AFCCG: Steelers at Patriots Discussion (2 Viewers)

[kyoun1e]

Agreed.  Most of the pressure of late has been coming from the outside with Harrison and Dupree leading the surge.  They'll need to give the Patriots some different looks or they'll get shredded (as they usually do against the Pats).  

I think this is a big question...will they mix it up? 

I get the impression that PIT kinda "does what they  do" on D, lines up, and plays vs. doing a lot of complex disguising. They'd be changing their stripes a bit at a late stage.

It would be a risk, but a risk probably worth taking.

 

[pats3in4]

So what is different this year?  I'll put my thoughts on this in my next post to avoid this one getting too long (forum: "too late!").

The tl;dr answer to why the Pats haven't lost much without Gronk this year is the running game being much better than previous years.  The long answer...

Like many teams, the Pats had primarily used a single back in their running game.  The names changed...Green-Ellis in 2011, Ridley in 2012, Blount from 2013-2015...but the plan hadn't.  At the same time, the Pats also had clear designated pass-catching RBs...Woodhead in 2011, Vereen in 2012-2014, White in 2015.  The designated runners were decent, but nothing special, and the good defenses the Pats encountered in the playoffs could handle them (or not deal with them at all as the Pats had no RB threat against Denver last year with Blount out).  The pass catchers were talented, but were no real threat requiring respect in the running game so defenses knew they could play pass against them.  

In 2016, two things changed:

- The Pats used James Develin as a blocking back for Blount a lot.

- Double-threat Dion Lewis got healthy after Gronk went down.

Blount on the field means either a run or a pass in which he pretty much can be ignored as a receiver.  Good defenses can handle this.  But when the combo of Blount/Develin started running over defenses even when defenses knew it was coming, that's when things changed.  Defenses were forced to respect the run with them in there, which opened up the passing game to the other receivers despite Blount/Develin not being much of receiving threats.  This was particularly true on play-action as Edelman could find extra room against the LB or safety shading towards him as they bit on the fake handoff to Blount.  This of course cycled back to the running game being more effective as the D needed to respect the play-action.

When Blount needs a breather, or the Pats want that extra receiving threat on the field, they can now use Lewis and not give up the threat of a run.  There a huge thread on Lewis, highlighting how electric he is, so I don't need to sing his praises.  But that the D needs to respect his running ability when he lines up in the backfield is something Woodhead, Vereen and White never truly brought to the offense.  This helps Brady immeasurably as the D simply cannot overplay the pass.

While Brady has been putting up unbelievable stats since the Pats offense went pass-wacky in 2007, his offense this year is more like the 2003/2004 offenses where he had a lot of help on the ground.  A return to a more balanced attack is the reason the Pats are doing fine without Gronk and why they are favorites to move forward. 

So now Pats fans are left wondering how awesome this offense would have been with a healthy Gronk.  They would have been the runaway favorites, IMO.

 

[fred_1_15301]

I think this is a big question...will they mix it up? 

I get the impression that PIT kinda "does what they  do" on D, lines up, and plays vs. doing a lot of complex disguising. They'd be changing their stripes a bit at a late stage.

It would be a risk, but a risk probably worth taking.

I don't think any team is going to change too much at this point.  For better or worse, it's what got them to this point.  They have some very talented (fast!) players on defense and they may have to hope that the talent can get to Brady.  The Pats are going to put up points in this game.

 

[Hu-Tang Clan]

Vegas did factor it in, to be fair.  They opened the line at a pick 'em and the game was at Arrowhead, a notoriously difficult road venue.  To me, that says they thought the Steelers were a better team on a neutral field.  The public/sharps bet it down to KC -2.

Chiefs are 1-6 at home in the playoffs since 2004 so not really all that notoriously difficult for the opponent at all.

 

[Anarchy99]

I saw this one and just didn't realize just how mediocre Roelisberger has been on the road this year. Is there anything to explain this?

QB RATINGS IN ROAD GAMES FOR THE 2016 REGULAR SEASON

Ryan 115.0
Moore 113.6
Brady 111.9
Prescott 103.4
Rodgers 101.9
Cousins 101.5
Hower 100.3
Luck 98.4
Brees 95.7
Bradford 94.9
Dalton 92.7
Kessler 92.3
Carr 92.2
Mariota 92.0
Kaepernick 90.6
Stafford 90.5
Smith 88.2
Tannehill 86.7
Keenum 85.0
Rivers 84.7
Siemian 84.6
Winston 84.5
Taylor 82.4
Wilson 82.1
Bortles 81.2
Newton 81.2
Anderson 79.2
Griffin 79.1
Roethlisberger 78.4
Manning 78.1
Palmer 77.0
Flacco 75.8
Osweiler 72.1
Wentz 72.0
Cutler 70.9
Goff 70.9
Petty 62.1
Gabbert 58.2
Barkley 58.0
Fitzpatrick 61.6

What's up with that? Ben posted . . .

- A 62.4 rating against the Eagles, ranked 13th against the pass
- A 57.1 rating against the Dolphins, ranked 15th against the pass
- A 67.3 rating against the Ravens, ranked 9th against the pass
- A 74.7 rating against the Browns, ranked 21st against the pass
- A 37.8 rating against the Bills, ranked 6th against the pass
- A 72.5 rating against the Chiefs, ranked 18th against the pass

PIT went 3-3 in those games. Overall including the game against KC, Big Ben threw 9 TD to match his 9 INT.

I'm all ears for explanations on this one . . .

 

[fred_1_15301]

I saw this one and just didn't realize just how mediocre Roelisberger has been on the road this year. Is there anything to explain this?

QB RATINGS IN ROAD GAMES FOR THE 2016 REGULAR SEASON

Ryan 115.0
Moore 113.6
Brady 111.9
Prescott 103.4
Rodgers 101.9
Cousins 101.5
Hower 100.3
Luck 98.4
Brees 95.7
Bradford 94.9
Dalton 92.7
Kessler 92.3
Carr 92.2
Mariota 92.0
Kaepernick 90.6
Stafford 90.5
Smith 88.2
Tannehill 86.7
Keenum 85.0
Rivers 84.7
Siemian 84.6
Winston 84.5
Taylor 82.4
Wilson 82.1
Bortles 81.2
Newton 81.2
Anderson 79.2
Griffin 79.1
Roethlisberger 78.4
Manning 78.1
Palmer 77.0
Flacco 75.8
Osweiler 72.1
Wentz 72.0
Cutler 70.9
Goff 70.9
Petty 62.1
Gabbert 58.2
Barkley 58.0
Fitzpatrick 61.6

What's up with that? Ben posted . . .

- A 62.4 rating against the Eagles, ranked 13th against the pass
- A 57.1 rating against the Dolphins, ranked 15th against the pass
- A 67.3 rating against the Ravens, ranked 9th against the pass
- A 74.7 rating against the Browns, ranked 21st against the pass
- A 37.8 rating against the Bills, ranked 6th against the pass
- A 72.5 rating against the Chiefs, ranked 18th against the pass

PIT went 3-3 in those games. Overall including the game against KC, Big Ben threw 9 TD to match his 9 INT.

I'm all ears for explanations on this one . . .

He's definitely much better at home than he is on the road but the numbers (specifically QBR) don't tell the entire story IMO.  He was terrible against the Eagles but the whole team was.  That may been the worst overall performance I've seen from the Steelers in the Ben era.  He was bad against the Dolphins (can't recall when he got injured in that game).  In the Ravens game, he was clearly very hampered by the injury.  He could barely do anything and the game plan was ridiculously conservative to account for Ben's handicap.  Against the Browns, he just didn't have to do a whole lot IMO.  He was fine.  There were some red zone opportunities that ended up as short FGs but again it's the Browns so it's sufficient       He was horrible against the Bills and they just rode their horse.  Against the Chiefs, again it was just the red zone inefficiencies and a couple poor decisions.  Other than that, he moved the ball fine.  Yes he's been bad on the road unlike most of the guys on that list, he has the potential for a great game.  So I count 3 games where he was horrible and not due to injury.  Not great but not as bad as what people make him out to be.

 

[Godsbrother]

I saw this one and just didn't realize just how mediocre Roelisberger has been on the road this year. Is there anything to explain this?

QB RATINGS IN ROAD GAMES FOR THE 2016 REGULAR SEASON

Ryan 115.0
Moore 113.6
Brady 111.9
Prescott 103.4
Rodgers 101.9
Cousins 101.5
Hower 100.3
Luck 98.4
Brees 95.7
Bradford 94.9
Dalton 92.7
Kessler 92.3
Carr 92.2
Mariota 92.0
Kaepernick 90.6
Stafford 90.5
Smith 88.2
Tannehill 86.7
Keenum 85.0
Rivers 84.7
Siemian 84.6
Winston 84.5
Taylor 82.4
Wilson 82.1
Bortles 81.2
Newton 81.2
Anderson 79.2
Griffin 79.1
Roethlisberger 78.4
Manning 78.1
Palmer 77.0
Flacco 75.8
Osweiler 72.1
Wentz 72.0
Cutler 70.9
Goff 70.9
Petty 62.1
Gabbert 58.2
Barkley 58.0
Fitzpatrick 61.6

What's up with that? Ben posted . . .

- A 62.4 rating against the Eagles, ranked 13th against the pass
- A 57.1 rating against the Dolphins, ranked 15th against the pass
- A 67.3 rating against the Ravens, ranked 9th against the pass
- A 74.7 rating against the Browns, ranked 21st against the pass
- A 37.8 rating against the Bills, ranked 6th against the pass
- A 72.5 rating against the Chiefs, ranked 18th against the pass

PIT went 3-3 in those games. Overall including the game against KC, Big Ben threw 9 TD to match his 9 INT.

I'm all ears for explanations on this one . . .

I'll try:

Eagles:  No friggin' idea.  Just did not play well.  In fact the whole team was crap.  He was under a lot of pressure that game (4 sacks)
Dolphins:  Ben was injured in this game and should have been pulled.
Ravens:  First game after injury, came back way too early.
Browns:  Wasn't a bad performance, just nothing great.  The Steelers led the entire game and won by 15.
Bills:  Game was played in snow storm.  Bell ran for 236 yards and 3 TDs so they rode that horse.
Chiefs:  Again did not play a bad game but not great statistically.  One bad pick.   Other than that an OK performance that could have been better  if a couple TD passes weren't dropped.

Overall you can't argue that he plays much better at home than on the road.   He's going to have to play much better for the Steelers to win on Sunday.

ETA:  Ben had a couple nice road games as well:  @WAS, @IND @CIN so he doesn't always lay an egg on the road.  He is just more consistent at home.
 

 

[Franknbeans]

1. Whether or not Ben has a good game on the road.

2, Whether or not the Steelers can make in-game adjustments to whatever the Patriots throw at them on both sides of the ball.

3. Whether or not the Patriots figure out a way to slow down Bell.  I imagine the Steelers should stick what's working with Bell dominating touches and keeping Brady on the sideline.  Can they slow down Bell and contain Brown?  Will one of them bust out?  Will both?  Both had good games with Landry Jones under center, so I imagine what they'll face on Sunday will be something different.

4. Will Butler have a better game plan to stop Brady's short passing game than **** LeBeau ever did?

5. Will the pass rush force Brady off his spot.

if they don't make him uncomfortable back there, it's game over.

 

[Anarchy99]

5. Will the pass rush force Brady off his spot.

if they don't make him uncomfortable back there, it's game over.

In some ways, I think the getting pressure on Brady meme is a bit exaggerated. It's the coverage that is probably more important.Brady will read the defense, make the final read and play call, and then usually run some sore of quick strike pass that takes under 2 seconds to get rid of the ball. Very rarely is the pash rush so fierce that Brady doesn't have time to throw.

If Brady misread the defense, if the DB's took away the short route, if the defense stuck his receiver at the line, that's where Brady gets whacked and when the pass rush comes into play. A lot of times, the NE OL is basically instructed to push a player past the pocket or keep someone at bay initially with not a whole lot of additional requirements. If the pass is gone in 2 seconds, the LT or RB doesn't usually have to care what they need to do next. 

As the play continues to break down and Brady now needs second and third reads or has to look for longer routes or open receivers, that's when Brady is almost guaranteed to get hit. Put another way, NE doesn't scheme a ton of deep routes, they save that for the second half when they feel they have the defense lulled to sleep. When they do call deep plays, they pass protect accordingly. It's those short routes turned into intermediate rounds turned into long routes where Brady gets smashed.

So while I agree that getting to Brady is a necessity for the Steelers, I think the defensive scheme and coverage around the LOS is more vital to be able to get to Brady. And IMO, PIT should have figured out by now that blitzing to bring pressure is a sure fire way to get burned unless they can disguise it really, really well.

 

[captain_amazing]

 

 

[Anarchy99]

And I gotta ask the Pittsburgh faithful about this one. Bradshaw, Harris, Swann, the Steel Curtain, all those Hall of Famers. Four titles in six years. Smack dab in the middle of all that, this game happened.

Pittsburgh Steelers at Houston Oilers - October 9th, 1977

NINE turnovers? Against the Oilers? 

Big ol' Terry led the way with 4 INT's to go along with his 7 completions. Then Tony Dungy came in (yes . . . THAT Tony Dungy) and threw 2 picks of his own to go along with his 3 completions. When those two clearly didn't have it, they thew in Mike Kruczek, who at least completed 2 passes without getting picked.

Nothing says dominance like 12 completions on 33 passing attempts for 211 yards with 0 TD and 6 INT. For those of you scoring at home (and even if you're not), that boys and girls works out to a NEGATIVE 17.3 passer rating for the game.

But fear not, Steelers fans. There was always the running game to fall back on. They only put the ball on the mat five times, so I guess that is light years better than the passing game. They ended up losing 3 fumbles.

Does anyone remember this game? It can't be weather related, as they were playing indoors. Certainly this proves the ON ANY GIVEN SUNDAY axiom, but my goodness, what a total self-inflicted meltdown by the Steelers.

 

[Godsbrother]

 

Great QB but you gotta admit he looks like a dork in this clip

 

[Godsbrother]

And I gotta ask the Pittsburgh faithful about this one. Bradshaw, Harris, Swann, the Steel Curtain, all those Hall of Famers. Four titles in six years. Smack dab in the middle of all that, this game happened.

Pittsburgh Steelers at Houston Oilers - October 9th, 1977

NINE turnovers? Against the Oilers? 

Big ol' Terry led the way with 4 INT's to go along with his 7 completions. Then Tony Dungy came in (yes . . . THAT Tony Dungy) and threw 2 picks of his own to go along with his 3 completions. When those two clearly didn't have it, they thew in Mike Kruczek, who at least completed 2 passes without getting picked.

Nothing says dominance like 12 completions on 33 passing attempts for 211 yards with 0 TD and 6 INT. For those of you scoring at home (and even if you're not), that boys and girls works out to a NEGATIVE 17.3 passer rating for the game.

But fear not, Steelers fans. There was always the running game to fall back on. They only put the ball on the mat five times, so I guess that is light years better than the passing game. They ended up losing 3 fumbles.

Does anyone remember this game? It can't be weather related, as they were playing indoors. Certainly this proves the ON ANY GIVEN SUNDAY axiom, but my goodness, what a total self-inflicted meltdown by the Steelers.

Yep I was in college.   The thing I remember most is watching the game at the frat house and taking a beating from the my brothers cause most were Browns fans.

 

[Franknbeans]

In some ways, I think the getting pressure on Brady meme is a bit exaggerated. It's the coverage that is probably more important.Brady will read the defense, make the final read and play call, and then usually run some sore of quick strike pass that takes under 2 seconds to get rid of the ball. Very rarely is the pash rush so fierce that Brady doesn't have time to throw.

If Brady misread the defense, if the DB's took away the short route, if the defense stuck his receiver at the line, that's where Brady gets whacked and when the pass rush comes into play. A lot of times, the NE OL is basically instructed to push a player past the pocket or keep someone at bay initially with not a whole lot of additional requirements. If the pass is gone in 2 seconds, the LT or RB doesn't usually have to care what they need to do next. 

As the play continues to break down and Brady now needs second and third reads or has to look for longer routes or open receivers, that's when Brady is almost guaranteed to get hit. Put another way, NE doesn't scheme a ton of deep routes, they save that for the second half when they feel they have the defense lulled to sleep. When they do call deep plays, they pass protect accordingly. It's those short routes turned into intermediate rounds turned into long routes where Brady gets smashed.

So while I agree that getting to Brady is a necessity for the Steelers, I think the defensive scheme and coverage around the LOS is more vital to be able to get to Brady. And IMO, PIT should have figured out by now that blitzing to bring pressure is a sure fire way to get burned unless they can disguise it really, really well.

Yeah, I wasn't really referencing the blitz since the Steelers have been burned early and often by Brady before. I meant more of the interior line push so Brady can't just take a 3 step drop and let it fly. They need to get their hands up in the passing lanes and must force the issue. Either way, it's a tall order for their D as they have not really had any success pressuring him in the past. The one saving grace may be that Lebeau is gone so his failed schemes hopefully haven't been inherited by Butler.

 

[Tanner9919]

Tomlin is a clown. Is he going to run on the field to tackle Lewis when he breaks one down the sideline? 

What is his record v BB? 

As someone else said they have to change what they do defensively or theyll get crushed.again. I like the Steelers I want them to win big time! But if its the same ole same ole Steelers v. Pats its gonna be over 10 mins into the game.The stronger teams are in the NFC. Neither Pitt or NE would beat or keep up with ATL or gb offenses..atl has an underrated defense and a sick pass rush..

Ne looks like the same NE team BB keeps dragging to chamionship games or SBs  and keeps losing ..aside from a pick at the goal line BB is 0-3 in SBs since 07.. I dont expect a superman performance from Brady..But I dont expect Tomlin to change his ways.

 

[avina1]

hi guys, I'm a Bears fan but I think the Steelers win this one, and then the Superbowl against ATL.

Steelers win 28 - 24

ok goodbye

 

[kyoun1e]

Ne looks like the same NE team BB keeps dragging to chamionship games or SBs  and keeps losing ..aside from a pick at the goal line BB is 0-3 in SBs since 07.. I dont expect a superman performance from Brady..But I dont expect Tomlin to change his ways.

I guess that one shouldn't count.

This thread has been good at avoiding idiocy...until now.

 

[theplayer11]

Tomlin is a clown. Is he going to run on the field to tackle Lewis when he breaks one down the sideline? 

What is his record v BB? 

As someone else said they have to change what they do defensively or theyll get crushed.again. I like the Steelers I want them to win big time! But if its the same ole same ole Steelers v. Pats its gonna be over 10 mins into the game.The stronger teams are in the NFC. Neither Pitt or NE would beat or keep up with ATL or gb offenses..atl has an underrated defense and a sick pass rush..

Ne looks like the same NE team BB keeps dragging to chamionship games or SBs  and keeps losing ..aside from a pick at the goal line BB is 0-3 in SBs since 07.. I dont expect a superman performance from Brady..But I dont expect Tomlin to change his ways.

^stupid post alert

 

[fred_1_15301]

hi guys, I'm a Bears fan but I think the Steelers win this one, and then the Superbowl against ATL.

Steelers win 28 - 24

ok goodbye

Wait come back!  I think I like you.      

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

Great QB but you gotta admit he looks like a dork in this clip

True, but can you tell me which game the clip is from? NE 47 Pitt 31, I am wondering which particular ### woopin it was? Brady has destroyed Pitt so so many times (pretty much every time) it is hard to keep track

 

[Sabertooth]

Packers fan here.  I think the Steelers win this one as well.  Who has New England really played?  The Ravens?  

I feel Brown and Leveon will have good games.  

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

Getting a little quiet in here, ok.

How about we start listing the excuses the steelers are compiling.

1, The coach starts the week whining about losing a day and a half of preparation

2. Antonio Brown whining about Butler grabbing him

3. ?

Lets get this thing goin

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

Packers fan here.  I think the Steelers win this one as well.  Who has New England really played?  The Ravens?  

I feel Brown and Leveon will have good games.  

Sounds logical, until you ask who has Pitt really played?

 

[Sabertooth]

Sounds logical, until you ask who has Pitt really played?

Kansas City.  

 

[Boston]

You can only play who the schedule gives you...also, the Pats are not some team that has come out-of-nowhere due to an easy schedule...this is their sixth straight AFC title game...a good many of their players are more than battle-tested...

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

Kansas City.  

A 2pt (questionable call aided) win over the 20th ranked Off and 20th ranked Def  not a lot to hang your hat on imho.

 

[Sabertooth]

You can only play who the schedule gives you...also, the Pats are not some team that has come out-of-nowhere due to an easy schedule...this is their sixth straight AFC title game...a good many of their players are more than battle-tested...

Good point.  I'll forever be grateful to New England for putting the Hawks in their place.  Hat tip! 

 

[Evilgrin 72]

Of course there's a chance... a pretty damn good one. Anyone thinking this game is anything resembling a lock one way or another is choking on hometown D.  It could be a blowout one way or the other... but it probably wont be. Very much looking forward to this game.  

Hey @Evilgrin 72 @Evilgrin72 (Which is you?).... meet somewhere in the middle with two handles of whiskey, an 8-ball, and a 65" Flatscreen? 
 

I remember when I used to be able to do stuff like this.  Now, I'll be watching the game dry and then hitting the sack in order to be fresh for a 9 AM presentation to the board on Monday.  I hate my life.

 

[[icon]]

I remember when I used to be able to do stuff like this.  Now, I'll be watching the game dry and then hitting the sack in order to be fresh for a 9 AM presentation to the board on Monday.  I hate my life.

You never met up with me in Orlando, *******. It woulda been epic  Flying in this March for a week long show again... staying at the vista cay instead of mariott grande vista. Likely still will be hitting Charley's for that damn 23oz Prime Filet. 

 

[fred_1_15301]

True, but can you tell me which game the clip is from? NE 47 Pitt 31, I am wondering which particular ### woopin it was? Brady has destroyed Pitt so so many times (pretty much every time) it is hard to keep track

Now we're talking!  The trash talk is back    

 

[fred_1_15301]

Packers fan here.  I think the Steelers win this one as well.  Who has New England really played?  The Ravens?  

I feel Brown and Leveon will have good games.  

This is not really a great reason as to why Team A will beat Team B though.  Even if New England hasn't played any good teams, they still may very well be a dominant team.  You can only play who is on your schedule.  They've beaten the #### out of just about everyone.  

 

[fred_1_15301]

Getting a little quiet in here, ok.

How about we start listing the excuses the steelers are compiling.

1, The coach starts the week whining about losing a day and a half of preparation

2. Antonio Brown whining about Butler grabbing him

3. ?

Lets get this thing goin

1.  That was meant to be a private conversation (pep talk) between the coach and his team.  God only knows what the evil emperor says to his team behind closed doors.

2. What did he say?  I heard a few quotes today where he basically said Butler would be following him around the field.  Didn't seem like any excuses.  Why would he make excuses when he knows that he's going to torch the guy      

3. ?

 

[Godsbrother]

A 2pt (questionable call aided) win over the 20th ranked Off and 20th ranked Def  not a lot to hang your hat on imho.

Is this Travis Kelce?

 

[fred_1_15301]

Is this Travis Kelce?

Right?  I can't believe people are questioning what was a pretty obvious hold.  

 

[Coeur de Lion]

Right?  I can't believe people are questioning what was a pretty obvious hold.  

Absolutely. Not to mention that Pittsburgh was also going to get the ball back with the score tied, more than 2 1/2 minutes left, and 2 TOs, and they had been going through the KC D like a hot knife through butter pretty much all game. It's just a really stupid thing to cry about.

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

Was it a hold? Sure, but often and particularly in that situation its often not called. Game on the line and u call crap like that? For instance, go back and look at the David Tyree play and take a look at how many holds could have been called that weren't.

Were it reversed there is no doubt steeler nation would view it very differently. As for what might have happened afterward I think the steelers would have probably won anyway, just tweakin the guy crowing about the win over kc, thats all

 

[NE_REVIVAL]

1.  That was meant to be a private conversation (pep talk) between the coach and his team.  God only knows what the evil emperor says to his team behind closed doors.

2. What did he say?  I heard a few quotes today where he basically said Butler would be following him around the field.  Didn't seem like any excuses.  Why would he make excuses when he knows that he's going to torch the guy      

3. ?

I understand the convo was private, but the first thing u say to your team you plant the seed and tell them they are at a disadvantage.

Brown working the refs talkin bout how butler uses his hands (ie holds) more than anyone in the league. Kinda surprised the prissy little brown could pull himself away from the mirror long enough to talk to the media

 

[Godsbrother]

Was it a hold? Sure, but often and particularly in that situation its often not called. Game on the line and u call crap like that? For instance, go back and look at the David Tyree play and take a look at how many holds could have been called that weren't.

Were it reversed there is no doubt steeler nation would view it very differently. As for what might have happened afterward I think the steelers would have probably won anyway, just tweakin the guy crowing about the win over kc, thats all

It has been said that holding could be called on every play.  That is why it is stupid to start blaming losses on them, especially one where the guy has is arm around the defenders neck and pulls him to the ground.  That was a text book holding call.

 

[Anarchy99]

Personally, I could care less who said what on social media or in the locker room. Equally so in terms of reactions to such information and incidents. That will impact the game as much as less as what color socks the players are wearing. 

 

[fred_1_15301]

I understand the convo was private, but the first thing u say to your team you plant the seed and tell them they are at a disadvantage.

Brown working the refs talkin bout how butler uses his hands (ie holds) more than anyone in the league. Kinda surprised the prissy little brown could pull himself away from the mirror long enough to talk to the media

Yup great strategy actually.  Plant that "us against the world" mentality.  Belichick has that mastered.  

 

[Bad_Mo]

Great QB but you gotta admit he looks like a dork in this clip

I think he was hamming it up, intentionally looking like a "dork"...

Regardless, if looking like that lands you Giselle...sign me up for dork lessons.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Sounds logical, until you ask who has Pitt really played?

They beat 12-4 Kansas City twice. 
They beat the 11-5 Giants who had just won 6 in a row.
 

 

[Godsbrother]

They beat 12-4 Kansas City twice. 
They beat the 11-5 Giants who had just won 6 in a row.
 

They also played the 13-3 Dallas Cowboys pretty competitively, holding the lead until the final 20 seconds or so.

 

[Godsbrother]

I think he was hamming it up, intentionally looking like a "dork"...

Regardless, if looking like that lands you Giselle...sign me up for dork lessons.

I am thinking that being an average dork isn't going get you Giselle.  You also need fame and money...

 

[Evilgrin 72]

They beat 12-4 Kansas City twice. 
They beat the 11-5 Giants who had just won 6 in a row.
 

What also gets lost in the "what playoff teams has ________ played" is that there are a lot of teams that were arguably as good or better than a couple of the teams that made the playoffs (at least as they were week 18.)  Steelers beat Baltimore, Cincinnati twice, Buffalo, Washington, and Indianapolis all on the road and all of those teams besides Cincy were .500 or better and most just barely missed the playoffs.  They also played that thriller against Dallas that they led with under a minute to go before blowing it.

This isn't to say anything vis-a-vis New England, just saying the Steelers didn't exactly have a cupcake schedule.  I think at one point I read it was the 3rd toughest in the NFL this year.  I think that was largely because aside from arguably the Jets game and the 2 games with Cleveland (one of which their key starters didn't even play,) there were really no "gimme" games on it.

In games they played this year with Ben, Bell, and Brown all active for 60 minutes, they're 10-2, with the only two losses being a 7-point defeat at Baltimore in Ben's first game back off the injury (a game in which he's always notoriously rusty) and the last-second loss to Dallas.  I think the Pats only have 1 loss since Brady returned, so that's even better, but it was against a slightly weaker schedule (NFC West vs. NFC East being the major factor there.)

Bottom line is that I don't think the "who did they beat?" discussion is a big factor either way.  Pretty much a wash as far as I'm concerned.

 

[PhD]

A 2pt (questionable call aided) win over the 20th ranked Off and 20th ranked Def  not a lot to hang your hat on imho.

and with that, you immediately lose all credibility.  

It's not like the tuck rule out there.  There is not a person with any authority in football who argues that it wasn't a hold or that it shouldn't have been called - consider that it was THAT blatant of a foul that even in that situation it had to be called.  

 

[Bossman]

Per Brian Wilson / CBS Sports

Edelman comments on Antonio Brown locker room streem:

"That's how that team is run," Pats wideout Julian Edelman told WEEI on Monday. "I personally don't think that would be something that would happen in our locker room, but hey, whatever. Some people like red and some people like blue. Some people like tulips and some people like roses. Whatever."

and Brady:

"That's against our team policy. I don't think that would go over well with our coach."

Link: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/julian-edelman-on-antonio-brown-video-thats-how-that-team-is-run/

 

[Godsbrother]

Per Brian Wilson / CBS Sports

Edelman comments on Antonio Brown locker room streem:

"That's how that team is run," Pats wideout Julian Edelman told WEEI on Monday. "I personally don't think that would be something that would happen in our locker room, but hey, whatever. Some people like red and some people like blue. Some people like tulips and some people like roses. Whatever."

and Brady:

"That's against our team policy. I don't think that would go over well with our coach."

Link: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/julian-edelman-on-antonio-brown-video-thats-how-that-team-is-run/

I don't think it went over well with Tomlin either but the water under the bridge is out of the cat's bag now.  You can't go back and undo it.  

 

[Steeler]

Per Brian Wilson / CBS Sports

Edelman comments on Antonio Brown locker room streem:

"That's how that team is run," Pats wideout Julian Edelman told WEEI on Monday. "I personally don't think that would be something that would happen in our locker room, but hey, whatever. Some people like red and some people like blue. Some people like tulips and some people like roses. Whatever."

and Brady:

"That's against our team policy. I don't think that would go over well with our coach."

Link: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/julian-edelman-on-antonio-brown-video-thats-how-that-team-is-run/

Tomlin discusses AB video in Press Conference: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6nfhnXrw40

I thought Tomlin handled it perfectly and it's a non-issue moving forward based on this response and his message to AB.

 

[Anarchy99]

Even more from the old, regurgitated stat collection I have laying around in my basement that shows absolutely nothing cuz only recent games matter category . . .

Results from all NE home games with Brady playing and Gronk NOT playing:
11-2 record, 32.2 ppg PF, +12.8 ppg margin of victory

Results from all PIT road games with Roethlisberger, Bell, and Brown all playing:
13-9 record, 21.7 ppg PF, +0.9 ppg margin of victory