jeaton6
Footballguy
I you do we are looking at multiple short stories today which will give me a bigger headache than I already have.
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Dynasty Value Discussion Thread (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter spider321
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Biabreakable
Footballguy
There is a subforum here where you can look for leagues.
In my opinion you want to avoid the potential pyramid scams such as what happened with phenoms.
FFPC is usually short rosters, so while technically a dynasty league, you should play that closer to a redraft league.
I don't know what is the best place to join a dynasty auction league, but a friend of mine did join one a year or so ago that was through FFPC I think, that involved devy auctions too.
Leroy's Aces
Footballguy
As a part owner and commissioner of FFPC dynasty, I want to comment on a few things in your post.
FFPC is licensed in many of the newly regulated states, including New York, Pennsylvania, Colorado, Maryland, and a few others I am forgetting, and are applying to states like Ohio, Missouri, Indiana and again, a few others. And there are a ton of states currently that permit fantasy and do not have a state-specific law.
We always have matching funds in a separate Special Purpose Entity, whose sole purpose is to protect consumer funds. On top of the fact that we have ethics and would not ever do this, it is impossible for us to screw customers out of money as all funds in that company are set aside exclusively for customers. We get annual audits, both financial and game testing. There are a bunch of other consumer protections. We have a compliance officer. While there could be another Phenoms, it will not be by any of the entities licensed in serious-about-regulation states like Pennsylvania and New York. Here is the list for Pennsylvania, and also Sportshub applied but is not yet listed. The license fee alone for PA is $50,000 plus annual taxes, too. We also submitted 200+ pages of applications, fingerprints, personal history up the wazoo, and so on. So there are only seven fantasy companies in the nation you can really trust as far as meeting the hefty financial and compliance requirements of a serious state like Pennsylvania. I cannot speak for any of the other companies, but as of today, any not on the linked list must be not operating in Pennsylvania or they are violating their pretty serious laws there.
FFPC does not currently offer dynasty auction or any online auction format. Maybe in 2019.
No one I have encountered runs their dynasty teams very much like a redraft league. They are just run like a normal dynasty league but with a short roster of players to keep. Stud players are worth more and QBs have reduced value. You still keep 14 skill players year over year, which makes for insane amounts of trading before cutdown deadline. Also, rookie/free agent drafts are also way more interesting as there is real veteran talent available. The last benefit is that it makes the leagues more competitive and easier to turn around a poor team in our experience.
I hope that helps provide a little bit of clarity on some of the items you mentioned.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
I wasn't looking for a league, was just trying to help a fellow FBG out.
I have a very bad taste in my mouth because of what happened with phenoms. I never joined phenoms because I saw how it could be a scam pretty easily, and then ultimately it turned out to be. I feel bad for writing for UTH for a brief time because of CP's close ties with Mike of phenoms. He was shilling for phenoms right up until the news broke about people not being paid and it going under. I presume CP was being compensated something in order to advertise for them on his podcast and so on.
I know many people here at FBGs remember unlucky (Mike) and it would not surprise me at all if they are still friends with him today.
I didn't mean to suggest that FFPC is a risk like phenoms. That was just a separate issue of my response. Thanks for the information about how this is being prevented. I hope that is useful to anyone reading this and looking for leagues.
As far as my statement about short roster dynasty leagues being closer to redraft than dynasty leagues with larger rosters, you can spin it however you like but 14 players is more like a deep keeper than a dynasty league where you can keep 24 or more offensive players. It just is. If people like to play that way more power to them but that format completely kills any long term draft and hold type of strategy, and therefore it becomes closer to a redraft league, the onus is always on winning now instead of a greater variety of strategies you may see owners using in dynasty leagues that do allow larger rosters. To each their own.
I guess the auction devy league was from somewhere else than FFPC then. My friend was playing FFPC as well so I thought it might have been hosted there. I guess not.
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Rookies - what now? (Now including rounds 2 and 3)
This one has fallen to page 5 now. Kind of been replaced by the WR and RB threads.
Also
Bojang's Post Draft Tiers
For actual drafts
***Official*** Post Your 2018 Rookie Draft
Some others as well. Its not all in one thread though.
flapgreen
Footballguy
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
It's actually kind of interesting because if we throw out the game where ARob tore his ACL on the first play, the two have actually played the exact same number of games.
In those games, ARob has only 2 more catches but has 400 more yards and 7 more TDs. Given that non-ppr is all yards/TDs it seems like that scoring system favors him a good bit more than PPR does.
True, but they are close enough where in non ppr I’ll take Diggs plus the stab at the last of the 8 RBs as if that RB hits, he’s worth 2x Diggs or ARob.
flapgreen
Footballguy
flapgreen
Footballguy
Pwingles
Footballguy
How are we feeling about Rico gathers right now?
Should owners be shopping him? Should people be buying?
Obviously his perceived value right now is pretty high after the witten news.
I am an owner in 2 spots both TE premium, have been stashing since before last pre season, whats the move?
Should owners be shopping him? Should people be buying?
Obviously his perceived value right now is pretty high after the witten news.
I am an owner in 2 spots both TE premium, have been stashing since before last pre season, whats the move?
tkrull
Footballguy
Pwingles
Footballguy
joey
Footballguy
One last question for FFPCer's out there...
Am I reading it right that the site only pays out $600 of the total $924 for $77 leagues (ie. the site keeps 1/3 of the buy in purse)?
Seems like a pretty damn high vig to me but wanted to make sure I wasn't misreading.
Pwingles
Footballguy
i am unfamiliar with ffpc but is there a progressive pot or partial deposit for next season?
joey
Footballguy
for $77 league, there is a pot for next season but it says the initial buy-in payment is $154 (basically paying for this and next season for initial buy-in, and then only paying $77 each year from then on to continuously pay for the next season). So it does seem like they're taking a 1/3rd "fee" off the top of the purse, which seems super high to me.
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
It's all great until they steal your money.
Pwingles
Footballguy
i would agree 33% rake is pretty high
again, i am unfamiliar with those leagues and dunno what sorts of services they provide aside from hosting the league
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
A co-owner of the site posted yesterday that they would never steal anyone’s money. So there’s that.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
They don't have to, they are already taking 1/3. Who's gonna ruin that gravy train?
Aunt Jemima
Footballguy
Don't play in the cheap leagues, as the buy-in's go up the % they keep goes down significantly. FFPC was historically a high stakes site, they just added the lower stakes stuff the last few years. Most of my leagues are $750 and they keep 15%.
It is getting expensive for those sites to be run with all the various state licensing regulations that require audits, etc. The good thing is they escrow the funds so you know your money is safe
It is getting expensive for those sites to be run with all the various state licensing regulations that require audits, etc. The good thing is they escrow the funds so you know your money is safe
Jello_Biafra
Footballguy
Whatever happened to getting a bunch of guys together to form a league?
It feels like Diggs has only played about half of his games healthy, though. That's not really an endorsement on his end. Just something to consider when comparing raw stats. Given the difference in value between the 8th and 16th picks, I'd probably take Diggs + 8th... but I'd always be worried about a random soft tissue injury.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
How do those in high stakes leagues compare the experience to low stakes leagues, in terms of competition, turnover, and activity? I would think owners would be quicker to bail on bad teams when they have to fork up a lot of money every year. I would also assume it would be hard to convince a replacement owner to pay a lot to take over said teams.
Even though ~$100 isn't what it was to me when I first started, I've never really had the desire to go any higher than that.
Even though ~$100 isn't what it was to me when I first started, I've never really had the desire to go any higher than that.
NeverEnough
Footballguy
I still won't go more than about $50 & it has yo be a super active league with no bs rules or idiots.
I think this is solid if you’re concerned he won’t get meaningful playing time due to injury or if he’s overrated for other reasons. In that case this might be a good time to cash in.
In a TE premium I personally see him as a huge lottery ticket and would hold unless I got an early 2nd *and a target player was available, or if someone was really in love w him and offered a prospect I liked. I have him otb and don’t anticipate any offers that would move me off of him because I realize opinions will vary on him and I’m on the high side
ETA: this is in response to Gathers above
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Aunt Jemima
Footballguy
This the additional service the FFPC provides, all owners pay a 'deposit' for a $750 league I think it is $250 (not 100% sure but close either way). Additionally is an owner trades his future 1st he needs to pay an additional deposit of $250. Let's one or two guys bail for year 2, one has a good team one bad. The good team is likely purchased at full price and the old owner gets his $250 back. In the case of the bad team let's say it is awful and can only be sold for $10. The old owner doesn't get his $250 back and the FFPC covers the $490 gap and the pot stays whole for the league. It has been 7 or 8 years and not one dynasty league has folded yet. All the crappy teams have been sold at some price.
tkrull
Footballguy
A 2nd would probably do it for me where I own him. Where I don't, I'd rather use my 2nd on a fresh dart throw. I'd buy for a 3rd.
As someone stated, the future deposits help offset owners who bail. I'm sure that huge rake helps cover the discounts they give on orphan teams as well. The cutdown rules likely make it a lot easier to entice someone to take over a dog roster, much easier to rebuild when the rest of the league can't hold onto their disappointing rook's/vet's or their sleepers.
I don't play in them, but there are frequent posters that do. The only thing I've ever noted is that I only occasionally pay attention to the trades that are posted from those leagues in the dynasty trade thread as their cutdown rules throw off a lot of values. And there definitely seem to be some fish as well as owners that go for broke with a plan to bail in those leagues based on many of the trades posted.
Andrew74
Footballguy
I have the 1.08 and am in talks to move up to the 1.03. I’ve thought about staying put since there are 8 (to me) solid RBs to draft and someone may take a WR prior to 8. On the other hand I do like having the option to take someone with a good opportunity (like Jones or Penny) as opposed to taking what falls. What do you guys think? How much to pay to move up? A late first? Early 2nd?
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I think all the backs landed in solid spots, with the exception of Chubb and maybe Michel. I’d define your tier breaks and see how things fall. I have a strong tier break after my 5th back, so in your shoes, I’d target the 1.05 at most. A mid 2nd could get that done. And that’s playing it safe, as it’s likely at least one WR or a back outside of my top 5 push a back or two down.Andrew74 said:
Biabreakable
Footballguy
Robinson does have a much stronger best season in his career, so might have more upside. Diggs did score 8 TD last season and if he stays healthy should improve on his numbers because Cousins is a lot better than Case Keenum.
I like both WR they are both worth having, not sure which one will have a better career. If Diggs goes off this season I am not sure if the Vikings will be able to pay him.
The 8th overall pick could be used on a RB. Not sure which RB would be left to you there but probably Freeman or Johnson. A bit more of a risk than the other RB and maybe RB who could do well but won't be able to sustain that many seasons.
It seems fair to me. You could ask for more I suppose but its a good offer.
-OZ-
Footballguy
As much as I like Barkley this really shouldn't be close. We hope Barkley is what we've seen from Zeke. The two years wear and tear doesn't make up for that.
I have Barkley in two leagues now, in one I'm heavily playing for the future, but would still jump on that swap.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
Do we realize that the next time the league decides that Zeke has abused a woman he’s out of the league for life?
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Just playing devil's advocate here, but I think we hope Barkley is what we've seen from Zeke plus another 40 receptions. The allure of Barkley is not just the size/speed combo, but the pass catching. PPR was designed to increase the value of WR back when there were a dozen or so bellcows getting 300 carries and scat backs were handling 3rd downs... but now that bellcows are rare, if you can find a bellcow that gets 70+ receptions, he pretty much breaks the game. It's like getting two players in one lineup spot. Additionally, Zeke looked human last year... despite being on pace for 387 carries
he was on pace for fewer yards and TDs than the year before. And now they've got Bo to take some of the load off of him. 387 carries is not a sustainable rate. Just ask Larry Johnson.In PPR, 1 rec is worth about 4 carries so Barkley's upside is beyond Zeke's, IMO.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Depends on league scoring and current roster, but assuming 12 man non-IDP I would take a late 1st in a flash and gotta believe a 2nd gets it done easily. I would not give a top 15 pick to move up but after 15 I'm much more open to it. There's very little predictability from 3 to 8 so who knows who's even going to go there? Throw in the wildcard factor (at least in my leagues) and you're gonna see the random Ridley/Moore/Mayfield picks in there too, so there's probably a 50/50 chance to see one of "your" top 2 options still there.Andrew74 said:
I have 1.04 in two and am looking to trade down and offered 1.04 for 1.07 and a future 2nd from a bad team but that is 16 man TE premium IDP so QB's, TE's, and IDP's make the 2nd a lot more valuable plus might even push another guy in front of the 1.07 - even odds I see Penny there still.
-OZ-
Footballguy
Fair enough. I was more referring to the fact that Zeke is a top 3 back and in his 3rd year. But sure, we can hope Barkley is better than Tomlinson, Thurman Thomas and Barry Sanders put together.Just playing devil's advocate here, but I think we hope Barkley is what we've seen from Zeke plus another 40 receptions. The allure of Barkley is not just the size/speed combo, but the pass catching. PPR was designed to increase the value of WR back when there were a dozen or so bellcows getting 300 carries and scat backs were handling 3rd downs... but now that bellcows are rare, if you can find a bellcow that gets 70+ receptions, he pretty much breaks the game. It's like getting two players in one lineup spot. Additionally, Zeke looked human last year... despite being on pace for 387 carries
In PPR, 1 rec is worth about 4 carries so Barkley's upside is beyond Zeke's, IMO.
I think fantasy points are more important than ranking. Unless Zeke starts getting more targets, his upside is limited. Barkley doesn't have to be Barry Sanders to outscore Zeke in PPR.
Shurmur pieced together the 5th most fantasy points from RBs last year according to data dominator (all MIN RBs) and Dallas ranked 9th. It'll be interesting to see what he does with the Giants (26th).
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I agree with you, but to play devil’s advocate to your playing devil’s advocate: Zeke runs good routes and has great hands himself. With Dez and Witten out of the picture, I can only assume the Cowboys have to start taking advantage of that.Just playing devil's advocate here, but I think we hope Barkley is what we've seen from Zeke plus another 40 receptions. The allure of Barkley is not just the size/speed combo, but the pass catching. PPR was designed to increase the value of WR back when there were a dozen or so bellcows getting 300 carries and scat backs were handling 3rd downs... but now that bellcows are rare, if you can find a bellcow that gets 70+ receptions, he pretty much breaks the game. It's like getting two players in one lineup spot. Additionally, Zeke looked human last year... despite being on pace for 387 carries
In PPR, 1 rec is worth about 4 carries so Barkley's upside is beyond Zeke's, IMO.
And Bo is zero threat to Zeke. If healthy, Zeke will be one of the top utilized backs in the league again.
But what about Rico and Gallup?
Kidding - don't want to get you going on Gallup again!You think they're going to run him into the ground? They've got to be planning to give him a breather. He was on pace for almost 400 carries last year. I kind of like Bo and was surprised he fell to the 7th. I think he could be a solid fill in for Zeke if they want to keep him fresh.
Pwingles
Footballguy
bo's upside is a poor mans Blount, which is passable in the nfl for situational stuff, but hard to predict fantasy wise
i think even in the event of a zeke injury or suspension, bo will not be a bellcow type guy, the workload will be split unless he shows a ton of upside that nobody saw coming
i think even in the event of a zeke injury or suspension, bo will not be a bellcow type guy, the workload will be split unless he shows a ton of upside that nobody saw coming
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I don’t think they plan on giving him a second contract. They’ve shown no signs of monitoring his carries to this point. I’m not saying he’ll get 400, but he’ll be the only back getting significant carries, when healthy, just like Bell, DJ, and Gurley, and likely Barkley.But what about Rico and Gallup?
You think they're going to run him into the ground? They've got to be planning to give him a breather. He was on pace for almost 400 carries last year. I kind of like Bo and was surprised he fell to the 7th. I think he could be a solid fill in for Zeke if they want to keep him fresh.
I do like Gallup and hope he has a Kupp-esque rookie season.
I was just kidding - I do believe Gallup and Rico will be steps down from Dez and Witten.
Zyphros
Footballguy
All these devils advocate things are confusing me.
He's adequate at that I'd say. No numbers or anything to back it up though. Depth chart says they list Tavon Austin as a RB which I thought was odd. He could be a great pass catching RB2 to Zeke if they use him that way. Unlike Bell, DJ and Barkley, who are extraordinary at pass catching. I do expect them to run Zeke into the ground but I take Barkley > Zeke in a startup. ETA: In PPR
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