2016 Oakland Raiders thread (1 Viewer)

[massraider]

I love the Smith deal, but the secondary is still hanging an 'under construction' sign.

Until I hear that Casey Hayward is elsewhere, I would love him, or Boykin as a cheap option.  Weddle as well.  I expect a word from him tomorrow at the latest.

I wonder about giving Amerson an extension.  No extensions will happen until after the deal, but you looking at a lot of players that can be extended over the next few months.  Amerson, Autry, Murray, Rivera, not to mention Carr and Mack.  

 

[Chadstroma]

I love the Smith deal, but the secondary is still hanging an 'under construction' sign.

Until I hear that Casey Hayward is elsewhere, I would love him, or Boykin as a cheap option.  Weddle as well.  I expect a word from him tomorrow at the latest.

I wonder about giving Amerson an extension.  No extensions will happen until after the deal, but you looking at a lot of players that can be extended over the next few months.  Amerson, Autry, Murray, Rivera, not to mention Carr and Mack.  

Hayward is a zone guy no?

 

[massraider]

Hayward is a zone guy no?

Ya know, I thought he did both, and played slot and outside.  I'd pay him 6 mill a year, without thinking about it.  

He's an interesting one.  He fired his agent right around start of free agency, so couldn't sign a deal, but that 5 day window is up.  His market should crystallize soon.  

 

[Chadstroma]

Maybe one or two big signings (Weddle, Penn/OL) and then I think MacKenzie goes into bargain shopping/stop gap mode. Fill in a few more spots. I like the idea of extending Carr and Mack now to deals that are heavily front loaded. Use up the cap room we have now to make us even stronger and able to do what we want in FA and keeping our own players.

MacKenzie has proven a couple of things to me. 1) Above all, he is disciplined and a master at the cap game. 2) He has a plan 3) He is above average in talent evaluation. 

It feels damn good to see our team have some organization to it and be honestly feeling good about what is going on and not just hope for progress towards a winning season.

 

[Chadstroma]

I am trying to figure out how we would use Irvin, Mack and Aldon Smith assuming we re-sign him later in season. Would we see Mack at DE even more? 

 

[massraider]

Chargers signed Hayward.  3 year, 15 mill and change.  Good deal for them, I think.

 

[ICON211]

Chargers signed Hayward.  3 year, 15 mill and change.  Good deal for them, I think.

Looks real good for them.  Would love to have brought him in especially at that price.

 

[Hankmoody]

Disappointed at the lack of work on the secondary.  We need one more CB (preferably two with a slot guy) for depth/competition and 3 safeties.  I hate the idea of going into the draft with glaring needs and the temptation to reach for a guy that's not BPA.  I'd have preferred to overspend a little on McLeod structured like the others than having a donut so far.

 

[Chaka]

Disappointed at the lack of work on the secondary.  We need one more CB (preferably two with a slot guy) for depth/competition and 3 safeties.  I hate the idea of going into the draft with glaring needs and the temptation to reach for a guy that's not BPA.  I'd have preferred to overspend a little on McLeod structured like the others than having a donut so far.

I agree that they need more help in the secondary but I don't necessarily think it has to be at CB.  I want to see what happens with Weddel and R.Johnson before worrying about draft needs at this point.

 

[Hankmoody]

My point is I don't want to worry about "draft needs" at all.  Get needs solved now, draft the best guy on the board.  If we pass on Elliott to reach for a CB or God forbid a safety because we "need" one I'm going to be livid. 

 

[massraider]

Disappointed at the lack of work on the secondary.  We need one more CB (preferably two with a slot guy) for depth/competition and 3 safeties.  I hate the idea of going into the draft with glaring needs and the temptation to reach for a guy that's not BPA.  I'd have preferred to overspend a little on McLeod structured like the others than having a donut so far.

Free agency is a long way from done.  But I am disappointed to.  

I'd like another CB, but signing Smith gives us improvement at every CB spot.  We have a better CB1, (Smith) CB2 (Amerson), and CB3(Carrie).  Everyone slides down, and is better than the guy he replaces.  If Hayden is the 4th CB, and McGill and McDonald compete to steal his playing time, that's pretty solid.  I don't love Carrie or Hayden, but they both have staring experience, and are young and fast.  Can Carrie be a good slot?  I dunno, but he's better than Hayden/Thorpe.  I don't think we can understate the impact Smith can have on this secondary, and defense.  Smith just made Mack more dangerous.  

Safety, I'm with you.  But I dunno if I'd trade any of the signings we have made for Gipson, or McLeod.  Nice safeties, but none of them are irreplaceable.  If we sign Weddle, and draft one in first 3 rounds, it looks better.  I don't think you can expect a ton of draft currency or free agent dollar spent on 3 safeties.  It's just not realistic.  Having said that, if we draft two safeties back to back in rounds 2-3 or 3-4, I will be very, very happy.  

 

[massraider]

Clarity on Eric Weddle’s next destination coming this week


Posted by Mike Florio on March 13, 2016, 2:35 PM EDT

AP

With free agency firmly in phase two, safety Eric Weddle has moved to the top of the list of available talent. Later this week, more clarity about his next destination will emerge.

As noted by Michael Gehlken of the San Diego Union-Tribune, Weddle has four offers on the table. Per a source with knowledge of the situation, Weddle has decided to keep the identity of all interested teams secret.

Two of the offers are expected to be rejected without a counter, reducing the final field to two franchises. Apparently, Weddle’s discretion is aimed at ensuring fans and players on teams that are (or aren’t) in the hunt won’t react negatively toward that franchise (or, possibly, to him) once he chooses another destination.

Of course, that type of unusual secrecy will prompt some to suggest that, if Weddle isn’t naming the interested teams, one or more of them are fictitious, aimed at squeezing perhaps the one team that is interested. Regardless, an answer seems to be coming soon from the well-respect 30-year-old who has made it to three Pro Bowls and who has been named a first-team All Pro twice.

 

[Chaka]

My point is I don't want to worry about "draft needs" at all.  Get needs solved now, draft the best guy on the board.  If we pass on Elliott to reach for a CB or God forbid a safety because we "need" one I'm going to be livid. 

As I said I think you need to see what happens with Weddel and Johnson before worrying about the draft.

And lots.of people in here were livid at this time last year, now they are talking about naming their kids Reggie.

 

[Bruno2]

Seems like the secondary has never been Reggie's priority. Other than the Hayden pick and bringing in Woodson it's like he's just trying to patch holes where ever there's a leak, and got pretty lucky with Amerson. They weren't sure what they were going to get with him, but they were in dire need of anybody at that point in the season last year.

I see the same trend this year. Spend money in the trenches and let the pass rush over compensate for the secondary. The Smith signing was nice (and needed) but it's clear Reggie isn't going to break the bank in the defensive backfield anytime soon.

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Hopefully Vic Tafur's tweet may just be due to the Raiders working quietly (didn't see a lot of chatter about the Raiders pursuing Irvin) but really hope this is wrong and that we're not one of the two teams Weddle has received an offer from and which he won't counter. 


Vic Tafur 


 
✔‎@VicTafur



Eric Weddle remains on the #Raiders back-burner. No word yet on any of his potential four visits, including Alameda.


1:32 PM - 11 Mar 2016

 

[Hankmoody]

As I said I think you need to see what happens with Weddel and Johnson before worrying about the draft.

And lots.of people in here were livid at this time last year, now they are talking about naming their kids Reggie.

Fair enough, there's still quite a bit of time, and Weddle appears to be the one taking his time, not us/the market.  But with the money we have we should have been able to make a mid-level move at minimum.  Gipson, McLeod, Abdul-Quddus, Sendejo, Iloka - all would be good starting points.  We'd still need two more.

 

[joey]

Weddle was supposedly checking out the neighborhoods and schools this past weekend as part of his decision making process. I hope the constant rain in the Bay Area this weekend didn't turn him and the family off. 

 

[BustedKnuckles]

Weddle was supposedly checking out the neighborhoods and schools this past weekend as part of his decision making process. I hope the constant rain in the Bay Area this weekend didn't turn him and the family off. 

Real football players LOVE the rain 

 

[Bruno2]

Weddle was supposedly checking out the neighborhoods and schools this past weekend as part of his decision making process. I hope the constant rain in the Bay Area this weekend didn't turn him and the family off. 

He's been in California for years now, he knows they need the rain. They've been in severe drought conditions for awhile. 

 

[drewd_21]

Weddle "leaning" towards the Pats at this point.

http://nfltraderumors.co/nfl-rumors-dak-prescott-eric-weddle-draft-cowboys/

 

[Chaka]

Weddle "leaning" towards the Pats at this point.

http://nfltraderumors.co/nfl-rumors-dak-prescott-eric-weddle-draft-cowboys/

Bummer but can you blame him?

 

[drewd_21]

And it ends up being Baltimore 

 

[joey]

rats.

ETA: who's the next best safety available now? Rashad Johnson?

ETA2: also just goes to show that, around this time of year, never believe any rumors. Of course, he's rumored this morning to be going to the Pats and then he ends up with a team that there wasn't even a whisper about (as far as I saw in these threads, at least). High levels of ####e floating around out there these past few weeks...

 

[Chaka]

Just signed special teams ace/LB Daren Bates from the Rams.  Another win for Reggie and the Raiders.

 

[RaiderBones]

rats.

ETA: who's the next best safety available now? Rashad Johnson?

ETA2: also just goes to show that, around this time of year, never believe any rumors. Of course, he's rumored this morning to be going to the Pats and then he ends up with a team that there wasn't even a whisper about (as far as I saw in these threads, at least). High levels of ####e floating around out there these past few weeks...

It sounds like the Raiders are kicking the tires on Tony Jefferson. He is an RFA so the Cardinals could match any offer the Raiders make though.

 

[massraider]

Rashad Johnson

Tony Jerfferson (RFA)

Reggie Nelson

Walter Thurmond

David Bruton

Really, tho, when you have no safeties, any safety is an upgrade.  Reggie Nelson is 34 years old, but he's the best S out there.  One has to wonder how the Cards are letting Rashad and Tony walk.  Maybe the Cards think they are gonna get overpaid?

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Too bad about Weddle. You can't win them all but he was the best safety hitting the UFA market, IMHO. Nelson is the only guy left who I'm somewhat excited over -- he was terrific in tandem with Iloka in a split safety role but I am wary how he'll do without other strong help in the depp backfield. Last year may have been his "spent wad" year and he'll naturally come down after his pro bowl 8-pick season (5 of which came on a streaky stretch in weeks 10-14). But I'll take any help we can muster at the position.

I think Thurmond is too injury prone, and Bruton seems more like a backup/rotational/situational safety. Don't know too much about Rashad Johnson's play -- he seemed very overshadowed on the ARI def, and looks like the Raiders are more interested in the Cards' RFA Tony Jefferson.

 

[massraider]

Probably the pick that allowed Carr to fall to Oakland.  

 

[Bruno2]

Cleveland fans have had it rougher than us. I actually kinda feel bad for them. And by the looks of it, they are about to go through a similar rebuild as the Raiders did. It's gonna be another long 3-4 years for Cleveland fans. How ironic Hue will be a part of it.

 

[massraider]

Cleveland fans have had it rougher than us. 

Over 50 years, yes.  But I dunno if any team was lower than the Raiders, post-Hue and Carson.  

 

[massraider]

Bruton seems more like a backup/rotational/situational safety.

Yes, I think so too.

And we could use on of those.  

 

[Hankmoody]

Yes, I think so too.

And we could use on of those.  

Yep!

I'd be thrilled with Jefferson.  I've watched him play a lot.  He's not the most talented guy, but man is he a try-hard.  He's constantly going all out and throwing himself around.  Fun guy to watch.  Johnson I think is a bit more of a system guy, looked better because of who was around him and missed a lot of plays individually in space, but hey I'll still take him because he's better than the stiffs we had last year.

 

[Hankmoody]

Probably the pick that allowed Carr to fall to Oakland.  

Was that their reaction to drafting him or releasing him?

 

[joey]

Yep!

I'd be thrilled with Jefferson.  I've watched him play a lot.  He's not the most talented guy, but man is he a try-hard.  He's constantly going all out and throwing himself around.  Fun guy to watch.  Johnson I think is a bit more of a system guy, looked better because of who was around him and missed a lot of plays individually in space, but hey I'll still take him because he's better than the stiffs we had last year.

in that case, SIGN BOTH!



(man, we need some safeties in the house)

 

[Bruno2]

Over 50 years, yes.  But I dunno if any team was lower than the Raiders, post-Hue and Carson.  

I agree... My point being, it's gonna get a lot worse before it gets better for them. Unless they get lucky and find a QB of the future. I think Wentz and Goff are being over-hyped which is understandable this time of year.

 

[massraider]

Reggie Nelson coming in here on a two year deal makes a ton of sense.  You can just see Reggie (McKenzie) doing it.  He's clearly going to make less than Weddle.  Is he clearly going to be worse than Weddle this year?  No.  

I'm currently terrified about safety, but find it hard to believe Reggie would have let all his targets get away.  

If we wind up with Jefferson and Nelson for 7 mill in cap space this year, I might get Reggie's face tattoo'd on my narrow white ###.

 

[Autumn Wind]

One thing to note, and I'm not saying this is Reggie's thinking, is that nothing covers up for a subpar secondary like a great DL and LB corps.

 

[joey]

One thing to note, and I'm not saying this is Reggie's thinking, is that nothing covers up for a subpar secondary like a great DL and LB corps.

agreed. but that's what we've been kinda doing these past few years, and we've had an OK defense.

I think we'd all like to see the Raiders have a GREAT defense, like the Broncos, Cardinals, etc.  We're only a couple of safeties and a stud rookie CB (if we go that way) away from that be a very good possibility. Don't even get me dreaming about Aldon Smith straightening his act out and resigning with us. Yowza...

 

[massraider]

Mike Wallace, 2 years, 11.5 mill with Baltimore.

Man, I was interested, but was thinking 3-4 mill/year.  

Wallace has made a lot of money for one or two good years in PIT.

 

[32 Counter Pass]

agreed. but that's what we've been kinda doing these past few years, and we've had an OK defense.

I think we'd all like to see the Raiders have a GREAT defense, like the Broncos, Cardinals, etc.  We're only a couple of safeties and a stud rookie CB (if we go that way) away from that be a very good possibility. Don't even get me dreaming about Aldon Smith straightening his act out and resigning with us. Yowza...

You are half right. We have been trying this approach, but not with GREAT players (except KM). IMO the need for pass rushers is equal, or even greater, than the need for DBs. We lost Aldon Smith, Edward's status is uncertain, and Tuck retired, making pass rushers a huge need. The player I like the most in this draft to fill that need is Noah Spence. He tore the senior bowl a new one and offers an immediate upgrade in pass rush. Granted he comes with lots of baggage, but I am willing to overlook his past transgression as immaturity.  I also believe we have a strong staff and locker room that will keep him on the straight and narrow.

 

[massraider]

You are half right. We have been trying this approach, but not with GREAT players (except KM). IMO the need for pass rushers is equal, or even greater, than the need for DBs. We lost Aldon Smith, Edward's status is uncertain, and Tuck retired, making pass rushers a huge need. The player I like the most in this draft to fill that need is Noah Spence. He tore the senior bowl a new one and offers an immediate upgrade in pass rush. Granted he comes with lots of baggage, but I am willing to overlook his past transgression as immaturity.  I also believe we have a strong staff and locker room that will keep him on the straight and narrow.

I'm all for defense in this draft, but I might like Shaq Lawson, Sheldon Rankins, and maybe even Jon Bullard over Spence.  I'd probably take a top CB over him as well.  Just my own preference.  

I'd like to see what happens if Rankins, Hargeaves, Jackson III and Alexander were there at #14, which player they would take.  

We have edge rush.  interior pass rush seems like a nice need.  

 

[massraider]

By the way, how's this for a Raider-centric take on today's trade:

Pats trade Chandler, weakening their defense this year (good for OAK).

Cards bring on a potential massive salary in 2017, lessening their chances of matching an offer sheet for Tony Jefferson.  (good for OAK).
 

 

[Hankmoody]

One thing to note, and I'm not saying this is Reggie's thinking, is that nothing covers up for a subpar secondary like a great DL and LB corps.

Almost.  You still need base-line level DB's to let the pass rush get there.  If you can't cover for 2.5 seconds it doesn't matter how good your rush is, it just can't get home that fast.  This is where the Raiders are (were) right now.

 

[massraider]

Cards bring on a potential massive salary in 2017, lessening their chances of matching an offer sheet for Tony Jefferson.  (good for OAK).

Levi Damien been reading my ####:

The Arizona Cardinals just pulled off a blockbuster trade, acquiring pass rusherChandler Jones from the Patriots in exchange for their 2nd round pick and guard Jonathan Cooper. It gives the Cardinals one of the league's top pass rushers (12.5 sacks in 2015), but could it also cause them to lose one of their other key free agent players? Let's take a look.

The primary free agent player in question here is Tony Jefferson who was a restricted free agent on whom the team placed an original round tender. Since Jefferson was undrafted out of Oklahoma, if he should be signed away by another team, the Cardinals would receive no draft pick compensation. Their only play would be to try and match whatever offer was given to Jefferson, which they would have five days to do should an offer be made.


 


Prior to the acquisition of Jones, the Cardinals were sitting at about $15 million. Jones' nearly $8 million cuts that figure in half, leaving the team with somewhere near $7.5 million in cap space.

Should a team such as the Raiders, who have reportedly looked into trying to sign Jefferson, make one of their frontloaded deals which would offer Jefferson more than the $7.5 million in his first year, it could make it difficult for the Cardinals to match it.

I suppose the question then becomes is Jefferson worth any deal that would have that much money up front? That would be for the Raiders as well as the Cardinals to decide.

Based on the deal the Raiders gave Nate Allen last year, it's clear they are willing to put up a bit of coin for a somewhat unproven safety. Allen had a $6.9 million salary in his first year with Raiders last season. A year later, and with the Raiders still sitting at nearly $30 million in cap space, tossing on a few extra k to Jefferson in his first year doesn't seem out of the question.

He has started 15 games over the past two seasons for the Cardinals, averaging just under 80 tackles per season. He is a strong safety by trade, which is what the Raiders need. It could be worth a shot.

 

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

Yes, I think so too.

And we could use on of those.  

Not disagreeing, but we should start with pure starters, if at all possible! 

 

[DocHolliday]

Mike Wallace, 2 years, 11.5 mill with Baltimore.

Man, I was interested, but was thinking 3-4 mill/year.  

Wallace has made a lot of money for one or two good years in PIT.

I want nothing to do with Wallace. There has to be another fast WR out there that simply takes the top off but does not come with Wallaces's attitude. Wallace is fast and has experience but his route running seems so limited. 

 

[ICON211]

I want nothing to do with Wallace. There has to be another fast WR out there that simply takes the top off but does not come with Wallaces's attitude. Wallace is fast and has experience but his route running seems so limited. 

Agreed.  I wish they tried to throw deep to Holmes more often.

 

[massraider]

[No message]

 

[joey]

I want nothing to do with Wallace. There has to be another fast WR out there that simply takes the top off but does not come with Wallaces's attitude. Wallace is fast and has experience but his route running seems so limited. 

Agreed.  I wish they tried to throw deep to Holmes more often.

and...with that we just re-signed Holmes to a 1 year "up to "$3 million" contract.

Set at WR as far as I'm concerned. A safety, please...

 

[joey]

Sounds like Penn is close to re-signing. 

Gonna be one hell of an offensive line!

that covers just about every single need except...um....what was it again?.....SAFETY!

In Reggie We Trust.