2021 Las Vegas Raiders - PLAYOFFS!!!! (1 Viewer)

[DA RAIDERS]

Tomlin has my absolute and complete respect. I would kill most of you on the board here to get him as HC. 

Yea, I said what I said. 

bring it!!

i too have a man crush on tomlin.  he's never coming to the raiders.

 

[Chadstroma]

bring it!!

i too have a man crush on tomlin.  he's never coming to the raiders.

But if the price is to kill you to make it happen... I will attend your funeral.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

chad....look away...

carr is a weird dude.  i have always doubted his fire.  his will to win at all costs.  i think his über christianity will never allow him to be a killer on the field.

he's not a dynamic player.  he's steady eddie.  sounds the same, win or lose.  he claims, in his odd measured voice, to be sick of the losing.  then he goes out and dinks and dunks his ### off in the first half.  then airs it out in a desperate gamble, in the 4th quarter, but the game is already lost.  

the presser after the chiefs game, is a perfect example.  made me want to puke.  he never says anything controversial.  IMHO, that was a missed opportunity to tell the team, that the stupid #### on the chiefs logo, was just that, stupid ####.  that presser tells me that he is not a leader in the locker room.

he does come across as a victim of circumstance. maybe rightfully so?  

i actually think he's a decent qb.  but he's timid/safe at all times, until it's too late.  the horse #### OL that gruden created for him, totally f'ed this season.  i said that before the season even started.  so maybe it's not his fault, but imho, he's not the answer.

/rant over.  maybe.

bolded....i think this is spot on.....

 

[Stinkin Ref]

when you don't have the game to cash the checks your actions write (victory lap/logo)...bad things happens....#curbstomp

 

[Chaka]

Speaking of coordinators who probably deserve another chance, and are sure to evoke responses of "NEVER!!!" and "HE MUST BE BANISHED FROM THE COACHING FOR ALL ETERNITY!!!"

But Dennis Allen has been doing a heckuva job with the defense in New Orleans.

 

[Chadstroma]

Speaking of coordinators who probably deserve another chance, and are sure to evoke responses of "NEVER!!!" and "HE MUST BE BANISHED FROM THE COACHING FOR ALL ETERNITY!!!"

But Dennis Allen has been doing a heckuva job with the defense in New Orleans.

You can be a great OC or DC and suck at HC. This is a proven fact over and over with NFL coaching that go from OC or DC and the HC became they were good at OC or DC then suck at HC and get fired. They then go back to OC and DC and then get another chance at HC and suck. Rinse and repeat. 

It is same as HC in college. 

The things that make you good at one don't mean they translate to the other. 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

But if the price is to kill you to make it happen... I will attend your funeral.

please spread my ashes off the top of mammoth mountain.  tia 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

when you don't have the game to cash the checks your actions write (victory lap/logo)...bad things happens....#curbstomp

the chiefs played "the wheels on the bus go round and round" after the game.  top notch trolling right there.

 

[Chaka]

You can be a great OC or DC and suck at HC. This is a proven fact over and over with NFL coaching that go from OC or DC and the HC became they were good at OC or DC then suck at DC and get fired. They then go back to OC and DC and then get another chance at HC and suck. Rinse and repeat. 

It is same as HC in college. 

The things that make you good at one don't mean they translate to the other. 

Rehash. By that logic Bill Belichik never becomes the HC of the Pats.

BTW remember when Uncle Billy backed out on the Jets in the 11th hour? 

 

[Chadstroma]

please spread my ashes off the top of mammoth mountain.  tia 

Done. I will have Carr do the honors. 

 

[Chadstroma]

Rehash. By that logic Bill Belichik never becomes the HC of the Pats.

BTW remember when Uncle Billy backed out on the Jets in the 11th hour? 

That is not a point against my point. My point is simply that what makes some great OC or DC or even college HC does not directly translate to good HC. It is a different skillset. That does not preclude someone having both skillsets and can made the transition. 

Similar to being in sales. You see it all the time. A great salesman does great. So, of course, the next progression is to promote to a manager. But being a great salesman and being a great manager are two completely different skillsets. Some great salesman will be great at being a manager too because they possess both but many will fail because of what is needed in the two different jobs are different things. It is a fallacy to think that someone must be good at this other job because they did this job great when the two jobs, though related, are different. 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Done. I will have Carr do the honors. 

  he's probably been there as a bako boy.

 

[DocHolliday]

bring it!!

i too have a man crush on tomlin.  he's never coming to the raiders.

I have no idea why anyone thinks Tomlin is coming to the Raiders.  

 

[DocHolliday]

the chiefs played "the wheels on the bus go round and round" after the game.  top notch trolling right there.

I hate the Chiefs but that was a great move.  The dumb Raiders had it coming and deserved anything the Chiefs threw at them after that game.  

 

[Chaka]

That is not a point against my point. My point is simply that what makes some great OC or DC or even college HC does not directly translate to good HC. It is a different skillset. That does not preclude someone having both skillsets and can made the transition. 

Similar to being in sales. You see it all the time. A great salesman does great. So, of course, the next progression is to promote to a manager. But being a great salesman and being a great manager are two completely different skillsets. Some great salesman will be great at being a manager too because they possess both but many will fail because of what is needed in the two different jobs are different things. It is a fallacy to think that someone must be good at this other job because they did this job great when the two jobs, though related, are different. 

You are using that argument as a reason to avoid guys like Allen & McDaniels.  My point exactly argues against why your premise is flawed.

Yes, someone can be better at one thing than another.  Someone can fail at something and never build on that failure. People can also be good at one thing fail at another thing, go back to the thing they are good at and take time to examine why they failed at the other thing, learn from their failures take that knowledge and succeed at the thing they previously failed at.

Your contention all but explicitly removes the possibility of learning and growth.

 

[Chadstroma]

I have no idea why anyone thinks Tomlin is coming to the Raiders.  

I didn't say I think he will.... I said I would kill @DA RAIDERS to make it happen if need be. 

 

[Chadstroma]

You are using that argument as a reason to avoid guys like Allen & McDaniels.  My point exactly argues against why your premise is flawed.

Yes, someone can be better at one thing than another.  Someone can fail at something and never build on that failure. People can also be good at one thing fail at another thing, go back to the thing they are good at and take time to examine why they failed at the other thing, learn from their failures take that knowledge and succeed at the thing they previously failed at.

Your contention all but explicitly removes the possibility of learning and growth.

I don't ever recall arguing against Allen though I am not sure why we would bring him back. Has any team ever brought back a failed HC that THEY had fail on them again? 

I was very clear about why I don't want McDaniels and it is a lot more than just he sucked as a HC before. And I mean, really sucked as a HC before. 

You are conflating two different things that I have said. One was actually about McDaniels which is about personality. Personalities generally do not 'learn and grow' unless there is a huge life altering thing that happens. 

The second is very simply being a good OC or DC or even college HC does not mean someone will ever be a good NFL HC. 

Allen would be a head scratcher if for anything else other than he failed with us once. I seriously can not think of another team that hired a HC... fired them, then brought them back again. The only one that I can think of is us with Art Shell but I would argue his first stint was not what I would call "failed". Under Allen we won.... what? 2 games in two years? And you want to bring him back? Geez... the rest of the league already laughs at us and you are wanting to give them more reasons to mock us. 

McDaniels, I believe, will never be a good HC. I don't believe he has the personality to be. I don't believe he can be a leader. I think he is self centered, egotistical jerk who will destroy anything we have that is good and not build anything up after. The only other guy that makes me vomit more right now thinking of hiring him is Meyer. 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I didn't say I think he will.... I said I would kill @DA RAIDERS to make it happen if need be. 

Reported 

 

[ICON211]

Allen would be a head scratcher if for anything else other than he failed with us once. I seriously can not think of another team that hired a HC... fired them, then brought them back again. The only one that I can think of is us with Art Shell but I would argue his first stint was not what I would call "failed". Under Allen we won.... what? 2 games in two years? And you want to bring him back? Geez... the rest of the league already laughs at us and you are wanting to give them more reasons to mock us. 

Certainly can't call Art's first stint a failure.  He was 54-38 with three playoff appearances and went to an AFC title game.  

Dennis Allen was certainly a failure, and yeah, while he may get and may deserve another HC shot I can't see how it can be with the Raiders.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

I don't ever recall arguing against Allen though I am not sure why we would bring him back. Has any team ever brought back a failed HC that THEY had fail on them again? . 

Gruden?  

 

[Chadstroma]

Gruden?  

Gruden was not failed in his first go around as well. Should have had a SB if not for that stupid tuck rule. 

 

[Chaka]

I don't ever recall arguing against Allen though I am not sure why we would bring him back. Has any team ever brought back a failed HC that THEY had fail on them again? 

I was very clear about why I don't want McDaniels and it is a lot more than just he sucked as a HC before. And I mean, really sucked as a HC before. 

You are conflating two different things that I have said. One was actually about McDaniels which is about personality. Personalities generally do not 'learn and grow' unless there is a huge life altering thing that happens. 

The second is very simply being a good OC or DC or even college HC does not mean someone will ever be a good NFL HC. 

Allen would be a head scratcher if for anything else other than he failed with us once. I seriously can not think of another team that hired a HC... fired them, then brought them back again. The only one that I can think of is us with Art Shell but I would argue his first stint was not what I would call "failed". Under Allen we won.... what? 2 games in two years? And you want to bring him back? Geez... the rest of the league already laughs at us and you are wanting to give them more reasons to mock us. 

McDaniels, I believe, will never be a good HC. I don't believe he has the personality to be. I don't believe he can be a leader. I think he is self centered, egotistical jerk who will destroy anything we have that is good and not build anything up after. The only other guy that makes me vomit more right now thinking of hiring him is Meyer. 

If you are not using that point to argue against Allen, who I agree is a virtual impossibility as a hire for the Raiders, then it is entirely irrelevant to the premise that Allen has done an impressive job in New Orleans since 2015/16 and should probably get another crack at a HC position.

The response was non-sequitur.

 

[Chadstroma]

If you are not using that point to argue against Allen, who I agree is a virtual impossibility as a hire for the Raiders, then it is entirely irrelevant to the premise that Allen has done an impressive job in New Orleans since 2015/16 and should probably get another crack at a HC position.

The response was non-sequitur.

It is relevant because you were saying he was doing a good job as a DC. I am just saying that isn't really a good indicator of being a good HC or not. It doesn't mean he isn't or can't be a good HC but he had a chance, failed horribly and then going back to DC and doing well doesn't mean he really is a good HC. I mean, likely someone will give him a shot again.... like Norv got how many chances? Like Wade got how many chances? and the list can go on and on....

 

[Chaka]

It is relevant because you were saying he was doing a good job as a DC. I am just saying that isn't really a good indicator of being a good HC or not. It doesn't mean he isn't or can't be a good HC but he had a chance, failed horribly and then going back to DC and doing well doesn't mean he really is a good HC. I mean, likely someone will give him a shot again.... like Norv got how many chances? Like Wade got how many chances? and the list can go on and on....

Of course, but virtually (literally?) every single HC was a DC, OC or STC, is there even a single example of one who wasn't?

Couldn't you simply say that some people succeed or fail as head coaches and whether they were good DCs, OCs or STCs, which is implied as they likely wouldn't have gotten a HC job if the weren't, probably doesn't have much bearing on their success as a HC?

 

[CGRdrJoe]

I have no idea why anyone thinks Tomlin is coming to the Raiders.  

we are raiders fans which means we are either drunk or stoned, sometimes both

 

[Chadstroma]

Of course, but virtually (literally?) every single HC was a DC, OC or STC, is there even a single example of one who wasn't?

Couldn't you simply say that some people succeed or fail as head coaches and whether they were good DCs, OCs or STCs, which is implied as they likely wouldn't have gotten a HC job if the weren't, probably doesn't have much bearing on their success as a HC?

The normal progression is to move up the coaching ranks ans usually OC or DC first. Yes, just as the same is true in the example I gave about salespeople and management. 

The issue I am pointing out is how the NFL cycles through OC and DC into HC and then back and then they do well at OC and DC and now people want to hire them for DC again. 

It happens over and over... there are very few HC's that failed their first time and came back and then were very successful. Can it happen? Yes. But what are the odds in favor of? Success or failure? 

 

[ZADO]

Gruden was not failed in his first go around as well. Should have had a SB if not for that stupid tuck rule. 

one could argue he took both teams to Super Bowl XXXV 

 

[Chadstroma]

one could argue he took both teams to Super Bowl XXXV 

Geez... way to stir the pot with the legion of Chucky haters 

 

[joey]

one could argue he took both teams to Super Bowl XXXV 

One could argue one of the teams he took to the super bowl was Dungy's. 

 

[ZADO]

One could argue one of the teams he took to the super bowl was Dungy's. 

one team he literally built over 4 years ,the other had a great defense in place but one of the worst offenses in the league ,which Gruden rectified .

Being gthe first time Tampa ever won a SB id say Gruden had a hand in that 

 

[joey]

one team he literally built over 4 years ,the other had a great defense in place but one of the worst offenses in the league ,which Gruden rectified .

Being gthe first time Tampa ever won a SB id say Gruden had a hand in that 

please don’t let logic and reality get in the way of me trying to rationalize that horrible loss in the SB. 

 

[Chadstroma]

please don’t let logic and reality get in the way of me trying to rationalize that horrible loss in the SB. 

We lost because of three reasons. 

1) Callahan was kind of dumb and not changing the calls on offense much is inexcusable. 

2) Barrett having an episode. Losing your center like that.... who was one of the best in the league....throws a big monkey wrench into everything. 

3) Gruden had TB ready to play. 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

one could argue he took both teams to Super Bowl XXXV 

Nope. I’ll give him some credit for the raider team. But more to al Davis and Bruce allen. Tampa was 100% dungy’s roster. 

Geez... way to stir the pot with the legion of Chucky haters 

One could argue one of the teams he took to the super bowl was Dungy's. 

This

one team he literally built over 4 years ,the other had a great defense in place but one of the worst offenses in the league ,which Gruden rectified .

Being gthe first time Tampa ever won a SB id say Gruden had a hand in that 

Gruden did not build that team. The Godfather and Allen built it. Gruden was an innovative coach back then.  But he wasn’t dictating who was drafted, signed etc. 

please don’t let logic and reality get in the way of me trying to rationalize that horrible loss in the SB. 

We lost because of three reasons. 

1) Callahan was kind of dumb and not changing the calls on offense much is inexcusable. 

2) Barrett having an episode. Losing your center like that.... who was one of the best in the league....throws a big monkey wrench into everything. 

3) Gruden had TB ready to play. 

This is correct. I was there. I’ll unsugar coat it. 

Callahan was a f’ing ####### for not changing the audibles and the play calls. 

Robbins going awol f’ed the team beyond measure.  I wish I’d been assigned to his detail, I would have gotten him back from TJ and had him ready to play.  we had friend working video production for the raiders and had access to the raiders hotel and heard about Robbins, way before the story broke.  Such a brutal loss  

correct. 

 

[ZADO]

Nope. I’ll give him some credit for the raider team. But more to al Davis and Bruce allen. Tampa was 100% dungy’s roster. 



This

Gruden did not build that team. The Godfather and Allen built it. Gruden was an innovative coach back then.  But he wasn’t dictating who was drafted, signed etc. 



This is correct. I was there. I’ll unsugar coat it. 

Callahan was a f’ing ####### for not changing the audibles and the play calls. 

Robbins going awol f’ed the team beyond measure.  I wish I’d been assigned to his detail, I would have gotten him back from TJ and had him ready to play.  we had friend working video production for the raiders and had access to the raiders hotel and heard about Robbins, way before the story broke.  Such a brutal loss  

correct. 

Tampa didnt win a SB with that team under Dungy tho...just sayin

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Tampa didnt win a SB with that team under Dungy tho...just sayin

gruden is a clown..just sayin.  

 

[kaso]

CB Nate Hobbs has been added to the Covid List today, meaning he is OUT for todays game against the Browns.  Mullen (Toe)  and Waller (Back) also ruled out due to injury.

 

[kaso]

Trayvon Mullen has been placed in the IR, ending his 2021 season.  

Really like him as a player, and think he will continue to develop as a pro.  Looking forward to seeing him on the field in 2022. 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

db room looking thin.  if they can tackle chubb, they have a chance.

 

[DocHolliday]

db room looking thin.  if they can tackle chubb, they have a chance.

Browns should be able to run the ball easily and win.  Carr doesn’t have any weapons.  

 

[C-Bound]

Browns should be able to run the ball easily and win.  Carr doesn’t have any weapons.  

Are suggesting not playing their defense over the Eagles?

 

[kaso]

Browns should be able to run the ball easily and win.  Carr doesn’t have any weapons.  

Hopefully Alex Van Pelt doesn't know this.... he is today's play caller for the Browns

 

[DocHolliday]

Hopefully Alex Van Pelt doesn't know this.... he is today's play caller for the Browns

I could be the play caller for the Browns today.  I would throw away any playbook that contains a passing play.  

 

[DocHolliday]

Are suggesting not playing their defense over the Eagles?

Who knows.  My days of trying to figure out who to play in FF ended this weekend.   

 

[kaso]

Raiders Inactives for today:

LB Compton (Personal Matter) - This one will likely get a lot of attention by the Browns fans online, he wasn't quiet about the game being rescheduled and had a few threads going with the Browns faithful.
LB Perryman
TE Darren Waller
G Jordan Simmons
OT Jackson Barton
DL Kendal Vickers

 

[kaso]

Ugh.  Will Compton is inactive because his mom passed away suddenly last night. 

Forgetting football for a moment, hug the ones you love today.  Call the ones you haven't spoken to in a while.  Be good to each other. 

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Whoever said that Jacobs need to run from the I formation. Man o man are you right. It’s soooooo obvious. 

 

[Chaka]

The normal progression is to move up the coaching ranks ans usually OC or DC first. Yes, just as the same is true in the example I gave about salespeople and management. 

The issue I am pointing out is how the NFL cycles through OC and DC into HC and then back and then they do well at OC and DC and now people want to hire them for DC again. 

It happens over and over... there are very few HC's that failed their first time and came back and then were very successful. Can it happen? Yes. But what are the odds in favor of? Success or failure? 

What % of new HCs succeed overall?

Urban Meyer, Bobby Petrino, Nick Saban all colossal failures so don't look for the next Jimmy Johnson or Pete Carroll? Of course not, even the Jags having been snake bit yesterday would be foolish to not at least consider Dabo.

Carroll, btw is another failed HC turned SB winning HC along with guys like Belichik and Shanahan.

I don't know that there is a statistically significant difference in success rate between first time HCs and guys who got second chances.

 

[Chaka]

Whoever said that Jacobs need to run from the I formation. Man o man are you right. It’s soooooo obvious. 

I'm wondering why he keeps getting pulled inside the red zone.

 

[ICON211]

Carr fumble turned this whole game around.  He fumbles way too often when he knows he's being tackled.  I can understand the strip sack fumbles when a QB gets hit from the blind side, but that last fumble was an absolute joke.

 

[SDJohnny]

4th & 5. Terrible decision to not blitz.