Chadstroma
Footballguy
I have a feeling that the route tree will be opened up to Ruggs more now than under Gruden.
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2021 Las Vegas Raiders - PLAYOFFS!!!! (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Hankmoody
- Start date
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Draft wise I thought we would go Jeudy because he was the better route runner snd most "polished" and I thought that that was what Gruden would want. I didn't consider Ruggs and actually said if Lamb and Jeudy were gone I did not want Ruggs (I have a prejudice against speed guys I think), that we should go defense and swing back to BPA if the receivers with our next pick.
When we selected Ruggs, I was not happy. I thought Al came back to life and was running the team again and I had flashbacks to things like selecting Heyward-Bey.
However, the more I started digging into Ruggs the more comfortable I became.
So, though I was calling Ruggs development this off season, I certainly wasn't in board from the get go.
Well done on your part.
Chaka
Footballguy
Actually I was thinking more along the lines of 8 40+ yard go get 'em balls.
If he keeps converting those at the rate he has, and let's not forget, or diminish Edwards and his 20 ypc average, how can that not open up everything underneath for Waller, Renfrow, Jacobs & Drake?
With marginally better line play this could be a truly elite offense.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
You got to give him a curl or comeback once in a while to keep the defense honest and really bite on a move for a go route. The slightest bite with his speed is lethal for every corner out there right now.Actually I was thinking more along the lines of 8 40+ yard go get 'em balls.
If he keeps converting those at the rate he has, and let's not forget, or diminish Edwards and his 20 ypc average, how can that not open up everything underneath for Waller, Renfrow, Jacobs & Drake?
With marginally better line play this could be a truly elite offense.
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ICON211
Footballguy
I'd like to see some quick slants from Ruggs. He took several of them to the house at Alabama and I never see them called for him.
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DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
DocHolliday
Footballguy
Ruggs is a good WR and he has crazy speed. He does need more short targets to get the ball in his hands so that he can use that speed for more than just chasing down deep throws. As Chad mentioned, mixing short routes in with the deep routes would keep defenses honest and force CBs to have to cover Ruggs all over the field. This offense has the ability to be almost as good as any in the league.
The NFL is now under investigation by a Congressional committee seeking info on the WFT email scandal involving Gruden.
I do not defend Gruden in anyway and like him or not, what happened to him and the Raiders organization was wrong. The NFL would love nothing more than for all of us to forget about the scandal and pretend nothing ever happened and move on.
Whether they did the Raiders a favor or not, the NFL should not have the power to cover up information that could be damning to themselves while making Gruden a scapegoat. These owners are not above the law, if we do nothing and turn a blind eye, they win. This is not over.....
I do not defend Gruden in anyway and like him or not, what happened to him and the Raiders organization was wrong. The NFL would love nothing more than for all of us to forget about the scandal and pretend nothing ever happened and move on.
Whether they did the Raiders a favor or not, the NFL should not have the power to cover up information that could be damning to themselves while making Gruden a scapegoat. These owners are not above the law, if we do nothing and turn a blind eye, they win. This is not over.....
ICON211
Footballguy
While I agree with a lot of what you said I'm not interested in grandstanding congress people getting involved in this. They seem to be trying to get involved because of the Gruden emails which have nothing to do with what the WFT was being investigated for. Gruden was an ESPN commentator not a league employee when he sent the emails and while his emails are vulgar and inappropriate, I don't see how they should be the basis to launch a congressional investigation into the NFL as a whole.
Chaka
Footballguy
Gruden wasn't scapegoated he was outright ambushed for no reason. Someone weaponized those emails with the sole purpose of attacking Gruden.
I for one would absolutely love to know who has access to those emails, who leaked the info we know and I want to see the contents of all 650,000 emails released.
Forget about nasty comments that football people make (gee really, those guys are #######s? Who would have guessed?) I want to know if anyone has been sharing injury information with gambling interests. Or if anyone has been burying information about player safety. Stuff like that.
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Chadstroma
Footballguy
Two things I saw that were interesting...
An ex Washington Cheerleader is convinced that the Snyder camp is who leaked them to try to blame Bruce Allen for the whole mess of an organization over there.
A producer for... I think HBO.... talked to Gruden and apparently Gruden made a comment about the truth coming out.
No idea if the cheerleader is on to something or what Gruden may be referring to, if anything, but interesting nevertheless.
An ex Washington Cheerleader is convinced that the Snyder camp is who leaked them to try to blame Bruce Allen for the whole mess of an organization over there.
A producer for... I think HBO.... talked to Gruden and apparently Gruden made a comment about the truth coming out.
No idea if the cheerleader is on to something or what Gruden may be referring to, if anything, but interesting nevertheless.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
I don’t want my tax dollars wasted on an investigation. That’s just plain dumb.
The NFL is simply operating as normal. CYA. Protect the shield at all costs. Gruden was an idiot. And he was simply collateral damage. He was easily the most famous person involved. Too many people saw the emails to keep it under wraps. So the NFL got in front of it, as best they could.
Is there a bunch of shady #### going on in the NFL? Of course. Kraft was caught ON VIDEO, getting handies. Nothing happened. Really good lawyers make things go away. The NFL has really good lawyers. They want the WFT stuff buried. It will stay that way.
The NFL is simply operating as normal. CYA. Protect the shield at all costs. Gruden was an idiot. And he was simply collateral damage. He was easily the most famous person involved. Too many people saw the emails to keep it under wraps. So the NFL got in front of it, as best they could.
Is there a bunch of shady #### going on in the NFL? Of course. Kraft was caught ON VIDEO, getting handies. Nothing happened. Really good lawyers make things go away. The NFL has really good lawyers. They want the WFT stuff buried. It will stay that way.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Nah, I say stick to these a-holes for once. We waste way more tax dollars on way less worthwhile stuff all the time.
Chaka
Footballguy
I put no weight behind Gruden's comments to Real Sports. What else is he going to say? It's standard political cover nowadays, all bluster up front and no need to follow-up with anything.
And what truth are we talking about? That he didn't make homophobic, racist and misogynistic statements? That ship has sailed. He got unfairly screwed, I'll be the first to defend that fact, but you still reap what you sow.
And, let's be real the product Gruden put on the field over the last three seasons at least earned him a spot on the hot seat, which wasn't going to happen with his contract...hey maybe Mark Davis leaked the emails?
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Apparently Davis didn't get any emails until after the first leak.
If he wanted him gone he could have could habe fired him at the first leak.
He is also doing a heck of a job acting if it wasn't him in terms of all reports suggesr he is pissed off about this whole thing and thinks the league is out to get him.
One place I am confident the leak did nit come from is Davis.
Who? I don't know but why Gruden was the target out of all those emails only brings up more questions as to who and why?
Chaka
Footballguy
I love you brother but sometimes I think you take me a little too seriously.
I don't think Mark Davis had the emails released.
I think it was The Ghost of Al Davis!
Chadstroma
Footballguy
DocHolliday
Footballguy
On to things that matter. Gruden is gone. Rejoice and don’t look back. Is Waller playing against the Eagles? Does it matter against the Eagles?
joey
Footballguy
If Carrier weren’t on IR, I would be less worried. The trio of Waller, Moreau and Carrier was one of the strongest and deepest positions on the roster. I loved when all 3 were on the field and you never knew who they might throw to, especially at the goal line.
I was the same and then when looking deeper at his college usage he wasn't really a deep threat. Think he's been criminally misused up to this point. Hope he gets the chance to show what he can do as an all around WR. Gruden even said this offseason "I didn't draft him to run digs". Hope they give the kid a chance to do more of what he's used to.
Chaka
Footballguy
Nothing is private the second you put into electronic format and send it out into the tubes.
Rule #1 of digital communication: Never, ever, EVER put anything into e-communication that you wouldn't want to see on the front page of the New York Times. EVER!!!
If he didn't understand that in 2011 he is absolutely reaping what he sowed.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
gruden was not the target of anything. neither were the raiders. it's not a giant conspiracy to #### the raiders. it's straight up collateral damage.
name me one human being, in the history of the WFT, more famous than john gruden. ??????? especially in todays media.(the last 25 years) you won't find one.
the NFL has sealed the investigation into the WFT. PERIOD. END OF STORY
so anything revealed OUTSIDE of that investigation(not related to the WFT) is fair game. no one gives a #### what bruce allen is doing. home boy is retired. rich AF and enjoying life. anything and everything regarding the WFT is in the wind.
so i give you john gruden. the idiot, dumb ### chode, who got caught. end of story.
ICON211
Footballguy
gruden was not the target of anything. neither were the raiders. it's not a giant conspiracy to #### the raiders. it's straight up collateral damage.
Someone went out of their way to get Gruden and/or the Raiders. The leaks were specific to Gruden and could have been done before the season. The investigation into the WFT was finished in July.
the NFL has sealed the investigation into the WFT. PERIOD. END OF STORY
The NFL wrapped up their investigation into the WFT in July and fined them and sealed all the stuff months ago. Whoever leaked the Gruden stuff had this info months ago and sat on it. You also keep saying that too many people found out and that's why it came out. Now you are saying it's sealed so it's over. Well then if just because it was sealed no one else would have found out there would be no reason to leak the stuff months after the investigation was over and sealed.
so anything revealed OUTSIDE of that investigation(not related to the WFT) is fair game. no one gives a #### what bruce allen is doing. home boy is retired. rich AF and enjoying life. anything and everything regarding the WFT is in the wind.
I am pretty confused by this statement. Nothing else was revealed except for the stuff targeting Gruden and/or the Raiders.
I don't care what Bruce Allen is doing, but now you have moronic people in Congress trying to use the emails Gruden sent to Allen as the basis to open up a congressional investigation into the NFL to see if racism and homophobia are prevalent in the NFL. Part of their argument is that Bruce Allen was the president of the WFT.
Someone went out of their way to get Gruden and/or the Raiders. The leaks were specific to Gruden and could have been done before the season. The investigation into the WFT was finished in July.
the NFL has sealed the investigation into the WFT. PERIOD. END OF STORY
The NFL wrapped up their investigation into the WFT in July and fined them and sealed all the stuff months ago. Whoever leaked the Gruden stuff had this info months ago and sat on it. You also keep saying that too many people found out and that's why it came out. Now you are saying it's sealed so it's over. Well then if just because it was sealed no one else would have found out there would be no reason to leak the stuff months after the investigation was over and sealed.
so anything revealed OUTSIDE of that investigation(not related to the WFT) is fair game. no one gives a #### what bruce allen is doing. home boy is retired. rich AF and enjoying life. anything and everything regarding the WFT is in the wind.
I am pretty confused by this statement. Nothing else was revealed except for the stuff targeting Gruden and/or the Raiders.
I don't care what Bruce Allen is doing, but now you have moronic people in Congress trying to use the emails Gruden sent to Allen as the basis to open up a congressional investigation into the NFL to see if racism and homophobia are prevalent in the NFL. Part of their argument is that Bruce Allen was the president of the WFT.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Like I said, I don't know who or why but I think it is a dang fair question to ask for who and why as well as even when. Out of ALL those emails, in an organization that saw treating cheerleaders as they did (which is absolutely disgusting and shows an atmosphere that was welcoming to those kind of commentary we have seen from Gruden), that those were the worse of the worse that was in all those? That seems awfully hard to believe.
Your argument is awfully inconsistent. Gruden got caught because too many people saw them.... but it is over because the NFL sealed it and we won't know anything else from it.... your explanation that it is outside the investigation makes no sense at all. The emails are part of the investigation. Other than those specific emails about Gruden, the NFL has not offered a single email otherwise whether directly about the "investigation" or not.
Who... why... and when... are very fair questions to ask.
Chaka
Footballguy
Yeah, initially I thought maybe the Gruden emails may have been released with knowledge of higher ups in the league office for petty reasons. But I imagine the last thing in the Goodell and the owners wanted was fresh air to put the WFT investigation back into the public eye.
The emails were weaponized, Gruden (and/or the Raiders) were specifically targeted.
I personally want to shine the cold, harsh, sickly fluorescent light of Congressional investigation to bring the entire mess into the public space.
Not just to see who assassinated Gruden but to find out what else the league is hiding. I particularly want to know anything and everything they can find about relationships between teams, the league office and gambling interests. A notion that isn't crazy to consider as a motivation for assassinating Gruden.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Someone went out of their way to get Gruden and/or the Raiders. The leaks were specific to Gruden and could have been done before the season. The investigation into the WFT was finished in July.
i just don't buy that it was a 'hit job" on gruden or the raiders. i'm not a big conspiracy guy. it's just an opinion.
The NFL wrapped up their investigation into the WFT in July and fined them and sealed all the stuff months ago. Whoever leaked the Gruden stuff had this info months ago and sat on it. You also keep saying that too many people found out and that's why it came out. Now you are saying it's sealed so it's over. Well then if just because it was sealed no one else would have found out there would be no reason to leak the stuff months after the investigation was over and sealed.
i'm not communicating this very well. it makes perfect sense to me.i think there were multiple people that have seen ALL of the WFT "evidence". jon gruden might be the most famous person in the NFL. lets say the first 5 people that saw the emails, didn't care. and the 6th person did. cared a lot. and started bringing it up to their superiors. at this point the superiors have to cover their asses. it gets kicked up the chain. finally a decision is made. we(the NFL) are screwed if this ever comes out and too many people know about it now, to keep it under wraps. PR people say to release it. and the lawyers sign off on it too, because gruden is not related to the WFT
I am pretty confused by this statement. Nothing else was revealed except for the stuff targeting Gruden and/or the Raiders.
again, because it's not related to the WFT. gruden wasn't part of the sealed evidence. if the ball boy for the jags sent these emails, we wouldn't know anything about it. but it was gruden. arguably, the most famous dude in the NFL. if he was still the blowhard in the booth, he would have been canned too. it has nothing to do with the raiders
I don't care what Bruce Allen is doing, but now you have moronic people in Congress trying to use the emails Gruden sent to Allen as the basis to open up a congressional investigation into the NFL to see if racism and homophobia are prevalent in the NFL. Part of their argument is that Bruce Allen was the president of the WFT.
that's my point. no one cares about allen. no one will care about gruden in 2-3 months either. congress should stay out of it, and i bet they will.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
did gruden work for the wft? no
if there is a sexual harassment case at your work, do you hear any details of it? no
if it was discovered during the sexual harassment investigation, that someone at work, had done some really dumb ####, that had NOTHING to do with the harassment, and was fired for it. would you then expect to hear anything about the sexual harassment case? no
would you hear why the was idiot fired. probably
same thing here
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DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
assassinating grudenthe dude was a bad coach. and apparently, not a great guy. good riddance.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
I hear the Raiders are playing a game today. Looks like Waller is probably out and if he does play, will be limited. I don’t if Ruggs role changes much but he should get more targets. This is a game that should feature Edwards. Could be more touches for Drake too.
TampaMike19
Footballguy
DocHolliday
Footballguy
Chadstroma
Footballguy
If Waller doesn't play, I am interested to see Moreau's role. He isn't Waller but he also can catch and run too.
Unless they see a particular matchup they like, I think the Waller targets gets spread out among pretty much everyone... Ruggs maybe not so much, but Edwards, Renfrow, Moreau, and Drake all with potential for an uptick. If I had to put my money on one being the biggest beneficiary, I would go Renfrow working underneath Ruggs and Edwards blowing the top off the D.
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Chaka
Footballguy
I agree he put a mediocre product on the field. I agree he deserved to be on the hot seat at the very least for that.
the dude was a bad coach. and apparently, not a great guy. good riddance.
I agree he should have resigned after his hateful emails were released (and I would have agreed if Davis fired him).
But he was absolutely assassinated.
This! It's been driving me nuts the past 2 weeks. But I guess I shouldn't complain. A win is a win. But for 3 quarters they completely dominated. Just hate the lax D and tackling at the end of games.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Team looked pretty dang good! As mentioned, the 3 and out, early in the 4th is too conservative. That’s 2 games in a row. Don’t like it.
Anyone else notice the emergence of the screen game since Gruden left? Us old schoolers know the Raiders never ran screens for decades! Al Davis hated them for some reason. I give Olsen credit for this, helps the young, mediocre Oline in passing downs, very smart playcalling.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
it's refreshing. the offense also seems simpler, less gimmicky. they actually ran a jet sweep for ruggs.
themeistersinger
Footballguy
Interesting stat:
The Raiders entered as the only NFL club with four receivers at 300-plus yards receiving for the season (Henry Ruggs III, Hunter Renfrow, Darren Waller, Bryan Edwards). True to form, Carr's leading receiver in this one was none of the above (TE Foster Moreau, 60 yards).
https://www.nfl.com/news/2021-nfl-season-week-7-what-we-learned-from-sunday-s-games
The Raiders entered as the only NFL club with four receivers at 300-plus yards receiving for the season (Henry Ruggs III, Hunter Renfrow, Darren Waller, Bryan Edwards). True to form, Carr's leading receiver in this one was none of the above (TE Foster Moreau, 60 yards).
https://www.nfl.com/news/2021-nfl-season-week-7-what-we-learned-from-sunday-s-games
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
It’s funny, the Magic football dork in me, noticed that today. In that, none of the raiders wrs are that great for fantasy. Too hard to predict who’s getting the ball.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Carr finished 31 of 34 for 323 yards, and remains paced to break Peyton Manning's NFL record for passing yards in a season (5,477).
Derek Carr threw for a career-best 90.9 completion percentage Sunday, the best single-game percentage of the NFL season to date among qualified passers. Carr's previous career high was 90.6.
All you Carr haters should send Carr personal correspondence begging him to forgive you for not having a clue.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Carr looked really good today. I think he had a little more time t9 throw and it showed. He was able to step into throws, way more than any other game this year. That throw to jones was a beauty.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Who are the Carr haters?
Chaka
Footballguy
They were just here but they scurried under the dishwasher when you turned on the light.
massraider
Footballguy
Man, I really like this a lot. I really like that an offense can have different heroes each week. It's not Jacobs and Waller, or the offense stinks. Drake? Another dimension, and really, having one back makes you easier to defend.
Usage and targets for these players post-Gruden will be fascinating.
They aren't here... They're winning, funny how they crop up when they start losing though. Apparently Derek Carr plays defense and Oline too.
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