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The force of nature that is Taylor Swift


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11 minutes ago, Flash said:

She doesn't write her own songs. Not solo writing anyway, most always a co-writer.

That's not true.  

Example:  She wrote the entirety of her 2010 album "Speak Now".   
 

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Really, the only thing about fame I find interesting is when outsiders become famous for being outsiders rather than people who already have a million connections traversing that terrain. Usually, there's a quality the outsider has that becomes famous for a reason, either by quality or lovableness or acceptance or whatever. Famous people maintaining fame is usually cynical and calculated, and not a whole lot of interesting comes from it. It reacts rather than shapes.

Hope that makes sense, now that we're on the subject of fame.

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Rolling Stone's Top 100 Greatest Songwriters from 2015:

#97 Taylor Swift
Many singer-songwriters reach the point where they have too many great tunes to fit into a live show. Taylor Swift reached that peak before she turned 21. And then she just kept going. She might be the youngest artist on this list — as you may have heard, she was born in 1989, the year Green Day released their first record. But she's already written two or three careers' worth of keepers. "Hi, I'm Taylor," she told the crowds on her Red tour. "I write songs about my feelings. I'm told I have a lot of feelings." Swift's first three albums display her emotional yet uncommonly inventive country style — even early hits like "Our Song" and "Tim McGraw" sound like nobody else. (Only she could slip the line "Any snide remarks from my father about your tattoos will be ignored" into a teen romance like "Ours.") But she's really hit her stride with the pop mastery of Red and 1989, especially on confessional ballads like "Clean" and "All Too Well." There's no limit to where she can go from here.

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5 minutes ago, Northern Voice said:

haters gonna hate, hate, hate, hate, hate

Rhymes with flatulate, at least. Not sure it's even as deep as flatulence, though. Heard her new song about the history of her million dollar mansion, though. Some sort of warmed-over social consciousness to go with conspicuous consumption.

*argbarf*

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1 minute ago, General Malaise said:

Rolling Stone's Top 100 Greatest Songwriters from 2015:

#97 Taylor Swift
Many singer-songwriters reach the point where they have too many great tunes to fit into a live show. Taylor Swift reached that peak before she turned 21. And then she just kept going. She might be the youngest artist on this list — as you may have heard, she was born in 1989, the year Green Day released their first record. But she's already written two or three careers' worth of keepers. "Hi, I'm Taylor," she told the crowds on her Red tour. "I write songs about my feelings. I'm told I have a lot of feelings." Swift's first three albums display her emotional yet uncommonly inventive country style — even early hits like "Our Song" and "Tim McGraw" sound like nobody else. (Only she could slip the line "Any snide remarks from my father about your tattoos will be ignored" into a teen romance like "Ours.") But she's really hit her stride with the pop mastery of Red and 1989, especially on confessional ballads like "Clean" and "All Too Well." There's no limit to where she can go from here.

This is where you could learn about the logical fallacy of "citing authority" and what that means, I guess. But I'll spare it. You have Google.

Edited by rockaction
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Ms Swift deserves some "credit" in the song-writing pantheon because, like it or not, the template for the modern popular song is hers - confessional, syllabic, bi-tonal (1--1--1--1-1-5-15151) verses turned over to hooky "producer" choruses. but she wrote songs to completion (yeah, every original tunesmith has the same producer for her first 6 albums) only in a world where publicists tell the truth

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brohans my take is that music is one of the most subjective of subjectives and no one should tell people what music they should like or not like basically just live and keep on keepin on and if you are the type that needs to run down someone elses music or tastes than maybe take a look at yourself and ask why that is take that to the bank 

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10 minutes ago, wikkidpissah said:

 (yeah, every original tunesmith has the same producer for her first 6 albums) 

I don't understand this part. Her country albums were produced by Nathan Chapman (a country producer). Her pop albums blur a bit between Chapman, Max Martin (who I assume you're referencing here, maybe?) who is absolutely who you go to as a hitmaker to Jack Antonoff (another hit maker but with a more rock than pop orientation) to the last two by Aaron Dessner and Antonoff again. 

It seems every 2-3 albums she switches out producers, no? Is Nathan Chapman a Max Martin alias or something?

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36 minutes ago, rockaction said:

This is where you could learn about the logical fallacy of "citing authority" and what that means, I guess. But I'll spare it. You have Google.

Oh, aren't you so kind.  Tell me more about how smart you are again.

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3 minutes ago, Northern Voice said:

I don't understand this part. Her country albums were produced by Nathan Chapman (a country producer). Her pop albums blur a bit between Chapman, Max Martin (who I assume you're referencing here, maybe?) who is absolutely who you go to as a hitmaker to Jack Antonoff (another hit maker but with a more rock than pop orientation) to the last two by Aaron Dessner and Antonoff again. 

It seems every 2-3 albums she switches out producers, no? Is Nathan Chapman a Max Martin alias or something?

on the phone with an old friend right after the 60 Minutes piece which launched our subject into the stratosphere, which insisted that she handled every aspect of her success from making burgoo for the crew to choosing amphead doilies. i asked old friend how much of a wunderkind she was and he laughed and he laughed and he laughed. then he listed over a dozen ghosts (two of em hacks from my ol posse) responsible for her output. whatever subsequent Swift input invaded my space was appreciated thru that filter and she became continually more preposterous. g'ahead, love her, hate her - it rearranges not a molecule of my existence. call her a force of nature in a public forum, i hab me sum fun.

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7 minutes ago, General Malaise said:

Oh, aren't you so kind.  Tell me more about how smart you are again.

I guess everything is relative.

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7 minutes ago, Leroy Hoard said:

After reading some of this, I have no clue what is being said. SWC has the right idea, just listen to what you like and go from there.

I agree. I like her enough as a pop star, not so much as a serious thing. I'm not really sure where it goes other than that. Not here to nitpick others' tastes, nor have mine nitpicked. Just stating an opinion. 

But I guess I'm smart. There's that.

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21 minutes ago, rockaction said:

I agree. I like her enough as a pop star, not so much as a serious thing. I'm not really sure where it goes other than that. Not here to nitpick others' tastes, nor have mine nitpicked. Just stating an opinion. 

But I guess I'm smart. There's that.

and kind.

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18 hours ago, Ghost Rider said:

Three months ago, I couldn't name a song by her (honest!).  Today, I have become a fan, largely thanks to her two 2020 albums, Folklore and Evermore, both of which are tremendous.  Some of her pop stuff is quite good as well.  I can't get into to her early country stuff, but I get the appeal for others.  Maybe I am fanboying already, but it feels like a lot of the criticism thrown her way over the years is unfair (not all of it, but a lot of it).  She is a helluva lyricist, and seems to have a really good head on her shoulders.  And yes, she is very easy on the eyes, which never hurts :P , but she is the real deal when it comes to songwriting. 

Who else is a fan? 

Aaron Dessner

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6 hours ago, Northern Voice said:

Anyway, back to the appreciation, 

New Romantics kind of went underrated as a bonus track on 1989  but it's up there with the other singles on the album. A throwback to the early 80s - In case you wondered what it would be like if Taylor Swift was lead singer for The Pet Shop Boys.

I had never heard that. Not bad at all. Of her pop stuff, I like the 1989 material the most. I love me some 80's, so an album that harkens back to the 80's is right up my alley. :cool: 

 

4 hours ago, General Malaise said:

That's not true.  

Example:  She wrote the entirety of her 2010 album "Speak Now".   
 

I am not one to play the misogyny card, but the "she doesn't write her own music" narrative just reeks of "Oh, she is a woman and she is pretty, so she couldn't have possibly written her own music."  Oh, but she didn't help? BFD.  Many of the most popular musicians in the last 60 years (using the Beatles as a starting point) didn't write many or any of their songs by themselves.  

 

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3 hours ago, eoMMan said:

She's very talented and very attractive (please don't ban for that).

She's in the news now...

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-56247655

Imo, she's gotta learn to let that go.

Haven't we evolved past the point where being slut shammed is something a woman is supposed to just "let go"? 

3 hours ago, FairWarning said:

Looking at her fans on twitter, its Trump-cultlike.  

Yeah, to say her hardcore fans are dedicated would be an understatement.  Fan is short for fanatic, after all. :lol: 

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2 minutes ago, Ghost Rider said:

Haven't we evolved past the point where being slut shammed is something a woman is supposed to just "let go"? 

Yeah, to say her hardcore fans are dedicated would be an understatement.  Fan is short for fanatic, after all. :lol: 

Funny they want to organize a boycott of that show.  I don’t know a lot about her, but it seems like she has made a LOT of money singing about her bad relationships.  If I were a betting man (ok I am), she probably will have a song lined up for her current BF also.  Personally I never really got the fascination with who celebrities are dating.  

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6 minutes ago, FairWarning said:

Funny they want to organize a boycott of that show.  I don’t know a lot about her, but it seems like she has made a LOT of money singing about her bad relationships.  If I were a betting man (ok I am), she probably will have a song lined up for her current BF also.  Personally I never really got the fascination with who celebrities are dating.  

Same here. I couldn't care less about who a celebrity is dating. I know that Swift has supposedly been dating the same guy for 3-4 years now, and has said before that Blank Space, her most famous song about relationships, was satire (it was poking fun at the media's portrayal of her), so if nothing else she is a master at turning any criticism or negative into a positive for herself. Madonna was that way as well for a long time, and it appears as if Taylor is as much of a marketing genius. 

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1 hour ago, Ghost Rider said:

Same here. I couldn't care less about who a celebrity is dating. I know that Swift has supposedly been dating the same guy for 3-4 years now, and has said before that Blank Space, her most famous song about relationships, was satire (it was poking fun at the media's portrayal of her), so if nothing else she is a master at turning any criticism or negative into a positive for herself. Madonna was that way as well for a long time, and it appears as if Taylor is as much of a marketing genius. 

She is definitely a marketing genius on the par of Madonna.  You don’t hear the stories about the music companies screwing the artists much anymore - they own everything themselves.  

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1 hour ago, FairWarning said:

She is definitely a marketing genius on the par of Madonna.  You don’t hear the stories about the music companies screwing the artists much anymore - they own everything themselves.  

Swift got pretty screwed somewhat on some of the rights to her early stuff. She doesn’t own the master recordings of much of it and made a big public thing of it not too long ago when the guy who did own them sold them to someone else instead of to her.

I do think that it’s funny that her music seems to basically fall into one of two categories: 1) expressing infatuation with a guy or 2)  being aggrieved by someone or some group

Pretty ironic from someone who had a hit called “Shake It Off”. Though I’m not really sure if it’s mostly schtick to sell albums, or if it really is representative of her life.

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8 hours ago, eoMMan said:

She's very talented and very attractive (please don't ban for that).

She's in the news now...

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-56247655

Imo, she's gotta learn to let that go.

Yeah, that's pretty silly on her part.  It hardly sounded like slut shaming - it was a joke.  Lighten up.  

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On 3/1/2021 at 12:37 PM, rockaction said:

Skinny girls love long cardigans, short skirts and Catholic school girl socks. Or they wear K Swiss or Stan Smiths with them, an outfit centered around white short shorts. Maybe beige socks and shoes with Daisy Dukes. Or even...a pair of tight jeans with some truly worn out knees. Maybe even...nerd cat eye glasses with some slacks.

What do you know about Japanese girls?

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2 minutes ago, grateful zed said:

What do you know about Japanese girls?

They don't make stationery like this where I'm from
So fragile, so refined
So I sniff and I lick your envelope
And fall to little pieces every time
I wonder what clothes you wear to school
I wonder how you decorate your room
I wonder how you touch yourself
And curse myself for being across the sea

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10 hours ago, Ghost Rider said:

Haven't we evolved past the point where being slut shammed is something a woman is supposed to just "let go"? 

Yeah, to say her hardcore fans are dedicated would be an understatement.  Fan is short for fanatic, after all. :lol: 

Maybe she could get them to storm the grammys this year.

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On 2/28/2021 at 9:23 PM, the rover said:

Saw her on her Reputation tour with second row seats.  One of the best live performances I’ve ever seen.  Had tickets to Lover Fest West, which just got cancelled.  But I also have a 16-year old daughter, so I have a legit excuse.

Lover Fest West? 

Interesting name. 

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1 minute ago, Zow said:

Lover Fest West? 

Interesting name. 

Not really.  Album was called Lover.   Rather than tour it, she wanted to create a festival.   Then she created a second festival in LA.   Lover. Fest. West.

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7 hours ago, General Malaise said:

Yeah, that's pretty silly on her part.  It hardly sounded like slut shaming - it was a joke.  Lighten up.  

In a vacuum, I would agree, but considering how much heat she has taken over the years for dating different men in her 20's (the horror!!), she is probably sick of any jokes about her dating life, and her natural instinct clearly is still to snap back.  

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1 hour ago, the rover said:

Not really.  Album was called Lover.   Rather than tour it, she wanted to create a festival.   Then she created a second festival in LA.   Lover. Fest. West.

Ah. 

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On 3/2/2021 at 4:30 AM, eoMMan said:

She's very talented and very attractive (please don't ban for that).

She's in the news now...

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-56247655

Imo, she's gotta learn to let that go.

She is definitely talented but come on.  This is the same girl that literally made a living writing songs about ex boyfriends and telling the public who they are.  Seems a bit disingenuous at best.  Taylor, was a joke, you need to let some stuff slide off of you

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On 3/2/2021 at 5:26 PM, Ghost Rider said:

In a vacuum, I would agree, but considering how much heat she has taken over the years for dating different men in her 20's (the horror!!), she is probably sick of any jokes about her dating life, and her natural instinct clearly is still to snap back.  

Yeah, I guess.  I'm a pretty sensitive fellow so I'm sure a joke like that at my expense might not amuse me.  

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5 hours ago, General Malaise said:

Yeah, I guess.  I'm a pretty sensitive fellow so I'm sure a joke like that at my expense might not amuse me.  

Her defensiveness about her dating life aside, I think she is a very likable person (based on interviews I've seen and whatnot).  She's as fan-friendly as any musician I have ever seen, and I am sure the constant shout-out she gives to her fans is a big reason so many defend her like she's their grandmother. :lol: 

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On 3/7/2021 at 5:24 PM, pantherclub said:

She is definitely talented but come on.  This is the same girl that literally made a living writing songs about ex boyfriends and telling the public who they are.  Seems a bit disingenuous at best.  Taylor, was a joke, you need to let some stuff slide off of you

You mean she needs to learn to shake it off?

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Leaving aside the fact that I am not a fan of the Grammy's, it's awesome to see Folklore with Album of the Year. Fantastic record. And that make Taylor the first woman to win Album of the Year three times. :cool: 

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1 hour ago, Ghost Rider said:

Leaving aside the fact that I am not a fan of the Grammy's, it's awesome to see Folklore with Album of the Year. Fantastic record. And that make Taylor the first woman to win Album of the Year three times. :cool: 

Wouldn't make the top ten back in the 70's outside of a TimDraft.

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