Ben Roethlisberger (2 Viewers)

[Family Matters]

Going with FM here.

Dont focus on the obscure stats, focus on the ones that count.

Passing Yards and touchdowns.

You know, I like the anaysis. EBF has turned Ben inside out looking at him from every perspective and that's really cool. But after you've done that you still get around the system he's in.BTW-who has has been the most effective at stopping Ben? Who has Ben's number and will keep him from becoming a fantasy QB1?

Answer: Cower. That undeniable stat makes all the others meaningless in Ben's case.

Put Ben in Cinncy, STL, Indy, KC or Minn and he could be a top 3 easy.

 

[-OZ-]

Emmitt Smith was the number one fantasy RB from 1992-1995 EACH YEAR. The last time the Steelers had a TOP FIFTEEN RB was in 1997. If Aikman didn't have Emmitt on his team, he would have been a much better fantasy player. Roethlisberger doesn't have Emmitt.

Good point - a better comparison is probably Pennington or Carson Palmer.

Or, dare I say it - Tom Brady without Dillon

why not Brady WITH Dillon?

Well, there really isn't much of a difference. #11 with Dillon, #12 without, so I guess that works too. I simply don't see Duce / Bettis as Dillon's equal, but none are exactly Emmitt either. So, either way, Ben's upside seems to be along the lines of Brady / Aikman.

 

[Family Matters]

EBF-I thought you would be interested in seeing this. While may support your arguement better, I doubt it's more than a better balance of play calling as oppose to a new offensive scheme:

-- Steelers to Open Up Offense --Tue May 24, 2005 --from FFMastermind.comThe Post Gazette reports QB Ben Roethlisberger asked the Steelers to open up the offense more, and it seems they will comply. "Certainly, we want to run the football, that's our identity," said OC Ken Whisenhunt, author of play calls that resulted in 61 percent runs from scrimmage last season. "But I think we'll be able to do a few more things throwing the football this year, especially on first and second down, and I think that will even help us run the ball better."

 

[Franknbeans]

The Steelers of spring have a different look about them that has little to do with new players or the absence of those who moved on. The offense is performing stunts infrequently seen last fall.

Quarterbacks are throwing the ball around their South Side campus as if tossing Frisbees on the beach. Last fall, they passed the football as seldom as any NFL team in the past 20 years.

Ben Roethlisberger asked the Steelers to open up the offense more, and it seems they will comply.

"Certainly, we want to run the football, that's our identity," said coordinator Ken Whisenhunt, author of play calls that resulted in 61 percent runs from scrimmage last season. "But I think we'll be able to do a few more things throwing the football this year, especially on first and second down, and I think that will even help us run the ball better."

The Steelers ran 618 times and passed 358 times (plus 36 sacks trying to throw) even though their quarterback had the best rookie season of anyone in the history of the league. Roethlisberger completed 66.4 percent of his passes for a 98.1 passer rating, both NFL rookie records.

But part of Roethlisberger's success came from the simple formula the Steelers used to provide him as much support as they could -- run the ball, pass only when necessary and play great defense. They limited the playbook as well.

As the Steelers take to the field today for their second full week of team voluntary practices, they are loosening the reins on Big Ben and allowing him to blossom more in his second season.

"The biggest thing is he's more comfortable with what we're doing," said Whisenhunt, who enters his second season as coordinator. "I think our offense is more comfortable with him and with what we're doing, and certainly I can get better. I've learned some things from the first year."

Roethlisberger said he'd like to see the offense open up more next season, yet he understood why Whisenhunt was more conservative with him at quarterback in 2004.

"I think he didn't want to overload my mind too much," Roethlisberger said. "Hopefully, he'll have enough confidence in me this year to do more."

Roethlisberger has been working at the team's facility since February and is taking on more of a leadership role this spring. Last year at this time, he was throwing to the scrub receivers as the No. 3 or No. 4 quarterback. He did not move up to No. 2 until training camp when Charlie Batch's knee was injured. Only when he replaced injured Tommy Maddox in the second game of the season did he throw to his starting receivers on a regular basis in practice. His extended work this spring and in training camp should build up his rapport and confidence with them.

"Sometimes that's getting comfortable with the offense, getting comfortable where the receivers are and trusting that," Whisenhunt said. "Those receivers and he are getting a lot more reps with things he didn't get to see last year because he didn't get as many."

Toward the end of last season, defenses played Roethlisberger differently, Whisenhunt said.

"Late in the season they were dropping a lot of people and trying to make him throw it into smaller windows. Whereas people were coming after us earlier in the season and he was escaping pressure and making big plays.

"I think certainly from what I've seen so far this spring, he's a lot more comfortable going through his progressions and going through his reads. When he's comfortable throwing the football, he's hard to stop."

Dropping into coverage rather than blitzing might be why Roethlisberger's interception rate swelled in the final five games, including two playoffs. He threw 10 interceptions in those five games after tossing only six in his first 101/2 games.

Might that be a formula defenses employ against Roethlisberger again next season?

"Some people may think that," Whisenhunt said. "I think people may try to do some things to us, from looking at last year's tape, but he's going to be a different quarterback, and I don't necessarily think those same things are going to hold up.

"I would certainly think he's dangerous when he's out of the pocket. You know what? I'm very encouraged when he's in the pocket. He was a very good pocket passer in college and he certainly has the arm and the ability to do that on this level."

Link

 

[Steel Dillo]

The Steelers of spring have a different look about them that has little to do with new players or the absence of those who moved on. The offense is performing stunts infrequently seen last fall.

Quarterbacks are throwing the ball around their South Side campus as if tossing Frisbees on the beach. Last fall, they passed the football as seldom as any NFL team in the past 20 years.

Ben Roethlisberger asked the Steelers to open up the offense more, and it seems they will comply.

"Certainly, we want to run the football, that's our identity," said coordinator Ken Whisenhunt, author of play calls that resulted in 61 percent runs from scrimmage last season. "But I think we'll be able to do a few more things throwing the football this year, especially on first and second down, and I think that will even help us run the ball better."

The Steelers ran 618 times and passed 358 times (plus 36 sacks trying to throw) even though their quarterback had the best rookie season of anyone in the history of the league. Roethlisberger completed 66.4 percent of his passes for a 98.1 passer rating, both NFL rookie records.

But part of Roethlisberger's success came from the simple formula the Steelers used to provide him as much support as they could -- run the ball, pass only when necessary and play great defense. They limited the playbook as well.

As the Steelers take to the field today for their second full week of team voluntary practices, they are loosening the reins on Big Ben and allowing him to blossom more in his second season.

"The biggest thing is he's more comfortable with what we're doing," said Whisenhunt, who enters his second season as coordinator. "I think our offense is more comfortable with him and with what we're doing, and certainly I can get better. I've learned some things from the first year."

Roethlisberger said he'd like to see the offense open up more next season, yet he understood why Whisenhunt was more conservative with him at quarterback in 2004.

"I think he didn't want to overload my mind too much," Roethlisberger said. "Hopefully, he'll have enough confidence in me this year to do more."

Roethlisberger has been working at the team's facility since February and is taking on more of a leadership role this spring. Last year at this time, he was throwing to the scrub receivers as the No. 3 or No. 4 quarterback. He did not move up to No. 2 until training camp when Charlie Batch's knee was injured. Only when he replaced injured Tommy Maddox in the second game of the season did he throw to his starting receivers on a regular basis in practice. His extended work this spring and in training camp should build up his rapport and confidence with them.

"Sometimes that's getting comfortable with the offense, getting comfortable where the receivers are and trusting that," Whisenhunt said. "Those receivers and he are getting a lot more reps with things he didn't get to see last year because he didn't get as many."

Toward the end of last season, defenses played Roethlisberger differently, Whisenhunt said.

"Late in the season they were dropping a lot of people and trying to make him throw it into smaller windows. Whereas people were coming after us earlier in the season and he was escaping pressure and making big plays.

"I think certainly from what I've seen so far this spring, he's a lot more comfortable going through his progressions and going through his reads. When he's comfortable throwing the football, he's hard to stop."

Dropping into coverage rather than blitzing might be why Roethlisberger's interception rate swelled in the final five games, including two playoffs. He threw 10 interceptions in those five games after tossing only six in his first 101/2 games.

Might that be a formula defenses employ against Roethlisberger again next season?

"Some people may think that," Whisenhunt said. "I think people may try to do some things to us, from looking at last year's tape, but he's going to be a different quarterback, and I don't necessarily think those same things are going to hold up.

"I would certainly think he's dangerous when he's out of the pocket. You know what? I'm very encouraged when he's in the pocket. He was a very good pocket passer in college and he certainly has the arm and the ability to do that on this level."

Link

That should throw some more fuel on this blazing inferno.

 

[Mark Wimer]

You are trying to make this Chevy look like a Porsche.

I disagree for reasons which I've stated many times. Roethlisberger was highly thought of entering the league. He was only the #11 pick, but many sources said that he had the highest upside of any QB in the class. Despite being an early entry QB from a mid-major conference, he produced immediately and played at a very high level as a rookie (at a position that's notoriously difficult for rookies). He showed the physical skills necessary to be a star and produced elite per throw averages that compare favorably with those posted by the top passers in the NFL. I know there are some question marks. He had a poor finish, he didn't throw very often, he had a good supporting cast, and the Steelers are known as a running team. I'm aware of all those things, but I still think people are way too lukewarm on Roethlisberger's long term prospects given what he accomplished last year and the potential he displayed.

An interesting article on Roethlisberger in Pittsburgh Post-Gazette today that Franknbeans has quoted above:Steelers Opening Up Offense for Roethlisberger in 2005

I own Roethlisberger in my IDP dynasty league, along with Eli Manning, and I am pleased as punch with that duo of future QB's (my QB of the present is Brett Favre, so soon I'll be having a starting rotation with the youngsters -- 06 or 07). I believe that Roethlisberger will really be a star in this league once he's had a few years of seasoning. We'll see if the Steelers really do open things up for 2005 come pre-season, but EBF is on track with most of his analysis, IMO. A strong running game allows QBs room to throw effectively, more often than not...

My .02.

 

[beefcake]

Call me crazy, but the last half of the season flashed through my head where he didnt seem to be making completions, too much scrambling... he had BETTER be improved next season, or else this stud QB is not going to appear (I know, kinda redundant).He's not a pocket passing Dan Marino... yet. Good Luck with that one.

 

[Bojang0301]

I'm so confused as to what the hell is going on with this thread and the posters who are posting in it. Some guys post about two lines saying no because of Pitt's offense and stats of a rookie. He has shown the most impressive skills since anyone named Marino. Yet people say that don't want him in dynasty or otherwise. Ben was not without his struggles but what QB has not struggled. He went 15 - 1 as a rookie and, like EBF has done, put up numbers that do matter if you are analyzing the player fully. It seems painfully obvious that Pittsburgh's system has to change at some point... Ben's skills are just too impressive not to. I don't see how this offense can't adjust. First lets start with a RB analysis... The Bus is 33, IIRC, he has already contemplated retirement and while probably can still carry the load he may be more suited to being the complement to Staley when Duce is healthy.... Duce is also over 30, 31 also IIRC, he also is wearing down and is also often injured. His pass catching skills seemed to be forgotten last year but hopefully they take advantage of them more this year. Haynes seems like he could fit in at some point but is unproven. Willie Parker is intriguing but I have studied him pretty extensivly and he appears best as change of pace. He did run for 100 against Buffalo but he doesn't consistently move the sticks which is what Cowher likes. Herron appears to be a long shot as well.Next the WR's... Ward is the consistent move the sticks guy. Not much more you can say about him other then he does his job. Randle El is in a make or break year. It's my opinion that he won't be back either way after this year. He has some good skills but not sure working along Hines he'll fit right. Cedrick Wilson is a solid WR who will fit well as a WR no.3. The selling point for me is Fred Gibson. The guy is tremendously athletic and should be able to fill in for Plaxico Burress. I believe the draft was a good sign in which direction they wanted to go. Heath Miller is probably the most talented TE to put on a Steelers uniform and hopefully that transitions onto the field. Despite losing Burress the Steelers increase the number of weapons Ben has this off season. If Gibson has a good transition I don't see how the loss of Burress will hurt at all. I firmly believe that Miller and Gibson were picks that hopefully are a sign of what is to come. They could definitly stay along the power route but the proven RB's are old and Ben's skills tell me they will do otherwise. I would definitly like to see what Neil O'Donnell did in his time with Pittsburgh and it is also my belief that Cowher and his OC always adjust to the talent on offense.

 

[Steelers4Life]

Funny, I said about 3 pages ago that the Steelers in '05 will be much more open offense simply because they will loosen the reigns on Roethlisberger. They treated him with kid gloves in 2004 as a rookie, but expectations will rise in '05.And Cowher has proven in the past that while he likes to run the ball and control the clock, he plans his offense around the strengths of his personnel. He's never had a QB like Ben before, and you can expect him to have much more of a role in trying to WIN games this year as opposed to not necessarily losing it last year. And if they utilize the TE, he'll have the weapons to do it.With Ben's talent, if they finish in the middle of the pack in passing attempts, his numbers will suprise a lot of people.

 

[Bojang0301]

1991 Pittsburgh Steelers 12 8 286 156 54.5 1963 6.86 89 11 7 30/214 23 4 78.8 1992 Pittsburgh Steelers 12 12 313 185 59.1 2283 7.29 51 13 9 27/208 27 5 83.6 1993 Pittsburgh Steelers 16 15 486 270 55.6 3208 6.60 71 14 7 41/331 32 8 79.5 1994 Pittsburgh Steelers 14 14 370 212 57.3 2443 6.60 60 13 9 35/250 26 7 78.9 1995 Pittsburgh Steelers 12 12 416 246 59.1 2970 7.14 71 17 7 15/126 44 4 87.7

Stats for Neil O'Donnell. He never put up much along the lines of TD's and Yards but he had plenty of attempts, especially considering he never made it through 16 games.

 

[redman]

What's the over and under on when this thread gets bumped back up after lying dormant? My pick would be November 15.

 

[wingo]

at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton. Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs.

at the

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

 

[Bojang0301]

  at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton.  Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs. 

  at the 

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

I like LHUCKS comment concerning the Steelers being Superbowl contenders when very few had them finishing over .500 at the begining of the year. I think a lot of people forget that and how good the team became under Big Ben. I think it seemed pretty obvious he wasn't carrying the team but I would bet anything in the world they would not have gone 15-1 under Maddox.

 

[Marc Levin]

Emmitt Smith was the number one fantasy RB from 1992-1995 EACH YEAR. The last time the Steelers had a TOP FIFTEEN RB was in 1997. If Aikman didn't have Emmitt on his team, he would have been a much better fantasy player. Roethlisberger doesn't have Emmitt.

Good point - a better comparison is probably Pennington or Carson Palmer.

Or, dare I say it - Tom Brady without Dillon

why not Brady WITH Dillon?

Well, there really isn't much of a difference. #11 with Dillon, #12 without, so I guess that works too. I simply don't see Duce / Bettis as Dillon's equal, but none are exactly Emmitt either. So, either way, Ben's upside seems to be along the lines of Brady / Aikman.

The Bettis/Staley combo is able to produces as well as Dillon doe solo. It is the run game support - not the actual RB - that is crucial to the analysis.

 

[wingo]

at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton. Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs.

at the

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

I like LHUCKS comment concerning the Steelers being Superbowl contenders when very few had them finishing over .500 at the begining of the year. I think a lot of people forget that and how good the team became under Big Ben. I think it seemed pretty obvious he wasn't carrying the team but I would bet anything in the world they would not have gone 15-1 under Maddox.

They were a 6-10 team the year before, and the Ravens were expected to win the division because Steelers made very few offseason moves. So it was basically the same team as the year before with the addition of Staley. They were not considered a Superbowl contender. That's a fact.

On another note, yes Ben didn't perform well in the playoffs, but I think he wasn't put in a great situation by his coach. How many times did they run on first and second down in the first half? Cohwer was playing his usual play not to lose football(1-4 in AFC championship games all at home) and they were all in the sudden down 17-3.

You can place the blame on Ben, but I put most of it on the coach, he's proven over time that he plays Marty ball in the playoffs and his record speaks for it's self.

Ben has been in the playoffs one year as a rookie, he's got seven more years to prove he is a choker like Manning.

 

[GI-Dawgs]

This has been an interesting thread. IMO, EBF has done a great job with the numbers. I don't see how anyone can argue the numbers aren't impressive. Take note of the numbers and watch him play a few times and I think you will be even more impressed. Now I understand Pittsburgh/Cowher are a run first team, but I think Cowher is an opened minded coach who will adapt if he sees fit. The backs are no spring chicken's here either. Shula's/Miami first 13 seasons are very similar to Cowher's/Pittsburgh first 12, girnd it out, ball control fooball. Then along came a guy named Marino and Shula changed his style. Remember how shocking it was to see a Don Shula team airing it out! (Granted it never won him a championship, but won alot of Marino owners some. ) Anyway, I'm not saying Ben is another Marino, I think that would be ridiculous. The point I'm trying to make is coaches do adapt to the talent around and for those who just sit back and say Pittsburgh is this or that and Ben will never be a good FF QB based on the fact he plays in Pittsburgh are being a bit narrow minded in their assesment of Ben and Coach Cowher.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

What's the over and under on when this thread gets bumped back up after lying dormant? My pick would be November 15.

I'll take the under, red, & say that it'll be bumped about an hour after Pittsburgh's first game.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

  at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton.  Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs. 

  at the 

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

Hater? There are people in here comparing him to Marino, saying he has "the best skills since Marino" and what's he done so far? Yards per attempt? Give me a break. If you want to start a thread saying "who was the best rookie QB last year?" I'll put Roethlisberger, but he's got a lot to prove before I compare him with anyone in the elite league.

 

[Biabreakable]

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index...topic=93538&hl=

talk about Ben prior to last season...

 

[redman]

What's the over and under on when this thread gets bumped back up after lying dormant?  My pick would be November 15.

I'll take the under, red, & say that it'll be bumped about an hour after Pittsburgh's first game.

You're probably right. At this rate it'll never leave the first page.

 

[Family Matters]

This should calm the deabte about Ben's increased ranking this year seeing how it was dependant on increased passing. Apparently, there will not much difference in the play calling after all. It seems they still like the run first option:

June 9, 2005, 07:32 SteelersRun-Pass Ratio Not To Change MuchAssociated Press - [Full Article]With OC Whisenhunt calling the plays in 2004, the Steelers were first in the AFC in rushing, but 20th in the league in passing. He doesn't expect the run-pass ratio to change much, in spite of his quarterback's progress. "You're not going to get away from what you did that won 15 games," Whisenhunt said. "We're still going to run the ball, but I certainly think that we can expand on what we did just because everybody's more comfortable with everybody."

 

[jurb26]

This should calm the deabte about Ben's increased ranking this year seeing how it was dependant on increased passing. Apparently, there will not much difference in the play calling after all. It seems they still like the run first option:

June 9, 2005, 07:32

Steelers

Run-Pass Ratio Not To Change Much

Associated Press - [Full Article]

With OC Whisenhunt calling the plays in 2004, the Steelers were first in the AFC in rushing, but 20th in the league in passing. He doesn't expect the run-pass ratio to change much, in spite of his quarterback's progress. "You're not going to get away from what you did that won 15 games," Whisenhunt said. "We're still going to run the ball, but I certainly think that we can expand on what we did just because everybody's more comfortable with everybody."

How many people expect Pitt to win 15 games again this year? I'm a Steelers homer and I don't expect it. I chalk this up to coach speak.

 

[Family Matters]

This should calm the deabte about Ben's increased ranking this year seeing how it was dependant on increased passing. Apparently, there will not much difference in the play calling after all. It seems they still like the run first option:

June 9, 2005, 07:32

Steelers

Run-Pass Ratio Not To Change Much

Associated Press - [Full Article]

With OC Whisenhunt calling the plays in 2004, the Steelers were first in the AFC in rushing, but 20th in the league in passing. He doesn't expect the run-pass ratio to change much, in spite of his quarterback's progress. "You're not going to get away from what you did that won 15 games," Whisenhunt said. "We're still going to run the ball, but I certainly think that we can expand on what we did just because everybody's more comfortable with everybody."

How many people expect Pitt to win 15 games again this year? I'm a Steelers homer and I don't expect it. I chalk this up to coach speak.

You may be right but when is as successful as Pitts is running the ball and you have coach like Cower who loves to run as much as he does how can anyone realistically think the play calling or balance run/pss ratio will change much?While I know a few on the board are high on Ben and feel there's a chance Ben will get to throw more, I submit it ain't gonna happen.

 

[jurb26]

You may be right but when is as successful as Pitts is running the ball and you have coach like Cower who loves to run as much as he does how can anyone realistically think the play calling or balance run/pss ratio will change much?

While I know a few on the board are high on Ben and feel there's a chance Ben will get to throw more, I submit it ain't gonna happen.

Well I think its clear looking at the plays breakdown from last year that his pass attempts will have to go up. How much is the real question. I agree that Pitt will run the ball a lot and that will remain their priority.

 

[EBF]

I am very confident that his attempts/game will go up. How much is the real question.

 

[Family Matters]

You may be right but when is as successful as Pitts is running the ball and you have coach like Cower who loves to run as much as he does how can anyone realistically think the play calling or balance run/pss ratio will change much?

While I know a few on the board are high on Ben and feel there's a chance Ben will get to throw more, I submit it ain't gonna happen.

Well I think its clear looking at the plays breakdown from last year that his pass attempts will have to go up. How much is the real question. I agree that Pitt will run the ball a lot and that will remain their priority.

I agree with you and EBF-how much will they go up. They can go up without really affecting his stats much fantasywise.

 

[jurb26]

You may be right but when is as successful as Pitts is running the ball and you have coach like Cower who loves to run as much as he does how can anyone realistically think the play calling or balance run/pss ratio will change much?

While I know a few on the board are high on Ben and feel there's a chance Ben will get to throw more, I submit it ain't gonna happen.

Well I think its clear looking at the plays breakdown from last year that his pass attempts will have to go up. How much is the real question. I agree that Pitt will run the ball a lot and that will remain their priority.

I agree with you and EBF-how much will they go up. They can go up without really affecting his stats much fantasywise.

Ideed they can and as a Steeler fan, I think that would be a god thing. As that would likely mean they are winning games again.

 

[Irish]

at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton. Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs.

at the

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

Hater? There are people in here comparing him to Marino, saying he has "the best skills since Marino" and what's he done so far? Yards per attempt? Give me a break. If you want to start a thread saying "who was the best rookie QB last year?" I'll put Roethlisberger, but he's got a lot to prove before I compare him with anyone in the elite league.

Bill Parcells compared him to Marino in respects to rookie years. Ask around and I bet you'll find out that Parcells is a very respected football man.

 

[Family Matters]

  at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton.  Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs. 

  at the 

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

Hater? There are people in here comparing him to Marino, saying he has "the best skills since Marino" and what's he done so far? Yards per attempt? Give me a break. If you want to start a thread saying "who was the best rookie QB last year?" I'll put Roethlisberger, but he's got a lot to prove before I compare him with anyone in the elite league.

Bill Parcells compared him to Marino in respects to rookie years. Ask around and I bet you'll find out that Parcells is a very respected football man.

Yes he is. Parcells is also a run first football man.

 

[jurb26]

Yes he is. Parcells is also a run first football man.

Try telling that to a young Drew Bledsoe.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

  at staring at the stats and comparing career numbers after Ben hasn't even played an entire season.

Aikman inherited one of the worst teams in the NFL and led it to become one of the most dominant dynasties ever, which is why he has his place in a small city called Canton.  Ben on the other hand played a partial season on a Superbowl contender his first year...and then choked in the playoffs. 

  at the 

The Steelers were only considered a Super Bowl contender once Ben got them going. People seem to forget that. If you're not satistfied with the statistical comparisons made in the initial post then surely you'll be happy with the direct comparison between their rookie years. I'm very curious to see how you twist those numbers to support your warped viewpoint.

You mean until he choked like a rook in back to back playoff games?

So are you comparing him to Peyton Manning now? Speaking of choking in the playoffs.Do they even play fantasy football in week 20? Looks like we have a hater on our hands.

Hater? There are people in here comparing him to Marino, saying he has "the best skills since Marino" and what's he done so far? Yards per attempt? Give me a break. If you want to start a thread saying "who was the best rookie QB last year?" I'll put Roethlisberger, but he's got a lot to prove before I compare him with anyone in the elite league.

Bill Parcells compared him to Marino in respects to rookie years. Ask around and I bet you'll find out that Parcells is a very respected football man.

Nope. I've asked three guys so far, they all say Roethlisberger wasn't that ####### good. They also mentioned Parcells is fat.

 

[EBF]

Bump for 2006. Still underrated and primed for a huge year.

 

[Texican]

Bump for 2006. Still underrated and primed for a huge year.

Man I hope you are right!

 

[chris1969]

I actually think he's over-rated as a QB right now. Fantasy wise, he's rated about right and if he keeps progressing, in 1 or 2 years he'll be under-rated. This is the wrong year for the Steelers to open up the pass game. He can only succeed if the Steelers stick with the game plan and don't rely on him to win games.

BTW you can cut and paste this and put it into the Eli Manning thread as well.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

He can only succeed if the Steelers stick with the game plan and don't rely on him to win games.

Must have missed his playoff wins at Cincy, Indy and Denver?

 

[EBF]

Roethlisberger >> Manning

Career numbers:

Eli Manning - 75.9 QB rating, 51.6% completion percentage, 6.37 yards per attempt, 30 TD, 26 INT

Ben Roethlisberger - 98.3 QB rating, 62.7% completion percentage, 8.89 yards per attempt, 34 TD, 20 INT

You can only cry "supporting cast" for so long. I'll admit that Eli was in a much tougher situation as a rookie, but he clearly had the better supporting cast last season with Barber, Toomer, Burress, and Shockey.

 

[EBF]

Reasons to expect better FF numbers next season:

- Bettis is gone and the running game appears destined for mediocrity. Parker is relatively untested and Staley has been very mediocre this preseason.

- Heath Miller is entering his second year and should play a bigger role.

- Early word out of Steelers camp is that both Willie Reid and Santonio Holmes are the real deal. On top of that, Cedrick Wilson has played fairly well for the team.

 

[LHUCKS]

Reasons to expect better FF numbers next season:- Bettis is gone and the running game appears destined for mediocrity. Parker is relatively untested and Staley has been very mediocre this preseason. - Heath Miller is entering his second year and should play a bigger role. - Early word out of Steelers camp is that both Willie Reid and Santonio Holmes are the real deal. On top of that, Cedrick Wilson has played fairly well for the team.

Reasons to expect similar numbers from last year:- Steelers D is just as good- Bettis' effect on the passing offense is a myth- They won the SuperBowl with a run-first offense

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

Reasons to expect better FF numbers next season:

- Bettis is gone and the running game appears destined for mediocrity. Parker is relatively untested and Staley has been very mediocre this preseason.

- Heath Miller is entering his second year and should play a bigger role.

- Early word out of Steelers camp is that both Willie Reid and Santonio Holmes are the real deal. On top of that, Cedrick Wilson has played fairly well for the team.

One more big play guy...

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburgh...s/s_466925.html

Second-year wide receiver Nate Washington, starting a second consecutive game for Hines Ward (hamstring), led the Steelers with 53 receiving yards on three catches, his first three of the preseason. "He'll be active game day," Cowher said of Washington.

 

[EBF]

Reasons to expect better FF numbers next season:- Bettis is gone and the running game appears destined for mediocrity. Parker is relatively untested and Staley has been very mediocre this preseason. - Heath Miller is entering his second year and should play a bigger role. - Early word out of Steelers camp is that both Willie Reid and Santonio Holmes are the real deal. On top of that, Cedrick Wilson has played fairly well for the team.

Reasons to expect similar numbers from last year:- Steelers D is just as good- Bettis' effect on the passing offense is a myth- They won the SuperBowl with a run-first offense

All fair points, but I still contend that the team will continue to build its offense around the QB. I don't expect St. Louis Rams type pass attempt numbers, but anything approaching the averages that Maddox and O'Donnell posted under Cowher would likely be enough to propel Ben into the "solid starter" category. He already approached that status last season in spite of an incredibly low number of pass attempts. I think the big breakout year is coming in either 2006 or 2007. We'll see.At any rate, he remains grossly underrated in the dynasty format (which is mostly what this thread was originally about). He's arguably the best young passer in the league, but he's not even top ten on most dynasty QB lists.

 

[Frenchy Fuqua]

It's been mentioned in other threads but is worth a revisit. In Roethlisberger's 16 starts last year (12 regular season/4 playoffs) he accounted for 29 TDs (24 passing/5 rushing). That's more than every QB but Carson Palmer. His passing yardage was a bit light (3188 yds) but if he even completes 2-3 more passes per game this year his per game numbers are on par with the elite FF QBs. Add the improvement in his game, the Steelers looking periodically at a no huddle O, development of targets Heath Miller, Ced Wilson, Nate Washington and rookies Holmes and Reid and a tough schedule and you have to love Roethlisberger's upside as one of the last QB1's/first QB2's taken. If he stays healthy he is a top 10 lock with top 5 potential.

 

[The Jerk]

It's been mentioned in other threads but is worth a revisit. In Roethlisberger's 16 starts last year (12 regular season/4 playoffs) he accounted for 29 TDs (24 passing/5 rushing). That's more than every QB but Carson Palmer. His passing yardage was a bit light (3188 yds) but if he even completes 2-3 more passes per game this year his per game numbers are on par with the elite FF QBs. Add the improvement in his game, the Steelers looking periodically at a no huddle O, development of targets Heath Miller, Ced Wilson, Nate Washington and rookies Holmes and Reid and a tough schedule and you have to love Roethlisberger's upside as one of the last QB1's/first QB2's taken. If he stays healthy he is a top 10 lock with top 5 potential.

He may not make it quite to the top 10 in 2006, but Roethlisberger could emerge as an excellent QBBC if the Steelers maintain their more aggressive first half passing scheme vs. the top NFL teams as seen in the playoffs. I remember drafting Troy Aikman ten years ago, where his performance was much better in games Dallas was an underdog or slight favorite than when Dallas was heavily favored. Ben could emerge as a similar player.

 

[BGP]

I'd bet Ben goes on to have a career like Jim McMahon. The guy has tons and tons of injuries already and he's only going into his third season. Every time you turn around, something else happens to him. Now its his thumb,

 

[3C's]

I'd bet Ben goes on to have a career like Jim McMahon. The guy has tons and tons of injuries already and he's only going into his third season. Every time you turn around, something else happens to him. Now its his thumb,

do you just throw out stupid #### so people can quote you in their sig?

 

[Tau837]

Reasons to expect similar numbers from last year:- Steelers D is just as good- Bettis' effect on the passing offense is a myth- They won the SuperBowl with a run-first offense

A few other things that might add up (some are minor, I realize):- Ward's hamstring is a problem right now.- They lost Randle El. In fantasy terms, he wasn't huge, but I think he made a larger impact on the field.- Any lingering effects at all from Ben's accident. Perhaps not likely, but there is at least a small chance of some effect.- Any lingering problems with Ben's thumb.I just reread this thread. Definitely one of the better threads from last offseason. I still think Ben is overrated as a fantasy QB.

 

[Franknbeans]

I'd bet Ben goes on to have a career like Jim McMahon. The guy has tons and tons of injuries already and he's only going into his third season. Every time you turn around, something else happens to him. Now its his thumb,

bitter gay pirate?

 

[AB in DC]

Reasons to expect similar numbers from last year:- Steelers D is just as good

You sure about that? They lost von Oelhoffen and Hope, and I'm not convinced that their replacements will be as good.

 

[Godsbrother]

I'd bet Ben goes on to have a career like Jim McMahon. The guy has tons and tons of injuries already and he's only going into his third season. Every time you turn around, something else happens to him. Now its his thumb,

Ben didn't have any trouble with his thumb Saturday night. His numbers: 3/4 30 1 TD 0 Int. I also think his "tons of injuries" are a bit overblown. His rookie season he played 15 games + 2 playoff games. Last season he played 12 games + 4 playoff games, despite taking a hit to the knee that may have knocked another QB out for the season.This summer he smashed head first into a car and started traing camp on Day 1. He seems to pretty tough to me.

 

[nightshift]

I'd bet Ben goes on to have a career like Jim McMahon. The guy has tons and tons of injuries already and he's only going into his third season. Every time you turn around, something else happens to him. Now its his thumb,

Ben didn't have any trouble with his thumb Saturday night. His numbers: 3/4 30 1 TD 0 Int. I also think his "tons of injuries" are a bit overblown. His rookie season he played 15 games + 2 playoff games. Last season he played 12 games + 4 playoff games, despite taking a hit to the knee that may have knocked another QB out for the season.This summer he smashed head first into a car and started traing camp on Day 1. He seems to pretty tough to me.

Steelers also have an excellent back-up in Omar Jacobs. The kid is still green, but can he pass!

 

[Godsbrother]

Reasons to expect similar numbers from last year:- Steelers D is just as good

You sure about that? They lost von Oelhoffen and Hope, and I'm not convinced that their replacements will be as good.

Time will tell. Kimo was getting a bit long in the tooth and only played on 1st and 2nd downs. Kiesel will be up to the task.Chris Hope was OK but his tackling was a bit suspect. I don't think you'll see much of a dropoff (if any) with Clark, Carter and 2nd round pick Anthony Smith, who has looked excellent so far.