Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

billyjoe

:MERGED: RB D. Williams Thread

Recommended Posts

This is my rankings for RBs in hP dynasty Leagues with PPR. Yes R bush and Addai are higher than most. But these are how I see them.L Maroney and D Williams could very well be starters as D Foster and C Dillon could both be cut for salary cap reasons. 1 - LT22 - SJax3 - R bush4 - Addai5 - LJ6 - F Gore7 - SA8 - Edge9 - Rudi J10 - FWP11 - Westbrook12 - L Maroney13 - MJD14 - D Williams

I'm never one to say your rankings are wrong cause who knows? However I'm greatly puzzled by having Alexander and James so high in a ppr league that is also dynasty. To not have Westy in the top 5 is definetly going out on a limb in a ppr imo. I agree also that Portis and Ronnie have to be in here.
SA had a broken foot, Injuried QB and a line that had 2 or 3 starters out almost ever week. He will bounce back this year and has 2 or 3 good to very good years left. PPR does not help him, but he scores TDs when healthy. Edge - The new coaches will make the 0-line beter, M leinart will be better the 2nd year, He has 2 very good WRS. and a good young TE. He will be much better used with this coaching staff than the last one. Edge can catch the ball out of the backfield and in the slot. He will get more receptions Has 2-3 years left. I thought long and hard before moving Westy down to 11. Especially in a PPR league. C buckhalter is healthy for the first time in three years. For some reason I think he cuttss into Westy touches as they try to keep Westy healthy and fresh for the play offs. I also think Westy may only have 2 years left where he is this productive.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Foster is average, the new OC is crafting the running game to DeAngelo's strengths, and he showed the explosiveness we had hoped he would show after coming back from an ankle injury. I have MJD a slot above Williams. I have Addai lower, but that could change if Rhodes walks and they dont bring in someone to fill his role. Caddy - want to see shades of 05 caddy first, although i feel pretty good that he will bounce back and he has room to move up.Deuce - role is limitedTaylor - i see RBBC coming in MinnyJames - way too oldHope this helps. Dynasty rankings are art more than science. I would be surprised if there's any ranking that I could get even 70% agreement with, besides LT #1

where does apeterson fit in on that list....:blackdot:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is my rankings for RBs in hP dynasty Leagues with PPR. Yes R bush and Addai are higher than most. But these are how I see them.L Maroney and D Williams could very well be starters as D Foster and C Dillon could both be cut for salary cap reasons. 1 - LT22 - SJax3 - R bush4 - Addai5 - LJ6 - F Gore7 - SA8 - Edge9 - Rudi J10 - FWP11 - Westbrook12 - L Maroney13 - MJD14 - D Williams

I'm never one to say your rankings are wrong cause who knows? However I'm greatly puzzled by having Alexander and James so high in a ppr league that is also dynasty. To not have Westy in the top 5 is definetly going out on a limb in a ppr imo. I agree also that Portis and Ronnie have to be in here.
SA had a broken foot, Injuried QB and a line that had 2 or 3 starters out almost ever week. He will bounce back this year and has 2 or 3 good to very good years left. PPR does not help him, but he scores TDs when healthy. Edge - The new coaches will make the 0-line beter, M leinart will be better the 2nd year, He has 2 very good WRS. and a good young TE. He will be much better used with this coaching staff than the last one. Edge can catch the ball out of the backfield and in the slot. He will get more receptions Has 2-3 years left. I thought long and hard before moving Westy down to 11. Especially in a PPR league. C buckhalter is healthy for the first time in three years. For some reason I think he cuttss into Westy touches as they try to keep Westy healthy and fresh for the play offs. I also think Westy may only have 2 years left where he is this productive.
SA will be 30 to start the season next year, I think 2 or 3 years is highly unlikely but again I guess it could happenEdge is almost exactly one year younger...again a couple of years is wishful thinkingWesty is another year younger than Edge and isn't used in as much as a physical way, more like a Faulk or Barber like role. I think he could go 3 or 4 years at good production. I hate to say it cause I love :wub: the way SA plays but I would be SHOCKED if he ended up in the top ten this year I personally agree, I do think Edge will have a good year this year but I think he is also on the downward spiral of his career.But again good list and way to put your thoguhts out there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

as far as williams situation, there is some risk that foster steals carries in 07 (if still with team)... but it is a dynasty league... he should take over soon...

as far as intrinsic talent, with some there seems to be mis-perception that williams is small... he is about 5'9" 210 (maybe 215?), which is similar size to emmit smith when he came up... not too many doubt smith was big ENOUGH to take care of business... he is also really fast... i think his bio said he was the fastest prep in his class from state of ARK (something like 10.7 100 m, which may not be reggie bush fast but is pretty fast... of course, he was probably a lot smaller then :hey: )...

there is some risk, but i don't think the risk of foster keeping job for another 2-3 years is nearly as great as the upside is if he hits... because if he does, & i think he will, he's going to hit big (potential top 10 with upside)...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is my rankings for RBs in hP dynasty Leagues with PPR. Yes R bush and Addai are higher than most. But these are how I see them.

L Maroney and D Williams could very well be starters as D Foster and C Dillon could both be cut for salary cap reasons.

1 - LT2

2 - SJax

3 - R bush

4 - Addai

5 - LJ

6 - F Gore

7 - SA

8 - Edge

9 - Rudi J

10 - FWP

11 - Westbrook

12 - L Maroney

13 - MJD

14 - D Williams

I'm never one to say your rankings are wrong cause who knows? However I'm greatly puzzled by having Alexander and James so high in a ppr league that is also dynasty. To not have Westy in the top 5 is definetly going out on a limb in a ppr imo. I agree also that Portis and Ronnie have to be in here.
SA had a broken foot, Injuried QB and a line that had 2 or 3 starters out almost ever week. He will bounce back this year and has 2 or 3 good to very good years left. PPR does not help him, but he scores TDs when healthy.

Edge - The new coaches will make the 0-line beter, M leinart will be better the 2nd year, He has 2 very good WRS. and a good young TE. He will be much better used with this coaching staff than the last one. Edge can catch the ball out of the backfield and in the slot. He will get more receptions Has 2-3 years left.

I thought long and hard before moving Westy down to 11. Especially in a PPR league. C buckhalter is healthy for the first time in three years. For some reason I think he cuttss into Westy touches as they try to keep Westy healthy and fresh for the play offs. I also think Westy may only have 2 years left where he is this productive.

Buckhalter is UFA - that aside if he is not resigned then Reid will bring in another back to spell Westy

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI...Duckett will be in the Carolina backfield gobbling up carries and TDs. You have been warned.

things didn't work out so well for him in Washington this year

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI...Duckett will be in the Carolina backfield gobbling up carries and TDs. You have been warned.

things didn't work out so well for him in Washington this year
Yes dear God please let the Duckett hype die. He was a healthy scratch numerous times this year.He barely saw the field after Portis got hurt.Lets review his last two games. 8 carries for 14 yards. He had a long of 11.Lets take that out, 7 carries for 3 yards. His final game was 3 carries for -4 yards.The guy is a complete and utter bust. Anyone remember Dodds dropping Portis to RB21 because of Duckett? Err...Yeah...Duckett represents as much threat to Deangelo Williams as Lee Suggs does.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI...Duckett will be in the Carolina backfield gobbling up carries and TDs. You have been warned.

BBO ?(Blinded By Ownership?) ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI...Duckett will be in the Carolina backfield gobbling up carries and TDs. You have been warned.

things didn't work out so well for him in Washington this year
Glad to see you weigh in. That's the kiss of success of me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

FYI...Duckett will be in the Carolina backfield gobbling up carries and TDs. You have been warned.

things didn't work out so well for him in Washington this year
Glad to see you weigh in. That's the kiss of success of me.
looking forward to the day you start making some sense

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm really lost on this one.

MJD had a better rookie year, higher chance to start in 2007 - Ranked lower.

Addai had a better rookie year, is the starter - Ranked lower.

Duece, Caddy, Chester Taylor, Edge?

At least those 4 are currently starters.

Yes DeAngelo should be starting. Fosters 28/19 carries in week 16/17 worried me a bit. Could easily be a Benson/TJ type role. Which means Foster/DWill are mostly useless for 2007.

And that ranking isn't even in PPR. I'd be scared to see how the two experts would rank him in PPR. By the looks of who is ahead of him, probably top 10. (mcgahee/maroney for sure - it's only 2 spots)

Not to mention the Panthers rush attack sucks balls.

Someone please explain to me how in a DECENT rookie year (worse then Addai/MJD - Addai is ranked 22) we're putting Williams in an somewhat elite ranking. (top 15 RB dynasty in non-ppr is pretty damn elite.)

:D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bump to get some more opinions. Personally, I see elite physical talent in DeAngelo, and think he has a great chance to an excellent back in the NFL. I have never been a fan of Foster, and there is a very good possibility that D. Will has a considerable increase in touches this year (in both the passing and running game). I like the ranking of 14th.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bump to get some more opinions. Personally, I see elite physical talent in DeAngelo, and think he has a great chance to an excellent back in the NFL. I have never been a fan of Foster, and there is a very good possibility that D. Will has a considerable increase in touches this year (in both the passing and running game). I like the ranking of 14th.

Agree here. Something tells me that, after Foster is cut and DeAngelo finishes in the top 10 with 50+ receptions, the tone of this debate will change!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bump to get some more opinions. Personally, I see elite physical talent in DeAngelo, and think he has a great chance to an excellent back in the NFL. I have never been a fan of Foster, and there is a very good possibility that D. Will has a considerable increase in touches this year (in both the passing and running game). I like the ranking of 14th.

Agree here. Something tells me that, after Foster is cut and DeAngelo finishes in the top 10 with 50+ receptions, the tone of this debate will change!
Here's my main problem with him.Foster got hurt, Dwill has some success. While in the playoff hunt, foster gets 28 carries in week 16? Then 19 the next week? If Dwill was this uber stub about to explode, why did Foster reasserthimself in the final two weeks as the work horse back? If Dwill is so obviously better, why wasn't obvious to John Fox? Why did Foster keep getting the bulk of the carries with the season on the line? Maybe it's all because Dwill was a rookie. But I still don't like Foster getting 50 carries in the last 2 weeks of the season, right before "Dwill is about to take over and be a top 10 RB". Look at Addai, his role kept expanding. Dwills role was REDUCED once Foster got back. That tells me Fox thought Foster gave him a better chance to win starting, and Dwill as the 3rd down back.So either Fox is an idiot for keeping "DeW" down, or maybe "DeW" isn't the elite talent some of the people around here think he is. So at the end of 06, Fox thought Foster gave them the best shot to win. What's changed?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bump to get some more opinions. Personally, I see elite physical talent in DeAngelo, and think he has a great chance to an excellent back in the NFL. I have never been a fan of Foster, and there is a very good possibility that D. Will has a considerable increase in touches this year (in both the passing and running game). I like the ranking of 14th.

Agree here. Something tells me that, after Foster is cut and DeAngelo finishes in the top 10 with 50+ receptions, the tone of this debate will change!
Here's my main problem with him.Foster got hurt, Dwill has some success. While in the playoff hunt, foster gets 28 carries in week 16? Then 19 the next week? If Dwill was this uber stub about to explode, why did Foster reasserthimself in the final two weeks as the work horse back? If Dwill is so obviously better, why wasn't obvious to John Fox? Why did Foster keep getting the bulk of the carries with the season on the line? Maybe it's all because Dwill was a rookie. But I still don't like Foster getting 50 carries in the last 2 weeks of the season, right before "Dwill is about to take over and be a top 10 RB". Look at Addai, his role kept expanding. Dwills role was REDUCED once Foster got back. That tells me Fox thought Foster gave him a better chance to win starting, and Dwill as the 3rd down back.So either Fox is an idiot for keeping "DeW" down, or maybe "DeW" isn't the elite talent some of the people around here think he is. So at the end of 06, Fox thought Foster gave them the best shot to win. What's changed?
Foster has more power and is a better grind-it-out RB.Now let me add, Foster is NOT the RB you want grinding it out for you.And that speaks volumes about DWill.Is he explosive? YES! Is he an every down RB? No.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

John Fox has always shown a lot of loyalty to his veteran backs. Look how long he held onto and kept starting Stephen Davis.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bump to get some more opinions. Personally, I see elite physical talent in DeAngelo, and think he has a great chance to an excellent back in the NFL. I have never been a fan of Foster, and there is a very good possibility that D. Will has a considerable increase in touches this year (in both the passing and running game). I like the ranking of 14th.

Agree here. Something tells me that, after Foster is cut and DeAngelo finishes in the top 10 with 50+ receptions, the tone of this debate will change!
Here's my main problem with him.Foster got hurt, Dwill has some success. While in the playoff hunt, foster gets 28 carries in week 16? Then 19 the next week? If Dwill was this uber stub about to explode, why did Foster reasserthimself in the final two weeks as the work horse back? If Dwill is so obviously better, why wasn't obvious to John Fox? Why did Foster keep getting the bulk of the carries with the season on the line? Maybe it's all because Dwill was a rookie. But I still don't like Foster getting 50 carries in the last 2 weeks of the season, right before "Dwill is about to take over and be a top 10 RB". Look at Addai, his role kept expanding. Dwills role was REDUCED once Foster got back. That tells me Fox thought Foster gave him a better chance to win starting, and Dwill as the 3rd down back.So either Fox is an idiot for keeping "DeW" down, or maybe "DeW" isn't the elite talent some of the people around here think he is. So at the end of 06, Fox thought Foster gave them the best shot to win. What's changed?
Foster has more power and is a better grind-it-out RB.Now let me add, Foster is NOT the RB you want grinding it out for you.And that speaks volumes about DWill.Is he explosive? YES! Is he an every down RB? No.
Allow me to disagree with both of these posts.1. DeAngelo carried more mail in college than many RBs. He was not drafted in the 1st round to be a 3rd down back. 2. I was shocked that Fox was as loyal to Foster as he was down the stretch last year. It made no sense to me or anyone who had watched DeAngelo play the week before. Still, however, that has nothing to do with who he will go with for the upcoming season. Foster's contract situation will factor in heavily.Enough for now...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

he set the NCAA all-time record for yards from scrimmage. he's absolutely capable of being an everydown RB in the NFL.

he's listed at almost 220 pounds. I have no doubts he can easily handle 20+ carries/game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Words from the new Carolina Offensive Coordinator. Take it for what it's worth.

http://www.heraldonline.com/247/story/13340.html

Panthers offensive coordinator Jeff Davidson laughed Thursday and said he still hasn't finished inspecting his new team's 2006 game tape.

But he's starting to get a better sense for what he has to work with, and seems to like it.

Part of his mandate in coming here to replace the fired Dan Henning was to beef up the Panthers running game -- which ranked 24th in the league last year. Toward that end, Davidson said he was fine with the stable of backs which included DeShaun Foster, DeAngelo Williams, Eric Shelton and Nick Goings.

"Comfortable," he said of the group. "I think that we're always going to look to improve, but that's going to be true at any position you ask me about. Until I see these guys in live action, I'm not going to put any stamp of approval or show a need to go in any direction on them, because I need to see them in live action. And try to use them in the right way, in my opinion.

"I've seen them on tape, but I'd like to be able to get them in formation to try to get them in the right position to do the things that I'd like to do. So that's left unsaid."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think this is good news for D Will. Foster won't go into camp with the starting spot again, and DeAngelo is clearly the best player in that backfield. I fully expect Williams to win the job and be very productive next season.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've seen DeAngelo Williams ranked from inside the top 20 RBs to an upper-20 ranking. Makes sense, we don't even know if the guy will have over 50% of the carries. There has been plenty of good news though:

talks of a run-oriented attack and rush-first offense, and talks of DeAngelo being featured in 07

What I'm wondering is:

(1) chances DeAngelo starts the first game of season

(2) rank DeAngelo for dynasty (PPR/non-PPR)

(3) prediction on yards/receptions/TDS

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've got Panther's season tickets, and I'll be darned if I know. I think he'll get the nod over Foster, but will still share reps. Alot depends on the o-line and how it shapes up. I'd rank him over Foster, but I'll still stay away from them. Of course, being in Charlotte Panthers get taken way too early anyway, so I generaly avoid them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dude, that's a funny title, regarding the "De." Being a homer, I would be reluctant to draft either unless it's for really good value. However, I give the slight nod to Williams.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think DeAngelo is too talented not to take the job this year, but Foster will spell him at times. That being said, I think Williams is the better runner, receiver, and short yardage back, so I don't see Foster as a TD or receptions vulture. DWill should take a huge step forward.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pure speculation, goes without saying.(1) 75%(2) 12-15 (3) 1300(total)/30/10 (total)

\He had 33 catches last year splitting time. I think it will be more like 1500 combined yards, 50 catches, and 10 scores.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If we'll see a real RBBC with roughly even splits I'd guess close to 1000 combined yards and 6-8 TDs. recemptions - maybe 30?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RB DeAngelo Williams is excited about Carolina's new offensive scheme. New OC Jeff Davidson is implementing a zone blocking scheme that will run more screen plays than in past years. When Williams saw the playbook, he couldn't contain his enthusiasm. "I'm excited about the offense altogether because it's identical to the offense we ran in Memphis," Williams said. "We threw a lot of screen passes to the running backs and we ran the outside and inside zone plays. It's just like the offense at Memphis, but with some different terminology."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im waiting patiently to see rep breakdown in TC. Much like Dallas, with a new regime, you could see the RB that we all knew was less talented finally get less touches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bad O-line, zero depth on O-line, Bad QB, RBBC. I don't like either Foster or Williams even if Williams is really excited in May. Foster will be the better value based on draft position and that's saying very little. I don't believe the Carolina O-line will pull off this new scheme, I see many runs for losses.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im waiting patiently to see rep breakdown in TC. Much like Dallas, with a new regime, you could see the RB that we all knew was less talented finally get less touches.

I really don't understand why people think Foster is less talented. Foster has battled through a bunch of injuries for sure, and at thsi time he's probably lost a step or two. But sheer talent? Foster has to win that battle hands down. Physically translating talent into stats? That's entirely different.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im waiting patiently to see rep breakdown in TC. Much like Dallas, with a new regime, you could see the RB that we all knew was less talented finally get less touches.

I really don't understand why people think Foster is less talented. Foster has battled through a bunch of injuries for sure, and at thsi time he's probably lost a step or two. But sheer talent? Foster has to win that battle hands down. Physically translating talent into stats? That's entirely different.
Foster hands down more talented than Williams?I can see a debate, but I never expected someone to say Foster was clearly more talented than Williams.Personally, I think Foster has never been the same since microfracture. He's still serviceable, but he's turned from an explosive back into a more plodding ball control back - and one who has trouble punching it in inside the 5.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Panthers Oline:

LT Travelle Wharton

Positives: Has a thick, muscular frame, with good overall body mass and long arms … Physical in-line drive blocker who has the leg drive to generate movement off the snap … Shows above-average initial quickness into his setup … Uses his hands well to turn his man, displaying the kick slide needed to seal the corner in pass protection … Has above-average balance and body control, delivering a strong hand jolt while using his upper-body power properly to position and wall off … Does a very effective job locking on with his hands to redirect and sustain the defender working in-line … Plays with good knee bend, anchoring firmly vs. the rush and picks up stunts well, doing a nice job of redirecting fluidly to fire out and neutralize linebackers operating in the second level … Works to finish and mirrors consistently vs. the power charge … Takes proper angles on the move, showing the ability to fire out low, generate movement and swing his hips around to seal … Battles with good leverage and is active away from the play, displaying proper angle awareness … Tough pass protector with quick feet, extending his arms and bends his knees properly when riding an inside move past the quarterback.

Negatives: Lacks ideal bulk, but compensates with good hand usage to lock on and sustain … More of a finesse-type of blocker (lacks explosion off the ball in the running game) … Will impact on the edge, but needs to maintain aggression to consistently finish at the point of attack (not a road grader) … Has the upper-body strength to turn his man, but struggles some when trying to adjust to double moves or the speed rush … Consistent player, but needs to show more aggression … Shows good kick and slide movements off the snap, but appears a little sluggish changing direction when working in space.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/travelle_wharton

Panthers T Travelle Wharton will miss the 2006 season with a torn ACL and MCL.

Don't underestimate this loss. Wharton has grown into a solid starter at the most important position on the offensive line. Carolina has no obvious replacement. RT Jordan Gross has tried it before with poor results, and LG Mike Wahle isn't athletic enough.Source: Gaston Gazette

Perhaps the weakest link of the Oline at the most important position LT. Missed all but the 1st game of the 2006 season which had a negative effect on overall line play. Sounds like he is recovered but his injury was severe enough that he might still be another year away from playing at optimal level. Backup would be Jordan Gross who is better suited to play RT, Rashad Butler who also missed all of his rookie season in 2006 to injury.

Based on Wharton's write up above he seems better suited to a ZBS than a power oriented blocking scheme the Panthers have been using for many years now.

LG Mike Wahle 30 years old 9 year veteran who played most of his career with the Pack. Very good at pulling which also compliments the ZBS. Can move out to LT if needed there but that is not his best position.

C Justin Hartwig Free agent starter from the Titans entering his 6th year. An above average starting center who missed all but 2 games due to a groin injury. Now healthy Hartwig will be one of the Panthers best linemen and anchor the pivot of thier blocking schemes.

RG Evan Mathis Going into his 3rd season. Started 15 games for the Panthers last year. Very strong player but like most of the Panthers Oline is a bit undersized. Should benifit from ZBS.

RT Jordan Gross 5th year veteran who started his career at LT but struggled there. Plays much better as a RT.

Positives: Very good athlete with above-average speed, quickness, body control and change-of-direction agility … Technically sound drive blocker who shows good explosion in his initial step off the snap … Has fluid lateral agility, easily redirecting while gaining movement with his kick slide … Keeps his balance working into the second level and has a wide leg base in his pass set … Hard worker who will do anything the coaches ask and is a model for good work ethic, especially in the weight room … Shows good hip swerve and leg explosion, delivering good hand punch coming on the rise … Stays on his feet moving down the line and is very quick handling the switch-off … Will jolt the defenders on contact with his hands, locking on to steer out … Shows proper knee bend and hip flexibility setting up in pass protection … Has no problems handling movement and is quick to react to stunts and blitzes … Can run his feet, stay up and sustain his blocks, showing aggression throughout his play … Works to finish and is very quick on the pull, breaking down and staying under control at the second level … Can sink his hips and redirect, coming off the double team with good balance and anchor.

Negatives: A little light in the leg department and might need to add more bulk to his frame … Might be better suited for right tackle, as he does whiff a lot on a quick set (inconsistent hand placement), but the rest of his game has no flaws.

This entire Oline is a bit undersized but athletic and should work better in space and on the move with the ZBS.

ETA- Panthers have added Ryan Kalil one of the best Oline prospects in the 2007 rookie draft.

Positives: Has just adequate muscle definition, but is naturally strong with very good lateral agility and the short-area burst to generate movement off the snap and get into the second level blocks … Has room on his frame to add at least another 20 pounds of bulk with no drop-off in quickness … Builds his acceleration nicely and runs with a normal stride, body control and good balance … Has the loose hips to work his way down the line and does a very good job of locking on and controlling defenders working in space … Is a smart, instinctive type who is quick to pick up twists and games … Colorful character who likes to keep his teammates loose … Has a quick hand punch to shock a lethargic defender and while he can use more leg strength to drive his man off the ball, he has good hand placement to pull, jerk and drag down … Unquestioned team leader who will not hesitate to get vocal when the need arises … Quick to adjust to the blitz and has a smooth kick slide in pass protection … Shows very quick hand-snap action and can handle long-snapping chores … Gains advantage most of the time due to his burst coming off the ball … Does a consistent job of getting his hand on the defender … Has enough force behind his punch to impede the defender's forward charge … Quick to gain position setting up in pass protection, displaying the body control to sustain … Does a good job of walling off and shows good desire to control the action in the middle, using his hands effectively to widen the rush lane … Even when he is mismatched (size issues), he will get movement off the ball, as he is consistent at taking proper angles … Usually gets a good surge due to his explosion, and is light on his feet to pull and run down the line … Effective when asked to impact on the edge, consistently turning and sealing … Gets into the second level with good urgency and looks up other people after neutralizing his man … Has the agility and quickness to move or cut off … Lacks ideal bulk, but has a good pass set and punch to stop the pass rushers frequently … Shows good hand technique and hits with authority … Can sink his hips and stay square with good recovery quickness … Knows how to grab and control defenders … Can readily adjust on the move and uses his lateral agility to make the reach block … Can shuffle and slide his feet with good base and is alert to movement and over-arm action.

Negatives: Because of a lack of size and bulk, he needs to keep his hands active in order to gain movement … Needs to improve his lower body strength to prevent the mammoth nose guards from walking him back into the pocket … Very quick to get into the second level, but sometimes gets out of control in his pursuit and gets washed out on the play … On the move, he sometimes gets his hands too far outside his frame and will whiff on a few blocks … Vulnerable to the bull rush, but knows angles and sticks to his blocks.

Compares To: Tom Nalen of the Denver Broncos … Outside of Nalen, few centers get their jerseys as dirty as Kalil does … Kalil is a tough-as-nails blocker who compensates for size limitations with very good hand placement, a strong punch and quickness off the snap … He gets movement with his ability to take angles and shows good alertness on pulls and traps … He keeps his hands active to handle multiple defenders and his body control, balance and vision lets him consistently neutralize second-level defenders … He is susceptible to a strong bull rush from a nose guard, causing him to walk back in the pocket, but he has an array of moves and is a solid enough technician to make the game a long afternoon for his opponent.

Remains to be seen where Kalil will play for the Panthers but he should be an upgrade wherever he does.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im waiting patiently to see rep breakdown in TC. Much like Dallas, with a new regime, you could see the RB that we all knew was less talented finally get less touches.

I really don't understand why people think Foster is less talented. Foster has battled through a bunch of injuries for sure, and at thsi time he's probably lost a step or two. But sheer talent? Foster has to win that battle hands down. Physically translating talent into stats? That's entirely different.
I know we have discussed this in other threads, but DeAngelo is clearly more talented. He was draft higher (by a team that had Foster I would add), had more yards in college (he is the NCAA all time leader in yards from scrimmage), is more explosive, is more elusive, and is a better receiver. Now I definitely think that Foster's knee issues have affected his explosiveness, so there could be an argument pre-injury (as Bloom stated). Foster was pretty dynamic in college, but always had fumbling issues, injury problems, and doesn't have the complete skill set of a DeAngelo Williams. At this point in their careers, it really isn't close.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Panthers Oline:

LT Travelle Wharton

Positives: Has a thick, muscular frame, with good overall body mass and long arms … Physical in-line drive blocker who has the leg drive to generate movement off the snap … Shows above-average initial quickness into his setup … Uses his hands well to turn his man, displaying the kick slide needed to seal the corner in pass protection … Has above-average balance and body control, delivering a strong hand jolt while using his upper-body power properly to position and wall off … Does a very effective job locking on with his hands to redirect and sustain the defender working in-line … Plays with good knee bend, anchoring firmly vs. the rush and picks up stunts well, doing a nice job of redirecting fluidly to fire out and neutralize linebackers operating in the second level … Works to finish and mirrors consistently vs. the power charge … Takes proper angles on the move, showing the ability to fire out low, generate movement and swing his hips around to seal … Battles with good leverage and is active away from the play, displaying proper angle awareness … Tough pass protector with quick feet, extending his arms and bends his knees properly when riding an inside move past the quarterback.

Negatives: Lacks ideal bulk, but compensates with good hand usage to lock on and sustain … More of a finesse-type of blocker (lacks explosion off the ball in the running game) … Will impact on the edge, but needs to maintain aggression to consistently finish at the point of attack (not a road grader) … Has the upper-body strength to turn his man, but struggles some when trying to adjust to double moves or the speed rush … Consistent player, but needs to show more aggression … Shows good kick and slide movements off the snap, but appears a little sluggish changing direction when working in space.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/travelle_wharton

Panthers T Travelle Wharton will miss the 2006 season with a torn ACL and MCL.

Don't underestimate this loss. Wharton has grown into a solid starter at the most important position on the offensive line. Carolina has no obvious replacement. RT Jordan Gross has tried it before with poor results, and LG Mike Wahle isn't athletic enough.Source: Gaston Gazette

Perhaps the weakest link of the Oline at the most important position LT. Missed all but the 1st game of the 2006 season which had a negative effect on overall line play. Sounds like he is recovered but his injury was severe enough that he might still be another year away from playing at optimal level. Backup would be Jordan Gross who is better suited to play RT, Rashad Butler who also missed all of his rookie season in 2006 to injury.

Based on Wharton's write up above he seems better suited to a ZBS than a power oriented blocking scheme the Panthers have been using for many years now.

LG Mike Wahle 30 years old 9 year veteran who played most of his career with the Pack. Very good at pulling which also compliments the ZBS. Can move out to LT if needed there but that is not his best position.

C Justin Hartwig Free agent starter from the Titans entering his 6th year. An above average starting center who missed all but 2 games due to a groin injury. Now healthy Hartwig will be one of the Panthers best linemen and anchor the pivot of thier blocking schemes.

RG Evan Mathis Going into his 3rd season. Started 15 games for the Panthers last year. Very strong player but like most of the Panthers Oline is a bit undersized. Should benifit from ZBS.

RT Jordan Gross 5th year veteran who started his career at LT but struggled there. Plays much better as a RT.

Positives: Very good athlete with above-average speed, quickness, body control and change-of-direction agility … Technically sound drive blocker who shows good explosion in his initial step off the snap … Has fluid lateral agility, easily redirecting while gaining movement with his kick slide … Keeps his balance working into the second level and has a wide leg base in his pass set … Hard worker who will do anything the coaches ask and is a model for good work ethic, especially in the weight room … Shows good hip swerve and leg explosion, delivering good hand punch coming on the rise … Stays on his feet moving down the line and is very quick handling the switch-off … Will jolt the defenders on contact with his hands, locking on to steer out … Shows proper knee bend and hip flexibility setting up in pass protection … Has no problems handling movement and is quick to react to stunts and blitzes … Can run his feet, stay up and sustain his blocks, showing aggression throughout his play … Works to finish and is very quick on the pull, breaking down and staying under control at the second level … Can sink his hips and redirect, coming off the double team with good balance and anchor.

Negatives: A little light in the leg department and might need to add more bulk to his frame … Might be better suited for right tackle, as he does whiff a lot on a quick set (inconsistent hand placement), but the rest of his game has no flaws.

This entire Oline is a bit undersized but athletic and should work better in space and on the move with the ZBS.

ETA- Panthers have added Ryan Kalil one of the best Oline prospects in the 2007 rookie draft.

Positives: Has just adequate muscle definition, but is naturally strong with very good lateral agility and the short-area burst to generate movement off the snap and get into the second level blocks … Has room on his frame to add at least another 20 pounds of bulk with no drop-off in quickness … Builds his acceleration nicely and runs with a normal stride, body control and good balance … Has the loose hips to work his way down the line and does a very good job of locking on and controlling defenders working in space … Is a smart, instinctive type who is quick to pick up twists and games … Colorful character who likes to keep his teammates loose … Has a quick hand punch to shock a lethargic defender and while he can use more leg strength to drive his man off the ball, he has good hand placement to pull, jerk and drag down … Unquestioned team leader who will not hesitate to get vocal when the need arises … Quick to adjust to the blitz and has a smooth kick slide in pass protection … Shows very quick hand-snap action and can handle long-snapping chores … Gains advantage most of the time due to his burst coming off the ball … Does a consistent job of getting his hand on the defender … Has enough force behind his punch to impede the defender's forward charge … Quick to gain position setting up in pass protection, displaying the body control to sustain … Does a good job of walling off and shows good desire to control the action in the middle, using his hands effectively to widen the rush lane … Even when he is mismatched (size issues), he will get movement off the ball, as he is consistent at taking proper angles … Usually gets a good surge due to his explosion, and is light on his feet to pull and run down the line … Effective when asked to impact on the edge, consistently turning and sealing … Gets into the second level with good urgency and looks up other people after neutralizing his man … Has the agility and quickness to move or cut off … Lacks ideal bulk, but has a good pass set and punch to stop the pass rushers frequently … Shows good hand technique and hits with authority … Can sink his hips and stay square with good recovery quickness … Knows how to grab and control defenders … Can readily adjust on the move and uses his lateral agility to make the reach block … Can shuffle and slide his feet with good base and is alert to movement and over-arm action.

Negatives: Because of a lack of size and bulk, he needs to keep his hands active in order to gain movement … Needs to improve his lower body strength to prevent the mammoth nose guards from walking him back into the pocket … Very quick to get into the second level, but sometimes gets out of control in his pursuit and gets washed out on the play … On the move, he sometimes gets his hands too far outside his frame and will whiff on a few blocks … Vulnerable to the bull rush, but knows angles and sticks to his blocks.

Compares To: Tom Nalen of the Denver Broncos … Outside of Nalen, few centers get their jerseys as dirty as Kalil does … Kalil is a tough-as-nails blocker who compensates for size limitations with very good hand placement, a strong punch and quickness off the snap … He gets movement with his ability to take angles and shows good alertness on pulls and traps … He keeps his hands active to handle multiple defenders and his body control, balance and vision lets him consistently neutralize second-level defenders … He is susceptible to a strong bull rush from a nose guard, causing him to walk back in the pocket, but he has an array of moves and is a solid enough technician to make the game a long afternoon for his opponent.

Remains to be seen where Kalil will play for the Panthers but he should be an upgrade wherever he does.
Good info...thanks! It seems as though they will have a very respectable line, and the new system will utilize the strengths of the current lineman more effectively. They may not be dominant, but with talented WR and two solid QBs, their offense should be very good. I see DeAngelo doing very well this season...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im waiting patiently to see rep breakdown in TC. Much like Dallas, with a new regime, you could see the RB that we all knew was less talented finally get less touches.

I really don't understand why people think Foster is less talented. Foster has battled through a bunch of injuries for sure, and at thsi time he's probably lost a step or two. But sheer talent? Foster has to win that battle hands down. Physically translating talent into stats? That's entirely different.
I know we have discussed this in other threads, but DeAngelo is clearly more talented. He was draft higher (by a team that had Foster I would add), had more yards in college (he is the NCAA all time leader in yards from scrimmage), is more explosive, is more elusive, and is a better receiver. Now I definitely think that Foster's knee issues have affected his explosiveness, so there could be an argument pre-injury (as Bloom stated). Foster was pretty dynamic in college, but always had fumbling issues, injury problems, and doesn't have the complete skill set of a DeAngelo Williams. At this point in their careers, it really isn't close.
You really think being drafted about 5 spots higher is a huge deal? Also you do realize the Panthers drafted Deshaun when they had Stephen Davis right? I didn't realize Dwill was a better receiver, that's news to me. Can I go out on a limb and guess you blew a high draft pick last season on Williams and this could be why you believe he is so much better? Just a shot in the dark. Now besides your fantasy hopes and dreams, did you actually watch any Panther games last year? Did D. Williams really impress you? I watched every one of them and left unimpressed and honestly don't see Williams as being clearly anything, besides shorter. By the way, I don't own either of these guys in any league so my opinion isn't born out of wishful thinking. :lmao:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.