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That's cool. We can disagree there.
Clearly, you don't "know what she means" when she says what she says. I think there's a special decoder ring involved but you'll have to consult the experts on that.
Surrounded by enemies? This is Netanyahu think. Most Palestinians are just human beings trying to live a normal life. When you characterize them as terrorists seeking to destroy Israel, I think you are being xenophobic.timschochet said:
I didn’t characterize Palestinians as terrorists. But the sad facts are that their two governments, freely elected, consistently publicly call for the violent destruction of the state of Israel and have done so ever since 1948. The government of Gaza, Hamas, has gone even further, declaring a holy war against Jews and calling for their complete extermination. They engage in terrible propaganda in their media and schools, hateful bigoted anti-Semitism. Frankly, they make Netanyahu’s own bigotry much easier.
Here's a clip from Laura Ingraham's Fox News show where she and Matt Schlapp (the chair of the American Conservative Union and a former member of the George W Bush administration) accuse two Muslim congresswomen of anti-Semitism while Fox runs the chryon reading: "Exposed: the Left's anti-Semitism probem."
The moderators misinterpret posts and respond to complaints. I strongly doubt that they were trying to make a statement about anti-Semitism or anything else.
Thanks, I appreciate the sentiment.
The mods want us to be excellent to each other. Your post that earned you the timeout wasn't being excellent.Thanks, I appreciate the sentiment.
Anyway, further support for my very true and accurate statement that many conservatives co-opt anti-Semitism in bad faith to spread hatred and division and then turn around and ignore or even embrace it when it suits their purposes: It's now almost 1 PM eastern time and Fox News (which I think we can all agree is operated by and marketed to "many conservatives" and which obviously pushed the Omar/Tlaib anti-Semitism allegations ad nauseam) has not uttered a single word about what Ingraham did last night. link
I think calling this behavior "disgraceful, pathetic, disingenuous garbage" is entirely accurate- if anything it's too mild. I also think it's important to call out such behavior for what it is. It appears the moderators disagree, so
This is an Israel-based, online newspaper: far-left-california-democrats-want-to-link-israeli-govt-to-pittsburgh-massacreTobiasFunke said:Thanks, I appreciate the sentiment.
Anyway, further support for my very true and accurate statement that many conservatives co-opt anti-Semitism in bad faith to spread hatred and division and then turn around and ignore or even embrace it when it suits their purposes: It's now almost 1 PM eastern time and Fox News (which I think we can all agree is operated by and marketed to "many conservatives" and which obviously pushed the Omar/Tlaib anti-Semitism allegations ad nauseam) has not uttered a single word about what Ingraham did last night. link
I think calling this behavior "disgraceful, pathetic, disingenuous garbage" is entirely accurate- if anything it's too mild. I also think it's important to call out such behavior for what it is. It appears the moderators disagree, so
Maybe a day, if even that. Two weeks is crazy. I guess I can see where it was unexcellent, but I can't believe he got banned for that. I can't believe someone wanted to report that. Should be much different weight given to posts attacking substance versus attacking the poster, although often the former is obviously meant to achieve the latter.
KD I addressed with you that you had posted a YouTube handle of someone who was obviously an admirer of Oswald Mosely and (albeit in a different video) suggested that he and Hitler were ‘right’. I only mention that because of Tobias’ post above. Please consider your sources and the purposes of the sources and voices you are taking in and disseminating.
I was giving full context there.
It’s beyond disgusting. I’ll add that Ingraham likes to retweet VDare on her twitter feed. - It’s hard to follow if she is just that pernicious or is there something manifestly wrong in her morally or intellectually. Does she know who these people are when she features them or just reading off scripts?
You are missing the part that makes the behavior so terrible. People are welcome to think some of the things Omar and Tlaib have said was anti-Semitic, or that opposing Israel's priorities and approach amounts to anti-Semitism. I think they're very wrong, but there is certainly room for differences of opinion on that. Nothing wrong with being overly vigilant on this subject.
People disappoint me all the time, often in new and ever more objectionable ways. I sympathize with your passions. I have them too. some times one has to run with their passions and accept the consequences as they arise. The thing is, if we are true to ourselves accepting consequences is a small thing. The dignity with which we do so ought to flail to shame those who are reprehensible, yet they are oblivious to our integrity.
The history of faux horror at the Omar and Tlaib comments by ingraham is very important here. Her segment on censorship(i realize that is a very loose description of the segment) could actually be defended if she had not engaged in this prior behavior and if she had apologized for putting that guy up there. I find it very believable that she didn't put the graphic together and could have bought that she was making a point about censorship and people were digging too deep into things if the history didnt exist.
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"You can't oppose [insert something conservatives were outraged about here*], and then support a conservative who engages in similar behavior, and then expect a rational person to find you to be credible" is pretty much the defining theme of the current Republican party.
Maybe many middle-aged men are increasingly isolated and depressed because they waste countless hours of each day sitting in front of a computer alone and posting anonymously to strangers on a message board rather than:
I could buy this if Bernie didn’t have a long history of calling out Big Money. I won’t even comment on the link as I have no clue that guys history but assuming he hasn’t been railing against money in politics for years then these two aren’t remotely comparable.
There has to be more.
That was a pretty clear antisemitic comment by Omar. Much more clear than anything else she has ever said IMO.
It is ridiculous to jump to accusations of anti-semitism because somebody on the right called out the three most influential donors on the left. It makes the argument even more ridiculous when a democrat (that is jewish) calls out one of those same people for the very same thing.
I don’t understand your post - history is definitely relevant when determining if someone or something is anti-Semitic.
I can't tell if you are being serious here.
We can discuss the merits of these recent examples, but it would seem terribly naive to suggest that history is irrelevant.
Even if you give her the benefit of the doubt, how hard would it be for her to clarify her position? At a minimum it comes across as intentional and at worst anti-Semitic. It reminds me of some of Trumps vague tweets that stirred things up.
Not the history you brought up. You specifically mentioned history regarding calling out money. That is completely irrelevant. It might be relevant if the guy cherry picked three donors that were jewish and were further down the list, but that wasnt the case.
I’m still lost. I brought up Bernie’s history and specifically said I don’t know anything about the Republican guy referenced.
Maybe I am just naive. I just rarely think of a person's heritage in these instances. I would have no idea Leon Cooperman was Jewish if not for this outrage.
All I know is that if I had been accused of that in the past I would be extra careful with a tweet like that - I would find it hard to believe it didn’t cross her mind and that comes from someone who hasn’t followed this closely and is a neophyte when it comes to Jewish people.
First, the statement was clearly anti-Semitic on its face. Nobody criticizes billionaires for being on the side of other billionaires. That doesn’t happen. And yes I’m serious.
We are close to being in agreement except I do think people criticize billionaires for being on the side of billionaires- you can count me as one and I think it’s fair to say Bernie is another.
I think you are over-analyzing it - seriously.
Just one well known example of this: the worst anti-Semite of my lifetime was World Chess Champion Bobby Fischer, who was Jewish and who had Jewish friends all his life.
To close the loop on the Bernie discussion- maybe you were not serious about his comment being anti-Semitic - my point was:
This isn’t true at all. Spend some time on leftie twitter and you’ll see something to the effect of “RICH PEOPLE HAVE CLASS SOLIDARITY; DO YOU?” every single day.
I do not think bernie's comment was anti semitic. Nor do i think any comments about the three biggest donors trying to buy elections are ant semitic. When you spend millions or even hundreds of millions of dollars on campaigns that's pretty much exactly what you are doing.
