Birdie048
Footballguy
NFL Network—> Flowers was compared to T Lockett Sea WR in physical attributes & numbers. That could be a good comp pending where he lands
I was hoping early 2nd pick but could be gone by then
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WR Zay Flowers, BAL (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
I was hoping early 2nd pick but could be gone by then
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
They've been talking about him being late first since the Shrine Bowl. Lot of teams fell in love with him.
Boston
Footballguy
It will be an odd year with the draft...besides Bijan and Gibbs pretty much all the other top prospects have a pretty sizable swing as to where they will get drafted...once the NFL draft happens that will clear some stuff up but right now after those two you are gonna have to make some legit choices...they will not be lay-up/no-brainer picks.
I was just thinking a few minutes ago how glad I am to not have any picks at 3 or 4 and have to mess with trying to figure that out.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Absolutely true - Hill was unique in he went over the middle and took some tough hits.
I’m not sure Flowers is as stout? I’ll have to look into him more.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I wonder how many non-QB skill guys go in the first round since this class is supposed to be so special. I’m guessing it may only be 2-3 guys.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I have been wondering the same. Every year the mock drafts around this time are littered with skill players, and seemingly every year in the NFL draft first round is all about edge rushers, D lineman, quarterbacks, and offensive tackles.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
6 WRs went in Round 1 last season. I don’t think we sniff that this year - but no RBs last season (Hall went early second) and I’d be very surprised if Bijan does not go before that.
Maybe a guy like TE Meyer goes in late first though.
Boston
Footballguy
Such a huge swing...for RB it will be Bijan and maybe Gibbs...at WR you have 4 potentials and TE is a complete wildcard as Mayer, Washington, Kincaid and Musgrave could all be #1's but you can't be surprised if they don't as well...that is a total of 10 potentials but the hard reality is Bijan is the only definite but I do have hard time believing 2 definitely and probably 3 WRs (and would not be surprised by 4) go in the 1st as that has turned into a premium position.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I’d be surprised if Gibbs goes in the first but possible of course.
Boston
Footballguy
He is interesting...when you get to the bottom of the 1st you have teams like KC, Buffalo, Philly, Dallas and Cincy that are all good teams and either could use a RB or may need one depending on what happens with Pollard or Mixon...that being said with the depth of the RB class they could simply pass and figure it out later...right now there are just so many viable scenarios and I think we need to be ready to be surprised where some of these guys end up once the draft happens...will definitely make for some good speculation until then.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
KC is possible. While Gibbs may be better than Cook, the Bills took a similar RB in Round 2 last year, so don’t see them. I could see them in on Bijan.
Dallas I’ve heard could be in on Bijan also, so maybe Gibbs is fall back.
Anyway, apologies for going off-topic, but I guess it started since I think Flowers is a guy that could be one of the first rounders.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Seems very realistic. It’s hard to get excited about rookie TEs, but it’s nice to see that there’s some infusion of talent in what has been a wasteland position for a few years now.
There were so many plays last season where Flowers got wide open 20+ yards downfield, and the ball never even got out. BC was horrific last year, and Flowers was a 1-man offense for them. Probably a good bet no other Boston College player even gets drafted this year.
Flowers is my WR3 in this draft, and I think he profiles as a potential #1 WR despite his size. Tyler Lockett was brought up earlier as a comp, I've seen TY Hilton as well, and those both track. Flowers has great quicks, but also is pretty well rounded. He's not a 1-dimensional deep threat like Jalin Hyatt is.
Flowers is my WR3 in this draft, and I think he profiles as a potential #1 WR despite his size. Tyler Lockett was brought up earlier as a comp, I've seen TY Hilton as well, and those both track. Flowers has great quicks, but also is pretty well rounded. He's not a 1-dimensional deep threat like Jalin Hyatt is.
socrates
Footballguy
I like the comparison to Tyler Lockett, but also consider similarities to Antonio Brown.
| Steve Smith (2001) | Antonio Brown (2010) | Tyler Lockett (2015) | Zay Flowers (2023) | |
| Height | 5-9 | 5-10 | 5-10 | 5-9 |
| Weight | 184 | 186 | 182 | 182 |
| Arm | 31 - 1/2 | 31 | 30 | 29 - 1/4 |
| Hand | 9 - 1/4 | 9 | 8 - 3/8 | 9 - 1/4 |
| 40 yd Dash | 4.44 | 4.48 (Pro Day) | 4.40 | 4.42 |
| 10 yd Split | 1.54 | 1.56 | 1.55 | 1.53 |
| Vertical Jump | 38 - 1/2 | 33 - 1/2 | 35 - 1/2 | 35 - 1/2 |
| Broad Jump | N/A | 8' 9" | 10' 1" | 10' 7" |
* Edit to also add Steve Smith's numbers for comparison
Last edited:
metoo
Footballguy
What Steve Smith says about him.
Zay Flowers: Future NFL STAR
Steve thinks Boston College star Zay Flowers is Wide Receiver 1 in this year’s NFL Draft.#stevesmith #stevesmithsr #nfl #underdogfantasy #underdog #football ...
youtube.com
Da Franchise
Footballguy
Lockett looks so much smaller to me than the rest of those guys. I don’t know why but he’s always looked tiny to me while Smith, AB, and Flowers look much more filled out.
The Frankman
Footballguy
It's funny because when you mentioned AB I immediately thought of Elijah Moore, who is 5'10 and 178. How much muscle Flowers' frame can handle and still maintain his speed/separation will be key. Prime AB was jacked while Lockett never really was a massive guy.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Warren Sharp
@SharpFootball
as the NFL trends more to zone coverage...
Zay Flowers could take advantage
posted a 52% positive play rate v zone (37% v man)
and was #4 in this class in missed/broken tackles
we also haven't come close to seeing what he can do because his QB situation was horrific at BC
only 60% of his targets were catchable
that ranked 62nd in this class out of 70 WOOF
but he still gained 8.5 yards per target whereas every other receiver on his team averaged 6.1 yards per target
@DanPizzuta
looks at the 2023 WR class:
LINK 2023 NFL Draft: Contextualizing Wide Receiver Production
...Lifting A Bad Offense
Zay Flowers is the WR4 in this class, per Grinding The Mocks, and among his strengths was carrying a bad offense that didn’t produce much without him. On throws not to Flowers, the Boston College offense averaged only 6.05 yards per pass attempt which was the third-lowest figure for a receiver prospect in this class.
Flowers has shown the ability to win in just about every area of the field, despite his frame of 5-foot-9 and 181 pounds. He won both outside and from the slot and 49% of his routes were charted as deep by SIS, the second-highest rate for a receiver in this class. In that way, he could profile like a Brandin Cooks-type receiver who wins on the outside with smaller size. ...
-----------------------------------------
Go to link for full read.
@SharpFootball
as the NFL trends more to zone coverage...
Zay Flowers could take advantage
posted a 52% positive play rate v zone (37% v man)
and was #4 in this class in missed/broken tackles
we also haven't come close to seeing what he can do because his QB situation was horrific at BC
only 60% of his targets were catchable
that ranked 62nd in this class out of 70 WOOF
but he still gained 8.5 yards per target whereas every other receiver on his team averaged 6.1 yards per target
@DanPizzuta
looks at the 2023 WR class:
LINK 2023 NFL Draft: Contextualizing Wide Receiver Production
...Lifting A Bad Offense
Zay Flowers is the WR4 in this class, per Grinding The Mocks, and among his strengths was carrying a bad offense that didn’t produce much without him. On throws not to Flowers, the Boston College offense averaged only 6.05 yards per pass attempt which was the third-lowest figure for a receiver prospect in this class.
Flowers has shown the ability to win in just about every area of the field, despite his frame of 5-foot-9 and 181 pounds. He won both outside and from the slot and 49% of his routes were charted as deep by SIS, the second-highest rate for a receiver in this class. In that way, he could profile like a Brandin Cooks-type receiver who wins on the outside with smaller size. ...
-----------------------------------------
Go to link for full read.
smbkrypt24
Footballguy
Flowers
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Why?
smbkrypt24
Footballguy
I have him ranked 3 slots higher than Downs. Admittedly the NFL draft effects my rankings so it could change, but on the clock now I am choosing Flowers.
ChiefD
Footballguy
I would cream my pants if he fell to the Chiefs.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
I can see why it would since you're a Chiefs fan, but it didn't seem to help Hardman, Skyy Moore (yet) or CEH. People get all excited about players going to certain teams because of their offense, thinking it's a slam dunk, but we know that isn't always the case. Just like they used to with NE. Same way with free agents. Having said that, I would take Flowers over Downs for sure if he went to the Chiefs and Downs went to a bad team with a bad QB.
Birdie048
Footballguy
OK... reverse that thinking....
Flowers goes to Baltimore and Downs goes to KC? Who do you take (assume 12 team late 1st round 1QB league)
What if Flowers goes to Miami behind Hill/Waddle and Downs goes to Phil behind AJB/Devonte? How much does landing spot impact them now?
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
Flowers over Downs easily for me. I can't imagine anything happening in the draft that would make me flip. Flowers currently 1.7 on my draft board to Downs 2.7
rockaction
Footballguy
Flowers seems to be the pick here. Just looking at both of their testing and their rankings by publications with film grinders. Why do they both strike me as this year's version of Skyy Moore, though?
I don't want either, frankly. Their athletic scores are really low according to Player Profiler. I'll pass, thanks. Maybe take a Day Three RB or something like that. Hwarf.
I don't want either, frankly. Their athletic scores are really low according to Player Profiler. I'll pass, thanks. Maybe take a Day Three RB or something like that. Hwarf.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
For me, the debate is Flowers vs Addison. But no, the 1st round WR options aren't inspiring stash options to burn the 1.7 on in start 2WR/flex1. I will say that Flowers has "it" if I'm just watching highlights. Between that and the lofty endorsements from the draft evaluators I trust most, he's the WR I think I could talk myself into.
And no, it doesn't help that I was very high on Skyy Moore last year.
And no, it doesn't help that I was very high on Skyy Moore last year.
socrates
Footballguy
I have moved Flowers up a tier ahead of Downs, alongside Addison, Johnston and Charbonnet. I still have Downs at the top of the next tier, however, along with Tucker, Achane, Spears and Mims. Flowers is often being mocked as an end of Round 1 NFL pick; Downs is being mocked as a late Round 2 selection, if that matters. Draft Destination could be more significant than which round each player is selected, and that certainly could bump Downs up or Flowers down for me.
If I am making a decision today, I would easily take Flowers over Downs, and the gap between those tiers is fairly significant for me. Those values can change quickly, however.
sushinsky4tsar
Footballguy
Since other comps have been made, worth adding Waldman's (from A-Z podcast):
Flowers -- some shades of Waddle
Downs -- Landry
Like the AB one, I wouldn't take these too literally. But yeah, I agree that they're in a different tier.
Flowers -- some shades of Waddle
Downs -- Landry
Like the AB one, I wouldn't take these too literally. But yeah, I agree that they're in a different tier.
Wigglytuff's Gruff
Footballguy
Steve Smith said Flowers reminded him of Waddle also.
I hit the character limit in my Route Running thread, so I'm putting the full quotes and links for each player in their bespoke threads.
+ "displays remarkable change of directions skills to change his speeds, both when running routes and after the catch", "runs a variety of routes to all areas of the field and can generate separation consistently with all of them" "Has made significant strides as a route runner to add nuance to routes", "does not have much experience facing Press-Jam coverage at the line of scrimmage" - https://247sports.com/college/bosto...-report-nfl-draft-2023-190378091/#190378091_2
+/- "creates separation up and down the route tree with his movement skills", "Rounds off too many in-breaking routes. Not always sharp on his slants or in-breakers.", "an unlimited route tree" - https://www.si.com/nfl/draft/news/zayflowers
+ "strong route runner who creates separation at the top of his route, shows burst/explosion and ability to create space, good stair step to create space on over/crossing routes", "runs diverse route tree at every level" - https://steelersdepot.com/2023/01/2023-nfl-draft-player-profiles-boston-college-wr-zay-flowers/
+ "His route running is crisp and explosive while taking advantage of the defenders’ leverage." - https://vikingswire.usatoday.com/lists/vikings-skol-search-zay-flowers-boston-college/
+ "Flowers is the best pure separator in the draft class." - https://twitter.com/pff_college/status/1615440697015914497
+ "polished with his route running skills very electric" - https://twitter.com/drobalwayzopen/status/1619783337740226560
+/- "best described as a good collegiate route runner, but isn’t yet a true technician" - https://www.bigblueview.com/2023/2/...s-wr-boston-college-scouting-report-ny-giants
+ "excels in both route running and yards after the catch" - https://draftwire.usatoday.com/lists/2023-nfl-draft-zay-flowers-scouting-report/
+ "one of the best route runners in this year's NFL Draft" - https://twitter.com/nflrookiewatxh/status/1627426686831673345?s=21
+/- "Sudden feet to slip press and race ahead of coverage", "Stair-steps man coverage out of leveraged positioning", "Routes are fast and maintain their momentum through turns", "Routes need better salesmanship and attention to detail"
+ "unique change of direction speed that allowed him to consistently win in his routes" - https://www.thefantasyfootballers.c...-rookie-profile-zay-flowers-fantasy-football/
+ "displays remarkable change of directions skills to change his speeds, both when running routes and after the catch", "runs a variety of routes to all areas of the field and can generate separation consistently with all of them" "Has made significant strides as a route runner to add nuance to routes", "does not have much experience facing Press-Jam coverage at the line of scrimmage" - https://247sports.com/college/bosto...-report-nfl-draft-2023-190378091/#190378091_2
+/- "creates separation up and down the route tree with his movement skills", "Rounds off too many in-breaking routes. Not always sharp on his slants or in-breakers.", "an unlimited route tree" - https://www.si.com/nfl/draft/news/zayflowers
+ "strong route runner who creates separation at the top of his route, shows burst/explosion and ability to create space, good stair step to create space on over/crossing routes", "runs diverse route tree at every level" - https://steelersdepot.com/2023/01/2023-nfl-draft-player-profiles-boston-college-wr-zay-flowers/
+ "His route running is crisp and explosive while taking advantage of the defenders’ leverage." - https://vikingswire.usatoday.com/lists/vikings-skol-search-zay-flowers-boston-college/
+ "Flowers is the best pure separator in the draft class." - https://twitter.com/pff_college/status/1615440697015914497
+ "polished with his route running skills very electric" - https://twitter.com/drobalwayzopen/status/1619783337740226560
+/- "best described as a good collegiate route runner, but isn’t yet a true technician" - https://www.bigblueview.com/2023/2/...s-wr-boston-college-scouting-report-ny-giants
+ "excels in both route running and yards after the catch" - https://draftwire.usatoday.com/lists/2023-nfl-draft-zay-flowers-scouting-report/
+ "one of the best route runners in this year's NFL Draft" - https://twitter.com/nflrookiewatxh/status/1627426686831673345?s=21
+/- "Sudden feet to slip press and race ahead of coverage", "Stair-steps man coverage out of leveraged positioning", "Routes are fast and maintain their momentum through turns", "Routes need better salesmanship and attention to detail"
+ "unique change of direction speed that allowed him to consistently win in his routes" - https://www.thefantasyfootballers.c...-rookie-profile-zay-flowers-fantasy-football/
