*** 2013 Oakland Raiders thread *** (1 Viewer)

[Faust]

Don’t Ditch Dennis

 

[Garrett]

Anyone who wants to dump Allen, my first question would be who they expect is realistic to replace him and why that would be an improvement. I haven't heard of any realistic options so far.

 

[RaiderBones]

Anyone who wants to dump Allen, my first question would be who they expect is realistic to replace him and why that would be an improvement. I haven't heard of any realistic options so far.

I think Allen should get a 3rd year. He was handicapped with the current roster. Now at the end of year 3 with all that cap space to work with and just about a full draft to work with if the team doesn't show a lot of improvement then yes he should be replaced. Now if Allen were to be let go there are a couple of options I can think of. I wouldn't mind taking a look at Ray Horton and Jay Gruden for example.

 

[Chachi]

The Chachinator has heard the idea of removing the a Raiders and Jaguars from the NFL is gaining momentum.

The Chachinator is on board!

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Can we agree that the ghost of Al Davis is alive and well in Oakland ?

Also i heard a rumor that Chucky wants to coach again...in Oakland

 

[joey]

I'd take back Chucky in an instant.

But if that did happen, part of me would be sad about YET ANOTHER change, yet another instance of the team having ADD when it comes to coming up with a plan and having the patience to stick with it. Stability...we don't got it.

 

[Faust]

Rotoworld:

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports owner Mark Davis recently "rejected" coach Dennis Allen's request to give the Raiders' assistant coaches contract extensions.
It's not just an ominous development for the assistants. It's bad news for Allen, whom NFL.com's Mike Silver recently reported is "very much on the hot seat," and whose job security may be decided based on the effort and performance level of his roster during the final two games. The 2013 Raiders are 4-10 and close out the season at San Diego, before hosting Peyton Manning's Broncos. Oakland has lost four consecutive games, and six of its last seven.

Source: Adam Schefter on Twitter

 

[Faust]

Jon Gruden remains intrigued by the Oakland Raiders

 

[Raider Nation]

Well, we don't have a lot of talent, but we make up for it by being a really stupid team.

 

[raidergil]

Well, we don't have a lot of talent, but we make up for it by being a really stupid team.

Amazing that hasn't changed from coach to coach

 

[32 Counter Pass]

Yup. The team has completely lost focus. Penalties are up. Turnovers are up.

Adios Señor Allen

 

[RaiderBones]

Yup. The team has completely lost focus. Penalties are up. Turnovers are up.

Adios Señor Allen

Yea, I think Allen is gone as well. Just 3 weeks ago I thought he was safe, but things have fallen apart the past 3 weeks. Next week won't be any better facing Manning. Manning may go for a record 10 TD passes in one game.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

Yup. The team has completely lost focus. Penalties are up. Turnovers are up.

Adios Señor Allen

Say Adios Señor Reggie too.

 

[lod01]

Jon Gruden remains intrigued by the Oakland Raiders

Gruden is a clown but if he sees something in McGloin, then bring him on. He worked some magic with gannon and McGloin doesn't look much different. Actually looks kinda like Brees back there with no experience.

 

[lod01]

Yup. The team has completely lost focus. Penalties are up. Turnovers are up.

Adios Señor Allen

Yea, I think Allen is gone as well. Just 3 weeks ago I thought he was safe, but things have fallen apart the past 3 weeks. Next week won't be any better facing Manning. Manning may go for a record 10 TD passes in one game.

He will stat whore to a minimum on 266 yards. That we know for sure.

 

[32 Counter Pass]

Yup. The team has completely lost focus. Penalties are up. Turnovers are up.

Adios Señor Allen

Say Adios Señor Reggie too.

That would be very surpising. And a very bad omen for the Raiders future.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

Yup. The team has completely lost focus. Penalties are up. Turnovers are up.

Adios Señor Allen

Say Adios Señor Reggie too.

That would be very surpising. And a very bad omen for the Raiders future.

I agree it would be surprising. But not so much a bad omen. After this season, what do we know for sure about the building blocks of this team? If we change Allen out, and most likely draft a QB, what kind of coach is willing to ascend to Reggie's omnipotent role as GM? Not many with any kind of pedigree any less rawer than Allen anyway.

I put realistically Reggie staying at 80/20 and Allen staying at 20/80. That said, if a Chucky would require a Bruce Allen type or whoever he said he needed to be his GM, I think we have to entertain the idea of a complete regime change. Allen's firing would just be buying another year for Reggie till he probably gets axed at the end of 2014. Mark Davis should expect more out his new regime two years in. We knew this season would be a struggle, but what momentum do you see to salvage any of it? I'm sure there is some, but at some point, you need to consider scrapping it all and starting over. And be brave enough to do it, while being mocked as the same old dysfunctional Raiders.

Having said that, I think Reggie is safe.

 

[RaiderBones]

OAKLAND RAIDERS‏@RAIDERS2h

Head Coach Dennis Allen has named @TerrellePryor the starting quarterback for Sunday's season finale vs Denver.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

What a #### show. We need leaders most of all. I'm not sure we have one

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Gruden is a blowhard windbag. He might be able to tutor his successor, but he's not the long term answer. But at least he has passion and should bring a spark

 

[32 Counter Pass]

But not so much a bad omen. Obviously, I disagree. Dismissing Reggie would be the first sign that Davis could evolve into a meddlesome owner. How has that worked for the Cowboys? The Browns? The Redskins? He has been preaching patience and has been willing to admit what he doesn't know. Even as recently as a December 11 interview: http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2013/12/11/mark-davis-on-reggie-mckenzie-and-dennis-allen-if-youre-committed-to-something-you-have-to-be-patient-with-it/

After this season, what do we know for sure about the building blocks of this team?

​And exactly what players on this roster would you consider building blocks? I consider Velhdeer, Wiz, Houston and Branch the only players that I would label building blocks. And Branch was hurt all year. The general consensus is that you cannot make a proper evaluation of a draft class for three years. The fact that Hayden and Watkins were injured slows that process. Sio looks like a developing star, and Rivera and McGee have flash ability to play in this league.

If we change Allen out, and most likely draft a QB, what kind of coach is willing to ascend to Reggie's omnipotent role as GM?

​I am not sure what you mean here. Ascend would imply the the coach would be above the GM in the power structure. Maybe you meant acquiesce? I have never had the impression that Reggie is ruling the team with an iron fist. Reggie and DA have said time and again that they are on the same page in regard to personnel moves.

Mark Davis should expect more out his new regime two years in.

No he shouldn't. And if you read that blog linked above he seems to say this. When Reggie was hired this team was devoid of talent, lack draft choices, and this past year had more dead cap space than active players. No team has ever been successful with that equation. No Team.

 

[Tool]

So much for the Mcgloin experiment...

Oakland Raiders head coach Dennis Allen said QB Terrelle Pryor will be the starting quarterback Week 17.

 

[lod01]

So much for the Mcgloin experiment...

Oakland Raiders head coach Dennis Allen said QB Terrelle Pryor will be the starting quarterback Week 17.

Meaningless. They just want to see if the guy has learned anything while watching a real QB play. He will drop back, see his primary covered and run as usual. The guy is untrainable. They said it was planned to get him in before the end of the season.

 

[Tool]

So much for the Mcgloin experiment...

Oakland Raiders head coach Dennis Allen said QB Terrelle Pryor will be the starting quarterback Week 17.

Meaningless. They just want to see if the guy has learned anything while watching a real QB play. He will drop back, see his primary covered and run as usual. The guy is untrainable. They said it was planned to get him in before the end of the season.

So is there any chance Oakland passes on a QB in the 1st round and Mcgloin can compete and/or win the starting job next year?

 

[lod01]

So much for the Mcgloin experiment...

Oakland Raiders head coach Dennis Allen said QB Terrelle Pryor will be the starting quarterback Week 17.

Meaningless. They just want to see if the guy has learned anything while watching a real QB play. He will drop back, see his primary covered and run as usual. The guy is untrainable. They said it was planned to get him in before the end of the season.

So is there any chance Oakland passes on a QB in the 1st round and Mcgloin can compete and/or win the starting job next year?

Nope. They have a tough decision. I doubt they go QB. Too many holes on D. The QBs are just not 1st rd worthy at their pick. Al's dead.

 

[32 Counter Pass]

My very early take is that the Raiders would be better served waiting on QB. I think guys like Fales and Murray could be there in the second round. These are guys that have as much upside as the guys being mentioned at the top of the 1st round IMO.

McGloin has flashed but as his body of work grows it has become clear that he has very poor decision making at times. In the Chargers game I saw him try to force the ball in when he had a receiver open at a shorter distance.

 

[Ed Wood]

So much for the Mcgloin experiment...

Oakland Raiders head coach Dennis Allen said QB Terrelle Pryor will be the starting quarterback Week 17.

Meaningless. They just want to see if the guy has learned anything while watching a real QB play. He will drop back, see his primary covered and run as usual. The guy is untrainable. They said it was planned to get him in before the end of the season.

Wonder if the Pryor call came from Davis (like the previous Pryor call).

I don't think Pryor is "untrainable." Far from it. He's made a lot of strides. Now, of course, it's too late to tell from one more game whether he's the answer. The all-knowing Allen ruined any chance of that by thinking he could save his hide with a more traditional QB for six weeks.

Anyway, back to Pryor. He was playing well until the 10 sacks he took in KC. Hasn't been the same since then and, yes, he tucks it runs way too quickly (much quicker than he did before KC). Maybe now he's beyond saving. But I don't think so. Pryor played fairly well in Denver. Hope he plays as well this Sunday. Can't expect him to play better, I don't think, not after being on the bench for six weeks.

If they don't think they have the QB answer on the roster, it'll be interesting to see what Reggie does. I'm fairly confident it won't be the right thing...

 

[Bruno2]

Funny how fast opinions change. Before the start of the season the majority us expected a down year due to all the cap space issues and the lack of talent. Most of us were willing to give DA and McKenzie 3 years to turn things around before calling for their heads.

We saw a glimmer of hope early in the season when Pryor flashed his athletic ability and the defense was playing decent. But that didn't last long as the reality set in that the Raiders are so devoid of talent and leadership. We knew this year was a "throw away" year.

What concerns me is I don't see any young talent brought in by McKenzie making a difference on the team. Some can say Sio but if that's all, that's clearly not enough. I thought the Hayden pick was a head scratcher from the beginning and just never sat well with me. Burning a 1st on a guy who almost died and hadn't played for a year was a highly questionable move in my opinion. And Watkins, well I knew nothing about him but if he can stay healthy he will help solidify the OL, but overall I think Reggie's first draft with picks to make was a poor one. All we can hope is this off season he makes all the right moves and the team shows some progress in the talent and leadership departments.

 

[Vision6]

Allen lost the team when he benched Pryor. It was an ugly and desperate move.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Pryor is not the answer. Never has been. We should trade down for whatever bonus picks we can get and take a qb around the 3rd round.

 

[Garrett]

Going into this season, what game did you strongly feel Oakland would win that they ended up losing?

 

[joey]

Going into this season, what game did you strongly feel Oakland would win that they ended up losing?

Yeah. I took the Under on the Raiders this year (5 1/2 wins) cuz I couldn't count more than 5 games they could win. Massive cost cutting off-season combined with a miserable preseason. I think it was the early season promise that had many fans, myself included, thinking that maybe I was a little wrong on the Raiders being a lock to be a bottom 5 team this year. In the end, my instinct was right, but it was the early season spark that probably lead most to be more disappointed than expected after this season.

 

[Raider Nation]

ALAMEDA, Calif. (AP) — For an organization seeking to rebuild through the draft, the Oakland Raiders have struggled to find impact players in the first two drafts under general manager Reggie McKenzie.Whether because of injuries, a lack of enough premium picks or bad decisions, the Raiders have gotten only one starter from the last two grab bags.

Of the 16 players taken in McKenzie's first two draft classes, five are no longer with the organization, three are on season-ending injured reserve, and most of the others are struggling to get on the field.

With the organization hampered by bad contracts from departed players that are still eating up salary cap space, the misses in the draft are more notable, a clear factor in another disappointing season in Oakland.

"Sometimes things don't work out," coach Dennis Allen said. "Sometimes mistakes are made. But, I'm very confident in Reggie McKenzie and the personnel staff of being able to evaluate football players: quarterbacks, offensive linemen, defensive lineman. I'm very confident in his ability to do that. I'm very confident in our ability as a coaching staff to do that."

Allen said it is far too early to judge this year's draft class, which has been mostly underwhelming from the top on down. The biggest disappointments have been first-round cornerback D.J. Hayden, who struggled before going on IR, and fourth-round quarterback Tyler Wilson, who spent most of the year on the practice squad before being signed by Tennessee last week.

Sixth-round running back Latavius Murray has also missed the entire season with an ankle injury.

McKenzie and the Raiders have had much greater success finding productive undrafted free agents, with the most notable being receiver Rod Streater and quarterback Matt McGloin.

But with little cap room to sign free agents, the Raiders could ill afford to miss on their top pick. They traded down nine spots to take Hayden 12th overall, despite a near-fatal heart injury that cut short his final season in college.

Hayden missed most of the offseason program and was not allowed to partake in contact for much of training camp because of the injury. When he did play, he struggled keeping up physically with NFL receivers and allowed opposing quarterbacks to have a 110 passer rating when throwing in his direction, according to Pro Football Focus.

After allowing two touchdowns on four passes against Philadelphia on Nov. 3, Hayden hurt his groin in practice and was shut down for the season.

"Unfortunately some of these injuries have limited what some of these guys can do," Allen said.

By trading down, the Raiders got an additional second-round pick they used on offensive tackle Menelik Watson, who had played only two seasons of organized football. Watson also missed much of training camp and the start of the season with injuries and is mostly being used in six-linemen formations.

The highlights from the draft were third-round linebacker Sio Moore, who has been a starter all season and has 3½ sacks, and sixth-round tight end Mychal Rivera, who has 36 catches for 384 yards and four touchdowns. Sixth-round defensive lineman Stacy McGee has also shown promise.

Allen said he believes some of these rookies will be part of the nucleus of the organization when it ends a run of 11 straight non-winning seasons.

"It's not a huge percentage where those guys come in and make a huge impact early in their career," Allen said. "Obviously, you know about the ones that do, but rookies generally don't make a huge impact in their first year. But there's a lot of things that we see in these guys that we can develop where they can get better, where they can be the backbone of our team moving forward."

McKenzie's first draft class has produced even less, although he was hampered by not having a pick until 95th overall at the end of the third round.

His first pick, offensive lineman Tony Bergstrom, played sparingly as a rookie and has spent all of this season on injured reserve. The most productive player from that class was fourth-round linebacker Miles Burris, who started 15 games as a rookie but missed the first 10 games this season with a knee injury. He has played only 30 defensive snaps since his return.

Three of the six players are no longer with the team. Fifth-round defensive lineman Jack Crawford has played 126 defensive snaps this season and has yet to make a sack in his career.

For you guys who have confidence in Reggie, my question is.... based on what?

 

[RaiderBones]

ALAMEDA, Calif. (AP) — For an organization seeking to rebuild through the draft, the Oakland Raiders have struggled to find impact players in the first two drafts under general manager Reggie McKenzie.Whether because of injuries, a lack of enough premium picks or bad decisions, the Raiders have gotten only one starter from the last two grab bags.

Of the 16 players taken in McKenzie's first two draft classes, five are no longer with the organization, three are on season-ending injured reserve, and most of the others are struggling to get on the field.

With the organization hampered by bad contracts from departed players that are still eating up salary cap space, the misses in the draft are more notable, a clear factor in another disappointing season in Oakland.

"Sometimes things don't work out," coach Dennis Allen said. "Sometimes mistakes are made. But, I'm very confident in Reggie McKenzie and the personnel staff of being able to evaluate football players: quarterbacks, offensive linemen, defensive lineman. I'm very confident in his ability to do that. I'm very confident in our ability as a coaching staff to do that."

Allen said it is far too early to judge this year's draft class, which has been mostly underwhelming from the top on down. The biggest disappointments have been first-round cornerback D.J. Hayden, who struggled before going on IR, and fourth-round quarterback Tyler Wilson, who spent most of the year on the practice squad before being signed by Tennessee last week.

Sixth-round running back Latavius Murray has also missed the entire season with an ankle injury.

McKenzie and the Raiders have had much greater success finding productive undrafted free agents, with the most notable being receiver Rod Streater and quarterback Matt McGloin.

But with little cap room to sign free agents, the Raiders could ill afford to miss on their top pick. They traded down nine spots to take Hayden 12th overall, despite a near-fatal heart injury that cut short his final season in college.

Hayden missed most of the offseason program and was not allowed to partake in contact for much of training camp because of the injury. When he did play, he struggled keeping up physically with NFL receivers and allowed opposing quarterbacks to have a 110 passer rating when throwing in his direction, according to Pro Football Focus.

After allowing two touchdowns on four passes against Philadelphia on Nov. 3, Hayden hurt his groin in practice and was shut down for the season.

"Unfortunately some of these injuries have limited what some of these guys can do," Allen said.

By trading down, the Raiders got an additional second-round pick they used on offensive tackle Menelik Watson, who had played only two seasons of organized football. Watson also missed much of training camp and the start of the season with injuries and is mostly being used in six-linemen formations.

The highlights from the draft were third-round linebacker Sio Moore, who has been a starter all season and has 3½ sacks, and sixth-round tight end Mychal Rivera, who has 36 catches for 384 yards and four touchdowns. Sixth-round defensive lineman Stacy McGee has also shown promise.

Allen said he believes some of these rookies will be part of the nucleus of the organization when it ends a run of 11 straight non-winning seasons.

"It's not a huge percentage where those guys come in and make a huge impact early in their career," Allen said. "Obviously, you know about the ones that do, but rookies generally don't make a huge impact in their first year. But there's a lot of things that we see in these guys that we can develop where they can get better, where they can be the backbone of our team moving forward."

McKenzie's first draft class has produced even less, although he was hampered by not having a pick until 95th overall at the end of the third round.

His first pick, offensive lineman Tony Bergstrom, played sparingly as a rookie and has spent all of this season on injured reserve. The most productive player from that class was fourth-round linebacker Miles Burris, who started 15 games as a rookie but missed the first 10 games this season with a knee injury. He has played only 30 defensive snaps since his return.

Three of the six players are no longer with the team. Fifth-round defensive lineman Jack Crawford has played 126 defensive snaps this season and has yet to make a sack in his career.

For you guys who have confidence in Reggie, my question is.... based on what?

I admit I'm starting to lose faith in Reggie. One of the Raiders bigger needs in the draft was DL. I wanted Star Lotulelei or Sheldon Richardson. Instead Reggie drafts D.J. Hayden. Both Sheldon and Star were drafted the next two picks after D.J. Hayden. Both Star and Sheldon are playing good and both would have been a nice addition to the Raiders DL.

 

[Raider Nation]

I haven't seen much of Richardson (watching the Jets makes my head hurt) but Lotulelei is killing it with the Panthers.

 

[RaiderBones]

I haven't seen much of Richardson (watching the Jets makes my head hurt) but Lotulelei is killing it with the Panthers.

There's no crying in football but....

 

[32 Counter Pass]

ALAMEDA, Calif. (AP) — For an organization seeking to rebuild through the draft, the Oakland Raiders have struggled to find impact players in the first two drafts under general manager Reggie McKenzie.Whether because of injuries, a lack of enough premium picks or bad decisions, the Raiders have gotten only one starter from the last two grab bags.

Of the 16 players taken in McKenzie's first two draft classes, five are no longer with the organization, three are on season-ending injured reserve, and most of the others are struggling to get on the field.

With the organization hampered by bad contracts from departed players that are still eating up salary cap space, the misses in the draft are more notable, a clear factor in another disappointing season in Oakland.

"Sometimes things don't work out," coach Dennis Allen said. "Sometimes mistakes are made. But, I'm very confident in Reggie McKenzie and the personnel staff of being able to evaluate football players: quarterbacks, offensive linemen, defensive lineman. I'm very confident in his ability to do that. I'm very confident in our ability as a coaching staff to do that."

Allen said it is far too early to judge this year's draft class, which has been mostly underwhelming from the top on down. The biggest disappointments have been first-round cornerback D.J. Hayden, who struggled before going on IR, and fourth-round quarterback Tyler Wilson, who spent most of the year on the practice squad before being signed by Tennessee last week.

Sixth-round running back Latavius Murray has also missed the entire season with an ankle injury.

McKenzie and the Raiders have had much greater success finding productive undrafted free agents, with the most notable being receiver Rod Streater and quarterback Matt McGloin.

But with little cap room to sign free agents, the Raiders could ill afford to miss on their top pick. They traded down nine spots to take Hayden 12th overall, despite a near-fatal heart injury that cut short his final season in college.

Hayden missed most of the offseason program and was not allowed to partake in contact for much of training camp because of the injury. When he did play, he struggled keeping up physically with NFL receivers and allowed opposing quarterbacks to have a 110 passer rating when throwing in his direction, according to Pro Football Focus.

After allowing two touchdowns on four passes against Philadelphia on Nov. 3, Hayden hurt his groin in practice and was shut down for the season.

"Unfortunately some of these injuries have limited what some of these guys can do," Allen said.

By trading down, the Raiders got an additional second-round pick they used on offensive tackle Menelik Watson, who had played only two seasons of organized football. Watson also missed much of training camp and the start of the season with injuries and is mostly being used in six-linemen formations.

The highlights from the draft were third-round linebacker Sio Moore, who has been a starter all season and has 3½ sacks, and sixth-round tight end Mychal Rivera, who has 36 catches for 384 yards and four touchdowns. Sixth-round defensive lineman Stacy McGee has also shown promise.

Allen said he believes some of these rookies will be part of the nucleus of the organization when it ends a run of 11 straight non-winning seasons.

"It's not a huge percentage where those guys come in and make a huge impact early in their career," Allen said. "Obviously, you know about the ones that do, but rookies generally don't make a huge impact in their first year. But there's a lot of things that we see in these guys that we can develop where they can get better, where they can be the backbone of our team moving forward."

McKenzie's first draft class has produced even less, although he was hampered by not having a pick until 95th overall at the end of the third round.

His first pick, offensive lineman Tony Bergstrom, played sparingly as a rookie and has spent all of this season on injured reserve. The most productive player from that class was fourth-round linebacker Miles Burris, who started 15 games as a rookie but missed the first 10 games this season with a knee injury. He has played only 30 defensive snaps since his return.

Three of the six players are no longer with the team. Fifth-round defensive lineman Jack Crawford has played 126 defensive snaps this season and has yet to make a sack in his career.

For you guys who have confidence in Reggie, my question is.... based on what?

I admit I'm starting to lose faith in Reggie. One of the Raiders bigger needs in the draft was DL. I wanted Star Lotulelei or Sheldon Richardson. Instead Reggie drafts D.J. Hayden. Both Sheldon and Star were drafted the next two picks after D.J. Hayden. Both Star and Sheldon are playing good and both would have been a nice addition to the Raiders DL.

For me it isn't as much a matter of confidence in Reggie as much as trying to avoid a merry-go-round of constant changes in GM and HC. We KNOW for a fact that is not a recipe for success. In my mind Reggie has had 1 draft and the jury is still out. You cannot judge a draft in 1 year. Period.

You seem to want to completely ignore the fact that Reggie's first draft was void of top picks. He also had to deal with the worst cap situation in the NFL, severely handicapping his ability to sign players. Given the limited resources he still managed to sign enough FAs last year to improve the defense (until the lack of depth caught up to them). And Reggie has a very good job find FAs at the college level.

All of that said, 2014 will be a make or break season for Reggie..

 

[Bob Magaw]

Well, we don't have a lot of talent, but we make up for it by being a really stupid team.

and injured a lot!

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I have Richardson on my idp team. He's a stud.

 

[RaiderBones]

ALAMEDA, Calif. (AP) — For an organization seeking to rebuild through the draft, the Oakland Raiders have struggled to find impact players in the first two drafts under general manager Reggie McKenzie.Whether because of injuries, a lack of enough premium picks or bad decisions, the Raiders have gotten only one starter from the last two grab bags.

Of the 16 players taken in McKenzie's first two draft classes, five are no longer with the organization, three are on season-ending injured reserve, and most of the others are struggling to get on the field.

With the organization hampered by bad contracts from departed players that are still eating up salary cap space, the misses in the draft are more notable, a clear factor in another disappointing season in Oakland.

"Sometimes things don't work out," coach Dennis Allen said. "Sometimes mistakes are made. But, I'm very confident in Reggie McKenzie and the personnel staff of being able to evaluate football players: quarterbacks, offensive linemen, defensive lineman. I'm very confident in his ability to do that. I'm very confident in our ability as a coaching staff to do that."

Allen said it is far too early to judge this year's draft class, which has been mostly underwhelming from the top on down. The biggest disappointments have been first-round cornerback D.J. Hayden, who struggled before going on IR, and fourth-round quarterback Tyler Wilson, who spent most of the year on the practice squad before being signed by Tennessee last week.

Sixth-round running back Latavius Murray has also missed the entire season with an ankle injury.

McKenzie and the Raiders have had much greater success finding productive undrafted free agents, with the most notable being receiver Rod Streater and quarterback Matt McGloin.

But with little cap room to sign free agents, the Raiders could ill afford to miss on their top pick. They traded down nine spots to take Hayden 12th overall, despite a near-fatal heart injury that cut short his final season in college.

Hayden missed most of the offseason program and was not allowed to partake in contact for much of training camp because of the injury. When he did play, he struggled keeping up physically with NFL receivers and allowed opposing quarterbacks to have a 110 passer rating when throwing in his direction, according to Pro Football Focus.

After allowing two touchdowns on four passes against Philadelphia on Nov. 3, Hayden hurt his groin in practice and was shut down for the season.

"Unfortunately some of these injuries have limited what some of these guys can do," Allen said.

By trading down, the Raiders got an additional second-round pick they used on offensive tackle Menelik Watson, who had played only two seasons of organized football. Watson also missed much of training camp and the start of the season with injuries and is mostly being used in six-linemen formations.

The highlights from the draft were third-round linebacker Sio Moore, who has been a starter all season and has 3½ sacks, and sixth-round tight end Mychal Rivera, who has 36 catches for 384 yards and four touchdowns. Sixth-round defensive lineman Stacy McGee has also shown promise.

Allen said he believes some of these rookies will be part of the nucleus of the organization when it ends a run of 11 straight non-winning seasons.

"It's not a huge percentage where those guys come in and make a huge impact early in their career," Allen said. "Obviously, you know about the ones that do, but rookies generally don't make a huge impact in their first year. But there's a lot of things that we see in these guys that we can develop where they can get better, where they can be the backbone of our team moving forward."

McKenzie's first draft class has produced even less, although he was hampered by not having a pick until 95th overall at the end of the third round.

His first pick, offensive lineman Tony Bergstrom, played sparingly as a rookie and has spent all of this season on injured reserve. The most productive player from that class was fourth-round linebacker Miles Burris, who started 15 games as a rookie but missed the first 10 games this season with a knee injury. He has played only 30 defensive snaps since his return.

Three of the six players are no longer with the team. Fifth-round defensive lineman Jack Crawford has played 126 defensive snaps this season and has yet to make a sack in his career.

For you guys who have confidence in Reggie, my question is.... based on what?

I admit I'm starting to lose faith in Reggie. One of the Raiders bigger needs in the draft was DL. I wanted Star Lotulelei or Sheldon Richardson. Instead Reggie drafts D.J. Hayden. Both Sheldon and Star were drafted the next two picks after D.J. Hayden. Both Star and Sheldon are playing good and both would have been a nice addition to the Raiders DL.

For me it isn't as much a matter of confidence in Reggie as much as trying to avoid a merry-go-round of constant changes in GM and HC. We KNOW for a fact that is not a recipe for success. In my mind Reggie has had 1 draft and the jury is still out. You cannot judge a draft in 1 year. Period.

You seem to want to completely ignore the fact that Reggie's first draft was void of top picks. He also had to deal with the worst cap situation in the NFL, severely handicapping his ability to sign players. Given the limited resources he still managed to sign enough FAs last year to improve the defense (until the lack of depth caught up to them). And Reggie has a very good job find FAs at the college level.

All of that said, 2014 will be a make or break season for Reggie..

I have actually been one of Reggie's bigger supporters. I just wasn't a big fan of the D.J. Hayden pick when DL was a bigger need and two very good DL were available in Star and Shelton. All I want is to start winning and I hope Reggie gets us there this next season. With a lot of cap space and what will probably be a top 5 pick things should start looking up next season.

 

[Raider Nation]

Each week brings more embarrassment than the week before.

 

[Raider Nation]

If Allen was even on the fence entering this game, he just got pushed over it. We aren't even competitive. Embarrassing.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

Open letter to Mark Davis:

Dear Mark,

Please don't accept this latest debacle as the sort of thing you should stomach and expect at the end of year two of a complete rebuild. Do it right and fix it all the way. No time for halvsie solutions. Throw em both out on their keisters, and take the whole lot of their minions with them. Time for a new start.

 

[joey]

Gruden and Bruce Allen?

 

[Raiderfan32904]

if they'll have us, yes

 

[massraider]

We have 3rd pick?

 

[Raider Nation]

We have 3rd pick?

1) HOU

2) STL

3) JAX

4) CLE

5) OAK

 

[Raider Nation]

How does Bortles look in black?

 

[ICON211]

We have 3rd pick?

1) HOU

2) STL

3) JAX

4) CLE

5) OAK

Really? How the hell did that happen? I know if the season ended last week Raiders would have picked 3. Guess tie breakers changed.

 

[Faust]

Dennis Allen, GM could return to Oakland Raiders in '14

By Gregg Rosenthal

Around The League Editor

After more than a decade of near-constant overhaul, the Oakland Raiders could be favoring some stability this offseason.

NFL Media columnist Michael Silver reported Sunday that owner Mark Davis has given both Raiders general manager Reggie McKenzie and coach Dennis Allen signals this week that he is leaning toward keeping them in 2014.

Sources familiar with Davis' thinking note to Silver that an embarrassing loss to the Denver Broncos on Sunday could change things.

Silver, who reported the news on NFL Network's "NFL GameDay Morning," added that if Davis could convince former coach Jon Gruden to return to Oakland -- something Davis and Gruden have discussed -- the Raiders owner would get rid of Allen and McKenzie in order to give Gruden full control. However, Silver said that Gruden's return to the Raiders is "not likely to happen," as the Super Bowl XXXVII-winning coach strongly is leaning toward staying with ESPN.

Allen is 8-23 in two seasons as Raiders coach. Oakland has been in the middle of a massive rebuild after purging a lot of poor contracts. We'd argue that Allen has done a good job this season, considering the talent on the roster.

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