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QB Deshaun Watson, CLE (9 Viewers)

A question I'm curious about for others following this situation:

If you're Nick Caserio, you might have been granted a semi-second window here. He had a chance right after the season to make the big deal with the largest recoupment of assets. Then the legal scenarios came out and his value went in the tank.

Now, his value is probably somewhere in the middle of those two previous extremes. Do you deal him right now ahead of any legal resolution or do you see the legal situation out, hoping for a positive reconciliation, and then hope to get the same level of assets as your first window would have allowed?

AKA - what would you do and when would you pull the trigger if you were running the Texans?
They need to drum up a multi bid, and take the best offer ASAP. They played the long game and it backfired. It could backfire worse yet though, if criminal charges are filed or he suffers significant injury in camp. 

 
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A question I'm curious about for others following this situation:

If you're Nick Caserio, you might have been granted a semi-second window here. He had a chance right after the season to make the big deal with the largest recoupment of assets. Then the legal scenarios came out and his value went in the tank.

Now, his value is probably somewhere in the middle of those two previous extremes. Do you deal him right now ahead of any legal resolution or do you see the legal situation out, hoping for a positive reconciliation, and then hope to get the same level of assets as your first window would have allowed?

AKA - what would you do and when would you pull the trigger if you were running the Texans?
Perhaps Caserio does not have the authority to take the best action he sees fit.

I suspect that to be the case as 3 firsts for DW would be a stretch in the absence of legal issues.

 
SeniorVBDStudent said:
Perhaps Caserio does not have the authority to take the best action he sees fit.

I suspect that to be the case as 3 firsts for DW would be a stretch in the absence of legal issues.
The image painted of Cal McNair is sort of the opposite. That he's just let his people do things when he probably should have put a stop to them.  Suppose he could be trying to change that, though.

 
Deshaun Watson was present at the start of Texans training camp. 

The NFL, which is investigating the nearly two dozen sexual misconduct allegations lodged against Watson, said the quarterback could participate in team activities during training camp. The legal proceedings in the cases against Watson are expected to last throughout the 2021 NFL season unless Watson settles with the alleged victims out of court -- a move his attorney has dismissed. 

SOURCE: Adam Schefter on Twitter 

Jul 28, 2021, 10:06 AM ET

 
massraider said:
Wait, are you unaware that this is a profession? 

I am making an assumption here. I am assuming he found them through normal channels, and didn't hire them through sketchy means. I make this assumption because if he was hiring them through poorly-disguised prostitution fronts, that would have been all his lawyer would have needed to win the battle of PR. 

Assuming these women weren't advertising a 24 hour discreet encounter on shady websites, I believe that any court strategy that would come across as, "they are a masseuse, we all know they are whores, right?", would go very badly. 
Perhaps but it would also be admitting publicly to something that is illegal and generally perceived as immoral. I am not sure that's the a big PR win. 

 
part one: as much as I would hate it....I send him home every day...(I actually would have already told him not to show up from the beginning, while publicly acknowledging that he was planning on coming and it was our decision for him not to attend)....he made it clear long ago he didn't want to be here....his teammates know that....I don't want him around my team, he doesn't want to be around my team...I don't see the point, it's just uncomfortable and a distraction for everybody....In my mind he has played his last snap for us and I wouldn't have a problem telling people that....he was a part of our story as the Texans, but he will no longer be a main character...if we are "resetting our culture" there is too much smoke for there not be fire with 24 plus no matter how this shakes out....I want to send that message and make it clear.....plus I don't want him to get hurt...time to move on

part two: I actively look to deal him for whatever I can get all along realizing this unfortunately is setting our franchise back and under normal circumstances he is a tremendous player.....but these circumstances are not normal and IMO they will NEVER sniff getting back anywhere close to normal....especially here.....I just can't have this guy as the face of my franchise anymore, I just can't...and it's really past the point of trying to sell that to the other teams....they know it.....so I fully expect them to take advantage of me......if I am lucky, he and his contract becomes somebody elses's problem.... and they can spend the energy on the PR nightmare this will be trying to put some spin on it..... and if it works out for them....so be it...I'll take the L...for many boat owners there are two really good days.....the day you buy the boat......and the day you sell it.....I'm looking to sell......come get a smokin deal...

part three: lick your wounds....throw some dirt on it....move on....start over.....take a tough season and hope you get Rattler or whoever and start your rebuild....I think you would earn much more respect handling things this way, then dragging out the drama and trying to get even a "fair" deall...chalk it up to a loss and yeah it sucks to be us, but we are moving forward....

 
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Perhaps but it would also be admitting publicly to something that is illegal and generally perceived as immoral. I am not sure that's the a big PR win. 
Compared to this???

Mike Vick killed dogs, and was welcomed in Philly.

Guys get forgiven for calling a pro every day. Heck, you can even own a team. #Patriots

 
Compared to this???

Mike Vick killed dogs, and was welcomed in Philly.

Guys get forgiven for calling a pro every day. Heck, you can even own a team. #Patriots
I would think there plan would be to win outright and admit to nothing by preventing it from ever reaching court and to keep all the details out of the public. 

 
Compared to this???

Mike Vick killed dogs, and was welcomed in Philly.

Guys get forgiven for calling a pro every day. Heck, you can even own a team. #Patriots
I think the issue is that this has a sense of entitlement, privilege, and disrespect, etc. all wrapped around kind of an icky creepy weird sexual vibe that people don't really want to be around (even tho I know there is some weird #### out there) ....and that will follow you around forever since the cat is already out of the bag...like someone that gets tagged as something by a rumor, even if it isn't true....that "tag/rumor" still follows you wherever you go....people want to cross over and walk on the other side of the street...

 
I would think there plan would be to win outright and admit to nothing by preventing it from ever reaching court and to keep all the details out of the public. 
That ship has clearly sailed. Right now, a lot of people believe he enlisted massage therapists, and sexually assaulted them. If they could paint the pic that he was calling over rub n tug artists, and some sleazy lawyer rounded them all up for a payday, that is without question the lesser of two evils. He would be the butt of jokes for a while, like Kraft.  Should be said: The chances of this thing going to court, raised in the post I was commenting on, is very very slim. PR battle, and settlement. Long and the short of it, there is no reason not to let the public know that these women are sex workers. It would be much, much better for Watson.  That is why I made that assumption.  

I think the issue is that this has a sense of entitlement, privilege, and disrespect, etc. all wrapped around kind of an icky creepy weird sexual vibe that people don't really want to be around (even tho I know there is some weird #### out there) ....and that will follow you around forever since the cat is already out of the bag...like someone that gets tagged as something by a rumor, even if it isn't true....that "tag/rumor" still follows you wherever you go....people want to cross over and walk on the other side of the street...
If you had some sex workers over, rather than unsuspecting massage professionals who were dragged into a fetish without prior consent, that mitigates a lot of the creepy factor. Not completely, we all have varying levels of icky-ness, but quite a bit, I would think.  

 
part three: lick your wounds....throw some dirt on it....move on....start over.....take a tough season and hope you get Rattler or whoever and start your rebuild....I think you would earn much more respect handling things this way, then dragging out the drama and trying to get even a "fair" deall...chalk it up to a loss and yeah it sucks to be us, but we are moving forward....
Right. And if we're being honest, their track record indicates the likelihood of the Texans front office negotiating a fair trade was remote even in the best of circumstances.

 
That ship has clearly sailed. Right now, a lot of people believe he enlisted massage therapists, and sexually assaulted them. If they could paint the pic that he was calling over rub n tug artists, and some sleazy lawyer rounded them all up for a payday, that is without question the lesser of two evils. He would be the butt of jokes for a while, like Kraft.  Should be said: The chances of this thing going to court, raised in the post I was commenting on, is very very slim. PR battle, and settlement. Long and the short of it, there is no reason not to let the public know that these women are sex workers. It would be much, much better for Watson.  That is why I made that assumption.  

If you had some sex workers over, rather than unsuspecting massage professionals who were dragged into a fetish without prior consent, that mitigates a lot of the creepy factor. Not completely, we all have varying levels of icky-ness, but quite a bit, I would think.  
The ship hasn't sailed. The story has been really quiet so far and isn't getting anywhere near the same national attention that Vick's dog fighting scandal or even deflategate got. If this gets settled outside of court and everyone signs an NDA, we will never get any real details and Watson will recover just fine imo. 

 
The ship hasn't sailed. The story has been really quiet so far and isn't getting anywhere near the same national attention that Vick's dog fighting scandal or even deflategate got. If this gets settled outside of court and everyone signs an NDA, we will never get any real details and Watson will recover just fine imo. 
for many many people there isn't much difference between "settling" and admitting guilt......its just the way it is....most think they are the same....and in some ways you are even more sleazy then just admitting it and facing the consequences...

people always want to compare this to Vick and some other things....this is way different....Vick served prison time, paid his debt, and became an advocate....Vick didn't "settle" anything....

in some ways IMO....settling could be a bad option.....you don't just get to "put it behind you and move on"....I've seen that said a bunch in this thread....but this IMO has more of a longer lasting creepy feel to it....its gonnna stay with Watson no matter how this shakes out.....yeah the Vick thing stays with him, but he has tried to make amends, etc...paid his debt....and telling a ball boy to take a little air out of the football isn't even in the same stratosphere....if Watson "buys his way out"....which is basically what "settling" does....it doesn't "go away"....

 
for many many people there isn't much difference between "settling" and admitting guilt......its just the way it is....most think they are the same....and in some ways you are even more sleazy then just admitting it and facing the consequences...

people always want to compare this to Vick and some other things....this is way different....Vick served prison time, paid his debt, and became an advocate....Vick didn't "settle" anything....

in some ways IMO....settling could be a bad option.....you don't just get to "put it behind you and move on"....I've seen that said a bunch in this thread....but this IMO has more of a longer lasting creepy feel to it....its gonnna stay with Watson no matter how this shakes out.....yeah the Vick thing stays with him, but he has tried to make amends, etc...paid his debt....and telling a ball boy to take a little air out of the football isn't even in the same stratosphere....if Watson "buys his way out"....which is basically what "settling" does....it doesn't "go away"....
I want to be clear, I was not comparing the actions of deflategate to what Watson did. Not the same universe. I only meant in terms of press coverage. For example, my wife who doesn't care for sports knew what deflategate was because it was talked about on The Today Show, Evening News, Tonight Show, etc. I don't think my wife even knows who Deshaun Watson is yet alone some kind of sex scandal around him. It's just not getting a lot of mainstream coverage. I look at Tyreek, Mixon, Ben, Hunt who all had worse situations because there was video and/or there were details. Those incidents were just speed bumps in their careers. It will likely cost Watson endorsements but I don't think it will impact his NFL career- as long as he can keep any gory details out of the press. 

 
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The best thing for Watson is provide nothing for the media to report, not start attacking the victims and admitting to hiring dozens of sex workers. Plus it adds the element of how big a creep is Watson if 20 some sex workers he hired all felt that whatever happened between them was so inappropriate that they felt abused. 

 
When did the narrative change from massage therapists to sex workers?  It was my understanding (from earlier this year) that the former outnumbered the latter by something like 10-1.  Is that incorrect?

 
I want to be clear, I was not comparing the actions of deflategate to what Watson did. Not the same universe. I only meant in terms of press coverage. For example, my wife who doesn't care for sports knew what deflategate was because it was talked about on The Today Show, Evening News, Tonight Show, etc. I don't think my wife even knows who Deshaun Watson is yet alone some kind of sex scandal around him. It's just not getting a lot of mainstream coverage. I look at Tyreek, Mixon, Ben Hunt who all had worse situations because they was video and/or there were details. Those incidents were just speed bumps in their careers. It will likely cost Watson endorsements but I don't think it will impact his NFL career- as long as he can keep any gory details out of the press. 
details have already been released.....we know the things he was trying to do in these situations and what he is being accused of....repeatedly....that horse can't be put back in the barn...it has "lost steam" because things are basically on hold so to speak all the way through FEB IIRC ....as that is when some of the court stuff is scheduled to happen for Watson....other things may happen between now and then.......(at least that is what someone mentioned above)......it will pick up steam as we get closer to the season, and the league and/or team makes decisions on his status..... and then once the season starts it may cool again....but once resolution is near, there will be a lot more steam...

if we are being honest....I think we all pretty much know what was going here....settling doesn't make it go away...it wouldn't make me feel like "hey ok, he didn't do anything wrong, all good, nothing to see here, I'm happy to have him being the QB of my team".....it just won't....so IMO it already has and will continue to impact his NFL career....if it went to court and he was found innocent and it was shown this was all a money grabbing scheme by 24 women and a lawyer, and they all lied....then maybe it would go away...but if he chooses to settle.....all he is basically doing is admitting they weren't lying, and paying money to buy his way out so more details don't get released then already have been....granted there will be some in our world that bury their head in the sand and won't attach "settling" to basically admitting guilt....but they are living in the minority IMO....

I'm really struggling to see how an NFL team takes a chance on this guy and gives up resources and pays him the kind of money he is making.....and then also spinning it to their fan base.....like I said it would probably be an easier sell to my fan base if he just admitted it, took his medicine, and dealt with it.....public apology, remorse, treatment, advocate, etc.....I can sell that to my fan base easier then "oh he settled so technically he hasn't done anything wrong....say hi to our new starting QB".....

 
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Right. And if we're being honest, their track record indicates the likelihood of the Texans front office negotiating a fair trade was remote even in the best of circumstances.
Well, different front office now. Unless they are going to contract negotiations out to Alabama's offensive coordinator.

 
details have already been released.....we know the things he was trying to do in these situations and what he is being accused of....repeatedly....that horse can't be put back in the barn..
I'm glad that you have determined the facts of this case based on the few limited leaks that have come out publicly.  You are truly a scholar and legal expert.

Perhaps you should submit a resume to the league so your expertise can be put to proper use by acting as judge, jury and executioner before any civil or legal proceedings have concluded.

 
When did the narrative change from massage therapists to sex workers?  It was my understanding (from earlier this year) that the former outnumbered the latter by something like 10-1.  Is that incorrect?
It didn't change. Someone brought up a hypothetical, and I went down a rabbit hole. 

My bad!

 
on the field and practicing today

(there was speculation he wouldn’t take snaps)

bizarre unresolved situation 
But he's being made to play on 2nd team defense as a safety. They also have used him as a RB catching a swing pass out of the backfield. He's clearly not being welcomed back. 

 
But he's being made to play on 2nd team defense as a safety. They also have used him as a RB catching a swing pass out of the backfield. He's clearly not being welcomed back. 
I thought for sure this was a bad attempt at sarcasm.

He is indeed taking reps at RB & S, in addition to running simultaneous reps (both take the snap and throw to different receivers) with Tyrod

 
I'm glad that you have determined the facts of this case based on the few limited leaks that have come out publicly.  You are truly a scholar and legal expert.

Perhaps you should submit a resume to the league so your expertise can be put to proper use by acting as judge, jury and executioner before any civil or legal proceedings have concluded.
I love these kind of posts....lol...I said several times IMO...this is a discussion in a thread...I'm giving one POV.....what we have heard seems to be pretty consistent....can't really argue that....I'm all about letting it play out #hillthread....if they all 24 turn out to be lies.....great and I hope all 24 of the accusers get in trouble for false reporting and I hope Watson goes on to have a great career...I am mostly attacking the angle of those that think he should settle and "it will all go away".....I don't think that happens here, in part because we already do know some of the details.....and "settling" will be perceived by many as admitting wrong doing...

 
…and "settling" will be perceived by many as admitting wrong doing...
I disagree that anyone who is following the story would perceive anything beyond a $100M player settling just to be rid of the situation. I say that because settlement was not immediate, his attorney has protested any confidential settlement, prosecutors conducted witness interviews and did not file charges, NFL has conducted interviews and not suspended or put on leave, etc.  in short, a whole bunch of things that run contrary to guilt. But assuming you are right, perception of wrongdoing results in… what exactly? 

 
But he's being made to play on 2nd team defense as a safety. They also have used him as a RB catching a swing pass out of the backfield. He's clearly not being welcomed back. 
Which is blatantly idiotic by the Texans. What happens if/when he gets injured in these silly punishments? Now you are on the hook for his salary, no matter what happens with him legally. 

When Watson's had enough of this crap show "punishment" by the Texans and decides to feign injury if no trade is coming I hope with all of my core he decides to go with a  "groin" injury.
That'd be something, doubly so if its a legit injury.

 
I disagree that anyone who is following the story would perceive anything beyond a $100M player settling just to be rid of the situation. I say that because settlement was not immediate, his attorney has protested any confidential settlement, prosecutors conducted witness interviews and did not file charges, NFL has conducted interviews and not suspended or put on leave, etc.  in short, a whole bunch of things that run contrary to guilt. But assuming you are right, perception of wrongdoing results in… what exactly? 
32 teams say I don't want this guy being the face of my franchise and his NFL career is over...? 

 
I thought for sure this was a bad attempt at sarcasm.

He is indeed taking reps at RB & S, in addition to running simultaneous reps (both take the snap and throw to different receivers) with Tyrod
Same. I thought it was funny, too.

This has to be some arrangement with him.  He must be OK with this, because the only other explanation is that no one hates the Texans more than the current group running the team.  

 
IMO....assuming there is fire behind the smoke x24....

if he fights it in court I think he loses ....

"settling" in many ways is also a loss if it leads to nobody wanting to touch him (no pun intended).....

so I still really feel the only way he wins or gets an outcome close to what he wants is to take responsibility, volunteer for treatment, say he has some mental health issues (good time for this), be humble, make public apologies, make it "right" with his accusers the best he can, and then thank the NFL and HOU for standing by him in whatever capacity that ends up being.....

this approach is best for everybody.....the accusers get some closure and maybe a few bucks, he becomes more tradeable and/or seeing the field again for HOU.....(we love people admitting they made mistakes and owning up to it)....other teams could say hey, he made some mistakes but owned up to them....we want to provide support and give him another chance, etc....owning up to his transgressions seems to be the best way to get him as close as he can to what he wants....

 
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on the field and practicing today

(there was speculation he wouldn’t take snaps)

bizarre unresolved situation 
This opens the door for a lot of criticism of the league as well. How many other players were told to stay away for a single charge, let alone 24? Him being there is interesting in many ways. 

 
This opens the door for a lot of criticism of the league as well. How many other players were told to stay away for a single charge, let alone 24? Him being there is interesting in many ways. 
IMO, the Texans have to so this now if they have any hope of trading him. 

'Hey look, he's practicing, he's doing well, he's not a distraction. Ignore the boogie man behind the curtain '.

Not saying it's right, but it's smart.

 
This opens the door for a lot of criticism of the league as well. How many other players were told to stay away for a single charge, let alone 24? Him being there is interesting in many ways. 


Of the league or of the team?

As far as I can remember, while the league may place the player on the commish exempt list... other than that it's the team who bars players from team activities.  Chiefs with Tyreek and Larry Johnson, Steelers with Chickillo.  Even Adrian Peterson the articles make it sound like it was the Vikings decision to put him on the exempt list which I found surprising.  I thought it's the commish decision, but maybe it changed since then.

Edit to add: I do think it's stupid to let him practice.  The exception for me would be if I thought it might bear fruit if he's around the team for  a couple of days to remember some of the positives, and then we approach him about resolving difference.  If that's the case though I'd probably show more care in how I treat and refer to him than I've seen being done.

 
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This opens the door for a lot of criticism of the league as well. How many other players were told to stay away for a single charge, let alone 24? Him being there is interesting in many ways. 


I don't think he has been charged at all.  A civil suit is different than being charged with a crime.  He has 24 accusations but no charges.  

 
This opens the door for a lot of criticism of the league as well. How many other players were told to stay away for a single charge, let alone 24? Him being there is interesting in many ways. 
Up till now the league has never sent anyone home not facing criminal charges unless video evidence exists and/or after completing their investigation.

They put out a memo on AB that all but put him on exempt list with the threat if anyone signed him they might put him on it but never actually did it as the memo did the job of scaring everyone off.

I  feel pretty sure the league would like Watson to go away until this is over but their hands are bit tied right now with no criminal charges, no video, and not able to fully complete an investigation when they can't talk to all parties.

In terms of opening the door or setting a precedent I do think the league should be leery of just trying to make players go away when faced with civil lawsuits that don't have video or indisputable evidence, especially without doing a full investigation.  That opens up a door of frivilous lawsuits in hopes you can get the player to just settle so they can put this behind them.

 
Aaron Wilson @AaronWilson_NFL

Deshaun Watson reported to training camp to avoid $50,000 daily fines and has a standing trade request as well as a no-trade clause in his $156 million contract. Today, he isn't practicing after having his foot examined yesterday by a trainer.
https://twitter.com/aaronwilson_nfl/status/1422562782998892547?s=21
 

Aaron Wilson @AaronWilson_NFL

Deshaun Watson's foot injury isn't regarded as major, per sources, but going to take precautions. Especially in light of his unresolved trade request.
https://twitter.com/aaronwilson_nfl/status/1422563336860864512?s=21

 
I don't think he has been charged at all.  A civil suit is different than being charged with a crime.  He has 24 accusations but no charges.  
People also keep throwing around 24 "sexual assaults" when it s been sexual misconduct, which is a very different thing. Its like the difference between shoplifting and armed robbery.  Misconduct isn't a felony.

Most predictable foot injury ever by the way. Absolutely idiotic by this staff to have him running drills at DB and RB. I'm they they thought it was funny or cute to punish the guy, but joke's on them if they have to pay him now, regardless of his legal status.

 
People also keep throwing around 24 "sexual assaults" when it s been sexual misconduct, which is a very different thing. Its like the difference between shoplifting and armed robbery.  Misconduct isn't a felony.

Most predictable foot injury ever by the way. Absolutely idiotic by this staff to have him running drills at DB and RB. I'm they they thought it was funny or cute to punish the guy, but joke's on them if they have to pay him now, regardless of his legal status.
You're absolutely right that there's a difference.

I don't know all the accusations but there's at least two assault accusations - touching one woman's V and touching another with his P. 

 
any chance this dude plays in 2021?

I took a flyer on him in 15th round (redraft) last weekend.  I figure his status should be resolved by opening day - if he plays, well worth it.  If not, he will be the first guy I cut.

 

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