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Classic Album Discussion Thread: The Kinks-Lola Versus Powerman and the Moneygoround, Pt. 1 (1 Viewer)

zamboni said:
They're close IMO, but I also like PG a bit more. 
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They are both great, but quantity doesn't always equal quality IMO. More so-so songs on PG, whereas on HOTH, Crunge is the only really just ok song (though love Bonham's ability to step on and off a beat - best offbeat syncopation drummer of all time).

 
I am a big Led Zep fan.  Houses of the Holy was the first one I bought.  I'm not arguing one LZ album over the other but this one sure is in my favorites.  

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
They are both great, but quantity doesn't always equal quality IMO. More so-so songs on PG, whereas on HOTH, Crunge is the only really just ok song (though love Bonham's ability to step on and off a beat - best offbeat syncopation drummer of all time).
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I'll give you that. IMO PG's best songs rank near the best they ever did, but there is definitely a bit of filler, too.

 
Yeah, let's just say I, II, IV, Houses of the Holy, and Physical Graffiti are all great and call it a day. III is very good, too, and then we drop off.

 
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zamboni said:
Yeah, let's just say I, II, IV, Houses of the Holy, and Physical Graffiti are all great and call it a day. III is very good, too, and then we drop off.
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Presence and In Through the Out Door. are flat out bad. 

"Nobody's Fault but Mine" -- maybe -- was the only highlight out of 19 or so songs?

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
They are both great, but quantity doesn't always equal quality IMO. More so-so songs on PG, whereas on HOTH, Crunge is the only really just ok song (though love Bonham's ability to step on and off a beat - best offbeat syncopation drummer of all time).
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Absolutely agree.  I mentioned that in the thread about Kashmir, it’s one of my favorite parts of the song. 

 
dkp993 said:
Absolutely agree.  I mentioned that in the thread about Kashmir, it’s one of my favorite parts of the song. 
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Black Dog's syncopation and tempo changes still blows me away -- have no idea still how the band so seamlessly moves from what seems like standard time signatures to very off-beat ones and then move right back to a more standard time. At some points, Page and Jones are in 5:4 time, Bonham is in 4:4 time, and they reconnect every 20 beats. The time gaps between the end of the last vocal line in each verse gets shorter each time.

That's crazy progressive rock, and they pull it off specifically because of the base Bonham pounds out.

 
While most of the albums that came before it are better, In Through the Out Door is very good. Fool in the Rain blew my mind when I first heard it back in the early 90's. 

 
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The Black Crowes- Shake Your Money Maker (1990)

Twice As Hard 

Jealous Again

Sister Luck

Could I’ve Been So Blind

Seeing Things

Hard to Handle

Thick ‘n Thin

She Talks To Angels

Struttin’ Blues

Stare It Cold

Special thanks to Tom Skerrit for requesting this, though I would have gotten around to it at some point anyhow. This is a great, old fashioned blues rock album. “Twice as Hard”, “Jealous Again” and their cover of “Hard to Handle” are all terrific rock songs, and the rest of the record is fine as well. But the best tune on the album, amd one of the best ballads of the 1990s is “She Talks To Angels”. As someone who has been, in the last couple of years, directly involved with the rehab community, I can attest to the essential truth and  power of the lyrics of this amazing song. 

 
As a huge Stones fan I fell in love with Crowes on first listen. This record can be described as derivative but it's still very good and they grew as a band and expanded their sound.

I saw them live 5 or 6 times and they grew as a live band as well - at the end of their run they became more of a jam band live as opposed to just playing their songs straight up. The last time I saw them was at the Town Hall just off Times Square in NYC. It was one acoustic set and one electric set - they did not let you bring the drinks that you could purchase in the lobby into the main room where the band was playing (we got asked to leave a few times for sneaking drinks in) and at one point we left the venue to do some shots at a bar across the street. It was election night and we ventured into Time Square - it was the night Obama got elected for the first time - we were a mixed political group and one friend was real upset at this - but either way it was pretty surreal. 

 
Fantastic Fantastic album one of my all time favorites.  The popular songs on the album are great but imho Sister Luck and Seeing Things are 1a and 1b for their best songs.  

 
The Crowes were a great live act in the 90s and into the early 2000s.  I don't think any of the spin-off bands I've seen are anywhere close to creating a similar vibe. This is a great record.  After reading about Led Zeppelin last night, and the Crowes this morning, I'm hugely tempted to stay home and smoke pot all day long. Unfortunately, I'm an old guy with kids and no life.

 
Solid band, but not one I was ever really wild about. Bad timing again, as it came out when I was getting into classic rock, so this "new stuff" came off as vastly inferior and not worth my time at the time. I've come around to liking a few of their songs, but still not a band I would ever go out of my way to hear. 

 
shuke said:
Let's not get carried away here.
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Let's not be apologists. Those albums were pablum and seemed like phone-in efforts from the band, objectively as standalone, and especially in relation to all other earlier studio albums.

CletiusMaximus said:
The Crowes were a great live act in the 90s and into the early 2000s.  I don't think any of the spin-off bands I've seen are anywhere close to creating a similar vibe. This is a great record.  After reading about Led Zeppelin last night, and the Crowes this morning, I'm hugely tempted to stay home and smoke pot all day long. Unfortunately, I'm an old guy with kids and no life.
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Loved this band and their flavor of southern rock -- great sonic sound and super bluesy (with a tinge of funk) and they could flat out jam. Rich Robinson is an underrated axeman.

Saw them live multiple times from about 1992 through 1996 or 97 -- and lost respect for their live act. In the early days, super tight band, was clear no studio trickery was needed for them to achieve either their signature sound or enhance the musicianship. But as time went on, they became...lazy. I don't know how else to put it. Shows became much shorter, much more lax in their tightness and togetherness, and seemed to just be less enthusiastic.

Kicker for me was a Nov 1 show in Buffalo. They had their big Halloween show the night before, which I get why the atmosphere the next night may have been a little spent. But they played horribly -- one or two songs off-tune, multiple songs with slips and errors, and generally not giving a $#!t. And clocked in at barely an hour before they up and left the stage.

Maybe they were hungover, tired, and spent from the crown the night before. But they certainly weren't good, nor professional. Definitely darkened my perception of them as a great live band, and never wanted to spend dough on tickets again after that fiasco.

Too bad the band went through such a tumultuous time (especially the brothers' estrangement) -- their first three albums were back-to-back-to-back gold.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
As a huge Stones fan I fell in love with Crowes on first listen. This record can be described as derivative but it's still very good and they grew as a band and expanded their sound.

I saw them live 5 or 6 times and they grew as a live band as well - at the end of their run they became more of a jam band live as opposed to just playing their songs straight up. The last time I saw them was at the Town Hall just off Times Square in NYC. It was one acoustic set and one electric set - they did not let you bring the drinks that you could purchase in the lobby into the main room where the band was playing (we got asked to leave a few times for sneaking drinks in) and at one point we left the venue to do some shots at a bar across the street. It was election night and we ventured into Time Square - it was the night Obama got elected for the first time - we were a mixed political group and one friend was real upset at this - but either way it was pretty surreal. 
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Dude, I was at that show too.  The whole evening was an incredible experience with the show and witnessing history in Times Square, just a great memory.  Actually had front row seats.  There was a big controversy when tickets first went on sale, and they were sold out like 30 seconds in.  A bunch of people on a Crowes message board at the time complained about it, and the band looked into it. Turned out most of the tickets were bought by bots/resellers, so the band had those orders cancelled.  The cool thing was, their people then went through the thread and PM'd all the people who had said they got shut out, and gave them a secret code and website to order tickets to the show.  I was shocked when I got the message from them, and then even more so when I put my order in an pulled front row tix.  I've seen the Crowes over 50 times, and this was one to remember.

As far as SYMM goes, I remember when I first heard Jealous Again on the radio and it just CLICKED for me.  Been a huge fan ever since (well, until Chris Robinson turned into a total douchenozzle, and broke up the band with his greed a few years ago).  Just a great, no-frills, rock and roll album, and it's not even their best.  They really hit their stride with their next two albums, Southern Harmony and the Musical Companion, and Amorica, which while not as popular, were both light-years ahead of SYMM musically.

 
We had a karaoke game on the original Xbox that had Talks To Angels as a track. You had to match the surprisingly difficult up and downs on that track and while I'm a decent singer, it didn't go well for me. My wife and daughter (about 8 at the time) were both kind of giving me a hard time.

My 5 y.o. at the time son chimed in with the utmost deadpan sincerity saying "I liked it...But you failed." We still use that phrase often.

 
Skipdog77 said:
Dude, I was at that show too.  
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That’s funny. This is the second time this has happened where I’ve talked about a show and some other FBG chimes in he was there as well.

It was a great night. I know I was the one who got the tickets for the four of us but don’t remember how exactly - guess I just got lucky. We had good seats as well but not quite front row.

 
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Saw the Crowes for first time in 1990, right around the time that the album was released. My friend and I were big Aerosmith fans, and the Crowes I were opening for Aerosmith on their Pump tour. Was instantly hooked. 

My favorite song is Seeing Things. The slow crescendo through to the end gives me goose bumps every time I hear it. And the volume must be at 11. 

Will post more later. 

 
Stompin' Tom Connors said:
Let's not be apologists. Those albums were pablum and seemed like phone-in efforts from the band, objectively as standalone, and especially in relation to all other earlier studio albums.

Loved this band and their flavor of southern rock -- great sonic sound and super bluesy (with a tinge of funk) and they could flat out jam. Rich Robinson is an underrated axeman.

Saw them live multiple times from about 1992 through 1996 or 97 -- and lost respect for their live act. In the early days, super tight band, was clear no studio trickery was needed for them to achieve either their signature sound or enhance the musicianship. But as time went on, they became...lazy. I don't know how else to put it. Shows became much shorter, much more lax in their tightness and togetherness, and seemed to just be less enthusiastic.

Kicker for me was a Nov 1 show in Buffalo. They had their big Halloween show the night before, which I get why the atmosphere the next night may have been a little spent. But they played horribly -- one or two songs off-tune, multiple songs with slips and errors, and generally not giving a $#!t. And clocked in at barely an hour before they up and left the stage.

Maybe they were hungover, tired, and spent from the crown the night before. But they certainly weren't good, nor professional. Definitely darkened my perception of them as a great live band, and never wanted to spend dough on tickets again after that fiasco.

Too bad the band went through such a tumultuous time (especially the brothers' estrangement) -- their first three albums were back-to-back-to-back gold.
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Marc Ford (guitarist) became a heroin addict and a show liability. Ultimately Ford was fired. Which was too bad because I really liked him. The band definitely changed after he left. Though I will always be a fan. 

 
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Everyone compared The Black Crowes to the Rolling Stones in 1990, but I thought they were more like a mix of Lynyrd Skynyrd and the Allman Brothers. I saw them live in 1990 and became an instant fan. I thought SYMM was the last great album of the classic rock era (and I still do).

I stopped following the band after a few albums because I couldn't get into the free-form jamming. I mean, I like jamming now and then. But after hearing how tight they could be on their first couple of albums, it really just felt like they had gotten a little lazy. 

 
[scooter] said:
Everyone compared The Black Crowes to the Rolling Stones in 1990, but I thought they were more like a mix of Lynyrd Skynyrd and the Allman Brothers. I saw them live in 1990 and became an instant fan. I thought SYMM was the last great album of the classic rock era (and I still do).

I stopped following the band after a few albums because I couldn't get into the free-form jamming. I mean, I like jamming now and then. But after hearing how tight they could be on their first couple of albums, it really just felt like they had gotten a little lazy. 
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For what it’s worth, the last show I saw... ~2010-12ish... they were really tight. It was a really good show. Was an outdoor show and it started pouring down rain in the back end, and they kept on playing for another 45 minutes to an hour. Most everyone stayed. Vocals and harmonies were incredible. 

 
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Tom Skerritt said:
For what it’s worth, the last show I saw... ~2010-12ish... they were really tight. It was a really good show. Was an outdoor show and it started pouring down rain in the back end, and they kept on playing for another 45 minutes to an hour. Most everyone stayed. Vocals and harmonies were incredible. 
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Last tour with Jackie Greene in the band was very very good.

Chris does their songs in band "As the Crow Flies" and has Marcus King in the band and they are good too.

 
Did a three leg travel tour in the summer of 1998 on the Sho Nuff tour... Dallas, Austin, and San Antonio. 

Got my second tattoo during the Austin stop. Also got my first hemorrhoid.  :lmao:

San Antonio set was so freaking hot, (it was like 110-115 degrees in Texas) they played for 45 minutes, maybe an hour, and ended the show very early.  Some people were pissed, but I loved it. 

Buddy and I showed up at the club a several hours early in SA. We walked in, sat at the bar, and listened to sound check for about 20 minutes until someone asked what we were doing there and told us we needed to leave. Will always remember those 20 minutes. 

 
Indigo Girls (1989)

Closer to Fine

Secure Yourself

Kid Fears

Prince of Darkness

Blood and Fire

Tried to Be True

Love’s Recovery

Land of Canaan

Center Stage

 History of Us

This was actually Indigo Girls’ 2nd album- Strange Fire came out a year earlier with an independent label and no sales- but it was their breakthrough. “Closer to Fine” became an instant hit and ever since it’s become THE song of the lesbian movement of this country (along with the band itself- I’ve attended a couple of concerts and the audience has been heavily lesbian each time.) 

But the lesbian theme shouldn’t hide the fact that this is an outstanding record, the first of many for this duo, in the folk/singer songwriter tradition of Joni Mitchell and Jim Croce. Emily Sayers and Amy Ray are both accomplished songwriters and very different: Emily has better pop sense, while Amy is darker, moodier. Their harmonies together are as good as any this side of Simon & Garfunkel. Michael Stipe adds guest vocals to “Kid Fears”; other gems on this album include “Prince of Darkness”, “Lamd of Canaan”, “Love’s Recovery”, and of course “Closer to Fine”. 

 
I think the Indigo Girls self-titled album is great. I've never heard anything about the song Closer to Fine having some lesbian movement attached to it. The IG's are lesbians, and have a big gay following due to that, but they have a lot of straight people who love them as well. My best friend, who is straight, has got to be one of their biggest fans. Anyway, there isn't a bad song on this album. "Prince of Darkness" is my favorite.

 
simey said:
I think the Indigo Girls self-titled album is great. I've never heard anything about the song Closer to Fine having some lesbian movement attached to it. The IG's are lesbians, and have a big gay following due to that, but they have a lot of straight people who love them as well. My best friend, who is straight, has got to be one of their biggest fans. Anyway, there isn't a bad song on this album. "Prince of Darkness" is my favorite.
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Yeah, I always thought Closer to Fine was about self-exploration and searching for some sort of meaning in life and identity. I think the lyrics sort of back that up. There's an element of the search for soul or self (whatever you choose) inherent in the lyrics. 

Yes, lots of lesbians like the Indigo Girls, but if Dylan had sung that song, it'd be no different in what it was about.  

 
I actually went to an IG concert in a small venue with my fiance and one of her lady friends.  Teased them about being their "beard" as there were lots of females in attendance. Pretty good concert - their songs and harmonies were solid.

 
rockaction said:
Yeah, I always thought Closer to Fine was about self-exploration and searching for some sort of meaning in life and identity. I think the lyrics sort of back that up. There's an element of the search for soul or self (whatever you choose) inherent in the lyrics. 

Yes, lots of lesbians like the Indigo Girls, but if Dylan had sung that song, it'd be no different in what it was about.  
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I never wrote that “Closer to Fine” was about lesbianism; it’s not. What I wrote is that it became an anthem of the lesbian movement, partly because of the identity of the artists and partly because the lyrics are about self- expression and freedom, and mostly because it’s catchy and anthemic. 

 
timschochet said:
I never wrote that “Closer to Fine” was about lesbianism; it’s not. What I wrote is that it became an anthem of the lesbian movement, partly because of the identity of the artists and partly because the lyrics are about self- expression and freedom, and mostly because it’s catchy and anthemic. 
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Point noted.  

 
timschochet said:
I never wrote that “Closer to Fine” was about lesbianism; it’s not. What I wrote is that it became an anthem of the lesbian movement, partly because of the identity of the artists and partly because the lyrics are about self- expression and freedom, and mostly because it’s catchy and anthemic. 
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No idea about an anthem of the lesbian movement.  That said, when my wife started revisiting this album 8 years ago, she decided to buy a Subaru Outback shortly afterward.   Coincidence?

 
Alex P Keaton said:
No idea about an anthem of the lesbian movement.  That said, when my wife started revisiting this album 8 years ago, she decided to buy a Subaru Outback shortly afterward.   Coincidence?
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In all seriousness, Subaru was the first car company to target lesbians as a distinct demographic, and they responded.  

 
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