This PFF ranking supports my claims imo Washington has the 4th highest rated line in the league
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/11/20/ranking-the-2013-offensive-lines-second-quarter/5/
Last edited by a moderator:
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
QB Kirk Cousins, ATL (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter pizzatyme
- Start date
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/11/20/ranking-the-2013-offensive-lines-second-quarter/5/
Your opinion is well stated, and I understand the logic behind, but the simple truth is that isn't how the NFL works. Right or wrong, that is the case. Again, if you owned the Washington flying pigs, you would be less likely to "rest" RGIII if it was going to cost you a significant amount of money because upset fans don't pay for parking, buy concessions, buy jerseys etc, even if it might be "smart" to do so.
But with regards to the bolded, I disagree. If you only get 16 games in a season to experience game action, that is most definitely different than a league that has 82, plus a D-league that allows some evaluation. There is no "minor league" of football (since the CFL doesn't import many players, and NFL-Europe got shut down). The only time players can truly experience an NFL game is during the regular season. Those games are two "precious" (for lack of a better word) to waste them by seeing what a backup can do. You have to let your starters and main guys get that work.
financewonk
Footballguy
lod01
Footballguy
lod01
Footballguy
There is a difference between scrambling (Ben) and just running around like this guy. Putting Ben and this guy in the same sentence is laughable.
Last edited by a moderator:
Warrior
Footballguy
Good to see RW inject some common sense into the conversation.
Speaking Tuesday, Redskins coach Mike Shanahan brushed off talk that Robert Griffin III should be benched.
A surprising number of people seem to believe Kirk Cousins is the answer to the Redskins' woes, but Shanny rightfully isn't having it. "It doesn't happen overnight," Shanahan said of RGIII's development. "You need those repetitions." Shanahan still believes Griffin has "all the ability in the world to make that big jump." The suggestion that the Redskins should bench Griffin — a player they surrendered three first-round picks for — down the stretch of a lost season is absolutely asinine, and would set back, not further, the team's agenda heading into 2014. Shanahan could be gone next year, but the Redskins have far too much invested in RGIII to pull the plug any time soon. He needs, and deserves, time after returning from a catastrophic knee injury.
Speaking Tuesday, Redskins coach Mike Shanahan brushed off talk that Robert Griffin III should be benched.
A surprising number of people seem to believe Kirk Cousins is the answer to the Redskins' woes, but Shanny rightfully isn't having it. "It doesn't happen overnight," Shanahan said of RGIII's development. "You need those repetitions." Shanahan still believes Griffin has "all the ability in the world to make that big jump." The suggestion that the Redskins should bench Griffin — a player they surrendered three first-round picks for — down the stretch of a lost season is absolutely asinine, and would set back, not further, the team's agenda heading into 2014. Shanahan could be gone next year, but the Redskins have far too much invested in RGIII to pull the plug any time soon. He needs, and deserves, time after returning from a catastrophic knee injury.
Warrior
Footballguy
Your QB analysis is laughable, and clearly doesn't extend past repeating "running around" over and over trying to make some sort of point.
We get it, you treat different types of QBs very differently.
Warrior
Footballguy
Honest question: Do you really think that Denver's current O-line, the one that has been ravaged with injuries, is the #1 (that's right, very top of the league) in pass-blocking? Because your cited rankings as proof and those rankings say they're #1.
Common sense, and actually watching the Redskins play now and then, can quickly tell you all you need to know here. PFF's pass-blocking stats are severely flawed. I have no doubt they ranked Peyton's Indy O-line as top of the line too, until the moment his quick release and decision making suffered a neck injury. Suddenly, magically, the backup QB was getting sacked at the highest rate in the league. Funny how dependent these rankings are on the QB, isn't it?
Using the PFF as the be-all, end-all of rankings for O-lines is lazy. Just open your eyes and watch a Redskins game, that'll tell you all you need to know about their pass blocking.
Last edited by a moderator:
I honestly have never looked at the different metrics and analyses that go into PFF's oline rankings but I do know that they are widely cited as being credible.
Denver being ranked #1 indicates there are some results-based numbers used (results-based as in the qb didn't get pressured ergo the o-line did it's job, not adjusting for individual qb variables etc) but doesn't that assumption mean that RG3 shares a larger portion of the blame than expected?
And I know I'm coming off as a RG3 hater or whatever but when I watch Washington play I notice how jittery/frantic/terrified RG3 looks in the pocket. That and his egregious overthrows
RBM
Footballguy
Ridiculous to just assume sitting him the rest of this year automatically stunts his growth. Priority number one should be winning games. Griffin puts the team at a disadvantage weekly. And I actually have a feeling this kid needs rest more than reps.
Yes, there it. The difference is you have an opinion of one of them that is not based on fact, and are unable to use facts to support that opinion.
You want to say RGIII can't read defenses, doesn't progress through his options, etc, then say that. (I'd still disagree, but that's another subject). But don't make some stupid statement that aren't based in facts & hope they won't get challenged.
STEADYMOBBIN 22
Footballguy
OK, obviously your reading comprehension is bad because I did not compare Roethlisberger and Griffin, (in fact I specifically said I didn't compare them) I compared Roethlisberger and RGIII; what I did was prove that the original post was inaccurate. It said you had to get rid of the football quick to be a "real QB," and when QBs "ran around like a fool," it never ended well.
Roethlisberger is an example of a QB who doesn't get rid of the ball quick, yet he is most definitely a "real QB," and in several seasons, it couldn't have ended any better.
metoo
Footballguy
fatness
Footballguy
Lichtensteiger, Polumbus, and Williams are studs.
Have you ever watched Polumbus play? Lichtensteiger holds his own most of the time, Montgomery gets pushed around a bit, Chester gets pushed around a lot, and Polumbus makes all of them look like Hercules. The guy's terrible.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
fatness
Footballguy
I agree. Most starting QB's don't play all 16 games any more due to injury, and we've seen this year how inadequate QB backups can really sink a team.
This is what I posted in the skins thread before seeing this one:
I know people believe Griffin needs to be in there getting snaps and getting experience. But I disagree. It wasn't that long ago when QBs were drafted and carried clipboards for a few YEARS before they were given a starting gig. In today's high priced league, teams can't afford to sit these guys like that. But I think at this point, it would benefit Griffin way more to get to sit back and watch Cousins play than to go out there and get killed week in and week out. He could sit back, watch the game while not getting crushed, and be getting tips and pointers from the coaches while it is going on, just like QBs used too. At this point, I see no real benefit to him being out there. He's a game away from becoming (as someone alluded too) another David Carr.
I know people believe Griffin needs to be in there getting snaps and getting experience. But I disagree. It wasn't that long ago when QBs were drafted and carried clipboards for a few YEARS before they were given a starting gig. In today's high priced league, teams can't afford to sit these guys like that. But I think at this point, it would benefit Griffin way more to get to sit back and watch Cousins play than to go out there and get killed week in and week out. He could sit back, watch the game while not getting crushed, and be getting tips and pointers from the coaches while it is going on, just like QBs used too. At this point, I see no real benefit to him being out there. He's a game away from becoming (as someone alluded too) another David Carr.
lod01
Footballguy
fatness
Footballguy
A couple of things:
Most college QBs (especially if they are drafted high) are more prepared for the NFL today, because of the nature of the big college programs and the offenses that many college teams runs (Washington's offense incorporates many plays from RGIII's Baylor days, IIRC).
Back in the "good old days," if you let a QB sit for 2-3 years to learn the offense, you could still control his contract, because FA was not nearly as prevalent. Today, if you are talking about a 1st round pick, you control his rights for 5 years, MAX. If you sit him for 3 years, and he resents that (or you bench/sit him, making him resentful), by the team he is "ready" to be a NFL QB, he can choose to leave your franchise. NFL teams need to see if these young QBs are going to be the answer for them early, so they can decide about extending their contracts before they hit FA. It's really "sink or swim" anymore. QBs have to adapt quickly, or the franchise has to prepare to move on. The only way for the franchise to do so is to see him play, in live games.
PatsWillWin
Footballguy
You're not a troll for starting the thread, you're a troll because you're a well known troll.
The Claymaker
Footballguy
I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
cowboyz1
Footballguy
What we are seeing is a second year rookie QB who spent the entire off season rehabbing and unable to work on his craft. While the rest of the league worked on how to stop him. Defensive coordinators have a lot of pride and stopping RGIII and the read option was on everyone's short list. It proves that a QB needs the off-season to prepare and you can't do that while rehabbing and even more so for a second year rookie. Especially now with the new rules for practice the teams have to follow. With RGIII we are seeing the result of not enough on field preparation, a QB that has lost his confidence and is not the leader that many thought he was. Hopefully he will make it through the rest of the season without getting really injured or getting his ego or confidence shattered in the process. In watching him defect questions, I think he is far more fragile and immature than most think. We may just be witnessing the second coming of Vince Young! He was off my draft board by the way for these very reasons. He's no AP and I haven't seen any QB come off an ACL and play well the next year especially one that runs the read option as a key to his success. He will also be off my draft board next year and until I see how his head turns out will not get a look in any round. Said all that to say this. I really dont think RG could hanldle getting benched so unless he gets hurt he's the starter.
Personally, I think the players association screwed themselves by negotiating softer practice routines. It is painfully obvious that the players aren't in the shape they need to be in to take the punishment of a full season of hitting. Practicing in pads and in weather prepares your body and toughens it up. These players are softer and it's noticeable.
Reminds me of a quote from Apocalypse Now. "Every day I squat here, Charlie is getting stronger while he squats in the bush". Players fought for easier practice schedules and now they are paying for it in injuries to hamstrings, quads, ankles, necks, shoulders and heads. I do believe this is the worst season for injuries that I have seen. Repeat injuries too. That short list that every team has should they need to sign someone to plug a whole, is empty. Especially if you need D linemen. I just think they went too far in negotiating a softer practice schedule and is costing us quality football on the field.
Personally, I think the players association screwed themselves by negotiating softer practice routines. It is painfully obvious that the players aren't in the shape they need to be in to take the punishment of a full season of hitting. Practicing in pads and in weather prepares your body and toughens it up. These players are softer and it's noticeable.
Reminds me of a quote from Apocalypse Now. "Every day I squat here, Charlie is getting stronger while he squats in the bush". Players fought for easier practice schedules and now they are paying for it in injuries to hamstrings, quads, ankles, necks, shoulders and heads. I do believe this is the worst season for injuries that I have seen. Repeat injuries too. That short list that every team has should they need to sign someone to plug a whole, is empty. Especially if you need D linemen. I just think they went too far in negotiating a softer practice schedule and is costing us quality football on the field.
Last edited by a moderator:
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
RG3 is the same height/weight as Adrian Peterson... At 6'2 220 running a sub 4.4 he probably would have been a top RB prospect. No he isn't 6'5 240 but I would suspect him to be fine for durability based on size.The Claymaker said:I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
Interesting point. I always here that a QB second year is all about adjustments. I wouldn't soley blame RG3 for this. Eagles defenders and RG3 both said the defenders knew plays ahead of time. Coaches deserve some of the attention here as well, maybe even more since it's their job to be ready for adjustments. I respect Shananhan as a coach and love RG3 as a prospect, but they are starting to seem like a bad fit.cowboyz1 said:
STEADYMOBBIN 22
Footballguy
This is 100% true as far as we know, but he still looks like a wet noodle every time he gets touched. Arms and legs go every direction!RG3 is the same height/weight as Adrian Peterson... At 6'2 220 running a sub 4.4 he probably would have been a top RB prospect. No he isn't 6'5 240 but I would suspect him to be fine for durability based on size.The Claymaker said:I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
The Claymaker
Footballguy
I am not going to argue his size and weight as I have not measured him myself, however Gruden talking during the game said he was about 200 pounds or slightly less as he spoke to him during the week. Now maybe you trust Rotoworld more and that is your option, I will believe the guy who spoke to him directly in the past week. I will also say comparing Petersons body to RG3 is not in the ballpark, they may be similar height but Peterson is a rock. He doesn't flail around like a rag doll when hit. Again, just my opinions, I am sure you are probably right.RG3 is the same height/weight as Adrian Peterson... At 6'2 220 running a sub 4.4 he probably would have been a top RB prospect. No he isn't 6'5 240 but I would suspect him to be fine for durability based on size.The Claymaker said:I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
Last edited by a moderator:
MattFancy
Footballguy
The lack of offseason for him is a bigger issue than most are making it out to be. Is it 100% right now? Maybe, maybe not. I don't think you'll find many players at 100% this late in the season. But when you spend all offseason working on getting your knee back together, you don't have much time to work on drop backs, timing with your WRs, watching film, reading defenses, etc.cowboyz1 said:
I believe RG3 is a great competitor and will work hard in the offseason to prove this season was a fluke. He'll be able to work with his WRs, work on his passing game, and spend plenty of time watching film. Dude just had too much going on last offseason. I'm not even close to throwing in the towel yet. Weren't we saying all these things about Cam last year?
Donnybrook
Footballguy
I really want to see Cousins start as well but probably for the opposite reason than most in this thread. I want to see him get exposed as an average backup QB so that people will stop talking about him like he is a franchise QB. I think he is the most overrated player in the league and does nothing better than RG3 does.
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
It's even hard for me to believe. I try not to be subjective, so I just go with the piblic information we all have available. As far as flailing around I'd just assume it's because the RB position is more violent. RG3I am not going to argue his size and weight as I have not measured him myself, however Gruden talking during the game said he was about 200 pounds or slightly less as he spoke to him during the week. Now maybe you trust Rotoworld more and that is your option, I will believe the guy who spoke to him directly in the past week. I will also say comparing Petersons body to RG3 is not in the ballpark, they may be similar height but Peterson is a rock. He doesn't flail around like a rag doll when hit. Again, just my opinions, I am sure you are probably right.RG3 is the same height/weight as Adrian Peterson... At 6'2 220 running a sub 4.4 he probably would have been a top RB prospect. No he isn't 6'5 240 but I would suspect him to be fine for durability based on size.The Claymaker said:I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
http://www.thefootballeducator.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/TGC-Robert-Griffin-III-at-the-NFL-Combine-Joe-Robbins-Getty-Images.jpg
AP
http://i.a.cnn.net/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/0702/gallery.nfl.combine/images/070225_366.jpg
MattFancy
Footballguy
Don't get me wrong, I like Kirk. But Skins fan and some people in general are letting 1 game against the Browns and 1 series against the Ravens mean so much. If anything, haven't we learned that 2nd string QBs are 2nd string for a reason? Look at Kolb and Flynn has prime examples.
ShaHBucks
Footballguy
Kolb was 4-0 last season..
MattFancy
Footballguy
pizzatyme
Footballguy
Yes, because they run with the exact same styles.RG3 is the same height/weight as Adrian Peterson... At 6'2 220 running a sub 4.4 he probably would have been a top RB prospect. No he isn't 6'5 240 but I would suspect him to be fine for durability based on size.The Claymaker said:I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
pizzatyme
Footballguy
Darren McFadden has about the same measurables as AP too. How's that working out?RG3 is the same height/weight as Adrian Peterson... At 6'2 220 running a sub 4.4 he probably would have been a top RB prospect. No he isn't 6'5 240 but I would suspect him to be fine for durability based on size.The Claymaker said:I don't think this is a bad thread, the bad part is reading it and seeing people act like their opinion is better/smarter or somehow more accurate then anyone elses.
Ben did run around a lot and still does on occasion and he still takes some shots, however, his nickname is BIG Ben, he is a big man at 6'5 240+ he can take a shot and get back up. RG3 is about 6' and is probably barely 200 pounds and yes, I think that makes a huge difference. The other big difference in the running around they do is Ben was running mostly side to side and looking downfield (He also does have a devestating pump fake), watching RG3 he is almost always back pedaling and trying to throw down field and that just doesn't work in the NFL. Just like the pick against Philly, absolutely horrible play and he has thrown multiple picks in the exact same manner.
RG3 reminds me of my son playing Madden when he was about 8-10 years old, he would take a fast guy and use him at QB and then run around for as long as possible and he would either get sacked for a huge loss or make some amazing play. He hated to take the small plays, the short gains that eventually lead to a score, had to have it all at once. Problem is, that worked for him in Madden, but right now it is not working for RG3.
Personally I agree with JohnnyU, I think Cousin's has some skill and will someday be a starting QB, but no way the skins can let him walk or trade him as long as they got RG3 starting, he's too much of an injury risk. He claims he was going to play smarter this year, not sure when that is going to happen, but it certainly has not happened yet. I do not think he is a bad QB at all, I think he needs to play smarter and protect himself better. I also think the play calling could be improved, but again just mho, I actually don't claim to know more than NFL coaches, at least not on here.
JamesTheScot
Footballguy
What do you think he spends all his time doing during the week during the season?
Training camp basically makes it a 20 week season instead of 16. We expect the guys who play in the preseason to have their regular season game worked into shape by the second or third week of the season. Even if you give RG3 a 7 week mulligan, he should be 4 games into his stride by now.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
Cousins was drafted in the same draft as RG3, so automatically saying "2nd string QBs are 2nd string for a reason" is a fallacy with regards to Cousins and RG3. Of course the guy drafted at the top of the draft is going to start over a guy drafted in the 4th round and Washington thought enough of Cousins to draft him in the 4th round, which isn't a throw away round. The 4th round is very important to teams. I don't see any reason why Cousins couldn't be a stud in the NFL. He was a highly regarded prospect coming into the draft and some experts thought he may go in the 1st round.
Last edited by a moderator:
I don't think he is saying RGIII isn't in game shape, but that the things one can work on in the off-season (mechanics, footwork, reading defenses, understanding offensive concepts, getting more familiar with receivers, etc) can't be done in the regular season. You don't have enough time to focus on those things, as the week-to-week game-planning and film study for the weekly opponent is too time consuming.
pizzatyme
Footballguy
This is correct. Plus, I'm guessing many have never been to witness a training camp. The amount of time the QB goes full speed (not game speed) is about 10%. There is far too much emphasis being put on TC. Even with that, RG3 has had ample time to offset missing TC.
pizzatyme
Footballguy
Plus he was drafted higher than Brady. Let's not discount a highly regarded 4th rd. pick.
MattFancy
Footballguy
I've been to Redskins training camp specifically. Sure he's had time to get back into the swing of things. But when teams are working all offseason to stop you and you're working all season rehabbing a knee injury, things aren't going to go so well. Give him a full offseason and he'll be much improved.
The Claymaker
Footballguy
You may be spot on with this comparison, but I do think the difference in those three QB's is arm strength, Kolb and Flynn have very little and Cousins appears to have a decent arm with some mobility. I personally don't think RG3 sucks, but he clearly needs more work and much more work on his decision making.
pizzatyme
Footballguy
What specifically did you see at Redskins camp that leads you to believe would help Griffin be better?
MattFancy
Footballguy
Just more practice in general. He didn't do a ton at TC. If I remember, he didn't really even do many team drills until toward the end of TC. He mainly was doing individual drills and 7-on-7.
I believe he needs to spend this offseason working more on his footwork and drop backs. He didn't get a ton of time to do that during the offseason. Every QB will always tell you there is something they can do better and improve. I'm sure RG3 would tell you that's what he needs to work on. I'm sure part of the footwork is knee related. And has the knee keeps getting stronger and stronger, his footwork will improve.
MattFancy
Footballguy
Agreed. No chance Skins OL is in the top 5. Maybe run blocking, but they can't pass block, especially since the Denver game.
