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Gavin's hit on Huber (1 Viewer)

j3r3m3y

Footballguy
http://twitpic.com/show/thumb/dout2l.gif

I see people all over the internet saying this was a cheap shot and should have been flagged, and that Gavin should face a fine.

I have no dog in this fight (not a fan of either team) and it is unfortunate that he got hurt but I am not seeing what is illegal about this hit. Anyone want to clue me in?

 

Limp Ditka

Footballguy
There's some lingo out there that no matter what position a kicker is in, he is considered in a 'defenseless' one.

 

Ray

Footballguy
It's sucks that he got hurt, but I like that it highlights that:

Every player should be required to wear a facemask that makes a broken jaw impossible.

 

renesauz

IBL Representative
Leading with the crown of your helmet into a guys chin is cheap. Period, end of story.

 
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B-Deep

Footballguy
well

it was a blow with a helmet to the head of a defensless player

so i am guessing there is a fine coming

 

Godsbrother

Footballguy
He will be fined because he came in high but I have a big problem calling a player defenseless when he is about to make a tackle.

This was not a case of someone 25 yards away from the play being blindsided.

 

Flying Elvis

Footballguy
Leading with the crown of your helmet into a guys chin is cheap. Period, end of story.
Exactly. Helmet first, directly into the chin. It certainly doesn't have the look of an intentional head shot, but it's a head shot nonetheless.

I expect a fine.

 

Smack Tripper

Footballguy
I guess in my mind, they're all in the nflpa and it would be nice to see a little more concern across the brotherhood. Just bcause you CAN light someone up doesn't mean you should or you have to. "Clean "" play but a garbage one

 

Dinsy Ejotuz

Footballguy
I guess in my mind, they're all in the nflpa and it would be nice to see a little more concern across the brotherhood. Just bcause you CAN light someone up doesn't mean you should or you have to. "Clean "" play but a garbage one
I meant to say something about this earlier in the year... was watching Redzone and Larry Fitzgerald was blocking on a play. He had a pursuing DB absolutely dead to rights on a blind shot, and he let up. He blocked him, but he didn't kill him. Guarantee when the DB saw the film he was grateful because he'd have been crushed. Was a great example of what you're talking about.

 

Dinsy Ejotuz

Footballguy
He will be fined because he came in high but I have a big problem calling a player defenseless when he is about to make a tackle.

This was not a case of someone 25 yards away from the play being blindsided.
By rule Kickers and Punters are defenseless at all times.

 

MoveToSkypager

Footballguy
It was a stupid block by Garvin because there was no way in hell the punter was going to bring Brown down, and Brown had to break a tackle to make up for Garvin's mistake. Garvin should have curled under the lane of Brown and blocked #40 instead, so Brown didn't have to make up for Garvin's mistake. No harm because of Brown's remarkable play, but that doesn't change the fact that Garvin chose the wrong guy to block. He just wanted to make a fun hit instead of helping his team succeed. I'm glad me-first players like Garvin get fined.

 

adam220891

Footballguy
He blindsided a punter with his helmet and broke his jaw and a vertebrae in his neck.

Honestly, it was disturbing to see.

 

ClownDogs

Footballguy
It was a stupid block by Garvin because there was no way in hell the punter was going to bring Brown down, and Brown had to break a tackle to make up for Garvin's mistake. Garvin should have curled under the lane of Brown and blocked #40 instead, so Brown didn't have to make up for Garvin's mistake. No harm because of Brown's remarkable play, but that doesn't change the fact that Garvin chose the wrong guy to block. He just wanted to make a fun hit instead of helping his team succeed. I'm glad me-first players like Garvin get fined.
Not sure i would call him a "me first" type player. Probably more of a special teamer possibly making a name for himself would fit better?

And somewhat hard to tell without slowing it down, but looks like his facemask hit his shoulder pad? Not sure I personally would call it "leading with the crown" of the helmet type hit to be honest.

 

Phenix

Footballguy
It's sucks that he got hurt, but I like that it highlights that:

Every player should be required to wear a facemask that makes a broken jaw impossible.
Boldin had a broken jaw when he got hit against the Jets a few years back. he was wearing a big boy helmet.

 

jurb26

Footballguy
It's sucks that he got hurt, but I like that it highlights that:

Every player should be required to wear a facemask that makes a broken jaw impossible.
Boldin had a broken jaw when he got hit against the Jets a few years back. he was wearing a big boy helmet.
I'm not sure if it applies in Boldin's case but one thing that drives me nuts in today's NFL is that hardly any players actually strap their helmets on properly. That's why they are constantly coming off. Having the right equipment doesn't matter if you don't use it properly.
 

fruity pebbles

Footballguy
Tool play. I hope Garvin blows his knee out.
I think this comment is even more "toolish" than Garvins hit.
Absolutely no reason he needs to level the guy except that hes an ahole.
You mean other than the fact that Huber was in line to tackle Brown, right?
Garvin is 6'3 230. He lined up the punter who wasn't even looking at him. Big man. He could have easily taken him out of the play without taking his head off.

 

BigSteelThrill

Footballguy
He deserves a fine.

But at some point, if they really want to fix this fairly, a player has to be responsible for his own welfare on the field.

 

Copeman

Footballguy
Tool play. I hope Garvin blows his knee out.
I think this comment is even more "toolish" than Garvins hit.
Absolutely no reason he needs to level the guy except that hes an ahole.
You mean other than the fact that Huber was in line to tackle Brown, right?
Garvin is 6'3 230. He lined up the punter who wasn't even looking at him. Big man. He could have easily taken him out of the play without taking his head off.
I agree, but remember, that play is happening alot faster than anyone of us could possibly understand. To me it looks like he hit him in the chest and his momentum (because it was such a hard hit) made his helmet glance up to Hubers helmet.

Garvin is a nobody, trying to make a name for himself on special teams, so I'm sure he's out there full throttle. Just because a punter is in his way doesn't mean he should let up. We've all seen punters bring returners down many times. But of course with these new rule interpretations in the last few years, I suppose he should have tried, eventhough these guys have all played a certain way all their lives. I'm sure it's not an easy thing to adjust to.

Heck, with the speed of the game, he might not have even known it was the punter.

 
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renesauz

IBL Representative
He will be fined because he came in high but I have a big problem calling a player defenseless when he is about to make a tackle.

This was not a case of someone 25 yards away from the play being blindsided.
ON replay, it's pretty clear that that punter was moving very tentatively, and had zero interest in actually making a tackle.

That said, I agree with your premise- hitting him wasn't bad, even a hard hit wasn't bad- it was HOW it he hit him (very high leading with the crown)

 

Copeman

Footballguy
And this wasn't the only replay of it. On this one, it looks like he is hitting him JUST with the crown of his helmet. Other angles clearly show his right shoulder hitting Hubers chest at the same time.

 

MoveToSkypager

Footballguy
It was a stupid block by Garvin because there was no way in hell the punter was going to bring Brown down, and Brown had to break a tackle to make up for Garvin's mistake. Garvin should have curled under the lane of Brown and blocked #40 instead, so Brown didn't have to make up for Garvin's mistake. No harm because of Brown's remarkable play, but that doesn't change the fact that Garvin chose the wrong guy to block. He just wanted to make a fun hit instead of helping his team succeed. I'm glad me-first players like Garvin get fined.
Not sure i would call him a "me first" type player. Probably more of a special teamer possibly making a name for himself would fit better?

And somewhat hard to tell without slowing it down, but looks like his facemask hit his shoulder pad? Not sure I personally would call it "leading with the crown" of the helmet type hit to be honest.
Yeah, people are getting all hand-wringy about the hit. The hit IMO was fine. Maybe I'm wrong, but the punter was pursuing Brown. If you are going to pursue the ball carrier, you don't have diplomatic immunity. Keep your head on a ####### swivel. Just a dumb block in my opinion and if the Steelers have a ST coach worth his salt, Garvin has already been lit up about finding the right guy to block, not just the easy guy to block.

 

MoveToSkypager

Footballguy
Tool play. I hope Garvin blows his knee out.
I think this comment is even more "toolish" than Garvins hit.
Absolutely no reason he needs to level the guy except that hes an ahole.
You mean other than the fact that Huber was in line to tackle Brown, right?
Garvin is 6'3 230. He lined up the punter who wasn't even looking at him. Big man. He could have easily taken him out of the play without taking his head off.
I agree, but remember, that play is happening alot faster than anyone of us could possibly understand. To me it looks like he hit him in the chest and his momentum (because it was such a hard hit) made his helmet glance up to Hubers helmet.

Garvin is a nobody, trying to make a name for himself on special teams, so I'm sure he's out there full throttle. Just because a punter is in his way doesn't mean he should let up. We've all seen punters bring returners down many times. But of course with these new rule interpretations in the last few years, I suppose he should have tried, eventhough these guys have all played a certain way all their lives. I'm sure it's not an easy thing to adjust to.

Heck, with the speed of the game, he might not have even known it was the punter.
I wouldn't worry about FP. Those hits are standard in this sport. He probably doesn't know.

 

jsharlan

Footballguy
If he had led with his shoulder, I don't think it would even be a debate. Huber also probably wouldn't have a broken jaw.

 
1. I feel bad for the Punter; I suspect that's how the majority of us would end up if we were thrown in an NFL game and were asked to run a single play; trying to make a tackle on a punt return.

2. That being said, the team needs to coach the Punter how to run down field, engage blockers and make a tackle... or tell him just to get the #### out of the way after kicking the ball if they don't think he can handle the task.

3. Huber messed up and kept his eyes focused on the returner the entire time (at least in the seconds leading up to the hit). I have little doubt Gavin knew he was going to "blowup" the Punter with a SportsCenter worthy hit. While it may not have been illegal per the rulebook, it was unnecessary. I remember a number of years back when Warren Sapp broke Chad Clifton's pelvis on a blindside hit. While that play was further away from the ball, both seemed about as classless and cheap as I've seen.

 

Phenix

Footballguy
Tool play. I hope Garvin blows his knee out.
I think this comment is even more "toolish" than Garvins hit.
Absolutely no reason he needs to level the guy except that hes an ahole.
You mean other than the fact that Huber was in line to tackle Brown, right?
Garvin is 6'3 230. He lined up the punter who wasn't even looking at him. Big man. He could have easily taken him out of the play without taking his head off.
Agreed.

 

BigSteelThrill

Footballguy
Tool play. I hope Garvin blows his knee out.
I think this comment is even more "toolish" than Garvins hit.
Absolutely no reason he needs to level the guy except that hes an ahole.
You mean other than the fact that Huber was in line to tackle Brown, right?
Garvin is 6'3 230. He lined up the punter who wasn't even looking at him. Big man. He could have easily taken him out of the play without taking his head off.
Agreed.
Huber is 6'1" 215.

 

Steelers4Life

Footballguy
Gavin led with his shoulder into the punter's chest, which naturally left his helmet at the same level as the punter's chin. He'll be fined because of the outcome of the play and the public's reaction. He probably deserves one.

But Huber was not blindsided, he was hit from the front. It's not Gavin's fault he didn't see him coming, because he should have. This wasn't a crackback, blindside hit. It was a big block on a punter who should've been either ready to take it or out of the way entirely.

And Huber was definitely in a position where he could've either made the tackle or slowed Brown down. If he's defenseless and only a punter, he should punt and run off the field instead of acting like a real football player capable of making a tackle.

 

jurb26

Footballguy
And Huber was definitely in a position where he could've either made the tackle or slowed Brown down. If he's defenseless and only a punter, he should punt and run off the field instead of acting like a real football player capable of making a tackle.
I don't doubt the NFL comes to this in a few years. K/P will kick and then immediately run off the field and a sub player runs on to take his place for safety reasons.

 

Max Power

Footballguy
That's football. Fine him for "player safety" reasons, but I don't think Gavin was out of line here. Huber is paid to play on that same field. Occupational hazard.

 

mad sweeney

Footballguy
I guess in my mind, they're all in the nflpa and it would be nice to see a little more concern across the brotherhood. Just bcause you CAN light someone up doesn't mean you should or you have to. "Clean "" play but a garbage one
I meant to say something about this earlier in the year... was watching Redzone and Larry Fitzgerald was blocking on a play. He had a pursuing DB absolutely dead to rights on a blind shot, and he let up. He blocked him, but he didn't kill him. Guarantee when the DB saw the film he was grateful because he'd have been crushed. Was a great example of what you're talking about.
That was against Seattle and he did it twice. First it was Thurmond and then later in the game it was Sherman.

 

The General

Footballguy
It was pretty cheap could have blasted him without getting up in his chin. A majority of special team players probably talk about lighting the punter up though.

Should and will be fined.

 

treat88

Footballguy
A punter is only considered defenseless if the contact is considered unnecessary.

Garvin came in intentionally high with bad intentions, no doubt about it.

But Huber was not considered a defenseless player on that play as he was pursuing the ball carrier. To be considered defenseless the kicker has to stay away from the action.

That said, if a guy doesn't want to be hit in a defenseless position, they shouldn't put themselves in defenseless positions....especially punters that aren't actually defenseless.

All that said, Huber seems like a class act and I wish him nothing but the speediest of recoveries. Garvin deserves to lose his check for the game.

 
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Steed

Footballguy
Hines ward did the same thing to Keith rivers a while back. Broken jaw and he had to eat through a straw all offseason.

 

CariocaSean

Footballguy
The hit was completely unnecessary. Huber wasn't going to stop Brown from scoring - wasn't even in position to. Garvin could have easily held Huber back with one hand and prevented any tackle. He didn't need to try and take the punter's head off. Cheap shot - dirty ### hit! No doubt about it. I hate this kind of thing.

As has been mentioned - also was technically an illegal hit and should have been flagged as such.

 
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zftcg

Footballguy
It's sucks that he got hurt, but I like that it highlights that:

Every player should be required to wear a facemask that makes a broken jaw impossible.
Boldin had a broken jaw when he got hit against the Jets a few years back. he was wearing a big boy helmet.
As I recall, Boldin actually had a broken face.

I'm not sure if it applies in Boldin's case but one thing that drives me nuts in today's NFL is that hardly any players actually strap their helmets on properly. That's why they are constantly coming off. Having the right equipment doesn't matter if you don't use it properly.
Totally agree. I'd like to see players get flagged when their helmets pop off, or at least have to sit out the next play. Loose helmets are a contributing factor in concussions.

 

The Swanman

Footballguy
A punter is only considered defenseless if the contact is considered unnecessary.

Garvin came in intentionally high with bad intentions, no doubt about it.

But Huber was not considered a defenseless player on that play as he was pursuing the ball carrier. To be considered defenseless the kicker has to stay away from the action.

That said, if a guy doesn't want to be hit in a defenseless position, they shouldn't put themselves in defenseless positions....especially punters that aren't actually defenseless.

All that said, Huber seems like a class act and I wish him nothing but the speediest of recoveries. Garvin deserves to lose his check for the game.
The guy on NFL Network just said that the Punter and/or Kicker is considered defenseless through the entire down. I don't know the rule but thought I would share what he said.

 

SteelerMurf

Footballguy
Tool play. I hope Garvin blows his knee out.
I think this comment is even more "toolish" than Garvins hit.
Absolutely no reason he needs to level the guy except that hes an ahole.
You mean other than the fact that Huber was in line to tackle Brown, right?
Garvin is 6'3 230. He lined up the punter who wasn't even looking at him. Big man. He could have easily taken him out of the play without taking his head off.
Agreed.
Huber is 6'1" 215.
Bigger than a lot of guys on that play including Antonio brown 5'10" 186 who he was trying to tackle. If you don't want blocked don't go to the middle of the action like most kickers don't Was hit over the top? Yeah but anyone ever play football? Do you check number before you block? I never did!If kickers are defenseless they should wear a red jersey and run off field after kick.

 
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Bayhawks

Footballguy
MoveToSkypager said:
It was a stupid block by Garvin because there was no way in hell the punter was going to bring Brown down, and Brown had to break a tackle to make up for Garvin's mistake. Garvin should have curled under the lane of Brown and blocked #40 instead, so Brown didn't have to make up for Garvin's mistake. No harm because of Brown's remarkable play, but that doesn't change the fact that Garvin chose the wrong guy to block. He just wanted to make a fun hit instead of helping his team succeed. I'm glad me-first players like Garvin get fined.
Well this is not correct. He hit Huber at exactly the same time as Brown was running around/through the attempted tackle of #40. How was he supposed to "curl under the lane of Brown and block #40?" If he had tried to do so, he wouldn't have gotten to #40 in time, and Huber would have been in a position to (at the very least) slow Brown down.

In that situation, you block the man (Huber) that you are able to block, and you let the PR make a guy miss. Garvin chose the right guy to block. He could have done so, however, without the high contact that will likely result in a fine.

However, it's easy for us to say "he should have known it was a punter and hit him softer" with the benefit of hindsight. I guarantee you if Garvin "lets up" because it was a punter and the punter somehow avoids/fights through the "softer" block to make the tackle, his ST coach will have some harsh words for him. For a ST player who is trying to make/stay on the team, "taking it easy" on an opposing player isn't necessarily the best career choice.

 

Phenix

Footballguy
Well the head of officiating says "the punter is a defenseless player the entire play."

Shame on officials, shame on anyone who agrees, shame on the NFL and shame on any punter who will ever say they are a football player then.

This is the most disgusting thing, football has now become stupid. Seriously.

Its not the game we came to love, it literally is powder puff. Can't hit anyone, you can't touch half the players because its illegal, the other half of player you can only touch in certain spots.

Sad, if this keeps up, how in the world is this sport not going to lose its luster. After seeing how fantasy is so luck based now and skill has fallen off because even the noob novice gets all the up to date info by just turning in a TV, this sport will not be as popular 5 years from now. When hardcore fans such as myself are starting to have doubts, and there are many of us, thats all it takes.

 

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