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2016 Oakland Raiders thread (1 Viewer)

Scott Bair had a nice piece regarding OTA observations. 

Del Rio mentioned that Ward seemed ahead of the game,  and called him a pleasant surprise.

The notion of what this D line could be like with Mack, Mario, Irvin, Autry, Ward etc. is kind of getting me pretty excited.  Some real nice young talent there,  locked up for a while, cheap.  
It is obvious we have edge rushers to spare now. For us to move from good to great- we need someone who can collapse the pocket. I think the guys we have are good but not anyone that we can count on to break the middle of the opposing O-line.

Very young talent. This roster is extremely young. Most are well under 6 years experience and only 4 have 10 or more years in the league (Nelson, Condo, Janikowski, and Penn).

 
It is obvious we have edge rushers to spare now. For us to move from good to great- we need someone who can collapse the pocket. I think the guys we have are good but not anyone that we can count on to break the middle of the opposing O-line.

Very young talent. This roster is extremely young. Most are well under 6 years experience and only 4 have 10 or more years in the league (Nelson, Condo, Janikowski, and Penn).
ill be drafting the Raiders D for my fantasy D for sure

 
Scott Bair had a nice piece regarding OTA observations. 

Del Rio mentioned that Ward seemed ahead of the game,  and called him a pleasant surprise.

The notion of what this D line could be like with Mack, Mario, Irvin, Autry, Ward etc. is kind of getting me pretty excited.  Some real nice young talent there,  locked up for a while, cheap.  
What is even scarier is that the line is so potentially scary without even factoring in Aldon Smith.

 
Wasn't one of the knocks on Ward coming out of the draft is that he was thought to be a little soft or not mean enough? Throwing down with Osemele is a good sign.
I did not hear that about him and, while I did not read about him being a McSorley type enforcer I did love what I read about all the effort he put in just to make it to practice.  Guy is a hard worker and my guess is that there isn't much "back-down" in him.  IMO he is built like a John Henderson, albeit slightly smaller, and JDR knew how to use Henderson in the middle and I think the plan is to develop him into that role.

 
^^^ Henderson was a 335 lb 0 technique nose tackle. Ward is ~40 lbs lighter and plays 5 tech (3-4 end) or 3 tech (4-3 under tackle). He's more like Marcus Stroud, than Big Hen. We sorely need an interior rusher to compliment our horde of edge rushers, so hopefully Ward can bring that sort of presence.

 
I think his physical dimensions remind me of Wilkerson, or Mario. 

Haven't seen him play yet,  so we'll see who he plays like. 

 
^^^ Henderson was a 335 lb 0 technique nose tackle. Ward is ~40 lbs lighter and plays 5 tech (3-4 end) or 3 tech (4-3 under tackle). He's more like Marcus Stroud, than Big Hen. We sorely need an interior rusher to compliment our horde of edge rushers, so hopefully Ward can bring that sort of presence.
That's why I said he reminds me of a slightly smaller (2" & 32 lbs, not ~40) version of Henderson.  Henderson was long for his weight and so is Ward.  I don't think they drafted him to be a DE, at least not according to everything I heard during the draft.

I guess you could say he is closer to Stroud (1" & 16 lbs) but I don't think their weight distribution look similar.

 
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Chaka said:
I did not hear that about him and, while I did not read about him being a McSorley type enforcer I did love what I read about all the effort he put in just to make it to practice.  Guy is a hard worker and my guess is that there isn't much "back-down" in him.  IMO he is built like a John Henderson, albeit slightly smaller, and JDR knew how to use Henderson in the middle and I think the plan is to develop him into that role.
I always believe the pinnacle of goondom is Tiger Williams, but love the old time hockey reference regardless.

 
Good Lord.

Seems like a very, very high bar.  Don't like all the hype.
Well....

it is refreshing to be talked about better than "Raiders? Ha ha ha ha ha ha" but yea, the high expectations mean if we don't live to them it will make it harder to take. I think it is reasonable to expect a winning season this year. How winning is the real question.

 
The schedule and our division make it hard for me to get above 9 wins. 

Thats the the bar I'm setting for myself this season. 

 
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Realistically, I think this is a team that will contend with the Chiefs for the division title.  At least a wild card spot.  I don't see them as legitimate Super Bowl contenders yet.  Give the young / new players another year to gel and maybe.  Still a dangerous team, but consistency will be key.  Not much depth aside from D line either.  A key injury or two would likely sink this team's hopes, and why I don't think they are a top contender yet.  Should finally be a fun year to watch NorCal football again.

 
 Oakland Raiders (11-5)

In 2015, the Raiders were a team that played better than their record indicated. They followed that up this offseason with some of the league’s biggest free-agent signings, including Kelechi Osemele,Sean Smith, and Bruce Irvin. In each of the last two years, Osemele was among the top five guards in run-blocking grade. Cornerbacks are one of the most inconsistent positions from one year to another, but Smith has stopped that trend; the former Chief has never allowed a catch rate above 59 percent, and each of the past four years he’s recorded at least eight passes defended. Throw in Derek Carr, who had the highest grade for a quarterback age 26 or younger, and Amari Cooper, who should improve in his sophomore season, and you have the recipe for a special year.

:goodposting:

 
Sapphire Gentlemen’s Club promises free limousine rides and free lap dances or the entire term of their time as a Las Vegas Raider.

The Oakland Raiders could soon turn into the Las Vegas Raiders, and if they do, fears about too much partying could be increased thanks to offers like the one being made by Sapphire Gentlemen’s Club. If the team does indeed move to Vegas, Sapphire is prepared to offer every member of the team free limousine rides to the club and free lap dances when they get there.

And not just once… for the entire term of their time as a Las Vegas Raider.

The club’s website claims it’s the biggest gentlemen’s club in Las Vegas and has won the award for best gentlemen’s club four years in a row. It’s the first but not likely the last club in Vegas that will offer players an exclusive deal if they spend time at the establishment. I would expect everything from strip clubs to night clubs to Circus Circus trying to get in on the action when the Raiders move.

And that might be the exact reason former NFL player Donte Stallworth seems to believe a move to Vegas for any team would be disastrous:

 
I'm interested in seeing how Latavius does this year, and his situation next year. 

There was always the feeling that the team was never thrilled with his preparation, or commitment,  or something.  

Yet in the offseason, they didn't make a strong move to challenge him. A 5th round pick, even if Washington turns into Jones-Drew 2.0, isn't much of a statement.  They didn't pursue Forte for example, and his price was reasonable.

I could see a scenario where he has a great year behind this line,  but what happens then? 

Does he leave for greener pastures, with the Raiders drafting a replacement? Or,  and I wonder about this, do other NFL teams get scared off, figuring he is just a beneficiary of our line? If so, could he be re-signed for cheap? 

 
I'm interested in seeing how Latavius does this year, and his situation next year. 

There was always the feeling that the team was never thrilled with his preparation, or commitment,  or something.  

Yet in the offseason, they didn't make a strong move to challenge him. A 5th round pick, even if Washington turns into Jones-Drew 2.0, isn't much of a statement.  They didn't pursue Forte for example, and his price was reasonable.

I could see a scenario where he has a great year behind this line,  but what happens then? 

Does he leave for greener pastures, with the Raiders drafting a replacement? Or,  and I wonder about this, do other NFL teams get scared off, figuring he is just a beneficiary of our line? If so, could he be re-signed for cheap? 
I have a hard time figuring out if it's just the homer in me or not but I'm buy Latavius everywhere I can where people aren't valuing him like crazy. Major upgraded O-line, they're not afraid to workhorse him. He should be in for a good year. Thinking if he gets close to matching the same carries as last year that last year should be his absolute floor.

I consider this buy a 1 year maybe 2 year max fix. We're going to get our RB in next year's draft I think.

 
massraider said:
I'm interested in seeing how Latavius does this year, and his situation next year. 

There was always the feeling that the team was never thrilled with his preparation, or commitment,  or something.  

Yet in the offseason, they didn't make a strong move to challenge him. A 5th round pick, even if Washington turns into Jones-Drew 2.0, isn't much of a statement.  They didn't pursue Forte for example, and his price was reasonable.

I could see a scenario where he has a great year behind this line,  but what happens then? 

Does he leave for greener pastures, with the Raiders drafting a replacement? Or,  and I wonder about this, do other NFL teams get scared off, figuring he is just a beneficiary of our line? If so, could he be re-signed for cheap? 
I think Reggie sees what we see in Latavius...... An average running back and those are the guys you don't spend your salary cap space on and are easily replaced.

 
a development group led by former Raiders Ronnie Lott and Rodney Peete looking to take a crack at getting a stadium built in Oakland. This after several previous attempts by other development groups were not considered viable by the Raiders and the NFL.

Roger Goodell likes this idea. And what Goodell wants, Goodell usually gets.

So, he made a call to Oakland Mayor Libby Schaaf who had told the San Francisco Chronicle previously that she would only speak to a development group if they were brought to her by the Raiders. Goodell asked, and so she met with the group.

http://www.silverandblackpride.com/2016/6/6/11868466/roger-goodell-throws-weight-behind-new-oakland-raiders-stadium-development-group

 
a development group led by former Raiders Ronnie Lott and Rodney Peete looking to take a crack at getting a stadium built in Oakland. This after several previous attempts by other development groups were not considered viable by the Raiders and the NFL.

Roger Goodell likes this idea. And what Goodell wants, Goodell usually gets.

So, he made a call to Oakland Mayor Libby Schaaf who had told the San Francisco Chronicle previously that she would only speak to a development group if they were brought to her by the Raiders. Goodell asked, and so she met with the group.

http://www.silverandblackpride.com/2016/6/6/11868466/roger-goodell-throws-weight-behind-new-oakland-raiders-stadium-development-group
Still a long shot. Oakland has nothing to offer. A's have no interest or desire to work with the Raiders and a 10 year lease that is yet another roadblock. Literally the only positive is the NFL offering another $100 Million on top as consolation for missing out on L.A. and likely the only reason this development group is getting any attention is because it is a minority owned group lead by past NFL players.

 
massraider said:
I'm interested in seeing how Latavius does this year, and his situation next year. 

There was always the feeling that the team was never thrilled with his preparation, or commitment,  or something.  

Yet in the offseason, they didn't make a strong move to challenge him. A 5th round pick, even if Washington turns into Jones-Drew 2.0, isn't much of a statement.  They didn't pursue Forte for example, and his price was reasonable.

I could see a scenario where he has a great year behind this line,  but what happens then? 

Does he leave for greener pastures, with the Raiders drafting a replacement? Or,  and I wonder about this, do other NFL teams get scared off, figuring he is just a beneficiary of our line? If so, could he be re-signed for cheap? 
Latavius flashed some great potential before last year. Then if you look at his game log last year, the first three games are what you want to see and then he slowed leading to the bye week. Comes back from the bye week and is back in the 5's for YPC and then sputtered again after 4 games.

I think he really is best fitted as an RBBC guy and not a 30 touch guy. (Heck, his touches even when puttering out were in the 10-20 range)

I really keep trying to check myself from the homer blinders but I really think we will see Washington get a lot of work. The funny thing about Washington was that they kept saying that they wanted to bring in a big back to compliment Murray and they ended up with a little back in Washington. I take that as when they were in the draft and he fell that far down that they felt the value was too much to pass up even though he did not fit their predefined compliment to Murray.

 
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FreshiZ said:
I have a hard time figuring out if it's just the homer in me or not but I'm buy Latavius everywhere I can where people aren't valuing him like crazy. Major upgraded O-line, they're not afraid to workhorse him. He should be in for a good year. Thinking if he gets close to matching the same carries as last year that last year should be his absolute floor.

I consider this buy a 1 year maybe 2 year max fix. We're going to get our RB in next year's draft I think.
Yeah. They had every opportunity to grab Henry in the 2nd. IMO I think they believe he's adequate. He's not a punishing runner, nor does he have the greatest hands out of the backfield and he will fumble on occasion. But when he finds a crease, he's gone like a rocket. I think they'll see how he does as the bell cow behind that new and improved OL. Regardless of how he does, I doubt he comes back.

 
Seriously? They moved to Anaheim for a "better" stadium and land agreement. NFL teams don't really move because of attendance anyway. They move for stadiums and more guaranteed revenue.

And, no. It's a Rams town now (and Chargers). The Rams set attendance records in the Coliseum that the Raiders never touched.
If the NFL let the Raider back into the LA market, I have absolutely no doubt they would draw better than either the Rams or Chargers. What color best captures that gang mentality, blue, powder blue or black?  :headbang:

 
massraider said:
I'm interested in seeing how Latavius does this year, and his situation next year. 

There was always the feeling that the team was never thrilled with his preparation, or commitment,  or something.  

Yet in the offseason, they didn't make a strong move to challenge him. A 5th round pick, even if Washington turns into Jones-Drew 2.0, isn't much of a statement.  They didn't pursue Forte for example, and his price was reasonable.

I could see a scenario where he has a great year behind this line,  but what happens then? 

Does he leave for greener pastures, with the Raiders drafting a replacement? Or,  and I wonder about this, do other NFL teams get scared off, figuring he is just a beneficiary of our line? If so, could he be re-signed for cheap? 
 Murray left  a lot of plays on the field last year, and it hurt the Raiders. That said he may be undervalued at the moment given the situation, but if you pursue that strategy I recommend handcuffing him to DeWash. My gut tells me the rook may end up playing a much bigger role than expected. 

 
FreshiZ said:
I have a hard time figuring out if it's just the homer in me or not but I'm buy Latavius everywhere I can where people aren't valuing him like crazy. Major upgraded O-line, they're not afraid to workhorse him. He should be in for a good year. Thinking if he gets close to matching the same carries as last year that last year should be his absolute floor.

I consider this buy a 1 year maybe 2 year max fix. We're going to get our RB in next year's draft I think.
Fantasy-wise, agree with the 1-year buy, with the caveat that if Washington looks good in preseason and situational use, he may eat into Murray's carries sooner rather than later. I'd like to totally believe in Murray as you have, as he is the ostensible workhorse behind an upgraded line. But not having seen enough flash from Murray, hesitant to really go all in on him.

NFL-wise, really excited to see the difference this line makes for Murray and our run game in general. Having a credible run game only helps Carr and opens up our offense that much more.

 
Great post, thanks -- the ability to find opportunity to get Mack, Edwards, Smith, and Irvin into the game at the same time has us all salivating, as (as the article points out) the strengths of these players accentuate the strengths of others. Example: Edwards's strong interior play only makes Irvin's rush abilities more potent when they wouldn't be just on their own. Mack will likely be a monster regardless, but if all four of these guys are able to see the field on some downs, it will cause mayhem.

Hope we live up to all this hype, and if we do, we better come up with a better unit nickname than the Death Line. Something epic like Monsters of Midway/Doomsday Defense/Steel Curtain/Sack Exchange level of awesomeness. 

 
Hat tip to Arif for linking the article in recent podcast.

I hadn't really thought about Mack as playing 3 technique so this article was really interesting for me because of that.

 
Great post, thanks -- the ability to find opportunity to get Mack, Edwards, Smith, and Irvin into the game at the same time has us all salivating, as (as the article points out) the strengths of these players accentuate the strengths of others. Example: Edwards's strong interior play only makes Irvin's rush abilities more potent when they wouldn't be just on their own. Mack will likely be a monster regardless, but if all four of these guys are able to see the field on some downs, it will cause mayhem.

Hope we live up to all this hype, and if we do, we better come up with a better unit nickname than the Death Line. Something epic like Monsters of Midway/Doomsday Defense/Steel Curtain/Sack Exchange level of awesomeness. 
there were reports that Mack bulked up to 270 lbs.......

 
Great post, thanks -- the ability to find opportunity to get Mack, Edwards, Smith, and Irvin into the game at the same time has us all salivating, as (as the article points out) the strengths of these players accentuate the strengths of others. Example: Edwards's strong interior play only makes Irvin's rush abilities more potent when they wouldn't be just on their own. Mack will likely be a monster regardless, but if all four of these guys are able to see the field on some downs, it will cause mayhem.

Hope we live up to all this hype, and if we do, we better come up with a better unit nickname than the Death Line. Something epic like Monsters of Midway/Doomsday Defense/Steel Curtain/Sack Exchange level of awesomeness. 
Oakland Raiders: Khalil Mack

There was no bigger story in the IDP world last offseason than the unknown position of Khalil Mack. The fantasy community was extremely torn on whether he was a defensive end or linebacker -- and so was the NFL, as Mack was named a first-team All-Pro at BOTH spots. Questions remain a full year later. Contrary to the claims of some, Mack played linebacker in base formations last year and his assignment there was most accurate even if it decreased Mack's IDP value. Where will Mack be assigned in 2016? The addition of Bruce Irvin gives some hope that Mack gaining DL eligibility is possible.  Irvin excelled in Seattle playing 4-3 Strongside Linebacker (SAM) in a defense that current Oakland DC (and former Seattle LB coach) Ken Norton Jr. is very experienced with. Irvin’s pass coverage skills will let Mack rush the passer even more frequently, making improvement on Mack's 2015 sack total (15) achievable. The Raiders’ inside linebacker duo of Malcolm Smith and Ben Heeney can succeed in any alignment, and Irvin and Norton have 4-3 roots, while HC Jack Del Rio and NT Dan Williams bring 3-4 backgrounds. The next few months will be vital to see if Mack will be a useful IDP at linebacker or a league-winning centerpiece at defensive end.

Prediction: 65% chance Mack gets a Linebacker designation

 
RT has Mack as LB and in my leagues he is still a top end LB for points. If he got the DE designation- that is HUGE in points and really is a "league-winning centerpiece".

 
Great post, thanks -- the ability to find opportunity to get Mack, Edwards, Smith, and Irvin into the game at the same time has us all salivating, as (as the article points out) the strengths of these players accentuate the strengths of others. Example: Edwards's strong interior play only makes Irvin's rush abilities more potent when they wouldn't be just on their own. Mack will likely be a monster regardless, but if all four of these guys are able to see the field on some downs, it will cause mayhem.

Hope we live up to all this hype, and if we do, we better come up with a better unit nickname than the Death Line. Something epic like Monsters of Midway/Doomsday Defense/Steel Curtain/Sack Exchange level of awesomeness. 
Black Hole Defense too easy?

 
My only wonder on this would be in this lineup if we pushed Mack inside then are we really getting the most out of him? I wonder if he would be better on the edge to fit his skillset or if his talent would overwhelm your typical NFL guard. Not sure. I could see it going either way.

It is funny though that one of our biggest "problems" right now is figuring out how we can get all of our pass rushers on the field in obvious passing downs. I am more use to "how are we going to get under the cap?" or "How are we going to win with this QB?" etc.

 
Very good question.  The Broncos use Von Miller around the formation, but, for the most part, on passing downs, you can find him opposite Ware, going against right tackles.  

I believe the best nickel lineup will be: Mack-Autry-Mario-Irvin.  If Aldon proves to be back to his old self, then I might see a situation where Mack slides inside, or Irvin moves up to a nickel role (with potential to blitz).  But Irvin doesn't seem to have the pass-rushing versatility of Aldon or Mack.  I feel like Aldon and Irvin essentially are best doing the same thing, rushing from the right side.  

It does seem like Mack moving inside, in some capacity, seems the easiest way to get all four on the field.  Maybe a 3 man lineup, with Mario over the nose, and Mack hovering from a MLB spot, obviously coming, but from where?  Really, in that scenario, just the concern from the interior of the O-line might be worth the wrinkle, even if Mack is a better pass rusher from the edge.

From a larger view, if I had to pick a free agent that won't be worth the money, I would go with Irvin.  He has not been a special player in Seattle, and seems to be a one trick pass rusher.  He's clearly a lovable guy, and a leader, and has bought in to the team, so he might be like a Tuck, not an impact player, but contributes in intangibles and steady play.  We might need him more as an off the ball LB on early downs more than his use as a pass rusher on obvious passing down.  Malcolm Smith has been a nice journeyman vet for us, but is a replaceable player.  Heeney is an unknown, and even if he's good for us, he'll probably have a lot of growing pains this year.  

 
Very good question.  The Broncos use Von Miller around the formation, but, for the most part, on passing downs, you can find him opposite Ware, going against right tackles.  

I believe the best nickel lineup will be: Mack-Autry-Mario-Irvin.  If Aldon proves to be back to his old self, then I might see a situation where Mack slides inside, or Irvin moves up to a nickel role (with potential to blitz).  But Irvin doesn't seem to have the pass-rushing versatility of Aldon or Mack.  I feel like Aldon and Irvin essentially are best doing the same thing, rushing from the right side.  

It does seem like Mack moving inside, in some capacity, seems the easiest way to get all four on the field.  Maybe a 3 man lineup, with Mario over the nose, and Mack hovering from a MLB spot, obviously coming, but from where?  Really, in that scenario, just the concern from the interior of the O-line might be worth the wrinkle, even if Mack is a better pass rusher from the edge.

From a larger view, if I had to pick a free agent that won't be worth the money, I would go with Irvin.  He has not been a special player in Seattle, and seems to be a one trick pass rusher.  He's clearly a lovable guy, and a leader, and has bought in to the team, so he might be like a Tuck, not an impact player, but contributes in intangibles and steady play.  We might need him more as an off the ball LB on early downs more than his use as a pass rusher on obvious passing down.  Malcolm Smith has been a nice journeyman vet for us, but is a replaceable player.  Heeney is an unknown, and even if he's good for us, he'll probably have a lot of growing pains this year.  
Irvin can cover. So, perhaps Aldon for Irvin at DE and Irving at LB. The is the thing about Irvin. Perhaps to his detriment in Seattle as they asked him to cover a lot.

 
Chadstroma said:
Irvin can cover. So, perhaps Aldon for Irvin at DE and Irving at LB. The is the thing about Irvin. Perhaps to his detriment in Seattle as they asked him to cover a lot.
Coming out of college, most thought Irvin was a one-dimensional pass-rusher, and that's how Seattle used him initially in situational passing downs -- believe he had 8 sacks his rookie year.

They later moved him to SAM, where he was pretty ineffectual at first but gradually improved his game in both coverage (where a SAM needs to be good) and leveraging his pass rush skills as a versatile linebacker (remaining primarily on the strong side).

As a whole, Irvin is solid at both getting after the QB and dropping into coverage, but not spectacular at either phase. He's not a pure pass rusher, and not quick enough to keep up with speedy backs and slot receivers as a linebacker. His best work historically seems to have come as a pass rushing DE in nickel using his agility against left tackles. But I think he remains best used situationally in both SAM and DE positions, taking advantage of the holes or coverage draws that Mack, Mario, and others create.

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Like its simplicity. Like the subtlety of the Event Horizon line -- takes the Black Hole metaphor a step further. There is no escaping the Event Horizon line.

Doesn't pass the bad-@$$ test, tho.
Who died and made you King bad-@$$? ;)

 
I know we're just having fun here, but let's have the defense *EARN* a nickname before we just hand it to them.

signed,

Cold Bucket of Ice Water

;)

 

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