Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
spider321

Dynasty Value Discussion Thread

Recommended Posts

25 minutes ago, thriftyrocker said:

What would people take for Garoppolo at this point? I tried to buy him both last offseason and during the season and always balked at taking that little step more to get it done, and now regret it. Is a pick equal to the top rookie QB enough, or is he already a late 1st valuation or more?

2QB:  Not even considering dealing as he's still highly undervalued IMO. (Dynasty QB16 per fantasypros rankings)

1QB: Doesn't hurt to try with a 2nd. Definitely not something I'd accept but doesn't hurt to try. What QBs you have to possibly throw in return?

Edited by Craig_MiamiFL

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Craig_MiamiFL said:

So read some Greg Cosell on Watkins. Guy is the best evaluator out there by far IMO.

 

Have not heard Cosell in a few weeks but I recall him saying that in this tape review something to the extent that Watkins was open, that for whatever reason Goff was just not going to him. Something like that.

Yesterday, and I wish I could recall where I saw it, but I saw a video of a long pass to Woods which was complete for a big gain. Watkins was more wide open then Woods and it would have likely been a bigger gain if he's gone to Watkins but Goff never looked his way. ETA-that play was from the game against Atlanta.

Watkins has been very professional throughout all this, which is not easy to do when bad stats don't help you get a good contract. He said the other day, and not speaking negatively of Goff when he said it, that Goff had built up a trust with some of his other WR's and it was hard for him to come into the picture later, in camp, and earn that trust and comfort but he thought things would improve if he returned next year, which he was open to doing. I think he's correct with his assessment.

Edited by menobrown
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, menobrown said:

Have not heard Cosell in a few weeks but I recall him saying that in this tape review something to the extent that Watkins was open, that for whatever reason Goff was just not going to him. Something like that.

Yesterday, and I wish I could recall where I saw it, but I saw a video of a long pass to Woods which was complete for a big gain. Watkins was more wide open then Woods and it would have likely been a bigger gain if he's gone to Watkins but Goff never looked his way. ETA-that play was from the game against Atlanta.

Watkins has been very professional throughout all this, which is not easy to do when bad stats don't help you get a good contract. He said the other day, and not speaking negatively of Goff when he said it, that Goff had built up a trust with some of his other WR's and it was hard for him to come into the picture later, in camp, and earn that trust and comfort but he thought things would improve if he returned next year, which he was open to doing. I think he's correct with his assessment.

Depending on cost, Watkins is a good buy candidate. Still has an elite skill set, a qb with an upward trajectory, and better health prognosis. As always, cost matters but IF he were in this incoming WR class, I’d rank him above everyone else, making him worth about a mid first to me. My guess is I’m slightly high on my valuation, so I’d look to offer a pick in the 1.08-1.10 window with the realistic expectation of giving a 1.05 or 1.06 pick.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, thriftyrocker said:

What would people take for Garoppolo at this point? I tried to buy him both last offseason and during the season and always balked at taking that little step more to get it done, and now regret it. Is a pick equal to the top rookie QB enough, or is he already a late 1st valuation or more?

I sold him for Watkins and Olsen when he got traded.  I would still do that if I owned him now.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, thriftyrocker said:

What would people take for Garoppolo at this point? I tried to buy him both last offseason and during the season and always balked at taking that little step more to get it done, and now regret it. Is a pick equal to the top rookie QB enough, or is he already a late 1st valuation or more?

I offered a late first in a 1QB league and was declined. So yes, the hype is real. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Ack88 said:

Depending on cost, Watkins is a good buy candidate. Still has an elite skill set, a qb with an upward trajectory, and better health prognosis. As always, cost matters but IF he were in this incoming WR class, I’d rank him above everyone else, making him worth about a mid first to me. My guess is I’m slightly high on my valuation, so I’d look to offer a pick in the 1.08-1.10 window with the realistic expectation of giving a 1.05 or 1.06 pick.

I think a late first is a fair risk for both sides. If I still owned Sammy and could get the 1.05, honestly I'd jump at that. In my leagues he isn't valued that highly, however, in the dynasty community I still think the perception is out ahead of reality for him. Everyone seems to assume he's an elite talent and he would be a top 5-10 WR if he was just in the right situation, but is that really still the case? I personally don't think so. I see him as a WR2 with some upside but plenty of risk as well. "Buy low" if you want, there are worse things to do I guess, but if he has another bad season his value will tank. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Tick said:

I sold him for Watkins and Olsen when he got traded.  I would still do that if I owned him now.

SF or 2 QB? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, jeaton6 said:

SF or 2 QB? 

No, 1 QB.  I have Brady and Mariota.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Ack88 said:

Depending on cost, Watkins is a good buy candidate. Still has an elite skill set, a qb with an upward trajectory, and better health prognosis. As always, cost matters but IF he were in this incoming WR class, I’d rank him above everyone else, making him worth about a mid first to me. My guess is I’m slightly high on my valuation, so I’d look to offer a pick in the 1.08-1.10 window with the realistic expectation of giving a 1.05 or 1.06 pick.

In my leagues, the Watkins owners still value him as super elite & want a small ransom for him. Hard pass.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, RushHour said:

I think a late first is a fair risk for both sides. If I still owned Sammy and could get the 1.05, honestly I'd jump at that. In my leagues he isn't valued that highly, however, in the dynasty community I still think the perception is out ahead of reality for him. Everyone seems to assume he's an elite talent and he would be a top 5-10 WR if he was just in the right situation, but is that really still the case? I personally don't think so. I see him as a WR2 with some upside but plenty of risk as well. "Buy low" if you want, there are worse things to do I guess, but if he has another bad season his value will tank. 

I don't think I'd jump at 1.05, at least until after the draft, but that's probably right.  

9 hours ago, Magic_Man said:

In my leagues, the Watkins owners still value him as super elite & want a small ransom for him. Hard pass.

As an owner, I just don't want to trade a guy I think can be elite and then see him blow up for the other team.  At least without getting near his upside in the trade.  He's almost untradeable right now.  Not because he's so elite, but because we think he can be and the loss aversion risk is real. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Tick said:

No, 1 QB.  I have Brady and Mariota.

You realize this must be an outlier. A QB who has proven nothing for a guy who has talent and shown he can Perform (probably 4th round startup) and a high performing TE. Great deal for you. Doubt you could get those two for most top QBs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/11/2018 at 1:38 PM, Aunt Jemima said:

What's the current value of some of the aging TE's like Jimmy Graham,Delanie Walker, Greg Olsen?? If you were rebuilding what would you take pick wise??

I'm a rebuilding team in a Zealots league and around midseason I was offered Graham for what was likely, and turned out to be, the 3.12.  I didn't have any use for him due to his age, but figured I could hold him for a week or two and flip him to a contender for a 2018 2nd.  None of the contenders bit on the offers or countered.  I then offered him to everyone with a third round pick.  He's still sitting on my roster.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/11/2018 at 0:38 PM, Aunt Jemima said:

What's the current value of some of the aging TE's like Jimmy Graham,Delanie Walker, Greg Olsen?? If you were rebuilding what would you take pick wise??

Tough to answer.

I'm going to assume this is FFPC and if it's not forget everything I'm about to say.

I'd just sit on Jimmy G until FA sorts itself out. A new landing spot for him will be followed by some nice puff pieces and that's a better  time to move him IMO.  Would the Saints be interested in getting him back? Will he return to Miami? I'd hold and see.

I'd take a solid second for Delanie, mid to late . Late gets it done if I need roster room.

Olsen just got arguably  best TE OC in the business. Norv protege Rob Chudzinski was the OC who was there when Olsen first broke out. I'd use that when selling him now but would have to have a pick in high second at least  to move him now. Even on a rebuilding team, due in large part to Norv, I'd just as well sit on him till next season instead of what might be selling low. Roster space might be a factor but he might be worth more later.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, jeaton6 said:

You realize this must be an outlier. A QB who has proven nothing for a guy who has talent and shown he can Perform (probably 4th round startup) and a high performing TE. Great deal for you. Doubt you could get those two for most top QBs

No complaints from me!  And that was before he won those games at the end of the season.

Edited by Tick

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What veteran receivers do people consider equal in value to 2018 1.01? I expect Barkely to be a special talent.  

Yes or No?

Odell Beckham

Deandre Hopkins

Julio Jones

Davante Adams

Anyone else?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, az_prof said:

What veteran receivers do people consider equal in value to 2018 1.01? I expect Barkely to be a special talent.  

Yes or No?

Odell Beckham

Deandre Hopkins

Julio Jones

Davante Adams

Anyone else?

Yes

Yes

Not close

Not close

Mike Evans is close

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, az_prof said:

What veteran receivers do people consider equal in value to 2018 1.01? I expect Barkely to be a special talent.  

Yes or No?

Odell Beckham

Deandre Hopkins

Julio Jones

Davante Adams

Anyone else?

Like for wrote, Mike Evans is close. Antonio Brown even if he's "getting old" 

That's it. And it depends on the league if I'd give the pick for those guys.

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, az_prof said:

What veteran receivers do people consider equal in value to 2018 1.01? I expect Barkely to be a special talent.  

Yes or No?

Odell Beckham

Deandre Hopkins

Julio Jones

Davante Adams

Anyone else?

OBJ > 1.01

Hopkins > 1.01

Evans = 1.01

Julio < 1.01

Adams < 1.01

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, FreeBaGeL said:

OBJ > 1.01

Hopkins > 1.01

Evans = 1.01

Julio < 1.01

Adams < 1.01

Probably, but I doubt you'll get much added to the 1 for OBJ or Hopkins. 

Funny, 3 years ago I traded the 1.01 (Gurley) for Mike Evans.  I took a lot of flack for making "a mistake" at the time.  Yet here he is, still worth the #1, and the prospect is even more promising than Gurley was at the time. (TBH, I'd be happy with Barkley if he did as well as Gurley his first 3 years)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/12/2018 at 10:03 AM, Magic_Man said:

In my leagues, the Watkins owners still value him as super elite & want a small ransom for him. Hard pass.

I'm a dyno Sammy owner. Wouldn't call it a ransom, but certainly would want fairly high value. Just think, Sammy just wrapped up his what? 4th year in the NFL, and he's just 1 year older than Calvin Ridley just coming in now. This was also an odd lose-win season for Sammy. Dude's stats sucked apart from the goalline TDs he got toward the end, BUT his value jumped way up after finally being able to make it a full season without any lower body injuries which he's had the history of.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, ShamrockPride said:

I'm a dyno Sammy owner. Wouldn't call it a ransom, but certainly would want fairly high value. Just think, Sammy just wrapped up his what? 4th year in the NFL, and he's just 1 year older than Calvin Ridley just coming in now. This was also an odd lose-win season for Sammy. Dude's stats sucked apart from the goalline TDs he got toward the end, BUT his value jumped way up after finally being able to make it a full season without any lower body injuries which he's had the history of.

Don’t own him anywhere but he’s an obvious talent. Made a few sick catches this year including a Willie Mays-style over the shoulder grab. Watkins is poster boy for how important situation/QB is for wides. He’s a hold because no one is going to pay for his lack of usage.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really appreciate the discussion on David Johnson, especially the thoughtful back and forth on his remaining value and his situation. I have him in one league and share the same concerns as FreeBaGeL and FF Ninja so I would move him if I could find the right deal. I also agree with Bia that a primary consideration in his value is his special receiving ability (I like the characterization of Christian McCaffery at 230 lbs). 

To me the decision on trading him comes down to timing. A local AZ reporter and Rapoport are suggesting Shurmur is the clear front runner for HC. I think that's a very positive replacement for Arians, and checks off a big box on DJ's value if it happens. If AZ gets a decent QB in via FA, and people are feeling good about Shurmur's recent work with developing Keenum, then some of the concerns depressing DJ's value now could lift a bit. I worry about their ability to get a QB in the draft given their position but that could also bring some hope. We also don't know about Fitzgerald retiring, which would be a ding. 

I'm also intrigued by the part of the discussion here related to DJ's value relative to Barkley. I agree with Bia that it is basically a push, and I see the proposition as having 3 years of high floor production from DJ versus buying in at the front end of Barkley's career but taking on the additional risk since he's never played a down in the NFL.

A major factor to me is whether Barkley gets drafted by the Browns. I want to wait to see if that happens because if it does I think it would represent a chance to buy him at a slight reduction compared to where he is valued now. I agree with FF Ninja that the Browns offense could become a positive in a short period of time. Their sucking seems metaphysically guaranteed, but it isn't. They've drafted a lot of early round talent on that side of the ball, and as Ninja mentioned the line is good. A standard argument around the Browns is that had they drafted Wentz or Watson they would never have broken out. Would that same argument be applied to Barkley by owners of the 1.1? They're not going to give the pick away, and they may see the same young pieces coming into shape, but they also may come off their demands for your first born.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wouldn't call DJ and Barkley a push just because of what DJ has proven vs. Barkley being all potential.  Sure Barkley looks great and all but he's still unproven at the NFL level.  There's a very clear top4 RB's to me in Gurley, Bell, DJ and Zeke.  Then Barkley in tier2, then everyone else below that.  So it's very close to me but haven't we learned a little bit of skepticism when it comes to "the best RB prospect since AP, in Trich?"  For every Trich there was a Gurley and Zeke so the odds seem to be in his favor, but anointing him to be better than literally the best in the league already seems like a reach.  Maybe it's my skepticism or my cautious nature when it comes to rookies, but I can't put him above the best of the best until I see it for myself.  That's the reason I felt I needed to add OJ Howard in my last offer, and that's the reason I won't make another offer for that pick, but I imagine after the draft, some people will knock him down a peg or two for going to the Browns, or other bad landing spots.  He's unlikely to be put into a great situation unless he goes to the Giants, and even they are kind of a mess right now.  Tampa or Oakland seem like the best landing spots in that top10 but I would guess it takes a move up to get Barkley for them.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Where is everyone on Marquise Goodwin? His numbers with Garoppolo (weeks 13-17) were: 8-99; 6-106; 10-114; 3-37; and 2-28-1. So a few productive games and two quiet ones, and he had a handful of good games earlier in the season.

I don't watch SF play very much so can anyone comment on whether he has developed a more all-around game? If so, he has all-world speed and seems to me to be someone you could get cheap, especially if SF adds a WR via FA or the draft as many people seem to expect. If they do add a WR, and/or if Garcon comes back healthy, could he still produce in that offense?

Edited by DAG

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's the best you can expect to get for Drew Brees now? In 12 team leagues. 

If you have a good qb1 and backup, making Brees expendable, would you trade him for a 2nd? Understand this really depends on other teams needs, and the off season is really a bad time to trade old QBs, so is he just a hold?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

What's the best you can expect to get for Drew Brees now? In 12 team leagues. 

If you have a good qb1 and backup, making Brees expendable, would you trade him for a 2nd? Understand this really depends on other teams needs, and the off season is really a bad time to trade old QBs, so is he just a hold?

I think I'd take a second for Brees in the situaiton you described. You could grab one of the rookie QB's there and cross your fingers - but if you're already set at QB, there's not much risk.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, kutta said:

I think I'd take a second for Brees in the situaiton you described. You could grab one of the rookie QB's there and cross your fingers - but if you're already set at QB, there's not much risk.

Agreed. But would you trade the 2nd, or more to the point expect someone to give a 2nd?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don’t think you’re getting a 2nd in a 12 team league. He’s been old for awhile but he put up elite numbers before. This year, with the running commitment, his numbers were pretty average.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, -OZ- said:

Agreed. But would you trade the 2nd, or more to the point expect someone to give a 2nd?

Great point. I wanted to respond to this because it is the thing that annoys me most about dynasty analysis. On podcasts, you hear people saying stuff like they would buy X player for a second and sell for a late-first. I understand that you want to buy low/sell high and there is a value point where it's not worth it to make a trade, but in this scenario you value the player at a late-first round pick but you're also not willing to pay what you actually think the player is worth. 

You also hear guys saying that you should "sell high" on X player because their production isn't sustainable (e.g. Chris Thompson from last year). The other one is when a player is described as a "flip" candidate - like it's the easiest thing in the world to sell some over-performing player for a late first round pick and get out before the milk goes bad.  

I always think what leagues are you guys playing in? If you think a player is a sell high or a flip candidate and you play in anything resembling a competitive league, then it's likely that many of the other people in your league have the same view of that player and aren't willing to buy that player for an inflated price. In leagues I have played in, selling high on players is much more difficult to do in practice because people are awake to what you're trying to do. Most dynasty analysis assumes your league mates are idiots basically.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/12/2018 at 11:18 PM, az_prof said:

What veteran receivers do people consider equal in value to 2018 1.01? I expect Barkely to be a special talent.  

Yes or No?

Odell Beckham

Deandre Hopkins

Julio Jones

Davante Adams

Anyone else?

Odell Beckham No

Deandre Hopkins No

Elliot No

Gurley No

Julio Jones No

Davante Adams - I'm a bit wishy washy because its a Packer 

Mike Evans No

Michael Thomas No

Keenan Allen No

David Johnson No

LeVeon Bell No

Brandin Cooks Maybe

Amari Cooper Maybe

Dalvin Cook Maybe

Leonard Fournette Maybe

Alvin Kamara Yes

Kareem Hunt Yes

Adam Thielen Yes

Tyreek Hill Yes

Allen Robinson Yes

Stefon Diggs Yes

Doug Baldwin Yes

 

 

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 1/14/2018 at 10:17 AM, DAG said:

I really appreciate the discussion on David Johnson, especially the thoughtful back and forth on his remaining value and his situation. I have him in one league and share the same concerns as FreeBaGeL and FF Ninja so I would move him if I could find the right deal. I also agree with Bia that a primary consideration in his value is his special receiving ability (I like the characterization of Christian McCaffery at 230 lbs). 

To me the decision on trading him comes down to timing. A local AZ reporter and Rapoport are suggesting Shurmur is the clear front runner for HC. I think that's a very positive replacement for Arians, and checks off a big box on DJ's value if it happens. If AZ gets a decent QB in via FA, and people are feeling good about Shurmur's recent work with developing Keenum, then some of the concerns depressing DJ's value now could lift a bit. I worry about their ability to get a QB in the draft given their position but that could also bring some hope. We also don't know about Fitzgerald retiring, which would be a ding. 

I'm also intrigued by the part of the discussion here related to DJ's value relative to Barkley. I agree with Bia that it is basically a push, and I see the proposition as having 3 years of high floor production from DJ versus buying in at the front end of Barkley's career but taking on the additional risk since he's never played a down in the NFL.

A major factor to me is whether Barkley gets drafted by the Browns. I want to wait to see if that happens because if it does I think it would represent a chance to buy him at a slight reduction compared to where he is valued now. I agree with FF Ninja that the Browns offense could become a positive in a short period of time. Their sucking seems metaphysically guaranteed, but it isn't. They've drafted a lot of early round talent on that side of the ball, and as Ninja mentioned the line is good. A standard argument around the Browns is that had they drafted Wentz or Watson they would never have broken out. Would that same argument be applied to Barkley by owners of the 1.1? They're not going to give the pick away, and they may see the same young pieces coming into shape, but they also may come off their demands for your first born.

Nice post and I agree the possibility of Barkley going to the Browns would present a buy low opportunity. Hell it might shift the 1.01 to Guice or another RB if they are drafted high and get a better offense to fit with.

While I agree the Browns have a good offensive line, something they have done a good job of maintaining for a pretty long time now. Really hinging on the Joe Thomas pick and then usually being able to draft so high, adding some good talents along the way as well. Free agent signing of Kevin Zeitler offsetting the loss of Mack. They have a lot of good players on their offensive line.

Hue Jackson does not inspire my confidence in Barkley getting bell cow opportunities. He did do it before with the Raiders and Michael Bush, or when Bernard was injured with Hill. But generally he likes to split carries and that won;t help Barkley in the short term.

It could turn out great as well. Just saying a different coach and I would feel a bit more optimistic about the prospect of Barkley being there.

The Browns may be gunshy due to Trent RIchardson pick not that long ago. I remember Richardson seeming like a can't miss RB. The Browns were able to ruin him pretty quickly (or he did so himself, however you want to look at it I guess). This at least feels like additional risk because the Browns got RIchardson so wrong before. They even traded up with the Vikings to draft RIchardson when the Vikings were drafting Kalil if he was there all along. To the Browns credit, at least they didn't want Kalil (or need him with Joe Thomas). 

Maybe it would be great football and a great way to develop a QB with Barkley and Duke Johnson to go to short for easy completions, a really high upside TE in Njoku and maybe even some receivers to work with in Gordon and Coleman?

Its not bad if they can just find the QB. 

The Browns could possibly do both in this draft. Barkley would be an asset.

Philosophically I think drafting a RB that high is something I don't really think teams should do. As I think they should prioritize other positions, but Barkley may be worth a top 10 pick. If he is thats a good reason to value him more. Espeically if he is top 5 pick. The success rate of RB drafted this high is really strong. So with that pretty commonly being floated out right now, that makes the 1.01 pick seem more valuable, if Barkley is a top 5 pick, but if he is, he likely was drafted by the Browns, which does take some of the shine off that.

Shurmur to Arizona seems like a good fit but recently I have been hearing he goes to the Giants. Not sure what other options Arizona has in play right now. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, RushHour said:

Great point. I wanted to respond to this because it is the thing that annoys me most about dynasty analysis. On podcasts, you hear people saying stuff like they would buy X player for a second and sell for a late-first. I understand that you want to buy low/sell high and there is a value point where it's not worth it to make a trade, but in this scenario you value the player at a late-first round pick but you're also not willing to pay what you actually think the player is worth. 

You also hear guys saying that you should "sell high" on X player because their production isn't sustainable (e.g. Chris Thompson from last year). The other one is when a player is described as a "flip" candidate - like it's the easiest thing in the world to sell some over-performing player for a late first round pick and get out before the milk goes bad.  

I always think what leagues are you guys playing in? If you think a player is a sell high or a flip candidate and you play in anything resembling a competitive league, then it's likely that many of the other people in your league have the same view of that player and aren't willing to buy that player for an inflated price. In leagues I have played in, selling high on players is much more difficult to do in practice because people are awake to what you're trying to do. Most dynasty analysis assumes your league mates are idiots basically.

There are a lot of leagues.

The whole premise is somewhat vague anyways. But the folks you are listening to may play in leagues like this, There are a lot of leagues.

For dynasty you would think that most leagues that have existed for a handful of years already are full of some fairly experienced owners for the most part. I can see such tactics being more possible within the first few years of a league, where you still may have some owners still in the process of selecting themselves out of the running with subsequent moves like that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, DAG said:

Where is everyone on Marquise Goodwin? His numbers with Garoppolo (weeks 13-17) were: 8-99; 6-106; 10-114; 3-37; and 2-28-1. So a few productive games and two quiet ones, and he had a handful of good games earlier in the season.

I don't watch SF play very much so can anyone comment on whether he has developed a more all-around game? If so, he has all-world speed and seems to me to be someone you could get cheap, especially if SF adds a WR via FA or the draft as many people seem to expect. If they do add a WR, and/or if Garcon comes back healthy, could he still produce in that offense?

Good questions. He was excellent with JimmyG. I rode him as a flex play in redraft through most of those games. I don’t own him in dynasty, but would like to acquire this offseason. Seems like a trade will be difficult, though. If SF drafts a WR early or gets a big time FA, that is when I will try to get him cheap. If I owned him, I would want a late 1st. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, DAG said:

Where is everyone on Marquise Goodwin? His numbers with Garoppolo (weeks 13-17) were: 8-99; 6-106; 10-114; 3-37; and 2-28-1. So a few productive games and two quiet ones, and he had a handful of good games earlier in the season.

I don't watch SF play very much so can anyone comment on whether he has developed a more all-around game? If so, he has all-world speed and seems to me to be someone you could get cheap, especially if SF adds a WR via FA or the draft as many people seem to expect. If they do add a WR, and/or if Garcon comes back healthy, could he still produce in that offense?

Good questions. He was excellent with JimmyG. I rode him as a flex play in redraft through most of those games. I don’t own him in dynasty, but would like to acquire this offseason. Seems like a trade will be difficult, though. If SF drafts a WR early or gets a big time FA, that is when I will try to get him cheap. If I owned him, I would want a late 1st. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, -OZ- said:

Agreed. But would you trade the 2nd, or more to the point expect someone to give a 2nd?

Probably not. If it was a late second and I was desperate for a QB, maybe. But I think I’d rather take my chances with one of the rookies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, IHEARTFF said:

Good questions. He was excellent with JimmyG. I rode him as a flex play in redraft through most of those games. I don’t own him in dynasty, but would like to acquire this offseason. Seems like a trade will be difficult, though. If SF drafts a WR early or gets a big time FA, that is when I will try to get him cheap. If I owned him, I would want a late 1st. 

I can't see paying a late first. Garcon was out and Jimmy G really had no else to throw to really. His numbers seem a bit inflated due to circumstances but he does have world class speed so perhaps there's something there.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, kutta said:

Probably not. If it was a late second and I was desperate for a QB, maybe. But I think I’d rather take my chances with one of the rookies.

Thats my thought, I actually offered Brees for Kizer and a little upgrade at receiver. Rejected. That owner has the weakest QBs, but seems he's content with what he has. So Brees is a hold.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

I can't see paying a late first. Garcon was out and Jimmy G really had no else to throw to really. His numbers seem a bit inflated due to circumstances but he does have world class speed so perhaps there's something there.

That’s what I would ask for. If buying, I would be bidding a late 2nd maybe right now. His value is going to change this offseason. If they clearly upgrade from him, he might be available for a 3rd. If they don’t, JimmyGs #1 target is worth more than any rookie WR, so a mid 1st. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, IHEARTFF said:

That’s what I would ask for. If buying, I would be bidding a late 2nd maybe right now. His value is going to change this offseason. If they clearly upgrade from him, he might be available for a 3rd. If they don’t, JimmyGs #1 target is worth more than any rookie WR, so a mid 1st. 

Short term maybe. But if you don't really believe in his talent, not long term.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, IHEARTFF said:

That’s what I would ask for. If buying, I would be bidding a late 2nd maybe right now. His value is going to change this offseason. If they clearly upgrade from him, he might be available for a 3rd. If they don’t, JimmyGs #1 target is worth more than any rookie WR, so a mid 1st. 

I really wouldn't buy him no matter what happens at more than a late 2nd. Even then I'd need extra roster space for a low ceiling guy with a real high bust probability.

He's kind of like a poor man's Pryor last off-season.

Edited by voiceofunreason
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Could Mularkey's exit in Tennessee impact their skill position players the way Fisher's did for the Rams?  That offense was overly cute far too often. 

After moving on from Mariota, I'm tempted to give him another shot.  I feel sick about having sold Davis for Henry recently, but am otherwise happy about the change as a Henry owner.  Sell Walker, buy everyone else?

 

Haley out as OC in Pittsburgh has to be somewhat concerning for Bell, Brown, JuJu owners, no? 

Edited by Concept Coop

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Concept Coop said:

Could Mularkey's exit in Tennessee impact their skill position players the way Fisher's did for the Rams?  That offense was overly cute far too often. 

After moving on from Mariota, I'm tempted to give him another shot.  I feel sick about having sold Davis for Henry recently, but am otherwise happy about the change as a Henry owner.  Sell Walker, buy everyone else?

Think we need to see who the new coach and o coordinator are first.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, fruity pebbles said:

Think we need to see who the new coach and o coordinator are first.

Certainly fair, especially if we're pondering a Rams like turnaround.  Personally, I'll gladly take the unknown over the status quo, however. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Concept Coop said:

Certainly fair, especially if we're pondering a Rams like turnaround.  Personally, I'll gladly take the unknown over the status quo, however. 

The leading candidates don’t look that great to me. Seems like the top choices have all been placed elsewhere. Mularkey was an offensive coordinator before he was head coach. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, Concept Coop said:

 

Haley out as OC in Pittsburgh has to be somewhat concerning for Bell, Brown, JuJu owners, no? 

No for me.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, IHEARTFF said:

That’s what I would ask for. If buying, I would be bidding a late 2nd maybe right now. His value is going to change this offseason. If they clearly upgrade from him, he might be available for a 3rd. If they don’t, JimmyGs #1 target is worth more than any rookie WR, so a mid 1st. 

I'm not sure he will be the top target even with just Garcon back next year though.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Concept Coop said:

How would you rank these assets in a pretty standard 12 team PPR league? 

1.08
1.10
1.12
Kupp
Watkins
Woods
 

Watkins

1.08

Woods

Kupp

1.10

1.12

Watkins could easily deliver far less than any of these other commodities but also could be worth well more. I'm willing to take that risk. To me, the back half of round #1 is not great this year. The WR crop looks pedestrian to me.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Concept Coop said:

How would you rank these assets in a pretty standard 12 team PPR league? 

1.08
1.10
1.12
Kupp
Watkins
Woods
 

Watkins

Woods

1.08

1.10

Kupp

1.12

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Ack88 said:

Watkins

1.08

Woods

Kupp

1.10

1.12

Watkins could easily deliver far less than any of these other commodities but also could be worth well more. I'm willing to take that risk. To me, the back half of round #1 is not great this year. The WR crop looks pedestrian to me.

 

1 minute ago, Tick said:

Watkins

Woods

1.08

1.10

Kupp

1.12

I might like kupp too much in PPR but I'd put him over woods, both on par the the 10/12. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.