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Clinton Portis, top 5 RB? (1 Viewer)

thatguy

Footballguy
Alright, so a lot of people said in the Portis/Bailey trade thread that without question Portis is a top 5 RB--not in terms of fantasy value, but in terms of his overall skillset as an NFL RB.I figured I'd start another thread to debate this. Off of the top of my head, here are a five RBs that are likely better than Portis (really, it's pretty subjective):LT, SA, LJ, Tiki, EdgeAfter these guys, there is atleast a handful of others who, IMO, are about on par with Clinton.

 

wannabee

Footballguy
I think most would make a case that the top three (in no particular order) are LJ, LT2, and SAlex.Most have #4 as Edge.Now, five is where it gets interesting. Postid could be #5. But, a case could be made for Tiki, SJax, Rudi, and a few others. So, to answer your question, I think he is in the RB5-7 range. The differences will be determined by league scoring and personal preference.

 

thatguy

Footballguy
I think most would make a case that the top three (in no particular order) are LJ, LT2, and SAlex.

Most have #4 as Edge.

Now, five is where it gets interesting. Postid could be #5. But, a case could be made for Tiki, SJax, Rudi, and a few others.

So, to answer your question, I think he is in the RB5-7 range. The differences will be determined by league scoring and personal preference.
I'm not talking fanasy-wise, I'm talking about overall skillset as an NFL RB.
 

wannabee

Footballguy
you might be right. But until SAlexander leaves Sea, we will never know. Same goes for Edge. So, I go on that. But, on NFL rankings, there are several more backs in that class who do not show up on the fantasy map due to situation and opportunity. Caddy, Dillon, Jordan, Willis etc. who could be as good as portis. My point is it is diificult to separate the back from the situation. Until a couple of months ago, many thought Portis' success was due to the Denver offense.

 

Ronnie Mack

Footballguy
1. LJ2. TIKI3. PORTIS4. ALEXANDER5. LT*first you have to determine criteria, here's mine:a. big play abilityb. durabilityc. complete backMy take is #26 is carrying the Skins on his back- the guy is a true warrior. LT is talented, but breaks down. And Alexander isnt getting any love until they play somebody- give me a break that division is such a joke. Edge is guilt by association, and runs like a fullback.

 

crush304

Footballguy
here are the all time rankings for rushing yards through a players first 4 years in the league1.) Eric Dickerson 6968 yds2.) Earl Campbell 6457 yds3.) Terell Davis 6413 yds4.) Clinton Portis 5930 yds5.) LT 5899 yds6.) Emmitt Smith 5699 yds7.) Barry Sanders 5674 yds8.) Eddie George 5365 yds9.) Walter Payton 5316 yds10.) Curtis Martin 5086 yds

 

pinda

Footballguy
1. LJ

2. TIKI

3. PORTIS

4. ALEXANDER

5. LT

*first you have to determine criteria, here's mine:

a. big play ability

b. durability

c. complete back

My take is #26 is carrying the Skins on his back- the guy is a true warrior. LT is talented, but breaks down. And Alexander isnt getting any love until they play somebody- give me a break that division is such a joke. Edge is guilt by association, and runs like a fullback.
wow, this has to be coming for a Portis/Skins fanLT breaks down???? the guy got hurt this year, give the man a break. he got hurt b/c somebody punched him hard enough to break a rib.

no chance that Portis' skill set is better than LT. Portis is not a pass catching RB. do you guys forget that LT caught 100 receptions not even 2 years ago, come on give the guy some credit and lose the short sightedness.

1. LT

2. Barber

3. Alexander

4. LJ

5. it's a toss up here between Portis, James

and if this is a for what he means to his team type thread, then how can you look past guys like Thomas Jones, Brian Westbrook, Warick Dunn, Deuce McAllister.....these guys have been the heart and soul of their teams.

 

~OMM~

Footballguy
I agree mostly with what Pinda says and think R. Mack is also being shortsighted. LT2 got screwed by a cheap shot from a worthless Raider after a play ended in Week 13 I believe. LT2 is the most complete RB in the NFL at the moment and LJ is the one that needs to prove his full season durability, IMO. Then again; LJ may just do that and is certainly talented and powerful enough to be the #1 back in the league with that O-line, if it stays together. As far as Portis is concerned...his fantasy value took an obvious hit when he left the Broncos but he seems to be living up to that contract he acquired when going to D.C. I always liked him as he helped me win alot of $ when he was a rookie in 2002 and I grabbed him in the 8th round of a redraft league. Now I just respect him as I always pull for the Redskins to lose. I feel there are about 6-7 RB's I would take in a PPR redraft over Portis, but he is definately not to be overlooked. ~2 cents - OMM~

 

Bri

Footballguy
Portis and the public's perception of him remind me of Curtis Martin. I hope he can "keep it up" and get the credit he's due eventually, like Martin.

 

John 14:6

Jesus is Lord!
It's very hard to say since you have to factor in the surrounding offense (especially the line) and how the team uses their RB. For example, TEs scored 8 goalline TDs and 14 redzone TDs for the Redskins (based on the FBG week 17 stats). I know that all players lose some TDs to vultures, but this seems to be a lot. Portis had 11 TDs, tied for 11th in the league among all players. If he had just half of those 8 goalline TDs, he'd have 15 TDs to put him 4th overall behind Alexander, LJ, and LT. If he had just half of the 14 redzone TDs, he'd have 18 and still be 4th, but much closer to LT who had 20. I guess the point is if he was on a team with a philosophy like the Chiefs who give the RB ample scoring opportunities, he could even be a top 5 fantasy RB.

 
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ren hoek

Footballguy
I give Portis a lot of credit for bulking up and becoming a RB who can handle 300 carries in a bruising running game. In Denver it seemed like he made his living by piercing through the defense with game-breaking speed and agility and a great zone-blocking offensive line. In Washington, it's like he's become a completely different back, providing a physical running game behind a more traditional offensive set. His production up to this point while with two different teams has flown way under the radar.

 

-OZ-

Footballguy
1. LJ

2. TIKI

3. PORTIS

4. ALEXANDER

5. LT

*first you have to determine criteria, here's mine:

a. big play ability

b. durability

c. complete back

My take is #26 is carrying the Skins on his back- the guy is a true warrior. LT is talented, but breaks down. And Alexander isnt getting any love until they play somebody- give me a break that division is such a joke. Edge is guilt by association, and runs like a fullback.
Are you even watching the Chiefs when you make this ranking?Big play - check

Durability - unknown until he starts a full season

Complete back - LJ loses about 10 spots on this alone. Learn to block, then he may be top 3. The best RB in the game would not be pulled on passing downs.

1. LT

2. Tiki

3. Edge

4. Alexander

5. Portis

 

Blackjacks

Footballguy
With no reasoning behind this comment I'll say I think he's right behind LT and EDGE. I put him above Alexander and Johnson due to the fact that if he was running in those systems I think CP would put up better #'s. Plus Alexander maybe has 3 years left at most CP just getting ready to hit his prime years.....THAT"S SCARY. :eek:

 

Chase Stuart

Footballguy
I don't understand how anyone can make a case that Tiki Barber isn't the best RB in the NFL. He's led the league in yards from scrimmage each of the past two years, and has a worse supporting cast than all the others with the big TD totals. Sure he's hold, but this year there wasn't a better RB than Tiki.Alexander and LJ were the only one with better stats, and their OLs are 10X better than Barber's.

 
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avoiding injuries

Footballguy
As a Redskins fan my team already has Portis. I would have to name 5 other RB's I would rather have on my team. Can't do it.1. LT22. Portis3. Edge4. SA5. LJLT2, I'd be a fool not to want him.Edge and Portis match up rather well, but I went with Portis b/c of age.SA is remarkable, but I dropped him b/c of W Jones and company.I have yet to see a RB fail in the KC backfield the past few years. OL gets a lot of credit there.

 

-OZ-

Footballguy
I don't understand how anyone can make a case that Tiki Barber isn't the best RB in the NFL. He's led the league in yards from scrimmage each of the past two years, and has a worse supporting cast than all the others with the big TD totals. Sure he's hold, but this year there wasn't a better RB than Tiki.

Alexander and LJ were the only one with better stats, and their OLs are 10X better than Barber's.
I agree that Tiki is right up there, but if I'm starting a team, I don't take him above LT. This year, he may well have been the better RB, he led his team to the playoffs and IMO, probably into the NFC Championship game.

 

Chase Stuart

Footballguy
I don't understand how anyone can make a case that Tiki Barber isn't the best RB in the NFL. He's led the league in yards from scrimmage each of the past two years, and has a worse supporting cast than all the others with the big TD totals. Sure he's hold, but this year there wasn't a better RB than Tiki.

Alexander and LJ were the only one with better stats, and their OLs are 10X better than Barber's.
I agree that Tiki is right up there, but if I'm starting a team, I don't take him above LT. This year, he may well have been the better RB, he led his team to the playoffs and IMO, probably into the NFC Championship game.
Agreed, but only because of Tiki's age. There's not a better RB in the NFL right now though.
 

packersfan

Footballguy
Since I was the first one to mention in that thread that I believe Portis is, without question, a Top 5 RB in the NFL in terms of pure talent here's my list:1. LT: I worry about the durability issues (he's been banged up now each of the past two seasons) but in terms of pure talent there isn't anyone in the league I would take ahead of him. There is nothing he cannot do on a football field -- even throw the ball. :)2. Edgerrin James: I still wonder just how good Edge could have been if he had never suffered that knee injury because as good as he is now, he's not quite as good as he was then. But he's still immensely gifted and excels in all aspects of being a RB, including the pivotal aspect of blocking where he may be the best in the league now that Marshall Faulk is nearing the end of the line.3. Clinton Portis: I think his talent is off-the-charts. He has now proven he can excel in two vastly different offensive systems. He's tougher than given credit for being and he has home-run ability every time he gets his hands on the ball. 4. Tiki Barber: The only thing keeping Barber down a bit on my list is he's older than the RBs listed above him. But he's an absolutely sensational RB who can also do everything on the football field. If he'd only get a head coach who truly appreciated his vastly under-rated short-yardage skill maybe Barber could make a run at the single season TD record. 5. Shaun Alexander: So what if he's the product of a great system? He's putting up huge numbers year in and year out. He's absolute money near the goal line and I don't care who else is on the field, if you have a RB with a nose for the goal line that's a HUGE asset to your football team. He's also proven to be a good receiver out of the backfield and he's running with more authority and purpose than he did earlier in his career. He's a legitimately great RB and well deserving of the MVP award this season.That's my list. :)

 

Ronnie Mack

Footballguy
1. LJ

2. TIKI

3. PORTIS

4. ALEXANDER

5. LT

*first you have to determine criteria, here's mine:

a. big play ability

b. durability

c. complete back

My take is #26 is carrying the Skins on his back- the guy is a true warrior. LT is talented, but breaks down. And Alexander isnt getting any love until they play somebody- give me a break that division is such a joke. Edge is guilt by association, and runs like a fullback.
wow, this has to be coming for a Portis/Skins fanLT breaks down???? the guy got hurt this year, give the man a break. he got hurt b/c somebody punched him hard enough to break a rib.

no chance that Portis' skill set is better than LT. Portis is not a pass catching RB. do you guys forget that LT caught 100 receptions not even 2 years ago, come on give the guy some credit and lose the short sightedness.

1. LT

2. Barber

3. Alexander

4. LJ

5. it's a toss up here between Portis, James

and if this is a for what he means to his team type thread, then how can you look past guys like Thomas Jones, Brian Westbrook, Warick Dunn, Deuce McAllister.....these guys have been the heart and soul of their teams.
Dude chill- I grew up in Diego. And LT broke down in '04 as well (groin)- which would equate to durability issues. Maybe he should follow the Portis plan and bulk up this offseason. Your yacking about being "shortsighted" check out the most yards gained chart on this post, that would support my basis.
 

dgreen

Footballguy
It's very hard to say since you have to factor in the surrounding offense (especially the line) and how the team uses their RB. For example, TEs scored 8 goalline TDs and 14 redzone TDs for the Redskins (based on the FBG week 17 stats). I know that all players lose some TDs to vultures, but this seems to be a lot. Portis had 11 TDs, tied for 11th in the league among all players. If he had just half of those 8 goalline TDs, he'd have 15 TDs to put him 4th overall behind Alexander, LJ, and LT. If he had just half of the 14 redzone TDs, he'd have 18 and still be 4th, but much closer to LT who had 20.
Teams know Gibbs wants to run the ball, especially down at the goal line. The OL, early in the season, just wasn't getting the push needed to punch it in against 11 defenders. So, Gibbs started to run play action and hit the H-back for TDs. That started giving the Skins offense the ability to run the ball in short-yardage situations.
I guess the point is if he was on a team with a philosophy like the Chiefs who give the RB ample scoring opportunities, he could even be a top 5 fantasy RB.
Portis ranked 6th in FBG scoring this year. He finished 24 points behind Edge, who had about 20 more touches than Portis.I think we could see both Portis and the OL take the next step in Gibbs' offense next year. That means they won't really care about trying to fool anyone at the goal line. They'll just line up, maybe even tell you what they're running, and pound it in for a TD.

 

jurb26

Footballguy
1. LT2. Portis3. Barber4. SA5. Edge6. McGahee7. L.Johnson8. Jordan9. S.Jackson10. R.Johnson

 

-OZ-

Footballguy
1. LT

2. Portis

3. Barber

4. SA

5. Edge

6. McGahee

7. L.Johnson

8. Jordan

9. S.Jackson

10. R.Johnson
Decent list, but Warrick Dunn has to be on it ahead of Rudi IMO. He brings more things to the field. I might put Jordan ahead of McGahee for the short term as well.
 

jurb26

Footballguy
1. LT

2. Portis

3. Barber

4. SA

5. Edge

6. McGahee

7. L.Johnson

8. Jordan

9. S.Jackson

10. R.Johnson
Decent list, but Warrick Dunn has to be on it ahead of Rudi IMO. He brings more things to the field. I might put Jordan ahead of McGahee for the short term as well.
Dunn was a guy I struggled to leave off. I had to give the edge to Rudi though because I think he is a bit tougher a runner and Dunn benifits from having Vick create seams in the running game. I could go either way with the 2 of them though.
 

-OZ-

Footballguy
1. LT

2. Portis

3. Barber

4. SA

5. Edge

6. McGahee

7. L.Johnson

8. Jordan

9. S.Jackson

10. R.Johnson
Decent list, but Warrick Dunn has to be on it ahead of Rudi IMO. He brings more things to the field. I might put Jordan ahead of McGahee for the short term as well.
Dunn was a guy I struggled to leave off. I had to give the edge to Rudi though because I think he is a bit tougher a runner and Dunn benifits from having Vick create seams in the running game. I could go either way with the 2 of them though.
Fair enough. I value receiving ability in my RBs more than some do. I like the option and how it affects the defensive scheme.
 

jwvdcw

Footballguy
Since I was the first one to mention in that thread that I believe Portis is, without question, a Top 5 RB in the NFL in terms of pure talent here's my list:

1. LT: I worry about the durability issues (he's been banged up now each of the past two seasons) but in terms of pure talent there isn't anyone in the league I would take ahead of him. There is nothing he cannot do on a football field -- even throw the ball. :)

2. Edgerrin James: I still wonder just how good Edge could have been if he had never suffered that knee injury because as good as he is now, he's not quite as good as he was then. But he's still immensely gifted and excels in all aspects of being a RB, including the pivotal aspect of blocking where he may be the best in the league now that Marshall Faulk is nearing the end of the line.

3. Clinton Portis: I think his talent is off-the-charts. He has now proven he can excel in two vastly different offensive systems. He's tougher than given credit for being and he has home-run ability every time he gets his hands on the ball.

4. Tiki Barber: The only thing keeping Barber down a bit on my list is he's older than the RBs listed above him. But he's an absolutely sensational RB who can also do everything on the football field. If he'd only get a head coach who truly appreciated his vastly under-rated short-yardage skill maybe Barber could make a run at the single season TD record.

5. Shaun Alexander: So what if he's the product of a great system? He's putting up huge numbers year in and year out. He's absolute money near the goal line and I don't care who else is on the field, if you have a RB with a nose for the goal line that's a HUGE asset to your football team. He's also proven to be a good receiver out of the backfield and he's running with more authority and purpose than he did earlier in his career. He's a legitimately great RB and well deserving of the MVP award this season.

That's my list. :)
excellent list. Mine is: 1. LT2

2. Barber

3. SA

4. Portis

5. Edge

LJ is way overrated. Anyone can run in that system, and LJ hasn't mastered the other aspects of the game yet.

 

packersfan

Footballguy
Since I was the first one to mention in that thread that I believe Portis is, without question, a Top 5 RB in the NFL in terms of pure talent here's my list:

1. LT: I worry about the durability issues (he's been banged up now each of the past two seasons) but in terms of pure talent there isn't anyone in the league I would take ahead of him. There is nothing he cannot do on a football field -- even throw the ball. :)

2. Edgerrin James: I still wonder just how good Edge could have been if he had never suffered that knee injury because as good as he is now, he's not quite as good as he was then. But he's still immensely gifted and excels in all aspects of being a RB, including the pivotal aspect of blocking where he may be the best in the league now that Marshall Faulk is nearing the end of the line.

3. Clinton Portis: I think his talent is off-the-charts. He has now proven he can excel in two vastly different offensive systems. He's tougher than given credit for being and he has home-run ability every time he gets his hands on the ball.

4. Tiki Barber: The only thing keeping Barber down a bit on my list is he's older than the RBs listed above him. But he's an absolutely sensational RB who can also do everything on the football field. If he'd only get a head coach who truly appreciated his vastly under-rated short-yardage skill maybe Barber could make a run at the single season TD record.

5. Shaun Alexander: So what if he's the product of a great system? He's putting up huge numbers year in and year out. He's absolute money near the goal line and I don't care who else is on the field, if you have a RB with a nose for the goal line that's a HUGE asset to your football team. He's also proven to be a good receiver out of the backfield and he's running with more authority and purpose than he did earlier in his career. He's a legitimately great RB and well deserving of the MVP award this season.

That's my list. :)
excellent list. Mine is: 1. LT2

2. Barber

3. SA

4. Portis

5. Edge

LJ is way overrated. Anyone can run in that system, and LJ hasn't mastered the other aspects of the game yet.
I don't agree that Johnson is over-rated. I think he's proving to be a very talented RB. However, he needs to do it for a bit longer to be included with a group of RBs who have excelled over the course of several years. I thought about moving Edge down my list a bit -- I originally had Portis No. 2 and Edge No. 3 -- but when you consider that Edge is arguably the best in the league at picking up blitzes and helping to protect the QB that is a HUGE asset in his favor. That's even more true when you consider the team he plays on and how important the passing game and their QB is to their success. Edge isn't quite the same explosive Edge he was pre-knee injury, but I think he's a more complete RB now and he clearly can carry an offense either as a runner or receiver out of the backfield. Put all of that together and that's why I moved him up to No. 2. He isn't going to bust one for 90 yards the way Portis can but I think he does everything else more completely (although Portis is under-rated in many aspects of the game) at a slightly higher level.

 

jbz

Footballguy
What I found a nice surprise about Portis was his blocking ability. I watched every Redskins game he's played and his blocking and blitz pickup is terrific.

 

pinda

Footballguy
1. LJ

2. TIKI

3. PORTIS

4. ALEXANDER

5. LT

*first you have to determine criteria, here's mine:

a. big play ability

b. durability

c. complete back

My take is #26 is carrying the Skins on his back- the guy is a true warrior. LT is talented, but breaks down. And Alexander isnt getting any love until they play somebody- give me a break that division is such a joke. Edge is guilt by association, and runs like a fullback.
wow, this has to be coming for a Portis/Skins fanLT breaks down???? the guy got hurt this year, give the man a break. he got hurt b/c somebody punched him hard enough to break a rib.

no chance that Portis' skill set is better than LT. Portis is not a pass catching RB. do you guys forget that LT caught 100 receptions not even 2 years ago, come on give the guy some credit and lose the short sightedness.

1. LT

2. Barber

3. Alexander

4. LJ

5. it's a toss up here between Portis, James

and if this is a for what he means to his team type thread, then how can you look past guys like Thomas Jones, Brian Westbrook, Warick Dunn, Deuce McAllister.....these guys have been the heart and soul of their teams.
Dude chill- I grew up in Diego. And LT broke down in '04 as well (groin)- which would equate to durability issues. Maybe he should follow the Portis plan and bulk up this offseason. Your yacking about being "shortsighted" check out the most yards gained chart on this post, that would support my basis.
"Dude", could you imagine LT's stats behind the Broncos rush line. LT bulk up, that's funny, Portis bulked up is probably closer to where LT is on a regular basis. And you kind of proved my point about LT and Portis if you were only basing it on the yards gained stat, most NFL fans would agree and think beyond numbers and see why Portis has those numbers, maybe because of the Denver running system.
 
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John 14:6

Jesus is Lord!
I think we could see both Portis and the OL take the next step in Gibbs' offense next year. That means they won't really care about trying to fool anyone at the goal line. They'll just line up, maybe even tell you what they're running, and pound it in for a TD.
I sure hope so. I have Portis in a TD only league (which is why I didn't realize right off hand how high he finished in standard leagues). I used to have Ahman Green in this same league. He would score about 9 TDs and lose several to play action passes to the TEs. I traded him right before his 20 TD season when the team finally just gave him the ball at the goalline. Given that Portis has a lot more TDs in the second half of the season, I think you may be right :thumbup:
 

fatness

against the grain
What I found a nice surprise about Portis was his blocking ability. I watched every Redskins game he's played and his blocking and blitz pickup is terrific.
He seems to recognize where the unblocked defender comes from quite well. And man, does he launch into his blocks. That's why his shoulders have been sore all year.
 
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jurb26

Footballguy
1. LJ

2. TIKI

3. PORTIS

4. ALEXANDER

5. LT

*first you have to determine criteria, here's mine:

a. big play ability

b. durability

c. complete back

My take is #26 is carrying the Skins on his back- the guy is a true warrior. LT is talented, but breaks down. And Alexander isnt getting any love until they play somebody- give me a break that division is such a joke. Edge is guilt by association, and runs like a fullback.
wow, this has to be coming for a Portis/Skins fanLT breaks down???? the guy got hurt this year, give the man a break. he got hurt b/c somebody punched him hard enough to break a rib.

no chance that Portis' skill set is better than LT. Portis is not a pass catching RB. do you guys forget that LT caught 100 receptions not even 2 years ago, come on give the guy some credit and lose the short sightedness.

1. LT

2. Barber

3. Alexander

4. LJ

5. it's a toss up here between Portis, James

and if this is a for what he means to his team type thread, then how can you look past guys like Thomas Jones, Brian Westbrook, Warick Dunn, Deuce McAllister.....these guys have been the heart and soul of their teams.
Dude chill- I grew up in Diego. And LT broke down in '04 as well (groin)- which would equate to durability issues. Maybe he should follow the Portis plan and bulk up this offseason. Your yacking about being "shortsighted" check out the most yards gained chart on this post, that would support my basis.
"Dude", could you imagine LT's stats behind the Broncos rush line. LT bulk up, that's funny, Portis bulked up is probably closer to where LT is on a regular basis. And you kind of proved my point about LT and Portis if you were only basing it on the yards gained stat, most NFL fans would agree and think beyond numbers and see why Portis has those numbers, maybe because of the Denver running system.
:lmao:
 

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