pats win in 3 weeks, that will be 4 rings when they really should have won 1 (or 2). And Brady still has plenty of years ahead of him and expecting him to nosedive is nuts when you look at him play. For God's sake, they might win their 4th ring with Jabar Gaffney and Reche Caldwell as their top 2 WRs! Brady continues to get more out of less.

 

[Assani Fisher]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

Didn't he lose 3 SBs? I understand that he didn't have great talent around him, but they even got blown out in a few. Super Bowls are the epitome of clutchness imho. I have Elway as a distant third. I think Brady and Montana are tied for first.Wasn't Elway up on the Redskins 10-0 in the first quarter in one SB and then that offense didn't score a point for the rest of the game...how can that be considered clutch to come up that empty in the most clutch circumstance(the SB)? Hell, if Terrell Davis never existed we'd be grouping Elway with Manning and Marino instead of this group.

 

[Assani Fisher]

Elway should be a runaway #1. Joe #2. Brady a distant #3.

I don't know about runaway, but no way should he be behind Brady.

Give it a break, Mr Horse teeth only won a superbowl because he had Terrel Davis.Brady is doing it with a bunch of journeymen WR's.

And a great defense ... and a great coach.

Bellichick has a losing career record without Brady. His defense's ranking in the SB years:2001: 6th in points allowed, 24th in yards allowed, they won the SB 20-172003: 1st in points allowed, 7th in yards allowed, they won the SB 32-292004: 2nd in points allowed, 9th in yards aloowed, they won the SB 24-21Conclusion: His defense has always been a bend but don't break type of unit. But in the SBs, none of them could be characterized as low scoring, although I will admit that the defense was the key unit in the first SB against a great Rams offense.Edited to add: In Montana's SB wins his defense let up 21, 16, 10, 16, and 10 points...so in addition to by far having better surrounding offensive talent, Montana also had more SB help on defense.

 

[Iron Mike Tomczak]

I'd have to say Brady edges out Montana. What's about to come is going to sound weird, but hear me out...Montana's 49ers teams should have won 6 titles (and possibly a 7th if they weren't jobbed by the refs in the NFCCG vs. Washington). Those '80s 49ers were that good. They should have won in 1987 & 1990, but Montana played like poop in the 1987 playoff loss to the Vikings and was ineffective before getting injured in the 1990 NFCCG. When his teams weren't title-contender caliber, the 49ers bowed out meekly (1985, 1986) in the first round with Montana playing stinkers of games in those losses. Doesn't make Montana a bum by any stretch because four SB titles is still damn impressive, but look at it this way...the 49ers four titles are like the Bulls winning only 4 instead of 6 titles in the 1990s - an underachievement of sorts.In contrast, the Pats had no business winning SB36. They were 4 plays from being 10-6 in 2003, but Brady played huge in those near-losses and saved HFA which carried them to a SB38 title. In 2004 the team was clearly championship-material, but still had to go into 15-1 Pittsburgh where Brady played lights-out *with the flu* (there's his 'The Catch' game) and then he picked apart a blitz-happy Eagles team that had 3 Pro Bowlers in the secondary backing those blitzes up. Brady's road to his titles has been more impressive and this is why I'm giving him the nod. If the Pats win SB41 in three weeks, he'll start to distance himself from the field.

Joes 4 has to edge Bradys 3.Until theyre on the same level with rings, how can you give the nod to Brady.I read your post and I hear your argument, but it seems like youre banking on Brady winning it all this year. That ship has still to set sail, and how clutch would Brady be if he loses this weekend. I would wait it out a few weeks to say what youre saying. And I appreciate the fact that you are not just basing this opinion on nothing, you have showed a substaintial amount of data to develop your well thought out but poorly advised argument. Career wise, you have to give it to Joe as of now, nothing you can say will take away the fact he has won more Superbowls, and what is more clutch than being the QB for a 4 SB winning team (just ask terry bradshaw).

Which is more impressive: Winning 4 rings when you should have won 6 or winning 3 rings when you should have won 1 (I'll concede 2 if the Pats 2003 season is considered like the 49ers 1988 season - those Pats were real close to 10-6)? If the Pats win in 3 weeks, that will be 4 rings when they really should have won 1 (or 2). And Brady still has plenty of years ahead of him and expecting him to nosedive is nuts when you look at him play. For God's sake, they might win their 4th ring with Jabar Gaffney and Reche Caldwell as their top 2 WRs! Brady continues to get more out of less.

Id take the more rings.Putting Shoulda woulda coulda aside....take whats real. Stats are stats, and theres no denying Brady will continue to play. But how many superbowls did Montana win in the 1990s? I think its reasonable to say 2000's are Brady's as the 1980's we're Montana's. And Montana won 4. Ill stick to my guns and say 4 of 6 beats 3 of 5, which is to say Brady doesn't win this year. If Brady does win the SB this year, Ill certainly change my opinion with that achievement and admit my faults. Until then, Joe is the better QB to have. Better Defense or not. Hell, the best defense is a great offense, no?