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**2015 MLB Season Thread: This is how the chapter ends (1 Viewer)

Yankees need to can Joe Girardi. The teams' win total has been in decline pretty much every season since his second year at the helm, they haven't even made it to a division series since 2012. Enough is enough. This is the Yankees we're talking about, the gold standard in American professional sports. 85 win seasons aren't going to do it.

Sincerely,

Nationals fans

 
It's still a little early, but a good look at how League Champ business looks. But I wanted to show the totals, with Cubs included.

CHC: 31%

KCR: 13%

NYM: 12%

HOU: 11%

TEX: 11%

STL: 7%

LAD: 7%

PIT: 6%

TOR: 2%

CHI on pace to potentially be the biggest WS Champ on record ('04 Red Sox).

TOR will grow more than the other %-wise.

STL won't do much until WS Champ with their recent history.

PIT surprisingly small to us, but may get a big push if they beat CHI.

Overall, all markets are considering solid...no MIA, LAA, OAK, ATL, TB, etc.

 
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gump said:
It's still a little early, but a good look at how League Champ business looks. But I wanted to show the totals, with Cubs included.

CHC: 31%

KCR: 13%

NYM: 12%

HOU: 11%

TEX: 11%

STL: 7%

LAD: 7%

PIT: 6%

TOR: 2%

CHI on pace to potentially be the biggest WS Champ on record ('04 Red Sox).

TOR will grow more than the other %-wise.

STL won't do much until WS Champ with their recent history.

PIT surprisingly small to us, but may get a big push if they beat CHI.

Overall, all markets are considering solid...no MIA, LAA, OAK, ATL, TB, etc.
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Is this US business or something because I don't believe the Toronto number at all. It is the largest market in the league. For instance, Fox blew loads over 7.5 million viewers last night. Toronto averaged 1.5 million this year for regular season games in a country with a 10th of the population.

 
Northern Voice said:
gump said:
It's still a little early, but a good look at how League Champ business looks. But I wanted to show the totals, with Cubs included.

CHC: 31%

KCR: 13%

NYM: 12%

HOU: 11%

TEX: 11%

STL: 7%

LAD: 7%

PIT: 6%

TOR: 2%

CHI on pace to potentially be the biggest WS Champ on record ('04 Red Sox).

TOR will grow more than the other %-wise.

STL won't do much until WS Champ with their recent history.

PIT surprisingly small to us, but may get a big push if they beat CHI.

Overall, all markets are considering solid...no MIA, LAA, OAK, ATL, TB, etc.
Click to expand...
Is this US business or something because I don't believe the Toronto number at all. It is the largest market in the league.For instance, Fox blew loads over 7.5 million viewers last night. Toronto averaged 1.5 million this year for regular season games in a country with a 10th of the population.
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It's US and CA, but this deadline was for the overnight pickups around the home city.

Obviously TOR's market is really spread out...hence the note about it growing the most. Orders shipping to arrive the next morning are still coming in.

I'd estimate they end up close to 10%...a pretty solid 'B' market.

 
Doctor Detroit said:
Northern Voice said:
the moops said:
Northern Voice said:
I don't believe the Toronto number at all. It is the largest market in the league.
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what means this?
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It's the largest market for TV viewership, and it isn't close.
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Los Angeles and New York combined have more TVs than the entire country of Canada. Trying to convince us anyone in Saskatchewan cares about the Blue Jays is also kind of sweet and naive.
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They're not watching them. 100K watch the Dodgers http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-et-ct-dodgers-channel-tv-ratings-charter-20150610-story.html

1.5 million watch the Jays. And they do have fans coast to coast, you're just straight wrong on that one.

 
Just for DD http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/blue-jays-fever-sweeps-through-rider-nation-1.3255432- search "Saskatchewan Blue Jays" and you can find a bunch more (and some delightful nature articles)

If merchandise sales in Regina are any indication, Roughriders fans may be shelling out less green for their football team and spending it on Toronto Blue Jays gear.
That's the effect of the Toronto Blue Jays' recent AL East division title win, securing the team's first playoff birth in 22 years.

Jumpers in Regina are already on the bandwagon, according to local businesses in the city.

"We had a full section of Jays. [Now] we can't keep up with them. And we've been getting them every second day and as soon as they come, they're gone," said Moses Asres, manager at River City Sports in east Regina.

Asres said his store has nearly outsold all of its Blue Jays gear, a pretty big accomplishment, considering the store's location.

"Actually, we kind of switched from green to blue right now, and yeah, we can't keep up with that," he said. "This is the first year I've seen it selling like this. It's like it outsold almost everything in the store right now."

Another local business to turn blue is Flaman Fitness, an exercise equipment store in central Regina.

Its running man on a tread mill on the building's roof, usually decked out in Riders' green, switched jerseys last week. But that doesn't mean he doesn't still bleed green.

"You know, they've got a couple wins now and things are going good. But they've had their time. You know? And the Riders, every year they look good. This is just a bad year for them," said Brad Provick, a salesman at Flaman.

"It's been a long time for the Blue Jays, so I think it's time to get excited about it," he said.

"I would say I've had the blues much longer," said longtime Jays fan Matthew Taylor, who's given up on the Riders, for this year. "I went to, I think, the first four home games of the year and the labour day classic. And I'm like, 'nah, guess we'll see you guys next year.'"

While the Riders hunt for an elusive playoff spot, Taylor will be getting his fill with some autumn ball at the Blue Jays first playoff game next Thursday in Toronto, when they'll square off against either the Texas Rangers or the American League wildcard winner.

"My dad and I are actually going to the first two playoff games next week," he said.
Jerret Romanow said that just because he`s adding to his Jays gear collection this year, that doesn`t mean he's lost any love for the Roughriders.
"There's always next year or the year after. So I don't think anybody's giving up on them and throwing in the towel. But this time it's time for the Jays," he said.
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To be fair, the Blue Jays averaged about 70% of stadium capacity and were 8th overall in attendance this season. That's pretty good for being in the largest media market, especially without having to share it with another MLB team.

 
Drove down from Vancouver to Seattle a couple of years ago when the Jays were playing the M's. Couldn't believe how many Jays fans we passed on I-5, and then they easily outnumbered the M's fans at Safeco that night, even with King Felix on the mound.

 
Dickie Dunn said:
Drove down from Vancouver to Seattle a couple of years ago when the Jays were playing the M's. Couldn't believe how many Jays fans we passed on I-5, and then they easily outnumbered the M's fans at Safeco that night, even with King Felix on the mound.
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It's one thing the team has always done well. They go coast to coast every winter. Also a farm team in Vancouver, the now yearly sold out exhibition games in Montreal, and they've always had national TV and radio. They are the only team in Canada that everyone agrees with (even though Raptors are only Canadian team, they don't get much love outside of Toronto, Jays do).

 
Bruce Dickinson said:
To be fair, the Blue Jays averaged about 70% of stadium capacity and were 8th overall in attendance this season. That's pretty good for being in the largest media market, especially without having to share it with another MLB team.
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I hope a Royals fan isn't getting chirpy about attendance.

 
Billy Bats said:
fred_1_15301 said:
Billy Bats said:
fred_1_15301 said:
Billy Bats said:
Are the Pirates serious? Bunch of losers.
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BOOO.go away
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Pirates are going away sooner.
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Just a victim of bad luck. I'm still pretty happy with the 98 win season :shrug: The Phils are on their way up BTW.
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Great season. Just thought it was a little silly to throw at Jake there.

:lol: yea Phils. Now there's a bunch of losers. :X
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Just excuse me. I agree but I'm very bitter right now. I'll be back to normal in the morning.

 
Hard to hate Arrieta. Guy is a gamer and seems very classy as well. I don't think he'll give up more than 2 runs total this entire postseason. :shrug:

 
Northern Voice said:
Doctor Detroit said:
Northern Voice said:
the moops said:
Northern Voice said:
I don't believe the Toronto number at all. It is the largest market in the league.
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what means this?
Click to expand...
It's the largest market for TV viewership, and it isn't close.
Click to expand...
Los Angeles and New York combined have more TVs than the entire country of Canada. Trying to convince us anyone in Saskatchewan cares about the Blue Jays is also kind of sweet and naive.
Click to expand...
They're not watching them. 100K watch the Dodgers http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/envelope/cotown/la-et-ct-dodgers-channel-tv-ratings-charter-20150610-story.html

1.5 million watch the Jays. And they do have fans coast to coast, you're just straight wrong on that one.
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Dodgers are among the worst examples, they are among the worst TV markets in the U.S.

What you look for is the share, and the Dodgers 1.3 share stinks. Here is midseason data.

Toronto for the year averages 733k viewers per game, and 1.2 million over the last month, that's pretty good if the numbers are correct.

The channel is averaging 793,000 viewers for Blue Jays broadcasts this year, a 36% increase over 2014.
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But the share numbers seem to be skewed. 13.8 million households in Canada, and they are saying a 6.8 share is 266k. That should be households, but that math comes to 14.7 million households so I'm not sure if they counted stuff from Buffalo or Seattle or whatever.

7.4 million people in Toronto making it the 5th biggest in North America. New York has 20 million people and 7.5 million households, so they have more households than Toronto has people (total population and total viewers also not the same thing). The 2009 World Series which had the Yankees drew a 12 share and had 20 million viewers nationwide. New York TV Market drew a 36 share out of 7.5 million households, or about 7 million people.

So although I'll give you your due here, because these numbers are impressive, New York by itself is still at least Canada's equal when the Yankees are good. I'm not sure the Mets will attract nearly the following, but I would imagine a good 20+ share in NY for the NLDS or about 4 million viewers. So ease up on the "and it's not close stuff." :)

Good luck vs Texas.

 
BTW, the TV ratings have long been a sticking point in Toronto (for fans) because we see the massive, massive deals teams sign in the states that allow teams to flex payroll muscles. At the same time, we know Toronto has more viewers than these places and the value of the TV rights is worth as much or more (again, especially factoring in viewers across the country).

We also know that the company with the broadcast rights owns the team (and the stadium and everything else) and doesn't put near the equivalent of those huge TV deals into the Jays. Which is their prerogative, they can move money around as much as they want to show profits and losses as they see fit, but the Jays are clearly a cash cow.

This was all frustrating as hell when they were a mid-low payroll team, and that's likely why we're uptight about it as fans. Toronto is not a small market, it's one of the largest in North America, this team should be near the top in payroll every year, and now the fans have shown that if they are, they will be in attendance as well.

 
Northern Voice said:
BTW, the TV ratings have long been a sticking point in Toronto (for fans) because we see the massive, massive deals teams sign in the states that allow teams to flex payroll muscles. At the same time, we know Toronto has more viewers than these places and the value of the TV rights is worth as much or more (again, especially factoring in viewers across the country).

We also know that the company with the broadcast rights owns the team (and the stadium and everything else) and doesn't put near the equivalent of those huge TV deals into the Jays. Which is their prerogative, they can move money around as much as they want to show profits and losses as they see fit, but the Jays are clearly a cash cow.

This was all frustrating as hell when they were a mid-low payroll team, and that's likely why we're uptight about it as fans. Toronto is not a small market, it's one of the largest in North America, this team should be near the top in payroll every year, and now the fans have shown that if they are, they will be in attendance as well.
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the Leafs still suck

 
It's the 5th largest TV market, and the numbers say there is a audience for the product even when the team is so so (a 5 share two years ago proves that, a 5 in a U.S. market is top 10 by percentage). St Louis, Detroit, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Boston, SF are always good TV markets, KC pulled a crazy 13 share in their market this year which is great.

People don't understand what "small market means either." Tampa, Minnesota, and Cleveland are not small market teams. They are mid size, like Detroit and Seattle.

Large Market: NY, Chicago, Philadelphia, LA, Toronto, DC, SF, Boston

Medium: Atlanta, Detroit, Tampa, Seattle, Minnesota, Cleveland, Houston, Miami, Colorado

Small: Milwaukee, Cincinnati, Kansas City, San Diego, Baltimore, Oakland

Cincinnati might be able to be considered a medium market because of their draw regionally, they actually have a surprising presence in Indiana and elsewhere. Atlanta could be considered smaller than it's TV households because of the general indifference of that fan base to sports. The LA teams, Houston, and Phoenix are all weird fan bases who don't love their TVs, maybe because the weather is nice. Miami fans will show up if the team is REALLY good, but I'd say Arizona fans are much better in general.

But yeah if I'm a Jays fan and I compare the numbers to other cities, I'm asking why they aren't among the top ten salaried teams every single year.

 
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Did Pedro Martinez just say: "Pete Rose that's one guy I don't like, he really ####ed me?"

????????????????????????????

 
Doctor Detroit said:
It's the 5th largest TV market, and the numbers say there is a audience for the product even when the team is so so (a 5 share two years ago proves that, a 5 in a U.S. market is top 10 by percentage). St Louis, Detroit, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Boston, SF are always good TV markets, KC pulled a crazy 13 share in their market this year which is great.

People don't understand what "small market means either." Tampa, Minnesota, and Cleveland are not small market teams. They are mid size, like Detroit and Seattle.

Large Market: NY, Chicago, Philadelphia, LA, Toronto, DC, SF, Boston

Medium: Atlanta, Detroit, Tampa, Seattle, Minnesota, Cleveland, Houston, Miami, Colorado

Small: Milwaukee, Cincinnati, Kansas City, San Diego, Baltimore, Oakland

Cincinnati might be able to be considered a medium market because of their draw regionally, they actually have a surprising presence in Indiana and elsewhere. Atlanta could be considered smaller than it's TV households because of the general indifference of that fan base to sports. The LA teams, Houston, and Phoenix are all weird fan bases who don't love their TVs, maybe because the weather is nice. Miami fans will show up if the team is REALLY good, but I'd say Arizona fans are much better in general.

But yeah if I'm a Jays fan and I compare the numbers to other cities, I'm asking why they aren't among the top ten salaried teams every single year.
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GPJ will disagree but I don't know how you can say SF is large market and Oakland is small. They're the same media market . The Oaklands were among league leaders in attendance as recently as the early 90s. The stadium situation is unfortunate and both the city and club share the blame. The Giants were able to get their stadium built and have outmarketed the A's ever since. There's more potential revenue for Oakland than there is in Cincinnati or Milwaukee but the A's have to fight for it.

 
Eephus said:
Doctor Detroit said:
It's the 5th largest TV market, and the numbers say there is a audience for the product even when the team is so so (a 5 share two years ago proves that, a 5 in a U.S. market is top 10 by percentage). St Louis, Detroit, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Boston, SF are always good TV markets, KC pulled a crazy 13 share in their market this year which is great.

People don't understand what "small market means either." Tampa, Minnesota, and Cleveland are not small market teams. They are mid size, like Detroit and Seattle.

Large Market: NY, Chicago, Philadelphia, LA, Toronto, DC, SF, Boston

Medium: Atlanta, Detroit, Tampa, Seattle, Minnesota, Cleveland, Houston, Miami, Colorado

Small: Milwaukee, Cincinnati, Kansas City, San Diego, Baltimore, Oakland

Cincinnati might be able to be considered a medium market because of their draw regionally, they actually have a surprising presence in Indiana and elsewhere. Atlanta could be considered smaller than it's TV households because of the general indifference of that fan base to sports. The LA teams, Houston, and Phoenix are all weird fan bases who don't love their TVs, maybe because the weather is nice. Miami fans will show up if the team is REALLY good, but I'd say Arizona fans are much better in general.

But yeah if I'm a Jays fan and I compare the numbers to other cities, I'm asking why they aren't among the top ten salaried teams every single year.
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GPJ will disagree but I don't know how you can say SF is large market and Oakland is small. They're the same media market . The Oaklands were among league leaders in attendance as recently as the early 90s. The stadium situation is unfortunate and both the city and club share the blame. The Giants were able to get their stadium built and have outmarketed the A's ever since. There's more potential revenue for Oakland than there is in Cincinnati or Milwaukee but the A's have to fight for it.
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It goes to share of the market, Oakland is half the size SF and San Jose are. They might all be in the same media market, but the shares aren't the same. Baltimore and DC are the same metro area for example, it's the 4th biggest metro area in the U.S. Baltimore and DC TV markets are split however, DC being the 9th biggest and Baltimore being the 26th biggest. Baltimore has a smaller pool of people to draw from, even though they've been here 40+ years longer and have a more established fan base.

I'm exactly halfway between DC and Baltimore, and I get Baltimore TV but the share of fans for the Redskins for example, is probably 75%. I'd say the Orioles and Nats are about an een split, but Baltimore has the older fans while the Nats have the younger fans and people like me who moved here.

If Oakland was its own market, I think it would be around #30. SF would be low teens. I suppose San Jose would be the difference, but I'm not sure what that market prefers as far as baseball. Based on ratings and attendance, I'd say SF.

 
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Doctor Detroit said:
fred_1_15301 said:
Doctor Detroit said:
Doctor Detroit said:
Did Pedro Martinez just say: "Pete Rose that's one guy I don't like, he really ####ed me?"

????????????????????????????
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I listened to it four times, he said it! :lmao:
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I met Pete in Vegas and he seemed like a nice enough guy :shrug:
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fred_1_15301 said:
Doctor Detroit said:
Doctor Detroit said:
Did Pedro Martinez just say: "Pete Rose that's one guy I don't like, he really ####ed me?"

????????????????????????????
Click to expand...
I listened to it four times, he said it! :lmao:
Click to expand...
I met Pete in Vegas and he seemed like a nice enough guy :shrug:
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First time anyone ever said this IMHO.
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lol you're probably right but it's true. He's still a degenerate but was really nice to us.

 
Rose is a huge scumbag and apparently really ####ed Pedro Martinez in some way, at least according to him.

Did anyone else not hear that? I got some random twitter likes so I'm thinking I'm not crazy.

 
Doctor Detroit said:
Eephus said:
Doctor Detroit said:
It's the 5th largest TV market, and the numbers say there is a audience for the product even when the team is so so (a 5 share two years ago proves that, a 5 in a U.S. market is top 10 by percentage). St Louis, Detroit, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Boston, SF are always good TV markets, KC pulled a crazy 13 share in their market this year which is great.

People don't understand what "small market means either." Tampa, Minnesota, and Cleveland are not small market teams. They are mid size, like Detroit and Seattle.

Large Market: NY, Chicago, Philadelphia, LA, Toronto, DC, SF, Boston

Medium: Atlanta, Detroit, Tampa, Seattle, Minnesota, Cleveland, Houston, Miami, Colorado

Small: Milwaukee, Cincinnati, Kansas City, San Diego, Baltimore, Oakland

Cincinnati might be able to be considered a medium market because of their draw regionally, they actually have a surprising presence in Indiana and elsewhere. Atlanta could be considered smaller than it's TV households because of the general indifference of that fan base to sports. The LA teams, Houston, and Phoenix are all weird fan bases who don't love their TVs, maybe because the weather is nice. Miami fans will show up if the team is REALLY good, but I'd say Arizona fans are much better in general.

But yeah if I'm a Jays fan and I compare the numbers to other cities, I'm asking why they aren't among the top ten salaried teams every single year.
Click to expand...
GPJ will disagree but I don't know how you can say SF is large market and Oakland is small. They're the same media market . The Oaklands were among league leaders in attendance as recently as the early 90s. The stadium situation is unfortunate and both the city and club share the blame. The Giants were able to get their stadium built and have outmarketed the A's ever since. There's more potential revenue for Oakland than there is in Cincinnati or Milwaukee but the A's have to fight for it.
Click to expand...
It goes to share of the market, Oakland is half the size SF and San Jose are. They might all be in the same media market, but the shares aren't the same. Baltimore and DC are the same metro area for example, it's the 4th biggest metro area in the U.S. Baltimore and DC TV markets are split however, DC being the 9th biggest and Baltimore being the 26th biggest. Baltimore has a smaller pool of people to draw from, even though they've been here 40+ years longer and have a more established fan base. I'm exactly halfway between DC and Baltimore, and I get Baltimore TV but the share of fans for the Redskins for example, is probably 75%. I'd say the Orioles and Nats are about an een split, but Baltimore has the older fans while the Nats have the younger fans and people like me who moved here.

If Oakland was its own market, I think it would be around #30. SF would be low teens. I suppose San Jose would be the difference, but I'm not sure what that market prefers as far as baseball. Based on ratings and attendance, I'd say SF.
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Metro areas are nebulous. You left St. Louis out of your original list. The city and immediate suburbs are under 3M but they've traditionally drawn from a much larger area. They're small-mid market but higher revenue.

The SCOTUS has ruled that San Jose is Giants territory but Oakland has Sacramento within two hours driving distance depending on traffic. Metro Sacramento has a larger population than the metropolitan areas of several of the small market teams. Sacramento almost as large as metropolitan St.Louis FWIW. Like all two team markets, it's contested ground but the Giants have outmuscled the A's out of the AAA River Cats which won't hurt their marketing efforts in the area.

 
St Louis is a mid market team, I left them out because they are and have always been a regional team. Their sticky fingers go everywhere.

If DC and Baltimore weren't separate TV markets, DC would still draw a larger fan share because they have more of the market. It's not nebulous, it's just a numbers game. Jeff from NOVA is in the DC/Balt/Annapolis metro and he ain't driving in this ####ty traffic to Camden Yards after work on Wednesday. :shrug:

 
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Northern Voice said:
Dickie Dunn said:
Drove down from Vancouver to Seattle a couple of years ago when the Jays were playing the M's. Couldn't believe how many Jays fans we passed on I-5, and then they easily outnumbered the M's fans at Safeco that night, even with King Felix on the mound.
Click to expand...
It's one thing the team has always done well. They go coast to coast every winter. Also a farm team in Vancouver, the now yearly sold out exhibition games in Montreal, and they've always had national TV and radio. They are the only team in Canada that everyone agrees with (even though Raptors are only Canadian team, they don't get much love outside of Toronto, Jays do).
Click to expand...
That will change when the Expos come back.

 
Dickie Dunn said:
Northern Voice said:
Dickie Dunn said:
Drove down from Vancouver to Seattle a couple of years ago when the Jays were playing the M's. Couldn't believe how many Jays fans we passed on I-5, and then they easily outnumbered the M's fans at Safeco that night, even with King Felix on the mound.
Click to expand...
It's one thing the team has always done well. They go coast to coast every winter. Also a farm team in Vancouver, the now yearly sold out exhibition games in Montreal, and they've always had national TV and radio. They are the only team in Canada that everyone agrees with (even though Raptors are only Canadian team, they don't get much love outside of Toronto, Jays do).
Click to expand...
That will change when the Expos come back.
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The fact that Montreal fans have backed the Jays to the extent they have, including the exhibition games and the Jays being broadcast separately in Quebec in French speaks to how much that really is a baseball city. Toronto voted in favour of contraction/relocation more than once and they constantly fought over TV territories. I ####### love Montreal and have been lucky enough to get their a couple times a year for the past 5+ years for both work and pleasure, I really hope they do get their team back - a downtown stadium there could be incredible.

 
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