Another plane crash: Germanwings A320 (1 Viewer)

[squidrope]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

They do not think the co-pilot passed out because he did something manually with the flight control.

The history of the co-pilot is now probably the key focus. Some facts here.

Can't remember if it was in this awesome thread or in the knock-off thread or not, but he had 630 flight hours. I'm not sure if that's in total or just in a commercial capacity, but that's VERY VERY low hours for a commercial pilot to be flying a A320. At least it seems so in my mind. I think the FAA regulations require 1,500 here in the US.

NBC reporting that co pilot was licensed by the FAA in 2012 to fly single engine non-commercial planes.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

They do not think the co-pilot passed out because he did something manually with the flight control.

The history of the co-pilot is now probably the key focus. Some facts here.

Can't remember if it was in this awesome thread or in the knock-off thread or not, but he had 630 flight hours. I'm not sure if that's in total or just in a commercial capacity, but that's VERY VERY low hours for a commercial pilot to be flying a A320. At least it seems so in my mind. I think the FAA regulations require 1,500 here in the US.

NBC reporting that co pilot was licensed by the FAA in 2012 to fly single engine non-commercial planes.

It was his life long dream to become a pilot.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

damn kid was probably engrossed in his texting.

 

[TenTimes]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

 

[msommer]

Possible solution

Flight path entered by pilot prior to take off.

Flight path approval needed by air traffic control.

If plane deviates from the flight path without ground approval.

Autopilot automatically engages and plane continues on original flight path.

Pilots lose control of plane, and plane is flown by autopilot until ATC gives control back to pilots.

Big storm in flight path, ground approval to deviate not given, plane crashes

Sounds familiar? It should, because that is exactly what happened on the AirAsia flight a few months back

 

[culdeus]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

 

[squidrope]

Possible solution

Flight path entered by pilot prior to take off.

Flight path approval needed by air traffic control.

If plane deviates from the flight path without ground approval.

Autopilot automatically engages and plane continues on original flight path.

Pilots lose control of plane, and plane is flown by autopilot until ATC gives control back to pilots.

Big storm in flight path, ground approval to deviate not given, plane crashes

Sounds familiar? It should, because that is exactly what happened on the AirAsia flight a few months back

Then have a component that when atmospheric conditions get to "X" or a collision is imminent, ATC cannot engage autopilot.

 

[hxperson]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?

It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

 

[Keerock]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?

It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

Pegging?

 

[culdeus]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?

It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

You kill random people for no reason it's terrorism. What do you call McVeigh? A murderer or terrorist?

I don't really see the point in parsing the two. you kill random people and you are a terrorist. You target someone you know and you are a murder in my book.

 

[Keerock]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?

It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

You kill random people for no reason it's terrorism. What do you call McVeigh? A murderer or terrorist?

I don't really see the point in parsing the two. you kill random people and you are a terrorist. You target someone you know and you are a murder in my book.

Maybe he knew all the passengers?

 

[TenTimes]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Yea when I tuned out they didn't have the audio yet of the co-pilot breathing (his personal headset microphone audio I mean), medical correspondent was speculating but couldn't say much without knowing if there was audible breathing or not.

A retired FAA crash investigator seemed pretty sure no further details (including that audio) would be released once the beating on the door was discovered.

I wonder why the crew as a whole left a single pilot in the cockpot anyway? Shouldn't an attendant step in during bathroom breaks incase of emergency.

 

[fred_1_15301]

Did anyone notice that the 2 threads have been merged and Fat Nick is considered the OP of the master thread? I bet you Fat Nick noticed.

 

[Scoresman]

why cant they build the whole plane out of the stuff they use for the black box?

Because it would weigh too much.

But every plane already has a black box on it and that obviously doesnt weigh too much.

 

[hxperson]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?

It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

Pegging?

Ok, not anything. I'd rather lose my right arm than be caught waxing my chest.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Did anyone notice that the 2 threads have been merged and Fat Nick is considered the OP of the master thread? I bet you Fat Nick noticed.

FTR El Floppo's thread had more responses at the time of the merger. Also, better schtick.

WINNING

 

[fred_1_15301]

why cant they build the whole plane out of the stuff they use for the black box?

Because it would weigh too much.

But every plane already has a black box on it and that obviously doesnt weigh too much.

Or can they just create a bunch of black boxes and encapsulate the passengers/crew inside the boxes?

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Yea when I tuned out they didn't have the audio yet of the co-pilot breathing (his personal headset microphone audio I mean), medical correspondent was speculating but couldn't say much without knowing if there was audible breathing or not.

A retired FAA crash investigator seemed pretty sure no further details (including that audio) would be released once the beating on the door was discovered.

I wonder why the crew as a whole left a single pilot in the cockpot anyway? Shouldn't an attendant step in during bathroom breaks incase of emergency.

I heard one of the ex-NSTB people on TV this morning say that on U.S flights a flight attendant must go into the cockpit if one of the pilots needs to take a leak. Apparently not every other country has this policy.

 

[RUSF18]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Yea when I tuned out they didn't have the audio yet of the co-pilot breathing (his personal headset microphone audio I mean), medical correspondent was speculating but couldn't say much without knowing if there was audible breathing or not.

A retired FAA crash investigator seemed pretty sure no further details (including that audio) would be released once the beating on the door was discovered.

I wonder why the crew as a whole left a single pilot in the cockpot anyway? Shouldn't an attendant step in during bathroom breaks incase of emergency.

I heard one of the ex-NSTB people on TV this morning say that on U.S flights a flight attendant must go into the cockpit if one of the pilots needs to take a leak. Apparently not every other country has this policy.

Also have heard this spoken about but have seen other places claim that it's not actually written down in a reg anywhere.

 

[Fat Nick]

Did anyone notice that the 2 threads have been merged and Fat Nick is considered the OP of the master thread? I bet you Fat Nick noticed.

Suck it Floppo!

 

[Fat Nick]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

They do not think the co-pilot passed out because he did something manually with the flight control.

The history of the co-pilot is now probably the key focus. Some facts here.

Can't remember if it was in this awesome thread or in the knock-off thread or not, but he had 630 flight hours. I'm not sure if that's in total or just in a commercial capacity, but that's VERY VERY low hours for a commercial pilot to be flying a A320. At least it seems so in my mind. I think the FAA regulations require 1,500 here in the US.

NBC reporting that co pilot was licensed by the FAA in 2012 to fly single engine non-commercial planes.

So that's the same license I have...I hope that he just got that as a start, and then advanced it in Europe under whatever agency they have there.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

why cant they build the whole plane out of the stuff they use for the black box?

Because it would weigh too much.

But every plane already has a black box on it and that obviously doesnt weigh too much.

Or can they just create a bunch of black boxes and encapsulate the passengers/crew inside the boxes?

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

 

[fred_1_15301]

why cant they build the whole plane out of the stuff they use for the black box?

Because it would weigh too much.

But every plane already has a black box on it and that obviously doesnt weigh too much.

Or can they just create a bunch of black boxes and encapsulate the passengers/crew inside the boxes?

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

 

[jamny]

Imagine the co-pilot's parents. Already devastated by the crash, now to find out it might have been done on purpose by your son.

 

[Fat Nick]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

 

[TheIronSheik]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

 

[Statcruncher]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

Same reason as almost everything, money.

 

[Scoresman]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

The black box weighs too much

 

[TheIronSheik]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

Same reason as almost everything, money.

No. I meant like why isn't this like a mandatory thing? Like seat belts and airbags. No one says they aren't in a car because it's too expensive.

 

[tjnc09]

It seems like evey pilot should have an unique pass code that can override the manual lock. Pilot suicide isn't a new concept so it's strange that they make it impossible to get back into the c-pit if one of the pilots leaves. I know this was a "brilliant" idea after 9/11 but it was only a few years ago a pilot did the same thing intentionally crashing a plane full of passengers into the ground.

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

Imagine the co-pilot's parents. Already devastated by the crash, now to find out it might have been done on purpose by your son.

Maybe they are partly to blame.

 

[mquinnjr]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

Same reason as almost everything, money.

No. I meant like why isn't this like a mandatory thing? Like seat belts and airbags. No one says they aren't in a car because it's too expensive.

They won't even put their AARP-eligible planes (based on manufacture date) on their respective balance sheets or allow a passenger to bag without charge, but surely airline companies will invest in these?

 

[mr roboto]

I feel like the door system will always have some kind of weakness. It's either designed to keep people out (giving people inside the power) or designed to let the right people in (which could be exploited by the wrong person). What's more likely - someone inside the cockpit (pilot) locking people out to the detriment of the safety of the flight (what happened here) or someone getting in who shouldn't be there? This incident aside I'm still more concerned with hijacking and terrorism from the flying public not the crew.

 

[renesauz]

Seems like either they know more than they're saying or the prosecutor is making a snap judgment about this deliberate thing....

Is there any way the pilot could have passed out or had some other medical incident that would cause a steep descent?

They haven't found the data recorder so perhaps once that's found there will be more info, unless they have something not being released to the public.

Was following this last night. They did find the data recorder but speculation was that because criminal intent is suspected they're going to keep anything they find confidential for now.

Someone was banging on the door and there was screaming on the audio. Unless he slumped over it was a terrorist attack. They could still hear the Co breathing so he wasn't dead and there was enough O2 to let people still scream.

Terrorist.

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?

It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

You kill random people for no reason it's terrorism. What do you call McVeigh? A murderer or terrorist?

I don't really see the point in parsing the two. you kill random people and you are a terrorist. You target someone you know and you are a murder in my book.

Terrorists have an agenda to promote. Mass murderers do not. Sounds more likely it was a mass murder/suicide than terrorist plot.

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

It seems like evey pilot should have an unique pass code that can override the manual lock. Pilot suicide isn't a new concept so it's strange that they make it impossible to get back into the c-pit if one of the pilots leaves. I know this was a "brilliant" idea after 9/11 but it was only a few years ago a pilot did the same thing intentionally crashing a plane full of passengers into the ground.

All you need to ensure is the two person rule, having someone step into the cockpit if pilot/co-pilot needs to tinkle. But then the person replacing said pilot could be in cahoots with the other pilot, or the other pilot offs the third person. Someone has to actually fly the plane, I'm not sure any system is fool-proof. If a pilot wants to crash a plane, it's not going to be easy to stop him.

 

[mr roboto]

It seems like evey pilot should have an unique pass code that can override the manual lock. Pilot suicide isn't a new concept so it's strange that they make it impossible to get back into the c-pit if one of the pilots leaves. I know this was a "brilliant" idea after 9/11 but it was only a few years ago a pilot did the same thing intentionally crashing a plane full of passengers into the ground.

All you need to ensure is the two person rule, having someone step into the cockpit if pilot/co-pilot needs to tinkle. But then the person replacing said pilot could be in cahoots with the other pilot, or the other pilot offs the third person. Someone has to actually fly the plane, I'm not sure any system is fool-proof. If a pilot wants to crash a plane, it's not going to be easy to stop him.

This.

 

[Fat Nick]

It seems like evey pilot should have an unique pass code that can override the manual lock. Pilot suicide isn't a new concept so it's strange that they make it impossible to get back into the c-pit if one of the pilots leaves. I know this was a "brilliant" idea after 9/11 but it was only a few years ago a pilot did the same thing intentionally crashing a plane full of passengers into the ground.

So the logic here was that if somebody outside the cockpit had the ability to get inside the cockpit no matter what (i.e. against the wishes of whomever was IN the cockpit), that was a security issue. They could basically bring up passenger after passenger to the pilot outside the cockpit, and say, "If you don't use your code to open that door, we'll cut their throat." Until the pilot broke down and gave them the code. I get why it is the way it is...Having a minimum of 2 people in the cockpit at all times is a good step...

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

It seems like evey pilot should have an unique pass code that can override the manual lock. Pilot suicide isn't a new concept so it's strange that they make it impossible to get back into the c-pit if one of the pilots leaves. I know this was a "brilliant" idea after 9/11 but it was only a few years ago a pilot did the same thing intentionally crashing a plane full of passengers into the ground.

I think I heard the guy on TV this morning saying that this is a code that the pilot can use to override the manual lock. BUT IIRC that code can be overridden by whoever is in the cockpit.

 

[Statcruncher]

or maybe they can design an inflatable thingamabob for weight considerations that encapsulates the entire plane within a big rubber ball.

Now you're just being ridiculous.

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

Same reason as almost everything, money.

No. I meant like why isn't this like a mandatory thing? Like seat belts and airbags. No one says they aren't in a car because it's too expensive.

It may be some day, but it takes time. Airbags were invented in the 70's but didn't become mandatory in the US until 1989. The UK doesn't have any laws requiring airbags according to Wiki.

 

[Fat Nick]

It seems like evey pilot should have an unique pass code that can override the manual lock. Pilot suicide isn't a new concept so it's strange that they make it impossible to get back into the c-pit if one of the pilots leaves. I know this was a "brilliant" idea after 9/11 but it was only a few years ago a pilot did the same thing intentionally crashing a plane full of passengers into the ground.

All you need to ensure is the two person rule, having someone step into the cockpit if pilot/co-pilot needs to tinkle. But then the person replacing said pilot could be in cahoots with the other pilot, or the other pilot offs the third person. Someone has to actually fly the plane, I'm not sure any system is fool-proof. If a pilot wants to crash a plane, it's not going to be easy to stop him.

Yeah. Agree that having someone else in there is a key step. Totally agree that it's not foolproof. If the two are in cahoots, then it is what it is, but at least it makes it more difficult. You'd have to have that exact combination of pilot/FA on the same flight, and they'd have to know in advance who was "in," which increases the odds of them being discovered. The "Lone wolf," practicing a "tell no one and act alone," is a lot harder to discover than a network that needs to communicate.

I agree though...Even if the FA steps in, if the pilot left in there wanted to bring it down, I don't think that FA is going to stop him.

 

[Keerock]

Hehe.. he said "tinkle"

 

[DCThunder]

I used to fly JetBlue a lot and would sit in the front row of the plane because my wife had a disability that required easy access to the front of the plane. The seats had a clear view of the front lavatory. About 3/4s of the way into a 2+ hour flight, one of the pilots would come out, go into the head and take care of business. When he did, the flight attendants would move one of the beverage carts out of its storage slot and put it crosswise across the aisle. Then another FA would go into the cockpit. When the pilot came out of the head, everything went back to normal. So at least on JetBlue, having a 2nd person in the cockpit at all times, seems to be mandatory.

 

[Fat Nick]

They need to find out how to scale THIS up...

Wow! Why isn't this on every small plane right now?

So I once read an interesting study that said that this system was often (forget the %, but it was well above minimal) not even deployed in fatal crashes, despite the fact tha it could have saved the lives of the pilot/passengers. The reason cited is that basically, when you pull the chute, you've basically committed yourself to your plane being a near total loss, and many pilots think they can recover way past the point of no return.

Sad that $$$ are what you think about when a plane is crashing, but it's very true. I guess this wouldn't be as big of a deal for commercial pilots as the airline foots that bill, but still...I don't see why a combination of systems couldn't be used on a larger jetliner.

If the system is pulled, step 1 is that the plane's engines cut out. Step 2 is that the plane holds altitude with no power to bleed off speed. Step 3 is that the plane must enter a stall. At the point of stall, chutes deploy. You'd have to slow a jet down or the chutes would rip right off, but I feel like chutes mounted, say, nose, tail, mid, and wings, and deployed at a slow enough speed could work.

 

[Officer Pete Malloy]

Not sure if this helps or not...5 min long video on Airbus cockpit access

 

[hxperson]

Could be just a crazy. If it was a terrorist attack, why has it taken so long for any group to publicly claim it? Why would they go through all this without an immediate follow through message?


It certainly could be terrorism, but I'm still open minded about anything right now.

You kill random people for no reason it's terrorism. What do you call McVeigh? A murderer or terrorist?

I don't really see the point in parsing the two. you kill random people and you are a terrorist. You target someone you know and you are a murder in my book.

Terrorists have an agenda to promote. Mass murderers do not. Sounds more likely it was a mass murder/suicide than terrorist plot.

Agree...not sure what I'd call McVeigh, but just killing random people does not make one a terrorist, by my definition nor any dictionary that I've seen. There is usually some external goal in mind for terrorism, and at this point we have no idea if the co-pilot had one here.

 

[TenTimes]

No. I meant like why isn't this like a mandatory thing? Like seat belts and airbags. No one says they aren't in a car because it's too expensive.

Narrator: A new car built by my company leaves somewhere traveling at 60 mph. The rear differential locks up. The car crashes and burns with everyone trapped inside. Now, should we initiate a recall? Take the number of vehicles in the field, A, multiply by the probable rate of failure, B, multiply by the average out-of-court settlement, C. A times B times C equals X. If X is less than the cost of a recall, we don't do one.

Business woman on plane: Are there a lot of these kinds of accidents?

Narrator: You wouldn't believe.

Business woman on plane: Which car company do you work for?

Narrator: A major one.

 

[eoMMan]

I told my wife she can have access to my cockpit tonight.

No word back yet though.

 

[General Malaise]

I don't know why but I keep thinking back to the movie Naked Gun where Nordberg is hypnotized into assassinating the queen.

I thought it was Reggie Jackson who was hypnotized into assassinating the queen?

 

[George Jefferson Airplane]

I don't know why but I keep thinking back to the movie Naked Gun where Nordberg is hypnotized into assassinating the queen.

I thought it was Reggie Jackson who was hypnotized into assassinating the queen?

All black guys look alike?

 

[General Malaise]

I don't know why but I keep thinking back to the movie Naked Gun where Nordberg is hypnotized into assassinating the queen.

I thought it was Reggie Jackson who was hypnotized into assassinating the queen?

All black guys look alike?

Well....yeah, but that's not he point. I take my Naked Gun knowledge very very seriously. It's an important film.