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BROWNS THREAD 2009 4 GAME WIN STREAK! (1 Viewer)

Word this week is Randy Lerner is looking at offering some position to Mike Holmgren. THIS is a correct move. Remember the Lerner family originally wanted to trade their first round pick to Green Bay to get Holmgren back in 1999. Unfortunately, the NFL barred the Browns from trading the pick.

Mike Holmgren is also unfairly maligned for his personnel decisions. Here is a full timeline of Holmgren as GM from 1999-2002

http://blogmedia.thenewstribune.com/media/...%20Timeline.htm

Text of the timeline is included at the end of this post.

HIGHLIGHTS of Mike Holmgren as Seahawks GM:

1. Traded the #17th choice in the 1999 draft to the patriots for ultimately the 22nd, 82nd, 40th, and 191st. The 22nd pick was used on DE Lamar King who was riddled with injuries, which wasn't anyone's fault.

2. Traded James McKnight to the Cowboys for a 3rd round pick in 2000. The pick was used on WR Darrell Jackson who had a long productive career in Seattle. In his career he recorded 7132 yards and 51 TDs.

3. Traded Joey Galloway to the Cowboys for first round picks in 2000 and 2001. The 2000 pick was used on future NFL MVP RB Shaun Alexander.

4. Traded the 10th and 72nd choices in the 2001 draft to the Packers for QB Matt Hasselbeck and the 17th pick which is used on future 5x all-pro OL Steve Hutchinson.

5. Signs John Randle in 2001 who delivers 11 sacks and a pro bowl appearance.

Now let's review what actually happened. Holmgren was stripped of his GM duties as of 2003. While GM, he acquired the quarterback of the future, a future NFL MVP RB, a stud offensive linemen in Steve Hutchinson, and WR Darrell Jackson. However, most of these players were slow to blossom into genuine superstars, and as it turns out, Mike Holmgren was unfairly stripped of personnel decisions before everything had played out.

The shark move here is for the Browns to hire Holmgren as soon as they can, and put him in charge of personnel and make him head coach if need be. The criticisms of this guy are completely unjustified. Holmgren is severely undervalued.

TIMELINE: HOLMGREN AS GM (1999-2002)

By Mike Sando

The News Tribune

Jan. 8, 1999 – Mike Holmgren is hired as Seahawks’ coach, general manager and executive vice president of football operations. Team president Bob Whitsitt and vice president Randy Mueller had been reluctant to bestow a coach with total control over personnel, but owner Paul Allen was willing to do what it took to land Holmgren.

Feb. 11, 1999 – Warren Moon is released. Holmgren decides to go with youth at the most important position.

April 17, 1999 – Holmgren trades 17th choice in NFL draft to New England for 20th, 82nd and 191st choices. Pats select Boston College C Damien Woody. Holmgren then trades 20th choice to Dallas for 22nd and 140th choices. At the urging of defensive coordinator Fritz Shurmur, Holmgren selects Saginaw Valley (Mich.) State DE Lamar King with 22nd choice. The 82nd choice is used on Auburn WR Karsten Bailey. The 140th choice is used on Penn State LT Floyd Wedderburn. The 191st choice winds up being part of a trade that lands Tennessee CB Steve Johnson, who is quickly released.

June 24, 1999 – WR James McKnight is traded to Dallas for third-round choice in 2000. The trade pays off when Holmgren uses the choice from Dallas to select Florida WR Darrell Jackson.

July 31, 1999 – Contract disputes cause King and WR Joey Galloway to miss the opening of Holmgren’s inaugural training camp.

Aug. 12, 1999 – Three-time Pro Bowl DE Michael Sinclair receives a $6 million signing bonus as part of seven-year, $35 million extension. Whitsitt had promised a long-term deal long before Holmgren arrived.

Aug. 22, 1999 – Contract talks between Galloway and the Seahawks are called off amid much acrimony and gamesmanship.

Aug. 30, 1999 – Defensive coordinator Fritz Shurmur loses three-month battle with cancer. Jim Lind takes over duties as defensive coordinator.

Jan. 12, 2000 – Veteran defensive coordinator Steve Sidwell is hired to replace interim coordinator Jim Lind, whose defense led the NFL in interceptions but ranked 23rd in yards allowed.

Jan. 25, 2000 – Mueller leaves for New Orleans, becoming Saints’ general manager while ridding the Seahawks of one of their last links to early days in Seattle.

Jan. 28, 2000 – Ted Thompson is hired from Green Bay to replace Mueller.

Feb. 12, 2000 – Galloway is traded to Dallas for first-round choices in 2000 and 2001. The first of those choices lands Alabama RB Shaun Alexander. The second choice will be used to trade down in the first round, with Seattle ultimately netting North Carolina State WR Koren Robinson, Auburn FB Heath Evans and Princeton OT Dennis Norman.

Feb. 12, 2000 – DE Phillip Daniels signs a lucrative free-agent contract with Chicago, depriving the Seahawks of their best all-around DL. Holmgren would later refer to letting Daniels get away as a “rookie mistake.” The defensive line is set back at least two years.

Feb. 21, 2000 – Free-agent S Reggie Tongue is signed away from Kansas City and receives a $3.5 million bonus. Tongue winds up being benched after his first six games in Seattle, but he bounces back with a solid season in 2001 and leads the team with five interceptions in 2002.

March 1, 2000 - Veteran S Darryl Williams is released.

March 17, 2000 – Free-agent C Robbie Tobeck is signed to a salary-cap friendly deal. Tobeck promptly suffers freak knee injury, but recovers in time for the 2001 season and becomes a team leader.

April 14, 2000 – RB Ahman Green is traded to Green Bay for CB Fred Vinson. Holmgren was fed up with Green’s fumbling and nearly released the talented runner before aides convinced him to work a trade with his former team. The trade backfires famously when Vinson suffers career-ending knee injuries while Green leads Packers’ revival.

April 15, 2000 – DT Sam Adams signs with Baltimore, depriving the Seahawks of their most talented DL. Holmgren wasn’t a big fan of Adams, but the Ravens get last laugh when Adams becomes Pro Bowl performer and Super Bowl winner.

April 15, 2000 – Alexander and Wisconsin OT Chris McIntosh are drafted in the first round.

April 28, 2000 - John Schneider leaves the Kansas City Chiefs to become Seattle’s director of player personnel.

May 10, 2000 - Scot McCloughan leaves job as area college scout for Green Bay Packers to become Seattle’s director of college scouting.

June 19, 2000 - Veteran MLB George Koonce is signed in free agency and becomes a starter for one of the NFL’s worst defenses.

July 19, 2000 - Veteran WR Mike Pritchard is released.

July 26, 2000 - Once-promising MLB DeShone Myles is placed on injured reserve, all but ending his career.

August 20, 2000 - Fred Vinson, the CB acquired in the Ahman Green trade, is placed on injured reserve.

August 27, 2000 - Record-setting PK Todd Peterson is released in favor of rookie Kris Heppner.

August 28, 2000 - Veteran backup QB Glenn Foley is released shortly after tossing six interceptions during an exhibition game.

Sept. 26, 2000 - Heppner is released after struggling. Former WSU PK Rian Lindell is signed to replace him.

Nov. 28, 2000 - Veteran CB Chris Canty is released.

March 1, 2001 - Veteran WRs Sean Dawkins and Derrick Mayes are released.

March 2, 2001 – QB Matt Hasselbeck and the 17th choice in 2001 draft acquired from Green Bay in exchange for the 10th and 72nd choices in the 2001 draft. Green Bay uses the 10th choice to select Florida State DE Jamal Reynolds and the 72nd choice to select Oklahoma LB Torrance Marshall. Holmgren uses the 17th choice for Michigan LG Steve Hutchinson.

March 3, 2001 – Former Minnesota Vikings DT John Randle is signed to a five-year, $25 million deal in free agency. Skeptics call the move risky, but Randle responds with an 11-sack season and seventh berth in Pro Bowl. In 2002, a knee injury can’t stop Randle from leading the team in sacks for a second straight season.

March 5, 2001 – Veteran S Jay Bellamy signs with New Orleans.

March 8, 2001 – Eight-time Pro Bowl DT Cortez Kennedy is released, ending his career.

March 8, 2001 – QB Jon Kitna signs a free-agent contract with Cincinnati. The Bengals show improvement in 2001, but Kitna becomes the only AFC starter with a lower passer rating than Hasselbeck that season.

March 9, 2001 – New England DT Chad Eaton is signed to a cap-friendly deal in free agency. The move pays off handsomely in 2001 when Eaton helps restore the run defense to respectability.

March 12, 2001 – Veteran LG Pete Kendall signs a lucrative free-agent contract with Arizona. Holmgren never made serious attempt to re-sign the former No. 1 choice.

March 23, 2001 – Legendary San Francisco WR Jerry Rice visits Seahawks headquarters after being granted permission to pursue trade opportunities.

April 9, 2001 – Pittsburgh LB Levon Kirkland is signed to three-year contract in free agency. Like Randle, Kirkland becomes a leader in locker room and an integral part of an improved run defense.

April 12, 2001 – Tennessee S Marcus Robertson is signed to a three-year contract in free agency. Robertson suffers a hamstring injury and is limited for much of season.

April 21, 2001 – Koren Robinson and Steve Hutchinson are chosen in the first round of a Seattle draft that also nets CB Ken Lucas, S Curtis Fuller and WR Alex Bannister.

June 5, 2001 – Rice signs with Oakland.

June 7, 2001 – Vinson is released, putting the finishing touches on one of the most lopsided trades in NFL history.

Aug. 3, 2001 - Veteran QB Trent Dilfer is signed as insurance for Hasselbeck.

Aug. 22, 2001 - Hasselbeck signs an incentive-laden contract worth as much as $22.6 million.

Aug. 29, 2001 – Having missed out in the Rice sweepstakes, Holmgren settles for veteran WR Bobby Engram, who had been released by Chicago. Engram becomes a clutch third-down option and a mentor for a young receiving corps.

Sept. 2, 2001 - Seahawks release WR Karsten Bailey, a third-round choice in 1999. Bailey caught six passes in two seasons.

Sept. 7, 2001 - Holmgren elevates Dilfer into the No. 2 role, ahead of Brock Huard.

Feb. 20, 2002 - After failing to reach a contract agreement with Pro Bowl LT Walter Jones, Seattle designates him as their franchise player. Jones refuses to sign the accompanying one-year, $4.92 million offer, then skips minicamps and training camp as the dispute wears on.

Feb. 22, 2002 - Former Pro Bowl DE Michael Sinclair is released after three disappointing seasons.

March 1, 2002 - Holmgren commits to Dilfer as his starter for 2002, and the sides agree on an incentive-laden contract.

April 10, 2002 - Veteran CB Doug Evans, a free agent from Carolina, is signed to bolster Seattle’s weak pass defense.

April 16, 2002 - Veteran DL Brandon Mitchell, a free agent from New England, is signed to provide depth.

April 19, 2002 - Backup QB Brock Huard is traded to Indianapolis for a fourth-round pick that becomes promising DT Rocky Bernard.

April 20, 2002 - Seattle selects Washington TE Jerramy Stevens in the first round of the draft after trading down from 20th to 28th. UNLV DE Anton Palepoi and Oregon RB Maurice Morris are chosen in the second round.

April 22, 2002 - Veteran DE Matt LaBounty is released.

May 21, 2002 - Free-agent QB Ryan Leaf is signed to a one-year contract after being released by Dallas. Leaf retires from football during training camp.

June 21, 2002 - CB Ike Charlton, a disappointing second-round choice in 1999, is traded to Jacksonville for a conditional draft choice.

July 12, 2002 - Veteran MLB Levon Kirkland is released after failing to fulfill his end of an agreement to lose weight. The move backfires when Seattle struggles against the run and Kirkland becomes an important part of Philadelphia’s formidable defense.

August 19, 2002 - Veteran QB Mark Rypien is signed after Dilfer suffers a knee injury.

August 27, 2002 - Veteran RT Jerry Wunsch is signed to provide depth on the line after Seattle fails to reach an agreement with franchise LT Walter Jones, who misses the first two games during a contract dispute.

Sept. 1, 2002 - Special-teams ace Fabien Bownes is released in part because Alex Bannister, a fifth-round pick in 2000, has developed into an oustanding player on special teams.

Sept. 2, 2002 - Rypien is released in favor of former CFL passer Dave Dickenson, who is claimed off waivers from San Diego. Dickenson is released after three weeks.

Sept. 3, 2002 - The Seahawks break off contract talks with franchise player Walter Jones, who promptly signs a one-year offer and rejoins the team for its third game.

Oct. 29, 2002 - Veteran QB Jeff George is signed as insurance after Dilfer is placed on injured reserve with a torn Achilles’ tendon.

Nov. 21, 2002 - OT Chris Terry is claimed off waivers from Carolina, providing instant stability to the right side of the line.

Dec. 26, 2002 - Against the backdrop of a 6-9 record, Holmgren meets with Whitsitt three days before the final game of the season. They continue ongoing discussions about Holmgren’s future, amid speculation that a change could be forthcoming. The Seahawks want him to step aside as GM, something Holmgren isn’t sure he’ll agree to do.

Dec. 29, 2002 - The Seahawks score 21 fourth-quarter points to force overtime against San Diego, then beat the Chargers on their way to a franchise-record 591 total yards. Hasselbeck breaks his own franchise record for passing yards in a game. Seattle’s pass offense finishes the season ranked third in the NFL. The more Holmgren thinks about things, the more he wants to stick around.

Dec. 30, 2002 - Holmgren tells players and coaches he might be willing to step aside as GM, but his future with the team remains in question.

Dec. 31, 2002 - With a four-year record of 31-33 and a defense that ranked last against the run in 2002, Holmgren agrees to remain coach while renouncing his titles as GM and executive vice president. Holmgren also fires his defensive coaching staff. Whitsitt begins the search for a new GM.

“I think the biggest title you can have is Super Bowl champion,” Holmgren explains. “When I thought long and hard about that and what’s important to me, (wife) Kathy, this football team and this organization, the titles take a back seat, they really do.

“It’s about coming together, winning, having fun doing it and getting to the Super Bowl.”

Mike Sando: 425-822-9504

THE NEWS TRIBUNE

 
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eric rymer said:
very :goodposting: I've been as frustrated as anyone, but I really like what he's trying to bring to the table.
I read that and didn't feel like I got a lot out of it. Basically he's trying to promote discipline and good character. I'd like to see some talent and production.
I like the plan, I question the execution...so far anyway.I also don't think acquiring a bunch of talent and throwing it on the field is the answer either, that's what created the mess Mangini walked into. Savage proved that he was a good talent evaluator, but he's an awful architect of building a winning franchise. Mangini has a plan, I have a lot of doubts whether it will work or not, but at least it's a plan...direction. Something this organization has sorely lacked since coming back to the league.

 
i have a good feeling about this one for some reason.

Browns 20 Ravens 17 *

and a two game winning streak as they go up to Detroit and beat the Lions next week too! :confused:

*(lack of sleep does strange things to the human mind.)

 
Hopefully today was enough to squash any thoughts of drafting a QB early in round 1 of the 2010 draft. We need to get some other pieces in place first:

1. WR - they are horrible. How can Robiskie not even be active?

2. OL - the right side needs upgraded big time

3. DL - it all starts up front, and they could use some more talent in this group

4. LB - they could use a playmaker in this bunch....

5. TE - a playmaker like Winslow would be nice. Did Greg Estandia win the Plain Dealer, "Brown for a Day" contest or something? Where did he come from and how is he in the NFL?

6. DB - most of the spots could use an upgrade here.

 
Hopefully today was enough to squash any thoughts of drafting a QB early in round 1 of the 2010 draft. We need to get some other pieces in place first:1. WR - they are horrible. How can Robiskie not even be active?2. OL - the right side needs upgraded big time3. DL - it all starts up front, and they could use some more talent in this group4. LB - they could use a playmaker in this bunch....5. TE - a playmaker like Winslow would be nice. Did Greg Estandia win the Plain Dealer, "Brown for a Day" contest or something? Where did he come from and how is he in the NFL?6. DB - most of the spots could use an upgrade here.
So pretty much every position except Joe Thomas.
 
Gawd I hope they don't take a WR in the 1st rd. Make that first day. Get a FA in this dept.

Give me someone like Berry who can hopefully make plays....or someone to help the right side of the line (would have to be a tackle that early in the draft).

 
Gawd I hope they don't take a WR in the 1st rd. Make that first day. Get a FA in this dept.Give me someone like Berry who can hopefully make plays....or someone to help the right side of the line (would have to be a tackle that early in the draft).
My post from last February that I'll repost as it STILL applies today...
Might be in the minority from what I've read, but I want the Browns to draft Crabtree about as much as I want a kick in the balls.I'm sick of watching the Browns get run (and passed) over week after week after week. I want defense, defense, defense and more defense.
:goodposting:
 
The CBA is going to really determine alot this offseason. Who's a UFA, who's a RFA, and what teams can do. There are a few teams that have some big contracts ending and could use a non-capped season to hang onto their guys.

 
This whole Holmgren thing I think really separates the media into who knows what on Earth they are talking about and who doesn't. I listened to Tony Grossi say Holmgren was a terrible GM in Seattle, which is horribly wrong. The media likes to create narratives and they often stubbornly stick to these narratives despite evidence to the contrary. I read an ESPN article that even went ahead and singled out Koren Robinson and used that one pick to basically invalidate all the excellent talent Holmgren brought to the Seahawks. It would be like singling out Kyle Boller and using that to say Ozzie Newsome is not a good GM.

Its frustrating. Holmgren has been the #1 guy I've wanted in here since 1999, and even moreso now in 2009. But I'm afraid that Randy Lerner lacks solid football knowledge, and therefore these pundits probably actually carry some weight with Lerner, which could steer away from Holmgren and towards another disaster like Ernie Accorsi.

 
let's get a head count: who thinks Mangini is fired at the end of the year?

personally, i'm not sure, but i'm starting to lean toward YES.

 
To be honest, I don't care who's coaching this team next year. I want some play makers on defense and it begins with Ronaldo McClain, I don't care if it's with pick #1, he could be everything Patrick Willis is and he's exactly what this team needs. An impact player on D.

 
To be honest, I don't care who's coaching this team next year. I want some play makers on defense and it begins with Ronaldo McClain, I don't care if it's with pick #1, he could be everything Patrick Willis is and he's exactly what this team needs. An impact player on D.
It's ROLANDO McClain and he's a junior, but could come out. No idea if there has been any speculation about that in 'bama or among the media.
 
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To be honest, I don't care who's coaching this team next year. I want some play makers on defense and it begins with Ronaldo McClain, I don't care if it's with pick #1, he could be everything Patrick Willis is and he's exactly what this team needs. An impact player on D.
It's ROLANDO McClain and he's a junior, but could come out. No idea if there has been any speculation about that in 'bama or among the media.
:foot in mouth:Regardless he'd be silly to not declare.
 
I'm not sure about Mangini, but I know Daboll has to go. The offense is putrid.

Can anybody tell me how Robiskie can't make the active roster for a game? Was it a totally wasted pick? Do we have the worst WR coach in the league?

 
Fallerjw said:
Can anybody tell me how Robiskie can't make the active roster for a game? Was it a totally wasted pick? Do we have the worst WR coach in the league?
in quote i read a few weeks ago seemed to imply that he wasn't doing his part on special teams.i'm speculating it's maybe a doghouse issue?
 
Still 4 home games left in the freezing cold. 1 win team. Not sure if Lerner is going to keep bailing everyone out on these blackouts. Could get interesting.

 
i really thought with the injuries piling up, and getting near the end of the season that the players would be quitting, but they haven't.

i think we may actually see a competitive game on thursday. :popcorn:

 
amnesiac said:
i really thought with the injuries piling up, and getting near the end of the season that the players would be quitting, but they haven't.i think we may actually see a competitive game on thursday. :excited:
:popcorn: As bad as they've been, it's hard to believe they competed as well as they did against the Chargers. I'd love to see the Browns beat the Steelers and finish up the season strong, but I also don't want to miss out on a chance to draft Ndamukong Suh.
 
amnesiac said:
i really thought with the injuries piling up, and getting near the end of the season that the players would be quitting, but they haven't.i think we may actually see a competitive game on thursday. :lmao:
One of the problems with bad teams is that they aren't consistent. For whatever reason, a lot of pundits seem to expect consistency, and that trips them up a lot. Often they assume what happened last game will translate to the next game.The Browns get shut out by the Ravens, and the pundits expect little from the offense against the Lions. Then the offense shocks them by posting 37 points. Then they expect perhaps something better against the Bengals, and the offense looks horrible in the 16-7 loss to the Bengals, but the defense looks better. So now they expect better defensive play but the offense to stink, and we get the opposite in a 30-23 loss to the Chargers. But now because that game was close, people expect a competitive game. But the trend has been wild inconsistency, so I expect a 30-6 blowout loss to the Steelers.One game doesn't make a trend.
 
amnesiac said:
i really thought with the injuries piling up, and getting near the end of the season that the players would be quitting, but they haven't.

i think we may actually see a competitive game on thursday. :goodposting:
One of the problems with bad teams is that they aren't consistent. For whatever reason, a lot of pundits seem to expect consistency, and that trips them up a lot. Often they assume what happened last game will translate to the next game.The Browns get shut out by the Ravens, and the pundits expect little from the offense against the Lions. Then the offense shocks them by posting 37 points. Then they expect perhaps something better against the Bengals, and the offense looks horrible in the 16-7 loss to the Bengals, but the defense looks better. So now they expect better defensive play but the offense to stink, and we get the opposite in a 30-23 loss to the Chargers. But now because that game was close, people expect a competitive game. But the trend has been wild inconsistency, so I expect a 30-6 blowout loss to the Steelers.

One game doesn't make a trend.
absolutely not. but the Steelers have lost four in a row, while the Browns have been showing some improvement lately.
 
i really thought with the injuries piling up, and getting near the end of the season that the players would be quitting, but they haven't.

i think we may actually see a competitive game on thursday. :hot:
One of the problems with bad teams is that they aren't consistent. For whatever reason, a lot of pundits seem to expect consistency, and that trips them up a lot. Often they assume what happened last game will translate to the next game.The Browns get shut out by the Ravens, and the pundits expect little from the offense against the Lions. Then the offense shocks them by posting 37 points. Then they expect perhaps something better against the Bengals, and the offense looks horrible in the 16-7 loss to the Bengals, but the defense looks better. So now they expect better defensive play but the offense to stink, and we get the opposite in a 30-23 loss to the Chargers. But now because that game was close, people expect a competitive game. But the trend has been wild inconsistency, so I expect a 30-6 blowout loss to the Steelers.

One game doesn't make a trend.
absolutely not. but the Steelers have lost four in a row, while the Browns have been showing some improvement lately.
I think its debatable that the Browns are showing improvement. Also, now that I've seen the weather forecast that includes strong winds, I think the score should be closer than 30-6. Hard to score 30 in that environment. Might be more like 17-6.

 
So what's the consensus on Quinn? Is he the QB of the future?

He's definitely showing flashes and the 7 TD to 0 INT over the past 3 games is encouraging, especially without weapons like Braylon, Winslow, and Lewis (out most of the time over the past 3). It's not the most exciting aspect to be throwing to Massaquoi, Robiskie, and Evan Moore.

I'm thinking the problems have been mostly Daboll and not so much Quinn and Anderson. I'd like to see more accuracy but I think Quinn has a future. What do you guys think?

 
So what's the consensus on Quinn? Is he the QB of the future?He's definitely showing flashes and the 7 TD to 0 INT over the past 3 games is encouraging, especially without weapons like Braylon, Winslow, and Lewis (out most of the time over the past 3). It's not the most exciting aspect to be throwing to Massaquoi, Robiskie, and Evan Moore.I'm thinking the problems have been mostly Daboll and not so much Quinn and Anderson. I'd like to see more accuracy but I think Quinn has a future. What do you guys think?
i'm interested in why he seems to be thriving in the no-huddle.is he calling his own plays? calling his own audibles? is he just more comfortable with that rythm?i haven't been able to actually see the last few games, so i'm looking forward to watching the game tonight.
 
So what's the consensus on Quinn? Is he the QB of the future?He's definitely showing flashes and the 7 TD to 0 INT over the past 3 games is encouraging, especially without weapons like Braylon, Winslow, and Lewis (out most of the time over the past 3). It's not the most exciting aspect to be throwing to Massaquoi, Robiskie, and Evan Moore.I'm thinking the problems have been mostly Daboll and not so much Quinn and Anderson. I'd like to see more accuracy but I think Quinn has a future. What do you guys think?
In my opinion, he's done enough to not draft a QB in round 1 or 2. Try to put some talent around him and see what he can do. If you can fix the right side of the line, and get a stud WR it might be enough. It also seems like the importance of timing and being on the same page with the receivers is huge. If he had been the starter from day 1, and been able to get used to these guys, the offense might look a lot better right now.
 
:sadbanana: :wall:

Quinn looked like crap, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt playing in those conditions.

ETA: The sweetest part of this is that Steeler fans have to shut the hell up for 9 months. We've got bragging rights.

 
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The most encouraging aspect of the game was that the Browns played with heart. Good to see them not mailing anything in despite the record.

 
So what's the consensus on Quinn? Is he the QB of the future?He's definitely showing flashes and the 7 TD to 0 INT over the past 3 games is encouraging, especially without weapons like Braylon, Winslow, and Lewis (out most of the time over the past 3). It's not the most exciting aspect to be throwing to Massaquoi, Robiskie, and Evan Moore.I'm thinking the problems have been mostly Daboll and not so much Quinn and Anderson. I'd like to see more accuracy but I think Quinn has a future. What do you guys think?
i'm interested in why he seems to be thriving in the no-huddle.is he calling his own plays? calling his own audibles? is he just more comfortable with that rythm?i haven't been able to actually see the last few games, so i'm looking forward to watching the game tonight.
Quinn's strength is reading the defense and getting the ball out quickly. He struggles with the intermediate and deep routes because he doesn't have the strongest arm, and his accuracy on those routes is not the greatest. If the young WR's develop, and the Browns continue to the build the line and find a running game, then Quinn might be serviceable enough. He "should" get better with more playing time. Last night was Tressel ball at its finest. The defense should be commended for playing way over their heads last night. Outstanding.
 
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The most encouraging aspect of the game was that the Browns played with heart. Good to see them not mailing anything in despite the record.
I agree. It appears that there are plenty of guys on the roster who are buying into whatever it is that Mangini is selling...... at least, that's what I'm telling myself.
 
If the defense plays like they did last night, these guys have a legitimate shot at 4-12, or even 5-11. That would be quite an accomplishment considering no Rogers, DQ, Lewis, Heiden, Pool, et al., in addition to all the turmoil.

 
Definitely Quinn should be the QB next year. I will be so upset if we take a QB early in this draft. Fill in other areas. We need someone to replace Stuckey on the FA market, he should be our #3 slot guy, or #4, and he doesn't seem to be filling that "role" right now. Either him or Robiskie need to move into that roll. Cribbs does enough on ST and Wildcat to not have to give him the "#2 title" or anything like that, he plays when we need him out there (pay the man too...just don't overpay, lol).

Alot of the big plays last night were from rookies...Mo, Bernard, Maiva, Mack, etc. Mix in Robiskie getting PT and it seems the draft class is coming along. Now we just got to get this Hawaiian rollin'.

What's with the Browns/Mangini NOT throwing the red flag on that Hines Ward sideline pass that set up a 3rd and 1? He didn't even come close to catching that ball.

 

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