For My Christian Friends Supporting Trump (1 Viewer)

[Joe Bryant]

Just a FWIW. 

This is kind of a dumb thing for me to post here as it doesn't apply to hardly anyone here but I still thought it was maybe worthwhile. 

I posted this to my Facebook feed. I have a good number of friends who support Trump. Many are Christians. 

We'll see - it might have been a dumb thing to post on my Facebook as well. 

I posted:

Note for my Christian Friends. I don't have many people on my Facebook feed. If you're reading this, you're one of my people. And I hope my people will hear this joke/jab exactly as what it is. Something pointed to make a bigger point.

It's no secret I didn't vote for President Trump and I've been critical of him. But I see the Mueller report as absolutely a win for America. I trust the report and I'm super glad to know the report showed he was clear.

BUT, I urge us as Christians to be careful with the "so much winning" type celebrations. Because right or wrong the PARODY article in the Babylon Bee here is how lots of Non-Christians see our President. And us.

Be mindful of how we do what we can to reflect Christ. And as always, I'm speaking mostly to myself. Much love for you.

https://babylonbee.com/news/evangelicals-relieved-their-president-now-only-guilty-of-paying-off-porn-stars




 

 

[Henry Ford]

Though not a Christian, I have a hard time seeing how the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth are compatible with supporting and cheering for Donald of Queens. 

 

[[scooter]]

"Now only guilty of paying off porn stars!"

(Well, that plus cheating on multiple wives, lying on an industrial scale, and violating just about every one of the seven deadly sins on a weekly basis, etc., etc., etc.......)

 

[Joe Bryant]

Though not a Christian, I have a hard time seeing how the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth are compatible with supporting and cheering for Donald of Queens. 

Agreed. That's what I'm saying to my Christian friends. 

 

[Don't Noonan]

Agreed. That's what I'm saying to my Christian friends. 

Has Trump admitted he had affairs?  I may have missed it.

 

[apalmer]

Though not a Christian, I have a hard time seeing how the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth are compatible with supporting and cheering for Donald of Queens. 

As a Christian, so do I. In fact, my wife and I have finally decided that we need to change churches because we can no longer silently sit and listen to sermons that more and more frequently include celebrating Donald Trump and attacking those evil Liberals and Socialists who want to destroy him. I suspect I may need to compose a letter to the minister explaining our decision. I'm sure it won't change his viewpoint, but I'll certainly feel better for having done it.

 

[[scooter]]

Agreed. That's what I'm saying to my Christian friends. 

Has Trump admitted he had affairs?  I may have missed it.

https://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/trump-cheating-ivana-marla-beautiful-1994-article-1.2822695

"My life was so great in so many ways. The business was so great... a beautiful girlfriend, a beautiful wife, a beautiful everything. Life was just a bowl of cherries,"

He literally defines a "great life" as "cheating on your wife". And he makes no apologies for either the cheating or the philosophy.

 

[Henry Ford]

Has Trump admitted he had affairs?  I may have missed it.

I’m getting the impression over time that you don’t know anything at all about Donald Trump. 

 

[Don't Noonan]

I’m getting the impression over time that you don’t know anything at all about Donald Trump. 

I am specifically talking about the alleged affairs with McDougal and Daniels which the article referred to.

 

[BobbyLayne]

As a Christian, so do I. In fact, my wife and I have finally decided that we need to change churches because we can no longer silently sit and listen to sermons that more and more frequently include celebrating Donald Trump and attacking those evil Liberals and Socialists who want to destroy him. I suspect I may need to compose a letter to the minister explaining our decision. I'm sure it won't change his viewpoint, but I'll certainly feel better for having done it.

Dude, seriously? I mean I come from Reformlandia/DeVos country - and I’ve never heard politics from the pulpit. The last Democratic Party candidate to carry Ottawa county was George B. McClellan in 1864.

 

[Don't Noonan]

As a Catholic I find it hard to understand why any Catholics would vote Democrat and back a candidate who supports abortion.  

 

[Stealthycat]

I don't think Trump is any more Christian than Obama was

 

[[scooter]]

As a Catholic I find it hard to understand why any Catholics would vote Democrat and back a candidate who supports abortion.  

Maybe their standard is similar to yours: as long as the candidate doesn't admit to having any abortions while they were a candidate, then it's totally consistent with their religious beliefs to vote for that person.

 

[zoonation]

Donald Trump is the antithesis of Christianity.  

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

As a Catholic I find it hard to understand why any Catholics would vote Democrat and back a candidate who supports abortion.  

I know Catholics, and I understand people who say this, I know some. I don't attack people's values. All I ask of anyone whether I know them or on this board is just stick to that, it's about legislation, fine. But don't claim Trump has a moral objection to abortion (I don't think so), that's he is in anyway reflective of Christian/Catholic values (he's not, he's the opposite), or that his other policy/legislation stances are Christian/Catholic (they're very much not). You want to put that singular policy point above all others, ok, I understand.

 

[Don't Noonan]

Maybe their standard is similar to yours: as long as the candidate doesn't admit to having any abortions while they were a candidate, then it's totally consistent with their religious beliefs to vote for that person.

That is not my position so no

 

[BobbyLayne]

Y’all are missing out on how great the Bee is though

https://babylonbee.com/news

 

[[scooter]]

I don't think Trump is any more Christian than Obama was

OK.

Trump violates the seven deadly sins every week, while Obama......what? He refused to change churches when he didn't agree with everything the pastor said? He refused to push anti-abortion legislation? (Which, btw, is the same thing that Trump has done.) His traditional stance on gay marriage wasn't quite traditional enough, even though Trump has made little attempt to overturn Obergefell v. Hodges?

It's funny how Obama's inability to be as perfect as Jesus was considered to be a dealbreaker in 2008, and now blasphemy is just a minor flaw.

 

[sho nuff]

As a Catholic I find it hard to understand why any Catholics would vote Democrat and back a candidate who supports abortion.  

Because it’s one issue and I can turn it around and ask how a Catholic could vote for Republican and back a candidate who supports the death penalty.

 

[Don't Noonan]

I know Catholics, and I understand people who say this, I know some. I don't attack people's values. All I ask of anyone whether I know them or on this board is just stick to that, it's about legislation, fine. But don't claim Trump has a moral objection to abortion (I don't think so), that's he is in anyway reflective of Christian/Catholic values (he's not, he's the opposite), or that his other policy/legislation stances are Christian/Catholic (they're very much not). You want to put that singular policy point above all others, ok, I understand.

I agree that Trump is not the ideal candidate for Catholics because of his likely infidelity among other things.  However, considering the alternative in Hillary it was a slam dunk as Trump has put 2 conservative judges on Supreme Court and has come out against abortion.

 

[pinkham13]

I think Christians largely support Trump for several reasons

#1. PC culture is going bonkers. Trump is more a traditionalist and abhors PC culture in his rhetoric anyway.

#2. Making America great again= gutting NAFTA among other things. Globalization has redistributed American jobs to low wage and low standard environmental law type places.

#3. Standing up to communist China. While the commies built islands and military apparatus on many islands in the Pacific, challenging U.S. hegemony that the previous administration did nothing to stop. Christians understand Communism is a soul crushing tyranny that must be contained or eliminated not emulated.

 

[Don't Noonan]

Because it’s one issue and I can turn it around and ask how a Catholic could vote for Republican and back a candidate who supports the death penalty.

For me, you are talking about executing an innocent baby compared to executing an evil convicted killer who is likely to kill again.  No brainer.  

 

[Juxtatarot]

I don't think Trump is any more Christian than Obama was

I agree.  My guess is Obama is really agnostic or atheist.  His mom was.  He might only show a religious side for social and political reasons.  I have no proof to back this up, it's just a gut feeling.

Edit to add:  Although, I'd say Obama acts more Christian than Trump.

 

[Stealthycat]

OK.

Trump violates the seven deadly sins every week, while Obama......what? He refused to change churches when he didn't agree with everything the pastor said? He refused to push anti-abortion legislation? (Which, btw, is the same thing that Trump has done.) His traditional stance on gay marriage wasn't quite traditional enough, even though Trump has made little attempt to overturn Obergefell v. Hodges?

It's funny how Obama's inability to be as perfect as Jesus was considered to be a dealbreaker in 2008, and now blasphemy is just a minor flaw.

I just said Trump isn't a Christian and neither was Obama IMO. I don't care if you go to church or what is said .... 

I don't vote on a president for their religious beliefs. If someone does, that's fine, its just not my priority. 

 

[timschochet]

I really don’t think it’s a big mystery why conservative religious Christians support Donald Trump: he does stuff they like. 

1. 2 ultra conservative Supreme Court justices. 

2. Dozens of ultra conservative judges elsewhere. 

3. Wont support Planned Parenthood. 

4. Protects “religious liberty”. 

5. Bans transsexuals from the military. 

6. Supports the conservative Israeli government. 

I could go on and on. If I were a conservative Christian what’s not to love? His personal weaknesses seem like a small price to pay. 

 

[parrot]

"Now only guilty of paying off porn stars!"

(Well, that plus cheating on multiple wives, lying on an industrial scale, and violating just about every one of the seven deadly sins on a weekly basis, etc., etc., etc.......)

Using his "charity' to buy portraits of himself and bragging about them being the most costly?  I mean he had to get at least half the seven with that one move, right?

 

[sho nuff]

For me, you are talking about executing an innocent baby compared to executing an evil convicted killer who is likely to kill again.  No brainer.  

Both are against the teachings and beliefs of the Catholic Church.

I could also name any number of issues where the democrat position in social issues is more in line with the teaching skills of Jesus than the GOP stance in those issues.

I abhor abortion...I hate that it is a necessary thing in this world.  But I also understand the consequences of banning it and the safety of the people put in jeopardy by doing so.

Also...I typically put aside many things in my faith when it comes to how I’m governed.

Edit:  I also understand the likelihood abortion gets banned is very slim.

 

[[scooter]]

I think Christians largely support Trump for several reasons

#1. PC culture is going bonkers. Trump is more a traditionalist and abhors PC culture in his rhetoric anyway.

#2. Making America great again= gutting NAFTA among other things. Globalization has redistributed American jobs to low wage and low standard environmental law type places.

#3. Standing up to communist China. While the commies built islands and military apparatus on many islands in the Pacific, challenging U.S. hegemony that the previous administration did nothing to stop. Christians understand Communism is a soul crushing tyranny that must be contained or eliminated not emulated.

...and if Obama had cozied up to the commies the way that Trump has (praising Kim, bootlicking Putin, making secret trademark deals with China for his own personal emolument), he would have been excoriated by the right.

To borrow a phrase, Trump is a Communist-enabler. His positions and his actions enable Communist dictatorships to continue to be oppressive.

 

[pinkham13]

...and if Obama had cozied up to the commies the way that Trump has (praising Kim, bootlicking Putin, making secret trademark deals with China for his own personal emolument), he would have been excoriated by the right.

To borrow a phrase, Trump is a Communist-enabler. His positions and his actions enable Communist dictatorships to continue to be oppressive.

 Not the way I see it. Bill Clinton gave the nuke technology to NK supporting the commies. Now Trump wants to be friends and take over their nukes to pressure China on their doorstep.

 

[dkp993]

It's a great question Joe and one I've never understood in regards to Trump supporters.  While I'm not religious I certainly respect others beliefs.  I have a few devout people in my life that also support Trump and I just can't wrap my head around it.

To quote the great Maynard Keenan..

"Sit and talk like jesus
Try walkin' like jesus
Sit and talk like jesus
Try walkin' like jesus
Try braving the rain
Try lifting the stone
Try extending a hand
Try walkin' your talk or get the #### out of my way"

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

Has Trump admitted he had affairs?  I may have missed it.

If not, we can add lying to the list (if it wasn't already on there).

Politics has become kind of a spectator sport. People are pretty good at overlooking the moral faults of athletes on the team they root for. And they're similarly good at overlooking the moral faults of politicians from their own party.

The somewhat unusual thing about Christians giving Trump a pass is that (a) if my radar is working properly, it's pretty obvious that Trump isn't actually a Christian, and (b) many of Trump's faults are exactly the sorts of things that many Christians have said that they cared about in other contexts.

All humans are hypocrites. All of us. But it's usually not quite so stark as it is with Christian support for Trump. I'm not quite sure how I would handle that if I were a Christian. I might do some whataboutism with Hillary. Or I might say that politics and religion are separate from each other and that being an evangelical Christian doesn't mean automatically having to support every Republican no matter how despicable. (I think it's only the evangelicals who so staunchly support Trump in overwhelming numbers, right? I don't think Catholics or Mormons do, for example.)

Religion and politics don't have to be so joined at the hip.

 

[[scooter]]

...and if Obama had cozied up to the commies the way that Trump has (praising Kim, bootlicking Putin, making secret trademark deals with China for his own personal emolument), he would have been excoriated by the right.

To borrow a phrase, Trump is a Communist-enabler. His positions and his actions enable Communist dictatorships to continue to be oppressive.

 Not the way I see it. Bill Clinton gave the nuke technology to NK supporting the commies. Now Trump wants to be friends and take over their nukes to pressure China on their doorstep.

North Korea started its nuclear program in the 1960s with help from the Soviet Union, and began developing its current weapons in 2002

Perhaps you are confusing this fact with Clinton's 1994 deal, where he arranged for North Korea to dismantle its bomb-making plants in exchange for the U.S. helping them build a "light water" plant (which would not be capable of making bombs)? That plan worked just fine until 2002 when they started developing bombs again.

 

[pinkham13]

North Korea started its nuclear program in the 1960s with help from the Soviet Union, and began developing its current weapons in 2002

Perhaps you are confusing this fact with Clinton's 1994 deal, where he arranged for North Korea to dismantle its bomb-making plants in exchange for the U.S. helping them build a "light water" plant (which would not be capable of making bombs)? That plan worked just fine until 2002 when they started developing bombs again.

That could be it. 

 

[Steve Tasker]

Well of course, Jesus - whose entire teachings basically boil down to "treat others how you would want to be treated", would abhor "PC culture".  

 

[Sinn Fein]

Well of course, Jesus - whose entire teachings basically boil down to "treat others how you would want to be treated", would abhor "PC culture".  

Jesus was definitely a Mac guy - you can tell by the sandals he wore.

 

[badmojo1006]

I think Christians largely support Trump for several reasons

#1. PC culture is going bonkers. Trump is more a traditionalist and abhors PC culture in his rhetoric anyway.

#2. Making America great again= gutting NAFTA among other things. Globalization has redistributed American jobs to low wage and low standard environmental law type places.

#3. Standing up to communist China. While the commies built islands and military apparatus on many islands in the Pacific, challenging U.S. hegemony that the previous administration did nothing to stop. Christians understand Communism is a soul crushing tyranny that must be contained or eliminated not emulated.

Did you steal this from The Onion?

 

[The Commish]

First off...I love the bee.  If you don't subscribe, you should.  It's freakin' awesome, even when they are making fun of me.

Second,  A genuine, honest Christian shouldn't be able to get passed any of the morality issues to even get to a position they might think Jesus would take politically.  There is nothing about this Presidency, thus far, that one could categorize as "Jesus like".  So @Joe Bryant I think you're spot on with your comments and I hope you continue to remind people of the standard we should be holding this guy to.  

 

[NCCommish]

As all know I am avowed atheist. But I also like a lot of Jesus's philosophy. Especially "what you do for the least of you, you do for me." The Judgement of Nations is my favorite set of passages in the Bible. And I just dont see how being for Trump can square with what is essentially the 11th commandment handed down from Christ himself. To be fair I would say a lot of Democrats fail that test as well. I'm trying to support the ones I think don't. 

 

[Henry Ford]

 Not the way I see it. Bill Clinton gave the nuke technology to NK supporting the commies. Now Trump wants to be friends and take over their nukes to pressure China on their doorstep.

The way you see it is based on a false premise.  

 

[That one guy]

I think it boils down to 2 simple and related concepts, the reason and justification for support

The reason:  Christian = Republican.  You can dissect and analyze that all you want, but simply speaking the Republican Party has somehow convinced a large majority of evangelicals/Christians (especially in the South) that they are the party of faith; similar to the way they’ve managed to convince that same contingency that they are the party of military/veterans/patriotism.  The other side, the Democrats, are not those things.

Justification:  they are supporting a political leader, not a religious leader, and “we all fall short of the glory of god”.  For any and all discrepancies, inconsistencies, and hypocrisies between faith and politics, use this as reference

 

[pinkham13]

The way you see it is based on a false premise.  

Maybe but I see the Clinton regime did indeed try to work with NK and gave them what they wanted. Why is it bad when Trump tries to work with the Koreans 

 

[[scooter]]

The way you see it is based on a false premise.  

Maybe but I see the Clinton regime did indeed try to work with NK and gave them what they wanted. Why is it bad when Trump tries to work with the Koreans 

Clinton didn't give them what they wanted.

They wanted nuclear weapons. They had already started a nuclear weapons program in the late 1970s. Clinton put a stop to that in 1994 by arranging to swap weapons for non-weapons.

If your argument is that Clinton shouldn't have done that, then North Korea would have just developed their nukes 8 years sooner than they did.

If your argument is that Clinton should have just bombed the hell out of the country, then that same exact argument could be made against Reagan, Bush, and Bush (and Trump).

When George W. Bush took over as President in 2001, North Korea had not yet re-started their weapons program. (They were still adhering to the terms of the 1994 agreement.) So, if the conservative argument is that the 1994 agreement was so terrible, then why aren't they upset with Bush for not tearing up the agreement in 2001 -- before North Korea started making weapons again?

And why is Trump getting a pass in all of this? If the answer is, "Well, we don't want to start a war", then why not give credit to Clinton for having the same philosophy in 1994?

 

[The Commish]

As all know I am avowed atheist. But I also like a lot of Jesus's philosophy. Especially "what you do for the least of you, you do for me." The Judgement of Nations is my favorite set of passages in the Bible. And I just dont see how being for Trump can square with what is essentially the 11th commandment handed down from Christ himself. To be fair I would say a lot of Democrats fail that test as well. I'm trying to support the ones I think don't. 

   

 

[pinkham13]

Clinton didn't give them what they wanted.

They wanted nuclear weapons. They had already started a nuclear weapons program in the late 1970s. Clinton put a stop to that in 1994 by arranging to swap weapons for non-weapons.

If your argument is that Clinton shouldn't have done that, then North Korea would have just developed their nukes 8 years sooner than they did.

If your argument is that Clinton should have just bombed the hell out of the country, then that same exact argument could be made against Reagan, Bush, and Bush (and Trump).

When George W. Bush took over as President in 2001, North Korea had not yet re-started their weapons program. (They were still adhering to the terms of the 1994 agreement.) So, if the conservative argument is that the 1994 agreement was so terrible, then why aren't they upset with Bush for not tearing up the agreement in 2001 -- before North Korea started making weapons again?

And why is Trump getting a pass in all of this? If the answer is, "Well, we don't want to start a war", then why not give credit to Clinton for having the same philosophy in 1994?

They got money, fuel,  lifting of sanctions and technology and they now also have the bomb. I’d say they got everything they wanted.

 

[The Commish]

Maybe but I see the Clinton regime did indeed try to work with NK and gave them what they wanted. Why is it bad when Trump tries to work with the Koreans 

This is playing out in real time, right in front of your eyes.  Go to BBC to get the latest...it's laid out nicely there.  There's also a thread here laying out what the problems are currently.

 

[pinkham13]

As all know I am avowed atheist. But I also like a lot of Jesus's philosophy. Especially "what you do for the least of you, you do for me." The Judgement of Nations is my favorite set of passages in the Bible. And I just dont see how being for Trump can square with what is essentially the 11th commandment handed down from Christ himself. To be fair I would say a lot of Democrats fail that test as well. I'm trying to support the ones I think don't. 

What. A balanced post. Pretty cool bro

 

[[scooter]]

Clinton didn't give them what they wanted.

They wanted nuclear weapons. They had already started a nuclear weapons program in the late 1970s. Clinton put a stop to that in 1994 by arranging to swap weapons for non-weapons.

If your argument is that Clinton shouldn't have done that, then North Korea would have just developed their nukes 8 years sooner than they did.

If your argument is that Clinton should have just bombed the hell out of the country, then that same exact argument could be made against Reagan, Bush, and Bush (and Trump).

When George W. Bush took over as President in 2001, North Korea had not yet re-started their weapons program. (They were still adhering to the terms of the 1994 agreement.) So, if the conservative argument is that the 1994 agreement was so terrible, then why aren't they upset with Bush for not tearing up the agreement in 2001 -- before North Korea started making weapons again?

And why is Trump getting a pass in all of this? If the answer is, "Well, we don't want to start a war", then why not give credit to Clinton for having the same philosophy in 1994?

They got money, fuel,  lifting of sanctions and technology and they now also have the bomb. I’d say they got everything they wanted.

They didn't get the bomb from anything Clinton gave them, though.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

The Bible says that homosexuality is bad a few times.

The Bible VERY explicitly says divorce is bad like a billion times.

All over the world Christians are walking around with their 4th wife telling us how homosexuality is the worst sin ever because the Bible says so.

Picking and choosing their morals and what they care to focus on or disregard this week is nothing new for many (not all) Christians, so I can certainly see how they support Trump even though he is the complete antithesis of what Jesus taught.  Many of the policies they support most fervently are the antithesis of Jesus already to begin with.

 

[pinkham13]

They didn't get the bomb from anything Clinton gave them, though.

I guess the point is you said Trump is cozying up to a dictator and I’m saying Clinton also worked with the regime by lifting sanctions etc. How is Trump really any different at this point.

 

[Politician Spock]

No matter what candidate or incumbent you are speaking about, trying to equate them to christianity is like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.

And that's not because of the issues of candidates and incumbents (despite them, like Trump, having issues). It's because christianity is still stuck in a reality that existed 20 centuries ago, and doesn't fit in our reality today. Christians justify this issue by believing they aren't supposed to be conformed to this world, which is ironic given how much the religion stole from pagan religions over the first few centuries. Very little of christianity is original stories, doctrine, or tradition. You can pretty much find the vast majority of it pulled from religions that existed before it. Which is why no rational candidate or incumbent would ever be a fundamentalist christian, as they get eaten alive in today's reality.