2023 Las Vegas Raiders - RIP Jack - one of the greatest Super Bowl moments ever (2 Viewers)

[LawFitz]

1st game is months away. Deep breath people

Projected starting QB is arguably a bum in sheep's clothing even when he's healthy. And has ridden the Shanahan offense and years of excuses that actually came from him constantly getting hurt. Ooh, if only The Grop could stay healthy - prorate his numbers! The one year he did stay healthy, he couldn't match Mahomes in the greatest moment of the greatest game. Now we're supposed to buy that this guy can compete with Mahomes without Shanahan. And then to top it all off, this same dude couldn't even pass his physical when they signed him, and their only out is that they can cut him at any time and be left with the Hoyer and Aiden O'Connell next season?!? This is way more likely a clown show right now than some super genius McDonald's moment waiting to reveal itself to the outside world.

 

[LawFitz]

^^^ I think what makes the above even more infuriating is that they had a functional starting QB under contract, which they lit on fire and then signed this mess in the immediate wake. Absolutely ****ing atrocious optics here.

 

[Chadstroma]

1st game is months away. Deep breath people

Projected starting QB is arguably a bum in sheep's clothing even when he's healthy. And has ridden the Shanahan offense and years of excuses that actually came from him constantly getting hurt. Ooh, if only The Grop could stay healthy - prorate his numbers! The one year he did stay healthy, he couldn't match Mahomes in the greatest moment of the greatest game. Now we're supposed to buy that this guy can compete with Mahomes without Shanahan. And then to top it all off, this same dude couldn't even pass his physical when they signed him, and their only out is that they can cut him at any time and be left with the Hoyer and Aiden O'Connell next season?!? This is way more likely a clown show right now than some super genius McDonald's moment waiting to reveal itself to the outside world.

What, me worry?

 

[Chadstroma]

^^^ I think what makes the above even more infuriating is that they had a functional starting QB under contract, which they lit on fire and then signed this mess in the immediate wake. Absolutely ****ing atrocious optics here.

A good QB that was very reliable to start, fighting through injuries that I have no doubt most QB's would not have played with. I have no reason to take a shot at Jimmy G but I would by lying if I said that he would not have missed time that Carr played with the same injuries.

But the REALLY frustrating thing is walking away from that QB for nothing to get this QB in return. That just sucks.

But then again, they are playing chess and we are coloring with crayons. How can we hope to understand the genius decision making at work here.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

carr was smart when he put his contract together. and most of us thought it was a good contract for the raiders. Hopkins just got straight up cut. you have to have a partner to take a trade.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

1st game is months away. Deep breath people

Projected starting QB is arguably a bum in sheep's clothing even when he's healthy. And has ridden the Shanahan offense and years of excuses that actually came from him constantly getting hurt. Ooh, if only The Grop could stay healthy - prorate his numbers! The one year he did stay healthy, he couldn't match Mahomes in the greatest moment of the greatest game. Now we're supposed to buy that this guy can compete with Mahomes without Shanahan. And then to top it all off, this same dude couldn't even pass his physical when they signed him, and their only out is that they can cut him at any time and be left with the Hoyer and Aiden O'Connell next season?!? This is way more likely a clown show right now than some super genius McDonald's moment waiting to reveal itself to the outside world.

everything you say is correct. gotta give it time to see how it plays out. carr was not the answer

 

[Chaka]

Short of miraculously acquiring Mahomes, this team was not going compete in 2023. It was always about 2024 and we all knew it. If you didn't know it you were deluding yourself.

The roster is objectively better and there is no reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center this fall. Personally I would rather see O'Connell under center this season. Let's see if he is anything, and if he isn't (which is likely) then go get a real QB next off-season.

So, let's keep the sarcasm and hijinks high in here and have some fun.

 

[Bruno2]

I’m honestly trying to give them the benefit of the doubt. Even trying to remember how the Patriots of the late 90s-early 00s were initially built at the beginning of the Belichick/Brady run. Tough D, lots of running of the football and Wally Pipp(ing) Drew Bledsoe for Brady. If I remember right, the passing offense wasn’t prolific until Randy Moss and Gronk came along. I just find it hard to believe the narrative that they expected exactly what has happened with JimmyG thus far.

 

[LawFitz]

No reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center in the fall.

I can think of a reason.

 

[LawFitz]

Might as well fire up the Aiden O'Connell bandwagon. Maybe he's the next Brady. Maybe the actual Brady can be convinced to lace 'em up again to be O'Connell's Bledsoe.

 

[Chadstroma]

No reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center in the fall.

Short of miraculously acquiring Mahomes, this team was not going compete in 2023. It was always about 2024 and we all knew it. If you didn't know it you were deluding yourself.

The roster is objectively better and there is no reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center this fall. Personally I would rather see O'Connell under center this season. Let's see if he is anything, and if he isn't (which is likely) then go get a real QB next off-season.

So, let's keep the sarcasm and hijinks high in here and have some fun.

There is also no reason to think that Jimmy G will make it a full season even if he is still under the center to start the year.... and in fact, there is reason to think he might not be under center. Sure, chances are his surgery went well and all is good but it is within plausible reason to worry about. And once more, he has not shown any reason to have any level of confidence in his ability to QB a entire season.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

No reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center in the fall.

Short of miraculously acquiring Mahomes, this team was not going compete in 2023. It was always about 2024 and we all knew it. If you didn't know it you were deluding yourself.

The roster is objectively better and there is no reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center this fall. Personally I would rather see O'Connell under center this season. Let's see if he is anything, and if he isn't (which is likely) then go get a real QB next off-season.

So, let's keep the sarcasm and hijinks high in here and have some fun.

There is also no reason to think that Jimmy G will make it a full season even if he is still under the center to start the year.... and in fact, there is reason to think he might not be under center. Sure, chances are his surgery went well and all is good but it is within plausible reason to worry about. And once more, he has not shown any reason to have any level of confidence in his ability to QB a entire season.

bruh...stop worrying

 

[Chadstroma]

It basically is living out the whole end question I always had in all the Carr debates in the past.... we get rid of him.... ok, great.... then what? The answer so far is a QB that is not better than him though is a better system fit that has played an entire season once in 9 years. There is plenty to debate whether or not Jimmy G is or is not an upgrade but I think it is about a push. But not only does he have a horrible record of actually staying healthy, he is currently not well enough to play football. We then let Stidham walk after supposedly wanting to see what he could do... and he showed what you would expect from a QB with no starting experience but enough to that you can say "Yes, he can be an effective backup at least" and grab Hoyer who no one serious is going to say should be starting. We draft a kid that clearly needs to develop. There is a whole lot of hope and prayer for pretty much no gain and a whole lot of downside. It isn't how you turn an organization around.

 

[Chadstroma]

No reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center in the fall.

Short of miraculously acquiring Mahomes, this team was not going compete in 2023. It was always about 2024 and we all knew it. If you didn't know it you were deluding yourself.

The roster is objectively better and there is no reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center this fall. Personally I would rather see O'Connell under center this season. Let's see if he is anything, and if he isn't (which is likely) then go get a real QB next off-season.

So, let's keep the sarcasm and hijinks high in here and have some fun.

There is also no reason to think that Jimmy G will make it a full season even if he is still under the center to start the year.... and in fact, there is reason to think he might not be under center. Sure, chances are his surgery went well and all is good but it is within plausible reason to worry about. And once more, he has not shown any reason to have any level of confidence in his ability to QB a entire season.

bruh...stop worrying

Of course not. I mean... we have the prettiest QB in the league so that has to count for a win or two, right?

 

[DA RAIDERS]

No reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center in the fall.

Short of miraculously acquiring Mahomes, this team was not going compete in 2023. It was always about 2024 and we all knew it. If you didn't know it you were deluding yourself.

The roster is objectively better and there is no reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center this fall. Personally I would rather see O'Connell under center this season. Let's see if he is anything, and if he isn't (which is likely) then go get a real QB next off-season.

So, let's keep the sarcasm and hijinks high in here and have some fun.

There is also no reason to think that Jimmy G will make it a full season even if he is still under the center to start the year.... and in fact, there is reason to think he might not be under center. Sure, chances are his surgery went well and all is good but it is within plausible reason to worry about. And once more, he has not shown any reason to have any level of confidence in his ability to QB a entire season.

bruh...stop worrying

Of course not. I mean... we have the prettiest QB in the league so that has to count for a win or two, right?

maybe 3

 

[Chaka]

No reason to think Garoppolo won't be under center in the fall.

I can think of a reason.

It's June...ish

 

[Chaka]

Might as well fire up the Aiden O'Connell bandwagon.

Agreed

 

[Chaka]

I just find it hard to believe the narrative that they expected exactly what has happened with JimmyG thus far.

The waiver clause in Jimmy Garoppolo's contract suggests they knew something.

 

[Bruno2]

It basically is living out the whole end question I always had in all the Carr debates in the past.... we get rid of him.... ok, great.... then what? The answer so far is a QB that is not better than him though is a better system fit that has played an entire season once in 9 years. There is plenty to debate whether or not Jimmy G is or is not an upgrade but I think it is about a push. But not only does he have a horrible record of actually staying healthy, he is currently not well enough to play football. We then let Stidham walk after supposedly wanting to see what he could do... and he showed what you would expect from a QB with no starting experience but enough to that you can say "Yes, he can be an effective backup at least" and grab Hoyer who no one serious is going to say should be starting. We draft a kid that clearly needs to develop. There is a whole lot of hope and prayer for pretty much no gain and a whole lot of downside. It isn't how you turn an organization around.

I said basically the same thing a page ago. I’m trying to wrap my head the plan but it doesn’t make any sense unless they’re leaving the door open for Brady to come back.

 

[Chaka]

It basically is living out the whole end question I always had in all the Carr debates in the past.... we get rid of him.... ok, great.... then what? The answer so far is a QB that is not better than him though is a better system fit that has played an entire season once in 9 years. There is plenty to debate whether or not Jimmy G is or is not an upgrade but I think it is about a push. But not only does he have a horrible record of actually staying healthy, he is currently not well enough to play football. We then let Stidham walk after supposedly wanting to see what he could do... and he showed what you would expect from a QB with no starting experience but enough to that you can say "Yes, he can be an effective backup at least" and grab Hoyer who no one serious is going to say should be starting. We draft a kid that clearly needs to develop. There is a whole lot of hope and prayer for pretty much no gain and a whole lot of downside. It isn't how you turn an organization around.

I said basically the same thing a page ago. I’m trying to wrap my head the plan but it doesn’t make any sense unless they’re leaving the door open for Brady to come back.

Florio has been covering this extensively; if Brady buys a piece of the team it will require all 31 other owners to approve allowing him to shut up. If he's an owner and tries to take the field it creates issues with roster limits and potential salary cap shenanigans.

Seems unlikely the 31 other owners all agree to let that happen.

The only hope is they view Brady as a significant enough potential revenue benefit for the league to make them ignore the other issues.

 

[LawFitz]

The only hope is they view Brady as a significant enough potential revenue benefit for the league to make them ignore the other issues.

Or they could delay officially consummating the ownership transaction by a year or two.

 

[Chaka]

BTW Brady doesn't suddenly make this team a contender. The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

 

[DocHolliday]

^^^ I think what makes the above even more infuriating is that they had a functional starting QB under contract, which they lit on fire and then signed this mess in the immediate wake. Absolutely ****ing atrocious optics here.

This is the part that bothers me and why I don’t think McD is the answer. He didn’t want Carr and moved on from him with no plan in place. You have to be a team builder and not a big baby that plays favorites. At least Gruden is gone.

 

[LawFitz]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

 

[ZADO]

crayons rule

 

[Chaka]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

 

[joey]

An extended hold out by Jacobs would be the icing on this crap cake the team is currently baking.

 

[LawFitz]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

You think this is even remotely the same as watching Brady be the starting QB for a year+?

And let's not forget that a tanking culture is a losing culture. You want that to be a young QBs first experience? How about the message that sends to the overall locker room culture?

By trying to win, you absolutely get more than just a worse draft pick the next season. You can dance around that original statement all you want. I think it's completely misguided.

 

[Chaka]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

You think this is even remotely the same as watching Brady be the starting QB for a year+?

And let's not forget that a tanking culture is a losing culture. You want that to be a young QBs first experience? How about the message that sends to the overall locker room culture?

By trying to win, you absolutely get more than just a worse draft pick the next season. You can dance around that original statement all you want. I think it's completely misguided.

Not dancing around anything. I'm happy to own it.

The roster appears better, particularly on defense. With my full Silver and Black colored glasses on and with a lot of squinting and Kool Aid drinking I can even make the argument: With Brady they may even be a playoff team with the chance to pull off a miracle. With the same glasses I could make the argument for Garoppolo taking them to the playoffs too.

But, objectively, they're not of the same caliber in 2023 as the Chiefs, Bills, Bengals etc.

I understand the concept of "learn for a year behind Brady". The flip side of that is it also kicks the can down the road and the Raiders go into 2024 still with little idea of what they have in O'Connell.

Getting to watch Brady's work ethic doesn't feel like a very compelling argument for the same amount of uncertainty.

It's not like Brady has much of a reputation as a QB mentor, either. I am sure if you were able to get Tampa Bay's coaching staff to be honest we would find that Brady went off script most of the time last season on the way to 751 passing attempts. I wonder what Kyle Trask took away from that?

If O'Connell is going to be a great QB it's because he already has the makeup to be one. If he can't get what he needs working with McDaniels, Garoppolo and Brady the owner then Brady the starting QB isn't going to change that.

Ride Garoppolo as long as you can then put the kid under center and let him sink or swim.

 

[Chaka]

An extended hold out by Jacobs would be the icing on this crap cake the team is currently baking.

I think history suggests overpaying RBs is the bigger mistake.

The shelf life of elite RB production is short. Jacobs won't get $10+ mil/year on the open market.

He has two options: 1) bank his career peak production and sign a multi-year deal at a shade under $7mil/season and a mostly bankable signing bonus 2) take the short money, sign the tender, bank $10 mil in 2023 and hope he can perform well enough to get a similar longer term contract offer in 2024 to make up the signing bonus he passed for this year.

His third option is to follow the LeVeon Bell path and, good luck with that.

 

[ZADO]

Uh oh.........

JOSH JACOBSRB, LAS VEGAS RAIDERS
View attachment 3587

Raiders GM Dave Ziegler said RB Josh Jacobs has not signed his franchise tag and will not participate in the voluntary offseason program.​

Jacobs is not allowed to participate in the voluntary offseason program until he signs his franchise tag or the two sides agree on a long-term contract. He previously said he was willing to play on the franchise tag but only if the Raiders added extra talent around him. The team has since added Jakobi Meyers. Ziegler said they are working through "that situation" with Jacobs but didn't seem concerned by the matter. For now, we expect Jacobs to play out the 2023 season on the tag and hit the open market next offseason.

Stop. at the moment, this is a non story.

and now ?

 

[Chadstroma]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

I don't think that is the same. I think there is value in seeing a vet show by doing. But I don't expect Brady will be playing at all. I put the chances somewhere around not a chance and extremely unlikely.

 

[joey]

An extended hold out by Jacobs would be the icing on this crap cake the team is currently baking.

I think history suggests overpaying RBs is the bigger mistake.

The shelf life of elite RB production is short. Jacobs won't get $10+ mil/year on the open market.

He has two options: 1) bank his career peak production and sign a multi-year deal at a shade under $7mil/season and a mostly bankable signing bonus 2) take the short money, sign the tender, bank $10 mil in 2023 and hope he can perform well enough to get a similar longer term contract offer in 2024 to make up the signing bonus he passed for this year.

His third option is to follow the LeVeon Bell path and, good luck with that.

I get that. I’m just saying that we have very few really good players on this team to really root for, and one of them is holding out.

 

[Chaka]

An extended hold out by Jacobs would be the icing on this crap cake the team is currently baking.

I think history suggests overpaying RBs is the bigger mistake.

The shelf life of elite RB production is short. Jacobs won't get $10+ mil/year on the open market.

He has two options: 1) bank his career peak production and sign a multi-year deal at a shade under $7mil/season and a mostly bankable signing bonus 2) take the short money, sign the tender, bank $10 mil in 2023 and hope he can perform well enough to get a similar longer term contract offer in 2024 to make up the signing bonus he passed for this year.

His third option is to follow the LeVeon Bell path and, good luck with that.

I get that. I’m just saying that we have very few really good players on this team to really root for, and one of them is holding out.

Both sides are doing what is best for themselves. I can't fault the Raiders or Jacobs at this point.

Let's see where they are by TC.

 

[Chaka]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

I don't think that is the same. I think there is value in seeing a vet show by doing. But I don't expect Brady will be playing at all. I put the chances somewhere around not a chance and extremely unlikely.

Sure, that absolutely makes sense, but it doesn't need to be Brady.

There is also a lot of value to getting reps.

 

[Chadstroma]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

I don't think that is the same. I think there is value in seeing a vet show by doing. But I don't expect Brady will be playing at all. I put the chances somewhere around not a chance and extremely unlikely.

Sure, that absolutely makes sense, but it doesn't need to be Brady.

There is also a lot of value to getting reps.

Yup, there are several washed up vets we can pick up when Jimmy G is not available.

Chess vs Crayons. This organization is operating at a whole different level.

 

[Chaka]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

I don't think that is the same. I think there is value in seeing a vet show by doing. But I don't expect Brady will be playing at all. I put the chances somewhere around not a chance and extremely unlikely.

Sure, that absolutely makes sense, but it doesn't need to be Brady.

There is also a lot of value to getting reps.

Yup, there are several washed up vets we can pick up when Jimmy G is not available.

Chess vs Crayons. This organization is operating at a whole different level.

Quality QBs are difficult to find. They weren't going to simply upgrade from Carr by osmosis. They made a lateral move to Garoppolo and the pursuit for the future Mr. Right continues. Just like it does for the majority of franchises.

Carr wasn't the answer for this staff, and he wasn't for the previous staff either. He was a mostly competent place holder. It was time to move on with, or without the QB of the future already rostered.

It's not chess or paint-by-numbers, it's the harsh reality of market economics.

 

[LawFitz]

pursuit for the future Mr. Right continues

Did not need to dump Carr while doing this. Could have handled it way more professionally and let the story play out with a draftee organically taking his job, as has happened with so many other tier II veterans at QB and every position in this game. The way they handled this transition was an awkward cross section of childish and dumb - could easily have Carr in Garrapolo's exact shoes right now, but without fresh screws in his foot. Agreed Carr wasn't the long term answer, but there was no reason to think he couldn't be a better stop-gap solution than a busted-foot Jimmy the Grop.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Uh oh.........

JOSH JACOBSRB, LAS VEGAS RAIDERS
View attachment 3587

Raiders GM Dave Ziegler said RB Josh Jacobs has not signed his franchise tag and will not participate in the voluntary offseason program.​

Jacobs is not allowed to participate in the voluntary offseason program until he signs his franchise tag or the two sides agree on a long-term contract. He previously said he was willing to play on the franchise tag but only if the Raiders added extra talent around him. The team has since added Jakobi Meyers. Ziegler said they are working through "that situation" with Jacobs but didn't seem concerned by the matter. For now, we expect Jacobs to play out the 2023 season on the tag and hit the open market next offseason.

Stop. at the moment, this is a non story.

and now ?

10 days later? still a non story.

 

[Chadstroma]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

I don't think that is the same. I think there is value in seeing a vet show by doing. But I don't expect Brady will be playing at all. I put the chances somewhere around not a chance and extremely unlikely.

Sure, that absolutely makes sense, but it doesn't need to be Brady.

There is also a lot of value to getting reps.

Yup, there are several washed up vets we can pick up when Jimmy G is not available.

Chess vs Crayons. This organization is operating at a whole different level.

Quality QBs are difficult to find. They weren't going to simply upgrade from Carr by osmosis. They made a lateral move to Garoppolo and the pursuit for the future Mr. Right continues. Just like it does for the majority of franchises.

Carr wasn't the answer for this staff, and he wasn't for the previous staff either. He was a mostly competent place holder. It was time to move on with, or without the QB of the future already rostered.

It's not chess or paint-by-numbers, it's the harsh reality of market economics.

You say this like they have an actual plan and this was all part of it.

 

[Chaka]

The only thing you get is a worse draft pick in 2024.

Totally disagree with this. If O'C is going to be anything, he could surely benefit from shadowing the GOAT for a year or two. GOAT over Grop all day.

Meh. He'll get plenty of face time with Brady as an owner.

I don't think that is the same. I think there is value in seeing a vet show by doing. But I don't expect Brady will be playing at all. I put the chances somewhere around not a chance and extremely unlikely.

Sure, that absolutely makes sense, but it doesn't need to be Brady.

There is also a lot of value to getting reps.

Yup, there are several washed up vets we can pick up when Jimmy G is not available.

Chess vs Crayons. This organization is operating at a whole different level.

Quality QBs are difficult to find. They weren't going to simply upgrade from Carr by osmosis. They made a lateral move to Garoppolo and the pursuit for the future Mr. Right continues. Just like it does for the majority of franchises.

Carr wasn't the answer for this staff, and he wasn't for the previous staff either. He was a mostly competent place holder. It was time to move on with, or without the QB of the future already rostered.

It's not chess or paint-by-numbers, it's the harsh reality of market economics.

You say this like they have an actual plan and this was all part of it.

And you know you are speaking from a position that they have no plan and haven't had one all along.

Neither of us has any real idea what is happening behind closed doors.

Carr wasn't the long term solution and neither is Jimmy G. The only plan seems to be to hold down the fort, doesn't really matter by who, until the QB of the future can be brought in.

 

[Chaka]

pursuit for the future Mr. Right continues

Did not need to dump Carr while doing this. Could have handled it way more professionally and let the story play out with a draftee organically taking his job, as has happened with so many other tier II veterans at QB and every position in this game. The way they handled this transition was an awkward cross section of childish and dumb - could easily have Carr in Garrapolo's exact shoes right now, but without fresh screws in his foot. Agreed Carr wasn't the long term answer, but there was no reason to think he couldn't be a better stop-gap solution than a busted-foot Jimmy the Grop.

Meh. Jimmy G not being in the lineup opens the door for O'Connell to see significant PT this year. Keeping Carr would likely have sidelined that outcome for longer.

The Raiders QB of the future likely isn't on the roster and he wasn't available, or let go, this past off season. Keeping Carr or rolling with Garoppolo wouldn't have changed that reality.

 

[krsone21]

I can't wait for the new #4 to see the field. Way more accurate than the old #4 and tougher in the pocket as well. Let's go O'connell!!!!

 

[kaso]

Hear me out for a moment. We may not have the next Brady in the QB room, but I feel like we have the next Farva.



(Nobody will convince me otherwise, O'Connell is a descendent of Farva from Super Troopers.)

 

[LawFitz]

Count me in on wanting to see O'Connell sooner rather than later, if the alternative is a busted grape. Best approach would be a year sitting behind a decent starting vet - or at minimum, most of that first year with some starts sprinkled in to finish. I'm in the sooner rather than later camp, but not necessarily the start from day one camp, especially not for a late-round pick.

 

[Chadstroma]

I can't wait for the new #4 to see the field. Way more accurate than the old #4 and tougher in the pocket as well. Let's go O'connell!!!!

I can't tell if you are joking or not.

 

[Chadstroma]

You guys are crazy with O'Connell. He may or may not be an NFL QB. His apparent strengths fit the system but he is not NFL ready right now. He needs time to develop. For his own good there should be no reason he sees the field in a season game.

 

[LawFitz]

For his own good there should be no reason he sees the field in a season game.

100%. Even the GOAT sat and watched. However, by fall, Brian Hoyer may be the only thing keeping the crowd from shouting for McDonald's new GOAT.

 

[Chaka]

Did not need to dump Carr while doing this.

IDK. I am as big a Carr supporter as you can find in this thread but what is the advantage of playing out this scenario with Carr vs Garoppolo?

Garoppolo is extremely injury prone but when he plays his teams win. You can explain away everything, as I did about a billion times in here talking about the defensive support (or lack thereof) Carr has received throughout his career. But the bottom line is Garoppolo is good enough to take a good team to a Super Bowl. To go with the excuse route; Garoppolo didn't lose the SB against the Chiefs as people like to claim (the Niners had a 10 point lead with 9 minutes left in the fourth. It was a team loss). The best QB in the game pulled out a miracle. And Garoppolo couldn't match it.

What we know about Carr OTOH, is that he isn't good enough to make up for mediocre to outright terrible defenses. But he generally remains healthy and is good enough to take a decent team to the playoffs. And he literally threw a game ending interception snatching defeat out of the jaws of victory in his only shot, so far, at elevating his legacy.

In a vacuum where is the advantage in having a $5 million more expensive Carr (up to $25 mil if Garoppolo's foot leads to him getting cut) for 17 vs Garoppolo for 17 games this year?

If we factor in injury history and, safely assume neither Carr or Garoppolo are the future for the Raiders: where is the advantage in having Carr for 17 vs Garoppolo for 8-10 and O'Connell for 7-10?

This just doesn't feel like the rudderless ship that so many of us are framing it as. It's a #####y reality in a market with only 4-7 elite QBs being fought over by 32 suitors.

Rip the band-aid off, build a foundation and aggressively pursue the future Mr. Right in the 2023-2024 off-season.

 

[Chaka]

You guys are crazy with O'Connell. He may or may not be an NFL QB. His apparent strengths fit the system but he is not NFL ready right now. He needs time to develop. For his own good there should be no reason he sees the field in a season game.

Why? To protect the deep 7-10 to 10-7 run this team is poised to make?

Tape up Garoppolo as long as he can hold together and then throw in the kid and let him sink-or-swim.