TripItUp
Footballguy
any links you have that are positive about Watson's shoulder would be appreciated.
Stefania Bell and others that I've heard on podcasts do not sound very positive.
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WR Amari Cooper, Free Agent (2 Viewers)
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any links you have that are positive about Watson's shoulder would be appreciated.
Stefania Bell and others that I've heard on podcasts do not sound very positive.
I'm basing my comment more on what I've not heard, which is really nothing negative. That's mainly multiple Browns beat writers who have wrote countless articles about him being on track, looking good, comments from head coach, GM,etc. Just nothing at all that sounds like a reason for concern and he ended mini-camp throwing the ball great by multiple accounts.
In terms of injury info and the growing popularity of online fantasy medical opinions I must say, with all due respect to Stefania who was a pioneer on this forefront, I don't pay her any mind. The only person I've paid any attention to on this front in years is ProFootballdoc(Dr. Chao). There is simply no one else in that space with his pedigree and I've found his information, while of course not 100% accurate, as a very strong source that has for the most part guided me well over the years.
This is not said to stump for him, just to say if he's not saying it I don't really care.
He's voiced no concerns on Watson. His last update was February when he said he should begin throwing in March and be full participant in camp.
Just not seeing any reports from anyone I put much credibility or stock in to be concerned.
TripItUp
Footballguy
Stefania Bell went into great detail about how Watson's injury is different and difficult.
I consider her the cream of the crop when it comes to injury analysis...she's in the inner circle of team doctors etc.
Ok, trust my sources as I'm sure you do yours, proceeding myself with no worries.
Gruden's Keyboard
Footballguy
Stefania Bell was the first to (correctly) express doubt on Kyle Pitt's knee going into last season iirc.
Here (10 days ago) she talks about the complicated nature of the injury in general terms, but also states at 40:00 that it is her understanding that Watson is "throwing very well" and "on track to start the season".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFIQFORZspk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFIQFORZspk
I don't pay any attention to her so can't know but I can say for sure that Dr. Chao expressed a lot of doubt early on so it was not some novel idea.
TripItUp
Footballguy
the tone was a bit different on the podcast I listened to, but she did not say definitively that Watson won't come back to 100%...I want to be clear about that.
it was more of a "proceed with caution" tone.
Regardless, her assessment coupled with his current limitations and jameson backing up has been enough for me to steer clear of Cleveland players at ADP.
I'd agree with this. As long as its not an injured version of Watson playing, I don't think the QB matters for Cooper. He's produced with a host of guys throughout his career. and at this point, its tough to argue Watson is anything above a league average QB, and that might be being generous.
Da Franchise
Footballguy
It’s cool she’s in the inner circle of team docs. I’ll listen to guy who was actually head team doc for 17 years, which is Chao. Until some other former or current team doc starts analyzing injury info for the public, it’s pretty pointless to look anywhere else. He’s not infallible but literally, by definition, every other source is worse than him when it comes to NFL injury.
TripItUp
Footballguy
Bell > Chao and not close IMHO
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
RaidersAreOne
Footballguy
I wish the Browns had a better QB situation. Cooper as their WR1 and down Chubb for at least 4 games should mean a ton of looks. I don't think much of Jeudy either.
Such a shame Watson is a JAG.
Such a shame Watson is a JAG.
(HULK)
(Smash)
If you actually looked at Amari's splits when Watson was healthy, you'd have a completely different take on it.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Cooper is gonna eat regardless of who’s behind center.
what are they looking like? if my memory serves me, I think he performed better with Flacco than he did with Watson.
(HULK)
(Smash)
Going from memory, but it was something like he averaged 90 yards and a TD a game with Watson.
ok I broke it down a little more.
Watson played week 1,2,3,7,9, and 10.
I am excluding week 7 as watson got hurt early in the game and it skews the stats some to leave it in.
he averaged 96 yards per game
under flacco he played week 13-16 and the wildcard game.
I'm throwing out week 13 as flacco just joined the team and didnt really know the offense. so I'm assuming week 13 would not be representative of the typical (though he got 3 catches for 34 yards that day)
after that he averaged 127.5 yards per game with Flacco. even if you include the first week his average was like 109 yards per game with flacco. still better by at least 12%. better by 30% if you exclude that game.
that said, if you think Flacco is JAG what does that make Watson?
I fully acknowledge the sample size is too small to really draw anything conclusive from this but this does make Watson look bad.
RaidersAreOne
Footballguy
Boy would I ever love to see Cooper moved to the 49ers.
Zow
Footballguy
That's where I've been getting him in redrafts. Got him for like $2 in an empire league. I'm happy with the value all-around.
Cooper's shine has some natural tarnish to it because he's just older and Watson looks terrible. But, he's basically priced at his floor and Cooper has shown - kind of like a Tyler Lockett - that he consistently meets to exceeds that floor every year making him a boring but nonetheless great value.
Average is distorted by the Wk 16 monster game. If you look at medians, it looks like this:
Watson 5 games (ex wk 7): 8 targets / 6 catches / 98 yds / 2 total TDs
Flacco 6 games (wouldn't exclude wk 14): 8 / 4 / 77 / 3 total TDs
BIRDGANG52
Footballguy
All boring draft:
Barkley
Adams
Evans
Connor
Cooper
Potential team name, "The Retirement Home" or "Nobody Under 28".
(HULK)
(Smash)
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Cooper was wide open on several pass attempts by Cleveland where Watson just completely missed him
The bad news is Watson is likely to remain the QB but it should be noted Jameis Winston is the back up and he could see the field at some point
Did I see Cooper drop a pass where he was wide open? Not the best thrown ball as I recall but Cooper needs to make that catch.
What I saw though is a WR that still knows how to get open a lot and is the most accomplished WR of the group
2/16 receiving, Njoku led all receivers/TEs with 4/44 but he's gone with a high ankle sprain for at least a couple weeks if not longer.
I think Cooper is an incredible BUY LOW on the 1st Monday of the NFL season
You might find a panicked owner
The bad news is Watson is likely to remain the QB but it should be noted Jameis Winston is the back up and he could see the field at some point
Did I see Cooper drop a pass where he was wide open? Not the best thrown ball as I recall but Cooper needs to make that catch.
What I saw though is a WR that still knows how to get open a lot and is the most accomplished WR of the group
2/16 receiving, Njoku led all receivers/TEs with 4/44 but he's gone with a high ankle sprain for at least a couple weeks if not longer.
I think Cooper is an incredible BUY LOW on the 1st Monday of the NFL season
You might find a panicked owner
Smack Tripper
Footballguy
He's dead money
RaidersAreOne
Footballguy
OUCH.
dcgangstas
Footballguy
The Browns have to bench Watson.
Speaking for the entire team that has to play with watson
Not sure if a lot teams will line up to sign him. I am not sure this is 100% on Watson. Maybe Cooper has lost a step. Not everyone is Mike Evans.
I tend to think Cooper is just fine and Watson blows.
Yeah, you literally only have to go back 4 games played for Cooper for a massive 265 yard receiving game on 11 catches. The game before that was 4 catches for 109 yards.
osubuckeyeman
Footballguy
It stinks keeping a talent like Cooper on the bench, but what else can you do? I traded for him right before week one's games. He is still talented, but the Browns have Watson and offensive line issues. I have not watched the game yet, and I will, no matter how painful. You can not trade him for any value at this point. I do not think cutting him is the answer yet. The Browns' winning creates the issue of not benching Watson. I would like to see him with Winston, but I think they will ride with Watson till he is suspended, or who knows what would make them bench Watson. I'm embarrassed to admit what I gave up for him, and I'm a contending team, or I should say I was with potential to be. This week, I'm battling with the team I traded with to get Cooper to add to the misery. FF football is fun no matter what, even when this happens, but I generally feel like I stepped into a basket of rattlesnakes by making that trade.
No, so there's still hope. Thanks
Kdpatronis15
Footballguy
Do not have access to article, what does it say?
Don't know how credible Sports Illustrated is these days, but they've been saying they have heard some rumors that Dallas is trying to trade for Cooper, and that Cooper is interested in a return.
We know Cleveland doesn't seem to want to extend him, and they already paid Jeudy...so is this maybe something that could have legs?
We know Cleveland doesn't seem to want to extend him, and they already paid Jeudy...so is this maybe something that could have legs?
osubuckeyeman
Footballguy
Going to put him in this week because why not? Some whispers and a decent matchup. Just feels like he needs to be in the lineup this week.
I was going to say.
Watson fantasy owners have more reason to be feel letdown by Cooper then vice versa.
osubuckeyeman
Footballguy
It does not matter to me whose fault it is. Just get it done. I did not watch last week's game, so I can not comment on either Watson or Cooper's play. I know week one was pretty dag gone ugly though.
osubuckeyeman
Footballguy
That felt good for Cooper.
